By Geico offering car insurance as well as services for homeowners and renters insurance through the Geico Insurance Agency additional information can be found at Geico dot com or 180947. From w.v.u. Our Boston n.p.r. I mean if any Brooks this is on point last night's All-Star game was a glut of power hitting in pitching 10 homers 25 strikeouts but baseball is in a slump attendance is down fans are older millennial zur staying away so what ails our national pastime critics say too many home runs too many strikeouts too few balls in play analytics are sucking the heart out of the game which is too slow with too many meaningless games and too few good teams up next on point is baseball striking out. First this news. Live from n.p.r. News in Washington I'm nor Rahm for weeks people around the world have been following the saga of 12 boys and their soccer coach in Thailand 1st they were lost then they were found in a flooded cave next days later came a dramatic rescue and then recovery time in a hospital today they answered questions at a news conference before heading home at last Michael Sullivan reports from the northern city of Chiang Rai it's over and it's time to go home and they look ready doctors say the boys who lost a lot of weight during their ordeal have gained it back and they looked happy or maybe just relieved at tonight's news conference where they had to kick a ball around a little and answer a few carefully screen questions about their ordeal at an event organized in part one government official told Reuters to reduce public curiosity and let the boys get back to their regular lives Michael Sullivan reporting from Chang rhyme Republican congresswoman Martha Roby has defeated her challenger in a runoff for the g.o.p. Nomination and Alabama's 2nd Congressional District Kyle gas Troy Public Radio reports President Trump was among the 1st people who Robie thanked in her acceptance speech it wasn't a sure bet that Martha Roby would win the runoff or get the backing of the president during the presidential campaign Ruby had called Candidate Trump unacceptable and said she would vote for him after the release of the Access Hollywood Video despite being snubbed Trump endorsed Robey last month in the runoff and Tuesday night she explained why it's important because we have a shared conservative agenda that we're working together to get these policies across the finish line for the American people Robi will run against a Democrat Tabitha Eisner in the general election in a district that went heavily for President Trump in 2016 for n.p.r. News I'm Kyle Gaston in Montgomery Oregon senators Jeff Merkley and Iran Wyden led an unusual protest last night on the floor of the Senate over the Republican Party's up. To confirming federal judges Oregon Public Broadcasting Conrad Wilson reports Senators Wyden and Berkeley oppose the nomination of Ryan bounds of a federal prosecutor from Oregon the Senate is expected to take up his confirmation vote this week traditionally the Senate has not proceeded with traditional nominations without the support of home state senators but Center Republicans have pushed ahead with bones wide and says it's part of the trumpet ministrations efforts to seek more conservative judges a part of a pattern of the majority violating norms misleading the public bending rules to their absolute limits to reshape the judiciary and judges that are far far far from the mainstream the Oregon senators have questioned inflammatory writings by bounds while he was in college for n.p.r. News I'm covered Wilson in Portland and last check on Wall Street the markets mixed the Dow is up 21 points the s. And p. Is down 29 this is n.p.r. News. In California a fire burning near Yosemite National Park is now more than $12000.00 acres officials say it's only 5 percent contained firefighting efforts are being hampered by hot dry weather and steep terrain and Vesta gators have not yet determined the cause of the blaze which broke out Friday night is that many park remains open but park rangers warn air quality is poor because of the smoke California's Pacific Coast Highway will come fleetly reopened this morning a portion of the roadway has been closed for more than a year because of a huge landslide from member station. Krista Ahmanson reports the landslide dumped enough dirt and rock to add 15 acres of land to the coast back in early 2017 it blocked the highway and kept drivers from completing the scenic drive between San Francisco and Los Angeles on Wednesday morning the state will open a new quarter mile stretch of roadway it built on top of the slide it's welcome news to businesses who depend on the through traffic yeah that's one way to put it we've been paying taking only anticipating the opening of the highway Rick is general manager of the Big Sur river and this new stretch of highway one it cost $54000000.00 for n.p.r. News I'm Christine Romans on the European Commission is expected to impose a $5000000000.00 fine against Google over its Android mobile operating system Investigators say the company has been forcing mobile home manufacturers to preinstall its absence services and sometimes paid them not to install competing systems I'm sure rom n.p.r. News in Washington support for n.p.r. Comes from n.p.r. Stations other contributors include the Walton Family Foundation where opportunity takes root more information is available at Walton Family Foundation dot org And the John d. And Catherine t. MacArthur Foundation Ed Mack founded dot org. I'm Robin Young president says he supports one party's intelligence agencies but didn't believe claims that another party Russia was behind