Transcripts For CNN Anderson Cooper 360 20240709 : compareme

Transcripts For CNN Anderson Cooper 360 20240709



about what's at stake and about why it's important to get -- get to the bottom of what happened that day. federal prosecutors have brought five charges, including carrying a loaded weapon and assaulting police officers against an indiana man. he has denied assaulting police officers. more frightening, however, may be what investigators say he told them. according to investigators, mark maza said he wanted to talk to house speaker nancy pelosi that day. he didn't. then, investigators say he said this to them. quote, i was glad i didn't because you'd be here for another reason. cnn law enforcement correspondent, whitney whield joins us with the latest on this new round of subpoenas. whitney, what's here? what does it seem the house select committee is focusing on? >> well specifically, when it comes to alex jones and roger stone, they are focusing on the way in which these two men used their enormous platform and possibly their connections to the president to promote the big lie, to promote the stom stop the steal rally that preceded the riot. specifically, for alex jones, the committee is also acutely interested in his role in finding a major donor for the stop the steal rally. the subpoena also notes that jones was either asked or directly told, as of january 3rd, that you would lead a march from the ellipse from that stop the steal rally to the capitol where we know that violent insurrection then took place. for roger stone, the subpoena specifically mentions that the committee understands that he used, again, his enormous platform to promote his appearance at the stop the steal rally. and then, further, used the oath keepers -- a far-right extremist group -- as protection in washington, d.c. surrounding the dates of the stop the steal rally on the 6th and then another rally that happened on january 5th. but the -- what's very clear is that the committee is now circling trump. they are specifically going after people who had a direct line into the former president, longtime confidants. and then, obviously, a longtime conspiracy theorist, alex jones. john. >> so who else beyond those two was issued a subpoena and what was the reason for these? >> well, the other people are dustin stockton, jennifer laurence. taylor now a spokesperson for the president -- they are specifically interested in him because they believe that -- that he funneled around 200,$000 to the stop the steal rally. so, there another indication that the committee is very interested in how this was funded. dustin stockton and jennifer laurence were major parts of the stop the steal movement following the 2020 election. so they want to know why they were promoting the big lie, how they were doing it, how it was funded and really get to their roles in promoting the stop the steal rally. and then, iffurther, the subpoe notes that dustin stockton had a direct line into president trump, in to mark meadows who we know is not cooperating with the committee in the way the committee wants. and then, further, the subpoena points out that stockton actually raised alarm bells, was very concerned about potential violence, should this -- this march from the ellipse to the capitol take place. so all these questions about what is the -- what was the line between then-former president trump, his allies? what did they know about possible violence? what did they believe could happen? and then ultimately, john, how this was all funded. >> whitney wild, thank you so much for that report. for perspective on what this means for the investigation, former nixon white house counsel, john dean. and cary cordero, cnn legal analyst. so, cary, roger stone, alex jones. they are performers, among other things. what reason would the committee have to think that they would cooperate? >> well, i don't know that the committee really thinks that they will cooperate. but the committee is going to use all of the tools available to it to try to compel their cooperation. so, the question at this point now that we know that the committee is willing to refer for criminal prosecution, individuals who don't cooperate and don't respond to the subpoena to the justice department. and we know that the justice department is willing to prosecute such a case as it's doing with steve bannon. this is the last option the committee has available to it to try to compel them. and given the nature of the way that they behave and the way that they conduct their work, i think it tends to be unlikely that they will be persuaded to cooperate. but there is always that threat of additional criminal prosecution. and so, i think the committee is just doing everything within its power to try to get that cooperation. >> what do you think of the totality of the five names on this list? >> well, i think the committee is casting a wide net. it's casting a net from individuals who were advising the president, who might have been in -- involved in the financing, the planning. at its heart, the january 6th committee's work is about protecting our democracy. it's about protecting the constitutional transfer of power and the effective functioning of elections. and on january 6th, that process didn't work. the certification did not proceed smoothly. it did not proceed without violence in the first time in the country's history. and so, that's the goal of the committee and so they are trying to speak and hear from and receive testimony from anybody who had knowledge about how we got to that point. >> stand by for a second if you will. i want to bring in a contributor to "politico" magazine who's done extensive reporting on two of the individuals subpoenaed who were key players in the former president's stop the steal movement. david, you interviewed dustin stockton and jennifer laurence extensively over the last few years. a remarkable article that came out just a few days ago. you called them, what, the bonny and clyde of the maga movement. describe to me why you think they received subpoenas and if you think they'll comply? >> well, i mean, they received subpoenas i think because of that article. in that article, they sort of intimate at -- towards the end of it -- that they are really ready to talk about what happened on january 6th, their role in it, and the role of many of these other figures who were involved that day. >> so talk to me a little bit more. if they are, in fact, willing to talk as it does seem like they were hinting to you in that article, what do they know? i mean, they weren't involved directly with january 6th per se, at least according to your article, so what did they see? what do they snknow? >> well, they are complicated because they actually went around the country on an rv/bus tour holding these kind of like stop the steal rallies and trying to get people really jazzed up about what was going on in washington and how the election was being stolen from donald trump and they were, you know, in touch with figures they say from the trump family and with the white house as they were planning this. and then, they came to washington days before january 6th for the big rally. but there are also these sort of conflicting rivalries within the maga movement, within these sort of far-right nationalist movements. and what dustin and jen say is that they were planning a rally that was going to be safe and -- and -- and peaceful for the 5th. and then, part of the day on the 6th. and then, a sort of smaller group actually broke away from -- they sort of lost control but these other folks organized another rally that moved on to the capitol. >> interesting. so they could be the type of figures who do have a story to tell. might be willing to tell it. and might have some pent-up resentment against some others involved there in different aspects of it. john dean, glad to see you joining us now. broadly speaking, what do you make of what the committee is after in all this? >> well, i think they are clearly trying to narrow down what happened in the white house to use an old phrase -- what did trump know and when did he know it? they are talking to the people around him, who might know. but i think they know a lot more than we think they do. zoe lofgren, this weekend, told cnn that 200 people have been interviewed. they have 25,000 documents. they have received 200 tips. they know a lot, and i think they are just trying to get these witnesses to step forward and put it on the record under oath. >> so, john, given that, i mean, how much time would you spend trying to get roger stone or alex jones to talk? >> well, they can multitask. they can clearly have their lawyers pursue stone and keep on with the work. it won't hold the committee up to do so. but they might get something out of it if they can get him to come before the committee and testify. >> cary, how hard is it to walk and chew gum at the same time if they are pursuing these reluctant witnesses? and by reluctant, i mean refusing witnesses. how hard is to at the same time, lawyers for the committee say they want the former president's records soon -- the records soon because, you know, they are up against midterms in a year and this committee may not exist in a year. >> that's right. although, with respect to these individuals, none of these individuals were government officials. so, some of the issues that at least are being raised by former-government officials in terms of executive privilege and other things that are being litigated, that doesn't apply to any of these individuals. it's pretty straightforward. they're private citizens. they receive a subpoena from a congressional committee conducting a valid investigation and they are either going to cooperate or they're not. and if they're not, they are going to probably be referred for criminal prosecution. so i think in these particular cases, it's pretty straightforward and just because some of the individuals, like stone or alex jones, um, are clownish personalities, we need to make sure that that person -- those personas don't cloud the seriousness of the issues that they were involved in if in fact they were involved in the planning and the financing and the organizing of the