Part to some financials like capital one, comerica, synchrony, discover, and wells its self up 7. 5 all session. Up sevenfargo itself point 5 all session. After the initial jobless claims data, a little move in treasuries, now at 61 basis points. Stimulus stems the effect of the covid19 crime is might be infamous, according to mike mayo. He writes in the shortterm, that the potential for wave after wave of support for the economy and unemployed workers. That plus an outlook on banks, which he says show a [inaudible] right now. Lets welcome mike mayo, wells fargo senior analyst. You talk about contradictions in banking right now, one of them being the present versus the past. What do you mean by that . , banks are treated as if it is 2008 in the middle of the Global Financial crisis. Night and day difference for the banks. We do see a contradiction. Today, banks have double the. Mount of equity over 50 more liquidity. They have gotten out of the most risky activities. It has oversight by regulators and boards and shareholders for decades, you have had it stress ed for about a decade, banks are the more resilient than they have been for a generation, but they are still treated like it is 2008. That is a mistake the market is making, even while we go through record unemployment, we are seeing bankruptcies and we are seeing earnings help the banks. But thee sobering times Balance Sheets of banks are poised to absorb the problems that are to come. Vonnie how long does this earnings hell last, mike . Either you see it lasting a while or being short, sharp and swift. The Second Quarter will be a repeat of the first quarter. You will see big reserve bills, and i could trickle into the third and fourth quarter. This whole year might end up being a washout for the banks when it comes to the earnings themselves, but when we say that is an income statement assessor reduced oure have estimates five times and that might be enough. In might not be. We will have to see about it. What is interesting, even with all of our reductions for banks, banks should still have enough earnings to earn their dividends , sometimes by twice as much. They should still have Strong Capital ratios and we still have the largest banks growing the ir value, even during all these problems. That is a big different from big difference from 2008. Vonnie what about the banks is the market getting right or wrong . Mike contradiction number one, today versus the past. Bankadiction number two, stock valuations versus the valuations of Corporate America generally in the equity market. On the one hand, banks are treated like it is the end of the world, and on the other hand, the company that the banks trading ating our much higher valuations. If you look at the value of bank stocks relative to their book value and compare that to the market as a whole, you are at the lowest level in history. You are at a level than the Global Financial crisis. So somethings wrong. Either the market needs to come down to the bank because this is a much worse recession than , orne ask act expects banks are likely to catch up to the market. We think it is the latter because of stimulus by the government. This is a shock, a one hundred euros and, a pandemic. This is really tough times a 100 year event, a pandemic. This is really tough times. The at how congress, fed, and the treasury have acted with this counterpunch. The stimulus, you have not even felt the impact of the stimulus yet. You are talking about increasing trillion, they 5 federal Balance Sheet maybe by 5 trillion. It is a 10 trillion stimulus on is 10omy thats gdp trillion over six months. That is an enormous counterpunch. Herefore, we think the gear government is [inaudible] it is your contention that even in spite of all the difficulties, banks can hold onto their dividends. You talk about it as if it is one monolithic bank, but there are hundreds of different banks out there. Mike it is not but one ironyall, is that the largest banks be positioned better than the smaller banks. As a generality, larger banks have more diversified client bases, more diversified revenues. Look at the Capital Markets revenues. They were up one fourth by yearoveryear. They had a record investment the last twoe over months. That is an extra pillar that the largest banks can rely on. The other consideration is that the largest banks have larger customers, and larger customers have access to Capital Markets, which helps make them strong. That goes back to the government intervention. Forratulations, government intervening and making the plumbing work in Capital Markets when it was temporarily broken. With amet virtually fellow ceo of Morgan Stanley yesterday, and they said march was a mini stress test, which it was, and they said they performed better in this mini stress test than they expected. Either way, the official said going lower for the banks, but they have gone higher. They are probably not going lower in the Second Quarter either. So the banks are outperforming in terms of the feds stress test scenario. But the larger banks are in a better position. If you are going to have some banks cut dividends, you will have some banks with problems. The largest banks, we say goliath is