About its the a half ago. We were told specifically that the whistleblower did not want to get any of this information out, they did not want it to leak. There were only a few potential groups of people that would have known about this complaint. Within yourr people office. The people within the Inspector Generals office, and the whistleblower, and whoever that whistleblower gave this information to. I am trying to ascertain is how would it run and all the Mainstream Media outlets. Even though they got a lot of it wrong, they had the basics that involved the president of the United States talking to a foreign leader. Did you or anybody in your office leak this to the Washington Post or nbc news . Director maguire Ranking Member, i leave the Intelligence Community, we know how to keep a secret. As far as that how that got into the press, i do not know. I just know it is all over the place and has been reported for the past several weeks. Where they get their information from, i do not know. It was not from the Intelligence Community, me, or my office. Thank you, director. So, this is not the first time this has happened to this president. It happened with the call between the mexican president , australian prime minister, so it has happened twice before. The pieces of transcripts leaked out. Of course, this time it was leaked out again, and the president , thankfully he was able to put this out because of the actions of this situation. It is unprecedented. The president or of the United States to have their conversations leak. It is the third time. Director maguire i would have to put that to the white house to respond. To me, the president of the United States9 united state conversation would be a privileged conversation. Clearly they are being captured by intelligence agencies. Director maguire not necessarily. If the president they are captured and disseminated. I have to beire careful in this open hearing about how i respond to that. The Intelligence Community and Security Agency collect things to protect. I want to make sure. We would have the president of the United States not talk to foreign leaders or just publish all the transcripts, that is what is happening. If somebody is leaking this, than it is likely coming from the agency that you oversee. Director maguire sir i am not saying you do not know, but we have the transcript of the mexican president , prime minister, and contents of the call of the ukrainian president leaking out. Director maguire the whistleblower complaint was that there were 12 people who listened in. Others were briefed from the state department as well of the transcripts because they have an area and region responsibility and they would be informed on the interaction. There were a number of people from the white house reefed from the call. This would not be something the white house probably did not leak that out. Director maguire not the white house, but there are individuals that may or may not, i do not know. It would not be from the intelligence intercept. I am just saying the dissemination of these calls is supposed to be sacred. It is important for the state department and appropriate agencies. The not saying it is all in intelligence agency. When a president talks to a foreign legal leader that is confidential, there could be some facts that you want to get to the appropriate agency, not just the ic. This is the third time. I am not aware of this ever happening before, of contents of calls getting out. Director maguire i really do not know, i do not have the numbers. It seems to me that it is unprecedented, and i would also say that the decision by the president to release the transcripts is probably unprecedented as well. Here appreciate you being and have fun. Be careful what you say because they will use these words against you. Director maguire Ranking Member , either way i am honored to be here. I appreciate your service, and i am sure we will be talking again soon, hopefully not in the public, hopefully behind closed doors like this is supposed to be done. I yield back. Chairman, director maguire, thank you for being here and for your service and the service of your family. Director, what i find the will during is that we are not sitting here today, and the American Public is not aware of the allegations of the president asking for a favor of an investigation into the political opponent. We are not aware of the decision to hold aid and mr. Giulianis establishment of a personal state department or possible retaliation against a u. S. Ambassador. But for the happens decision of your inspector atkinson, manel appointed by President Trump and confirmed by a Republican Senate to come to this committee seven days after the complaint was required by law to transmitted. It was his decision, personal decision, not the kaleidoscope of fantabulous stick conspiracies theory theories the Ranking Member thinks is happening. It was the decision of magical Michael Atkinson to come to this committee, following not advice for you from you or any law, but his own conscious. Without his decision none of this is happening, correct . Director maguire i applaud michael and the way he has done this. He has acted in good faith and follow the law at every step of the way. The question is, did it or did it not meet the Legal Definition. A differenti asked question. Without his decision, none of this is happening, is that correct . Director maguire we have to black to back up to the whistleblower. Rep. Himes the whistleblower deserves the same accolades that mr. Atkinson does. Director, were you ever advised by the white house not to provide this complaint to congress for any reason . Director maguire no. Rep. Himes as i understand it, the