quote, president donald j. trump directed his lawyer rudy giuliani to make a remarkable call. mr. trump wanted him to ask the department of homeland security if it could legally take control of votinging m imachines in key states. >> some of the white house records turned over to the january 6th committee were torn up, we're told, and it was trump who ripped them to pieces and they had to be taped together by national archive staffers. and marc short testified before the house select committee last week in response to a subpoena. it is the most significant sign to date that pence's team is cooperating with the probe. >> joining me now is former attorney general and former white house counsel under president george w. bush, alberta gonzalez. thank you for being with us. you heard what "the times" is reporting that donald trump directed rudolph giuliani to call homeland security about seizing voting machines. your reaction? >> i'm not surprised, quite frankly, john. it is sad that i feel that way. but given everything that has been reported about what happened in the trump presidency around that period of time, i'm not surprised at all, quite frankly. it is obviously very disappointing. i said i think the weekend after the election, donald trump lost the election, and, you know, i think this reflects an individual who is in denial, and i think he was assisted by people, you know, within his circle and i think that's unfortunate as well. and so i think it is good that we're finding out what actually happened. and we'll see whether or not there are any consequences. i think there may be some decisions ahead for the attorney general in terms of whether or not to impanel a grand jury and whether or not to -- i think he's going to look into this and see whether or not there should be something that the department of justice should do in response. >> right. let's talk about that a little bit more. you said disappointing. do you think something legally incriminating about this information? >> could be. yes, obviously could be. from as minor as destruction of government records, but obviously that's minor comparison to the possibility that he in fact aptly participated in trying to overturn the election and that's a very serious matter. so the department of justice will look to see whether or not any federal laws have been violated and can be prosecuted. and so we still have a long way to go, but obviously whether or not a crime was committed here, i think the behavior that's being described is extremely troubling. and i think it -- again, it reflects a personality that of an individual that, like a child, unwilling to accept reality, and i think it is a reflection of a person who actually -- who is a loser. donald trump lost the election. and is someone unwilling to accept that. and i think that's very, very unfortunate and i think it's been harmful, certainly to the republican party, but more importantly harmful to this country. it made it more difficult, i think, for president biden to govern and i think, you know, he's -- president biden is dealing with some extraordinary challenges and to have this kind of distraction i think is very unfortunate. >> were you the attorney general this morning? would you empanel a grand jury? >> you know, i certainly would take a look at that, john, but, again there is going to -- the attorney general, the department of justice is always going to have more information in the public. certainly at the outset. and so it is going to depend on what merrick garland is looking at, what his advisers are telling him and so, you know, i don't know. i don't have the answer to that. >> a lot of public information, though, i'm sure. one would think, one would hope merrick garland knows a lot more than we do right now because of the investigation going on. but there is so much out in public right now, and you mentioned, you know, if donald trump actively tried to overturn the election, we have known for a long time he did and he literally told us just yesterday, like, literally in writing that that's what he was doing. he put out that statement about mike pence, where he said that mike pence, you know, could have overturned the election, which is what he was urging right there. it is almost a letter of intent. >> well, look, let's be clear. mike pence does not have the authority. did not have the authority or responsibility to overturn the election. just didn't exist. and, again, this is another indication of an individual, unwilling to accept reality and looking to blame anybody. that's what he's doing today. blaming mike pence, blaming the florida secretary of state -- the georgia secretary of state and other elected officials because unwilling to accept the fact that he is a loser. he lost the election. and, you know, you keep pressing about what the department of justice is going to do, i don't know quite frankly. i have confidence in merrick garland in terms of looking at the evidence. this is obviously a very important decision and it is one that he'll take with -- taking into consideration all the facts, hearing advice from the advisers, and so, you know, i'm not in a position to make that call. >> no, but you can appreciate, you're one of few people who held the job of attorney general. it is not like we have hundreds of attorneys general of the u united states that we can say, hey, and what do you think, you had this job before, so you're uniquely qualified to talk to us about this situation. >> well, and i am talking to you about the situation and i'm