cyber attacks I will say this I don't see any reason why it would be but I really do want to see the server. But I have I have confidence in both parties next time here and now. Today at 2 parley the mostly sunny today 85 it's 11 o 6. From w.v.u. Our Boston n.p.r. I'm Anthony Brooks and this is on point. Since. It's 6 pm the American League won last night's All-Star game beating the National League $8.00 to $6.00 in extra innings the game showcased baseball's new style lots of home runs including that one by Alex Bregman lots of strikeouts in a contest that lasted well into the night and while several major league baseball teams from Boston to Houston to Los Angeles are thriving of late the sport of baseball is not attendance is down young people are staying away calling it too slow and boring and you can afford the tickets by the way not to mention the 10 dollar beers this hour on point what ails the great American pastime you can join the conversation on air or online how much have you been following baseball this season did you enjoy last night's All-Star game give us a call at 180-423-8255 that's 180423 talk you can also join us any time at on point Radio dot org or on Twitter and Facebook at on point radio and joining me now from Washington is John Taylor baseball writer for Sports Illustrated he was at last night's All-Star game and the home run home run derby on Tuesday John welcome to on point there really glad to have you thanks for having harried and I'm doing very well so unfortunately I didn't watch the All-Star Game last night I have to go to bed early to do this show but I read about it I wished I had watched it give us the highlights what do you like about it homes own rooms more home an extension of the home run derby it seemed like it never and that we had a record and it was like what we did last night including what felt like all of them in the last 2 innings or so a lot of strikeouts and you mentioned a lot of walks so really in a sense it was kind of a perfect calculation of what baseball is and. Year 2018 home runs walk strikeout ball park and put in play Petrus throwing 95 plus miles per hour with pretty much every offering super hard during relievers I mean that's pretty much it's funny that you haven't also you know kind of just so neatly stands for the era in which we live but that's pretty much all we had last night well let's listen to a little bit of sound so as we mentioned a record home run a 10 home runs were hit last night's all star game that surpasses the previous record of 6 the game included these shots from Mike Trout scooter Jannat and Alex Bregman when he ought to. Go and gone and we could have done 7 more but you get the point so to John Taylor I mean home runs are a great thing isn't this what we go to the ball game to see because I detected a little bit of weariness in your voice about describing all these home runs I don't want to call it weariness but in a certain point you do start to kind of wonder where all the other balls Well you know batting average as it currently stands I believe is on pace to be one of the lowest we've seen since the late 1960 s. When the league had to lower the mound in order to bring all suns levels back up so much they were tying up 3 d.h. Time their 2. Singles are down pretty much everything is down and it's a certain what I love home runs you know they are they are the most exciting thing at least in most cases that can happen on a baseball field but it does kind of become a little bit of sensory overload when they when they just happen so often when you have you know when you have so many guys cranking out 20 in a season when one of the guys you homers are fight scooter Jeanette 2 years ago he was a totally nondescript completely unfair a Miss utility infielder. Or else I don't think around bad teams now all the sudden he's the kind of guy who could get 20 to 25 home are going to see that and while that's pretty cool a lot of sleep you're going to like Scooter Jeanette it is kind of indicative of just how you it's become to hit a home run nowadays due in part I imagine to all the monkeying that Major League Baseball has like week on which to base all that kind of help received this big rise in home runs over the last 2 seasons Yeah and John at the same time and last night was indicative of that as well we've got a game where pitchers are throwing a lot of strikeouts lots and lots of strikeouts a lot of home runs lots of strikeouts as you mentioned that means fewer balls in play but what's the effect of all those strike outs because again this is something that traditionally I mean I'm thinking of I remember the days of going to Fenway Park and seeing Pedro Martinez wrap Iraq up those caves in the in the center field bleachers people would put up those casings was very very exciting but too many of those as well maybe. Yeah and I agree I mean I I also grew up a Red Sox and I very fondly remember all the strikeouts of Pedro Martinez a pilot in his prime his 17th straight out game against the Yankees in late 991 of the great pitching performances of all time but again like home runs you get it's almost too much of a good thing at a certain point when everyone and their 95 plus one everyone can rack up strikeouts it does get a little kind of dull especially when you just go long stretches of time I know last night there was a good 5 or 6 batter stretch of one point were literally no one put the ball in play it was I think 5 strikeouts in a walk all in a row and I can get a little dull if you're watching because you're not really seeing anything happen especially because the odds of. The odds of anything good