opinion was that you were not obligated to convey, despite the clear wording of the law, to convey the complaint to congress. Defy aision was taken to subpoena of this congress to turn over the complaint. Who made the decision to defy the subpoena . Director maguire urgent concerns rep. Himes i am making a simple question, who made the decision to defy the congressional subpoena. Somebody said we would not comply. Director maguire nobody did, i endeavored, once we no longer had urgent concern with the seven day timeline to work to get the information to the committee. What i needed to do was to get work through the executive privilege hurdles with the office of Legal Counsel at the white house. Although this was the most important issue to me, the white house has quite a few other issues that they were dealing with. I wouldve liked to have had perhaps this moved a little faster than it did, but this is a deliberate process, and finally it came to a head yesterday. When i received the information on the 26th of august, we had seven days based on the act. All we did was lose the seven days. It may have taken longer than we or you wouldve liked, but you have the information. Rep. Himes i am focused on the subpoena, the subpoena is on your desk, the subpoena of the congress of the United States. It is clear. In are saying understands was taken was never taken not to comply, again i was looking into the decisionmaking process. Director maguire i did not ignore. I dealt with the chairman and asked to have one more week to be able to do what i needed to do to get this information released. He was gracing us enough and this committee was very supportive. It was not something ready to go, but i was committed to this committee into the chairman to get the information, and i was able to provide that yesterday. Rep. Himes thank you. Did you or your office ever speak to the president of the United States about this complaint . Congressman, ie am the president s intelligence officer, i speak with him several times during the week. Rep. Himes did you ever speak to the president about this complaint quote complaint . Director maguire my conversations are privileged and it would be inappropriate to me because it would destroy my relationship with the president Intelligence Matters to divulge any part of my conversation. Rep. Himes for the record, you are not denying that you spoke to the president about this complaint. Director maguire what i am saying is that i will not divulge privilege conversations that i have is the director of National Intelligence with the president. Rep. Himes has a white house instructed you to assert your privilege. Director maguire i have been in the executive branch. And also the homeland committee. After i maintained discretion with the president of the United States. Rep. Himes apparently the clock is broken, and i will yield back the balance of my time. Thank you chairman. Thank you for being here. You and i are at a competitive disadvantage because we are both lawyers neither of us are lawyers. You have lawyers on your staff . Director maguire i do. And we have looked at this definition thoroughly and have given you advice . Director maguire yes. Was so clear, how is it that we have different attorneys giving us different opinions, that is a rhetorical question. That is with respect to this issue. Just to clarify. A great jobnson did of telling us what he did and did not do, we now know what he was able to do. That is part of his investigation, he did not request records of the call. Was that hee did decided the difficulty in working through all of that was that he could not comply. One he did not try to over to overrun the executive privilege over conversation. Determinedd i also i this is quoting michael, determined that there were reasonable grounds to believe that information relating to the urgent concern appeared credible. That is a different statement than it is credible. Is there anything in statute from your lawyers that are advising you that says the determination of urgent concern lies solely with the icig . Director maguire i was never advised by my Legal Counsel to that effect. The justice as department ever weighed into say that the fact that the dni cannot make a separate decision as a result of the separate process that the matter is not a virgin concern . Ofector maguire the matter urgent concern is a legally defining turn. It is either yes or no. Rep. Conaway apparently that is not the case. Used it was, and if if you are saying that it is not because it involves the president , last time it checked, he is he is not in your chain of command, you are in his chain of command. For very definite reasons, it does not meet the urgent concern definition with respect to the whistleblower protections. Your team made that call. The Inspector General made a different call. Director maguire no, sir. Justicehe department of office of Legal Counsel that made the determination that it was not urgent concern. All we wanted to do was just check and see. To me, it seemed prudent, with the matter at hand right now to be able to make sure that in fact it did, and when it did not, once again, i endeavored to get the information to this committee. Rep. Conaway just to clarify the role that the Inspector General had with respect to the department of justice. I heard you say he was involved with the conversations and allowed to make his case, and you gave the Justice Department the letter. What was his exact involvement in making his case to the Justice Department to his decision . Was he or his lawyers there . Director maguire to the best of my knowledge, the ic ig icigs letter and complaint was forwarded to the office of Legal Counsel for their