events that led up to january 6th. >> john dean, cary cordero, david freelander, everyone should go check out david's article because you will learn a ton about two people who could become important figures in this investigation. so, congratulations to you, david, on that. still to come. what police are learning about the man accused of driving an suv through a christmas parade in waukesha, wisconsin. at least five dead, dozens injured. and later, closing arguments in the trial of three men accused in the killing of an unarmed black man ahmaud arbery. what happened in court when "360" continues. keep it fresh. available in over 10 amazing scents and aluminum free. secret (tiger) this is the dimension of imagination. ♪ ♪ woman: i have moderate to severe plaque psoriasis. now, there's 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52-year-old female. wilhelm haspel, 81-year-old male. ranging in age from 52 to 81 years old. >> people down in the street! casualties on main street. >> reporter: along with the dead, 48 people were injured. some as young as 3 years old. 18 children, including three sets of siblings, are being treated at children's wisconsin, a hospital in milwaukee. >> two of the 48 are children and they are in critical condition. >> injuries ranged from facial abrasions to broken bones to serious head injuries. >> reporter: police identified the suspect as 39-year-old darryl brooks. >> the suspect, prior to the incident, was involved in a domestic disturbance. >> reporter: brooks was released on $1,000 bail earlier this month in connection to charges including domestic abuse. he allegedly ran over a woman with his car, and the incident came after another 2020 case where he was charged with two counts of recklessly endangering safety. he allegedly fired a gun during an argument. cnn reached out to his attorney from the incidents, but did not get a response. meanwhile, new audio of the parade incident makes clear the chaos of the moment, heard in the voices of the first responders. >> a red escape, black male, i couldn't stop it. he is going westbound. blowing his horn. >> reporter: along the parade route, kayleigh thought at first the vehicle was in the parade. seconds later, she realized it wasn't. >> you see people running around and screaming and crying and running into the storefronts. um, and you realize that like this is real. this is serious. and people are hurt because of it. >> reporter: among those dead, members of milwaukee's dancing grannies. the post to their facebook page said those who died were extremely passionate grannies. their eyes gleamed with the joy of being a granny. they were the glue that held us together. now, as the community here tries to recover the investigation into the suspect, darryl brooks, continues. he has a criminal history going back to the '90s but on that incident he posted a thousand dollars bail for, the woman he allegedly ran over claimed to be the mother of his child and also claimed that that car part of it didn't happen until after he allegedly hit her with a closed fist. now, the milwaukee county district attorney's office said that bail amount set was inappropriately low and is not consistent with their risk-assessment procedure. and it is why they are now launching an internal review. on this christmas-parade incident, the suspect has his initial court appearance scheduled for tomorrow where police have said they would be referring five counts of first-degree intentional homicide. john. >> omar jimenez, thank you so much. our next guest, not only was there yesterday and witnessed the violence. he had two children marching in the parade. one of those children, as you see spotlighted here, nearly hit by the suv as it went through the crowd. i am joined now by kelly davis. kelly, thank you for being with us. i'm so sorry it's under these circumstances. how are you and your family holding up tonight? >> we're -- we're still in shock. you know, it -- it was an unfortunate incident, not something you would ever expect to happen, especially at a holiday parade. i know my two children there were in the parade were just really shaken up last night. you know, from seeing a lot of their friends, their band mates, you know, be hurt in such a horrific fashion. and it -- you know, it -- it's taken a lot with them to try and really grasp what -- what happened over the last 24 or 36 hours here. >> all right. walk us through where you were on the route, and when you noticed something was going wrong. >> i was sitting with one of my other sons and we were on main street right around east avenue. and that's when we saw the car, first, coming through. um, and the car wasn't going that fast, at first. but when we noticed the car, it was like, wait a minute. what is this -- what is this person doing? that -- it's -- something's not right and i thought maybe they were trying to get to the apartment buildings that were on the -- across the street from us. well, as they started to keep going west on main street, they started getting faster and i'm like something's not right. and then, they passed over barstow street or avenue and that's when i noticed when the car -- the red suv -- started to swerve in and out of the parade route. >> something's not right. yeah. >> and at that point, yeah, something's not right. and then, i saw what i thought was kind of like a skip. like, maybe, it had hit a car and that's when i said to my son who i was with -- i'm like, we got to go. something's not right. so we took off down in that direction. and by the time we got down to barstow, i mean, there were people running everywhere. um, screaming. and, you know, bodies were on the ground at that point. and for me, it was about trying to find out where my son and my daughter were. >> now, your daughter, isabella, right? >> yeah, isabel. >> isabel. you couldn't find her. how long did it take you to find her? >> took about ten minutes to find her. um, i was fortunate enough, as we were getting closer and closer to the accident scene, um, i ran across phillip who you highlighted earlier and he was with a couple other of his band mates. and i just told him, look, you got to get out of this. hurry up because it's not safe right now. go with your friends, find somewhere safe and we will find you. and then, that's when my son and i start ted to search for my otr daughter. now, did have my third son, my oldest son sitting a little further down on buckley and main street. and he was coming towards the accident scene trying to see if he could also find her. >> i can't imagine what was going through your head when you couldn't find your daughter. how awful that must have been. nor, can i imagine what it's like to see the video now that we've shown of how close the -- the truck came to phillip. >> exactly. you know, later on that evening when i was able to, you know, actually see phillip, met up with him later on that evening, it was -- it was very disturbing to see how close he came. >> and lastly, i know that you have coached kids who were hurt. >> yes. >> your children have friends who were hurt. what do you know about their condition? >> um, a couple of kids -- you know, i've heard they're in stable condition. i know one of the kids, um, had to go through surgery again today and he had surgery last night. i heard he's in stable condition. um, so that made me happy to hear that they, you know, both were in stable condition and getting better. it's never easy to see kids, like you said, who you've coached before get injured like that. and after i found my daughter, one of the things that will always stick with me is, you know, just watching and seeing, you you know, the bodies laying in the street and the blood that was all over. as much as i wanted to help, i do have to say that there are a lot of people, a lot of first responders there in the street helping everybody out. the community really seemed to have come together, and really helped out and in everybody's time of need. >> kelly, i am so sorry you had to see that and go through it. i am so happy for you, that you and your children are well. please, know that we are thinking about you and thinking about your community tonight. >> thank you very much. i appreciate the time tonight. up next, we have more breaking news. the defense attorney's comments about ahmaud arbery's quote, long, dirty toe nails caused his mother to get up and leave the courtroom. she will join us, after the break. we providedcult times, one hundred and fifty million meals to feeding america. and now through the subaru share the love event, we're helping even more. by the end of this year, subaru will have donated over two hundred and twenty five million dollars to charity. this is what it means to be more than a car company. 