hello, there. on thursday we are electing a new parliament. voters here will choose 18 new mps. we are live from belfast debating the big talking points that matter to go. joining us... gavin robinson, the leader of the dup. we invited the leader of the dup. we invited the sinn fein leader and the party tonight is represented by chris hazzard. colum eastwood is a leader of the sdlp and the leader of the alliance party is naomi long. and we also invited the of the ulster unionists, the deputy leader, robbie butler, completes the line—up. on the order they are positioned in was determined by the drawing of lots. the questions come from our studio audience. largely made up of grassroots party supporters from across all parties standing in northern ireland. we also have a number of undecided voters. at home, join the discussion on social media. a hashtag is #bbcnidebate. i should point out the team of bbc news correspondents are fact checking this debate on the news nite website. let's get started. question one comes from kellie cowen, an electrical engineer from belfast. how do the parties justify voting to cut the health service budget by £184 million? very good first question. sinn fein, you hold the finance ministry, this is your budget. justify it. to you hold the finance ministry, this is your budget. justify it.— is your budget. justify it. to be referred to _ is your budget. justify it. to be referred to the _ is your budget. justify it. to be referred to the coalition - is your budget. justify it. to be referred to the coalition that l is your budget. justify it. to be i referred to the coalition that sits around the election table, there is an understanding in the public that after iii years of tory austerity, public services have been absolutely devastated, there is a lot of goodwill in the public and they see the positive leadership that michelle o'neill and emma little—pengelly provide and i think doctor caoimhe archibald has done good things, moving forward with a 700 million for pay awards for the public sector workers and 25 million put into extending access to childcare and that is a start of a process. the most important thing that has been achieved as a recognition from the british government that stormont has been underfunded and with a new labour government coming into play there is the onus on all mps and colleagues to make sure we get a better deal to invest in the health service and continue with transformation. applause. you say that people are mindful of that. it might be argued that people are much more mindful of the 26% of the population on a waiting list. more than 350,000 people, the average weight is 50 weeks and in england it is 15. it is not unusual to wait for 12 hours in the emergency department, that was unthinkable ten years ago. and 30% of cancer targets are being met, that figure is 64% in england. your party has agreed this budget, were specifically are you cutting the £184 specifically are you cutting the £181; million that kellie is talking about? £184 million that kellie is talking about? ., �* ., . 'f~~ about? you're not cutting £186 million at all. _ about? you're not cutting £186 million at all. it _ about? you're not cutting £186 million at all. it is _ about? you're not cutting £186 million at all. it is an _ about? you're not cutting £186 million at all. it is an effective| million at all. it is an effective cut. the reason _ million at all. it is an effective cut. the reason why _ million at all. it is an effective cut. the reason why the - million at all. it is an effective. cut. the reason why the figures civen is cut. the reason why the figures given is kellie _ cut. the reason why the figures given is kellie is _ cut. the reason why the figures given is kellie is providing - cut. the reason why the figures given is kellie is providing the i given is kellie is providing the end of year from last year rather than the figure at the start and as a result of the work that we did and i started last year in highlighting the fact that northern ireland does not get sufficient funding to provide public services that we need... 15 provide public services that we need... , ., ,, ., need... is that while you were out of government? _ need. .. is that while you were out of government? i _ need... is that while you were out of government? i was _ need... is that while you were out| of government? i was representing the --eole of government? i was representing the peeple at _ of government? i was representing the people at westminster - of government? i was representing the people at westminster and - of government? i was representing the people at westminster and we | the people at westminster and we started the campaign and that meant the executive when it was restored at £950 million to allocate across departments. at £950 million to allocate across departments-— at £950 million to allocate across departments. you are still cutting 184 million? _ departments. you are still cutting 184 million? we _ departments. you are still cutting 184 million? we are _ departments. you are still cutting 184 million? we are not, - departments. you are still cutting 184 million? we are not, that - departments. you are still cutting 184 million? we are not, that is i departments. you are still cutting i 184 million? we are not, that is the end of your — 184 million? we are not, that is the end of your figure. _ 184 million? we are not, that is the end of your figure. since _ 184 million? we are not, that is the end of your figure. since then - 184 million? we are not, that is the end of your figure. since then there was an allocation of 450 million to the department of health, almost 50%, and a question arises and i think your audience and viewers would like to know of the £950 million, if we did not have an allocation towards a department of health or towards the department of education, many police officers were going to be made redundant and how many prisoners would be released and how many special needs children will be left to fight for the provision they need? 950 additional million pounds on the department of health got 50%. we pounds on the department of health ot 50%. ~ ., �* ., pounds on the department of health rot 50%. ~ ., �* ., ., ., ., got 50%. we don't have a lot of time for each question. _ got 50%. we don't have a lot of time for each question. naomi _ got 50%. we don't have a lot of time for each question. naomi long, - got 50%. we don't have a lot of time | for each question. naomi long, gavin robinson mentioned the police officers but what