actually happening one way or the other want to call a strike out box is pretty negligible means you put the ball in play I know no one wants to hit we've ground balls or pop ups or anything like that doesn't do anything for anybody and those are more interesting to watch certainly but the ball in play does lead to hits of course in a way that strikeouts walks or not and of course it makes defense do things like I noted that last night that we didn't really get any great or good defensive plays last night simply because there wasn't there weren't any opportunities for that to happen which is also I guess you could say a little bit dull as well yeah I agree with that that's a real shame as someone who loves the defensive side of baseball So John one more question before I let you go and that is looking forward toward the rest the 2nd half of the season we've got 4 teams the New York Yankees Boston Red Sox Houston Astros and the Seattle Mariners they're all on pace to win more than 100 games which would also be a major league record there are 6 teams including the Baltimore Orioles the royals the White Sox the Reds the matter of the Marlins and the Texas Rangers winning percentage is below $400.00 so talk about that I mean this kind of mismatch between the truly great teams and a whole bunch of teams not so great it's not surprising that we have a week that's kind of increasingly. Polarized and divided into the super elite and the super bad when you have teams so willing to do things like not spend money in the offseason and put themselves on 23 to 5 year rebuilding plans where they're simply not competitive on purpose and when you have a league in the commissioner's office that is war left entirely Ok with this. This is kind of the end result of a league that embraces tanking as the commissioner doesn't want to call the tanking the tanking is what it is as a viable strategy toward building content and the truth is if it works sometimes you know the Cubs You can argue about the Cubs and the Astros got to where they are by embracing that but that's not entirely accurate and then you look at teams like the Reds who've been tanking for pretty much 4 and a half years at this point and are still a bad team and don't really have any. New Visions of being better in the future so to me we know the way things play out this offseason with the way teams refused to sign free agents but there were so few teams that actually seemed interested in getting better or in contending it's not really a surprise we're in a position now kind of similar to where the n.b.a. Is where you have this concentration of super teams you know like you know Boston Boston or New York or both on past when more than 105 games use and having its best season in franchise history and then the other half you have all these bottom feeders who are all just vying for better draft picks and you know that this is the result that doesn't necessarily surprising it is a bummer though because the last thing you want to see such if you're a fan of any of those teams is you know 2 thirds of a season's worth or however many over a long of games that honestly don't matter no matter how well John Taylor baseball writer for Sports Illustrated thank you so much for joining us and pretty in particular for giving us that update from the All-Star game we appreciate it my pleasure thanks for having me and joining us now from St Paul Minnesota is Chris Heinz Sports Analytics an enterprise reporter for The Minneapolis Star Tribune he's one of the reporters working on a Minneapolis Star Tribune series on the state of major league baseball you can. A link to his article headlined Major League Baseball fans turning grey wall millennial Zz tuning out you can find that at our website at on point Radio dot org Chris Huhne welcome to on points great to have you had to do thanks for having me appreciate it so I thought we got a good sort of primer for this hour from John Taylor but jump in anywhere you want attendance is down millennial zone are turning away what ails baseball in your view right now and it's a question that I think has multifaceted answer to it I think there's several issues that are going on just besides the issues with pace of play and the game is too boring and one of the things in my piece that I found out in talking to people around baseball including the president of the twins' day Saint Peter is a major issue facing baseball right now is the marketing of its players and they kind of look at the n.b.a. As as the model league in terms of building up the audience for their players marketing the players and all you have to do is kind of look at the the social media following of various baseball players you know the sale today and Jim Crow Stan the reigning M.V.P.'s in the league have a combined Twitter following of about 550000 people James Harden the N.B.A.'s m.v.p. Has 5 and a half 1000000 and what's the main reason for that is that just because baseball isn't perceived as dynamic a game or is this really just not putting these athletes out on the Wheaties boxes aggressively enough you know it's a very good question I'm not sure I'm not sure there's a an exact answer but I would say one thing is the culture of baseball lends itself to being a sport where you don't want to stand out especially if you're a young player I know Mike Trout for instance you know the the best player in the game you know for the last few years here you know he should be a bigger star Yeah maybe in another. Eric he would be a bigger star than he is right now. You know those aren't holes I thought we have to go to a break but I want to pick that up right after the