Hasnt reached people of color and Cyber Attacks on vaccine makers in the bertrands. Counting the cost on aljazeera. The source of life and conflict ethiopia egypt and on the top floor of the selling of africas biggest hydroelectric dam on the blue nile can look for the way to bridge their differences this is interesting. Hello and welcome to the program on the wrong call for thousands of years the nile has been the backbone of civilizations and a source of conflict the latest dispute is over the largest harjo electric in africa being built in ethiopia. The government says its 4000000000. 00 project on the blue nile near its northern border with sudan will provide power to its more than 100000000. 00 citizens and create huge opportunities for the economy if europe it wants to start filling the dam in july when its rainy season begins but sudan and egypt downstream 1st want a legally binding agreement on how long it will take to fill the debt and how it will be operated the African Union is mediating if europe his government said on saturday the parties could finalized agreement within 2 to 3 weeks so lets take a closer look at the disputes egypt relies on the now for more than 90 percent of its water its facing a water shortage and says the debt could make it worse sudans caught in the middle it can benefit from cheap electricity and controlled extreme to prevent flooding but it says if the flow is included ated its own dams will be overwhelmed egypt and sudar want ethiopia to fill the dams reservoir slowly and then theres disagreement on how much water ethiopia were released during droughts and how the 3 countries will resolve disputes. Lets bring in our guests in Addison Gideon for head of the Technical Committee of the ethiopian negotiating team in washington d. C. Actually carly Political Writer and researcher on Egyptian Affairs and in heart dont assign us one tom former sudanese minister of irrigation and former advisor to the sudanese negotiating delegation a warm welcome to you all id like to start in this hour but this is a negotiation that has been going on for nearly a decade now ethiopia clearly wants to make this happen its very important 100000000 people can be supplied by this however it keeps faltering on technical aspects as well as political aspects can you just talk us through from ethiopias point of view what the sticking points are we believe that we have been very transparent in dealing with this issue since 2011. Our partners in sudan in digit. And the Relevant Design and study documents of that innocence done. They have been to the field and numerous times including the ministers of egypt and sudan we did all of this so that we can use to. Some transparency to what we do in the construction and design of that done. We have shown. Very much of transparency that president been. In the region. So in terms of transparency in terms of trust building i think as a responsible member of the International Community we have done our best now. We have gone through different phases of negotiation 1st it was about the construction during the period of the ip or eat and then the condition of the ip or the. 2 studies to be done when we tried to conduct our studies but they never materialized and now we are in the stage of discussing the feeling and operation of the renaissance down. Even in that. We have agreed on the stage because the feeling of the innocence done that will take 4 to 7 years. Of feeling and while knowing that we could fill the dam in 2 to 3 years given by the religion of the blue knight but for the sake of and consider taking the consideration and the concerns of downstream countries we have extended that willing period up to 7 years or if it is a way that you will feel it in 4 years and if it is a variable will extended up to 7 years so. As far as we are concerned that we have taken into consideration almost all of the concerns of the downstream countries and we have come so far that a few things that we may need to really conclude an agreement and we very much understand the concerns of the downstream countries and we hope that they do understand or so since they have built over the years many dams they do understand or saw. The concern of ethiopia that it has to feel that down in time especially where we are. Now we have very good i draw a g. In blue nile basin and the highest london is brim full. Even lick liquid clear is this sort of can maximum 4 level so we shouldnt miss opposition time where we can start killing the down with only 10 percent of the. Men on one floor of the blue nile is 4. 00 so i really dont understand what the real concern of brotherson done in g. D. P. Well lets bring in lets bring in 2. 00 and egypt lets start with bags or are we in d. C. What are those what are those concerns what is it i mean according to our guest everythings good weve negotiated a an agreement that works so what is egypts concerns. I believe asia concerned that we cannot trust as you become you know governments and we have other incidents they did with kenya was turkana lake and what they did was kenya and what that was somalia before i believe when we hear the ministry of you know forum that sir said egypt have to believe us just have to believe us no we dont have to believe you because you have other answer than that you was doing it in you know intentionally harming kenya unintentionally harming severely a so i believe you know we cannot trust just words we trust treaties and we trust International Laws we reach you know and washington and general and severity almost 90 percent of the problems being solved we have just 2 problems we were discussing that mechanism of how to the spewed settlements and how can we manage you know the operation of of the dad because we cannot trust that youve been a government to manage just by itself so this is by the International Law we are not talking about just we want to enforce our ideas or our you know opinions no based on 19. 