Reubens. He was a true original and a bright light in many, many peoples lives. He will be missed. Paul romans was 70 years old. Thats it for us, the news continue. The source with Kaitlan Collins starts now. Tonight, straight from the source. Donald trump expecting another indictment quote any day now. And as legal peril grows, so does his political power. The staggering new numbers and 40 million ways that his base may help keep him out of prison. Plus, trumps newest codefendant and maralago manager ups emerges from obscurity to the center of the storm, swarm today by cameras at his First Court Appearance but not as last. Could his indictment and up helping his boss delay that trial until after the election . And as President Biden reverses a trump decision to move Space Command to alabama, some politicians are blasting the politics are behind it. We will speak to one of the next. Im Kaitlan Collins and this is the source. Tonight trump is predicting that his next indictment is imminent. Any day now is the way he warded it in a no post on social media and of course with other Target Letters and other indictments, he has been the one to tell us about them. Though his legal problems seem to be growing, and amounting exponentially, his political fortunes are growing and growing as well. Its coming into clear view today just how m is dominating the nomination fight. A brandnew poll shows that he has a 37 point lead over his next closest republican rival. Florida governor ron desantis, in a New York Times cnn poll of kely Republican Voters, and more than 50 points ahead of the rest of the pack. So as this of course is going on too, impeachments, to criminal indictments as we are seeing here, as this is in continuing, weighing what Republican Voters are gonna decide. Im joined by one of those republican candidates in the race, former arkansas governor lisa hutchinson. Thank you for being so here with us tonight. Now the republican front runner says hes gonna be indicted any day now. Why arent these indictments hurting him with your partys voters . While, they are. Even though he has a grip on the campaign, on his candidacy, its a loosening grip. There is a growing resurgent effort against the trump gop establishment, and that resurgent effort is growing, its because he has misled his supporters. He told them that i am fighting for you, that is really asking them to fight for him by paying his legal fees when shes used 60 million of Campaign Funds that he solicited from small donors across america to play legal fees. These facts as they come out are going to slow his campaign down. The last place you see it will probably be in the poll numbers. But you are seeing that resurgency grow and i expect to continue to do so. What are you basing that off of governor . We are not seeing that in the numbers at this point. You are not seeing that when you go to iowa, New Hampshire and you talk to voters. You hear some concerns but overwhelmingly based on these new numbers, he is still the dominant force in your party despite those indictments. Whenever you see campaign rallies, there is incredible turnout. He brings a real Entertainment Value to his campaign. But whenever you look at winning in 2024, there is a recognition that will be problematic with trump leading the ticket, not just in his campaign but down the way. The debate is very important. The debate is going to bring out many of these facts. I am doubtful that donald trump will show up on the debate, because i expect to be there, i plan on being there, and these are facts that will be brought out and that he will not be able to withstand that type of scrutiny. You and i both dont think hes going to be there based on what we know, right now, but when you look at thipo, it finds that only 19 of republicans in your party believe, only 17 see the former president as having countries committed any serious federal crimes despite the fact that he is facing another potential indictment this week. What do you say to those voters . What do i say to them as that we cant win with donald trump leading the ticket. I tell them that these are very serious criminal charges and they are gonna have to cast a vote as to whether hes gonna be our nominee or not while these charges are pending. Can you imagine the circumstances that we have somebody leaving our ticket that has been convicted of a felony or soon going to trial . This is unbelievable in american political history. I dont know that weve ever, i know we havent had these type of circumstances before. And so, i know the see the poll numbers and i believe there is merit that theres gonna be a quiet reduction in those poll numbers as more of the facts come out and is more of the candidates join in and there is more candidates joining in my resurgency, and i think thats going to start having an impact. So you think the polls are just wrong . No, no no. I am saying that the polls are reflecting where we are today, but i am saying as you go on, hes going to lose support. Those poll numbers will go down, and you see it now and the donor base. You see it in the nervousness of iowans and a recognition that we need another alternative. But the last numbers that willo. We might not see that dramatic change until later this fall. So youve got to be patient, youve got two choices. 52 other Republican Voters who were surveyed here say they are not considering anything you talked about his legal fees there. Weve now learned that his Political Group spent more than 40 million on legal fees and just the first half of this year alone defending trump, his advisers and others. Is the Republican Party turning into a Legal Defense fund at this point . Well, hes merged his campaign into his defense strategy. His campaign is all about simply trying to address the criminal cases that are against him, both in terms of his fundraising but also in terms of his rallies, and shaping Public Opinion. If he loses the Public Opinion, if he loses the fund raising base, he has no defense strategy. And so its all merged and together, and that should be an alarming circumstance in fact for the gop and candidates that are gonna have to be run next year. Do you agree with will hurd but he said friday night that trump is running for president to stay out of prison . I know. I think he is using his run for president to run his campaign. That is the ultimate what he is doing now, and so becoming president is a hopeful thing obviously for him. But the whole point is they are merged together right now. I phrase it in a different way. This is an alarming day for our party. The debate is going to raise these issues. I need everybody support to be there. A set 2024. Com, 1 helps me get on that debate stage, we will raise these issues that are important to the public. Governor, you said his Political Legal strategy is a political one. How do you not agree with that sentiment if he is running this race in a way to benefit and to help insulate him from his legal issues . While he is running this race in a way that finds his campaign, the keeps the Public Opinion moving in his direction, thats what hes attempting to do, and thats why hell continue to have rallies. But youre asking me the motive as to why he ran to begin with, which was last year. I cant judge that. I respect will, he can say what he wants to say, all phrase in my way, and say that trumps candidacy is dangerous for the American Public. We have to beat him at the ballot box and people ask me what is your