move to 2035 petrol diesel cars and also on the gas board constituents are right about the costs in us but by making that decision, it becomes the right decision, but labour immediately make a decision, they said they would reverse it. there you have now a debating point, a moment where two sides don't agree, people have got to make a choice and that's really the principle. whether it's as important as that obviously not the key is... let it's as important as that obviously not the key is. . ._ not the key is... let me ask you about the _ not the key is... let me ask you about the prime _ not the key is... let me ask you about the prime minister's - not the key is... let me ask you l about the prime minister's speech tomorrow. it feels really important moment for rishi sunak, he has not quite hit the ground running yet in this conference. the speech tomorrow at midday is going to be think it is fair to say a pretty big moment if he is going to sell himself to the electorate. what do you want to hear? i electorate. what do you want to hear? . ., ., ,. , hear? i want for him to describe himself. who _ hear? i want for him to describe himself. who is _ hear? i want for him to describe himself. who is he _ hear? i want for him to describe himself. who is he here? - hear? i want for him to describe himself. who is he here? whatl hear? i want for him to describe l himself. who is he here? what is hear? i want for him to describe - himself. who is he here? what is his instinct? what does he think? do you know the answer _ instinct? what does he think? do you know the answer to _ instinct? what does he think? do you know the answer to that? _ instinct? what does he think? do you know the answer to that? i _ instinct? what does he think? do you know the answer to that? i think - instinct? what does he think? do you know the answer to that? i think i - know the answer to that? i think i do but i don't _ know the answer to that? i think i do but i don't think _ know the answer to that? i think i do but i don't think the _ know the answer to that? i think i do but i don't think the public - do but i don't think the public does. instinctively he is rated distinctively in the conservative party. very careful on taxation and spending but keen at the end of the day to make it bigger. the point about this is he has got to show that at the conference tomorrow, he has got to be able to show the public through the medium of television that he is different and that what his instincts are very, very different from keir starmer. tomorrow's speech is the start of the election campaign next year, no question. this is the base on which we launch and build, labour knows that because the following will be the start of the response. this has to be big, bold and very clear to the public, it is going to cost less, we will not keep taxing you, regulation is a big beast, but tomorrow he needs to talk. i regulation is a big beast, but tomorrow he needs to talk. i suspect some peeple — tomorrow he needs to talk. i suspect some peeple are _ tomorrow he needs to talk. i suspect some people are shutting _ tomorrow he needs to talk. i suspect some people are shutting the - some people are shutting the television screen saying rishi sunak? a low tax conservative? the tax personal tax levels in the uk are higher the highest levels outside of the second world war. that does not strike me as someone who has a low tax tory. i that does not strike me as someone who has a low tax tory.— who has a low tax tory. i think he is and coming _ who has a low tax tory. i think he is and coming of _ who has a low tax tory. i think he is and coming of covid, _ who has a low tax tory. i think he is and coming of covid, the - who has a low tax tory. i think he is and coming of covid, the cost l who has a low tax tory. i think he | is and coming of covid, the cost of living crisis, the war in ukraine, these things are almost inevitable. we have never spent money like we have in covid and we had to protect people. the public understand and what they want to know is what is the destination? we have got, richey has got to show them this is where we want to go but there are points along the way in which he will communicate how that's done. tomorrow is point number one. i believe in this and i therefore will bring your taxes down. i'm looking to give you a lower cost of living, i will get you regulation down, industry moving. here is how we're going to do it. if you does that people will go right, we can checklist this.— people will go right, we can checklist this. . , .. ,, checklist this. iain duncan smith, thank ou checklist this. iain duncan smith, thank you for— checklist this. iain duncan smith, thank you for coming _ checklist this. iain duncan smith, thank you for coming to - checklist this. iain duncan smith, thank you for coming to talk - checklist this. iain duncan smith, thank you for coming to talk to i checklist this. iain duncan smith, | thank you for coming to talk to us on the bbc news channel. interesting that the, iain duncan smith has called for the government to think about the money that is going to save by canning birmingham to manchester part of the hs2 line, he thinks part of that money should be given to devolved leaders to the mayors in places like manchester and the west midlands. interesting, we'll put it to the government, we're pretty sure we know what happening with hs2, wejust not we're pretty sure we know what happening with hs2, we just not know what prime minister will do with the money. studio: fascinating conversation. you are no stranger to political conferences. what do you think the tories really need to do at this point? what does rishi sunak need to do at this point to be able to consider this conference a success and set themselves up as iain duncan smith said, for the campaign moving forward? it’s smith said, for the campaign moving forward? �* . . smith said, for the campaign moving forward? 