i think our political systems are being stretched. we are pretty much in the uk to what you call a constitutional crisis. we zriedon t have a constitutio tun folds in a different way. but we re seeing a very big shake-up of an existing political structure because of a lot of deep factors. climate is one of them but it s not the technological revolution, people are feeling the foreign policy shift, the shift between the u.s. and china. there are big, big factors going on in the world that are shaking up today s political system. and it s not going to change from today to tomorrow. thinking that a new president or a new prime minister would mean that this was all over i think would be a mistake. all right. zanni, always great to have you on the show. we ll be reading the new issue of the economist. jon meacham, thank you as well. and we have a big lineup straight ahead open morning joe. joining us this morning, all three of president trump s 2020
trump has done plenty to warrant impeachment, but the ukraine allegations are over the top. neil, are they? i mean, at this point there are crucial questions as to high this matters. if you could lay them out for us. yeah, i think this is more significant than, for example, the whole did trump conspire with russian in 2016 question for two reasons. one is that here you ve got the actions are alleged to be the president as president taking them withholding eight that congress has appropriated in the national interests toward ukraine. and here the president is advancing his personal agenda as president using the exercise of his foreign policy powers as president. that s different than some candidate in 2016 allegedly conspiring with russia. and the second is the timing. here the president is saying, i don t have to turn over this information to congress in the teeth of a law that s been around for a long time that says
george stephanopoulos. and donald trump s own words to george stephanopoulos and, of course, donald trump admitting, jonathan lemire, that eight times, eight times accord to the wall street journal donald trump asked ukraine to interfere in america s political process. and the fact donald trump admitted with a helicopter behind him that he had reached out to have ukraine interfere in america s presidential elections. this is now been widely reported by the associated press and others, the wall street journal has that fantastic detail during that conversation the president eight different times urged the ukrainian leader to investigate joe biden. i wanted to highlight something that richard haass and i were just talking about offset a moment ago, it s not just that the president is urging, you know, a foreign leader to investigate a political rival, he s reported by extorting with
something going on with the president or his family that caused a conflict of interest and vice president biden behaved in a that was inconsistent with the way the biden family acted i think the american people ought to know that. election interference. ooh sso you re going secretary of state mike pompeo knows that s absurd. right. you talk about somebody mixing and swirling, a conspiracy of goo together, that s what he just did. no one has ever suggested that there was any election interference in this situation. this all had to do with the fact that donald trump actually is trying to get, according to the wall street journal, according to the wall street journal. donald trump s own words to
as richard haass said, invaded further invaded eastern parts of that country and posed a continuing and growing threat to ukraine. congress authorized weapon sales to protect ukraine and then donald trump refused to forward those weapon sales to ukraine while, according to the financial times and the washington post, he was tying those weapon sales with ukraine s digging up dirt in zelenskiy, the president of ukraine, him digging up dirt on a domestic political rival. and, i mean, don t you find that number from the wall street journal that not only did it one time, eight times according to the wall street journal. eight times. he leaned on the president on