02 treaty with the emperor manual lake the 2nd and by the way and this time as you be i was not and was not under occupation they are not colonized the emperor monday leak signed this treaty you know without any pressure england and england in this time was the colonists for egypt and this treaty obviously gave and the 3rd item of this treaty they cannot do any structures on the river at the brewery. Unless the have permission from the egyptian and the sudanese parts so i believe they did not trick of night the treaty and i believe you or your guest today was fair enough that he he did not mention that they do not recognize this treaty and did not recognize all of this you know treated equality is nonsense its not nonsense its International Low and also they night admission to 1997 and the convention on the law of. Big ational use of International Water crossing in article 7 obligation not to cause significant harm to any other country. Join you in this water crossing you cannot just say it is our river it is our water it is not your rever it is not your water thats a water crossing ports of road country and this is. You know guided by International Law an article 8 from the same you know conventions general of legations to a cooperative water crossing state shall cooperates on the basis of sovereign equality well lets talk about that lets talk about some of the others havent occurred we have a. Big dont have do dont have no lets talk about equality we do have a guest in a smile and a smile and sudan is one of the countries that will be affected by the building of the stamp where so what sudans position right now. Done. Is done. Since this done is the hydro polo generation done it will not have a big effect on the amount of water that is one suiters who done and then going to egypt because the losses only dave operational losses which is about to be a major good idea which is about 4 percent of the long tail of an inflow of the blue night. This 4 percent can easily be accommodated. Because due to the feeling of. Dead. Of war in. The us on high down which would have had to add. Would be the one that it didnt get. So i expect that they were positioned losses from day one will drop from 10000000000 cubic meters stadia to about 8000000 me to cool. So the last riches. Of mosts in good is going to be composite it by the by the gain that would have been in the house 1. 00 so generally speaking generally speaking there is no doubt but. In the end the amount of water going sushma down to egypt. There are some benefits that we all norway are or friends and we have been working to get up for a minute long time together in is a friend of mine and we have been welcome to get there for more than 15 years under our own in the same line of technical capabilities and. Things congress mostly the issue is that the 2 governments in egypt and in a few of the up there are overburdening the issue especially the. Initial position and the initial infinity which i saw said correctly that it is only 10 percent of the floor of the one eye and it is only 7 percent of the total amount of water that is going to be. Accommodated of thought in good so this issue this issue has never been an issue in this initial feeling that the talk during the last one or more near was on the said just after that so for a month for my amp to this down for the down into this. Even for a deep interest this initial feeling is not a big issue and it can be passed but the issue is that it should be part of the whole package if you lets lets bring in. Now d. D. Instead gideon that me just come to you egypt says it needs a legally binding agreement an International Framework for this. Guesting whole term says the problem may not be technical it may actually be a political problem why doesnt he give them a fairly Standard International agreement other countries have done this why is it seemingly not wanting to sign up. You know you know i was surprised to see you theres a segment of your guest from washington i mean instead of. Representing is own country now it talks about another sovereign country like kenya and somalia i think there are a couple of taking care of their business was the kenyan government and the european government i dont think we should trade into something which were not responsible for. The government of egypt and the government of kenya and the government to somalia are discussing this issues so theyll theyll take care of that our our our our concern now is the feeling and operation of the guard would be helpful to stay in that subject let let let let let me answer your question that actually there is a disputed region of the region mccann is. In and said that in the Draft Agreement what were saying is we have signed a declaration of principle in 2015 which limits the dispute resolution mechanism and takes you through a process of conciliation mediation and then later the final state to the heads of state so we are as we are saying we have to stay within this framework which our leaders the 3 leaders of egypt and egypt have signed and the dispute with mccown ism is is clearly stated there so. Any other dispute mechanism dispute resolution mechanism is not appropriate what more can we trust. More than the wisdom of our 3 leaders to resolve any dispute arising from the feeling and operation of a single doe and we put very much trust in the leaders of the 3 countries in the in their wisdom to to resolve any dispute arising from the feeling and operation of a single them now that it is on with many Many Political many border issues and we have to put our trust on our lead us not on extra none of the threat or that is the whole issue so what we are asking egypt is to respect the declaration of principles signed in 2015 and respect the dispute resolution mechanism that the 3 heads of state have signed this is this is what we are saying i dont understand why egypt is complicating this issue well lets go to lets go to is an expert. As much or cohen what were hearing is that there is a dispute resolution mechanism already in place that there needs to be some trust and thats good enough why does egypt want more than that. How can we trust the Prime Minister of us to be and hes just making a statement that he was gathering a 1000000 people to start a war and they rocket us were going