now on bbc news, it is hardtalk. welcome to hardtalk. i am stephen sakur. economies across the industrialised world are feeling the strain of soaring fossil fuel energy costs. but the bad news for energy consumers represents a potential bonanza for the biggest producers. step forward gas rich russia. ideally placed to exert growing influence in your apartment energy market. my your apartment energy market. my guess is sergei ryabkov, russia's deputy minister of foreign affairs. given moscow scope of an increasingly tense relations with the west, will energy deepen the mistrust? minister sergei ryabkov in moscow, welcome to hardtalk. thank you for having me. minister, we must start with the soaring cost of fossil fuel energy, particularly natural gas. russia possesses vast quantities of natural gas. plus 40% of the natural gas going into europe. there is the concern in europe about the leverage that gives moscow. are you prepared right now to alleviate those concerns? very much s0- _ alleviate those concerns? very much s0- in — alleviate those concerns? very much so. in fact, _ alleviate those concerns? very much so. in fact, this - alleviate those concerns? very much so. in fact, this is - much so. in fact, this is exactly what we have done in recent days and weeks, including with direct personal involvement of president putin who spoke very forcefully in favour of doing maximum on the part of russia to stabilise this market. we are the most secure, reliable and forward—looking supplier of natural energy to europe. we have always been such a supplier, and we will continuously work to this end. we invite all the colleagues in the european union and beyond, including our neighbours, to recognise the fact. we favour energy security of europe. we want to work collaboratively with them, with countries in europe, and with the european union for that case in order to ensure that there will be no jumps like the current one... if you are so determined to send that message, why is it that according to the international energy agency, russia is providing less gas to europe today than it did before the coronavirus pandemic, and the coronavirus pandemic, and the iea believes russia could definitely do more to increase gas availability to europe. why aren't you?— aren't you? they have in fact started pumping _ aren't you? they have in fact started pumping out - aren't you? they have in fact started pumping out from i aren't you? they have in fact started pumping out from its reserves into the pipelines to stabilise the market. i believe the demand skyrocketed against the demand skyrocketed against the background of very slow winds that in many ways negatively affected renewables, especially in northern europe and in great britain, for that case, in the uk. i am and in great britain, for that case, in the uk. iam notan case, in the uk. i am not an expert here. i do recognise that there are such sentiments widely spread out, but i would also refer to it as an element of what we believe is an in and out information war that west continues to, you know, rage to apply on russia on all sorts of pretext and in all sorts of situations. you believe we are always to be blamed for everything, we know this. we work deliberately, quietly, soberly towards stabilisation. it is not in our interest to rock the boat further. you pointed — rock the boat further. you pointed to _ rock the boat further. you pointed to putin _ rock the boat further. you pointed to putin saying i rock the boat further. you pointed to putin saying he would do his best to stabilise gas prices, but you could have also have pointed to the words of deputy prime minister and energy minister alexander novak, who said very recently that in his view, european certification of the nord stream stephen sakur pipeline so that it could be built, it is being built, he says certification for use were definitely call soaring european gas prices. now, too many in europe, that sound like a little bit like an implicit threat that if they don't do what you want, with regard to nord stream two... it what you want, with regard to nord stream two. . ._ nord stream two... it means that your _ nord stream two... it means that your preferred _ nord stream two... it means that your preferred option i that your preferred option would not be to certify so that prices saw further. i will say that we are talking here on a market that is kept in the hands of those who, through spelling out policies and approaches, determine what will happen in the next few weeks and months. we would prefer to have here a bear market. russia is about bears. now it is not about bullies. it is about bears. this is where we work towards four.— bears. this is where we work towards four. would you prefer a market where _ towards four. would you prefer a market where the _ towards four. would you prefer a market where the gas - towards four. would you prefer a market where the gas price l a market where the gas price stays skyhigh?— stays skyhigh? no, bears are those who — stays skyhigh? no, bears are those who play _ stays skyhigh? no, bears are those who play on _ stays skyhigh? no, bears are those who play on the - stays skyhigh? no, bears are i those who play on the exchange for a downward trend. and bullies are those who play upwards. bullies are those who play upwards-_ bullies are those who play uwards. ~ ., ., .,~ ., upwards. what do you make of the american _ upwards. what do you make of the american position? - upwards. what do you make of the american position? jake i the american position? jake sullivan gave an interview for us at the bbc the other day and said, we have long been concerned about russia using energy as a tool of coercion and a political weapon. we have seen it before and we could see it again. it would be a mistake for russia to try this. how does moscow respond to that sort of language? this does moscow respond to that sort of language?