Transcripts For BBCNEWS Miscarriage 20240708

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mr lavrov made the comments to try to justify russia's portrayal of ukraine as "nazi" despite the fact that its president is jewish. now on bbc news, the experience of losing a pregnancy can be life—changing, yet there is still so much we don't know about why it happens. our global health correspondent tulip mazumdar goes on a search for answers. you never think it will happen to you. one day, your baby is there. you heard its fierce heartbeat. the next, the life inside of them, their life inside of you, is gone. it's estimated that around one in five pregnancies end in miscarriage, but the numbers are vague, as most countries don't actually count these losses. i've had one healthy pregnancy, my beautiful boy rion, and four that ended in loss. two were early miscarriages and two happened much later into my pregnancies, where i gave birth to my tiny babies, rivah and rae. i am one of tens of millions of women around the world who have suffered pregnancy loss, and as my work as global health correspondent has shown me many times, i know how lucky i am to receive the level of care i have had. the conversation around pregnancy loss is opening up so much more in the uk, with things like this beautiful exhibition here in manchester. but after my losses, it struck me, given how physically and mentally painful miscarriage can be, why are we not talking about it more? why do we not know more about what happens? my name is professor siobhan ouenby. my name is natasha necati. rukhsana. i've spent the last few months looking into how pregnancy loss impacts families all around the world and how they can be better supported, why the colour of our skin can affect our chances of having a healthy pregnancy. i just don't think we're being listened to and heard in the spaces. do you think it is about the colour of your skin? all: absolutely. and heard from one group often left out of the conversation. my wife was near to death. i had a cry sitting on the toilet, because that was the only time i could get to be alone. the hats knitted lovingly for twins that were never worn. the tiny teddy which nestled next to a tiny baby, born silent. the beautiful shoes bought for stillborn babyjenny on what would have been her second birthday. this still parents exhibition here at manchester's whitworth gallery is the first of its kind, aimed at breaking some of that silence that still surrounds baby and pregnancy loss all around the world. ..0i’... the focus there clearly on failure. many countries do not even have a specific word for miscarriage, theyjust use the term spontaneous abortion, which can be very upsetting and confusing. even the medical term miscarriage is defined differently depending on where you are in the world, and it's based on when a baby can survive on its own outside the womb. whatever you call this type of loss, and no matter what point in pregnancy it happens, it can be a life—changing event. for the mums and families who contributed to this exhibition, it's a unique opportunity to acknowledge and reflect on their losses. most women don't get that chance. we're often told that miscarriage isjust a part of life, move on, try again, it wasn't meant to be. but a recent study suggests that millions of women around the world are potentially spending years suffering with undiagnosed and untreated post—traumatic stress after experiencing a miscarriage and researchers are increasingly looking for new and innovative ways to try and help women and families. back injanuary, i went to a very special event in edinburgh. as you walk with your lanterns, we hope you're able to find some light in the dark and will be walking in memory of your baby that died. as dusk approaches, hundreds of families gather to remember the lives that could have been and those which were far too short—lived. the starlight walk has been organised by the baby loss charity sands. kellie suffered a late miscarriage five months into her pregnancy and went through the traumatic experience of giving birth to her son, henry. i believe it changed my whole outlook in life. this person i was when i went into the hospital isn't the same person that walked back out. i got diagnosed with post—traumatic stress disorder and anxiety. data on miscarriage and its impact is vague, as losses are not officially counted in most countries, and it's still seen as taboo in many parts of the world, so millions of women end up suffering in silence. translation: i was very scared. one miscarriage is ok but then second, third and after the last one i lost all hope. i couldn't sleep. i would lay awake and pray to allah to make everything ok. i had lost something that i wanted really badly, - so i remember one night it was raining outside - and i wasjust in my bedroom, and then the rain just startedl coming and then from i nowhere i started crying, and i cried and i cried. it was very hard, this time in my life, and i thought something might be wrong with me and i was so worried and i lost my self—confidence. i was very depressed. research carried out at three london hospitals suggests nearly one in three women suffered post—traumatic stress one month after a loss. some women's symptoms improved over time, but one in six women still had post—traumatic stress after nine months. most women are never diagnosed or treated. the most common symptoms are flashbacks, so people are getting flashbacks of the event, re—experiencing what actually happened to them, perhaps. i think it can be incredibly destructive. at the moment, screening isn't