tomorrow that we re going to be moving forward, and i know bob shares that hope, also. what are you going to do about the timing of the sanctions? will you say that they will not go into effect until after an invasion if that happens? or will you do it preemptively? that s a work in progress. but i can describe where we ve come together on that, and i think it s a combination of both. bob, would you agree with that? i agree with senator risch. look, there are some sanctions that really could take place up front because of what russia has already done, cyberattacks on ukraine, false flag operations, the efforts to undermine the ukrainian government internally. those are just some examples of sanctions that could take place now. but then the devastating sanctions that ultimately would crush russia s economy, and the continuing lethal aid we are
opposition to his thoughts this time. let s talk about what you just mentioned, senator risch, chairman menendez, you re working together. the two of you are leading a broader discussion, bipartisan discussion to put together legislation to sanction russia. the ukrainians have written the two of you and the broader group specifically asking for help. so how close are you to a deal on this legislation? well, senator risch and i have been working with our staffs and colleagues, a bipartisan coalition both on the foreign relations committee and members off of the committee in an intensive effort over the last week. i would describe it as though we are on the 1 yard line and hopefully we can conclude successfully. what there is no doubt is that there s an incredible bipartisan resolve for support of ukraine
but i can describe where we ve come together on that, and i think it s a combination of both. bob, would you agree with that? i agree with senator risch. look, there are some sanctions that really could take place up front because of what russia has already done, cyberattacks on ukraine, false flag operations, the efforts to undermine the ukrainian government internally. those are just some examples of sanctions that could take place now. but then the devastating sanctions that ultimately would crush russia s economy, and the continuing lethal aid we are going to send which means putin has to decide how many body bags of russia s sons are going to return to russia. the sanctions that we re talking about would come later on if he invades. some sanctions would come up
and incredibly strong bipartisan resolve to have severe consequences for russia if it invades ukraine, and in some cases for what it has already done. so what i would say is what we are devising, building upon the legislation that both senator risch wrote independently and i wrote, which i call the mother of all sanctions, is to include a variety of elements, massive sanctions against the most significant banks, crippling to their economy, meaningful in terms of consequences to their accounts and pensions, more lethal assistance to ukraine, the ability to deal with russia s sovereign debt, to look at sectoral elements of russia s economy which is largely an extracting economy on energy, to sanction its sovereign debt. these are sanctions beyond any that we have ever levied before, and i think that sends a very clear message. senator risch, how do you get
devastating price. senator risch, some conservative personalities, even some sitting lawmakers, they re questioning why the u.s. is helping ukraine at all. i want you to take a listen. why is it disloyal to side with russia but loyal to side with ukraine? ukraine is strategically irrelevant to the united states. he wants to keep his western border secure. that s why he wants ukraine to join nato which makes sense. senator, as one of the top republican issues in congress, what do you say to that? well, i think, first of all, when you have a country like ukraine which wants to move west and look towards western values that is a democracy, we side always with countries that are democracies. certainly there isn t going to be troops committed in that regard. i tell you, the people who are saying we shouldn t be engaged