3 . smith said, for the campaign moving forward? �*, . , ., ., forward? it's a good question, i was 'ust sense forward? it's a good question, i was just sense we _ forward? it's a good question, i was just sense we last _ forward? it's a good question, i was just sense we last spoke _ forward? it's a good question, i was just sense we last spoke chatting i forward? it's a good question, i was just sense we last spoke chatting to j just sense we last spoke chatting to some government advisers and tory activists and i think what they want to hear from the activists and i think what they want to hearfrom the prime minister is a big division, an idea for what they can do to fuse the electorate. had what mark one rishi sunak stabilising the economy, a debate about the extent to which the economy is productive for most people, but he thinks thatjob is done. what you're going to see from rishi sunak tomorrow is him trying to sell a more positive vision, saying we have done the respect, here is my big idea how the country should go forward. you heard iain duncan smith talking about being the change candidate, a word rishi sunak has used a lot in the past few days. there is a strange shadow over this conference with hs2 which is rishi sunak promising to make the difficult bulk term decisions but is not telling us on what he is doing on his most difficult decision. will we get clarity on that tomorrow? the answer is probably. the bigger thing perhaps that tory activists will be looking for is something to enthuse them, something they can sell to the current scratch my country. conservatives are miles behind in the polls. some have explained that the polls. some have explained that the gaps are been slightly reduced but if you assume the conservatives are behind in the polls a big question is can he come up with something that closes the gap? star; something that closes the gap? stay with us because i want to bring in some comments we have just received from the home secretary suella braverman. she was asked whether the cabinet understood the regional impact of cancelling the northern leg of hs2. given only the prime minister has a constituency in the north. . ~ . minister has a constituency in the north. , ~ , , north. listen, the prime minister is ”uttin the north. listen, the prime minister is putting the long-term _ north. listen, the prime minister is putting the long-term interests - north. listen, the prime minister is putting the long-term interests of| putting the long—term interests of the british people, the british economy, ahead of everything else and i_ economy, ahead of everything else and i know— economy, ahead of everything else and i know that he is going to be making _ and i know that he is going to be making his — and i know that he is going to be making his mind up and making a decision— making his mind up and making a decision for— making his mind up and making a decision for the country in the best interest— decision for the country in the best interest of— decision for the country in the best interest of the country. he will be considering all of the evidence and importantly the value for money for the british— importantly the value for money for the british taxpayer. we have got to focus _ the british taxpayer. we have got to focus on _ the british taxpayer. we have got to focus on that and any decision that is reached — focus on that and any decision that is reached by the government will be one which— is reached by the government will be one which puts the interests of the british— one which puts the interests of the british people first and foremost. suetta _ british people first and foremost. suella braverman talking about that all—important decision. back to you in manchester. all-important decision. back to you in manchester.— in manchester. thanks, as we were heavin: in manchester. thanks, as we were heaving there _ in manchester. thanks, as we were heaving there is _ in manchester. thanks, as we were heaving there is this _ in manchester. thanks, as we were heaving there is this big _ in manchester. thanks, as we were heaving there is this big debate - heaving there is this big debate about what you do with the money you save by not going ahead with the manchester to birmingham line of h52. manchester to birmingham line of hs2. some call for some of that money to be devolved to local leaders. i have a government minister here, spencer, food, fisheries and farming? v3 f. it feels content contentious something. let me tell you, let me ask you, i know you will not tell me if hs2 is going to be can't but iain duncan smith said if it is the money should be given to local leaders like andy burnham to let them decide what to do to level up the midlands. tote burnham to let them decide what to do to level up the midlands.- do to level up the midlands. we are doinu lots do to level up the midlands. we are doing lots of— do to level up the midlands. we are doing lots of that _ do to level up the midlands. we are doing lots of that already, - doing lots of that already, investing _ doing lots of that already, investing in _ doing lots of that already, investing in local- doing lots of that already, - investing in local infrastructures and rait — investing in local infrastructures and rail. �* investing in local infrastructures and rail. . investing in local infrastructures andrail. ., , and rail. are you saying the money ou save and rail. are you saying the money you save should _ and rail. are you saying the money you save should be _ and rail. are you saying the money you save should be given - and rail. are you saying the money you save should be given to - and rail. are you saying the money you save should be given to local l you save should be given to local riders? it