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>> reporter: as the trial reaches its critical final days, protests outside the glenn county courthouse have grown in size and volume. for the first time, armed citizens with semiautomatic weapons were seen patrolling the perimeter of perimeter courthouse grounds, while inside the courthouse, attorneys began making closing arguments. travis mcmichael, his father gregory mcmichael, and william roddy bryan face murder charges and potential life in prison for the killing of 25-year-old jogger ahmaud arbery. >> this case is really about assumptions and driveway decisions. namely, their decision to attack ahmaud arbery in their driveways because he was a black man running down the street. >> reporter: and reminding the jury the definition of a citizen's arrest according to the law. >> they never, ever said on february 23rd, 2020, that they were doing a citizen's arrest. a citizen's arrest is for emergency situations when a crime really happens right in front of you. they never said it. none of the defendants saw mr. arbery commit any crime that day. >> reporter: travis mcmichael's defense attorney attempting to drive home the argument that his client was simply acting out of civic duty and responsibility. >> travis mcmichael spent almost a decade of his life learning about duty and responsibility. >> reporter: arguing to the jury his, quote, duty was necessary that february day. >> this neighborhood was being covered in suspicious persons, in extra watches, in neighborhood patrols and concerned citizens. >> reporter: insisting arbery's presence was suspicious. >> there is no evidence whatsoever that it was a place of exercise and jogging for ahmaud arbery. >> reporter: gregory mcmichael's attorney continued the theme arbery was in the neighborhood up to no good, suggesting that was obvious by his appearance. >> does not reflect the reality of what brought ahmaud arbery to satilla shores. khaki shorts with no socks to cover his long, dirty toenails. >> reporter: laura repeated over and over that arbery was to blame for his own death. >> he was a recurring nighttime intruder, and that is frightening and unsettling. >> reporter: and william bryan's attorney arguing there wouldn't even be a trial, were it not for his client, his cell phone, and the video he took. >> roddy bryan didn't shoot anyone. at the time of the shooting, he was some distance back. he was armed only with his cell phone. isn't it time -- isn't it time, ladies and gentlemen, that we send roddy bryan home? >> reporter: but the growing protest outside the court threatened the proceedings. the presence of demonstrators with guns had bryan's attorney, kevin goff, again motioning for a mistrial. it was denied. the judge did say he'd decided to move the jury deliberations to an interior room in the courthouse to keep jurors out of sight and earshot of the demonstrations. after court recessed for the day, attorney lee merritt said the arbery family appreciated the support from protestors. but urged them not to go so far as to possibly interfere with the trial, itself. >> the community's presence here has been a great encouragement to the family but we cannot allow anything to disrupt justice in this case. >> reporter: prosecutors will have two hours for their rebuttal-closing arguments tomorrow morning. then, there will be the charging of the jury. and then, the case will be delivered into the jury's hands for them to begin to make some kind of judgment. that's about midday tuesday. then, there's wednesday and of course thursday's thanksgiving. many wonder what the impact of that kind of timetable could have on a jury's potential decision. john? >> martin savidge, thank you so much for being there for us. ahmaud arbery's mother, wanda cooper jones, joins us now along with her attorney lee merritt. ms. cooper jones, i thank you once again for being with us tonight. i have heard defense lawyers, prosecutors over the last several hours say it was just out of line, what the defense attorney said about your son. the quote, long, dirty toenails. for you, as a mother, it prompted you to get up and leave the courtroom. what was going through your head? >> thanks for having me, as well. um, it was very, very disturbing. i thought it was very, very rude to talk about his long, dirty toenails and to totally neglect that my son had a huge hole in his chest where he was shot with that shotgun. she chose not to -- to recognize that -- that that gunshot wound -- actual his long toenails. >> why did you get up and go? >> i was faafraid that i was -- just was afraid. i sat there the last two weeks and let them dehumanize my son who wasn't doing anything wrong the day that he chose to go for that afternoon jog. and after, they go as far as describing his toenails long and dirty. despite, like i said earlier, that my son had a huge hole in his chest where he was shot with that shotgun. very disrespectful. >> why do you think they're doing that? >> i think that the defense is doing that because they know they don't have the proper evidence to get a conviction. so, they are actually going to any measures to get a -- to get a conviction, which is not there for them. >> one of the other things they're doing, in addition to the physical descriptions there, they are saying things like he was, quote, running away instead of facing the consequences, unquote. and that he was, quote, making terrible, unexpected, illogical choices, unquote. in essence, trying to blame him for what happened. what did you think of that? >> on february 23rd, the day that ahmaud was killed, ahmaud had no clue that he was under attack. ahmaud knew that he had not committed a crime, so it was no -- it was no reason for him to be under an attack like that. my son died as a very confused, scared individual. >> the defense also seems to be going to great ends in physical descriptions of your son. how do you think they are, subtly or not so subtly, trying to make race an issue? >> i do think anything they think that they can bring up to get a mistrial or to get a conviction which -- which they won't get -- they are going to any measures. >> do you feel good right now about the outcome here? do you think the case is going well as far as you're concerned? >> i do think that the prosecution has presented the evidence very well. i think that we will eventually -- for ahmaud eventually. >> and, lee merritt, very quickly if i can ask you at the end of martin savidge's piece, we played you delivering a message to the demonstrators that have been gathered outside the courthouse. why did you feel the need to tell that to people? >> i understand the need for the community to exercise their first amendment right, to support the family. but, you know, sometimes that passion and enthusiasm can take them a bit too far. and we've heard things like coffins outside of the courtroom, things that can be interpreted as a threat either to the defendants or to others and we don't want that kind of thing interfering with justice. >> well, lee merritt, we appreciate you being with us tonight. wanda cooper jones, again, thank you for being with us. >> thank you so much. up next, another federal judge calls out the former president for his lies that fueled the violence on january 6th and makes a comparison to former-vice president al gore that is sure to get under the former president's skin. when it comes to autism, finding the right words can be tough. finding understanding doesn't have to be. together, we can create a kinder, more inclusive world for the millions of people on the autism spectrum. go to autismspeaks.org ♪ ♪ there are beautiful ideas that remain in the dark. but with our new multi-cloud experience, you have the flexibility you need to unveil them to the world. ♪ we've been waiting all year to come together. -it worked! happy holidays from lexus. get 1.9% apr financing on the 2022 es 350. what if you could have the perspective to see more? at morgan stanley, a global collective of thought leaders offers investors a broader view. ♪ we see companies protecting the bottom line by putting people first. we see a bright future, still hungry for the ingenuity of those ready for the next challenge. today, we are translating decades of experience into strategies for the road ahead. we are morgan stanley. so just days after a federal judge said the former president was responsible for the attack on the capitol and a capitol rioter was a pawn provoked into action. another federal judge is going after the former president for lying about voter fraud during the 2020 presidential election. and today, a different judge took it a step further. during the hearing for a capitol riot defendant today, senior district judge reggie walton said former-vice president al gore had a better -- had better standing to challenge the 2000 election results but that he was, quote, a man and walked away. the judge also told defendant adam johnson who was photographed carrying house speaker nancy pelosi's lectern through the capitol on january 6th, that he was quote gullible enough to can come to washington, d.c. from florida based on a lie and that the person who inspired him is still making those statements. that person, of course, is the former president who continues to spread lies about the outcome of the 2020 election. joining us, two people who have experience in federal court, former-federal judge nancy gertner. and former-federal prosecutor and cnn chief legal analyst, jeffrey toobin. judge, let me start with you. is it unusual for a federal judge to weigh in like this, questioning the former president's manhood? >> that's a great question. questioning the president's manhood, no, that's not usual. but it's certainly not unusual for a judge to want to give some context to a sentencing. you know? you -- we all -- this is a moment when you address the defendant and you say that what you did was wrong. and, you know, you have to sort of get your life in order. all the kinds of things that a judge might do at sentencing. the problem here is that the crime itself that these guys were charged with is relatively minor. it's essentially disorderly conduct in the capitol. so, the crime doesn't convey the seriousness of the moment. so, the judge is trying to say, you know, this was very, very serious. as -- as far as questioning the former president's manhood, that is in a separate category. but i can see it was part of a larger picture. >> jeff, what did you hear in that? >> well, you know, perhaps judge gertner can correct me if i am wrong but federal judges are actually human beings. and i think you need to realize the context here. these judges, in the district court in washington, are hearing dozens of these cases. one after another. i mean, there are likely to be hundreds of cases, ultimately. and they're frustrated because they keep seeing all these mopes, to use a technical-legal term. you know, being brought in, pleading guilty. but they don't see a single person who has org -- who organized this rally, who conspired with these people -- none of them have been prosecuted. and it's frustrating to them because that's what they're used to seeing in federal court. they are used to seeing higher-level -- higher-level criminals and they are getting all these losers, instead. >> so, judge, what about what jeffrey's saying right there? are these judges trying to operate on two plains here? yes, there is sentencing and they are talking to the people standing right in front of them but they were also talking to the larger issue? >> sure, they are talking to the larger issue. there's no question but that's part of the -- you know, the ceremony