break listeners were talking about the 2018 Major League Baseball season and the declining popularity of the game you can join the conversation or you would die hard baseball fan or sport struggling to keep your attention give us a call 180-423-8255 that's 180423 talk we're going take a short break when we return we'll pick up this conversation with Chris Heinz as well as your calls I mean this is on point. That. We may never. Get. To. Live. Live. Live live in. Forests are looking to the skies over the Midwest hoping to catch a storm so buckle up all right for spam we're going to be a long day. Hoping we get something to look at I'm Lizzie O'Leary tour guide to making money on the thrill of the chase next time on Marketplace. Tonight at $630.00. You're playing someone else's game. The next instruction. Towards the end of the big. Saturday afternoon at 2 It's 1120 back to. Support for one point comes from w.b. You are Boston Geico offering auto insurance coverage for cars trucks or S.U.V.s and providing 247 customer service more information on auto insurance at Geico dot com or 180947 auto and read it and w.b. You are presenting endless thread the podcast that brings stories discovered on Reddit to listeners ear buds each week tales that range from the elementary school yard to science labs on school on endless thread available on Apple podcasts. This is on point I'm Anthony Brooks we're talking about why many sports fans are saying I'll catch you later to baseball you can join the conversation is baseball still America's great pastime in your view or the cost of parking tickets even hunt dogs preventing you from getting out to the game or 180-423-8255 that's 180423 talkee can also follow us on Twitter find us on Facebook and on point radio let's hear a little sound for the game to get us in the mood the Boston Red Sox entered the All-Star break with the best record in baseball they're on top of the American League East they've won 12 their last 13 games including Sunday's victory courtesy of Zander Bogart's they're all holding thank. You Stan Van style indeed and this year's home run derby was one for the record books 221 home runs it surpassed the previous high number of home runs at 203 in 2016 star slugger Bryce Harper won the homerun derby in front of his hometown fans in Washington d.c. And celebrated with his father on the field. Thanks. I'm talking with Chris Heinz Sports Analytics enterprise reporter for The Minneapolis Star Tribune about the Star Tribune series on the state of Major League Baseball and Chris let's just pick up where we where we were before the break you were talking about the marketing of baseball players and how it's just maybe not up to par yet in that we were talking about Mike Trout and specifically why he isn't a bigger star when. Maybe in another age or another sport he might be a gigantic star and I think part of it is the culture of baseball and the culture of baseball is one in a kind of tampers individuality it wants you to be part of the team don't disrespect the game don't stand out don't do anything flashy or showy and so in some ways I think a lot of the top players they might shy away from from opportunities that my game the more exposure of more of a brand but you know I do think that ultimately the marketing problems might be secondary to the problems on the field I do think that the pace of play how boring the perception that baseball is is what's really driving. Some concerns with attracting a younger audience for the game. Chris on stand by I want to introduce j. Scott Smith he's joining us now from New York he's a reporter for The Grio a news website geared toward African-Americans and Jay welcome to on point it's great to have you and it's great to be here so you've been listening to this conversation what do you think ails baseball and you know I'd like to go back if we could we started top of the hour with John Taylor just talking about all these home runs all these strikeouts which can be very exciting but which means fewer balls in play and it sort of affects the game as it's played on the field I'll start with you js is that a problem to what extent is that a problem for this game it can be a problem if it becomes too predictable and I've been listening to the conversation obviously and some of it gets brought up I mean it's funny now that we talk about there being too many strikeouts because I can remember the commercial from the late ninety's with Tom Glavine and Greg Maddux where they're saying chicks dig the long ball and that was that was seen as the big issue is there are many home runs and now it's almost like it's an all or nothing type of thing where and I heard it mentioned earlier about social media baseball is not very social media friendly despite the game having. Every opportunity to be social media friendly when you look at the n.b.a. It's and I spent a lot of time talking at the n.b.a. It's built on the big plays the big the big 3 pointer from Steph Curry or the or the crazy dribble through the legs moves on the drives to the basket or James Harden putting a move on the young man from the Clippers earlier this year that left him sitting on the ground those are the odd type of plays and that's the kind of climate we're in the n.b.a. Is embrace that the n.f.l. Is embracing with the big hits and the touchdowns and the big time plays but a lot of it does come back to baseball's almost being seen as stodgy I grew up playing baseball myself it was the 1st sport that I fell in love with before anything else back in Detroit and it was it is an interesting climate now that everything is set up for social media to be social