you save should be given to local riders? . you save should be given to local riders? , . , , ., riders? it is always the case for usina riders? it is always the case for using taxoayer _ riders? it is always the case for using taxpayer money - riders? it is always the case for| using taxpayer money efficiently riders? it is always the case for- using taxpayer money efficiently and that's— using taxpayer money efficiently and that's what _ using taxpayer money efficiently and that's what the — using taxpayer money efficiently and that's what the prime _ using taxpayer money efficiently and that's what the prime minister- using taxpayer money efficiently and that's what the prime minister and l that's what the prime minister and chancettor— that's what the prime minister and chancellor will _ that's what the prime minister and chancellor will go _ that's what the prime minister and chancellor will go through - that's what the prime minister and chancellor will go through the - chancellor will go through the process— chancellor will go through the process now _ chancellor will go through the process now. evaluating - chancellor will go through the l process now. evaluating where chancellor will go through the - process now. evaluating where we are at, process now. evaluating where we are at. looking _ process now. evaluating where we are at. looking at— process now. evaluating where we are at. looking at it — process now. evaluating where we are at, looking at it pragmatically, - at, looking at it pragmatically, that's— at, looking at it pragmatically, that's what— at, looking at it pragmatically, that's what you _ at, looking at it pragmatically, that's what you get _ at, looking at it pragmatically, that's what you get from - at, looking at it pragmatically, that's what you get from rishi| that's what you get from rishi sunak. — that's what you get from rishi sunak. a _ that's what you get from rishi sunak. a very— that's what you get from rishi sunak, a very pragmatic- that's what you get from rishi sunak, a very pragmatic looki that's what you get from rishi i sunak, a very pragmatic look at these _ sunak, a very pragmatic look at these things _ sunak, a very pragmatic look at these things and _ sunak, a very pragmatic look at these things and that's - sunak, a very pragmatic look at these things and that's good i sunak, a very pragmatic look at. these things and that's good news for the _ these things and that's good news for the country. _ these things and that's good news for the country.— these things and that's good news for the country. what is your sense of how the — for the country. what is your sense of how the hs2 _ for the country. what is your sense of how the h52 row _ for the country. what is your sense of how the h52 row as, _ for the country. what is your sense of how the h52 row as, or - for the country. what is your sense of how the h52 row as, or the - for the country. what is your sense of how the h52 row as, or the iack| of how the hs2 row as, or the lack of how the hs2 row as, or the lack of announcement rather than row, is overshadowing the conference? it’s overshadowing the conference? it's certainly not what i am giving talking — certainly not what i am giving talking to _ certainly not what i am giving talking to delegates, - certainly not what i am giving talking to delegates, lots - certainly not what i am giving talking to delegates, lots of i certainly not what i am giving - talking to delegates, lots of other chattenges — talking to delegates, lots of other challenges we _ talking to delegates, lots of other challenges we are _ talking to delegates, lots of other challenges we are trying - talking to delegates, lots of other challenges we are trying to - talking to delegates, lots of other challenges we are trying to solve i challenges we are trying to solve and going — challenges we are trying to solve and going around _ challenges we are trying to solve and going around the _ challenges we are trying to solve and going around the conferencej challenges we are trying to solve i and going around the conference i challenges we are trying to solve - and going around the conference i am talking _ and going around the conference i am talking to _ and going around the conference i am talking to people _ and going around the conference i am talking to people about _ and going around the conference i am talking to people about farming - and going around the conference i am talking to people about farming and l talking to people about farming and food production— talking to people about farming and food production and _ talking to people about farming and food production and the _ talking to people about farming and . food production and the environment. these _ food production and the environment. these are _ food production and the environment. these are also — food production and the environment. these are also issues _ food production and the environment. these are also issues which _ food production and the environment. these are also issues which are - food production and the environment. these are also issues which are very. these are also issues which are very much _ these are also issues which are very much at _ these are also issues which are very much at the — these are also issues which are very much at the forefront _ these are also issues which are very much at the forefront of _ these are also issues which are very much at the forefront of the - much at the forefront of the conference _ much at the forefront of the conference being _ much at the forefront of the conference being debated . much at the forefront of the l conference being debated and analysed _ conference being debated and analysed and _ conference being debated and analysed and lots _ conference being debated and analysed and lots of— conference being debated and analysed and lots of exciting i analysed and lots of exciting suggestions _ analysed and lots of exciting suggestions about— analysed and lots of exciting suggestions about how - analysed and lots of exciting suggestions about how we . analysed and lots of exciting i suggestions about how we can analysed and lots of exciting - suggestions about how we can meet those _ suggestions about how we can meet those challenges. _ suggestions about how we can meet those challenges. you— suggestions about how we can meet those challenges.