Hello and welcome to the program and the bulk of south africa is mocking freedom day. The historic day of the change, the course of the country hopes will high back in 1994. His years of segregation of white rule came to an end, and millions of black south africans costs their vote for the 1st time, was 30 years on many se, theres little to celebrate hopes being replaced by disappointment and skepticism. The African National congress, which has been in power since that time is accused of not keeping its promises. Its been embroiled and corruption scandals and unemployment is an all time high. Crime is widespread erase space and equality is still a problem. This is out of us. We comes a month ahead of general elections, which can see the amc lose its majority for the 1st time. So have south africans lost faith in that governing policy. Well put that into, i guess in the moment. First the this report from image in cuba. The 30 years since i thought the goods went to the post for the 1st Free Democratic by delivering a final end to decades of adults. Only white minority, high gigabytes wouldnt be bind. I cannot forget how we suffered at the hands of flights in the city at night, but they will light by cuz who are due to the assault of black person if they saw them walking on a pavement. The applicant, National Congress met by Nelson Mandela when a landslide victory in 1992 and his remaining powers. Since that with a general election a month away. The amc could be at risk of losing its majority. For the 1st time. The economy is stagnant unemployment, around 30 percent. Put those on to 35. 00. Its as high as 50 percent. Corruption has been a problem. The former secretary general, the amc is facing troll in june. And the amc speaker at the heisman resigned disciples accused of Money LaunderingPublic Services severely lacking with voting power costs and will to shortages a part of daily life. For many, the amc insists things will improve and defend the record. Our task over the last 30 years has been to bridge the huge devise of well an opportunity now country between black and white, between men and women. Between the acid and rudo drama. We have done so not only to contract the injustices of the past, but also that we may realize that for potential of any part of me in which every person has a se. But according to the will bank, south africa is one of the most on equal countries in the world. Roughly 10 percent of its population holds around 70 percent. The wealth and race is still a major factor in that division. Is there something the opposition party, the Economic Freedom fighters says it will address with radical policies, including confiscating white and blind. And the nationalization of mines and bonds, making them popular with young people. The other meno position policy is the democratic annoyance. De priorities during the 20 twentys day to 2020 non term will be 2. 13, a 2000000 new jobs for south africans to, to end load. Chevy installed africa, n. Whats a shipping number . 3 of the rates of bottling from the Democratic Alliance said it would be open to power sharing with the governing amc. Well, the amc says its in it to win. But if the amc wants to hang onto power, a coalition may be the only way that you can buy out is 0, the inside story the to okay, so lets bring in all of, i guess, all 3 of them are joining us from cape down. Melanie. So it is a political analyst and a full, a member of south Africas Parliament under president nelson. Mandela William Committee is founder and executive chair, person of the Democracy Works Foundation and zacky ok. My to is an activist and an independent candidate for south Africas Parliament. If i will welcome 2 or 3, if you saki, i wonder if i can start with you. Weve heard some of the examples that are of the failings of the a and c. In recent years. They pay the as a great jobs address, Poverty Issues to do with utilities, energy supplies. Well, i dont think its a site. Its as reasons to punish the a and see the polls give us a sense of the lived experience of what its like the south africans to face these challenges. Uh, how do we can everyone my experience has been how about i think and the other hall living came democracy. And as you would know, im a former president. United to my understanding is that i know 1994 with the modem which gives you the dignity back to black people in many different class, of course with the router degree for everyone. So what do we have . The clinical disposition of black African People, the land disposition and intellectual disposition, where people were really kind of cheap bodies for tonight. As opposed to human beings, you pay to be dignified citizens of the country. So youre looking at the free part of what was i was calling to inform the installer system to bring you into school when he went to work. When he went to the post office, how he usually come home, every aspect of life was told by rules that yeah, yeah. Was just pregnancy. And so what happened . What happened between you know, was in the same coffee stream because of the items he was needing to make his body to wherever. Well, when you look at the right, the thing is, so the sucking, so he let me jump in and just just let what i wanted to clarify as well. The reason failings having some way eclipsed past achievements wouldnt let me put that to you because also cited is disappointing with with the ac that its lost. Its quote moral compass. What do people mean when they say they are and see has lost its moral compass with you . You know, thank you and thank you for having me on the program. I think its a mix. Lets just see the answers left. Some bixler just under one hand. I am reach concepts about the freezer politic feed. Im going to move around and im also a child and go out and have my you searching your during your process yet. I search bixler just see weve got we have, weve taken away, im forming a part of it last week i headed to the constitution near losses. And so im an infinitive, but