today on "inside politics" they just put it on line, and now everyone knows. ron desantis gets hundreds of pages of raw research and debate advice from his super pac. what they want him to do, who they want him to hit, and how they want him to copy the man who likely won't be on stage. plus, the permanent split screen. georgia prosecutors propose a timeline that would put another trump trial side by side with the trump presidential run. and love is blindness. new cnn reporting about how joe biden doesn't want to see or hear about his son's legal problems and the concern inside the campaign that is making the president numb to a very real re-election risk. i'm phil mattingly in for dana bash. let's go "inside politics." up first, donald trump versus fox news part deux. or three, four, five, in a different language. sources tell cnn the 2024 republican frontrunner is not planning to participate in wednesday's debate on the network and is proposing some counter programming. where have i seen that before? >> you see the house is packed, and literally there took place less than 24 hours. we had less than 24 hours to do this because i said, listen, i'm not going to do the debate out of respect for myself. i won't do it because it would just be wrong. but i got to -- i love iowa. i'm here. we've got to do something. isn't that better than this debate going on? [ cheers ] they're all sleeping. they're all sleeping, everybody. >> now that may seem like a million years ago, but that happened. that was trump boycotting a different fox news debate during the 2016 gop primary. that one in iowa. then trump host a fundraiser for veterans in iowa just three miles away from his republican rival. will history be repeating itself? it's a very open question now. let's go live to reporting on this, and for the last couple of weeks people trying to figure this out. what are you hearing right now from trump world? >> reporter: we are hearing that donald trump is most likely not going to be on the debate stage next week. i did hedge in my story, and i'll hedge here, as well, that this is donald trump we're talking about. i have covered him for many years. his campaign has told me, listen, he could always change his mind at the last minute. as of now, he is not planning to attend. i think we'll probably hear him say something of the sort soon. but he is talking about counter programming. he's been personally throwing out ideas of potential other interviews he can be giving, including a potential interview with tucker carlson. he's also talking about potentially calling into other shows during the debate. now of course i have to note donald trump is openly feuding with fox news right now. he is -- criticizing rupert murdoch, and we know that tucker carlson also has left fox news. so there could be some motivations there behind the scenes. but some interesting things i've picked up, phil, is that, one, donald trump, his team is trying to set up some surrogates to be there in his place, people like congressman byron donnells and matt gaetz of florida, and as well as members of donald trump's team. they want them in the spin room to defend donald trump even if he is not there. i'm also told that donald trump has been telling people even this week that he does think that fox news is worried about the ratings for this debate. news executives from fox went to bedminster last month and encouraged donald trump to participate, and truffle thinks that was a -- trump thinks that was a sign that they're worried about ratings. one other thing i want to point out is that donald trump is also amid all of this facing that indictment in georgia. he's expected to surrender next week, i am told. and this could all be setting up a potential collision course with those debates. >> yeah. mostly appreciate the hedging, that is a veteran move by a veteran reporter. >> reporter: you got to do it. >> thank you so much. now i want to turn to something that has to do with the debate. it's fascinating. it just broke a couple of moments ago. a desantis debate strategy in plain view for him and for his rivals. "the new york times" got its hands on hundreds of documents dumped on line by the main super pac backing the desantis campaign. the memos give detail we rarely see and outline for, quote, must dos for desantis when he takes the debate stage in milwaukee next week. attacked joe biden in the media three to five times, states his positive vision two to three times. hammered the response and defend donald trump in absentia in response to a chris christie attack. very specific. the memo says desantis should follow the wisdom of the late roger ailes, his orchestra pit theory, and quite literally create drama. the memo, the "times" writes, comes complete with a complete recommendation for a ytrump-stye insult, the fake. ailes, of course, is the now-deceased former ceo of fox news, the network hosting the debate. let's get insights now from cnn's jessica dean, john sdwraf avlon and jane goldmacer, part of the team behind it. i'm fascinated. we were joking before the show the old days of super pacs figuring out how clearly they could push through the