— those challenges. you have been a minister in — those challenges. you have been a minister in various _ those challenges. you have been a minister in various different - minister in various different governments. don't you get frustrated that rishi sunak is not on the front foot and that he is just batting off questions about is hsz just batting off questions about is hs2 going to come to manchester? are you going to reduce taxes? ianthem h52 going to come to manchester? are you going to reduce taxes?— you going to reduce taxes? when you look at rishi — you going to reduce taxes? when you look at rishi sunak's _ you going to reduce taxes? when you look at rishi sunak's premiership - look at rishi sunak's premiership you get— look at rishi sunak's premiership you get a — look at rishi sunak's premiership you get a sense _ look at rishi sunak's premiership you get a sense that _ look at rishi sunak's premiership you get a sense that he - look at rishi sunak's premiership you get a sense that he is- look at rishi sunak's premiership you get a sense that he is a - look at rishi sunak's premiership you get a sense that he is a veryi you get a sense that he is a very thoughtful— you get a sense that he is a very thoughtful man, _ you get a sense that he is a very thoughtful man, very— you get a sense that he is a very thoughtful man, very pragmatic| you get a sense that he is a very- thoughtful man, very pragmatic man who does— thoughtful man, very pragmatic man who does not— thoughtful man, very pragmatic man who does not make _ thoughtful man, very pragmatic man who does not make rash _ thoughtful man, very pragmatic man who does not make rash decisions, i thoughtful man, very pragmatic man i who does not make rash decisions, he like to— who does not make rash decisions, he like to think _ who does not make rash decisions, he like to think things _ who does not make rash decisions, he like to think things through, _ who does not make rash decisions, he like to think things through, get - who does not make rash decisions, he like to think things through, get to - like to think things through, get to the right— like to think things through, get to the right conclusion. _ like to think things through, get to the right conclusion. he _ like to think things through, get to the right conclusion. he may- like to think things through, get to the right conclusion. he may takei the right conclusion. he may take time _ the right conclusion. he may take time to— the right conclusion. he may take time to do— the right conclusion. he may take time to do that, _ the right conclusion. he may take time to do that, to— the right conclusion. he may take time to do that, to get— the right conclusion. he may take time to do that, to get to - the right conclusion. he may take time to do that, to get to the - the right conclusion. he may takei time to do that, to get to the right decision, _ time to do that, to get to the right decision, but— time to do that, to get to the right decision, but i_ time to do that, to get to the right decision, but i think— time to do that, to get to the right decision, but i think that's- time to do that, to get to the right decision, but i think that's what i decision, but i think that's what you get, — decision, but i think that's what you get, someone _ decision, but i think that's what you get, someone who - decision, but i think that's what you get, someone who is - decision, but i think that's what you get, someone who is very. you get, someone who is very pragmatic— you get, someone who is very pragmatic and _ you get, someone who is very pragmatic and thoughtful, - you get, someone who is very. pragmatic and thoughtful, that's what _ pragmatic and thoughtful, that's what he — pragmatic and thoughtful, that's what he wanted _ pragmatic and thoughtful, that's what he wanted in _ pragmatic and thoughtful, that's what he wanted in a _ pragmatic and thoughtful, that's what he wanted in a prime - pragmatic and thoughtful, that's - what he wanted in a prime minister, someone _ what he wanted in a prime minister, someone who— what he wanted in a prime minister, someone who can _ what he wanted in a prime minister, someone who can really _ what he wanted in a prime minister, someone who can really see - what he wanted in a prime minister, someone who can really see the - someone who can really see the challenges, _ someone who can really see the challenges, think— someone who can really see the challenges, think about - someone who can really see the challenges, think about the - someone who can really see the challenges, think about the wayj someone who can really see the i challenges, think about the way we can meet— challenges, think about the way we can meet those _ challenges, think about the way we can meet those challenges - challenges, think about the way we can meet those challenges and - can meet those challenges and deliver — can meet those challenges and deliver. . r' can meet those challenges and deliver. . , ., . , . deliver. let me ask you a bit about our brief deliver. let me ask you a bit about your brief on _ deliver. let me ask you a bit about your brief on food _ deliver. let me ask you a bit about your brief on food in _ deliver. let me ask you a bit about your brief on food in particular. - deliver. let me ask you a bit about your brief on food