Transcripts For BBCNEWS The 20240703

A definitive plan because, you know, the world is changing, the situation in china is changing, but the world is very different now, especially after ukrainian war, because, erm, the democracies seem to be able to get together to form a meaningful deterrence, so whenever there is invasion contemplated. So if we deal with the matter very carefully, theres still a great possibility for us to maintain peace as we all need. Cheering tsais predecessor, president ma ying jeou, cheering tsais predecessor, president ma ying jeou, had tried to negotiate with china, even holding a meeting with president xi jinping in singapore. Tsais strategy has been completely different. Instead of trying to conciliate china, shes built up taiwans own defences. Nearly doubling spending, buying new fighterjets and developing taiwans first indigenous submarines. Today, the lion dance is to celebrate the opening of a new Special Forces Training Base on the outskirts of taipei. Another tangible example of where this new Military Spending is going. So i guess for president tsai, this is a sort of demonstration of what shes been trying to achieve in Defence Policy over the last eight years, because, you know, part of her big thing is taiwan doesnt spend enough on defence. When she came in, it was about 2 of gdp. Shes managed to push that up to about 2. 5 of gdp. A lot of people say taiwan needs to be spending north of 3 of its gdp to have an effective military, given the huge threat that it faces from china. One of the things youve done very differently from your predecessor, he engaged in dialogue with china, he was trying to get taiwan into basically an Economic Partnership with china. You, when you came to power, decided on a very different course, it strikes me. One of. Firstly, building up taiwans own military strength. I would say that we are. The Military Capability of ours is much strengthened with the investments that we have put in in the last eight years, and also with the assistance of our friends, primarily from the United States. Erm, so the investment that we have put into the military Capacity Building is unprecedented, erm, despite the fact that people are urging us to increase the budget further. I think if theres a need, we will always increase and expand our Military Spending, but this is a time for us to use the money available. Erm, efficiently and to build our capacity, erm. At a speed that can match with the expansion of the Chinese Military capability. She chats with soldier today, the president is also meeting some young recruits another major reform shes pushed through is a return to one year of compulsory Military Service. She concedes its not won her many supporters among young voters. I was actually able to convince the public here that extension of the mandatory Military Service is something that we need to do, and i get the support of the people here and also the young people, despite they have some complaint, but its not about their love for the country. They have a love for the country and they have the dedication for the country and they have no hesitation to serve in the military. Its just that we have to make sure that their time spent in the military is worthwhile. We are obligated to provide them with the best equipment, best training, and they know how to, erm. Protect themselves as well as protect the country. President tsais political opponents call her Military Strategy naive, even dangerous. They point to the vastly superior military forces china now has at its disposal and they say trying to defeat these with taiwans much smaller forces is a fools errand. Taiwan is small, it has a small population compared to china, and chinas military is vast, its Military Modernisation is extraordinary and, in the end, this is what your critics would say, is taiwan cannot hope by itself to deter china militarily. Of course, that makes some sense, but the cost of taking over taiwan is going to be enormous, and chinese leadership have to make a good calculation as to whether they are prepared to pay the cost. But what we need to do is to increase the cost of an invasion. So strengthening of Military Capability is one. And working with our friends in the region to form a collective deterrence is another. I suppose, again, just playing devils advocate here, your critics would say, well, thats all very well, but taiwan has very few formal diplomatic allies. It doesnt have any formal military alliances, erm, and that during the last eight years, particularly the last four years, the situation around taiwan has actually become objectively more threatening. Of course we cannot exclude any possibility at the moment, including a possible military conflict, an invasion from china, but the thing is, with the collective efforts of the parties concerned in the region, china actually feels the pressure because its not only military is the concern. They have to be. Aware of the fact that a war may cost their Economic Development and the economic consequences is such that it may probably delay the development of china for years, even for decades. So, if you are a leader of china, what