alleged lines that exists was like the role of a candidate they could pick up and put into ads. this is not that. this is a full-scale debate cornucopia to some degree. >> yeah. i mean, the seniorpiece is what you were reading -- centerpiece is what you were reading from, this memo, the super pac strategy they think desantis should employ on stage. it's interesting they're writing that out. the super pac can't legally talk to ron desantis. the only they/t can tell them wt he should be doing is to post it on the internet. usually you can't find it easily, but this is published, and it's not just that memo. it's research documents about his rivals outlining where they think desantis should be hitting them. and really notable who he's focused on. the rameswamy stuff, not a candidate on anyone's radar, is rising. in the private polling postsed on the website it showed things we've seen in public polling which is him reaching 11% in new hampshire. that's a real threat to ron desantis. so desantis is obviously not wanting to hits donald trump. we've seen that on the campaign trail. >> right. >> and this menlo makes clear, well, maybe you should defend him. maybe the way ahead is defending him and this is a dubious strategy for republicans for years. that's certainly one they're outlining. >> i want to get to that idea in particular, chris christie obviously has been fully on attack mode with the former president. he's made clear that, a, he wants him on the debate stage, trying to taunts him onto the debate stage, and is ready to go after him if that's the case. in your story, it says, quote, the debate prep memo urges mr. desantis to defend trump when chris christie attacks him with a specific suggestion for the attack line. trump isn't here, so let's leave him alone. he's too weak to defend himself here. we're all running against him. i don't think we want to join forces with someone on this stage who's auditioning for a show on msnbc. >> that's why the consultants get paid the big bucks. those zingers, folks. look, you know, this whole thing is fascinating. great scoopage by shane and his colleagues. it shows, first of all, the utter absurdity of these laws that have been put in place, where pacs can't talk to the candidates so they post detailed memos on line for them to find. it also pulls the curtain back on the strategy. the strategy of attacking chris christie, that's, you know, not unexpected. but they're thinking about eventualits. someone came up with a rhyme and gas to take cash on that one. it shows how canvas is. we're going to have a ron desantis bingo card during the debate to see if he hits joe biden and the media three to five times, to see the lines that gets used. that's never a good day because for a candidate who's struggling with authenticity to have a game plan, that's going to make it even more difficult. >> i want to get more on the desantis campaign, through that dynamic in a second. you've been on the ground, the ramaswamy burst, it's clear there's private polling showing the same thing, a steady climb. nobody's gone after him. and i was texting this morning with a republican campaign official, not with the desantis campaign, saying how long are you guys going to hold off here? and the response i got was there's a lot there when we want to launch, it's justice not time yet. it seeps like it's about to be time. >> it's going to be time for a lot of them. we'll see it play out on the debate stage next week. i will tell you, i was in iowa about a month ago now, several weeks ago, for the freedom -- the faith initiative that mr. vander plat hosted. and that obviously is a roomful of evangelical, very conservative voters. and we saw -- it was one of the cattle call events, many people spoke. ramaswamy got a ton of applause, attention, people seemed very into him in the room. we see the bus traveling with him. he's getting a lot of attention, and he's getting a really hard look from some of these -- these voters that really like where donald trump is on a lot of things, and we see ramaswamy go more extreme on some things, even further right as it were. and he certainly is getting a look, and we're seeing that in the polling. to your point, i think for a lot of campaigns, especially desantis, it's probably time. >> the idea that trump has a level of softness in his numbers in iowa is one that i think is pervasive across campaigns that are losing to him by 30 points. we see it in public polling, as well. you have to take out the guy who's rising to some degree or woman who's rising to some degree. you're trying to carve up the other real estate. we know from polling 37% of the republican primary vote in one poll is hard core with donald trump, no matter what. which means you've got a supermajority looking for an off-ramp. they're all campaigning for that. and it's not a surprise they're going to go after vivek. look, sdants coming at there -- desantis is coming at this from a position of weakness. it's the latest bit of bad news for desantis land. they need create a clear contrast and regain momentum as the apparent alternative which they've been losing to a bunch of candidates now