its almost stops. I mean, the reality from a positive to democracy is beneficial. Small is lease is only these if you were, if you connect types of to the answer and one way or the other, you know, you would have benefits as if youre why its been corporate big business. Your would have benefited by the large majority of somebody comes back to you, the underneath, you know, it has almost remained where they were doing your box. If you had a melanie, do you agree with that . A small, a leads, the cream of the crop. Those are the people that have benefited from the work of the i m. C. In recent years, if someone who was elected as a member of parliament for the amc and the Nelson Mandela, was it like to hear this criticism of what the Party Looks Like today . So i think many, i like the other 2 guys, william and jackie. I also grew half of my life under a past 8 and i was privileged enough to be part of the parliament and announcement the ends in the beginning of stopping back as well. The thing about it is, i mean, many of us, i think one of us, i think everybody on the show would also tell you that we are deeply, deeply disappointed in, in what has happened and, and, you know, does illusion in some, some respects. I mean, i do agree that it slowly does benefit greatly. Thats true of as when insight was off the whites, they have still benefit from post about it. And its also from people in business. Its also a growing black middle class. And i think one needs to also acknowledge that you know, that it is still as bad as things. Oh, for the majority of poor people in this country. It is in some way still better than it was not only because they have democratic rights and freedoms, but also because things in some respects having groups, things like free education, Free University education, if you apply in water access to water, even though in some places thats become a problem now, if, when there is electricity, the majority of people in this country has electricity, etc. So i think theres a narrative thats developed in the country and that is spelled in overseas as well. But nothing good has happened from in the last city. And i dont believe that is true, even though we faced enormous challenges and things have gone wrong. And particularly under this emerging, im curious to turn back the clock and talk about the journey south africa has been on since the end of a pass item. The legacy of course, of colonialism, but still very much wants to present to william did the go. She ations back in 1994, the settlements the board and ends to the 2 opponents. Ive given way, perhaps too many concessions to white south africans. I dont know. I dont think so. You know, i didnt say i told several, possibly in the beginning, but i mean, looking back, that was the case, you know, retired and because you have tons, funds is certain when done off to defend play as was Strong Enough to take a control. I mean we, we could not have another loosens, im so really a compromise agreement is actually patching goods. Im from south africa. I mean, its a, you know, put a framework, the democratic 5 most of the rules foster transform a society. So i think the 5 see a lot of the young black years. Im not blaming. Im denija niger for because the i, since i was giving away too much to our to ask because i think i, you know me, the 100 was just it was josh was at the time of year and i was like works with it. Its, im up to the best of out the house. You know, what i could do . Im at a time and took me to gods the framework to transform the society. And i think that a failure of the items in government has nothing to do with any goes a system was a compromise, but its a cell in splitting just by yeah, i mean the corruption that your age and incompetence as a nothing to do with a new go say some compromises. Let me solo take into this narrative and a little bit more detail if i may, because it is the perception. As you mentioned, there were some young south africa, Somebody Just to clarify what south africans were allowed to keep. Arguably the spoils of racist White Supremacy ne privacy, namely lands and assets. And it doesnt take a course of the economist to realize the wealth begets wealth. And thats a lot of opportunities lease to stock nation. I wonder exactly whether that is why you are now standing as an independent you saw the difference to say this to you between the, between 9499, we had a series about entering the country was good and the key and right to argument essentially became quiet little corruption and the state country is, is something that i didnt give a section on the delivery of a c o ensuring the a comfortable administration a little that has filed, it is not, you know, to ensure that the country goes on. But if you look to the date is the Racial Divisions that exist. Ready serious Racial Division between African People colored people. The deep racism that exist is being used to emotion and sought to divide people because no changes come to me for where can cause people over the last few years. In fact, the cost of living the ability to access with what was being taken away, you can check the arrival time which was destroyed this now coming back but literally was full. There was. Ready commutes around the same time a child seems to be just trying to move from one place to be honest. I would say that is why people have been continued to benefit the people like that. So we in a position of extreme coverage. But on the other hand, if we dont things sites where 2 people being the 165 or less. And thats, thats a difficult time to be. Melanie, do you agree with that . So i mean, you have a particularly interesting personal story and that you joined the i n c. You married wilhelm voted for with the grandson of one of the architects of a pod side. You will, ostracize from your community for joining the amc. Do you think that Nelson Mandela went far enough in creating a bedrock for a long lasting so called rainbow nation . You know, i think i prefer a