to what we have witnessed in the knesset today, right wing politicians in a shouting match with the families of the israeli hostages. also on the programme, the decision to sack sam altman has provoked rebellion at openai. more than 2 thirds of staff threatened to quit today unless the board resigns. and happy birthdayjoe biden. the us president turns 81 today — a number that seems to be moving in the opposite direction to his polling — his approval rating today slumped to the lowest level of his presidency. good evening. there are hopes rising that some of the 240 people kidnapped by hamas on october 7th could soon be freed. the qataris, who are leading the negotiation, said only "minor obstacles' remain. president biden says he and his team are working hour by hour to get it done. but the families of these hostages, who today have been meeting members of the war cabinet, say the priorities of the government are all wrong. "talk life, not death" plead the families — incensed by the government's plans to reintroduce the death penalty for hamas attackers. in resonse, the ministers of mr netanyahu's hard—right coalition said anyone speaking out against the death penalty "represented hamas more than they represent the state of israel." well, the situation in gaza is grim. the medical director of the indonesian hospital said shells had crashed into his surgery department today, filled with patients, killing at least ten people. we can't independently confirm the numbers. but the bbc has verified footage which shows tanks close to the hospital — the director said they were just 20m from the complex. israel says that like al shifa, hamas is using medical facilities as cover. that's denied by hamas and by indonesia. some hopeful news — 28 of the 31 premature babies evacuated from the el shifa on sunday, have arrived in egypt for medical treatment. we will get reaction to all that from a member of the israeli knesset who is with me in the studio. but first, this report from our special correspondent orla guerin — and a warning, you may find some of these images distressing. a tiny baby from gaza, now safe in egypt, straight into a waiting incubator. 28 premature babies have been transferred here. desperately vulnerable still but beyond the reach of war, unlike abouti million children who remain in gaza. night and day they are at risk. here, more wounded children being brought in. palestinians say they are victims of an israeli air strike on residential buildings. gunfire and here, israeli tanks near gaza's indonesian hospital where 12 people were reported killed. the army says troops came under fire from within the hospital and fired back at the enemy. in israel, families with loved ones held in gaza are daring to hope there will be a deal to free at least some of them. this was the moment on october the 7th when some hostages were dragged away from their homes, barefoot and in terror. his cousin was among them. this is my cousin, 39 years old, she is an occupational therapist, she loves travelling, she loves music, she is wonderful. she is being held along with her sister—in—law who three—year—old keeps asking when she's coming home. hamas doesn't give us any signs of life, we don't even know whether my cousin and her sister—in—law are alive or not. there has been a lot of positive indications in the last few days. are you hopeful now, are you cautious, what is your mood? yes, i'm hopeful, lam hopeful, i think i will see them again. i think we should be hopeful and i think this is the only way we can get up in the morning and start our day. you know, our livesjust stopped october seven. the deal, if it comes, it may only secured the relief ——release of a few dozen women and children. for many families the torment will go on. a number of western doctors that we have had on this programme, who for many years travelled to gaza, are adamant there was never any sign of hamas activity around the surgical wards in which they were assisting. but israel is pointing today to an interview done with an anonymous british doctor who worked in al—shifa hospital. he gave this account to a reporter at france 2a, which has now gone viral. the main point was when i was first asked to work there, i was told there was part of the hospital i was not to go near, and if i did, i would be in danger of being shot. shot — you mean actually being shot with a gun? yes. was it explained to you why that was? no, but implicit was that it was being used for nonmedical purposes. and did you see anything nonmedical, or did you obey the instruction and stay away? i stayed away, but i saw a few sort of dodgy—looking nonmedical characters coming in and out all the time. with me is danny danon, senior member of israel's knesset and israel's former ambassador to the united nations. welcome to the studio. i am sure you would point to that audio and video is released over the weekend as evidence hamas was operating around hospitals, the issue for a lot of people given to more attacks on hospitals today is where is the red line and is proportional to what is happening on the ground?- line and is proportional to what is happening on the ground? those are not hospitais- _ happening on the ground? those are not hospitals. you _ happening on the ground? those are not hospitals. you cannot _ happening on the ground? those are not hospitals. you cannot find - happening on the ground? those are not hospitals. you cannot find in - not hospitals. you cannot find in the uk hospitals with ak—47s, grenades and horse —— tunnels. hamas brought many hostages into the hospitals in daylight. we release some of the footage, we have much more. wear with the doctors and staff? they went through the emergency room, took them through the tunnels. some of the hostages were executed in the hospital. you cannot consider a hospital where hamas is doing whatever they want. we will do whatever we can to minimise civilian casualties for sure in a hospital but hamas will continue to hide in hospitals so we will go after them wherever they will go after them wherever they will be. ., ., ., will be. you are not saying there are not patients _ will be. you are not saying there are not patients and _ will be. you are not saying there are not patients and medical- will be. you are not saying there l are not patients and medical staff in the hospitals? medicine sonn frontier have 50 patients in there. the geneva convention says you are allowed to attack hospital, we try to avoid that.