is more important, taking over taiwan or your continuing growth economically and socially . Absolutely crucial to tsais strategy of deterring china is support from america. For decades, the United States has kept China Guessing as to whether they would or would not defend taiwan if beijing attacked. But following the russian invasion of ukraine, President Joe Biden has broken with that tradition, saying repeatedly he would send us troops to defend taiwan. Are you willing to get involved militarily to defend taiwan if it comes to that . Yes. You are . Thats the commitment we made. We are not. Look, heres the situation. We agree with the one china policy. Weve signed on to it and all the attendant agreements made from there. But the idea that it can be taken by force, just taken| by force, isjust not. Is just not appropriate. I itll dislocate the entire region and be another Action Similarto what happened in. In ukraine. President biden has been extremely supportive of taiwan. When asked about whether he would intervene if taiwan were attacked, he has repeatedly said yes. His critics have said that. That is moving america too far away from this idea of strategic ambiguity and that actually, that makes the situation for taiwan more dangerous. I think the ambiguity is still there. Erm, i think the Us Administration has been very careful in, erm, delivering the messages they want to deliver to, erm, the public. So, as far as i am concerned, the way i read it is that the ambiguity is still there. The Chinese Government sees things very differently. When the speaker of the us house of representatives, nancy pelosi, Landed In Taipei in august 2022 to show her support for tsais government, beijing reacted with fury. In chinas view, the United States had crossed a line. Probably the most high profile american visit during your presidency was that of the us house speaker, nancy pelosi. It caused a big reaction from china. For the first time, china fired Ballistic Missiles over the top of taiwan into the pacific ocean. So i wonder, from your point of view, what are the benefits of these sort of very high profile visits . We have been isolated for a long time and we need friends and we need people to come and express their concerns for us. So for any president , you just cant say no to a visit like, erm, speaker pelosis. But the thing is that of course there are risks associated with it, so you have to manage the risk. So there are a lot of communications and diplomacies, the details of which i cannot tell you, but there are a lot of work behind the scenes to make less of an impact on the cross strait situation. How important is victory on the battlefield for ukraine and continued western support for ukraine in terms of how it affects taiwan . Many people suggest that taiwan is a much important case than ukraine because we are indispensable in terms of Global Supply chain and our geographic location, erm. Represents a great deal in terms of strategic values to the region as a whole, so, erm, and there are arguments that perhaps the us should shift their support and resources from ukraine to taiwan. We say no, you have to support ukraine until the very end, because the determination is the most important thing as far as we are concerned. And we are. We dont want to take advantage of the western countries, erm, deciding to reduce or eventually abandon ukraine. No, thats not our position. Our position is that the democracies should support ukraine with all force and effects. You mentioned there taiwans position in the Global Supply chain. Do you think theres now a much wider recognition of just how important. I mean, were talking here, of course were talking about semiconductors, right . Were talking about Taiwan Semiconductors and other big taiwanese companies. Erm, do you think people around the world understand how vital taiwans position is . Let me put it this way, 90 of the advanced chips are produced in taiwan. And for, erm. The future, erm, technology, like ai, taiwan holds the key. So that itself is important enough for the rest of the world. President tsai has had to deal with her share of disasters. The latest, a huge earthquake which hit the island last month, bringing down buildings and unleashing landslides along the mountainous east coast. A week after the quake, i flew with the president as she visited the hardest hit areas. So were on board president tsais aircraft right now, heading from taipei to hualien, where there was a huge earthquake last week, and shes just getting a briefing about the situation there and about what shes going to see. Last time taiwan was hit by a quake of this size, hundreds of buildings collapsed and more than 2,000 people were killed. This time, the death toll was less than 20. We learned a lesson, of course. The earthquake in nantou 25 years ago had major damage, erm. To the region and it was devastating. And people were actually shocked and. And we realised that we had to do something about it because this is a place where theres no shortage of natural. Natural disaster. The other crisis tsais government had to face was covid i9. Back in 2003, the island had been hit by