telling you that what i would do is what merrick garland is doing, which is to evaluate the situation. and i don't have all the information that he's going to be evaluating. i can't comment on that. i think you want me to say, i wouldn't prosecute him, i wouldn't impanel a grand jury, i can't say that, i don't know. >> i want you to speak your mind. i'm curious based on your experience and based on your view of the facts that are in the public domain right now what you think. but i appreciate your reticence on that. let me ask you about your experience as white house counsel, because apparently maloney was in the room at various times or had knowledge of some of these requests. how high would your level of alarm have been had you heard the president say, call and see if homeland security can seize these voting machines? >> it would be extremely troubling. and i would have a very serious conversation with the president to advise him that i think this would be a bad, bad idea. and, you know, from my perspective, as someone who worked with george w. bush, this scenario is so impossible to even think about, but, you know, if i had to hypothetically in the room with donald trump when this directive -- when i hear this directive, you know, i would have a -- i would quickly have a conversation with the president. and i might even tell everyone stand down. let's not do anything until i have this conversation with the president. i would want to make sure the president understands exactly what he was doing. and the possible consequences of this kind of directive. so, you know, john, i really am glad to be on this show. there are so many important things on tap right now. can i have -- i want to make one comment about the last segment about ted cruz's comment about the supreme court. obviously i was involved in the selection and appointment of john roberts and sam alito to the supreme court. i know what the process is from the inside. the notion that ted's comment, whom i respect, are nonsensical. there is nothing wrong with saying as a president, i'm going to -- my hope is -- my intention is to nominate someone, a black woman, a woman, a hispanic, there is nothing wrong, i think, in my judgment, in the president saying that. the problem becomes if the president nominates someone who is not qualified. i have every expectation that president biden is going to nominate a black woman to the supreme court who is extremely qualified, based upon the names that have been mentioned, and i've looked at their resumes and backgrounds, these are extremely well credentialed individuals and from my perspective more than qualified to serve on the supreme court. and so i just find senator cruz's comments really kind of silly. >> alberto gonzales, terrific answers to the questions i asked and answers to the questions i didn't ask, which makes news in and of themselves. thank you for coming on. great to see you this morning. >> thank you. meanwhile, the lie that pervasive voter fraud is somehow affecting the outcome of elections is leading to dangerous language from some republicans. this is mike detmer, a republican candidate for michigan state senate, this is what he said when asked what can be done to protect republican ballot observers. >> what can we do to prepare for that? >> the second amendment isn't there for hunting rights. it's not there for self-defense. the second amendment is there, the founders put it there to protect others. the ideal thing is to do this peacefully. that's ideal. but the american people at some point in time if we can't change the tide, we need to be prepared to lock and load. >> joining us now to discuss this is michigan secretary of state jocelyn benson. thank you so much, secretary, for being with us. i know that you said you referred these comments to the michigan attorney general's office. do you think that there is a crime here? >> yes. i think that when you're arguing -- threatening to intimidate voters with actionable specifics that law enforcement absolutely needs to investigate to ensure, again, that we're doing everything we can to protect american citizens when they go to the polls in any election, from any threats or fear of harm. >> does what he said -- does that encourage armed conflict at polling places in your view? >> it is pretty clear that's what he's calling for. i think we have to realize this conversation, this call to arms is taking place in a greater context, a greater context of, you know, attempted coups, of attempted efforts to overturn the will of the people. this very conversation took place in the context of also telling people to unplug voting machines. if they don't like what they see, which is tampering with election equipment. there is a number of potential legal violations. there is a number of unsafe violent consequences that could result in what we know, what all the research shows is that violent threats and particularly calls to violence can lead to violence at the polls and, you know, of course, that's what the january 6th committee is also investigating with regards to the violence at the u.s. capitol on january 6th. >> the danger of being involved in elections, it is not an abstract one to you to be clear to our viewers. you were at your house in december of 2020 when a few dozen armed protesters surrounded your house. you were there with your young son. do you worry that it -- that this sort of encourages that, the targeting of individuals like yourself and just speak to what that was like. >> yes. and thank you. it was harrowing. for