of sentencing is -- is also talking to a larger and a wider audience. and i -- i mean, i agree with jeffrey that the -- that, you know, the more serious people have really not come before -- we haven't seen a lot. there are a couple more serious cases coming down the pike. and this is really like -- this is disorderly conduct in the capitol. and the only way to convey the seriousness of the moment to the wider public and to the defendant is to say what they have been saying. otherwise, it becomes an empty gesture and i agree with jeffrey, by the way, that federal judges are human beings. i just want to make that clear. >> and, jeffrey -- >> we agree about that. >> but, you know, there -- there's another -- well, there's another part of this and -- and chief judge has made this point, which is there is some unhappiness among some of these judges that the justice department is not prosecuting, um, serious enough crimes here. there have been a lot of misdemeanor cases. now, mostly, those are the ones that are moving through the process first and there are more serious felony cases in the works. but i think that's also what's going on here is that there are judges in that courthouse who think that the justice department is going too easy on these people who -- who invaded the capitol. >> so, judge, you know, this other federal judge last week who suggested the former president trump had some responsibility for the attack on the capitol and called the rioters, quote, pawns. um, you know, if he has responsibility for what happened there, is it legal responsibility? >> that's not for these judges to decide obviously that's for the january 6th commission. that's for whomever is doing the investigation in georgia with respect to election issues. that's for maybe the -- the justice department to be looking into what his relationship was to these events. that -- that's -- that's not for them to decide. they don't have that in front of them. but i mean, jeffrey was right -- jeff was right that these are not the kind of usual cases you see in -- in federal court. but part of the problem here is that the prosecutor had a limited menu of options. there are minor disorderly conduct in the capitol cases and then there are the bigger cases which require proof of conspiracy. you know, arguably, you know, interfering with the election, sedition that require more substantial proof. so, there's sort of nothing in between. and i think that's why the department of justice has been doing what it's doing because they -- they don't have -- they don't have very many things to -- they don't have very many weapons too deal with these guys. >> but they do have one important weapon and judge gertner knows this is something federal prosecutors use all the time, which is cooperation. which is, um, people pleading guilty for lesser sentences and cooperating against higher-ups. the more serious cases have not yet come before the -- the courts, yet. and if those senior people involved in invading the capitol start to cooperate against the people who organized this, if there were other people who organized that, that's where you could really start to see some serious cases but we haven't seen them yet. >> jeffrey toobin, judge gertner, i appreciate -- >> these guys have nothing to cooperate with. >> not yet. judge, i appreciate you being with us. jeffrey, thank you, sir. so, tennis star peng shuai resurfaced other the weekend but not in public. instead, on a video chat. who show spoke with and why it's raising a lot of questions. that's when "360" continues. r ud purchases on your discover card. ♪ limu emu... & doug ♪ ♪ superpowers from a spider bite? i could use some help showing the world how liberty mutual customizes their car insurance so they only pay for what they need. (gasps) ♪ did it work? only pay for what you need ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ spider-man no way home in theaters december 17th just getting by. it's an ongoing struggle. that's why president biden and democrats in congress have a plan to lower costs for america's working families. lower costs of health care premiums. and the price of prescription drugs. pay less for electric bills by moving to clean energy. we do it all by making the ultra-wealthy pay their fair share of taxes. it'd be a win for the everyday american family. right when they could really use one. congress, let's get this done. we're carvana, the company who invented car vending machines and buying a car 100% online. now we've created a brand-new way for you to sell your car. whether it's a year old or a few years old. we wanna buy your car. so go to carvana and enter your license plate answer a few questions. and our techno wizardry calculates your car's value and gives you a real offer in seconds. when you're ready, we'll come to you, pay you on the spot and pick up your car, that's it. so ditch the old way of selling your car, and say hello to the new way at carvana. it's another day. and anything could happen. it could be the day you welcome 1,200 guests and all their devices. or it could be the day there's a cyberthreat. only comcast business' secure network solutions give you the power of sd-wan and advanced security integrated on our activecore platform so you can control your network from anywhere, anytime. it's network management redefined. every day in business is a big day. we'll keep you ready for what's next. comcast business powering possibilities. there are new questions tonight in the disappearance of chinese tennis star peng shuai. the head of the international olympic committee said he spoke with her over the weekend on a video chat, but some are questioning the olympic leader's motives due to his connections to the former communist leader who peng says sexually assaulted her. peng hasn't been seen in public since she made those allegations, and ever since there's been concern for her safety. more from cnn's will ripley. >> free peng shuai, the growing call of protesters, politicians, professional athletes. >> we just have to unite and stand together. >> reporter: a global outcry for the chinese tennis star many fear is being silenced. >> it's time to speak up. there is less than 100 days until the winter olympics. >> reporter: the international olympic committee trying to calm the controversy, and ioc statement seems to support the chinese government narrative that the three-time olympian is safe and well, despite growing concern for her freedom. the ioc handing out this single image sunday of a 30-minute video call between peng, ioc president thomas bach and two officials. the ioc not giving access to the video asking to respect her privacy. an ioc official on the call said i was relieved to see peng sh b buy was doing fine. some suggest their concern is not peng but profits. the ioc statement fails to mention peng's explosive allegations three weeks ago that one of communist leaders sexually assaulted her. unlike the ioc, the women's tennis association prepared to pull hundreds of millions of dollars in business out of china demanding direct communication with peng, unmonitored, sun censored. the wta selling cnn this video does not change our call for a full, fair, and transparent investigation without censorship. >> the history books look back at this time, they will say the wta, what an incredible master class in humanitarian leadership, the right way to do it, to call china on its abuses and the international olympic committee sitting there as they always do basically doing nothing. >> reporter: which some say makes the ioc complicit in the apparent silencing of a tennis icon who dared into speak out against the former vice pr premiere. he is portrayed in chinese propaganda as down to earth, a crusader against corruption. >> the communist party will deal with this as an internal matter. i really doubt that they will actually refer this to prosecutors of the state because that would raise just too many issues. all senior leaders have the goods on everybody else. >> reporter: will ripley, cnn taipei. >> and what you're looking at there is a picture of cnn's current feed into china. china blocked our feed the minute we put this report on on peng shushuai. they don't want the people there to see it. up next, we pay tribute to the dancing granny, who as we say earlier lost some of their members in the parade tragedy in wisconsin. 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(phone chimes) ♪ ♪ ♪ i jump up on the stage ♪ ♪ and do my money dance ♪ ♪ i throw some money up ♪ ♪ and watch the money land ♪ ♪ i do my, i do my i do my money dance ♪ move your student loan debt to sofi - you could save with low rates and no fees. earn a $500 bonus when you refi... and get your money right. ♪ i do my money dance ♪ introducing the biggest advancement in the history of small business bookkeeping. having someone else do your books for you. i'm linda, your quickbooks live bookkeeper. let's do this linda! sounds good! a live expert bookkeeper who understands your business. felipe, i've categorized last month's hair gel expenses. steve, i just closed your books. great, how are we looking? profits are up! on to next month. on to next month, linda! get your books done for you by trusted experts. intuit quickbooks live bookkeeping. tragedy in wisconsin that left at least five people dead. among those killed were members of a beloved group called the milwaukee dancing grannies. so far we were that 71-yea le a owen enjoyed being a minor celebrity during their performances. last night the dancing grannies were doing what they love to do, bringing smiles to the crowd. here's 360's gary tuchman. >> they are all part of a beloved institution in the state of wisconsin, the milwaukee dancing grannies, and they've been performing for crowds around the state since 1984. just yesterday group members posted this message on their facebook page encouraging their fans to come out to the downtown waukesha festivities. grab your hot chocolate and head downtown tonight, they wrote. the grannies are kicking off their holiday parades. ♪ >> they perform in about 25 parades a year, like this one in june, 2019. here they are practicing for a st. patrick's day parade, and here they are showing off their holiday moves at a christmas parade two years ago. ♪ >> reporter: the grannies are anywhere from their 50s to their mid-70s according to their website. the only requirement for membership is to be a granny, and they say among them they have approximately 100 grandchildren, and even some great grandchildren. they practice together once camaraderie, they say the smiles they see while performing is the reason why they do what they do. the milwaukee dancing grannies say those who died were extremely passionate, whose eyes gleamed with the joy of being a granny. gary tuchman, cnn atlanta. >> such a loss. the news continues so let's hand it over to chris for "cuomo prime time." >> thanks,