winning. Vonnie i want to play some sound for you from yesterday. I spoke with fiber sanders demi jimmy Piper Sanders hadan, and this is what he to say about pnc, who raised bunch of cash yesterday. We are talking about 13 billion here. Plenty of dry powder to do some kind of a deal. Lets listen to what jimmy says. Jimmy i think it makes a lot of sense. I think theres going to be a lot of opportunities over the next three to six months and this is not something he has to do immediately, but he will certainly be ready to act. Vonnie there we have it. He does his deal that has been involved in so many of them. Talking about the ceo of pnc. What could he do, should he do . Is now the right time to raise that cash . Mike that was a phenomenal move. And extremely savvy move by the ceo of pnc. More about their expectations, their expectations being this could get a little ugly. You can have a vshaped recovery, we are not assuming that. You could have a ushaped l. Overy or you could have an nom assuming a deep u, quick rebound. This action by pnc says, we are not going to have a be recovery a v recovery. If you raise a war chest of 13 million, you need a market where you can deploy that. If this goes on longer, there should be opportunities. The most savvy acquisitions of one of the past couple decades, when pnc bought National City during the Global Financial crisis at 40 of tangible book value. Thats remarkable. That is a wow. He has the ability to write and 11 billion check to what comes available, whether it is a bank, a nonbank, a fintech firm or distressed assets, you are in a position of strength. Pnc for thepgraded first time in over a decade two months ago when things were getting really ugly, but after this move, pnc is our Number One Bank with active capital ratios the highest in history, and the day that build a ploy this 11 billon build ploys deploys this 11 billion, that is likely when the pnc stock is higher. Vonnie the regional banks, how many do we see go away, what kind of deals do we see . There is lots of dry powder out there, waiting for valuations to get even more attractive. What could the landscape look like in six months . Mike first of all, the banks messed up. They made a mistake. We talked about this after the new firm called thrill created by bb t and suntrust i thought there would be a lot more bank mergers, scale is making more of a difference than ever before, you better get on the train because the train is moving and you are going to need more size. You did not see any more deals after that, and we were like oh, that is probably not a good move. Now we are in a recession and you are seeing it in spades. Banks, 5000, could be cut in half to over the next decade, not just due to this period of weakness, but because technology, scale, marketing are more important than ever before. I will say, when it comes to acquisitions, the balance of power is shifting from the seller to the buyer. It is shifting to the likes of a pnc that can provide strength and security to those banks have are likely going to problems. We are talking about banks outside of the largest. Vonnie that is for sure, but having a bank in the next 10 pretty big is call. Mike mayo, wells fargo senior analyst, joining us there. Lets get a check on the first word news. Heres mark crumpton. Mark North Carolina republican richard burr is stepping down as cochairman of the Senate Intelligence committee. He is under investigation for stock trades he made ahead of the market downturn sparked by the coronavirus pandemic. Senate Majority Leader Mitch Mcconnell announced the move in a statement, saying he agreed it was in the best interests of the committee. The Los Angeles Times reported that the fbi server with a search warrant served with a search warrant and confiscated his cell phone. Dr. Richard bright alleges he was removed from a highlevel scientific post after warning the Trump Administration to prepare for the pandemic. Dr. Bright testified today before the house energy and commerce committee. He called the lack of a vaccine plan a significant concern. President trump says today that he thinks a vaccine will be available by the end of the year. The coronavirus may have led to a 30 for jump in cases of a serious blood disorder in children. Thats according to a study from italy. It found an increase in a rareilike illness, condition found in children under five. Similar conditions have been reported in new york and the u. K. Lockdown restrictions are being eased across much of japan, but Prime Minister shinzo abe is maintaining a state of emergency for tokyo and osaka. Government will also begin working on its second budget plan to help people hurt by the pandemic. They will evaluate next week if they can lift restrictions on certain areas. Global news, 24 hours a day, on air and at quicktake by bloomberg, powered by more than 2700 journalists and analysts in over 120 countries. Im mark crumpton, this is bloomberg. Vonnie . That. thank you for that is mark crumpton. Some countries easing lockdown, it is important to track patients who have recovered from covid19. A professor at Johns Hopkins university spoke to us earlier about a study that will follow patients post coronavirus, and