chance of winning . Neither have to elect him or coronated him or get in fight. Im getting in there and fighting for the Republican Party that i believe in and the country that i want for our future and for our grandchildrens future. It cant be led by donald trump. If you dont make the debate stage, will you stay in the 2024 race . I intend to make the debate stage. We have had 10,000 new donors just in the last couple of weeks and so we have momentum there. I have full expectation to be there. People expect me to be on that debate stage and i intend to be there. I know that the 40,000 donors will come through for us. I know you tend to be there, and you want to be there, but i think theres a real question that you will. When you look at this pollhe didnt just pull just trump, they pulall republicans new governorontit 1 when it comes to demraphics when it comes to, hispanics, evangelical, those with or without a college degree. When you see those numbers, why do you think youll be in that debate stage in just a month from now . While the rasmussen poll, very credible poll had me at 4 tied with a number of other contenders there. Lets just look at a broad variety of poles there. But again, i am not as known as some others that are out there. I want people to hear my story. Being a federal prosecutor, head of the dea, worked on Border Security issues in the bush administration, congress, a governor for eight years. I want them to hear that record of experience and as we get out there, expect those numbers to change. Governor asa hutchins in, we will see if they do, and of trumps numbers change with those pending indictments. Like so much for joining us tonight. Thank you caitlin and great to be with. You. Thank you. For more on this i want to bring in jamal simmons, former Communications Director for Vice President kamala harris, and alyssa farah griffin, white house commuters casons director. When youre looking at these polls alyssa, what is the broader picture of this entire New York Times poll is just how large his lead is over the all the other republican candidates. If youre asia hatches in iran to, whats your reaction when you see this poll . This poll should send shockwaves through any member the Republican Party wants to see the party take a different direction from donald trump. This notion that rhonda sat is with supposed to be an air apparent, and he had a real shot at that after the midterms, but thats largely been squandered. I have to put some degree of blame on some of the top contenders after donald trump, whether its rhonda scientist. Nikki haley, they have not aggressively taken on donald trump. A former president whos got near 100 name idea in this country. This notion that you are somehow just going to beat him by kind of defining yourself and maybe rolling out a great policy proposal. That doesnt work in Donald Trumps america. There has to be an effort about why is not a credible leader, Weizmann Unfit for office, talk about his legal exposure. How many in indictments do we have to have . I think that folks are think theyre smart that like to try to wait for some magic to happen, is no indication thats good. And going to happen. Republican is in endorsing a, maybe they should get indicted in the Republican Party and that would help them. When you hear this a lot of the, time is too many candidates, and thats what trump is above it all, because he splits the dissension. But when you look at this poll, they eliminate everyone else head to head in a p,nd desanti trump is so far ahead of in. Look at the number 62 to 31 . Even if ust e two of them. The actual numbers are even more impressive than this spread. 54 to 17. Its a pretty big deal. Donald trump clearly has the force when it comes to this republican primary, too bad its on The Dark Side rather in the lights. Clearly Donald Trumps the big character here. The question i think Tt Gornor Hutchinson was getting at a second ago, is that there are a few pivot points when it comes to campaign. The debates will be one of those pivot points. Remember, it takes a horse to beat a horse. Right now, nobody really knows anything about the rest of these candidates. Once they see them onstage, they see how they perform, i think then theyll take a poll in New Hampshire, South Carolina after that. Well see where this race is. But is a policy that matters. What is the take away from this, because the New York Times looked at all sides of the issue, whether people believe that trans people should be able to identify the gender they do, or you dont. By the should believe the changes we made to Social Security or medicare they shouldnt. Whether corporations to provide promote left or woke as desantis puts it or the republicans just a bit. On every side of the issue, Republican Voters still sided with trump over desantis, even at some of the issues that he says he is stronger than trump on. I think policy matters to a certain degree but i think we live in such a 24hour news cycle social media and violent, personalities really dry things. I dont think theres a bigger personality than donald trump. I dont think hell show up at the debate. If i was advising him i, would advise him not to. I would expect to have counted program which would use him as much as the people of them. I think with desantis sinking that there is an opportunity for somebody to emerge as the number two. I think its likely and nikki haley or a tim scott but it will acquire require them to get aggressive and define why donald trump cannot be leader. Part of its electability issue. Joe biden is chomping at the bit to run against donald trump because he thinks he can beat him again. If its a nikki haley, attempt scott, a will hurd, thats a much more challenging thing for the president. The argument that ron desantis makes a those two issues that he can get things done that he can be joe biden, thats where the art is. But when New York Times ann asked republican likely voters that they believe rot trump gets to get things done, 62 to 70 . The ability beat biden they gave trump 58 , and desantis 22 . Those are arguments hes been making on the campaign trail. Thats absolutely true. This poll is devastating for desantis in every possible way. Including the people that say they are favorably inclined to him, with 66 . Among those people, donald trump still beat him 49, 48. Its a pretty tough road for him. Not even in just those issues, its about trumps legal exposure. There were republicans 22 i believe when theyre looking at Trump Desantis had to head matchup, even if they believe that trump committed serious federal crimes, they would still pick him over desantis. You are republican, what does that say about where Republican Voters . I think that means that donald trump is not doing a masterful job at convincing the American Public that this is a witch on. These are not two allegations, are coming after him because hes defending you. All not true, but thats what hes done, and hes been aided by a lot of republicans in the party. If he is the nominee, they are going to bear the brunt of that. When he the, i think well lose to joe biden. He is so strong, he gets indicted and everybody else has campaign problems. Governor asa hutchins, and well see if hes right about that production. Jamal simmons, tank you for being here tonight. We got our First Look Tonight Today Have The Second Person accused of conspiring with trump to obstruct justice what. 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