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Transcripts For CNN Anderson Cooper 360 20240709 : Comparemela.com

Transcripts For CNN Anderson Cooper 360 20240709

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about what's at stake and about why it's important to get -- get to the bottom of what happened that day. federal prosecutors have brought five charges, including carrying a loaded weapon and assaulting police officers against an indiana man. he has denied assaulting police officers. more frightening, however, may be what investigators say he told them. according to investigators, mark maza said he wanted to talk to house speaker nancy pelosi that day. he didn't. then, investigators say he said this to them. quote, i was glad i didn't because you'd be here for another reason. cnn law enforcement correspondent, whitney whield joins us with the latest on this new round of subpoenas. whitney, what's here? what does it seem the house select committee is focusing on? >> well specifically, when it comes to alex jones and roger stone, they are focusing on the way in which these two men used their enormous platform and possibly their connections to the president to promote the big lie, to promote the stom stop the steal rally that preceded the riot. specifically, for alex jones, the committee is also acutely interested in his role in finding a major donor for the stop the steal rally. the subpoena also notes that jones was either asked or directly told, as of january 3rd, that you would lead a march from the ellipse from that stop the steal rally to the capitol where we know that violent insurrection then took place. for roger stone, the subpoena specifically mentions that the committee understands that he used, again, his enormous platform to promote his appearance at the stop the steal rally. and then, further, used the oath keepers -- a far-right extremist group -- as protection in washington, d.c. surrounding the dates of the stop the steal rally on the 6th and then another rally that happened on january 5th. but the -- what's very clear is that the committee is now circling trump. they are specifically going after people who had a direct line into the former president, longtime confidants. and then, obviously, a longtime conspiracy theorist, alex jones. john. >> so who else beyond those two was issued a subpoena and what was the reason for these? >> well, the other people are dustin stockton, jennifer laurence. taylor now a spokesperson for the president -- they are specifically interested in him because they believe that -- that he funneled around 200,$000 to the stop the steal rally. so, there another indication that the committee is very interested in how this was funded. dustin stockton and jennifer laurence were major parts of the stop the steal movement following the 2020 election. so they want to know why they were promoting the big lie, how they were doing it, how it was funded and really get to their roles in promoting the stop the steal rally. and then, iffurther, the subpoe notes that dustin stockton had a direct line into president trump, in to mark meadows who we know is not cooperating with the committee in the way the committee wants. and then, further, the subpoena points out that stockton actually raised alarm bells, was very concerned about potential violence, should this -- this march from the ellipse to the capitol take place. so all these questions about what is the -- what was the line between then-former president trump, his allies? what did they know about possible violence? what did they believe could happen? and then ultimately, john, how this was all funded. >> whitney wild, thank you so much for that report. for perspective on what this means for the investigation, former nixon white house counsel, john dean. and cary cordero, cnn legal analyst. so, cary, roger stone, alex jones. they are performers, among other things. what reason would the committee have to think that they would cooperate? >> well, i don't know that the committee really thinks that they will cooperate. but the committee is going to use all of the tools available to it to try to compel their cooperation. so, the question at this point now that we know that the committee is willing to refer for criminal prosecution, individuals who don't cooperate and don't respond to the subpoena to the justice department. and we know that the justice department is willing to prosecute such a case as it's doing with steve bannon. this is the last option the committee has available to it to try to compel them. and given the nature of the way that they behave and the way that they conduct their work, i think it tends to be unlikely that they will be persuaded to cooperate. but there is always that threat of additional criminal prosecution. and so, i think the committee is just doing everything within its power to try to get that cooperation. >> what do you think of the totality of the five names on this list? >> well, i think the committee is casting a wide net. it's casting a net from individuals who were advising the president, who might have been in -- involved in the financing, the planning. at its heart, the january 6th committee's work is about protecting our democracy. it's about protecting the constitutional transfer of power and the effective functioning of elections. and on january 6th, that process didn't work. the certification did not proceed smoothly. it did not proceed without violence in the first time in the country's history. and so, that's the goal of the committee and so they are trying to speak and hear from and receive testimony from anybody who had knowledge about how we got to that point. >> stand by for a second if you will. i want to bring in a contributor to "politico" magazine who's done extensive reporting on two of the individuals subpoenaed who were key players in the former president's stop the steal movement. david, you interviewed dustin stockton and jennifer laurence extensively over the last few years. a remarkable article that came out just a few days ago. you called them, what, the bonny and clyde of the maga movement. describe to me why you think they received subpoenas and if you think they'll comply? >> well, i mean, they received subpoenas i think because of that article. in that article, they sort of intimate at -- towards the end of it -- that they are really ready to talk about what happened on january 6th, their role in it, and the role of many of these other figures who were involved that day. >> so talk to me a little bit more. if they are, in fact, willing to talk as it does seem like they were hinting to you in that article, what do they know? i mean, they weren't involved directly with january 6th per se, at least according to your article, so what did they see? what do they snknow? >> well, they are complicated because they actually went around the country on an rv/bus tour holding these kind of like stop the steal rallies and trying to get people really jazzed up about what was going on in washington and how the election was being stolen from donald trump and they were, you know, in touch with figures they say from the trump family and with the white house as they were planning this. and then, they came to washington days before january 6th for the big rally. but there are also these sort of conflicting rivalries within the maga movement, within these sort of far-right nationalist movements. and what dustin and jen say is that they were planning a rally that was going to be safe and -- and -- and peaceful for the 5th. and then, part of the day on the 6th. and then, a sort of smaller group actually broke away from -- they sort of lost control but these other folks organized another rally that moved on to the capitol. >> interesting. so they could be the type of figures who do have a story to tell. might be willing to tell it. and might have some pent-up resentment against some others involved there in different aspects of it. john dean, glad to see you joining us now. broadly speaking, what do you make of what the committee is after in all this? >> well, i think they are clearly trying to narrow down what happened in the white house to use an old phrase -- what did trump know and when did he know it? they are talking to the people around him, who might know. but i think they know a lot more than we think they do. zoe lofgren, this weekend, told cnn that 200 people have been interviewed. they have 25,000 documents. they have received 200 tips. they know a lot, and i think they are just trying to get these witnesses to step forward and put it on the record under oath. >> so, john, given that, i mean, how much time would you spend trying to get roger stone or alex jones to talk? >> well, they can multitask. they can clearly have their lawyers pursue stone and keep on with the work. it won't hold the committee up to do so. but they might get something out of it if they can get him to come before the committee and testify. >> cary, how hard is it to walk and chew gum at the same time if they are pursuing these reluctant witnesses? and by reluctant, i mean refusing witnesses. how hard is to at the same time, lawyers for the committee say they want the former president's records soon -- the records soon because, you know, they are up against midterms in a year and this committee may not exist in a year. >> that's right. although, with respect to these individuals, none of these individuals were government officials. so, some of the issues that at least are being raised by