media friendly instant access or you think of the biggest baseball player that I've seen in the social media age was Jose Bautista hitting a home run against the Texas Rangers a couple of years ago with the huge bat flip in the crowd reaction that was maybe the biggest pop on social media I had seen for a baseball game or something like that where people crave those those good football moments those 10 2nd clips that you can reach tweeter put on Facebook over and over again baseball as has been mentioned does have this kind of stodgy we don't upstage the team don't be seen as too flashy were kind of old school and I think that does harm the game especially since even football which at one point was really stodgy like that has started to loosen up the reins a little bit on that sort of thing interesting we're going to talk about what Major League Baseball might be considering doing about that but I want to get to some callers in on this conversation we've got a lot a lot of them lined up Teddy is calling from Dayton Ohio Teddy It's good to have you go ahead you're on the air thank you for calling. Anthony. Just so what I've noticed over the last 2 years as far as a declining interest I've got several nice to nephews to all enjoy the game. And just to go with because late as 2001 we were watching of auto really hit a lot of Washington Phillips takes a lot of play and if we're lucky somebody like Gorky Miller hangs around and I just I grew up going to the Reds down you cannot reverse from my grandparents and it just it was a past time I played Little League and but those young people that I'm hanging out with in my family this much as they enjoy the dynamics of the game just standard go to remember her go to a great American ballpark just because of the time consumption the money consumption and it's just a little too saw other watching other games on their device just all out there in the stands waiting for something to happen on the field got a teddy So you know a little too slow and maybe a game for an another time almost John and Chris related to what we heard Teddy say there from Ohio here's a comment from our Web site jazz 0 Turner writes 162 games over 3 hours a shot while most people barely have time to drink a cup of coffee in the morning before working taking care of kids worrying about bills health care etc baseball is a great game but this is a throwback to an era when time rather the information was the coin of the realm of leisure many of us can no longer traffic in the pleasures of free time it's a sad comment but I'll come back to you Chris what do you what do you think I'm just a sport that is out of step with the time we heard Jay for example talking about it's not social media friendly you know you need this stuff that you can kind of click and access quickly Yeah I agree with everything that's been that's been said one point I would make Sports Illustrated recently did a study in which. They calculated that this season the average time between something happening a ball being in play and a game was 3 minutes and 45 seconds that's an entire song you can you can listen to a song on your on your phone and before anything is going to happen on the field of play and my piece one of the people I quoted was a sociology professor from the University of Minnesota named Douglas Hartman and he told me you know football for instance takes sometimes longer than a baseball game but people are interested by a football game because there's the promise of action you know that in a football game every 40 seconds they're going to line up and something is going to happen in baseball there is no guarantee that something is going to happen he could happen at any moment and it might not happen for several minutes so that's that's what really drives people away from the game it's not so much that the games take forever it's just that the games take forever plus not a lot of stuff is happening if stuff was happening on the field you might see more people tune in but we're in an age right now where we're having more strikeouts than ever and and you know more home runs than ever but it's really the strikeouts that that are really driving this this inaction on the field you know Jay one of my fondest memories and I have to admit I because of my working schedule I don't have a lot of time to go to baseball games I always think about it in terms of do I have the time do I have the time not to mention the money but some of my fondest memories of baseball games is going with a group of people and just kind of relaxing and spending most of the time talking to folks you know it's a social thing and once all you happens on the field Ok that's a benefit but I didn't necessarily go to see you know 2 lines of football players line up and do something every 40 seconds and there was that atmosphere of just letting letting things kind of play out I always think of the 1st baseball game I went to was I was 4 years old said 1009 $103.00 it was a tie It was a game of Tiger Stadium in Detroit between the Tigers and the Baltimore Orioles and I didn't. Ever seen a baseball diamond before like that so I my 1st memory of seeing the field of Tiger Stadium open up from the center field bleachers and just enjoying the camaraderie there being there with my mom and my and friends of ours from the school group and just getting to understand the spent time together and it is this is a different age I mean that's 35 years ago which kind of dating myself risk 35 years ago so it's a lot more leisure early Yeah of a to the game then you go to a football game you're expecting to see touchdowns big hits in the n.b.a. Game expecting