urged patience to keep social distancing. Have a listen. As you would see a soldier at war who can be relaxed and between the battles, you can see Health Care Workers relaxing between those battles. I dont think the public should know,he sense of, you there is a lack of urgency and our response. By that urgency, i mean continuing to be safer at home and social distance, physical distance. [inaudible] beautifully said. So with that, there is this huge tension between lockdown, stayathome, the wisconsin legislation we have seen in the last 24 hours. How do you perceive the gray area between a strict lockdown, stayathome, and getting back to normal . Jason i think you characterized it perfectly. In which sense of gray everyone is opening up in slightly different ways across the country. Across the world. We need to pay very close attention and be vigilant to how that opening up and how that quite in our behavior, frankly, our decrease in social and physical distancing from one another and return to work is going to impact new cases. We anticipate that it will impact new cases and yet, there are some painful decisions that have to be made, as you have mentioned multiple times, in the recession, preventing depression economically, and in many cases saving businesses. It is a delicate balance between being able to open up, expand the economic environment while also being vigilant to prevent ongoing transmission. We guesstimate how many people so far have had covid and how many of those people are immune . Ason the immune question is very hard one at this point. Investigators across the world are really struggling with coming to grips with whether or at immunities will recur as result of infection. For some people we believe it will, but we are seeing cases of relapse reinfection, if you will. What is critical to understand, in these patients who have a suppose it relapse supposed relapse, where they tested negative and repeatedly negative for the virus, and became what we call convalescent, where they recover, and we can detect antibodies in those circumstances. Then we follow those people over time to see if reinfection occurs in those circumstances. We are launching a study in june to do just that, to really in the next 12 months, with a cohort of patients, to see with the incidence of the viruses in this , especially if we saw a second or a third wave of this infection. Vonnie that was jason farley, Johns Hopkins university new ursing professor. Lets get to our next guest. We will be speaking to jen about their outlook on activism on the pandemic. This is bloomberg. Vonnie this is Bloomberg Markets. Im vonnie quinn. After posting some of their worst losses in march, activist hedge funds posted their best month since 2012 in april. Rossman. S now is jim jim, thank you for joining us. Activists are only as strong as the money they are able to raise towards these strategies. Do you think you will drive up enough interest to work in significant campaigns through the next year . Jim great question. We have definitely seen the impact of covid. If we look at the new campaigns that were initiated in march and april, its 54 down compared to and wevesix months, seen very little activity in the Public Markets that we would associate with activism. Proxy fights, poison pen letters , so we are in a quiet, subdued period for activism. Unless the market picks up, this trend is going to continue. Which, as you point out, could make it challenging for activists to raise new funds in the near term. You must be surprised at how much activity there is, given that people cant move around, the market has fallen out of bed, it is difficult to Ask Companies to do anything other than an survive then survive in this environment. One of the most interesting campaigns going on for you, and what reason . To point thatight out. A lot of the activities in activity is in respect to not new campaigns, but old campaigns. We are remaining very focused on where they do have investments made. Im watching very closely right now is, who are the new entrants coming into activism . There are different players at a table in the campaigns we are seeing. There are individual investors, family offices, hedge funds who we were unaware of that have an interest in engaging with activism. We are also looking at the pipe market. For every one of these situations where companies are out looking for capital and traditional sources are closed, whether that is Government Support or leveraged loan market, equity Capital Markets, there is a lot of behindthescenes conversation taking place right now around pipes. You have seen some pipe activity taking place with the traditional activists, but also around that are private equity firms, traditional institutional investors, so i think the most interesting thing you are going to see over the next couple of months are direct investments in Public Companies who need to shore up their Balance Sheets. Does that mean . You have been expecting private equity firms for a while to play a larger role in activism. We have seen them get more involved in Public Companies, but are you saying the deal being done today at a more distressed level, in times, that they really need the