might be wondering, what s the silver lining in here for donald trump. i have one, the new york times story says it s unclear whether dowd who resigned last week discussed the pardons with mr. trump before bringing them up with the other lawyers. and joyce, this goes to a defense we have seen in the stormy daniels case, in the case of silencing women and now we re seeing the same implied defense here tonight, which is donald trump must have the most rogue lawyers in the world. they re paying people without checking with him, they re facilitating payments out of their own pocket in their home equity line, now they re talking about possible pardons without talking to him. for a why who ran a lean organization at trump org, they seem to be doing whatever they feel like. you seem to be answering the question brilliantly. it s not much of a defense. for instance, dowd may find himself in the uncomfortable position of being interrogated