in particular. i i your brief on food in particular. i was struck by something claire coutinho energy secretary said yesterday about people wanting to tax red meat. what politicians have said that? i tax red meat. what politicians have said that? . . , ., tax red meat. what politicians have said that? . . , . ., tax red meat. what politicians have saidthat? . . , . . ., ., said that? i certainly had a lot of debate, said that? i certainly had a lot of debate. it's _ said that? i certainly had a lot of debate, it's not _ said that? i certainly had a lot of debate, it's not something - said that? i certainly had a lot ofj debate, it's not something we're going _ debate, it's not something we're going to — debate, it's not something we're going to do _ debate, it's not something we're going to do— debate, it's not something we're going to do._ think i debate, it's not something we're - going to do._ think tanks. going to do. from who? think tanks. she suggested _ going to do. from who? think tanks. she suggested labour— going to do. from who? think tanks. she suggested labour were - going to do. from who? think tanks. she suggested labour were in - going to do. from who? think tanks. she suggested labour were in favourj she suggested labour were in favour of that. i can see no evidence of that. it of that. i can see no evidence of that. . . of that. i can see no evidence of that. , ., of that. i can see no evidence of that. , . ., ., that. it is a debate on the left of olitics, that. it is a debate on the left of politics. that _ that. it is a debate on the left of politics, that fundamental - politics, that fundamental difference, _ politics, that fundamental difference, the _ politics, that fundamental difference, the left - politics, that fundamental difference, the left like i politics, that fundamental difference, the left like toj difference, the left like to regulate _ difference, the left like to regulate and _ difference, the left like to regulate and legislate - difference, the left like to i regulate and legislate and... difference, the left like to regulate and legislate and... that's not what i'm _ regulate and legislate and... that's not what i'm asking, _ regulate and legislate and... that's not what i'm asking, i'm _ regulate and legislate and... that's not what i'm asking, i'm interestedj not what i'm asking, i'm interested whether the conservative party at this conference is creating a few strawmen, arguments that are not there because there are no serious politician saying he is my plan to tax red meat. i politician saying he is my plan to tax red meat.— tax red meat. i think there is a debate on _ tax red meat. i think there is a debate on going _ tax red meat. i think there is a debate on going about - tax red meat. i think there is a debate on going about the - debate on going about the environment _ debate on going about the environment and - debate on going about the environment and how- debate on going about the environment and how we i debate on going about the - environment and how we work with agriculture — environment and how we work with agriculture and _ environment and how we work with agriculture and i— environment and how we work with agriculture and i think— environment and how we work with agriculture and i think farmers - environment and how we work with agriculture and i think farmers are i agriculture and i think farmers are part of— agriculture and i think farmers are part of the — agriculture and i think farmers are part of the solutions _ agriculture and i think farmers are part of the solutions we _ agriculture and i think farmers are part of the solutions we face - agriculture and i think farmers are part of the solutions we face to i part of the solutions we face to deal— part of the solutions we face to deal with— part of the solutions we face to deal with the _ part of the solutions we face to deal with the challenges. - part of the solutions we face to deal with the challenges. i- part of the solutions we face tol deal with the challenges. i think actuatty— deal with the challenges. i think actuatty when _ deal with the challenges. i think actually when you _ deal with the challenges. i think actually when you look- deal with the challenges. i think actually when you look at - deal with the challenges. i think actually when you look at the i actually when you look at the beautiful _ actually when you look at the beautiful landscapes - actually when you look at the beautiful landscapes we - actually when you look at the beautiful landscapes we see i actually when you look at the i beautiful landscapes we see in actually when you look at the - beautiful landscapes we see in north yorkshire _ beautiful landscapes we see in north yorkshire and — beautiful landscapes we see in north yorkshire and cumbria, _ beautiful landscapes we see in north yorkshire and cumbria, they- beautiful landscapes we see in north yorkshire and cumbria, they were i yorkshire and cumbria, they were created _ yorkshire and cumbria, they were created by— yorkshire and cumbria, they were created by those _ yorkshire and cumbria, they were created by those livestock - yorkshire and cumbria, they were i created by those livestock farmers, livestock _ created by those livestock farmers, livestock has — created by those livestock farmers, livestock has got _ created by those livestock farmers, livestock has got a _ created by those livestock farmers, livestock has got a very _ created by those livestock farmers, livestock has got a very important i livestock has got a very important place _ livestock has got a very important place to _ livestock has got a very important place to play— livestock has got a very important place to play in _ livestock has got a very important place to play in creating _ livestock has got a very important place to play in creating our- place