money and to turn to private equity, are you saying that there might come some Strings Attached with those deals later on . Jim it is going to be different. What weve seen so far is a level of inquiry go up by two or three times. Situations which would have been dominated by activists or traditional Capital Market seeing a lot more inquiry coming in from the large private equity firms. We will have to see how it plays out. Maybe later in the summer, in the fall we will see aroundements these deals, but the level of inquiry is the highest i have ever seen it since we started to track this trend. I think you are right. The demands are going to be higher. You mentioned different offices getting involved, meaning billionaire activist investors. We have seen some firms already do this. Offices in particular are starting to embrace the strategy . I cant comment on any in particular, because of our involvement in the market. I can just confirm for you that we are watching the trend closely and there are definitely new faces at the table. If i can just pile on and make you squirm even more, talk to us about the likes of david einhorn, whose are really in the toilet for the most part. Also, bill ackman seems to beginning really busy in china when it comes to fast casual. Jim yeah. I think some of the major activists have taken some significant hits, and it is going to take time, in particularl when we see the triple s amounts out, to tell what the impact is. An activist, you are seeing a ton of volatility, a lot of uncertainty about how deep this crisis is going to be. You do not want to appear to be tone deaf, picking on companies who are fighting for their survival, and frankly, what might be revealed by the 13 ups is that a lot of leading activists pivoted to of strategies, credit strategies,. He ability to make money vonnie we will have another conversation tomorrow. We are live in bloomberg World Headquarters in new york over the next hour. Here are the top stories we are covering on the bloomberg and around the world. Lazards jim rothman. Around the world. Lazards jim rothman. Cannot getdent trump a Lawsuit Dismissed that accuses him of illegally profiting from his washington hotel. Thats the ruling of a federal Appeals Court today, reversing an earlier win for the president. The attorney general of maryland and washington had accused mr. Trump of violating the s twotution emoluments clauses. The hotel reopened in 2016, shortly before President Trump was elected. The delivery of masks to britain has been delayed after officials about complained their poor quality. The masks were purchased from a chinese provider and the eu had plans to distribute them to help their workers in weekly installments over the next six weeks. Cities across the United States are projected to lose about 360 billion of revenue through 2022 because of the coronavirus pandemic. That is according to analysis by the National League of cities, inch predict municipalities pennsylvania will be hit the hardest, followed by several others. This is based on the expected rise in unemployment. Global news, 24 hours a day, on air and at quicktake by bloomberg, powered by more than 2700 journalists and analysts in over 120 countries. Im mark crumpton, this is bloomberg. Frome amanda live toronto, im amanda lang. And im shery ahn. Global stocks rebounding off of session lows after following nearly 2 . U. S. On the heels of dismal economic data, jobless claims hitting 2. 8 9 million last week. That brings the total to 36. 5 million. President donald trump escalating the war of words with china, trump telling foxbusiness he does not want to talk to chinese president xi jinping right now, and saying we could cut off the whole relationship. And General Motors repurpose thing and not a plant in canada to help make face masks. Weve got the latest. That conversation coming up next. Lets take a close amanda lets take a closer look at the markets. We have seen negative openings across the board that brought us across the s p 500 and the nasdaq. The turn for the better driven by some key groups, want watching wells fargo up 6 today, and you can see crude oil is on the way, the energy group the one lending a little bit of strength year. Tech has been weak, but it is turning around, cisco up 4 on this day after reporting its results yesterday. Worry after the comments we had from jay powell about a resurgence in the virus. We heard similar comments from the bank of canada today. What comes next is all important, and businesses are looking forward to reopening. As vonnie mentioned, they are looking to deal with the current pandemic. Means canada, that repurpose thing part of its plant in ontario to produce one million face masks a month. Back. S, great to have you in terms of how quickly you get to a million, and the all important question we just heard a story about the eu having to turn back masks from china over quality, where does the Million Masks go . Canada will they claim to some, but will they go to the u. S. As well . A great question. First and foremost, we have dedicated a portion of our oshawa plant to build a Million Masks a month. We are currently right now training employees. We tend to start production