me in particular in that moment i recognized, you know, while dealing with trying to keep my son safe and create an air of calm in my house that also these attacks aren't necessarily aimed at me as an individual, they're aimed at our democracy, they're aimed at that point trying to overturn the will of the voters. and reaction to that. so i have a responsibility as a state chief election officer to stand guard over the will of the voters, whatever it may be, whoever they may vote for. and in some ways it only made me more determined to do that work and to do it with integrity and to do it with determination, to ensure our democracy prevails. however, those threats and these calls to action for violence at the polls and everything else that is part of the misinformation and the lies right now circulating around our democracy are also manifesting themselves in real threats to local election officials who don't necessarily have the same spotlight or the same even protection that someone like myself at the state wide level does. and that's what i'm really concerned about. the election workers, the poll workers, you know, which in part are those who have been targeted in the conversation we were just having, and the threats to their livelihood and what could happen if we lose the ability of these professionals to do their jobs with integrity and with determination. then our democracy really does become threatened. >> they're taking on a whole world of worry that was never part of the job and they are not compensated for and shouldn't have to deal with in the u.s. so you -- i want to ask you, you sent a letter to the january 6th committee, that had details on efforts to overturn biden's victory in your state, in michigan. we have now learned that there are actually two versions of an executive order to seize voting machines, one to the pentagon, one to dhs. what is your reaction to learning that? >> i'm, you know, i'm disappointed and frustrated and angry, like everyone else, hearing and being reminded of this. i also lived through this in december of 2020. where every day, almost hourly, there were stories like this coming out, indications that this could happen and, you know, we had issues where there was clear coordination between the trump campaign and his attorneys and a lot of our efforts in michigan to protect the vote and efforts at the local level interfere with those protections. so my view is all of this was coordinated and all of this was coordinated within an effort to overturn the will of the people in michigan and around the country and nullify the votes of millions of americans. and recognizing that, the importance of the federal government right now, the justice department, the january 6th committee, investigating, gathering more evidence, unveiling more truth and seeking accountability for everyone involved in this un-american effort to overturn an election needs to be held accountable and we need to get to the truth. >> i appreciate you joining us this morning, michigan secretary of state jocelyn benson. >> thanks for having me. >> all right, countdown is on for the beijing winter olympics. now just three days away. team usa bobsledder elena myers taylor said she tested positive for covid upon arrival, but she's optimistic she'll be able to compete. she's one of two dozen new cases detected despite the events closed loop bubble. selena live in beijing with the latest. >> reporter: around 70 positive covid cases involving athletes or team officials and for the athletes, we talked about this during the tokyo games, it is heart breaking and frustrating since some of them feel perfectly healthy. so in addition to taylor, there is a skier, audrey king is stuck in isolation, but asymptomatic. any positive case in the closed loop they immediately get sent to isolation , they cannot leav until they clear two covid tests. that can take as long as weeks, but these games not just difficult for the athletes. it is also very tough on the local chinese staff inside the closed loop. today's a lunar chinese new year, the most important holiday, like christmas, and thanksgiving, combined, and important time to be with family. but all the staff here, they're stuck inside this loop, and earlier today i spoke to this woman who was standing over on this side of the fence so she could be as close as possible to her family, they were outside of the closed loop on the other side of the fence, her two young s sons, waiting for her meters away, saying how much they loved her, how much they missed her. she worked during the 2008 games, she said back then the mood was different. everyone was excited. it was-l like a big party. she said this time everything is so tough. >> it is nerve wracking, flat out nerve wracking for the athletes and for the spectators. selina wang, thank you for your reporting. we look forward to more from you in the coming weeks. we're monitoring this huge fire at a fertilizer plant in north carolina. wake forest canceled classes over fears the entire plant could explode. we have new details ahead. plus, why are efforts to ban books in schools spreading across the united states? and what can be done about it? a reality check coming up. plus, a shocking case of road rage. a man opening fire on a fellow driver. we have details ahead. ♪ got my hair ♪ ♪ got my head ♪ ♪ got my brains ♪ ♪ got my ears ♪ ♪ got my heart ♪ ♪ got my soul ♪ ♪ got my mouth ♪ ♪ i got life ♪ i don't just play someone brainy on tv - i'm an actual neuroscientist. and i love the science behind neuriva