estimating and measuring what s happening. they fear a civil war is lurking behind. isis is becoming stronger. it is getting outnumbered. not so organizations and groups are joining isis. on the other side, on the shia side, there are lots of fighters volunteering to fight against isis. so, all of this is a red flag, is a biggest concern and fear for iraqis that a civil war might erupt in the country. so then what needs to happen? i mean, there are those who say get rid of nuri al malaki. he s fostered the discontent that made the conditions ripe for isis to move in. is that enough? is the removal of nuri al malaki going to bring some sort of peace here? he s not the type of guy to give
north. really an autonomous state now. it s hard to know what the u.s. options are. it s a government of the shia side. they re iranian allies in a sense. they re supporting the government of syria, assad s side. yet, the sunni terrorists who now hold the territory, are essentially the terrorists that have been killing americans all over the middle east. so there aren t many good options. thank god we re no longer there. yeah, yesterday, general, i had a very sobering conversation with the former new york times baghdad bureau chief john burns. i want to get your reaction to something he said. let s take a listen. i m coming to the conclusion that the american military traces in iraq, all that america set out to achieve and all that it spent so heavily for in terms of blood and treasure, as president bush used to say, is going to be washed away. do you agree, washed away?
been, or a majority that s been oppressed by another group, the potential for hatred and the potential for long-term ramifications are there and you re right, that s where it affects america s national security interests. do we want in that region of the world, to see sunni/shia split, a v violent sunni-shia split. you have iran piling on the shia side. what does that mean for american national security interests? zainab i was surprised to read that ryan crocker, the u.s. ambassador to iraq from 2007-2009, for the iraqis to pull back from the brink, the americans must lead a high-level effort. we have done so successfully in the past we can do so again. are you at all optimistic about that this. before i go there, i want to actually more explain haas going on in iraq from an iraqi perspective. i disagree with you, david on the level of hatred between sunni and shias.
hezbollah, iran and the bashar al assad regime and many elements of the iraqi government fighting on the shia side. if you watch al jazeera or follow what s beginning on in social media, the people are overwhelmingly with the uprising going on in syria. they are seeing reports daily of massacres. one just cently with dozens, if not many more people killed. sunnis who were butchered in sierra by shiite militias. the massacres happening all the time are getting a lot of public sympathy. in the united states, we ve been focusing a lot of chemical weapons, red lines, how, when were chemical weapons used. in this part of the world, people watch every day and they
china in terms of support for the assad regime and political clout that limits the international community s ability to act with fwraeter sanctions. they really think they benefit with identifying themselves with a regime at this point? the irony of this is that for russians, it is a domestic issue and it particularly doesn t like the idea of the international community being able to say if there were protests, that they back the protests because russia facing its own. so, the muslims in russia are pro rebel. some, but they re anti putin. they want independence or whatever. this is a hard thing for me to sort out from this end, richard. what side is the arab world on? what side is the islamic world or is it a sunni versus shia area fight? very much a sectarian fight and you ll see lined up