here very shortly, hopefully early next week, and we should ramp up over the course of the month of may to get to that full million unit mark in june and beyond. Where the masks go, we are working with the federal government in canada, and they are the customer. To put give it to them them where they need them, so where they will go will be in canada, but it will be up to them to make that call. Vonnie scott, i think we can assume that the mask you are wearing is a gm canada mask, so congratulations. It take to refit the factory and what will it do to your bottomline in the coming quarters . To refit the factory was an effort of a lot of great, great people, both here in canada as well as in michigan, where we had a mask operation put together. We leveraged that skill set and brought it here and did that. I will tell you, we know how to manufacture things in great volume, so it took a little bit of a learning curve. But when the team got on it, i think we are in a really good place. As far as the bottom line goes, we are doing this for the canadian government. We will be a supplier to them, if you will, and we are doing it at no cost to them. We should be able to recoup the costs invested here. Amanda as we were expecting, we how ontario will face in reopening, starting monday. A lot of retail will be back in business, as long as they have a curbside entrance. Include vehicle dealerships, new and used. One thing we have heard from your ceo is that the path to full production will be dependent on demand. What is your read of how quickly that demand gets back to normal and you can get back to normal . Scott we have been working hard with the governments across the country to keep the dealerships open as an essential business. We have had to adjust our model and in most provinces we have been able to do that. Inlers are selling online ontario, by appointment only in ontario, so it has turned out to be an amazing thing to watch as the volume starts to pick up here in the month of may, greater than it was in april, and the dealership has done some things here that frankly i think will be the new norm going forward. Much more convenient for customers to do the transaction online and have that vehicle delivered to their home. I see some of this sticking with betterment of the customer going forward. Have you vonnie had to put measures in place vonnie vonnie have you had to put measures in place to help leadership more than you typically do . The dealership more than you typically do . Scott im sorry, i did not get the question. Vonnie financing in place to help the dealership . Scott there have been a lot of effort in place to help the dealers. We have shared with them our protocols very open and transparently, so they can learn from what we know about putting back in place. Our financial arm has done things to help with their payments on inventory, as business has been hit pretty hard in the last month and a half or so. Many vendors have stepped up to help dealers as well as the government, with Small Business activities. There is a lot of things that the dealers have been able to but they have of, been pretty resilient and seeing business come back in may has been pretty good. Scott, we have seen different jurisdictions handle reopening differently, and that is very true, canada versus the u. S. The border and how it reopens is still a very much live issue. We know that your business has been deemed essential, as presumably as needed things will move back and forth across it, but has it added complexity as you consider getting up to full run manufacturing again here . Scott not necessarily. As you mentioned, we have been deemed essential from the get go, so we made the decision to take our manufacturing march. Ons down in but we always have had the opportunity to do business when we are ready to, and that is starting to happen with our supply base this week and our Assembly Plants next week. Our materials are flowing as they should, so it has been good. Vonnie scott, congratulations and thanks for bringing us the news. It will feel great to make one Million Masks. Cott bell, gm canada president and director. This is bloomberg. Vonnie this is Bloomberg Markets. Im vonnie quinn in new york, this is amanda lang in toronto. The number of americans seeking Unemployment Benefits remain in the millions for the eighth thisght week, 2. 98 million week. We see the numbers continuing to rise, even after the country reopens. Our guest joins us on the phone from miami. We were talking about jobs not coming back, potential structural unemployment. How much of it do you see . This quantifying it at point is going to be very difficult, and i appreciate the question because it is a very important one, that we think markets are going to have to grapple with and not only over the next month, as we talk about statebystate reopening, but for the balance of 2020. The complicating factor is we cannot get a clear read of what true final demand is right now for a few reasons. One, as you mentioned, highend employment rate, a lot of workers that have been affected negatively like this. There will be a pretty heavy weight on it as of now from workers that are furloughed or individuals out of