plus. unlike ordinary memory supplements, neuriva plus fuels six key indicators of brain performance. more brain performance? yes, please! neuriva. think bigger. age is just a number. and mine's unlisted. try boost® high protein with 20 grams of protein for muscle health. versus 16 grams in ensure high protein. boost® high protein also has key nutrients for immune support. boost® high protein. what happens when we welcome change? we can transform our workforce overnight out of convenience, or necessity. we can explore uncharted waters, and not only make new discoveries, but get there faster, with better outcomes. with app, cloud and anywhere workspace solutions, vmware helps companies navigate change-- meeting them where they are, and getting them where they want to be. faster. vmware. welcome change. ♪ limu emu ♪ and doug. we gotta tell people that liberty mutual customizes car insurance so you only pay for what you need, and we gotta do it fast. 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[limu emu squawks] he'll be back. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty, liberty, liberty, liberty. ♪ legislators nationwide are drafting bills to restrict curricula to control the conversation of race and to remove books from library shelves. john avlon with a reality check. >> remember when republicans were running on protecting free speech, good times. turns out what they really meant was free speech for me, but not for thee. fueled by fear of critical race theory, conservatives are responding with speech codes of their own. latest example, a new bill pushed in new hampshire which seeks to expand prohibition on teacher advocacy of subversive doctrines. that sounds creepily mccarthyite, it is partly because it throws cold water on the teaching of communism, marxism and socialism, no word from bernie sanders on how he feels about that. the bill goes farther, targeting any doctrine or theory promoting a negative account or representation of the founding history of the united states of america. including a ban on teaching the united states was founded on racism. now, someone should remind these folks that their state motto is live free or die. just in case that needs some clarification, the dictionary definition of freedom is the power or right to act, speak or think as one wants, without hindrance or restraint. which, of course, is the opposite of what's being proposed. look, you can be deeply patriotic and not pretend our country is perfect, but that common sense balance seems to be in short supply. because this isn't an isolated incident. florida, governor ron desantis is backing a bill. makes me wonder whatever happened to the whole don't care about your feelings thing this is trying to legislate around people's feelings. should really be called the trigger warning for white guys bill. there is similar examples in texas where new laws restrict the way history and race are taught, a lone star state legislator submitted a list of 850 suspect books to school superintendents, including works by margaret atwood and tan hasse coates, resulting in books being removed for review in districts like san antonio. in virginia, the new governor following through on campaign ads highlighting a conservative activist who complained about toni morrison novel "beloved" with an executive order banning divisive concept crt, setting up a snitch line where parents can lodge complaints about teachers. moral panic has been catching. according to a study by pan america, in the first nine months of last year, 24 state legislatures introduced 54 bills and restricted teaching in public schools, higher education and state agencies. most recently the pulitzer prize winning graphic novel "maus" was pulled from the shelves. you would think a chronicle of the holocaust would have caught their attention. but their action succeeded in rocketing the book back to the top of the best-seller list, which is a healthy response. on the flip side, getting far less attention, washington state school board last week decided to drop the classic to kill a mockingbird from the ninth grade required reading list because of racist language, and white savior complex. wait until they get to huckleberry fin. banning books looks bad in the rear view mirror. it is a sign of weakness, not strength. in this rush to the culture war ramparts we're losing sight of common sense. we need to try to apply common standards, rootd rooted in obje fact facts. liberal democracy 101, so don't complain about cancel culture and then try to cancel voices on the other side. because if you really love this country, then have the confidence to recognize the good and the bad in our past. if you really love freedom, then have the courage to extend that principle consistently, beyond politics, especially on campus. and that's your reality check. >> you know, as a student told us the other day, history has not ever looked fondly on people who ban books. >> that's right. a universal truth. >> it does not age well. john avlon, thank you very much. a bipartisan group of governors is telling president biden the country needs to move away from the pandemic. we're going to speak to a democratic mayor who is lifting covid measures in his own city. and breaking this morning, pfizer is about to seek fda authorization for its vaccine for kids under 5. we'll have everything you need to know ahead. 