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Transcripts for BBCNEWS HARDtalk 20240604 03:45:00

haven t you just touched upon something very important, when you included in a sub clause the united states there in one of your areas of concern? isn t the truth that in recent years, what we ve seen is not just authoritarian regimes around the world resort to policies which you would regard as fundamentally abusive, but also we ve seen a fundamental lack of respect for international law and international norms coming from democratic systems and societies too? coming from the trump regime, certainly. you could look at the united states under donald trump, you could look at countries like poland and hungary, within the european union, you could look at a country like turkey, which is a democracy inside nato, and you could say in all of these examples, there are worrying signs that governments are using their legislative power to undermine, for example, the independence of the courts. look at israel today, which is almost at a state of civil war, because

Transcripts for BBCNEWS HARDtalk 20240604 22:44:00

and so i don t think the argument that the case against mass murder or genocide is purely western. haven t you just touched upon something very important, when you included in a sub clause the united states there in one of your areas of concern? isn t the truth that in recent years, what we ve seen is notjust authoritarian regimes around the world resort to policies which you would regard as fundamentally abusive, but also we ve seen a fundamental lack of respect for international law and international norms coming from democratic systems and societies too? coming from the trump regime, certainly. you could look at the united states under donald trump, you could look at countries like poland and hungary, within the european union, you could look at a country like turkey, which is a democracy inside nato, and you could say in all of these examples, there are worrying signs that governments are using their legislative power

Transcripts for BBCNEWS HARDtalk 20240604 23:43:00

of as universal, are in the nature of the international debate coming to be defined as western, as somehow the imposition of a western neo imperialist mind set? well, they shouldn t be because they were agreed by all countries at the end of the second world war, under the shadow of the holocaust. and, of course, they re embodied in international treaties, which all countries signed. and the problem has been to hold them to it, and i include america in having to hold them to it. so, support for the icc has, until recently, not been forthcoming from america, which is the leading western power, and so i don t think the argument that the case against mass murder or genocide is purely western. haven t you just touched upon something very important, when you included in a sub clause the united states there in one of your areas of concern? isn t the truth that in recent

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