talking about this being a job creation bill. we have 11 million jobs unfilled out there in the economy and we don t have the labor force to attack those. are we so worried about creating new jobs on top of those? it s not a big concern. the inflation part is. another concern obviously, brandon, are the taxes and all of the different tax gimmicks that they come up with. what do you think of the latest ones that apparently they say will mean that this bill cost nothing and has zero costs to the american public? i think it s absolutely ridiculous. it s fantasy land math to say that it cost nothing. when you like at irs expenditure, $400 billion in additional tax revenue, cbo, the congressional budget office said it s ridiculous. they said it s $200 billion. so they re doubling the amount of expected revenue here. they re making up numbers. all manchin is asking for, give him credit, to actually see how much these provisions cost. let s see what the bill costs
but they just can t agree on which one they want to go first. they are afraid if the 1.2 trillion goes first that the socialist progressives won t get their vote on the 3.5 trillion. if they do the 3.5 trillion first, the moderates are afraid that they won t get to the 1.2 trillion, but essentially the democrats want both of them, which is over 5 trillion, and if you take out the tax gimmicks, you re well over 6 trillion dollars. so this is socialist spending. i mean, you have to realize if you re spending money that you don t have, and you re going to tax the generation that s not even here yet, and you re going to take away rights of people, then, absolutely that is socialism, and joe biden is fully on board, even to the point of tanking the 1.2 trillion dollars bill yesterday so he could get to the 3.5 trillion dollars more quickly, bernie sanders level of spending. jon: the senator of arizona is one of those who is not in
our committee behind forwarding this resolution and moving the process forward. again, still a little bit of uncertainty because of a lack of clarity as to exactly what senators manchin and sinema will agree to and no margin of error there. to me it s not about a number, about pulling a particular number out of the air. it is what amount of resources will be necessary to provide the services that i think are so important to build back america better as the president has advocated, and then it s so important that we not yield to the old republican philosophy of borrow and spend. we went through that with donald trump, the king of the debt, driving up the debt both on his tax gimmicks and on the cost of his not responding, not only in terms of human loss, but great trillions of dollars required to try to undo the damage from the pandemic. we are paying for what we proposed, and we re not adding
annual shortfall is close to a trillion dollars a year. so i think we are missing a point by looking at the irs and not giving them the tools they need to fully collect the current tax liabilities. do you understand why republicans even some of the moderate ones who were on board for the bipartisan deal don t want to give the irs more resources to go after uncollected taxes? for the life of me, i can t figure that one out. i know senator portman well and we ve worked on irs reform tod together and we know if they have the tools they could collect more taxes particularly from those using tax gimmicks to avoid the true tax liability. so i think it is unfortunate. i think this is a avenue that if it is not in the bipartisan package, it will be in budget reconciliation. with some, you know, frustration, admission of some frustration, i ve read and asked questions for weeks, months now about the clock is ticking and
well, what is really important about the tax increases is a minimum tax you have to get agreed upon across countries and that is what secretary yellen is currently working on is getting some agreement so we don t have this arbitrage constantly going on in terms of especially the big tech firms booking profits abrood in low tax countries and sort of all the loopholes we see out there. what is really interesting is on the loophole side of it just on what is legally owed in taxes we under collect as much as $700 billion to $1 trillion a year that we re not collecting in taxes that are legally owed. so there is a lot of reason to do that but you need pretty sophisticated people hired up at the irs to be able to go after the kinds of tax gimmicks that people are being able to slip through and not pay those taxes. that goes a long way just doing that alone in paying for a lot of this. wow. up to $1 trillion from people who aren t paying taxes because