getting a second look in iowa and elsewhere. >> to that points, the super pac and the campaign not locally allowed to talk, how super pacs and campaigns communicate, not to this level that we've ever seen. that dynamic has been fascinating to me. it doesn't seem super positive all the time. >> yeah. >> where is it now? >> there's been real strategic disagreements. the desantis campaign has gone through three vets in the last month -- resets in the last month. the last is a notable one. the campaign manager was layered, and they brought in a deputy campaign manager who had been overseeing much of the super pac's operations in the early state. he's bringing the super pac's knowledge directly inside the campaign. and so i expect a little bit more seamsness between those two because of that movement. but look, i think when you think about the christie part of this moment oh and the ramaswamy you are looking at the box that desantis finds elimination. he wants to hits the anti-trump people to win some plowedets from the pro-trump people. hitting chris christie will be popular with trump fans. he needs to win over trump fans. and ramaswamy is taking those fans. there's donald trump and nothing in the memo about hitting donald trump. the guy in the front of the pac who may or may not be on that stage isn't the main focus, and there is, of course, a little bit of a repeat of what we saw in 2016. >> very much so. all right. stay with us. we've got a lot more to get to. again, great scoop by shane and the team. coming up, threats against the judge and jurors involved in the cases against the former president. donald trump and his accused co-conspirators have eight days to surrender in georgia. that's why herbal essences is packed with naturally derived plalant ingredients you love, and none of the stuff you don't. our sulfate-free collections smelell incredible... ♪ and leave your hair touchably soft and smooth. ♪ herbal essences with 30 grams of protein. those who tried me felt more energy in just two weeks! uuuhhhh... here, i'll take that! woohoo! ensure max protein, 30 grams of protein, 1 gram of sugar. enter the $10,000 powered by protein max challenge. ♪ ♪ (psst psst) ahhhh... with flonase, allergies don't have to be scary spraying flonase daily gives you long-lasting, non-drowsy relief. (psst psst) flonase. all good. now the calendar, the campaign, the courts, downright crazy. georgia prosecutors put a trial on track to trample all over the election calendar and glue cameras to a courtroom in the heart of the presidential nominating race. also, dismissed this as an accident or a series of unfortunate unconnected events to the former president soliciting on line at your own peril. federal agents arrested and charged a texas woman with threatening to murder the federal judge presiding over the trump 2020 election case. and the online trump mob puts the ordinary people who served on the trump grand jury under extraordinary threat. cnn's paula reid is live in washington. walk us through what this woman, abigail joshry is accused of doing. >> reporter: she is accused of calling judge chutkan's and threatening anyone who goes after trump. the judge was just assigned a case that was brought by federal prosecutors. and in this voicemail she allegedly says, "you are in our sights. we want to kill you." she allegedly made threats against chutkan's family and in a separate instance made comments about congressman sheila jackson lee and people in the lgbtq community. phil, federal judges, they do receive threats on occasion. this one we are told was not necessarily operational, but again when the former president mentions your name on social media, it certainly raises yourboro file and makes -- your profile and makes you more vulnerable to these kinds of threats. this woman is currently in detention and will have her first court hearing on september 13th. >> what more do we know about the online docksing of grand juries that were made in the indictment in georgia? >> reporter: this is incredibly troubling, but probably expected because on the third or fourth page of that indictment they listed the names of each of the grand jurors. that is the policy in fulton county, georgia. this doesn't happen at the federal level and in many other states and other places, but in fulton county, apparently in the interests of transparency and knowing who brought this indictment against you, they do list these names. and now pictures, profiles, even home addresses purporting to be those of these grand jurors have surfaced on line. now we have no way to verify this information. many of these appear to match the people listed in the indictment. the indictment is a public document. but it's unclear if these people who have been doxed are the same people or if they just have the same name. and phil, even one of the witnesses who's testified in this case, former state senator jen jerdin, said that threats like this could have a chilling effect when they eventually have to choose a real jury to hear this case. people are going to realize what's at stake and may not want to participate. >> yeah. it's a great point and a huge concern. paula, stick