happening and i think people are constantly slipping through the net, and i think being unwell for a number of years. it differs throughout the world. i think the challenges are the same — you have lost a baby at the end of the day and i think the core issue is that in the end, i think a lot of these people all around the world are suffering very similarly. we're in this beautiful meadow, i can see a couple of stags in the distance. this is one potential solution being developed by professor bourne and his team to try and make what can be a very traumatic experience more bearable. this is a virtual reality headset that we're offering women who need to have a procedure to remove pregnancy tissue when they have miscarried, to transport them to sort of a more calm virtual reality world for distraction from the pain and anxiety during the procedure. dr parker has just started trialling this new kit. she's also doing a study looking into how other activities like playing tetris or listening to a podcast might help. we're looking to see if a brief cognitive task shortly after a traumatic event can target specifically intrusive memories of flashbacks and whether that can prevent a development not only of those distressing symptoms in and of themselves, but other psychological problems. as night falls in edinburgh, each lantern for each life lost shines bright. more than 300 people are taking part in tonight's walk. there's been so much love here, lots of tears as well, silence at times, but also laughter and most of all, there's been acknowledgement, recognition of these precious lives that have been lost. for kellie, this walk is part of her healing process. i feel he's with me when i come to these, i feel close to him. i know he's with me every day, but these events make it more real. kellie remembers her son every day, but she still doesn't know why her baby died. in fact, most people never get a definitive answer, myself included. and that can make the healing process even harder. the causes of miscarriage are not well understood. most happen in the first three months of pregnancy and around half of those are due to genetic or chromosomal issues where the baby would have never survived. hormonal conditions, blood clotting problems and some infections can also contribute to higher risks, as can your age and being over 35 years old. but people can reduce their risk of miscarriage by giving up smoking, being a healthy weight and maintaining a balanced diet and avoiding alcohol. whilst there are still so many unknowns around miscarriage generally, when it comes to the risk for black and asian women, the picture is even more opaque. what researchers are increasingly finding though is that black and asian women are at higher risk of miscarriage — black women in particular are 40% more likely to suffer a loss than white women, according to one recent study. how and why is this happening? i wanted to find out, so i've been speaking to women in the us and in the uk, where most of the research on this is under way. isabel and paulson are expecting their baby boy next month. can you see your baby's face? very emotional. i'm just trying to contain myself now. they lost their previous pregnancy at four months last march. this baby is doing well and they're being supported by staff at this specialist recurrent miscarriage clinic in coventry, but the care they received during their previous pregnancy and subsequent miscarriage has left isabel scarred for life. the day that we were sure there was something wrong, i remember being laughed at by one of the staff nurses and saying, "just go home, why do you keep coming? "just take codeine and paracetamol, you will be fine." i was actually losing fluids and bleeding at the time. within 48 hours of going home, isabel started bleeding heavily. she was rushed to hospital, but her baby boy died. and why do you feel you weren't listened to, you weren't heard ? the colour of my skin. "black skin, it's not from here, you can wait." there is very little doctors can do to save a baby at this stage in pregnancy, but the feeling of not being listened to is what has stayed with isabel. judah, wa key—wa key. more than 100 miles away in hornchurch in essex, natasha cradles littlejudah. she experienced eight miscarriages before his arrival, including a late loss almost five months into her pregnancy. hello! what's going on? everything's supposed to be ok, no—one tells you that your waters are going to break early, so that was a massive shock to me, and then to lose your baby and have to bury your baby, that was just unimaginable. natasha says she also did not feel heard by some clinicians and says urgent research is needed to understand what's going on. we have been given the problem, we have been told about the problem, but we haven't been given a solution. we're in a western country, we're in 2022 and we do not have a solution to that, we don't even know what the steps are or the reason why and it'sjust really frustrating. it's notjust in the uk where there are these concerns. like isabel, these women in the us have also felt belittled and ignored. they call themselves sisters in loss. hi there. all: hi. it's the name of their organisation, created to help give black women a voice when it comes to maternal health. all have suffered pregnancy loss. i had my loss at 12 weeks. this was in 2018. neatrice told me she was inconsolable when she was scanned and told there was no heartbeat. i collapsed, i got sick right there and then she asked me, "why are you throwing up? "did you come here sick?" and i had to explain to her, "you just told me