people, i would have thought, they would have expected in this new mandate and i know it is a devolved matter but this is what people have asked us to ask you this evening... where is the plan, given we have had two years of suspension and three years of sinn fein suspension before that, and everything that has happened since the bengoa report in 2016, where is the bengoa report in 2016, where is the executive plan to cut waiting lists, to transform the services? medics and senior health officials say you do not have a plan between you. say you do not have a plan between ou. ~ , ., ., ., ., say you do not have a plan between ou. ,., ., ., you. we should not have a plan between us _ you. we should not have a plan between us because _ you. we should not have a plan between us because it - you. we should not have a plan between us because it is - you. we should not have a plan between us because it is for - you. we should not have a plan | between us because it is for the department of health and for the minister— department of health and for the minister of health... you department of health and for the minister of health. . ._ department of health and for the minister of health... you are on the executive- — minister of health... you are on the executive- we _ minister of health... you are on the executive. we have _ minister of health... you are on the executive. we have asked - minister of health. .. you are on the executive. we have asked for- minister of health... you are on the executive. we have asked for a - minister of health... you are on the| executive. we have asked for a plan in terms of — executive. we have asked for a plan in terms of transformation. - executive. we have asked for a plan in terms of transformation. it - executive. we have asked for a plan in terms of transformation. it is - in terms of transformation. it is correct — in terms of transformation. it is correct to— in terms of transformation. it is correct to say that the closing budget — correct to say that the closing budget of health last year looks like it— budget of health last year looks like it has been cut but what we have _ like it has been cut but what we have not— like it has been cut but what we have not taken into account is during — have not taken into account is during the _ have not taken into account is during the year they are monitoring, they will_ during the year they are monitoring, they will he — during the year they are monitoring, they will be further allegations and that is_ they will be further allegations and that is why comparing the end of year and — that is why comparing the end of year and start of year... i have to finish _ year and start of year... i have to finish this — year and start of year... i have to finish this. there is an increase in health— finish this. there is an increase in health funding, take the start of your position last year and this year— your position last year and this year and — your position last year and this year and if— your position last year and this year and if you go back and look at what _ year and if you go back and look at what has _ year and if you go back and look at what has happened to funding in the executive _ what has happened to funding in the executive over recent years, the department of health has seen a 70% increase _ department of health has seen a 70% increase in— department of health has seen a 70% increase in their budget and the department of education has seen a more _ department of education has seen a more than _ department of education has seen a more than 40% increase in their budget — more than 40% increase in their budget. the department ofjustice has seen _ budget. the department ofjustice has seen around 3% increase. we budget. the department ofjustice has seen around 396 increase. we are talkinr has seen around 396 increase. we are talking about — has seen around 396 increase. we are talking about health. _ has seen around 396 increase. we are talking about health. we _ has seen around 396 increase. we are talking about health. we will - has seen around 396 increase. we are talking about health. we will go - has seen around 396 increase. we are talking about health. we will go to i talking about health. we will go to the audience. _ talking about health. we will go to the audience. health _ talking about health. we will go to the audience. health is _ talking about health. we will go to the audience. health is not - talking about health. we will go to the audience. health is not the - the audience. health is not the department of health, all of us contribute to health and wellbeing and we _ contribute to health and wellbeing and we have to fund all departments fairly if— and we have to fund all departments fairly if we're going to have a healthier_ fairly if we're going to have a healthier and happier and safer society — healthier and happier and safer socie . , society. some people might say the crucial issue — society. some people might say the crucial issue here _ society. some people might say the crucial issue here is _ society. some people might say the crucial issue here is around - society. some people might say the crucial issue here is around health. | crucial issue here is around health. robbie butler, you are nodding your head but you're not prepared to implement that, you are part of this executive, why? you cannot be in or out? you either agree a budget and bring a plan or you walk out and join colum eastwood in opposition with the sdlp? that join colum eastwood in opposition with the sdlp?— with the sdlp? that is not the osition with the sdlp? that is not the position at _ with the sdlp? that is not the position at all— with the sdlp? that is not the position at all and _ with the sdlp? that is not the position at all and help - with the sdlp? that is not the position at all and help as - with the sdlp? that is not the position at all and help as a i with the sdlp? that is not the - position at all and help as a number one issue _ position at all and help as a number one issue on — position at all and help as a number one issue on the _ position at all and help as a number one issue on the doorsteps- position at all and help as a number one issue on the doorsteps and - one issue on the doorsteps and whether— one issue on the doorsteps and whether you _ one issue on the doorsteps and whether you campaign - one issue on the doorsteps and whether you campaign in - one issue on the doorsteps and whether you campaign in a - one issue on the doorsteps and - whether you campaign in a council, assembly— whether