to see the runs weren't you Teams like Golden State where they go on these crazy runs and these dunks and these really fast paced play when you think about like that they talk about the pace playing baseball a baseball game is really not that much longer than a lot of n.f.l. Games is just that you feel you get more out of an n.f.l. Game because it's constant motion it's constantly moving and with baseball it's hard and which is crazy to think of because football the players you don't always see their faces but you know who they are baseball you know you see these guys out here and at times they're like anonymous faces in the crowd so when people go to these games they're there for the atmosphere but in 2018 as opposed to 183 or 190-2003 going there just to spend time and hang out that's not that's not enough to move the needle with a lot of people these days yeah let's take some more calls Keith is calling from Atlanta Georgia Hey Keith you're on the air Good to have you. And I don't very well what's up basically I was. I'm thinking and basically like beyond analytics and pace of play and the whole buttoned up image of baseball I think Major League Baseball should reinvest back into the end of cities to attract black youth back to baseball I think there's a correlation between the decline of popularity of baseball and the decline of the black athlete and baseball I think undeniably no one moves the media like a black athlete and I think it would bring back popularity back to the game I mean that's is the way I feel Ok that's a great point I'm glad you put it on the table let me ask my guests about that Chris let me go back to you not a lot of kids of color playing the game at young ages and we know that you know interest in the sport is directly related to whether or not you played as a kid absolutely and keeping Keith brings up a great point where you go back through the history of baseball and you know going back even before Jackie Robinson helped integrate the league there was a large black following for baseball and that's where a lot of fans came from they they were they were black fans and it's it's it's remarkable to me that in this day and age that baseball hasn't done a better job of maintaining that fan base because that's that's at the core of baseball and I really do think that that's a severe problem that it's something that has been discussed in the past in the past 20 years or so baseball knows it's been a problem we don't make a bigger deal of it in the media but perhaps we should because that is a significant portion of baseball's fan base that has just tuned out the game over the last couple of decades you know what do you think Jay I mean what's the way to get young African-American players back involved in this game well speaking as an African-American to play baseball I can say that part of that is access you know and I've I've recently I recently spoke with Bob Kendrick who runs the Negro League museum. At Kansas City and I've talked to him before about this and he said a lot of the reasons in a lot of the ways that we lost a large amount of black players is this is even though I think it's now up to about 9.5 percent which is still grossly low compared to what it was in the 1970 s. And eighty's nearly a quarter of the league was African-American is access to access to fields access to equipment baseball is essentially becoming what hockey is where you where if you're a baseball player you can't just simply like basketball we just kind of get shorts and maybe uniforms you got to go uniforms you got to go gloves bats if you're a catcher you have catchers equipment you have specialized schools for pitchers and and all these different things happening and there's travel and there's fields I go back to Detroit for example I look around Philadelphia where where I where I work the last few years so many of these baseball diamonds in the inner cities as oppose if you go to a baseball down on the west side of Detroit as opposed to an Oakland County which is 20 minutes north of there and you look at the difference between the 2 where you have fields that barely have that have 3 foot high grass and and no bases and you can barely tell it's a baseball diamond you go 15 minutes north past 8 mile you've got scoreboard you've got $300.00 foot walls you've got travel teams and a lot of times it's about the access part of it too because you don't see the little leagues the Police Athletic League like they had in Detroit I spoke with Ryan Howard when they opened baseball academy under his name in Philadelphia and we both sat and talked about how growing up we had players we looked up to where I loved Rickey Henderson an Ozzie Smith and and Ken Griffey Jr where now you don't have that enough and they lost a generation of black players and they're starting to slowly but surely come back and you see it little by little with certain players and certain teams now and guys like Andrew McCutchen and I know there's a pitcher in Cincinnati for example Amir Garrett who's a really good pitcher of Billy Hamilton with the Reds and Betts with the Red Sox You have these guys who are starting to now show that it's the resurgence of little by little of black players but a lot of that is excess if you don't make the game accessible to us and I'll just say it as a black man to us. We're not going to show up we're going to go play football even though it's shown to be increasingly dangerous because of head injuries and everything and I go play basketball because that's all we see are these guys playing basketball and that seems to be the easiest quote unquote route to making it as a pro athlete