— sort of language? this is 'ust shameless i sort of language? this is 'ust shameless that i sort of language? this is 'ust shameless that they �* shameless that they continuously repeat the same tune and melody. we have never beenin tune and melody. we have never been in a position to exert pressure through our energy supplies, we are interested in a stable market, in an approach to both consumers and suppliers that ensures predictability, people are confident in what is going on. we are not interested in any way to use this as a political weapon. in any way to use this as a politicalweapon. now, look, political weapon. now, look, what politicalweapon. now, look, what we see during the previous administration, what we saw during the previous administration, and what we see under the current administration in the us is simply an attempt to decouple europe from russia's energy supplies for its own fortune, for its own advantages, for introduction of american gas, natural gas, and crude to european market at prices much higher than those offered by russia, at least before this current situation on the markets. and you know, it always happen this way, when the us early behind curtains, behind closed doors, try to impress and impose upon its allies in europe something that would be for their own advantage and to the disadvantage of russia. now it happens at open, at open stage, and they simply enjoy this. this is political pornography, what i call it. this is political pornography, what i call it.— this is political pornography, what i call it.— what i call it. this is a paradox _ what i call it. this is a paradox here. - what i call it. this is a paradox here. the - what i call it. this is a i paradox here. the world what i call it. this is a - paradox here. the world really wants russia's gas because the world needed to keep its economy is going. on the other hand, the world also want to see carbon emissions reduced, and reduced dramatically for a decarbonisation of the world economy. the question is, is russia, when it comes to the looming cop26 summit of the world's nations in glasgow, the hope is that will lead to new commitments to carbon emissions. is russia going to play ball? at the moment you are one of the dirtiest, polluting countries on earth. are you going to change? this is not true. dirtiest, and dirtiest once say that the russian natural gas is another dirtiest products. you russian natural gas is another dirtiest products.— dirtiest products. you are 52 out of the — dirtiest products. you are 52 out of the 57 _ dirtiest products. you are 52 out of the 57 high _ dirtiest products. you are 52 out of the 57 high emitting l out of the 57 high emitting carbon emission countries in the world, so i wouldn't say your performance is great right now. ., your performance is great right now. a, ._ your performance is great right now. ., .,y , your performance is great right now. ., a, your performance is great right now. ., ., a, your performance is great right now. ., ., ., ~ your performance is great right now. ., ., ~ ., now. you may say out of 67 or 87, whatever. _ now. you may say out of 67 or 87, whatever. we _ now. you may say out of 67 or 87, whatever. we know - now. you may say out of 67 or. 87, whatever. we know what we are doing. we have developed the most clean, the cleanest possible technology, both of production and transportation of natural gas and other resources, and we intend to limit and resources, and we intend to limitand diminish, resources, and we intend to limit and diminish, to cut down our carbon impact according to the state policy that was agreed in interagency format and presented formally to counterparts. have engaged in a meaningful dialogue with both the us, uk, european union, european commission, and refocused the work towards full implementation of this global agenda. you should understand and recognise the role that russia plays in the area of carbon sinking through vast forest resources. it is fair to say that others should do more in order to make sure that this transfer to modern fossils like our natural gas is done faster and not slower because of speculations on what is going on in europe right now.- on in europe right now. were ou on in europe right now. were you embarrassed _ on in europe right now. were you embarrassed when - on in europe right now. were you embarrassed when the l on in europe right now. were you embarrassed when the nobel committee awarded, jointly awarded the nobel peace prize this year to a senior russian independentjournalist because of his courageous stand of the principal of free expression in the most challenging and difficult of circumstances. was that embarrassing to you? he. that embarrassing to you? no, not at all- _ that embarrassing to you? no, not at all. it _ that embarrassing to you? no, not at all. it is _ that embarrassing to you? no, not at all. it isjust _ that embarrassing to you? no, not at all. it isjust a _ that embarrassing to you? iifr, not at all. it is just a sign on how the nobel prize committee slowly degenerates into a body that is driven by the idea of political correctness as understood by the board of that committee. and soon we will also see how these people would judge on physics, chemistry, healthcare and everything else based on their ideas on political correctness, not on meritocracy that we favour and that we promote. if that we favour and that we promote-— that we favour and that we romote. promote. if i may say so, your cynicism — promote. if i may say so, your cynicism about _ promote. if i may say so, your cynicism about the _ promote. if i may say so, your cynicism about the award - promote. if i may say so, your cynicism about the award isn't| cynicism about the award isn't matched by the senior spokesman inside the kremlin because he said of thejoint inside the kremlin because he said of the joint winner of the award this year, the editor—in—chief, he said he persistently works in accordance with his own ideals, he is devoted and talented and brave. you don't share the opinion? i brave. you don't share the opinion?