Certain Committee onto, you know, onto that very well. Thats a point was of course the agency wanted to go further at the time and both berkeley marley and they were justified to have gone on so that but it would have resulted in a, in a civil war. We wouldnt have had peace and the, and the amazing thing about us story of 50 years ago is that we achieved in south africa, which know what something which nobody thought was going to be possible to have a peaceful transition to a Democratic State with one of the most liberal constitutions in the world, and these things have fits of us through the last 50 years of constitution standing, even though some young people are questioning and argued fisheries independent, the prices independent. We have an independent prosecuting this already. You know, we have as your trip in the beginning said, we have a president that has gone to excel. We have a speaker whos in front of the quotes. We have an ex secretary general of the n. C in front of the codes. All these things are actually phenomenal signs of a, of a country that has, has achieved, you know, from the democratic from so much i do believe so as a white person that we have as wides, intergenerational responsibility that we carry. And that is to contribute to this country. Nothing. Anyway, id say that opinion with me, but i, i feel very strongly about that. You know and, and that we have a responsibility to keep on contributing to his country and not just sit on the edges and loads and criticize. Im interesting that you mentioned that you disagree that because one of the things often mentioned by members of the i n c is but there was an inability to implement much needed reform. So the hands of tied launch it because of the makeup of the judiciary. A concern being that the today is your dictionary represent roughly wipes. Members of the judiciary represents 30 percent of the bench, even though whites only make up around 7 percent of the population. What do you, what does that mean in practice . And you know, i think that is over place and, you know, i, theyre kind of criticism. I think, you know, how to just introduce the acts that has to be one of the really important king and independent organizations that has presented us sliding even further down. I mean, this country, it was a beans in bought the knowledge of, it wasnt for the judge. Would you disagree and the media sort of society. And then of course, also that weve got a big business may be competitive business success, which has accomplished guys probably that otherwise, you know, as a company we would have been on the phone now. But again, you know, to years, many other societies in touch with you guys actually made a ton of balance. And i think we have given the answer to much of the 3 pos adopted rate. It yourself are probably my way to think about single forwarding because he asked, and it had become a developed country. Youd have some of our sort of, i show the vision is also at the beginning, we were just knocked off and off and i include myself in the, i mean i was a journalist and the yes, the transition. Uh, im really just as you know because of the answers of the price of the past, we thoughts update back. Busy the answer will be an individual leaders will be more than a prize that will be responsible and honest, that has not been the case of we have no, i mean, certainly not the look to. So the former president jacob zoom is description zacky all still judicial system. There was a judicial dictatorship as an exaggeration. Well this is what i can say about the and the, the come we Community Coming to for the basic stuff. Okay. Jacobs. And lets see the distribution side now. If anything you truly as become the ratio to terms of gender. And the difficulty is now that the new address, particularly new black churches, doesnt come from a back drawl a, the agency started the, the ration was that come from the new tv and the then why just the cities that political battles are being pulled, you know, when we, when, when we need to look at all public predictors, its in the mean, we have to look at b and cs corruption in terms of its, this is all the 4 digit job is to make a decision, right . One of the things is citizens, the right spot, we need lets move on and talk about Coalition Building because according to recent polls, just over 40 percent. So vote to say that the that they will back the want us of course might c a n c going forward. Because if the amc wants to stay in power of the challenging job of Coalition Building will be necessary, we would need for the countries Political Landscape william to yes, i did. You know, i didnt see maybe im under retrace by and see very likely a screenshot of likely to be potentially a play uh a, but i play uh as a couple of weeks and i can probably send, i think i know a lot of subject terms uh, very well, and its about colors and politics because theyre expecting me to ship them there. So um, so for us to be 60, is that extra child from a company some point of view or data i keep on remind people that theyre touch it to call. It shows up as a municipal level, all of the majority of them have been officers successful. I of course, have been involved in police together. I sent you independence of godaddy, so police are get us on our side of it goes fast for you and ive told her, and probably some of you just called a mostly positive child. So now weve, which ive got involved, and i have a subject to do this, to pick a, i to the come see a 4 color settings up for thats after that. So im going to run some angle because thats a space weve been trying to beat. And i also think combinations much more appropriate, some bunk bed uh, a more appropriate model for diverse sizes receipt agent. But also um, you know, that have some, some nice, nice instructions, consistency company, some politics. Weve seen a lot more research to be seen as a contrast to Success Stories and after check wrong color, probably the semester, but somebody will. So i think it