with us. also here, former federal prosecutor elie honig, former new york state prosecutor, joey jackson. that's the part i want to pick up on now. these grand jurors were not there because they volunteered. they weren't there because they -- they were there because they had to be. and now they're facing this. what does that do going forward? >> i think it's problematic. you expect people to participate in the process, and you want them to participate. and you want them in doing so to feel protected and to feel they could render conclusions as grand jurors that are consistent with laws and facts without political retribution or any harm. and so you have to imagine that this would chill them. obviously there are important distinctions as elie can tell you regarding what grand jurors do. they're not trial jurors, they're jurors to make an assessment as to whether there's probable cause to believe a crime was committed and the subjects of the proceeding committed it. it's not proof beyond a reasonable doubt and only needs to be a simple majority. the people who do that hear many cases in order to participate now and moving forward need to know that the government protects them. so i know the laws in georgia are different as it relates to transparency. perhaps they should be reconsidered moving forward to have grand jurors not have concerns about their health, their safety, and their families. >> i do want to ask you about the reporting about the woman that was arrested for threatening judge tanya chutkan. i want to read something that she said who in the voicemail. if trump doesn't get elect friday 2024 we are coming to kill you so tread lightly. profanity. it was interesting, we were talking to michael moore this morning, former prosecutor in georgia, who said judges get threats, right. that's not a new thing necessarily. but this is -- the federal authorities move fast here. >> yeah. nothing will mobilize federal authorities like a threat against a judge or prosecutor or official apparatus. they acted quickly, they made the arrest. this woman is behind bars right now because of this. look, the feds have to be on the highest alert here because we know that nobody has a platform and a microphone like donald trump. and it's not speculation, it's proven fact that people act on his words. we've seen it so many times over the course of january 6th, other examples of lone wolves. that's the fear at this point is individual actors who see things on their social media feeds who decide to take action, even in the form of a threat or god forbid worse than that. this is going to be a recurring problem. we've got four different cases happening. we've got all sorts of people who are vulnerable. all the authorities have to be responsible for this, and prosecutors have to be on top of it, as well. >> one thing, joey, that i wanted -- we're trying to figure out now the line that trump would have to cross to -- begin the fact that these cases are live right now, bring down some kind of sanctions, bring down in type of change. you have the trump on truth social say figure you go after me -- saying if you go after me i'll go after you, talking about a super pac that attacked him. timing doesn't match up there. if i'm reading reports that a failed former lieutenant governor of georgia, jeff duncan, busmisspelled will be testifying before the grand jury, he isn't, how is that not crossing a line? >> judges have a lot of discretion. if a judge gives the indication that you're not to talk about certain things, you don't talk about it. >> judges will give you a second chance, another opportunity, like people they have different fuses. but there has to be rules of decorum. if we're going to talk about, right, everyone being equal in the eyes of the law, that should not only apply, phil, to criminal prosecutions, it should apply to the decorum and the standards that the judge sets. and so when you look and examine this we know that words have consequences. look at what we're seeing. we saw, you know, harkening back, do you remember the speaker's husband getting attacked? right? people could be unglued. and so watch what you say, mind what you say. and i think there would be a point where a judge will say, hey, you know what, come with me. and perhaps secret service will be with him in a cell. >> sorry, this is a really difficult situation for judges and prosecutors because in a normal case someone says something like that, especially the comment about geoff duncan, shouldn't testify, you would immediately as a prosecutor go to court and ask for a person to be locked up or at least have their restrictions upped. but here it's hard because -- >> unprecedented. he's a former president. paul, i want to ask, one of the co-conspirators in the georgia case is rudy giuliani. an unindicted co-conspirator in the special counsel's case. you had this great reporting with kaitlan collins about rudy giuliani who we know has had some financial issues because of our colleague katelyn polantz actually going down to mar-a-lago to talk to trump about needing help on this front. what did you learn? >> yeah. rudy giuliani's currently