selling, we did not have enough buying and when you push treasury prices down, it pushes interest rates up. neil: how up do you thing they go? guest: well, once we run past $4.25 on ten year treasury rates we will see a slow down because it pushes up the mortgage rates and how high? it is tough to say because we did not know how much money the federal reserve is going to print to keep buying bonds. they have been specious about what they will do when their bond buying program is over. so we do not know how high they can go but i think they can go high, maybe north of 5 percent. neil: thank you very much. we use financial types very rarely on there show and my only career dough credo we have are his credentials and his are