Brutality and corona virus grips the nation campaigning on the election trail has been forced to take a back seat will the president ial candidates ever hit the road and so their brand of politics to americans before the vote follow the u. S. Elections on a just. Under the long shadow of russia britains government is accused of ignoring moscows attempts to undermine its security and democracy so how should the u. K. Respond to these threats this is inside story. Hello and welcome to the program on iran come on the u. K. Is considering tighter security laws after an Intelligence Report on russian interference a Parliamentary Committee says no one in government wanted to know about moscows attempts to interfere in the 2014 Scottish Independence referendum and the brigs it vote 2 years later Prime MinisterBoris Johnson has rejected the assessment while the kremlin called it a phobia but the allegations are raising questions about the extent of russian influence on British Society well bring in our guests in a moment but 1st this report from sunny again in london. In the shadows of britains democratic process and its economy the threat of interference from russia looms large russia whose is an all encompassing Security Threat which is fueled by paranoia about the west and a desire to be seen as a great power how is it malicious cyber activity in order to shouted so aggressively for example by attempting to interfere in other countries elections by prepositioning itself other countries Critical National infrastructure of. The warning signs whether the Scottish Independence referendum in 2014 the 1st post soviet interference in a western democratic election but it raised little curiosity from the government this long awaited report paints a picture of a political system rife with complacency when it came to the issue of russian attempts at interference britains democratic processes were at stake as was National Security so the question remains why did governments take so long to tackle them there is a lot of russians with very close links to. Putin who are now very well integrated into but the u. K. Business political and social scene was referred to as lending london grad yet few if any questions have been hashed regarding the problems of considerable wealth. It was the governments failure to look into possible russian meddling in the 2016 brecks referendum that spoke to the investigation by m. P. s no evidence of interference has been found but the lack of curiosity to examine that raised alarm in the report after the break said vote it was the turn of the us in the 2016 president ial election u. S. Intelligence agencies concluded that russia had been behind Cyber Attacks on the Democratic Party to help the eventual winner donald trump. It was a wake up call that turned into an uproar after the attempted murder of 4 my double agent said on british soil with a soviet developed nerve agent russia denied it was to blame but it plunged u. K. Russian relations to a low not seen since the cold war but it is the undermining of british institutions that is at the heart of this storm the u. K. Will have to overhaul its previous approach if it is to have a chance of tackling this new normal sunny day ever aljazeera london. Lets bring in our panel in london we have andrew fox or hes the director of the russia and Eurasia Studies Center at the henry turks and society in moscow Dimitri Babich a political analyst at the News Media Company near and in washington d. C. We have nina yank of its shes a dissin from a fellow at the Wilson Center and author of the book how to lose the information war russia fake news and the future of conflict i want to welcome you all to the show lets begin in london with Andrew Foxhall i read the report almost every single paragraph is quite damning about the British Government and its complacency and simple lack of interest when it came to tackling the russian threat they seemingly were outmaneuvered guns and played almost all the time is this a threat that the British Government simply didnt think was serious. Were taught to disagree really with what you just said the successive British Government and i think thats an important point and one worth making early successive British Governments have demonstrated short sightedness and naivety seemingly where the threat of the challenge posed by putins russia is concerned particularly as it relates to the u. K. And i think again thats a point worth making is that this is a threat that this rather the report relate to the threat posed by russia to the United Kingdom and the time period that the report concerns itself with 2014 on words. This is of course itself 8 years best part of a decade after the murder of alexander litvinenko. 6 years after russias illegal war with georgia and its occupation since then of a part of that is that you. Tell that the number of years after russias conduct in chechnya its persecution of Mikhail Khodorkovsky undismayed movement of the u. K. S Oil Company as a result of which a number of profile russian individuals moved to the United Kingdom and sought political asylum here so really the true nature of the russian regime ought to have been obvious to london if no other western capital. In 2040 and yet the report makes clear successive British Governments i think as i say and you said earlier demonstrated shortsightedness naivety where the threat posed by russia is concerned it is it is staggering and as you say sort of concern drips almost from from every page of the of the report. But andrew lets be absolutely honest here one of the things that the report doesnt make clear but all of the writing around the report makes clear is that perhaps successive conservative governments were far too close to keep russian players and they simply werent investigating for that reason. Yes i mean i would just. Broaden out your comment it you know theres a focus obviously on one can serve successive conservative governments here but the labor governments of tony blair and gordon brown have their their own issues with with the kremlin and with russia but successive conservative governments as you said. Have have their issues with with russian money and i think its worthwhile you know just almost taking a step back and looking at this report came into being so you know its 5 years now since the intelligence and Security Committee originally announced that it wanted to conduct an inquiry into russian interference in the United Kingdom is 2 years since that inquiry began after you know foot dragging by both David Cameron and to reason may when they were Prime Ministers its now its 18 months since the report the result of run from that inquiry was sent to number 10 and 9 months since Boris Johnson as he then became Prime Minister attempted to sit on it so theres a theres a much broader context to this issue. Than simply the report itself now the report doesnt contain any smoking guns of the sort that i think a lot of people were hoping for the report doesnt concern itself or rather the reductive version of the report doesnt concern itself with details about Prominent Russians giving money for example to u. K. Political parties where you put your u. K. Political movements all the closeness of proximity of u. K. Political figures to Prominent Russian individuals. So it doesnt deal with the broader context that i think a lot of people were hoping for but it doesnt need to because the what we know about russia the threat that russia poses and the nature of the threat is in itself damning enough and in spite of that in spite of that successive governments did very little to come by. Dimitri in moscow the russians seem to playing this down they calling it russo phobia theyre saying that this is simply stereotyping that the russians had nothing to do with interference in u. K. Politics at all here is a massive report that suggests that they did whats whats