to bomb them how can we trust such statements. How can we trust that were going to fill what with your permission or not your permission within reach an agreement to not going to reach an agreement were going to sell it and youre like i believe you cant trust a party talking like that and also. You know military. Officials and has to be an army have a very very powerful statement they are letting egypt with war and they dont know what is the Egyptian Army and what is different under ranking number 9 you know internationally and number one in the region and they want to split us i believe they want to ask the issue maybe because of the elections it was in august and postponed for to 13 months i believe now mr abbey can relax a little best because he still has 13 months to play with this people. You know this is this is not kind of resolving International Issues by this is you know. Group again the statements from you know Prime Ministers from you know officials in the s. U. V. And i believe we cannot trust this kind of work and also he said that we have a mechanism agreements to for disputes you know settlement been signed i believe not it is not science they refused to sign and washington and january and february this campus and we was reaching almost you know 90 percent solve all the problems and also the gentleman from so then he make the calculation i was you know put the numbers of the numbers. Dab up 7 percent if i asked you would be a wants to did use the amount of the water go to egypt by 37000000000. Must have been huge that i mean we do have to stop because if we have we have to add up the numbers together well lets you know how to get out the numbers the numbers. Are agreed upon within the agreements that ethiopia egypt and who dont in the past thats no under discussion right now what is under discussion right now between the 3 countries is the timeline of the filling of the dam whether its 12 years as egypt once or whether its 4. 00 to 7. 00 as. Far as as if you did not say 12 years no no no im sorry no agreement in washington. It was a big building 2 months jet july and august and if they have too much rain big can fail and september as well and it takes 4 years 5 years then a. Year. If the point is there is a very Technical Agreement that has been made that could well be made but whats making it more difficult is all of the politics surrounding this i want to come back to our guests and i want to come back to get in. Why is this such an emotional issue why cant the technical aspects that seem to be very clear just be agreed upon was such an emotional issue. Im sorry to say you of your guest in washington is is not well informed and hes not discussing the things in the subject area that were discussing now i dont i dont appreciate it referring to my Prime Minister in in such a dirty got arima manner we dont talk about leaders inside to manage please. Your washington guests should the press refrain from making such statements and i do not want to go into those kinds of discussion but you should remember that it is on president. During the time of the it was in an open televisions that they wanted to wage war against it and interfere in our internet efforts we dont we dont want to go into that discussion the subject at hand is the feeling and operation of the gag so i would like to remind you the guest in washington to stay within. The topic of discussion instead of the giddy i did ask your question why is this such an emotional initiation york for that question. Yes you see if your guest doesnt know the agreement we have already agreed to fill that done in stages. Starting this july retain 4. 9 the next year will retain 13. 5 and will test start of. Brains in the 1st year 2000 brains and the rest of the total bonus will paste in the next. 5 or 6 years old or so will be filling the dam. In 7 years that that has been agreed he doesnt know that and what were discussing is now how to address if the outcomes if the prolonged drought how the 3 countries jointly will handle the drought condition and my friend talks about other subjects and now we he takes me to 2 to 2 issues like the 1959 argument commission the 19 or 2 agreement there is nowhere in the 1000 or 2 agreement that says that there will not use the blue note what us there is not know it in that agreement and. You see in 1959 both sudan and egypt agreed to apportion 100 percent of the night what that and all what we are talking about the free country is get in i do we are learning exercise and i want to bring in my guest in a hard turn as one l. Tom as one youve heard what egypt and israel of this position seem to be. There is a lot of emotions theres a lot of technical aspects that i just want very quickly to find out are you hopeful that the 2 countries can come to agreement there might well be not just in their favor but in your favor as well quite confident that variable and actually. I could say that i am confident that they are going to teach an agreement that technical side of the issue has been cut. Our cover photo of the may be 9295 percent of the issues have been dissolved what is on the stick now are only 2 issues 2 legal issues which are related to the technical issues one of them it does. It is illusion this illusion of conflicts and one is if the city continues sit together d that outweighs the means of resolving that if the intent be debbie agreement for the corporate or for america team in india or the 9000000 countries that is specific mechanism that should be followed and that one was actually taken from the 1950 mind dinna 97 you in agreement modern that i think even the day before yesterday when minister and without the heads of states of met eventually about the system i think that the issue i think that is on except addition of our the africans can deal with their issues even the African Union they have a mechanism for it is olding conflicts and that can be resolved tool so i think. That not at all or is the relation of 4 of conflicts can easily if the people in the league and people in the technical people sit together and i hope that they are going to stop today at 4 oclock i ho