to play in creating our tandscabes _ place to play in creating our landscapes and _ place to play in creating our landscapes and managing . place to play in creating our- landscapes and managing them and that's— landscapes and managing them and that's an _ landscapes and managing them and that's an important _ landscapes and managing them and that's an important debate - landscapes and managing them and that's an important debate to - landscapes and managing them and that's an important debate to have i that's an important debate to have and an— that's an important debate to have and an important— that's an important debate to have and an important case _ that's an important debate to have and an important case to - that's an important debate to have and an important case to get - that's an important debate to have l and an important case to get across. mark— and an important case to get across. mark spencer. — and an important case to get across. mark spencer, food, _ and an important case to get across. mark spencer, food, fisheries - and an important case to get across. mark spencer, food, fisheries and i mark spencer, food, fisheries and farming minister, got it at him, thank you for coming to speak to us on bbc news. there is going to be a lot more of this over the next 2a hours but it is all kind of now a to that rishi sunak keynote speech tomorrow afternoon. he has done his interviews today giving not much away, talking about big strategic decisions he wants to take. the big question now is does he start to take them tomorrow? abs, question now is does he start to take them tomorrow?— question now is does he start to take them tomorrow? a busy 24-hour is for rishi sunak _ take them tomorrow? a busy 24-hour is for rishi sunak and _ take them tomorrow? a busy 24-hour is for rishi sunak and you, _ take them tomorrow? a busy 24-hour is for rishi sunak and you, thank- is for rishi sunak and you, thank you very much. including when the uk went into lockdown, measures were taken when testing stopped, on key decisions and the decisions that are going to be looked into and the decisions already that the scientific consensus would suggest had the uk lockdown for example a week or two weeks earlier tens of thousands of people could have lived and it pains me to see if possibly my grandma and many others. it is really important these decisions are scrutinised in a great level of detail. haifa these decisions are scrutinised in a great level of detail.— great level of detail. how do you feel about _ great level of detail. how do you feel about the _ great level of detail. how do you feel about the input _ great level of detail. how do you feel about the input you - great level of detail. how do you feel about the input you and - great level of detail. how do you | feel about the input you and other bereaved families will have into this phase of the inquiry? tote bereaved families will have into this phase of the inquiry? we are certainly concerned. _ this phase of the inquiry? we are certainly concerned. we - this phase of the inquiry? we are certainly concerned. we feel - certainly concerned. we feel although they have advised us during the consultation period we are concerned only a few members have been chosen. the legal team looked at the thousands of the families involved, took information and put forward a panel of witnesses who gave evidence and its important evidence because it's not only commemorative but we know that effectively we are experts about what happened and the impact of decisions being made and the inquiry only called a few people from each notion and anyone that saw the evidence particularly members of our group, for example, the impact that had wasjust group, for example, the impact that had was just massive. we feel that the inquiry is missing out on that aspect of the evidence and it's difficult to be involved because there are very few seats allocated to families so we were told during the consultation it would go around to different regions to make it more accessible for people with disabilities and people unable to attend but that has not happened so we are not involved to the extent we would like to be. just we are not involved to the extent we would like to be.— would like to be. just reflecting on -hase would like to be. just reflecting on hase one would like to be. just reflecting on phase one of— would like to be. just reflecting on phase one of the _ would like to be. just reflecting on phase one of the inquiry, - would like to be. just reflecting on phase one of the inquiry, what - phase one of the inquiry, what questions were answered during that phase and what do you still need to have going forward? this inquiry will stretch forward several years, wanted? it will stretch forward several years, wanted? . will stretch forward several years, wanted? , . , . wanted? it well, there is always a balance between _ wanted? it well, there is always a balance between speed _ wanted? it well, there is always a balance between speed and - balance between speed and thoroughness. from the first part of the inquiry we have been looking at the inquiry we have been looking at the uk preparedness, we are able to see especially international comparisons to other countries that dealt with things in a much better way, they were more prepared and were not affected by austerity or brexit, and so international comparisons again or irrelevant theme in this particular module given that other countries —— are a relevant theme, seeing what was going on in the likes of italy and still delaying those measures, delaying those lockdown measures and you have the advantage of time and expertise but we did not deal with those particular issues and so those are really important issues that we need the inquiry to look at, not least because there are going to be more inquiries, more