— allowed to attack hospital, we try to avoid that. . . ., ., _ , to avoid that. humanitarian law says an attack to avoid that. humanitarian law says any attack on _ to avoid that. humanitarian law says any attack on a _ to avoid that. humanitarian law says any attack on a hospital— to avoid that. humanitarian law says any attack on a hospital must - to avoid that. humanitarian law says any attack on a hospital must be - to avoid that. humanitarian law says any attack on a hospital must be in l any attack on a hospital must be in proportion to a military advantage gained. are these attacks proportionate? gained. are these attacks --roortionate? ~ , , , . proportionate? absolutely yes. we called the director _ proportionate? absolutely yes. we called the director of _ proportionate? absolutely yes. we called the director of the _ proportionate? absolutely yes. we called the director of the hospitals | called the director of the hospitals many times which is why many of the leaders of hamas are not there any more because they knew we were coming so they went away with their hostages. we call the directors and told them to move out, we can help them facilitate and some actually listen to us. we will continue to do that but it is a war, we are fighting evil. if they hide behind hospitals, we are going to find them wherever they are. ilasiith hospitals, we are going to find them wherever they are.— wherever they are. with respect to the war, wherever they are. with respect to the war. what _ wherever they are. with respect to the war, what can _ wherever they are. with respect to the war, what can you _ wherever they are. with respect to the war, what can you tell - wherever they are. with respect to the war, what can you tell us - wherever they are. with respect to | the war, what can you tell us about this negotiation which is ongoing because we had no reaction to it, the report there would be a five—day pause in exchange for maybe 50 hostages, we have had no reaction from the israeli government, what do you know? i from the israeli government, what do ou know? ., , from the israeli government, what do ou know? . , ., , from the israeli government, what do ou know? . ., , ., you know? i am very cautious for the families of the _ you know? i am very cautious for the families of the hostages. _ you know? i am very cautious for the families of the hostages. we - you know? i am very cautious for the families of the hostages. we listen l families of the hostages. we listen to every word you say, they say. we are hopeful. but we are dealing with psychopaths so we don't know in the end whether it will go or not but we are committed to bring back the babies, the mothers and we cannot leave anyone behind. i babies, the mothers and we cannot leave anyone behind.— leave anyone behind. i know you're close to the — leave anyone behind. i know you're close to the the _ leave anyone behind. i know you're close to the the last _ leave anyone behind. i know you're close to the the last time _ leave anyone behind. i know you're close to the the last time you - leave anyone behind. i know you'rei close to the the last time you came in our programme you are holding up pictures of the people kidnapped, what do you make of watch happened in the classic today? if thickness of votes to introduce the death penalty and begins killing those convicted, won't hamas exact the same retribution on the hostages? now is not the time to discuss anything like that. it was a mistake, we should have the families and listen to them and that debate we can do afterwards. so and listen to them and that debate we can do afterwards.— and listen to them and that debate we can do afterwards. so you would condemn the _ we can do afterwards. so you would condemn the security _ we can do afterwards. so you would condemn the security minister- we can do afterwards. so you would condemn the security minister for. condemn the security minister for introducing the bill at this time? i think now is not the time to do anything, we have to defeat hamas and bring back the hostage. by the way i support the death penalty for these acts against our people but it is not the time to introduce legislation. is not the time to introduce legislation-— is not the time to introduce legislation. is not the time to introduce le . islation. , �* ., legislation. president biden made it clear in the washington _ legislation. president biden made it clear in the washington post - legislation. president biden made it clear in the washington post this i clear in the washington post this weekend that the americans want the west bank and gaza to be reunited under an invigorated palestinian authority rule, working towards a two state solution, do you support that? we two state solution, do you support that? ., ,, u, two state solution, do you support that? , ., that? we appreciate the support of president biden _ that? we appreciate the support of president biden but _ that? we appreciate the support of president biden but we _ that? we appreciate the support of president biden but we think - that? we appreciate the support of president biden but we think it - that? we appreciate the support of president biden but we think it is l president biden but we think it is wishful thinking. president biden but we think it is wishfulthinking. look president biden but we think it is wishful thinking. look what happened in 2005, we give the keys to the palestinian authority and a few months later hamas started a civil war. the authority went away and hamas took over. so i do not think there is a position for them to govern. first we have to defeat hamas, to change the regime of evil and then we have a proper discussion but it will involve regional players, international players but you cannot count on the palestinian authority for that.