former-government officials in terms of executive privilege and other things that are being litigated, that doesn't apply to any of these individuals. it's pretty straightforward. they're private citizens. they receive a subpoena from a congressional committee conducting a valid investigation and they are either going to cooperate or they're not. and if they're not, they are going to probably be referred for criminal prosecution. so i think in these particular cases, it's pretty straightforward and just because some of the individuals, like stone or alex jones, um, are clownish personalities, we need to make sure that that person -- those personas don't cloud the seriousness of the issues that they were involved in if in fact they were involved in the planning and the financing and the organizing of the events that led up to january 6th. >> john dean, cary cordero, david freelander, everyone should go check out david's article because you will learn a ton about two people who could become important figures in this investigation. so, congratulations to you, david, on that. still to come. what police are learning about the man accused of driving an suv through a christmas parade in waukesha, wisconsin. at least five dead, dozens injured. and later, closing arguments in the trial of three men accused in the killing of an unarmed black man ahmaud arbery. what happened in court when "360" continues. keep it fresh. available in over 10 amazing scents and aluminum free. secret (tiger) this is the dimension of imagination. ♪ ♪ woman: i have moderate to severe plaque psoriasis. now, there's 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52-year-old female. wilhelm haspel, 81-year-old male. ranging in age from 52 to 81 years old. >> people down in the street! casualties on main street. >> reporter: along with the dead, 48 people were injured. some as young as 3 years old. 18 children, including three sets of siblings, are being treated at children's wisconsin, a hospital in milwaukee. >> two of the 48 are children and they are in critical condition. >> injuries ranged from facial abrasions to broken bones to serious head injuries. >> reporter: police identified the suspect as 39-year-old darryl brooks. >> the suspect, prior to the incident, was involved in a domestic disturbance. >> reporter: brooks was released on $1,000 bail earlier this month in connection to charges including domestic abuse. he allegedly ran over a woman with his car, and the incident came after another 2020 case where he was charged with two counts of recklessly endangering safety. he allegedly fired a gun during an argument. cnn reached out to his attorney from the incidents, but did not get a response. meanwhile, new audio of the parade incident makes clear the chaos of the moment, heard in the voices of the first responders. >> a red escape, black male, i couldn't stop it. he is going westbound. blowing his horn. >> reporter: along the parade route, kayleigh thought at first the vehicle was in the parade. seconds later, she realized it wasn't. >> you see people running around and screaming and crying and running into the storefronts. um, and you realize that like this is real. this is serious. and people are hurt because of it. >> reporter: among those dead, members of milwaukee's dancing grannies. the post to their facebook page said those who died were extremely passionate grannies. their eyes gleamed with the joy of being a granny. they were the glue that held us together. now, as the community here tries to recover the investigation into the suspect, darryl brooks, continues. he has a criminal history going back to the '90s but on that incident he posted a thousand dollars bail for, the woman he allegedly ran over claimed to be the mother of his child and also claimed that that car part of it didn't happen until after he allegedly hit her with a closed fist. now, the milwaukee county district attorney's office said that bail amount set was inappropriately low and is not consistent with their risk-assessment procedure. and it is why they are now launching an internal review. on this christmas-parade incident, the suspect has his initial court appearance scheduled for tomorrow where police have said they would be referring five counts of first-degree intentional homicide. john. >> omar jimenez, thank you so much. our next guest, not only was there yesterday and witnessed the violence. he had two children marching in the parade. one of those children, as you see spotlighted here, nearly hit by the suv as it went through the crowd. i am joined now by kelly davis. kelly, thank you for being with us. i'm so sorry it's under these circumstances. how are you and your family holding up tonight? >> we're -- we're still in shock. you know, it -- it was an unfortunate incident, not something you would ever expect to happen, especially at a holiday parade. i know my two children there were in the parade were just really shaken up last night. you know, from seeing a lot of their friends, their band mates, you know, be hurt in such a horrific fashion. and it -- you know, it -- it's taken a lot with them to try and really grasp what -- what happened over the last 24 or 36 hours here. >> all right. walk us through where you were on the route, and when you noticed something was going wrong. >> i was sitting with one of my other sons and we were on main street right around east avenue. and that's when we saw the car, first, coming through. um, and the car wasn't going that fast, at first. but when we noticed the car, it was like, wait a minute. what is this -- what is this person doing? that -- it's -- something's not right and i thought maybe they were trying to get to the apartment buildings that were on the -- across the street from us. well, as they started to keep going west on main street, they started getting faster and i'm like something's not right. and then, they passed over barstow street or avenue and that's when i noticed when the car -- the red suv -- started to swerve in and out of the parade route. >> something's not right. yeah. >> and at that point, yeah, something's not right. and then, i saw what i thought was kind of like a skip. like, maybe, it had hit a car and that's when i said to my son who i was with -- i'm like, we got to go. something's not right. so we took off down in that direction. and by the time we got down to barstow, i mean, there were people running everywhere. um, screaming. and, you know, bodies were on the ground at that point. and for me, it was about trying to find out where my son and my daughter were. >> now, your daughter, isabella, right? >> yeah, isabel. >> isabel. you couldn't find her. how long did it take you to find her? >> took about ten minutes to find her. um, i was fortunate enough, as we were getting closer and closer to the accident scene, um, i ran across phillip who you highlighted earlier and he was with a couple other of his band mates. and i just told him, look, you got to get out of this. hurry up because it's not safe right now. go with your friends, find somewhere safe and we will find you. and then, that's when my son and i start ted to search for my otr daughter. now, did have my third son, my oldest son sitting a little further down on buckley and main street. and he was coming towards the accident scene trying to see if he could also find her. >> i can't imagine what was going through your head when you couldn't find your daughter. how awful that must have been. nor, can i imagine what it's like to see the video now that we've shown of how close the -- the truck came to phillip. >> exactly. you know, later on that evening when i was able to, you know, actually see phillip, met up with him later on that evening, it was -- it was very disturbing to see how close he came. >> and lastly, i know that you have coached kids who were hurt. >> yes. >> your children have friends who were hurt. what do you know about their condition? >> um, a couple of kids -- you know, i've heard they're in stable condition. i know one of the kids, um, had to go through surgery again today and he had surgery last night. i heard he's in stable condition. um, so that made me happy to hear that they, you know, both were in stable condition and getting better. it's never easy to see kids, like you said, who you've coached before get injured like that. and after i found my daughter, one of the things that will always stick with me is, you know, just watching and seeing, you you know, the bodies laying in the street and the blood that was all over. as much as i wanted to help, i do have to say that there are a lot of people, a lot of first responders there in the street helping everybody out. the community really seemed to have come together, and really helped out and in everybody's time of need. >> kelly, i am so sorry you had to see that and go through it. i am so happy for you, that you and your children are well. please, know that we are thinking about you and thinking about your community tonight. >> thank you very much. i appreciate the time tonight. up next, we have more breaking news. the defense attorney's comments about ahmaud arbery's quote, long, dirty toe nails caused his mother to get up and leave the courtroom. she will join us, after the break. we providedcult times, one hundred and fifty million meals to feeding america. and now through the subaru share the love event, we're helping even more. by the end of this year, subaru will have donated over two hundred and twenty five million dollars to charity. this is what it means to be more than a car company. 