work. On the other side of it, it is a of whatt picture to get the demand could be away from that, because business has been suppressed by the government. There are two things working, the natural unemployment friction that weighs on growth and demand, and on the other side, there is the other complicating factor, which is that so much activity is suppressed, we cannot get a clear picture of what the natural rate of businesses and our economys current Production Capacity actually is. Amanda we have heard from both jay powell and in canada, both. Entral banks when do you think the shift should come as to what they should do next he aga we cannot quite predict what the demand pickup looks like and what the rate do next . We cannot quite predict what the demand pickup looks like. Scott were trying to position the Core Plus Bond Fund and investor allocations are going to grapple with this question, because the fed has really driven the markets from a terrible rocky place to a much smoother one with their policy initiatives. The question now, can or should they go a step further. If they are going to, when will they . The basis on the twoyear treasury, barely cracking over the doubledigit year point market, the 10 treasury, 60 basis points, the treasury market is indicating that this is going to be here for a while, so it is going to of verytinued period accommodative policies from the federal reserve. We personally dont anticipate that you are going to see them move to dedicated high yield facility or equity facility, the next step. We believe it would take some extreme measures and the fed has probably given us most of the tools they are going to use during this cycle. The question is how long they keep pushing forward and expand the current tools. Vonnie what corporate do you like here, scott . Theres a bunch in the Corporate Bond funds, from ebay to fannie and freddie it would seem as well. Scott when we look at the Core Plus Bond Fund, we are looking at a total rate of return and all pockets in the bond market, where we think we can find value. We had a very significant disruption in Investment Grade credit markets, and that is the lifeblood of our economy. We were really front surprised really surprised to see the fed focused their. If you have a lot of fixed income investments that are focused on here, because this is what the fed is buying and what they will support. That could be a crowded trade that will quickly have limited total return potential, so we could jump to the other side and say, lets not by what the fed is buying. Lets by what the fed wants us to be buying. [inaudible] in five years, we think. Some opportunistic abilities in high yield. We think there are some opportunities, particularly some s like powerful trade marriott, and some other fascinating opportunities in high yield across the auto sector, some assets from ford along the way that we pick up. You mention the mortgagebacked security market, there is a nice being created in commercial mortgagebacked securities, and commercial mortgagebacked securities in areas where the economies are under more stress than others, like the Energy Market for example. They all have different pockets of the debt structure that are of interest to us. Here, not a ton of time and this is not a small question, but inflation versus deflation is the current debate. Where do you land . Scott we land on the side at the bigger risk ahead of us, we are thinking about risk the bigger risk we have to it knowledge would be deflation, because the economy is so suppressed we cannot get a clear picture of what final demand is or what transactions are really taking place. We think if there is a risking us to the economy coming back online, it is to find that the natural price point has fallen. Amanda scott campbell, we appreciate your time today. With Many Americans that businesses feeling the pinch of covid19 and the great lockdown, how is it affecting philanthropy . We will check in with the National Philanthropic trust and its ceo, next. Amanda welcome back. Im amanda lang in toronto with vonnie quinn in new york. The covid19 pandemic has created a prices without a crisis without precedent for large and Small Charities as they seek the help that they need, and this is so broad that the difficulties of Many Americans will make their futures less certain. We are here with the president and ceo of the National Philanthropic trust. Thanks for being with us, eileen. The level of concern on the part of charities out there, give us your read on how difficult it is out there right now. Eileen thanks for having me. The front lines are having a tough time right now. Unemployment is high and a third of the nonprofits are cutting staff due to covid19. The thing that is really scary, most nonprofits have 30 to 60 day reserves, but the grassroots thanrofits have less two weeks. They do not have a lot of capital to depend upon. A High Percentage will close of we do not come to the rescue somehow. Vonnie how does that happen, eileen . How do you rescue philanthropy at a time when it is most needed and most under strain . Eileen i think what happens, there is a whole trend for charities to not have reserved funds and spend as much as you