— authority for that. there is no hamas in _ authority for that. there is no hamas in the _ authority for that. there is no hamas in the west _ authority for that. there is no hamas in the west bank, - authority for that. there is no hamas in the west bank, is l authority for that. there is no - hamas in the west bank, is there? that is. but the palestinian authority is fighting against hamas and we are fighting against hamas. the palestinian authority which president biden sees as a potential governing body and gaza says there are 200 palestinians, including 52 children killed in the west bank by israeli forces and another eight by israeli forces and another eight by israeli settlers. president biden is concerned about what's in west bank so much so he would sanction settlers in the west bank? first so much so he would sanction settlers in the west bank? first of all we condemn _ settlers in the west bank? first of all we condemn any _ settlers in the west bank? first of all we condemn any act _ settlers in the west bank? first of all we condemn any act of- settlers in the west bank? first of. all we condemn any act of violence. people who live there, many of those who committed the crimes are teenagers. we arrested them and put them injail but look teenagers. we arrested them and put them in jail but look what the palestinian authority do? they glorify violence. so far they have not condemned the attacks on october seven. any act of violence against civilians i will condemn you but i have not heard anyone from the palestinian authority leadership condemning hamas atrocities so do not come to us and blame the culture... not come to us and blame the culture- - -_ not come to us and blame the culture... �* . .,, .,, culture... but october the 7th, as tina sa s culture... but october the 7th, as tina says it _ culture... but october the 7th, as tina says it was, _ culture... but october the 7th, as tina says it was, did _ culture... but october the 7th, as tina says it was, did not - culture... but october the 7th, as tina says it was, did not happen l culture... but october the 7th, as| tina says it was, did not happen in a vacuum. before that we had a lot of violence in the west bank which stirred the hatred and resentment and gaza and that is what concerns the american administration that the israeli government is not doing enough to control the violence in the west bank and it is perpetrating, it is bringing more violence. , ., , ., violence. there is no “ustification for violence. there is no “ustification wombat violence. there is no “ustification for october seven _ violence. there is no justification for october seven not _ violence. there is no justification for october seven not at - violence. there is no justification for october seven not at all. - violence. there is no justification| for october seven not at all. look what happened? we disengage from gaza in 2005. we left and look what happened. we had a ceasefire and hamas chose to break the ceasefire so there is no explanation for that terrible act of violence. i hope one day there will be a leadership among palestinians that will speak about peace with the israelis but when we do not see the palestinian authority condemn hamas, we are sceptical about their intentions. you condemn hamas, we are sceptical about their intentions.— condemn hamas, we are sceptical about their intentions. you wrote a iece for about their intentions. you wrote a piece for the _ about their intentions. you wrote a piece for the wall _ about their intentions. you wrote a piece for the wall street _ about their intentions. you wrote a piece for the wall street journal i about their intentions. you wrote a piece for the wall street journal on piece for the wall streetjournal on tuesday calling for countries around the world to accept limited numbers of gazan families. you will know how sensitive the issue is because there are repeated allegations from palestinian and arab countries that israel ultimately is seeking to expel palestinians from gaza. is that the motive behind this statement?— that the motive behind this statement? ~ , , ., ~ that the motive behind this statement? ~ , ., . statement? absolutely not. we said very clearly. — statement? absolutely not. we said very clearly. only — statement? absolutely not. we said very clearly, only those _ statement? absolutely not. we said very clearly, only those who - statement? absolutely not. we said very clearly, only those who choose | very clearly, only those who choose to leave gaza should have that option. gaza was not a nice place to live before the war and it won't be a nicer place after the war. we think the international community should think about options to offer those who want to move out. we said it should be a symbolic number and every country should take upon itself to help those palestinians to have a better life. if you want to move to another country you can do that, i can do the same, why not build that option for some of the people and who want to move out. we have to leave it there. thank you very much. you are watching bbc news around the world and across the uk. from across the uk cyber technology has become embedded in our daily lives. it is constantly evolving public security risks to the public, businesses and governments. the north—west is at the heart of the cyber economy. at this career event schoolchildren had been practising the skills needed to develop saiga technology and take on the threats it poses. it technology and take on the threats it oses. . , technology and take on the threats it oses. ., , ., ., ., , it poses. it was a lot of fun but the skills _ it poses. it was a lot of fun but the skills we _ it poses. it was a lot of fun but the skills we need _ it poses. it was a lot of fun but the skills we need are - it poses. it was a lot of fun but. the skills we need are supposed to be able _ the skills we need are supposed to be able to— the skills we need are supposed to be able to communicate. do the skills we need are supposed to be able to communicate.— the skills we need are supposed to be able to communicate. do you think somethin: be able to communicate. do you think something like _ be able to communicate. do you think something like this _ be able to communicate. do you think something like this would _ be able to communicate. do you think something like this would be - be able to communicate. do you think something like this would be good - be able to communicate. do you think something like this would be good as| something like this would be good as a job later on # yes. the north—west is becoming a cyber corridor. manchester has their government intelligence agency club while preston has many businesses. for more stories from across the uk, head to the bbc news website. you are watching bbc news. the un human rights chief, volker turk, has called for an international investigation into the alleged violations of international law that he blames on both hamas and israel. this weekend, after the evacuation of al shifa hospital, he posted another appeal for a ceasefire. the pain, dread and fear etched on the faces of children, women and men is too much to bear. how much more violence, bloodshed and misery will it take before people come to their senses? how many more civilians will be killed? this must stop. humanity must come first. a cease—fire, on humanitarian and human rights grounds, is desperately needed now. it is quite obvious that hama