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ask how to get a great deal for your business. and get up to a $500 prepaid card with select bundles when you switch to the network that can deliver gig speeds to the most businesses. or get started with internet and voice for $64.99 per month with a 2-year price guarantee. give your business the gift of savings today. comcast business. powering possibilities. breaking news. the prosecution will deliver its rebuttal tomorrow morning in the trial of three men accused of killing ahmaud arbery. today, jurors heard two drastically different perspectives on what happened the day arbery died. during closing arguments, prosecutors said the three white men on trial assumed the worst about a 25-year-old black man running in their neighborhood, chased him down, and killed him. in contrast, one of the defense attorneys argued that the men had a duty to catch arbery, whom she described as a frightening burglar with -- and i quote -- long, dirty toenails. martin savidge has the latest from georgia. >> reporter: as the trial reaches its critical final days, protests outside the glenn county courthouse have grown in size and volume. for the first time, armed citizens with semiautomatic weapons were seen patrolling the perimeter of perimeter courthouse grounds, while inside the courthouse, attorneys began making closing arguments. travis mcmichael, his father gregory mcmichael, and william roddy bryan face murder charges and potential life in prison for the killing of 25-year-old jogger ahmaud arbery. >> this case is really about assumptions and driveway decisions. namely, their decision to attack ahmaud arbery in their driveways because he was a black man running down the street. >> reporter: and reminding the jury the definition of a citizen's arrest according to the law. >> they never, ever said on february 23rd, 2020, that they were doing a citizen's arrest. a citizen's arrest is for emergency situations when a crime really happens right in front of you. they never said it. none of the defendants saw mr. arbery commit any crime that day. >> reporter: travis mcmichael's defense attorney attempting to drive home the argument that his client was simply acting out of civic duty and responsibility. >> travis mcmichael spent almost a decade of his life learning about duty and responsibility. >> reporter: arguing to the jury his, quote, duty was necessary that february day. >> this neighborhood was being covered in suspicious persons, in extra watches, in neighborhood patrols and concerned citizens. >> reporter: insisting arbery's presence was suspicious. >> there is no evidence whatsoever that it was a place of exercise and jogging for ahmaud arbery. >> reporter: gregory mcmichael's attorney continued the theme arbery was in the neighborhood up to no good, suggesting that was obvious by his appearance. >> does not reflect the reality of what brought ahmaud arbery to satilla shores. khaki shorts with no socks to cover his long, dirty toenails. >> reporter: laura repeated over and over that arbery was to blame for his own death. >> he was a recurring nighttime intruder, and that is frightening and unsettling. >> reporter: and william bryan's attorney arguing there wouldn't even be a trial, were it not for his client, his cell phone, and the video he took. >> roddy bryan didn't shoot anyone. at the time of the shooting, he was some distance back. he was armed only with his cell phone. isn't it time -- isn't it time, ladies and gentlemen, that we send roddy bryan home? >> reporter: but the growing protest outside the court threatened the proceedings. the presence of demonstrators with guns had bryan's attorney, kevin goff, again motioning for a mistrial. it was denied. the judge did say he'd decided to move the jury deliberations to an interior room in the courthouse to keep jurors out of sight and earshot of the demonstrations. after court recessed for the day, attorney lee merritt said the arbery family appreciated the support from protestors. but urged them not to go so far as to possibly interfere with the trial, itself. >> the community's presence here has been a great encouragement to the family but we cannot allow anything to disrupt justice in this case. >> reporter: prosecutors will have two hours for their rebuttal-closing arguments tomorrow morning. then, there will be the charging of the jury. and then, the case will be delivered into the jury's hands for them to begin to make some kind of judgment. that's about midday tuesday. then, there's wednesday and of course thursday's thanksgiving. many wonder what the impact of that kind of timetable could have on a jury's potential decision. john? >> martin savidge, thank you so much for being there for us. ahmaud arbery's mother, wanda cooper jones, joins us now along with her attorney lee merritt. ms. cooper jones, i thank you once again for being with us tonight. i have heard defense lawyers, prosecutors over the last several hours say it was just out of line, what the defense attorney said about your son. the quote, long, dirty toenails. for you, as a mother, it prompted you to get up and leave the courtroom. what was going through your head? >> thanks for having me, as well. um, it was very, very disturbing. i thought it was very, very rude to talk about his long, dirty toenails and to totally neglect that my son had a huge hole in his chest where he was shot with that shotgun. she chose not to -- to recognize that -- that that gunshot wound -- actual his long toenails. >> why did you get up and go? >> i was faafraid that i was -- just was afraid. i sat there the last two weeks and let them dehumanize my son who wasn't doing anything wrong the day that he chose to go for that afternoon jog. and after, they go as far as describing his toenails long and dirty. despite, like i said earlier, that my son had a huge hole in his chest where he was shot with that shotgun. very disrespectful. >> why do you think they're doing that? >> i think that the defense is doing that because they know they don't have the proper evidence to get a conviction. so, they are actually going to any measures to get a -- to get a conviction, which is not there for them. >> one of the other things they're doing, in addition to the physical descriptions there, they are saying things like he was, quote, running away instead of facing the consequences, unquote. and that he was, quote, making terrible, unexpected, illogical choices, unquote. in essence, trying to blame him for what happened. what did you think of that? >> on february 23rd, the day that ahmaud was killed, ahmaud had no clue that he was under attack. ahmaud knew that he had not committed a crime, so it was no -- it was no reason for him to be under an attack like that. my son died as a very confused, scared individual. >> the defense also seems to be going to great ends in physical descriptions of your son. how do you think they are, subtly or not so subtly, trying to make race an issue? >> i do think anything they think that they can bring up to get a mistrial or to get a conviction which -- which they won't get -- they are going to any measures. >> do you feel good right now about the outcome here? do you think the case is going well as far as you're concerned? >> i do think that the prosecution has presented the evidence very well. i think that we will eventually -- for ahmaud eventually. >> and, lee merritt, very quickly if i can ask you at the end of martin savidge's piece, we played you delivering a message to the demonstrators that have been gathered outside the courthouse. why did you feel the need to tell that to people? >> i understand the need for the community to exercise their first amendment right, to support the family. but, you know, sometimes that passion and enthusiasm can take them a bit too far. and we've heard things like coffins outside of the courtroom, things that can be interpreted as a threat either to the defendants or to others and we don't want that kind of thing interfering with justice. >> well, lee merritt, we appreciate you being with us tonight. wanda cooper jones, again, thank you for being with us. >> thank you so much. up next, another federal judge calls out the former president for his lies that fueled the violence on january 6th and makes a comparison to former-vice president al gore that is sure to get under the former president's skin. when it comes to autism, finding the right words can be tough. finding understanding doesn't have to be. together, we can create a kinder, more inclusive world for the millions of people on the autism spectrum. go to autismspeaks.org ♪ ♪ there are beautiful ideas that remain in the dark. but with our new multi-cloud experience, you have the flexibility you need to unveil them to the world. ♪ we've been waiting all year to come together. -it worked! happy holidays from lexus. get 1.9% apr financing on the 2022 es 350. what if you could have the perspective to see more? at morgan stanley, a global collective of thought leaders offers investors a broader view. ♪ we see companies protecting the bottom line by putting people first. we see a bright future, still hungry for the ingenuity of those ready for the next challenge. today, we are translating decades of experience into strategies for the road ahead. we are morgan stanley. so just days after a federal judge said the former president was responsible for the attack on the capitol and a capitol rioter was a pawn provoked into action. another federal judge is going after the former president for lying about voter fraud during the 2020 presidential election. and today, a different judge took it a step further. during the hearing for a capitol riot defendant today, senior district judge reggie walton said former-vice president al gore had a better -- had better standing to challenge the 2000 election results but that he was, quote, a man and walked away. the judge also told defendant adam johnson who was photographed carrying house speaker nancy pelosi's lectern through the capitol on january 6th, that he was quote gullible enough to can come to washington, d.c. from florida based on a lie and that the person who inspired him is still making those statements. that person, of course, is the former president who continues to spread lies about the outcome of the 2020 election. joining us, two people who have experience in federal court, former-federal judge nancy gertner. and former-federal prosecutor and cnn chief legal analyst, jeffrey toobin. judge, let me start with you. is it unusual for a federal judge to weigh in like this, questioning the former president's manhood? >> that's a great question. questioning the president's manhood, no, that's not usual. but it's certainly not unusual for a judge to want to give some context to a sentencing. you know? you -- we all -- this is a moment when you address the