Yeah so my question and I'll come back to you Chris for this I mean I think you mention that Major League Baseball is aware of this what can they do are they talking about what can be done I don't know teaming up with with with cities and towns and funding fields funding activities that would get more kids involved in this game is that you have to revert Yeah yeah they do have there there are a program which is Reviving Baseball and inner cities that's been around since the late eighty's and that's really what they've been the main outlet that they've been trying to use to to revive the game I do think that it's exactly right it's a problem of access and any more to be an elite level athlete it requires specialization and it requires a lot of time and money poured into a kid to do things like travel leaks to get the exposure out there it's a it's a burden it's time consuming and it's a lot of money and it's a lot of money that people may not have and that's that's a that's a big thing in today's society is that the cost of developing and nurturing a a elite level athletes has gone way up from what it used to be a couple decades ago we're talking about the ways in which Major League Baseball maybe striking out or asking can the m.l. Be improve itself make the game more accessible to black athletes for example to others maybe think about overwhelmingly high ticket prices and concession prices will talk about that after the break you can join the conversation is Major League Baseball outdated too slow How can the league market itself better to younger. More diverse audience 18042325 that's 180423 talk short break we'll be right back I'm Anthony Brooks. Ministration wants to detain all on authorized immigrants but others are calling for flexibility nursing mother 83 alternate hearing. Threat to public safety a member of the drug cartel in the country and has. Immigration Detention this afternoon on All Things Considered from n.p.r. News. This afternoon beginning at 4. Ok so a little bit scary weird the next fresh air Bo Burnham writer and director of the new film 8th grade about a girl with social anxiety who makes You Tube videos about how to be confident and make friends Burnham became a You Tube sensation when he was a teenager and You Tube was still new join us. Today and tonight it. Support comes from our members and from Wesley and University Center for the arts in the musical theater work Bone Hill inspired by 4th generation of Martha Red Bones Kentucky family lineage one night only July 19th 7 30 pm. C f. Partly to mostly sunny today highs in 85 degrees tonight clear skies lows around 60 sunny on Thursday highs in 85 degrees and sunny on Friday in the 8th 20 minutes till the. Support for on point comes from Exact Sciences offering color guard for average risk adults over 50 noninvasive colon cancer screening test that can be used by prescription only information to guard test dot com and Legal Zoom providing public radio listeners and others with legal advice and guidance on business matters and the state plans through its network of independent attorneys more information is available at Legal Zoom dot com point. This is on point I'm Anthony Brooks we're talking about the future of Major League Baseball and what the game will look like in the coming years you can join the conversation should Major League Baseball speed up the pace of play how would they do that what about rule changes what about tradition on holding onto that give us a call at 180-423-8255 My guests are Chris Hein Sports Analytics an enterprise reporter for The Minneapolis Star Tribune and j. Scott Smith a reporter with The Grio and gentlemen I want to play a little bit of tape here this comes from Oakland when asked about the athletics poor attendance early in the season season ticket holder John Westmoreland said his team only needed to do one thing to get more fans to come out and that is when I see what the A's are trying to do building for the future but most people want to see a team that wins now and if you're not winning down there they're likely not going to come out so j. Scott Smith we talked about this at the top of the hour with John Taylor but this this mismatch between a handful of very very good teams whether it's New York Boston Houston Seattle Los Angeles and a whole bunch of teams that are playing you know below 400 and a lot and one of the reasons is because a lot of these teams are rebuilding and they just sort of throw in the towel and say you know forget about this season we're building for the future but doesn't that create a problem and what can be done it's kind of similar to the and I've heard this mentioned earlier it's kind of similar to the argument that's going on in n.b.a. Circles right now with the dearth of teams that are really really good and in the n.b.a. The difference is the n.b.a. Has always been kind of structured that way where there's about 7 or 8 good teams at one time in the rest is filler and baseball is really weird cyclical I come from 2 aspects where my team the Tigers they are kind of embarking on this rebuilding training as they spent the better part of this decade as a part of the haves and they've been in only until last year they finally tapped out and say All right look we're starting this over it is true I mean if you factor in obviously the deficiencies with some of these teams where you look at the American League Central Division where in the air in the east you have. The Yankees and the Red Sox back to what they almost always do they're dominating in American League Central up until about 3 and a half weeks ago the Detroit Tigers were a game under 500 and