— opinion? i do, i see no contradiction _ opinion? i do, i see no contradiction between | opinion? i do, i see no - contradiction between what i said and what he said. he spoke and i spoke on the nobel prize committee. and i spoke on the nobel prize committee-— and i spoke on the nobel prize committee. the basic question for ou committee. the basic question for you than — committee. the basic question for you than is _ committee. the basic question for you than is you _ committee. the basic question for you than is you think - committee. the basic question for you than is you think he - for you than is you think he deserves it? i for you than is you think he deserves it?— for you than is you think he deserves it? i think muratov delivers a — deserves it? i think muratov delivers a product _ deserves it? i think muratov delivers a product which - deserves it? i think muratov delivers a product which he | delivers a product which he promises to his audience and does so in a very talented manner. exactly as a press secretary of our president pronounce. secretary of our president pronounce-— secretary of our president ronounce. s , ., ~ pronounce. why do you think durint pronounce. why do you think during his — pronounce. why do you think during his tenure _ pronounce. why do you think during his tenure as - during his tenure as editor—in—chief, six of his journalists have been murdered? i have no idea. trio journalists have been murdered? i have no idea.— i have no idea. no idea at all? would it be — i have no idea. no idea at all? would it be that they - i have no idea. no idea at all? would it be that they are - would it be that they are independent minded journalists who seek the truth and often challenge power and your government?— challenge power and your government? challenge power and your tovernment? ., a, , government? our “ournalists are independent— government? ourjournalists are independent enough _ government? ourjournalists are independent enough to - government? ourjournalists are independent enough to develop| independent enough to develop their ideas, to pursue their profession in a manner that clearly fit into the set of their ideas and the set of intervals and purposes that they serve, and the degree of independence is a debatable issue for every journalist. independence is a debatable issue for everyjournalist. i would not try to switch into a blame game here. ijust have a question, whether you see in your corporation as an independent one? that is a treat independent one? that is a great question. _ independent one? that is a great question. i _ independent one? that is a great question. i guess - independent one? that is a great question. i guess my| great question. i guess my question to you, because obviously i am asking the questions today, is why you so frightened of the bbc and other independent media outlets? tide independent media outlets? we are not independent media outlets? - are not frightened at all. we freely talk. the more you would engage us to talk with you, the better. but the policy which the uk government pursues towards our media, including sputnik v and others is just a shame for a country that tries to position itself as the major proponent of freedom of speech. yes, but the point is that in the last couple of days you have chosen, as a government, of course, not yourself personally, but as a government you have chosen to label a colleague of mine, who works for bbc russia, label him as a "foreign agent". we all know our history, in the past that was used to describe dissidents by the soviets. why are you doing this? wejust by the soviets. why are you doing this? we just rented this term from the us legislation back from 1938. and replicated it in a much mellower way, requirements for individuals and entities to register themselves as foreign agents. they are very, very liberal in russia compared to what we have in the us, for instance, those who receive grants and finance from outside, from foreign government, they are obliged to register themselves as a foreign agent. that is right, andrei zakharov has done none of those things, he is a completely independent journalist, working to the bbc�*s values, but now every single report he made, every 20 issues, has to be labelled as coming from this "foreign agenf! coming from this "foreign agent". did you really think thatis agent". did you really think that is acceptable and you think it helps the outside world believe in your assurances that russia is committed to freedom and democracy? that committed to freedom and democracy?— committed to freedom and democracy? committed to freedom and democra ? �* ., ., democracy? at the moment our colleagues _ democracy? at the moment our colleagues in — democracy? at the moment our colleagues in washington, - democracy? at the moment our colleagues in washington, dc. colleagues in washington, dc and elsewhere remove restrictions for our media outlets to operate freely, to allow our people to attend events, remove their requirements not to mandatorily label their productions as developed by foreign agents, this very moment all these requirements will be removed here as well stop this is a game of reciprocity... crosstalk. you should look into this mirror before you ask us to do something stop minister combet isn't all about reciprocity and it isn't equivalence, is there... it isn't equivalence, is there- - -_ there... crosstalk. this is _ there. . . crosstalk. this is just _ there... crosstalk. | this isjust reciprocity. there... crosstalk. - this isjust reciprocity. let this is 'ust reciprocity. let us dit this isjust reciprocity. let us dig deeper _ this isjust reciprocity. let us dig deeper into how russia runs its own political system, because what you have done is you've locked up the main opponent of vladimir putin on charges which