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>> well, first of all, glad to be with you this morning. it is time for us to begin to manage the sustained presence of this virus and amongst us, but that people of denver have done such a good job in doing what's been asked of them, get vaccinated, get boosted, and begin to practice the kind of behavior knowing that this virus is going to be with us. we are now 78% vaccinated, 40% and growing, in terms of people being boosted. and we also have a natural immunity from, of course, unfortunately omicron being around us and so we -- science, the numbers telling us, science is telling us it is okay to drop the mask, but make sure you're man managing the situation going forward. >> you also say we have to learn to live with it. what exactly does that mean? >> well, i, again, it is going to be with us for a while. science tells us this virus has potential to stick around, we may have other variants that come out and as our public health director bob mcdonald said yesterday, you know, what omicron showed us, we're beginning to see the waning of the impact of this virus again because of the number of people who are vaccinated and people who have natural immunity from the omicron. we believe that future variants will continue to be mild or milder than what we saw with omicron. so we'll continue to follow science, we'll continue to follow the data, we believe we're going to have to have a managed mentality of the virus with us for quite some time. and hopefully it just continues to be maybe similar to a common cold and doesn't continue to result in hospitalizations and deaths amongst us as we go forward. >> look, i think this is the most important discussion or such an important discussion i should say in terms of where we are in this pandemic. and the way you're talking about it is that you are assessing risk. and you think right now there is an acceptable risk going around indoors, unmasked, is an acceptable risk. not requiring proof of vaccination for indoor venues is an acceptable risk, correct? >> yeah, you know, let's be clear, for two years this has been a very difficult situation for all of us. and this public health emergency is, while not over, we're beginning to see that we have a more manageable situation. while we know more about the virus, and two, the people of denver and metro region and state of colorado have done what has been asked of them, where we have gotten that 70% or higher in terms of vaccinations and growing numbers of people being boosted. natural immunity from folks who have contracted the virus include yours truly during the omicron subvariant. we believe and the data has shown us we can manage the situation going forward, it doesn't mean it is over, we still got to continue to have a conversation and talk as loudly as we can about the 25% or so of folks who have not been vaccinated. they continue to pose a risk to themselves and everyone around them. we believe where we are, the numbers say, science tells us, it is okay to drop these masks. now, again, i'll repeat this, this emergency is not over. we still must be smart, cautious, wear a mask, if you feel uncomfortable, try to reduce, you know, real dense crowds, if you can, and be smart about this. but we are making the right moves, our numbers show us, in terms of hospitalizations, case rates, that we're going in the right direction. >> i got to let you run. you are keeping masks in schools. why? >> well, we don't want a situation where we have a large group of young people who have to be quarantined. and we're going to continue to advise and work closely with pediatricians, the state, the school officials, to make the right decision with regards to when to lift the mask order with our children. but we're going to be smart. we got to protect our children because we still believe that the vast and safest place for our children right now is in a classroom. so we're going to be a little more judicious with regards to our young people. >> mayor michael hancock, thank you for being with us this morning. >> absolutely. have a great day. >> here's what else to watch today. all right, check out this video, from pittsburgh, as crews lift a 21-ton bus from the site of last week's bridge collapse. you don't see that every day. >> that is amazing. plus, a man is denied a life saving kidney transplant because he refuses to get vaccinated. >> there is no telling how much longer i'll still be here. i have to have a kidney to prolong my life. you talk your vaccination status, that's when i told them there was nothing to talk about, it wasn't up for debate, i wasn't getting it. and then he told me, you know, you'll die if you don't get it. i said i'm willing to die. it's our ultimate sleep number event on the sleep number 360 smart bed. it senses your movements and automatically adjusts to relieve pressure points. and it's temperature balancing so you both sleep just right. and now, save 50% on the sleep number 360 limited edition smart bed. plus, 0% interest for 24 months. only for a limited time. my family's been devastated by covid-19. and we're not alone. we've all had to find new ways to keep going. and cue has made that easier. with cue, you get lab-quality covid-19 test results in just 20 minutes. speed and accuracy. it's just for the nba; it's for you too. cue health. the official covid-19 home test of the nba. go cue. go you. time now for five things to know for your "new day." advisers to donald trump drafted more than one executive order to seize voting machines during the former president's final weeks in office. there was one for the pentagon, and another for the department of homeland security. and the "new york times" reports that trump himself was directly involved. >> secretary of state antony blinken will hold talks with russian counterpart sergey lavrov today amid concerns of a possible russian invasion of ukraine. it comes as the kremlin says there was a mix-up and that it is still preparing its main reply to the u.s. proposal for de-escalating tensions. crews have pulled a 21-ton port authority bus from the site of friday's pittsburgh bridge collapse. this took about 15 minutes to pull this from the wreckage. 