facing seven-figure legal debt, and we learned that back in april giuliani and his longtime friend and attorney rob costello went down to florida to plead with trump to help giuliani with these bills. now we've learned they had at least two meetings while they were there, and we're told that trump in his trumpian indirect way did agree to provide some help but didn't commit to an amount or timeline. a month later, the trump-aligned pac save america did pay over $300,000 worth of bills that giuliani was facing. but otherwise, he hasn't received any additional money. and look, the big question going forward is whether trump is willing to, as he's usually reluctant to do this, but dig into his own pocket to pay giuliani's bills if for no other reason than to keep him in the fold. we are told that aides who were close to the former president are concerned that if giuliani is this vulnerable in terms of his bills, if trump doesn't help him, then he may be more apt to cooperate. there is, of course, something that parallels the situation with michael cohen, and they are really trying to avoid having anyone else who could be really helpful to prosecutors, right, go out and turn on the former president. so we'll see if giuliani gets any more help with those staggering legal bills. >> to that point, what's your response to kind of this dynamic now? >> look, the two biggest reasons that people cooperate in general is, one, they're facing print time which rudy giuliani now -- prison time which rudy giuliani now is, and two, finances. that said, i'm not cooperating with rudy giuliani in a million years if i'm a prosecutor. and i've cooperated with people who have done way worse things than giuliani has. murderers, i'd put them on the stand. the problem with rudy, he's not done anything nearly as bad but his credibility is zero. he has the least credibility of any human being i can think of. i don't see him as a viable cooperate for prosecutors. maybe i'm wrong. you have the defense view. >> i'm with you. >> that is exactly what we need on television. all right. thank you very much. appreciate. paula, great reporting. next, brand new reporting, how does president biden really feel about the latest chapter in his son's mounting legal troubles? details next. mlb partners witith t-mobile to not only enhance the fan experience, but to advance how the game is playayed. aaa relies on t-mobile's network to stay connected nationwide, so they can help get their members backck on the road. and we're helping pano ai innovate, to stop the spread of wildfires. now's the time to see what america's largest 5g network can do for your business. #1 isn't a status earned overnight. it's earned in every wash, and re-earned every day. tide. america's #1 detergent. subway's slicing their turkey fresh like on the titan turkey. piled high with double the cheese and more meat. i proffer freshly sliced turkey. it's my favorite mouth guard flavor. mmmm. now available at subway. the sub, not the mouth guard. you call a problem non grata. >> new cnn reporting out peers into the president's orbit, president biden's orbit, and find a deep rooted reluctance to mention his son and legal woes in front of dad. cnn's jeff zeleny is live in washington. you put together this story, your sources say there's worry inside the biden campaign right now about the president's seemingly blind approach to hunter biden. what did you learn? >> reporter: look, this is a chapter that president biden and certainly first lady jill biden had hoped would be closed. they thought that the investigation into their son hunter biden would be closed and they would move on before the campaign. we now, of course, understand after the special counsel announcement last friday that's not happening. and talking to a variety of advisers and allies and supporters of the president, they do not believe -- and research will show that voters do not necessarily mind this, unless there is a link that is tied to the president. as of now, there is not. they do wonder if there will be a blind spot about this because it is simply not mentioned or discussed on the campaign. one senior adviser put it like this to us, really is sinkly summed it up, saying hunter biden is not a topic of discussion in campaign meetings. it's just not addressed. that, of course, is because the president does not like to talk about this. this is a deeply personal family matter. however, we know that the republicans from the house committees to the republican presidential campaign trail talk about this considerabli. so there are some quiet to rumblings, is there a blind spot here for this biden campaign if this deepens. we are going to see likely a trial of the president's son unfold at the same time as a presidential campaign. this, of course, is unprecedented. so while the -- there certainly is not an equivalence between donald trump and this, republicans will try and make it so. starting perhaps next week on the debate stage in milwaukee. so while the president does not want to speak about this, some of his advisers are keeping a close eye on the fallout from all of this as it unfoefrld the next near -- unfolds over the next year and perhaps longer. >> a problem they didn't think they would be dealing with because of the plea deal and that's gone because of the special counsel. thank you so much. our great reporters and analysts are back with us now. just covered the white house for a bit, i have seen all of the polling that makes very clear that the president's son, investigations are nowhere near at the level of the economy, of health care, of any of the top-line issues that we see in poll after poll americans care about. i also know that they are furious about the idea that this is apples to apples with what the former president is facing. you can put those out there and make clear that's the case. the question becomes now, a special counsel, to jeff's point, you don't know where it's going to head. how real is that concern if you're a democrat right now? >> right because we have seen time and time again that special counsels sometimes stumble upon things that they weren't even looking for when they're going through these investigations. so that could happen. and look, jeff is exactly right. what i hear from republicans on the trail, when you're on the hill listening especially to house republicans but even some senate republicans, you hear hunter biden's name again and again and again. they are talking about it all the time. that's all they want to talk about, and they are. look, you have to be fair, they are using that because they tonight want to be talking about donald trump. there's no question about it. they don't want to answer questions about that. but -- >> also they've had a difficult time demonizing joe biden. doing it bypproxiy with hunter creates -- by proxy with hunter creates a moral equivalence with the trump family's challenges. you know this from covering the white house, there's deep reluctance as this reporting shows to raise this with president biden because he has stuck by his sole surviving son and will. and in private there are reports he's obsessed with the negative coverage of hunter. he's concerned, it's an irritant. that's understandable. not one that allies around him want to raise because it will derail a conversation. >> it is complicated. >> yes. >> if you're a senior member of the biden team and how he is with the family, his son, a lot is tied to the fact that his son is in recovery. >> yes. complicated things. >> and human. >> and i think you look the -- -- polling, hunter biden on a fox news poll a week ago in terms of if he did something illegal in february, 37%, in april 44%, now 50%. like the message is clearly getting out. i think obviously the plea deal and how it fell apart was public, and people are saying that, as well. >> he was ready to plead guilty. there's not a question he did something wrong. >> literally. the i think the question is, is this something that to the white house's point actually penetrates for if you're a suburban -- we talk constantly about the primary. what about the general election, the coalition that pushed biden over the top in 2020? suburban moms, his -- the people that moved his way? trump voters who moved his way, does it matter? >> i don't think this is an issue that people would answer a poll question saying they care about. they care about the look and economy and these issues. but between trump's indictments which also joe biden doesn't want his team and the dfrng talking about, he's issuing an order for the top person not to talk about two of the most talked about issues politically. that's a tough place to be on both of those counts. it's hard to never answer questions about his son's investigation. hard to never talk about the former president and the frontrunner to be a rival's criminal charges. and so it makes them not active participants in two of the biggest story lines. >> to your point about the general election, the place where it could transfer to independent voters to swing voters is if there were to be some connection between hunter biden's monetization of his relationships or names or claims and president biden. so far we need to keep saying that has not occurred. that's i think the way that that becomes a bridge to general election issue. >> we keep saying it has not occurred. but the internet, facebook -- a lot of these people are getting news, in from news sources, you know, it's about -- they keep that straight and keep the truth out there and not get joe biden, the president, swirled in with any sort of illegal things that may have happened. >> can i ask, you've covered capitol hill for a number of years. republicans for months if not longer were calling for a special counsel related to hunter biden. they got the special counsel, and this has been the response from some. take a listen. >> you should be pissed off. you should be pissed off because this appointment is illegal. it is contrary to the department of justice regulations, and it is designed to cover up wrongdoing from hunter biden, from joe biden, and from merrick garland. >> i believe that's why you saw merrick garland appoint a special counsel when he said he wasn't going to because we have built a case that will win in court. >> i'm