my baby "no longer has a heartbeat," so there was no compassion. i woke up, i was having really bad back pain and i was told by my doctor when i called that i wasjust constipated. they told me to come back in a few hours for an ultrasound. i never even made it back to that ultrasound because i miscarried at home. all four women described numerous occasions when they didn't feel their concerns were taken seriously by clinicians. i just don't think we're being listened to and heard in the spaces. do you think it is about the colour of your skin? all: absolutely. it really is a struggle all around when it comes to our maternal care. i've come to queen charlotte's and chelsea hospital here in west london, which sees many black and ethnic minority patients, to try and get a better understanding of why black women are at higher risk of having a miscarriage, whether they have underlying health conditions or not and no matter what their social, economic or educational background. why does a women's skin colour affect her chances of having a healthy baby? dr ekechi runs the early pregnancy unit here. she's also co—chair of the royal college of obstetricians and gynaecologists race equality task force. unfortunately, black women have a number of factors associated with the risk of miscarriage overrepresented, so for example, they are more likely to have a number of conditions that puts them at greater risk of miscarriage, but really, on a more significant level, what we hear time and time again is that black women never feel heard in this space. without addressing the institutional racism where it exists, we will never be able to truly say that all women receive the care that they so deserve. back in coventry, professor quenby runs the recurrent miscarriage clinic at university hospital. a lot of the patients are understandably very anxious because of their previous pregnancy losses. she's also a leading researcher in this field, which is notoriously underfunded. she's currently trying to raise money to investigate some of the many unknowns around why black women are at higher risk, including looking into any potential biological factors. we know, for example, if you're black and asian, then you handle glucose less well. so we know you're at much more increased risk of gestational diabetes. we also know that the balance of bacteria in your vagina is different in black and asian women to white women, and we know an imbalance in the bacteria in your vagina has been associated with miscarriage and preterm birth, so that's another area we can look at. researchers don't know if black women in african countries, for example, are also at greater risk. the data is simply not collected. there's clearly a myriad of compacts and difficult issues at play here, but the longer we don't have answers to some of these key questions, the longer so many women will continue to suffer needlessly. one idea professor quenby and her team are already working on in the uk is an app where women will be able to input their clinical details like ethnicity, weight and whether they have had any previous miscarriages. they'll then get specific evidence—based advice on how to lower their risk of a loss. but pregnancy loss can isolate you from those closest to you, especially your partner. again, there's been very limited research on this, but partners have reported feeling helpless, ignored and, in some cases, deeply traumatised. i've been hearing from partners all around the world, starting with amir sangal in karachi, pakistan. translation: at first, i i did not know what to do, because i had never experienced anything like this before. my wife was near to death. there was a feeling of loss like i had lost someone who was my own, but i had to control my emotions. amirand his wife, rukhsana, who we heard from earlier, suffered three miscarriages and one ectopic pregnancy, where the embryo starts growing outside the womb. they now have two little daughters, but they said it's very difficult to be open about pregnancy loss. our second loss remained between me and my wife. we did not share it with anyone in the family, because we felt this is our pain, we need to go through it alone. our society can make you feel like a loss is your own fault. within some families, there are mother—in—laws who taunt their daughter—in—law for having a miscarriage. we should be having more open discussions about miscarriage. i'm sharing my story with the world now in the hope it might benefit someone else. amir is not the only one opening up about his losses. more than 5000 kilometres away in malawi, chisomo mwamadi is on a mission to remove the taboo of miscarriage in africa, too. you're not supposed to express your grief or express your pain, you have to be the strong one. this is also culture in africa, especially in malawi, things like miscarriage are taboo in this part of the world. in the uk, men who have experienced pregnancy and baby loss are increasingly finding each other and starting up support communities. these men have all lost babies and they share their grief through football. there's no pressure to grieve. us playing football and us doing the training is us grieving. matt and his wife, lauren, have suffered four miscarriages. it absolutely crushed me. i would go and do some shopping and i would cry in the car on the way to the shops, or i would cry sitting on the toilet, because that was the only time i could get to be alone. during and after a loss, the focus is quite rightly on the woman. support for women is patchy across the world and many women don't get any support at all during or after a