Leaders of ukraine and russia meet for the 1st time theyll be in paris for a summit that aims to put an end to the conflict in Eastern Ukraine so will the 2 leaders find a solution and charge of a way forward and whats at stake this is inside story. Hello and welcome to the program im home here in ukraine elected a president in april whose top priority was to end the conflicts in the east more than 13000 people have been killed during the fighting there between the Ukrainian Army and russian backed separatists and i for the 1st time since he came into office thought a missile in ski is meeting bush president Vladimir Putin well french and german leaders are mediating the talks taking place in paris on monday the socalled Normandy Group last met to discuss ways to end the fighting more than 3 years ago but president selenski is optimistic he can bring peace to Eastern Ukraine but his critics see him as a political novice and fear he might give away too much in his quest for peace as opponents up in protesting heads off the paris meeting. Well speaking during an appearance on Ukrainian Television this is what sloane ski have to say on his expectations from the summit. But do you have portable one of all these i want to return with concrete things and concrete results but we understand not everything will be achieved the meeting itself is already a victory because as you see it we unlock the dialogue that hasnt existed since 2016 and it means there was no opportunity to talk about the end of the war this is what i expect what im looking for and what i want to find so much lets take a course a look at how we got here its all began in 2013 when then president Viktor Yushchenko which rejected a trade deal with the e. U. And accepted a bailout from moscow that led to 3 months of protests and his eventual removal from office in march 24th seen relations between russia and ukraine worsened after moscow an exclusive mia then fighting began between Ukrainian Forces and russian backed separatists in the east and in september of this year russia and Ukraine Exchange several dozen prisoners in a sign of e. s intentions. Well lets bring in our guests joining us on skype from kiev is our lexi her professor of comparative politics at kiev more here our cademy in moscow victor only of each lead analyst at the moscow based think tank center for actual politics and also on skype from young going to myanmar anna mcvey of or a member of the eurasia and Russia Research group at Kings College london welcome to you all let me start in kiev with a ski hire on these talks that will be taking place in paris see see them as a positive step forward and what would you say ukraine is wanting from these talks. Well i think its positive because previously for more than 2 years mr putin didnt want to have any thoughts with former president so this time was there were some steps that zones a ground so basic i sings there could be a progress of progress could be the guiding disengagement of troops in certain areas and exchange of prisoners if it happens it will be but its a question is what concessions will mr putin demand from ukrainian side because we need to understand very clearly is that for putin what is important its not done bus its the whole ukraine putin would like to use flippancy crane and to have control or we create so is a question is what he will try to to push forward and if we are talking about further political measures each will be taking when it does in the sense that what it was a lot of means could preeminence 1st as it should be security should be ceasefire and cease fire was proclaimed in some time but 2 cells and 14 m. Still there is no ceasefire there should be a withdrawal of Russian Troops withdrawal and disarmament of illegal military formations and finally control over ukraine in the russian border because for her many kilometers of ukrainian russian border not control as a by ukraine nor by International Observers so basically russia can do whatever whatever it wants so newshound Security Issues it will be impossible to move towards a political Political Part of means convenience and thats why im skeptical at about some singing more substantive zan you know definite go issues of disengagement and exchange of prisons ok lets get the view from moscow and i think. What is russia wanting from these talks. Well all conflicts at some point but are still a number of around. Intractable at this point. That. Would be expected to proclaim for. Political figures and fighters and other others in the socalled blue guns peoples republic. Of ukrainian parties participating in a new type of elections that would be. Those 2 republics selfproclaimed republics. Of how they would be greeted under what terms they would be integrated into ukraine and how that would be perceived both russia and ukraine the question of concessions is quiet. Quiet important not just for the for the ukrainian president. But also for. Russia because. Power in this. Conflict is. Too much and not being seen as a. Sense russia of course is interested in. The 2 peoples republics remaining more. Centered over the russian interests and the ukraine is more interested in them being completely political space and that that difference that. Interacted. With her on that. Expected. Asians are not very high from their summit but the very fact that it is being felt is already that that dialogue is going to verilog is going to take place between. Is a positive step in the last year of the previous ukrainian president S Administration of professionals at all not only were there no or their record contacts between or a shrink and which in the last year of question has it all but there was or there wasnt a single phone call between poroshenko which in the last year of bitter about our strength has. Cadence in in office so the very fact that the 2 president s are going to be able to speak to each other is a positive sense of element and hopefully