for years venezuela s people have been explaining to the world the way they have been rigging elections and turning down through control and repression, thejudiciary system, the national assembly, as well as the military at every single democratic institution. we have reached a point in which we realise he is willing to do anything to stay in power. the only way through which we can confront and defend him as building a huge, unprecedented social movement, citizen movement that is right now arousing and growing. finally the world has to understand this is a criminal system, much worse than a conventional dictatorship, and the only way we can stop migration, and this totalisation of democratic systems in other countries of the region is by transition to democracy. that requires strength, certainly, as well as
this year, right now it seems stuck. there are those in the opposition who think best way forward is to negotiate with majuro? do you agree? i do forward is to negotiate with majuro? do you agree? i do not discard negotiation majuro? do you agree? i do not discard negotiation at majuro? do you agree? i do not discard negotiation at this - discard negotiation at this point i want a negotiation when we can force a regime to move forward through a transition to democracy. i do not want a negotiation to have status quo in place which is what has happened in the last 15 initiatives of dialogue that has taken place in the last 20 years. we have to be very objective, what has been the outcome of these dialogues, majuro has gained legitimacy, money and time, which is at the end what they want, they do not care about venezuela and people dying. my point is we need to gain strength and legitimacy, to go into a true negotiation table, in which the people of venezuela can be sitting at that ta
it s supposed to be continuing this year. right now it seems stuck but there are those in the opposition who think the best way forward is to negotiate with maduro. do you think they re wrong? i did not discard a negotiation at some point, but i do want a negotiation in which we can force the regime to move forward to a transition to democracy. i do not want a negotiation to have the status quo in place, which is what has happened in the last 15 initiatives of dialogue that have taken place in the last 20 years. i mean, we have to be very objective. what has been the outcome of these proceedings and dialogues? maduro has gained legitimacy, money, and they have.and time, which is, at the end, what they want. they don t care about venezuela being destroyed and people dying. so my point is, we need to gain strength and legitimacy to go into a true negotiation table in which the people of venezuela can be sitting at that table and in which not a few representatives of the democratic
groups, groups of color, for example, the artist like the san ysidro movement, and these are groups that have been oppressed and repressed. you have a man on a hunger strike, and other opposition groups for peaceful transition to democracy. you have hunger strikes happening in cuba and a thousand political prisoners across gender and age and political lines that are in prison. why do you think, professor, much of the world turns its back to that reality you mentioned, turns its back to people, young artists, afro cubans that are trying to just live and exist and express themselves? why is it that much of the world simply doesn t care? ideology.
they do not want a democratic government. they do not want a democratic covernment. , ., ., government. they were part of that transition process. government. they were part of that transition process. after government. they were part of that | transition process. after committing the coup against the civilian government, they were part of negotiations with civilian activists, grassroots activist to try to get back to the tradition to transition to democracy. they stuck on something about which they are fighting now which is what happens to the two separate forces. how do you integrate them, should you integrate them, who would be in control if they were integrated? they did not like the proposals put forward by the mediators and turned on each other. criticism from the civilian led side says the international community should have punished the generals for carrying out that coup in the first place. what the americans have said is they were punished, economic aid stopped, the deb