sars. This time they moved fast to close the borders and the result was, in the first year of covid i9, just seven people died of the disease in taiwan. One thing thats very noticeable, although you didnt have any lockdowns domestically, you did close your borders very quickly. Was that key . That is one of the keys, because of the sars experience and the source of the disease back then was from china. And this time our suspicion is that it is also from china, so we make a very quick decision and then stop the chinese Tourist Groups coming into taiwan. And that was a time very close to the lunar new year. We made the decision and it was quick and early enough. President tsai is a famous dog and cat lover. She takes me to meet her four dogs and two cats. She is a retired rescue dog. Shes now 12 years old. The president is also something of an anglophile, having spent the early 1980s studying for a phd in law at the London School of economics, just when britain had elected its first female Prime Minister, margaret thatcher. I looked at the dates. In the uk, you did your phd 11984. It was the thatcher era. And ijust wonder, did you register that when you were in the uk . That this was britains first female Prime Minister and that she. I mean, even if you didnt like her. Shes a very determined lady. Erm, i have a lot of admiration for her, despite that i may not be in agreement with all her policies, but as a leader, shes a tough one. One thing that comes across very clearly from spending time with president tsai is that in spite of it looking very much like china, with a similar language, customs and religious beliefs, she sees taiwan as a different, separate place with its own unique history. It was first colonised by the dutch, the spanish and later the japanese and. And chinese. So its all left a legacy here that makes it very different . Yes. So we have very diverse culture here. Yeah. People influenced taiwan at different times and moved to taiwan and stayed here at different times, so its a very interesting place. This is still a very patriarchal society. You, i know, have appointed many women to high positions in government, you appointed the first transgender Cabinet Minister in taiwans history. Maybe in asias history, im not sure. Do you think theres an enduring legacy there that will last, or is there a danger taiwan could revert to what i might call the boys club once youre gone . I have a lot ofjudgment about that boys club that you use. People thought im something unusual happening in taiwan, but i want to say that the Taiwan Society and democracy and people are less bound by the traditional. So youre saying, basically, that means taiwan is a more open minded society than, for example, china is . We have the potential of being an open society. And the fact is that over the years, we realised there is a potential and become a, in my view, an advanced society. That is the background to what became taiwans boldest and most controversial piece of legislation. In 2019, despite resistance from conservative, religious and family groups, her government pushed through Legislation Making Taiwan the first place In Asia To Legalise same sex marriage. You were well ahead of any other country in asia in pushing through that legislation. Why was that such an important priority for you . Because thats the hope of the younger generation, because that is a way to express ourselves as a more advanced country in terms of the progressive values. And also we have very active advocates for the same sex marriage here. So, erm. And its a test to the society here to see to what extent they can move forward with their values. It was a very difficultjourney for us to travel through to get to the stage that the legislature finally approved the same sex marriage. So, erm, it takes. It has taken a lot of effort, a lot of peoples contribution as well, and i am actually rather proud that we managed to overcome our differences and get together and produce a package that we can all live with and eventually we are all proud of it. Its a very different place from when i was here as a student in the 1990s. Very much, very definitely. So, i mean, what is it that you think of as. Makes you feel satisfied about how taiwan has changed . I think were more international now. We have a lot of friends outside of taiwan. We used to be rather isolated and the primary relationship that we have to manage is with china. But nowadays we have to manage a lot of other relationships with the rest of the world. And we interact directly. With a lot of other countries and we help each other. This is a time that we feel that we are actually part of the world. In a few days from now, president tsai will hand over to her successor, taiwans current Vice President , william lai. He has promised to continue her legacy of protecting taiwans status quo. But what exactly is that status quo . In most places in the world, that is an easy question to answer, but not here. Most people here in taiwan, when you look at surveys and you ask them, they say, we want to maintain the status quo. No unification, no independence status quo. What does the status quo mean for you . I think all the people agree on this thing that we are on our own. We make our own decision, we have a political system to govern the place and we have constitution, we have laws regulating, erm. The society as a whole. So, you know. And we have our military, so we have all the elements of a state. And its just that we dont have enough number of diplomatic recognitions. China, of course, will say that were part of them. So its for the people to interpret what taiwan represents at this moment in time. But the most important thing is that we are on our own and we are a democracy and we enjoy freedom and democracy and progressive values and we are a group of people that are very proud of ourselves. Hello there. A bit of high cloud turning the sunshine hazing. Very much femke that we can but spells of warm sunshine, mist and fog likely especially during the mornings and some of us will see heavy showers but not everywhere. I dominating from the atlantic but not far away across in a continent a few areas low pressure. This one front likely to spill rain across the southeast of england early on saturday morning. Perhaps it spreads along the south coast. Elsewhere early mist and fog steering slowly from the northeastern coast and we could see thunderstorms. There will be in a mess. We could see a few showers. Top cabbages between 20 and 23 for most of us but cool if you are stuck under the cloud around the northeast coast. Ripping through into sunday and we have this area pay pressure still sitting out in the atlantic trying to dominate the weather. Squeezing most of the away. The childs one to propping up. Similar to recent days we have this area of low cloud in the north sea that will slowly clear back towards the east coast. Could linger all day for areas like aberdeen and perhaps in newcastle. 22 or so in sunny response. What about the new working week . Heading on its of monday and between Weather Systems at this stage. Monday is whether fairly quiet, wanting likely to dawn with mist and fog and low cloud as well. A good deal of sunshine breaks through fairly light went for most of us and a little cool if you are close to the east coast. Towards the west, place like cardiff and liveable up to around 20 degrees with temperatures coming down a notch as we compare them to what we have seen over the past couple of days with tablature have been up days with tablature have been up around 23 and 2a degrees. Looking to was tuesday, low pressure trying to approach both from the atlantic and also familiar continent. It might chance of catching of those downpours on tuesday. Not everywhere but most likely for her perhaps parts of northern ireland, the southwest of england, Eastern Scotland could see showers. Fairly typical for this stage in may. Into the middle of the week and we could see more of a signalfor middle of the week and we could see more of a signal for low pressure moving its way and probably from the south or east. Likely to bring some rain at times potentially for parts of east anglia, Eastern England in general. Elsewhere you are more likely to stick with the theme of sunny spells and the option of scattered showers. Temperature was looking at highs in the mid to high teens on wednesday. Moving forwards was the latter part of next week. Fairly unsettled spell for the middle of the week. Most of the sales should is the way and Computer Models look at higher pressure but it was the end of the week and into next weekend. Not too far away, showers looking potential but could see a bit of wet weather especially in the south. More so in the middle of the week looks a touch cool and a bit more unsettled, heading towards the middle of the week and into next we can come attempt is claimed by a degree or so. A lot of fairly dry and unsettled weather towards the Bank Holiday Weekend and there is the chance we could catch a few showers as well. Bye. Live from washington, this is a bbc news special programme on china and the west. Xijinping tells china and the west. Xi jinping tells Vladimir China and the west. Xijinping tells Vladimir Putin that china will always be moscows close partner and friend, as the two leaders vow to deepen their strategic partnership. And in the us, President Biden opposes steep tariff hikes on Critical Technologies from china hitting goods from electric cars to chips. Welcome to our show. We start with russias leader concluding his two day visit in china. There were smiles, handshakes and warm words from xi jinping and warm words from xi jinping and Vladimir Putin as both countries pledged to deepen relations. This year marks the 75th Anniversary of the establishment of china russia diplomatic relations and both agreed to combat what they say are destructive and hostile us policies. The us is urging china to stop supporting russias war in ukraine, saying it cannot seek to improve ties with the west and continue to support moscow, but theres been little sign mr xi has heeded those words and trade between china and russia has surged since the invasion. The kremlin leader said he appreciated chinas objective and flexible position on the conflict. Our china correspondent has more on those