there could be they could lay the groundwork at least for some future progress in next year ok with these talks are being moderated by france and germany and mad very divisive i could ask you what is europe wanting to get from these talks because it seems speaking to the gentlemen in kiev and moscow expectations for any kind of we forwards or are at rock bottom what was once europes angle in this europes go if. They want to make some kind of reply until the process and election of events gets his will it will just just and his kind of new keeps drive this kind of at least i would say that this meeting is very well that will keep a signal do we go ahead with this format all week quietly kind of slide so thats important for europe to get the sense is it going so were all week she asked. Or is it still the other thing is that a matter. I have not been part of the previous negotiations and they are not normal for us so he comes up with some kind of review any with matches that statement she has been through and through the same thing she has some sense of what he she has been saying all the time sensible things which annul been taken up gemma position has helped to negotiate my formula so if she is more cunning the air with that kind of wow all to miss that would be understandable but they were. The European Partners want to see basically is it the bible process or is it a dead horse at the moment and bo bo the evidence that appeared to suggest right now that they did it doesnt appear very viable certainly emanuel my craw has been suggesting that the time is set to get cool so its a rush its a pivot away from the side for sariel approach. And he seems to be the key driver in bringing any progress on a european level so. They have a d. Do you think that europe is is preparing to step back from its rapprochement with ukraine and start moving courser to russia. The outlook be too much of a grant sign well we are looking now at something which is a mile long carry. Out hootin dont business together that is not going to be proud breaking its mulled wine to result all the problems its what people are dying of the air it is a very kind of still serious security situation but that may be a make or break. Because my role is the only one among european leaders one has the drive the mh the image a nation also use yeah how some of that lives with billions. In terms of wealth being new president s coming with a huge political package open to ideas not being a free cell but momentum is why important that i do this moment actually whats on the stage or does and what does also to do with a leadership skills its also to do all the work. We want to move well where the search and what ukraine will be slight down there are rather screens all major european or let me ask you a rescue her and her how do you see things in terms of allies for ukraine are you concerns that allies such as emmanuel microland france or indeed donald trump in the u. S. Are turning away from from steadfast support if ukraine where do you see ukraines our eyes right now. Actually who says it is out in several days because who would be. E. U. E. U. Meeting which will decide on continuation of the socalled sec that all sentient is against russian to settle sanctions are connected with implementation of means it greenness and from what i understand this centuries will be continued for the next half a year however if we analyze the International Situation is not too bad a favorable for ukraine because macaron is making too much you know prashant statements to to have business as usual ways that asha and hes not very experienced in these kind of negotiations normandy for merkel is much more experienced definitely and by the way i believe today there was a statement from berlin said the ukraine 1st already done unilateral concessions in order to move forwards in negotiations and now its time for russia to make adequate concessions from the russian side regarding clown definitely there is a scandal in ze United States so as there is a threat to the process in the u. K. So. This country is is their birth to. And its not ready its not very hoot. For moving forward in normandy in normandy for one thing i would like to clarify it because my call it from more school mentioned socalled peoples republic we need to understand that nor any peoples republic it would say im not in minsk in minsk agreement is saying nothing about this artificial from a formations this are just broadcast on proxies and the. It is very important to keep in mind these peoples republic not recognized by anybody even by russia and begins is not mentioned in means agreements so we need to understand that what we what we have right now in the ukraine its not domestic ukrainian. Its ukrainian russian course where is it in or brusha east to control the whole ukraine and again let me stress unfortunately there are some troops russian generals and officers. In support you buy. Or dont buy us ok let me put that to you victor all of a charity you respond to that certainly we have the strength of feeling form of their ski hire and with your use of these peoples republics the socalled peoples republic see except that russian soldiers Russian Troops are in there and these battles are in fact a proxy for russia. Well. 2 socalled peoples republic self proclaimed. Not recognized by any 7 states including russia but at the same time they do exist they are facts on the ground at this point of course supported by russia in various in a number of ways both in. Support. Political support for them their. Military technical military technological Technical Support for them so of course to socalled. People the publics are facts on the ground and yes of course theyre very much tied to. Russia but at the same time the vast majority of the population of these republics. Vast majority are not people who came over from russia and. The people the native population there is quiet cognizant of