can on programs. When you come into a tough time like we are right now, it puts them in a very tough spot, much like Small Businesses, and they do not have a lot of reserve capital. A lot of donors do not like giving to reserve capital. They want to see their money going out quickly. It is a tough lesson for all of us to learn, that they need reserves. Donors who give to the charities are important right now and a lot of them are holding back. We have seen obviously the data on how they expect to hold back, even when the economy improves, eileen. When you are talking to charities, especially those in the arts, those that do not seem critical right now are left with , they have one or two events a year that are completely off the table. How do they reach their regular donors with the reminder that they need a lifeline . Eileen our donors have really stepped up. We have seen 100 increases from last year at this time to this grants. H about 56 more the dollars are really flowing out and going interestingly to Human Services and the health care, and to some global efforts. They are not going as much to the arts. We are seeing our donors really step up at this time and they are loosening restrictions, and giving charities a lot more leeway about what to do with the money. We think 100 of our money going out now, and we have given out about 73 million in these past couple of months, is really related to cope it is a health care reason or not. A lot of charities are suffering for payroll and just getting their rent paid. Our donors are reaching out to the charities that are important to them. You talk about 10 billion in covid related donations, 55 from corporations, that is a generous amount from individuals. What structural changes would you like to see post pandemic to get ready for Something Like this happening again . Either philanthropic efforts that may be need to merge or combine or go away, even, in order for whats left to be effective in a time of critical need . Eileen thats a great question. One of the things people think about is our darwinian theory, is that the survival of the fittest. Some of our greatest charities are small, emerging charities that have new ways to address problems, and they are not formidable enough financially to survive this. Just because a charity has more money does not mean it is the one doing the best job. Small ones can be doing the great jobs. We need to be looking at infrastructure and capacity building, and they really need loans, bridge loans for payroll rent. I think we have to look at unrestricted money, which has been demonized a little bit, but it is the most important money you can give a charity because overhead,equipment, Strategic Planning and fundraising, a key part of how they stay alive. On the there will be, other side of all this, massive debts at every level of government. How concerning is that to the charitable s sector, that governmet might have to pull in their belt . Eileen charities are often called upon to make up for gaps in the government, and the government will also be struggling to meet human needs and other needs. There will be a lot greater dependence on nonprofits. The 401 k s, the retirement down, so those baby boomers who would otherwise be sustainably giving would be holding back. We will have a lot of tension on the private philanthropy side and the government funding side, so i think it is a time when charities have to be creative and thoughtful about how they do their work, which i think they already are, but it will get tougher. Vonnie and really, we are out of time, but is there any trusted source if we want to Research Charities or find a good place for a donation . Things to recommend. One, go to your local community foundation. There are about 700 around the country. They have a pulse on what is going on in their own backyards and they are easy to find. There is a list on the foundations website, or Google Community foundation and the name of your region or state, and you can find them. The other thing, around the country, there are these entities called Unity Community loan funds, and they are organizations that provide , and a small amount to businesses. You can find an answer to a lot of things you might need help with a neuron backyard. Vonnie very with in your own backyard. Information,good eileen. Hopefully the pandemic goes away at some point. Eileen heisman from ne ational philanthropic trust. From me and amanda, this is bloomberg. Scarlet it is 2 00 in new york, 7 00 p. M. In london. I am scarlet fu. Romaine and i am Romaine Bostick and this is Bloomberg Markets the close. It looks like another interesting day on wall street. In u. S. Eavy selling cash trading in new york. That was met by heavy buying later in the day. We have seen the s p 500 swing about 70 points. Right now, it is flat on the day up about. 1 . The Dow Jones Industrial average up about. 5 . The nasdaq still in the red but about flat on the day. A tugofwar between folks who seem to think stocks are disconnected from economic reality. A lot of folks do see some immediate value in buying on the future recovery. Despite the rebound in equities, treasuries are being bid up with yields down across the curve. Also