you campaign in a council, assembly or— whether you campaign in a council, assembly or the _ whether you campaign in a council, assembly or the westminster- assembly or the westminster election. _ assembly or the westminster election, health _ assembly or the westminster election, health is _ assembly or the westminster election, health is number. assembly or the westminster. election, health is number one assembly or the westminster- election, health is number one topic i would _ election, health is number one topic i would disagree _ election, health is number one topic i would disagree with _ election, health is number one topic i would disagree with naomi - election, health is number one topic| i would disagree with naomi because she contradicted _ i would disagree with naomi because she contradicted herself, _ i would disagree with naomi because she contradicted herself, she - i would disagree with naomi because she contradicted herself, she said i she contradicted herself, she said health— she contradicted herself, she said health was— she contradicted herself, she said health was a — she contradicted herself, she said health was a matter _ she contradicted herself, she said health was a matter and - she contradicted herself, she said health was a matter and bringingl health was a matter and bringing forward — health was a matter and bringing forward a — health was a matter and bringing forward a plan _ health was a matter and bringing forward a plan was _ health was a matter and bringing forward a plan was for _ health was a matter and bringing forward a plan was for the - health was a matter and bringing| forward a plan was for the health minister— forward a plan was for the health minister and _ forward a plan was for the health ministerand then— forward a plan was for the health minister and then she _ forward a plan was for the health minister and then she said - forward a plan was for the healthi minister and then she said health was for— minister and then she said health was for everybody... _ minister and then she said health was for everybody... you - minister and then she said health was for everybody. . ._ minister and then she said health was for everybody... you are holding the health portfolio. _ was for everybody... you are holding the health portfolio. sorry, _ was for everybody... you are holding the health portfolio. sorry, excuse i the health portfolio. sorry, excuse me. the ulster _ the health portfolio. sorry, excuse me. the ulster unionist _ the health portfolio. sorry, excuse me. the ulster unionist party - the health portfolio. sorry, excuse| me. the ulster unionist party have taken _ me. the ulster unionist party have taken health— me. the ulster unionist party have taken health twice, _ me. the ulster unionist party have taken health twice, under- me. the ulster unionist party have taken health twice, under michaell taken health twice, under michael mcgimpsey— taken health twice, under michael mcgimpsey as _ taken health twice, under michael mcgimpsey as well— taken health twice, under michael mcgimpsey as well and _ taken health twice, under michael mcgimpsey as well and sinn - taken health twice, under michael mcgimpsey as well and sinn feinl taken health twice, under michael. mcgimpsey as well and sinn fein and the dup_ mcgimpsey as well and sinn fein and the dup in— mcgimpsey as well and sinn fein and the dup intheir— mcgimpsey as well and sinn fein and the dup in their previously— mcgimpsey as well and sinn fein and the dup in their previously promised | the dup in their previously promised £1 billion _ the dup in their previously promised £1 billion extra _ the dup in their previously promised £1 billion extra on— the dup in their previously promised £1 billion extra on we _ the dup in their previously promised £1 billion extra on we saw— the dup in their previously promised £1 billion extra on we saw a - the dup in their previously promised £1 billion extra on we saw a 2.3% - £1 billion extra on we saw a 2.3% reduction, — £1 billion extra on we saw a 2.3% reduction, we _ £1 billion extra on we saw a 2.3% reduction, we saw— £1 billion extra on we saw a 2.3% reduction, we saw two _ £1 billion extra on we saw a 2.3% . reduction, we saw two executive... sorry— reduction, we saw two executive... sorry to _ reduction, we saw two executive... sorry to interrupt _ reduction, we saw two executive... sorry to interrupt. this _ reduction, we saw two executive... sorry to interrupt. this is— reduction, we saw two executive... sorry to interrupt. this is why - sorry to interrupt. this is why people want to talk about it, it was a number one question. what you are spouting statistics. i have not come to colum eastwood yet. the difficulty is, people do not really want to hear those figures, they want to hear those figures, they want to hear when they are getting their hospital appointments and their hospital appointments and their operations? people are dying and emergency departments on waiting lists. they are getting diagnosed with cancer in an emergency department because they could not get an appointment to be seen. i absolutely agree and the underfunding_ absolutely agree and the underfunding is- absolutely agree and the i underfunding is important absolutely agree and the - underfunding is important but the other— underfunding is important but the other thing — underfunding is important but the other thing that _ underfunding is important but the other thing that has _ underfunding is important but the other thing that has affected - underfunding is important but the other thing that has affected the. other thing that has affected the transformation— other thing that has affected the transformation of— other thing that has affected the transformation of health - other thing that has affected the transformation of health is - transformation of health is abstention— transformation of health is abstention as _ transformation of health is abstention as an _ transformation of health is . abstention as an instrument, transformation of health is - abstention as an instrument, five years— abstention as an instrument, five years of— abstention as an instrument, five years of the — abstention as an instrument, five years of the last _ abstention as an instrument, five years of the last seven _ abstention as an instrument, five years of the last seven but - abstention as an instrument, five years of the last seven but we . abstention as an instrument, five years of the last seven but we doi years of the last seven but we do not have — years of the last seven but we do