the difficult position they have been put in by the events of the past 5 years where. Their Economic Outlook is quiet negative they face. A constant threat of resumption of. Conflict with ukrainian with the Ukrainian Army and of course a significant number of people from. That section of dont bust the peoples republic because the left has migrated into russia some have migrated into ukraine proper and of course people that are left understand the long term and its not going to be. Very soon. Im sorry to cut you off there. In terms of concessions we have heard that ukraine has made you know lots of Oil Concessions which russia be prepared to make some concessions as well in a bid to kickstart this process towards a peaceful resolution one of the issues proposed has been Holding Elections in these 2 disputed regions would russia be prepared to withdraw military infrastructure in the suv reaches alive all the displaced people to come back and take part in these elections well 1st of all there is also a question of what europe is willing to do and how that is going to be received by russia so for example if there are concessions by both sides including gratia how is brussels going to respond what. How are those sectoral sanctions should sanctions are going to be my defied in order to make moscow more. Accepting of of that or more willing to make concessions so it appears that europe and of course the United States is not going to in any case whatever here even if done by us is on its way to the integration into ukraine all sanctions are not going to be moved because of the question of crimea which is not recognized by the west so the question remains what part of the sanctions are going to be changed or modified is that going to be acceptable for moscow how is that going to be perceived by ukraine and how is that going to reflect on the Public Opinion in russia because of course in russia for the past 5 years the Public Opinion has been mostly on the side of the socalled peoples republic in the on the side of the russian speaking people in the south. In the south east or ukraine and if russia me. Too much of a new concessions in the in the eyes of the russians but deletion then it could also reflect on how the russian population their actual voters view the care and state there is of Russian Foreign policy in the russian president to just show them the russians are not werent there to make anyone said it was in some sense or later the biggest supporters of the president. Let me let the sanctions are obviously a question of given its a question of given think and whats russia to think its a question of given think and. Well if if russia would be for example willing to move on make moves on possible elections and the getting ukrainian representatives of the ukrainian Political Parties to take part in free and Fair Elections in these areas then that would be an obvious concession from us by moscow but of course also ukraine will have to move to make a concession amnesty and the amnesty of the political figures the fighters and others who have participated in various activities in those the publics because if these areas are to be integrated into ukraine then the people that live there if you have to have to feel secure and they have to kill sure be sure that theyre not going to be persecuted and theyre not going to face some sort of retribution from kiyo im sorry to cut you off we are in the dying minutes of this debate if i could turn to you and. You were wanting to respond to those points from 6 or all of it. Yes if we. Look at the glad picture was coastal but they already made quite a lot of substantial concessions but 8 pain that they were not recognized as such by ukraine 1st of all i must add also by the International Community just to give you a couple of examples there was an offensive in that. Order in late august Early September 2000 at the. Rebel forces of course supported by Russian Troops well making really big advances who didnt want pressure on them to stop their 1st misc agreement was signed. Which thought by doing it to open the rule well ok fred giles. But still some kind of peace in the next few days the 1st century its all going to have been well to him so that was the reward what what what most of us thought was a major concession one look taking more ukrainian get a. Second clear the whole all the time. Has been trying to bet that all the rebels will just wish what why go under only at the beginning and what it did far damage rather than what they have will be to secondly every conception can be all from the point of view it is a last will be the last empty elections yes in principle. 3 well elections but you cant put the kind of conditions well this elections which will eventually be raising the bar higher and higher like the return to all of this plays the relation of the border this and that so. Basically even as it would really to move on to something tangible they will find a form but right now were not talking you know who will be existing and were still trying to get to this place ok we have one minute left if i could get a one word answer from all 3 of you are you want to mystic or pessimistic that were on the right excitement excuse really i need to intervene so 1st of all i need to say that elections couldnt be done occupied if thats 1st and 2nd i am a bit shocked maybe by what i know was saying the sections were introduced against russia after m h 17 was shot down by a russian a rocket and after our show started intervention in za dont bust and end of august 2014 russia send regular troops so all of this sectoral sanctions were into so i am not sure how can we talk about russia made concessions russia made concessions by sending regular troops to ukraine into some 1014 and 2 summers and 15 thats why im not very optimistic because i sing mr putin actually he doesnt want peace he would like to do sentients but he doesnt want to stop zouk war where russia i