125 gallons of fuel had to be offloaded from the bus before they were able to lift it out. and an investigation is ongoing to determine why the bridge failed. >> strong ropes. a large fire burning overnight at a fertilizer plant in winston-salem, north carolina. officials are concerned about a potential explosion from ammonia nitrate on site. thousands of people in the surrounding area have been told to evacuate. and "the new york times" buying the hugely popular word guessing game wordle that we're only a little bit obsessed where on this show. the daily word puzzle gained millions of players in months since its release in october. the times says it bought wordle for a price in the low seven figures and that the game will initially remain free to play, initially, john berman. >> only initially. one promise in perpetuity. five things to know for your "new day." more on this on cnn.com and don't forget to download the 5 things podcast every morning. go to cnn.com/5things and you can find it wherever you get your podcasts. so, this morning, truly dangerous rhetoric from a republican candidate for office in michigan who told people to show up locked and loaded at polling places. plus -- >> he told me, you know, you'll die if you don't get it. i said i'm willing to die. >> what do you say to someone who would rather die than get the covid vaccine? 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father james martin is a jesuit priest and he's the author of an op-ed in "the new york times," how do you respond when an anti-vaxxer dies of covid and he's with us now. how -- just tell us the crux of your op-ed here. how do you respond? >> well, the point of the op-ed is so say we have conflicting emotions when that happens. there is a sense of frustration, sometimes satisfaction, but i think we can't give into these emotions. it is not a moral choice to celebrate someone's death. >> you say basically in this context, shodden fried is immoral. don't find another person's misery a source of satisfaction. it is immoral and one day you may be the unfortunate one. what are you seeing of people when they're responding to folks who have died from covid who are vaccine deniers? >> online you see people reacting with glee and then sometimes even trolling their survivors. trying to make it even worse for them. it is a sad situation and i think it really does warp our soul if we take delight in someone else's misfortune. for the christian, it is the opposite of what we're supposed to do. we're not supposed to celebrate when our enemies have misery. we're supposed to pray for them and try to love them as much as possible. >> so how do you in your view make strides towards convincing someone get the vaccine, an act of love as the pope called it, instead of facing death, instead of robbing those around them, their loved ones of a father or a mother or a child. >> that's a very good question. i mean, i think if i had the answer i would be a zillionaire now. it is not just about you. you may have this decision that it is not right for you, and you have the idea that it is not -- it is going to impinge on your freedom. it is not just about you. it is about the common good too. it is about protecting other people as well. so, you know it a very other directed thing. i think unfortunately we have been sort of mired in this rights sort of vocabulary, rather than thinking about the common good, thinking about other people. >> you know, when we talk to people who did not want to get the vaccine and decided they were going to do it because they didn't want to leave their family members without their loved one, a lot of them saw people like themselves die who made this choice. and learning of that actually helped them make a decision, because they saw themselves in someone who made a choice that in the end ended up killing them. that's a different thing, though, than people, you know, than highlighting a story and poking fun at it. because someone did not do what they needed to do to preserve their life. >> that's right. and the situation you're describing is a kind of conversion. i think what happens is, you know, it is stories and encounters with people in our lives that really have the power to convert us. i think much more than arguments and debates and things like that. so when those things happen, people's hearts are moved and they change, which is all for the good. >> yeah. listening to the stories of these transplant patients, my heart breaks. i think of their loved ones who may be without them. and it is very -- it is hard to watch. it is hard to imagine. father james martin, thank you for being with us. >> my pleasure. some absolutely chilling dash cam video. what happened after this driver opened fire in this extreme case of road rage? 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"the new york times" also reports trump was directly involved in looking for ways for top national security agencies to seize those machines. >> seizing polling machines. this morning, the ramifications