tired. we need take the gloves off. there is ridiculous. >> what we need to do is bring this forward, bring in hunter biden, bring in joe biden. >> can i just tell you that senator ted cruz was one of a number of senate republicans who signed a letter last year asking for a special counsel in this case -- they wanted that, to your point. they've asked for it, they have hammered it home. why don't we have one? this is bad. this is a coverup. now they do have one and it's not good enough, it's also a cover-up. >> yeah. look, it's a catch 22. it's a double blind. you should be pissed off at the hypocrisy. the person acting as special counsel is a former trump appointee, weiss. and according to the attorney general, when he said he wanted special counsel stastus. you got it. >> i understand the question because of the irs whistleblowers and what they said. now he has the authority that they wanted -- okay. >> you get the point. >> i think there's a lot more to dive into. we'll do that. coming up, one 2024 gop hopeful is betting a huge new ad buy will put him on the path to success. who is it? we'll tell you after the break. the america's best celebebrity sale is happening now. and it's making quite the spectacle. for a limited time, get two pair of celebrity-inspired frames by privéevaux co-founder jamie foxx for only $89.95 book your exam tay. liberty mutual customis your car insurance... so you only pay for what you need. that's my boy. ♪ stay off the freeways! only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ [car screech] [car door slam] [camera shutter sfx] introducing ned's plaque psoriasis. 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(intercom) flightdeck, see you at the house warming. wake up, achievers. you're making the most of every hour of your life. except the hours that you're sleeping. so why do we leave so much untapped potential on the table? this is a next level bed, for a next level you. my circadian rhythm is kicking your circadian rhythms butt! it's not a competition. i know, but i'm still winning! so, it is a competition. save 50% on the sleep number limited edition smart bed. plus, free home delivery when you add a base. shop now only at sleep number. - [announcer] do you have an invention idea but don't know what to do next? call invent help today. they can help you get started with your idea. call now 800-710-0020. south carolina senator tim scott is betting that big spending on the airwaves will pay off in a big number at the ballot box. his campaign is placing a new $8 million ad buy, that's in addition to the more than $6.5 million that's already spent by the time the first presidential primary contest rolls around. voters could see $65 million worth of pro-scott ads. when you add the group together, outside spending, he has a ton of money. my panel's back with me. shane, you're one of the best money reporters in the game in terms of understanding how things are working. my question now, if you look at top line numbers is that's a ton of money, he's great at raising money. do we feel like -- do you see an impact here? >> you know, we haven't really seen an impact of the ads yet. he's still in the single digits in iowa where his ads have been in heavy rotation. >> hang on. i want to pull up the iowa numbers to demonstrate what you're talking about. the 2024 ad spending in iowa right now, you have the pro-desantis super pac, scott, 3.8, anti-trump, 3.3 million. you add the pro-scott pac to it, as well, where we get the 6.6. that's a ton of money in iowa. >> yeah. and it -- it's making a difference in that people increasingly know him. i was just there for a few days, and he's a little bit under discussion, but he hasn't broken through. he's still in the single digits. look, that $65 million is a big number. and this eight is actually a big number from the campaign because in the sort of wonky world of television ads, the campaign money goes much farther than the super pac money. might be equivalent of $30 million from the pro-desantis super pac because the money buys more television ads. it hasn't connected so far. in the next bit, it's a lot of money from him. >> yeah. it's interesting, there was a -- i don't remember who -- one of our reporters was on the ground, i was reading through their file that they send us, as you know, after every campaign event. he had a call-in response with an iowa crowd -- >> going to bring it up -- >> it was fascinating, basically saying we can go off the air here because my ads have worked. >> right. and then he has this call-in response and says what i say and they respond back to him. he kind of laughs and says, oh, i'm glad that my money is going where -- that it's working on thtv ads. this does take time to build that up. but certainly for that group, it had broken through. >> look, for iowa grass top leaders looking for an alternative to trump finding who they can coalesce behind, tim scott's core message and appeal, an optimistic view of america, that's appealing. i think the ads keep him top of mind, particularly in this critical early states. >> what's also interesting is the shift in kind of the desantis message and iowa