independent observers regard as completely trumped up. in the last couple of days you have declared alexei navalny to be an extremist which, in effect, is branding him a terrorist under russian law. his whole political movement has been branded as extreme, which means they cannot operate. that wouldn't happen in the united states or the united kingdom to an opponent of the ruling party or government. so there is no equivalence. or government. so there is no equivalence-— or government. so there is no equivalence. please have a look at, sir, equivalence. please have a look at. sir. on _ equivalence. please have a look at, sir, on what _ equivalence. please have a look at, sir, on what happened - equivalence. please have a look at, sir, on what happened with l at, sir, on what happened with those who entered the building of congress on 6january, how many of them were arrested, how long they were sentenced for, and how much of this type transpired in the us in all quietness of global media outlets like bbc. 50 quietness of global media outlets like bbc.- quietness of global media outlets like bbc. ., outlets like bbc. so you equate alexei navalny, _ outlets like bbc. so you equate alexei navalny, the _ outlets like bbc. so you equate alexei navalny, the leader- outlets like bbc. so you equate alexei navalny, the leader of. outlets like bbc. so you equate alexei navalny, the leader of a | alexei navalny, the leader of a movement and an anticorruption campaigner, with individuals who actually commit of violence and storm political buildings, do you? and storm political buildings, do ou? ., ., do you? no, i don't equate him to anyone _ do you? no, i don't equate him to anyone or— do you? no, i don't equate him to anyone or with _ do you? no, i don't equate him to anyone or with anything. - do you? no, i don't equate him to anyone or with anything. he | to anyone or with anything. he was sentenced for some criminal misdeeds in a very open process and now he serves his sentence for this. and now he serves his sentence forthis. for everything and now he serves his sentence for this. for everything else this is a different story. i just referred to what happened and continues to happen in the us as an example of how people in major media outlets are crying out on one thing and keeping completely quiet on some other things which at least deserve the same degree of attention. tats least deserve the same degree of attention.— of attention. as a senior russian _ of attention. as a senior russian diplomat, - of attention. as a senior russian diplomat, does| of attention. as a senior. russian diplomat, does it bother you when the outside world sees, for example, the recent douma elections and conclude there were no —— by no means free and fair and also sees vladimir putin and his government's attempts to control the big tech companies and control how they operate, particularly in terms of their political coverage. we look at all of that happening and we see authority —— authoritarianism and repression and you don't care.— and you don't care. well, we listen to _ and you don't care. well, we listen to you _ and you don't care. well, we listen to you and _ and you don't care. well, we listen to you and others - and you don't care. well, we listen to you and others that| listen to you and others that promote this set of ideas with interest, because it affect the situation in the world. clearly we cannot simply disregard this, but we do believe and do understand a situation like a very deep, deep and deeply rooted division between my country and the so—called historic west. fortunately, the world doesn't limit itself these days for the historic west and i can speak on every single element of what you have pronounced for. you have your narrative, we have hours. it's harder to build bridges. narrative, we have hours. it's harderto build bridges. in narrative, we have hours. it's harder to build bridges. in all frankness, i do think the most we could hope for and work for between russia and the european union and the us on the other side, i'm not talking on global britain, because i don't know yet what it would mean in practical terms, yet what it would mean in practicalterms, but yet what it would mean in practical terms, but at least with those two interlocutors, it is a contractual relationship with no illusions, to do business where it is possible and to keep our difference as much as possible separate and apart from what we may do in terms of strengthening global security, international stability, and so on and so forth.— on and so forth. how big a problem — on and so forth. how big a problem than _ on and so forth. how big a problem than is _ on and so forth. how big a problem than is the - on and so forth. how big a problem than is the real. problem than is the real difference of opinion between moscow and washington and what is happening in terms of cybercrime and cyber security? president biden said a few months ago that "mr putin would pay for russian interference in the 2020 us election" and of course the 2016 us election, as described in washington. if you days ago the infrastructure security person said that russia had not significantly changed its behaviour in cyberspace since biden's warnings to vladimir putin. how big a problem is this?