miscarriage, but for men, support is practically non—existent everywhere. we don't all kind of sit round and discuss our losses, it's just that absolute knowledge that everyone has experienced what you're going through. what are partners, particularly men, up against when it comes to dealing with this kind of loss? this toxic masculinity, "big boys don't cry, man up." it's the stereotype - of being strong for your partner, isn't it? yes. you're listening to the dads still standing podcast and we're about miscarriage, stillbirth, baby loss. two of the football players have also set up a podcast where they're increasingly hearing from people all around the world. so, we're going to be talking to raul navarro jr. he's one of our followers on instagram. raul�*s been in touch from california. to be honest, i didn't have much support at all. - the hardest part, i think, is people wanted to - dismiss it, you know. thank you so much. for raul, liam, matt and all those speaking out, the aim is to help others who might be secretly struggling. many people choose not to talk about their losses, but it's about having the opportunity to if and when needed. what's the worst that can happen? we can't make anyone feel worse about what they've gone through, but actually, we can make a lot of people feel a little bit more at ease. yes, baby loss doesn't discriminant, doesn't care yes, baby loss doesn't discriminate, doesn't care what colour you are, how much you earn, how old you are, it touches everyone on every continent. all the dads we've spoken to have gone on to have healthy babies, and they all say speaking out has helped them to move forward. it's not the case for everyone, but most people who suffer a miscarriage will go on to have a healthy pregnancy. sadly, though, the more miscarriages you have, the more likely you are to have another loss. i am on another pregnancyjourney. apprehensive, hopeful, scared. excited. will everything be ok this time? what will happen? it's been two months since we met isabel and she had a scan at university hospital coventry after losing two previous pregnancies, and it's wonderful news. this is the gift i have been asking, to be able to hold my son in my arms, alive. little angelo has arrived safe and well. so, when i last saw you and paulson, it was a really anxious time. it now looks as though you're in a very different place. iam. i mean, when we last met, i was thinking... i was still doubting, to be honest, that i would have such a healthy baby and, you know, such a good outcome. our little angelo is a month old today. we just marked on monday we lost our baby a year ago, so it's been, you know, we have mixed feelings. we don't know how we feel, to be honest. you can just sleep and rest now. for those who can feel hopeless after a loss, what would you say to them more generally? you need to take your time, don't try to rush, don't try to hear what society's telling you, just get over it and listen to you, listen to your partner. you have to trust in yourself. it can feel like the vast majority of the miscarriages are inevitable, but that's not the case. there are answers and treatments out there, we just need to properly research them to find them. nobody knows what their pregnancyjourney is going to look like or whether they will be able to have children at all. i know how blessed i am in so many ways. but from my conversations with families, doctors, midwives, campaigners, researchers, it's clear that so many people feel very alone on this journey. opening up, though, being honest about the good, the bad, the joyous and the painful experiences of pregnancy loss, all of us can perhaps feel a little less alone. good evening. what a grey day — just about sums up our bank holiday monday — a lot of cloud across the country. yes, there have been a few scattered showers as well, fairly isolated, and there've been some breaks in the cloud, particularly across lincolnshire and cambridgeshire. that's where we've seen the highest temperatures. through the night tonight, the cloud is going to stay with us and one or two showers as well, but it'll prevent those temperatures from falling too far. it's going to be a relatively mild start to our tuesday morning, maybe the exception the northern isles and the northeast of scotland. but again, it's going to be another cloudy, grey affair. with any breaks in the cloud and some sunshine, we'll get some warmth, which could trigger off a few sharp showers. some of these through wales, central and southern england could be heavy and possibly thundery as well. highest temperatures maybe around 17 degrees, drier but a little bit cooler the further north and west you are. high pressure's starting to build across england and wales as we go through the week, lots of rain to come across the far northwest. isi hello, i'm christian fraser. you're watching the context on bbc news. efforts to evacuate mariupol stall — but so does the russian advance in the east, as ukraine continues to inflict damage with new military equipment from the west. the eu says it's ready to fast—track an embargo on russian oil, but there remain obstacles in the way. germany says it can end its reliance on russian oil before its self—imposed deadline at the end of the year, but hungary is holding out. the online hacktivists who are plaguing the kremlin — the russian cyberspace not as tightly defended as mr putin might have hoped. and later in the programme we'll be talking to bill browder about his new book and the ongoing fight to restrict russian money and the influence it buys.

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