pandemics rather and looking at where other nations are in the winter, huge disparity between code vaccines being offered in a number of countries from six months upwards and in the uk they are being offered to a small group of people. and also at the moment, the majority are using old vaccines which are not well matched to the new variants. masks have been used in health care, removed in health care. those protections are not there and looking at the uk at the moment there are individual hospitals which, so the evidence suggests the lessons have not been learned so the family is asking for a rapid review to take place after the first wave to take place after the first wave to avoid what happened in the second wave and the second wave my mum caught covid end was in hospital, we thought we would lose her as well, there just seems to be an ongoing theme of lessons not being learned and we hope that when the lessons in the report, the interim report put out, lessons can finally be learned and actions taken as a result. you and actions taken as a result. you and our and actions taken as a result. you and your family — and actions taken as a result. you and your family certainly have had a terrible set of experiences during the pandemic. you referenced inquiries that have been held in other countries. other countries that have looked back over what has happened and some of those crucial months, especially 2020. i wonder if you can reflect on what other countries have learned and what you have seen taking place in other countries in terms of what questions they have asked and answered. some inuuiries they have asked and answered. some inquiries did — they have asked and answered. some inquiries did very _ they have asked and answered. some inquiries did very swiftly _ they have asked and answered. some inquiries did very swiftly so _ they have asked and answered. fins inquiries did very swiftly so they did not take as long as we have here but they all would acknowledge that there were other ways of doing it and every country is different, obviously, we had huge advantages in this country given that we were and island, we looked at countries like south korea that did not even have, this is the focus of the inquiry today, lockdown spot countries that south korea did not need lockdown is because they had testing in place, even countries like germany, when we were told by the who to isolate every case we were stopping community testing at that stage. countries that germany had a huge investment, local devolved agencies able to rapidly increase testing and it took as a significant amount of time to set up testing in those places and instead of using existing public health departments which have been eroded since the first modular pandemic by austerity, we set up and sent a lot of money that in a system which the public accounts committee made little measurable distance to the transmission, we also had from the transmission, we also had from the current prime minister, ideas like eat out to help out which were described i think at the time by one if any neurologist like epidemiologically illiterate. these are lessons we should look at around the world and countries that were not so as a scientific adviser said, borisjohnson was in charge, some of his decisions were described as bipolar, he was all over the place incapable of making decisions and in some countries they did not lockdown as harshly, they had a good test and trace decision. in this opening this morning we were yo—yoing neither here nor there, borisjohnson here nor there, boris johnson incapable here nor there, borisjohnson incapable of making coherent decisions. there were lots of comparisons we can draw from abroad and hopefully those lessons will be learned. ., ., . . learned. you mention the importance of learnin: learned. you mention the importance of learning lessons. _ learned. you mention the importance of learning lessons. i— learned. you mention the importance of learning lessons. i wonder... - of learning lessons. i wonder... your processing the death of your grandmother, the ill—health and covid of other family members. grandmother, the ill—health and covid of otherfamily members. has the first phase of the inquiry helped at all or connection with other bereaved families, has that helped in terms of being able to come to terms with what happened? certainly it helps, the group which was set up soon after the first wave, that certainly helped post to get people together for support, and also to off—course most importantly campaign for this inquiry because without that campaign the inquiry would not have taken place but i don't think anything can prepare you for the loss in the circumstances we suffered when my grandma had gone into what was supposed to be a safe place, we were not able to visit her, we spoke to her by telephone, a haunting telephone call with her, she was not able to access medical treatment in a timely manner. we were given conflicting information. that was it. there was no bereavement despite campaigns from the group, there was no additional bereavement support provided from the government. and a pandemic loss is different to any others given given the fact that grieving are so important. i normally you are with your families important. i normally you are with yourfamilies but important. i normally you are with your families but we couldn't be. and we shared stories but we did not meet up as a family until 18 months later. that isjust meet up as a family until 18 months later. that is just not comparable with deaths in ordinary circumstances so that impact is something that we all live with. thank you, the experiences you bring up thank you, the experiences you bring up i'm sure a lot of members of the audience are going to identify with. thank you for taking us through that. fora reminder of thank you for