determination. I believe that is what they based their opinion on. If im incorrect, i will come back to the committee and correct that. Rep. Conaway i appreciate that. Appreciate your storied history. I apologize if your integrity was insulted, that happens a lot. Sometimes justified and most of the time not, and the insult was not justified the fact that we have differences of opinion, when we start losing those we start to attack each other and call each others names. Youxperience is that when have a legal matter, i have lawyers that i pay and you have lawyers you pay. I is i typically stick with the lawyers that i am paying. You have had good legal advice and making sure that this was protected, and at the same time wry,e was something a there would be a difficult area. I yelled back. Thank you. Director maguire, thank you for being here. I want to turn to what i fear may be one of the most damaging longterm effects of this whistleblower episode, and that is the Chilling Effect that it will have on others in government, who may witness misconduct, but now may the afraid to come forward to report it. Sir, i am worried that Government Employees and contractors may see how important this situation has played out, and decide that it is not worth putting themselves on the line. The fact that a whistleblower followed all of the proper ,rocedures to report misconduct and then the department of justice and white house seem to have weighed in to keep the complaint hidden is problematic. Notnt to know whether or you see how problematic this will be, and having a chilling thatt on members of the ic you are sworn to represent and protect . Director maguire i think that is a fair assessment. I do not disagree with what you said. I have endeavored to transmit to the Intelligence Committee my support of the whistleblowers, and i am quite sure that for at least two hours this morning there were not many people in the Intelligence Community doing less productive than watching this. Rep. Sewell my concern, i think it is a valid one. What has happened with this whistleblower episode, it will have a Chilling Effect. I want to ask you, have you given direction to this whistleblower, that he can, in congress, whene the president called the whistleblower a political hack and suggested that he or she was potentially disloyal to the country, you remain silent, i am not sure why, but i think that adds the Chilling Effect. Clear, you seems shall, everybody has a role to play. The process seems clear. Part of it includes you directing the whistleblower of his or her protected rights. Can you confirm that you directed at whistleblower that he or she can come before congress . Director maguire there are several questions there. One, i do not know the identity of the whistleblower. Two, now that the complaint has come forward, we are working with his counsel in order to be able to provide them with security clearance. My question is pretty simple. Can you assure this committee and the American Public that the whistleblower is authorized to speak to the committee with a full protection of the act. Can you confirm that, yes or no . . Director maguire i am working full that through that with the chair, and the chair was asking the whistleblower to come forward. I am working all counsel to support that. Rep. Sewell can you assure that the American Public that the whistleblower will come before this committee and congress and have full protections. What is the whistleblower statute for, unless it is to provide protections against retaliation and litigation . Director maguire i am doing everything to endeavored to support that. Director, do we have your assurance that once you work out the assured see clearances, that the whistleblower will be able to relate the full fact within his knowledge, concern and wrongdoing and whatever else that he or she will not inhibited and what they can tell and they will not be some reminder from the white house or elsewhere for what they can answer or not answer, do i have your assurance that whistleblower will be able to testify fully and freely and enjoy the protections of the law. Director maguire yes. I yield back. I also wanted to understand what you will do to try and ensure the trust of the employees and contractors that you represent to assure the American People that the whistleblower statute is in fact adhered to and no efforts will lead to ones obstruct a whistleblower who has watched misconduct to get justice . Director maguire supporting and leading the men and women of the Intelligence Committee is my highest priority. I do not consider that they work for me. I believe that i serve rep. Sewell i just want to go on record as being clear that this will have a Chilling Effect, and that is exactly not what the statute was intended for, it was intended for giveparency, and also to the whistleblower certain protections and i think the American People deserve that. Thank you. Director maguire thank you. Mr. Turner. For beingr, thank you here, thank you for your service and the clarity at which you have described the deliberations that you went through in applying the laws with respect to this complaint. It is incredibly admirable in the manner of with which you have approached this. I read the complaint and the transcript of the conversation with the president , and the president of the ukraine. Concerning that conversation, i want to say to the president , this is not ok, that conversation is not ok, and i think it is disappointing to the American Public. I can say what else it is not. It is not what is in the complaint. We now have the complaint and the transcript and people can read the allegations of the complaint, and the allegations are not the