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i said, and he s actually uploaded the full 3 hours, but on the podcast we hear the 15 minutes. i said to him, you know, it feels like. democracy and society relies on this shared reality. we have that you and i might both be looking at this table and say, you know, it s a grey table. we agree it s a grey table. i like the grey table. you hate the grey table. but if one of us thinks the grey table isn t there, it becomes really difficult to have a conversation because, you know, he kept saying things to me along the lines of, oh, you know, well, me and you, you re actually the same. but you think you re exposing the harm caused by sort of disinformation and trolling and and so and so do i. and there was this constant back and forth of him kind of denying some of the stuff i raised, and then he d say other things that

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