and cnbc s brian sullivan. brian, let me start with you, for 30 years we heard these silicon stories where guys just winging it and they re praising of bs artists having stanford degrees. we heard of steve jobs, he made things up the tried to get them to that point. you heard other stories in silicon valley of men doing the same thing for 30 years, fake it until you make it is a mantra out there and it has been. they convicted a woman and she could go to jail for 20 years. help me understand the difference between this and what men have been doing in silicon valley for 30 years. well, it s a complicated case. i had the opportunity to interview elizabeth holmes.