welcome to hardtalk. jonathan shapiro, better known by the pen name zapiro, welcome to hardtalk. thank you. well, it s a great pleasure to meet you, and i want to begin with something you said a few years ago. you said, moral outrage is what drives a cartoonist. you ve been at this cartooning for pretty much four decades. can you maintain outrage for four decades? you can. laughter when i was doing five or six cartoons a week, i would sometimes wonder what the hell i m going to do today, and you wake up in the morning and the news itjust keeps coming. it would happen to cartoonists everywhere in the world because that s what drives all of us, i m sure. anyone who takes this craft, or this genre of communication seriously. but in a place like south africa, the news just hits you from every every angle every day at an unbelievable rate. i wonder whether there s something personal about this outrage, which clearly developed quite young in you. you had a lot of trauma in your
to laugh at itself? jonathan shapiro, better known by the pen name zapiro, welcome to hardtalk. thank you. well, it s a great pleasure to meet you, and i want to begin with something you said a few years ago. you said, moral outrage is what drives a cartoonist. you ve been at this cartooning for pretty much four decades. can you maintain outrage for four decades? you can. laughter when i was doing five or six cartoons a week, i would sometimes wonder what the hell i m going to do today, and you wake up in the morning and the news itjust keeps coming. it would happen to cartoonists everywhere in the world because that s what drives all of us, i m sure. anyone who takes this craft, or this genre of communication seriously. but in a place like south africa, the news just hits you from every angle every day at an unbelievable rate. i wonder whether there s something personal about this outrage, which clearly developed quite young in you. you had a lot of trauma in your family
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well, i have the quotes here. director of the rape crisis cape town trust kathleen day, in 2017 it was unconscionable she said in 2017 it was unconscionable of zapiro to trigger the trauma of thousands of rape survivors. ajournalist, louise ferrera, she said, jonathan, why are you using our pain, making us relive our trauma to make a political point? the interesting thing about those quotes is that that is just one part of the debate. the debate was incredibly complex. there were radio discussions, phone in discussions where women phoned in and said more black women than white women who were phoning in and saying, i was shocked when i saw the cartoon and then i actually looked again and thought and looked again and thought, and said. this happened a number of times when i was on radio.