— big a problem is this? three oints big a problem is this? three points to — big a problem is this? three points to this, _ big a problem is this? three points to this, number- big a problem is this? three points to this, number one | big a problem is this? three l points to this, number one we have established a formal structured channel for our interaction with the us on this and related issues and all the agencies that have a say here, participate, didn't hear complaints from the us counterpart to the end, as you have described, sir, when my colleagues talk to their us counterparts at this channel and through this channel. number two, and through this channel. numbertwo, i and through this channel. number two, i think we should expand our agenda. with all due respect to the need to defeat cybercrime and all sorts of criminal activities in this area, we need to think also of broader issues like malign impact of cyber technology, ict, international information and communication technology, all critical infrastructure, elements of control and command in the military and otherwise. we have proposed to the us, their response is yet to be heard. numberthree, we are equally prepared to move further forward globally to develop a legally binding instrument that would guide us to a more stable and predictable situation in this area... ., ., ., area... you have made your three points. _ area... you have made your three points. i— area... you have made your three points. i want- area... you have made your three points. i want to - area... you have made your three points. i want to and l three points. i want to and with one more question. you have alluded to the fact that you view the current tensions with the west could affect a whole range of relations. perhaps the most important of all is the nuclear issue and non—proliferation. the intermediate—range nuclear forces treaty is dead. it has been dead. how worried are you that the tensions you describe in the relationship between the us and russia are now affecting the most profound element of all, the nuclear relationship? yes, i am quite concerned. but let me finish my third point. wejust want to let me finish my third point. we just want to cooperatively work with the us and others towards a possible, collegial, and hopefully consensual solution on this issue. and now on this we are deeply concerned by what we see is an approaching new missile crisis in europe. we havejust seen a new contract signed in the us to reduce intermediate—range capabilities, we have seen no desire on the part of nato to refrain from deployment of such capabilities in europe and it is not sufficient that nato declares no intention to deploy nuclear armed weapons. for us it is no difference whether it is not nuclear or nuclear arms, because they are of strategic reach to russia. our preferred course would be to introduce mutual moratoria and to do those very high level ones, so that both sides kind of believe in what is being spelled—out, because there is no such thing as trust and confidence in one another. they recognise this. and there will be no trust for the foreseeable future between russia and the west point with that thought, sergei ryabkov, i thank you very much forjoining me on hardtalk. i thank you. hello. it was a chilly start to monday for many a morning commuter, and it will be again on tuesday morning for one or two, particularly across some southern counties of england and south wales, as well as the far north—east of scotland. it's these areas where you'll have the clearest of the skies to begin with. in between, temperatures much higher than they were on monday, and that's because of this weather front and the cloud from it stretching across scotland into eastern england. and that's going to be inching a little bit further westwards as we go through tuesday. high pressure still, though, in the far west, keeping things dry. only an isolated shower possible, still some sunny spells. but a lot of cloud across scotland and northern and eastern england. that could produce some light rain or drizzle here and there, maybe as far west as the home counties as we go through into the afternoon. to the west of it, we'll keep temperatures on the high side for this stage in october, maybe up to around 16—17 degrees. but notice down these eastern coasts of scotland and north—east england, where they're getting on the other side of that weatherfront, more of a northerly wind, temperatures only around 10—13 celsius. whereas by wednesday, these same areas should warm up a little bit because the wind is going to shift direction. we're going to see our area of high pressure drift a bit further southwards. in doing so, atlantic winds will start to dominate, pushing away that weather front back eastwards in towards the north sea. but it'll reactivate across the farther north of scotland. this is where we'll see outbreaks of rain through the night into wednesday morning. and whilst there will be some pockets of chillier conditions on wednesday morning, for many, it won't be quite as chilly as tuesday. so, here's the details for wednesday. that weather front continuing to march away. there could be some light rain or drizzle close to some western parts of scotland, but most of you will have a dry day, varying amounts of cloud, some sunny spells. temperatures drop a little bit in western scotland �*cause of the breeze off the sea, but warm, as i said, down those eastern coasts, and most places still around 2—3 degrees above average. but a big drop in temperature is on the way to the north of this weather front, which will be pushing in as we go through into thursday, with some strong and gusty winds around it. notice those blue colours pushing southwards. that will be making inroads across scotland on thursday. along with those gusty winds, outbreaks of rain which could be heavy at times too, making it towards northern ireland, maybe to the borders of england late in the day. but much of england and wales will have a dry day, a bright day, still in the milder air with highs around 16 or 17. but as that weather front works its way southwards and eastwards, we'll all get a bit chillier for the end of the week into the weekend. colder still across some parts of eastern scotland, but even further south, we could see temperatures this weekend in the mid—teens. bye for now. hello. welcome to bbc news. the latest viewers for the viewers — regulators headlines for viewers in the uk and around the world. talks held to try and avert a crisis. what about those who have already fled? 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