taking us through that. for a reminder of the issues at stake here, here is a report from the health reporter stop. outside this inquiry in west london, families gathered. relatives of some of those who lost their lives to covid want to see more bereaved families called to give evidence. out of respect for the bereaved, we certainly feel that it should be a dozen, 20 people. clearly not everybody, but certainly so lady hallett and everybody else within the inquiry gets a real understanding of what's happened. inside the building, the chair opened this section of the inquiry with a message to those families. we simply do not have the time to call more witnesses. the need for me to reach conclusions and make recommendations to reduce suffering in the future when the next pandemic hits the uk is pressing. a powerful film was played with testimony from some of those most affected. the care home was closed to visitors _ this crucial second part of the inquiry will run until christmas and examine key decisions made during the pandemic, including the speed of the government's response, the effectiveness of social distancing, facemasks and other lockdown measures, and public confidence in the government, including the effect of any rule breaches by ministers and officials. they expect senior politicians, including borisjohnson, to give evidence, and their whatsapp messages to be made public. at the conservative party conference this morning, the prime minister refused to be drawn on reports that he has failed to hand over texts after changing his phone. have you said in your written testimony that there are some messages, because of a change in your phone or whatever it might be, that you don't have access to? have you said in your written testimony that there are some messages, because of a change in your phone or whatever it might be, that you don't have access to? i think, as people will know, this is a legal inquiry. - there is a full process. i submit a lot of different - evidence and documentation, i will be interviewed, all that will be - transparent and public. and of course i'm helping with all of that, as people would expect. i we want to learn the lessons from covid. i learning those lessons will take time, with the inquiry set to last for three more years. expect to hear much more about the vaccine roll—out, about care homes, about the nhs, about crucial decisions which changed so many lives. hello. it's freshened up a little bit in the last 2a hours. it was quite a humid, cloudy day for many of us yesterday. then a cold front swept through. you can see it on the edge of the screen there, moving through germany and also denmark. and in the wake of this weather front, we've got sunny spells and showers brought by this westerly atlantic breeze and the temperatures this afternoon, about 1k in glasgow nudging up to 18 or 19 in the south and the southeast. now tonight. another weather front approaches it. it'll reach northern ireland and scotland through the early hours and it will be quite persistent. so it's not going to be moving much to the north or south. it'lljust keep coming. and i think quite a lot of rain to come across this part of the country. temperatures will be about the same whether you're in the north or the south. so here's the weather map for wednesday. large area of high pressure and very warm weather across more south, west and parts of europe. we are closer to the weather front here. so a soggy day, i think, across parts of western scotland through tomorrow. south of that weather front with this south—westerly wind, it's starting to turn a little more humid again. temperatures are in the high teens as far north as newcastle and in the north of scotland, a little bit fresher there at around 12 or 13. the other side of the weather front now is the forecast for thursday. now, notice we're starting to develop a southerly breeze or south south westerly. this weather front will bring cloud and some rain to ireland, parts of western scotland. but the further east and southeast you are, the dry and brighter the weather will be. so a decent day i think for east anglia in the south east and i'm going to skip towards the weekend, notice the sort of large scale weather patterns across the atlantic, sort of the weather front sort of veer off to the north and we develop this more southerly flow of air. so a warm atmosphere coming in from the south thanks to this dip in the jet stream which is scooping up the warm air. look at that. hot conditions across spain and portugal, france to we could see temperatures widely into the 205, maybe even the mid or high 205. briefly across the south of the country. we've already had temperatures into the 205 this early october. that warmth is sustained for some of that. for some of us, this is actually quite extraordinary, really, but something we expect more often now. keep investing in fossilfuels — the head of influential oil cartel opec tells us that climate concerns shouldn't stop spending on new oil projects. and a fee for facebook — why meta could start charging users in europe for ad—free access, and it could apply to instagram too. welcome to world business report. i'm ben thompson. the head of the opec group of oil—producing countries has told the bbc it would be dangerous to stop investing in the oil industry and could lead to "dire consequences" for the global economy. haitham al ghais was speaking as many of the world's leading oil ministers discuss the future of the industry at a major industry conference in abu dhabi. the 13 opec countries control about 30% of global oil production and work together to influence prices. falling oil prices had helped ease overall price rises in many countries, but there are concerns that a jump in crude could once again stoke inflation.

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