was a place where they thought they were going to do very well. they still believe that they've got a ground operation that can allow that it to happen. take a listen to this piece of a desantis pac ad. >> freedom isn't given, it's earned. that's exactly what ron desantis did. after working his way through yale and harvard law he volunteered, deployed to iraq. a lieutenant, he earned a bronze star and assisted navy s.e.a.l.s. service to country is ron desantis' story. that's the american story. >> it reminds you that ron desantis for all his notoriety and us talking about him and him being the florida governor, he's still introducing himself to a lot of voters out there. and sometimes when we'll go into some of these smaller events, he'll say, well, in florida i did x, y, and z. in florida -- and i've seen people go, truly, did you know that? i didn't know that. i think there's an elements where he is still introducing himself. i think it is interesting that this is all about biography, all about service. this is not anti-wokism, this is not disney, this is about a man who has served his country. >> yeah. and if there's a moment where they look back and put together if something went wrong, if it doesn't end up going his way, the fact he's doing that at this point as opposed to in first $20 million, $30 million might be something they point at. appreciate the insights and reporting. ahead, an appeals court rules in favor of limiting access to the abortion pill mifepristone setting the case on track for a supreme court showdown. stay with us. they charge you a lot. we charge you a little. they put their names o on arena. we put ours on my lower back. so naturally when they announced they'd be raising their prices due to inflation, wewe decided to deflate our pris due to not hating you. and if this were one of their ads, they'd end it here with a "happy customer". so we'll end ours with an angry goat. oh h-ho, look at the angry goat. are you keeping as much of your investment gains as possible? high taxes can erode returns quickly. at creative planning, your portfolio is managed in a tax-efficient manner. it's what you keep that really matters. book your free meeting today at creativeplanning.com. the legality of abortion appears to be headed right back to the doorstep of the supreme court. the fifth circuit court of appeals handed down its decision on its use of mifepristone, ruling in favor of limiting access to the abortion medication. vice president kamala harris blasted the decision in a statement, warning that, "this lawsuit is a threat to a woman's freedom to make decisions about her own body and another step toward the ultimate goal of a nationwide abortion ban." medication abortion makes up the majority of abortions obtained in the united states. this is in the center of a fierce political battle right now. cnn's senior supreme court analyst joan biskupic joins me now. what does this ruling actually do? >> sure, phil, good to see you. this is the most important abortion case in federal litigation right now since the supreme court reversed roe v. wade last session. and you're absolutely right. it's barreling toward the supreme court right now. at issue is the authority of the food and drug administration to review drugs for their safety and effectiveness. and in this case the federal appeals court that ruled yesterday said that a lower court judge was wrong to say that the core year 2000 approval for mifepristone was flawed, so that stays, so the drug would stay on the market for some use, but what the appeals court did yesterday was to roll back -- potentially roll back various protocols that increased women's access to the drugs. here are some of the provisions. it would no longer make the drug available to women up to about ten weeks into their pregnancy. it would go back to about seven weeks. and it would no longer be available to be prescribed by non-physicians. and there would be no option to obtain the drug by mail after consultation with physicians or other medical personnel. so it would really limit the availability of the drug, which is why the department of justice immediately said that it would appeal to the supreme court, not just to make sure that the drug was available to women who needed to end a pregnancy but also because of the fda's approval authority that's at issue here. and phil, that would extend not only to mifepristone but all drugs, for cancer, diabetes, epilepsy, multiple conditions that rely on the food and drug administration's expertise. so this is all going to be teed up soon with the supreme court likely resolving this case by next summer, 2024, phil. >> right in the middle of an election year. joan biskupic, great reporting as always. i appreciate it. and a quick programming note. "the whole story" breaks down the details of the criminal indictment of donald trump in georgia. "the whole story with anderson cooper" airs sunday at 8:00 p.m. eastern on cnn. thanks for joining "inside politics." "cnn news central" starts right after the break. the effects can seem like magic. but there'e's no magic involve. 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