defendant and you say that what you did was wrong. and, you know, you have to sort of get your life in order. all the kinds of things that a judge might do at sentencing. the problem here is that the crime itself that these guys were charged with is relatively minor. it's essentially disorderly conduct in the capitol. so, the crime doesn't convey the seriousness of the moment. so, the judge is trying to say, you know, this was very, very serious. as -- as far as questioning the former president's manhood, that is in a separate category. but i can see it was part of a larger picture. >> jeff, what did you hear in that? >> well, you know, perhaps judge gertner can correct me if i am wrong but federal judges are actually human beings. and i think you need to realize the context here. these judges, in the district court in washington, are hearing dozens of these cases. one after another. i mean, there are likely to be hundreds of cases, ultimately. and they're frustrated because they keep seeing all these mopes, to use a technical-legal term. you know, being brought in, pleading guilty. but they don't see a single person who has org -- who organized this rally, who conspired with these people -- none of them have been prosecuted. and it's frustrating to them because that's what they're used to seeing in federal court. they are used to seeing higher-level -- higher-level criminals and they are getting all these losers, instead. >> so, judge, what about what jeffrey's saying right there? are these judges trying to operate on two plains here? yes, there is sentencing and they are talking to the people standing right in front of them but they were also talking to the larger issue? >> sure, they are talking to the larger issue. there's no question but that's part of the -- you know, the ceremony of sentencing is -- is also talking to a larger and a wider audience. and i -- i mean, i agree with jeffrey that the -- that, you know, the more serious people have really not come before -- we haven't seen a lot. there are a couple more serious cases coming down the pike. and this is really like -- this is disorderly conduct in the capitol. and the only way to convey the seriousness of the moment to the wider public and to the defendant is to say what they have been saying. otherwise, it becomes an empty gesture and i agree with jeffrey, by the way, that federal judges are human beings. i just want to make that clear. >> and, jeffrey -- >> we agree about that. >> but, you know, there -- there's another -- well, there's another part of this and -- and chief judge has made this point, which is there is some unhappiness among some of these judges that the justice department is not prosecuting, um, serious enough crimes here. there have been a lot of misdemeanor cases. now, mostly, those are the ones that are moving through the process first and there are more serious felony cases in the works. but i think that's also what's going on here is that there are judges in that courthouse who think that the justice department is going too easy on these people who -- who invaded the capitol. >> so, judge, you know, this other federal judge last week who suggested the former president trump had some responsibility for the attack on the capitol and called the rioters, quote, pawns. um, you know, if he has responsibility for what happened there, is it legal responsibility? >> that's not for these judges to decide obviously that's for the january 6th commission. that's for whomever is doing the investigation in georgia with respect to election issues. that's for maybe the -- the justice department to be looking into what his relationship was to these events. that -- that's -- that's not for them to decide. they don't have that in front of them. but i mean, jeffrey was right -- jeff was right that these are not the kind of usual cases you see in -- in federal court. but part of the problem here is that the prosecutor had a limited menu of options. there are minor disorderly conduct in the capitol cases and then there are the bigger cases which require proof of conspiracy. you know, arguably, you know, interfering with the election, sedition that require more substantial proof. so, there's sort of nothing in between. and i think that's why the department of justice has been doing what it's doing because they -- they don't have -- they don't have very many things to -- they don't have very many weapons too deal with these guys. >> but they do have one important weapon and judge gertner knows this is something federal prosecutors use all the time, which is cooperation. which is, um, people pleading guilty for lesser sentences and cooperating against higher-ups. the more serious cases have not yet come before the -- the courts, yet. and if those senior people involved in invading the capitol start to cooperate against the people who organized this, if there were other people who organized that, that's where you could really start to see some serious cases but we haven't seen them yet. >> jeffrey toobin, judge gertner, i appreciate -- >> these guys have nothing to cooperate with. >> not yet. judge, i appreciate you being with us. jeffrey, thank you, sir. so, tennis star peng shuai resurfaced other the weekend but not in public. instead, on a video chat. who show spoke with and why it's raising a lot of questions. that's when "360" continues. r ud purchases on your discover card. ♪ limu emu... & doug ♪ ♪ superpowers from a spider bite? i could use some help showing the world how liberty mutual customizes their car insurance so they only pay for what they need. (gasps) ♪ did it work? only pay for what you need ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ spider-man no way home in theaters december 17th just getting by. it's an ongoing struggle. that's why president biden and democrats in congress have a plan to lower costs for america's working families. lower costs of health care premiums. and the price of prescription drugs. pay less for electric bills by moving to clean energy. we do it all by making the ultra-wealthy pay their fair share of taxes. it'd be a win for the everyday american family. right when they could really use one. congress, let's get this done. we're carvana, the company who invented car vending machines and buying a car 100% online. now we've created a brand-new way for you to sell your car. whether it's a year old or a few years old. we wanna buy your car. so go to carvana and enter your license plate answer a few questions. and our techno wizardry calculates your car's value and gives you a real offer in seconds. when you're ready, we'll come to you, pay you on the spot and pick up your car, that's it. so ditch the old way of selling your car, and say hello to the new way at carvana. it's another day. and anything could happen. it could be the day you welcome 1,200 guests and all their devices. or it could be the day there's a cyberthreat. only comcast business' secure network solutions give you the power of sd-wan and advanced security integrated on our activecore platform so you can control your network from anywhere, anytime. it's network management redefined. every day in business is a big day. we'll keep you ready for what's next. comcast business powering possibilities. there are new questions tonight in the disappearance of chinese tennis star peng shuai. the head of the international olympic committee said he spoke with her over the weekend on a video chat, but some are questioning the olympic leader's motives due to his connections to the former communist leader who peng says sexually assaulted her. peng hasn't been seen in public since she made those allegations, and ever since there's been concern for her safety. more from cnn's will ripley. >> free peng shuai, the growing call of protesters, politicians, professional athletes. >> we just have to unite and stand together. >> reporter: a global outcry for the chinese tennis star many fear is being silenced. >> it's time to speak up. there is less than 100 days until the winter olympics. >> reporter: the international olympic committee trying to calm the controversy, and ioc statement seems to support the chinese government narrative that the three-time olympian is safe and well, despite growing concern for her freedom. the ioc handing out this single image sunday of a 30-minute video call between peng, ioc president thomas bach and two officials. the ioc not giving access to the video asking to respect her privacy. an ioc official on the call said i was relieved to see peng sh b buy was doing fine. some suggest their concern is not peng but profits. the ioc statement fails to mention peng's explosive allegations three weeks ago that one of communist leaders sexually assaulted her. unlike the ioc, the women's tennis association prepared to pull hundreds of millions of dollars in business out of china demanding direct communication with peng, unmonitored, sun censored. the wta selling cnn this video does not change our call for a full, fair, and transparent investigation without censorship. >> the history books look back at this time, they will say the wta, what an incredible master class in humanitarian leadership, the right way to do it, to call china on its abuses and the international olympic committee sitting there as they always do basically doing nothing. >> reporter: which some say makes the ioc complicit in the apparent silencing of a tennis icon who dared into speak out against the former vice pr premiere. he is portrayed in chinese propaganda as down to earth, a crusader against corruption. >> the communist party will deal with this as an internal matter. i really doubt that they will actually refer this to prosecutors of the state because that would raise just too many issues. all senior leaders have the goods on everybody else. >> reporter: will ripley, cnn taipei. >> and what you're looking at there is a picture of cnn's current feed into china. china blocked our feed the minute we put this report on on peng shushuai. they don't want the people there to see it. up next, we pay tribute to the dancing granny, who as we say earlier lost some of their members in the parade tragedy in wisconsin. 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