the thinking behind the. I dont know why you are saying that because i also read the report and i think the report is a scandal because let me quote you what they just wrote about the socalled russian interference in their breakfast referendum im called in the region evidence to provide either toss it be it to suggest that her majestys government had not seen or sort evidence or successful interference in u. K. Democratic process or a new t. V. That has had a Material Impact on any election for example on influencing the elections results so what are we talking about the report does not provide any facts any evidence or of russias involvement in the referendum in 2016 or in the squad your trip around them of 2014 let me tell you honestly it no one in russia almost no one knows about the problem of squash nationalism or about any. Contradictions between the english and the courts its not a matter that is of concern to russians so i think that it is just preposterous to say that you know as andrew just said we dont need facts what we know about russia easy enough this is not legal language this is not war theory of the British Parliament and also conclusions that this may report makes already dangerous for British Society because in fact the report suggests that the British Special services and not just the Government Departments not just the Electoral Commission should be knowledge supervising and protecting the British Election this is really dangerous and the report says that there is always concern about special services protecting elections or voting anywhere and this is exactly the case in britain lets bring in nina yank that in washington d. C. I see you say can your head there and some of the comments. Made in moscow. Do you believe that this that russia has a case to answer for. Listen just because an investigation wasnt conducted in the United Kingdom does not mean that there is not evidence of russian interference not only in the United Kingdom but across central and Eastern Europe for the past decade plus and here in the United States we know for instance thanks to the advertisements released by House Democrats in may of 2018 relating to the u. S. Election that some of those advertisements purchased by the Internet Research agency headed up by all the garcon privilege and then in russia were targeting the United Kingdom with anti immigration messages before the brags that referendum there is open source evidence of this interference and the fact that mr bobbitt is suggesting that just because an investigation did not happen which you know the report is damning in its conclusions regarding that that doesnt mean there is an evidence for this long term interference you know ive looked at this interference across again Central Eastern europe in a stone in 2007 in georgia in 2008 in poland in Czech Republic and certainly in Ukraine Russia uses this information and influence as a Political Tool this is a well established fact and the fact that mr bobbitt who has written i should add for r. T. Of sputnik before agents of russian propaganda is trying to push this narrative on a say is not surprising to me you know what i mean just all the american propaganda to me as a lawyer who accent is well known it all ok another please im looking forward to your response. Yeah yeah im ready to answer well if we are talking about the socalled russian interference in british or american elections mula commission has walked for 2 and a half years then merican media was full of fake reports of all russian involvement and what was the conclusion the mewing committee concluded that im quoting there was no collusion between mr Trumps Campaign and russia. In this case why is this report not based on any evidence you know the authors of the report say that we have not been provided with any evidence from the British Special services thats very strange so what is this report based on if the bridge your special services does not provide fact as for cases of british or american. Interference in 14 elections there are plenty of them the United States openly acknowledges and prides itself on interfering in Boris Yeltsins election in 1906 in russia we all remember you know andrew has cited russias operations in ukraine well its 17 years since the u. K. And the United States invaded illegally invaded iraq based on fake evidence as for the creation which this report takes for granted for example the soulsby affair its very strange that 4 months after petro from bashir of left the u. K. The vile that they were supposed to bring to to saulsbury poisoned and killed one person and badly poisoned another person in a different city in the inside the u. K. How could it happen 4 months after they left the u. K. This is really. Really something that should have given some food for thought for this commission but unfortunately these facts are not examined north taken for syrias information and we just report the same thing all the time russia interferes russia gets involved russia destroys russia is called a whore style contrie in this report well this is a very aggressive move i cannot imagine our Parliament Call in britain and aggressive or horse style country well of course in the United States hostile country despite all their actions against us so you can see from this report who is really aggressive and then under the thumb see you in just a 2nd to the military to me to we are going out on a diagonal from a legal point of view i want to get to everyone i will just 10 seconds. Ok just 10 seconds in this report this report calls to investigate every of on connected to porton and some call it suggest that any people connected to the kind of russian state even if theyre involved in Charity Activities in the u. K. Are somehow suspect you imagine what would happen if the Russian Parliament areas or the Russian Press wrote that anyone connected to Boris Johnson should be suspect thats absolutely wrong from a legal point of view and to say that Boris Johnson or the conservative governments were pro russian is a more capable of war because Boris Johnson has been openly hostile to russia he called for demonstrations near the Russian Embassy whether souls very airfare occurred doing 2 things one fact he said i want you to enjoy you too we will we will. Going to come back to you in just a 2nd but in. In london perhaps the bigger question here is not the countrys interfere in other countries affairs i mean lets face it the americans and the brits one of the most famous case is the 53 coup in iran backed by the cia and the british you know this does happen its just part and parcel of international. Affairs. This is about britains own failures within its own security establishment with its own government itself and not taking this seriously i mean its not about the russians the russians are going to interfere as do the british as the americans in other Peoples Affairs this is about a failure on the british front surely. I mean 1st of all i would i would welcome the opportunity to respond to what dmitri said but i mean i just dont see that its its really worth our time i would reject the moral equivalence that hes attempting to draw between what the you can the u. S. Do more when what russia does and ill leave it at that i think youre right however in that in that much of the focus of much of the the the analysis of that region of the reporters who was released yesterday has focused on russia where it actually to my mind the greatest story actually is about the United Kingdom and how successive u. K. Governments failed in their basic. Right all role to protect u. K. Citizens by intentionally or unintentionally wittingly or unwittingly by omission all on purpose failed to take seriously the threat posed by a hostile state whether thats russia or anybody else to democratic processes and thats the thats the key thing that comes out of this to my mind. The report you kno