they were 3 games out of 1st place that whole division right now is not good even the Cleveland Indians the defending division champs were they were they were in a World Series 2 years ago they weren't doing very well with 4 really bad teams behind them some of the issues with attendance there due to the weather because you saw the swath of bad weather that was all over the Midwest and East Coast in March and April where so many games were snowed out rained out in from everywhere from as far west as Minneapolis and Chicago all the way to Boston New York and d.c. It's winning always always helps with the way that the league is structured and this might become a bit more of an issue when we get closer to the labor issues in the next couple of years when the collective bargaining agreement comes up because of all the issues with free agency and whatnot is how do you mitigate this because unlike the n.b.a. Where you can look Butin do what the 76 years did for example and be bad historically bad in their case for 34 years and you build a draft picks and boom these guys are instantly they are instantly good in baseball you can't do that because sometimes these draft picks either never panned out or it may be 56 years down the line before you start to see a guy show up after he works his way to the minors I think with the way the league is set up right now they need to I don't know if Manfred can address it because it has semi work for the Astros' and the Cubs but then you have as I heard earlier the Cincinnati Reds have just been kind of wallowing bad for so long that perhaps if there is another aspect of either figure out a way to maybe incentivize not losing if you could come up with something like a draft lottery for example like the n.b.a. Has where it isn't always a guarantee for the worst record you're going to get the best pick of the litter I guess in terms of players that's kind of a hard thing to figure out you can't do anything about the weather it is what it is right going to shorten the season because that's costing too much money I would say look at maybe incentivizing not losing as opposed to saying hey if we know we're not in it let's just go out here and drop $110.00 games and wait 3 years and we'll be back to you let's go to Stella who's calling from Canton Massachusetts just outside of Boston Stella good to have you. Hi Anthony thank you for taking my call so I I do I'm not an avid watcher of baseball but as a spectator I've noticed that watching baseball on t.v. Versus other sports like hockey and and football is a lot more slow. When you're out a game getting that fever is when you actually go to a game kids are being bombarded by technology you know attention spans are low or they like to be engaged and I think that coupled with the fact that when we were in when I was in high school many years ago we could get a ticket for $14.00 with less than $20.00 we could spend the day at Fenway Park it has become an affordable American past time and I think what you're seeing is the result of decades of kids who have lost interest because they do not go to the game you cannot afford to go to the games it's become something that is for the rich and famous and it is completely lost and on the portable my middle or lower classes so I really appreciate you putting this point on the table and we're going to pick this up in a moment I want to get one more call from Steve who is calling from Madison Wisconsin go ahead Steve you're on the air thanks for calling Hi Anthony Gentleman thank you for taking my points I have a couple of points I do agree Baseball needs to engage the African-American on the largest crowd in Wrigley Field history at a ballgame was Jackie Robinson's 1st game over 70 years ago. But what makes baseball special is the pace of play is. That anything can happen at any given moment and I think it's a mistake to try to pander to the fragmented attention span and that search for instant gratification. Because it's contrary to the nature of the game the n.f.l. Is also on the decline we've had conversations on this very program about that and . The n.f.l. I mean a football game 3 hour football game has about 11 minutes of actual action as does a 3 hour base. And also the analytics the statistics they make your head swim the average person and it is not 1st and in all the alphabet soup and and number crunching that goes I need a statistics degree to follow along with all right Christine you put a bunch of things on the table that I want to talk to Chris and Jay about Christmas start with you style a call though and made this point and we hear this a lot it is expensive to go to to to a baseball game even though I know baseball teams will tell you that they have these programs you can line up at certain times of the week you can you know get tickets at a discounted price at such and such I know the Red Sox do that but at the end of the day if you want to get to a game you've got to spend a lot of money isn't Major League Baseball addressing this in any way at all because it's a complaint that a lot of people have this seems to be low on the priority list and you want your I know. In my story this week a lot of the comments underneath mentioned how expensive it was to go park to buy the tickets to get your food to get your drinks you know you really have to say if you really have to save up for you have to save up to make it a night out. So that's it's a huge problem for baseball right now I will say one thing going in at least the twins favor here in Minneapolis and I tend to push back a little bit against this narrative that's coming from baseball that the weather is driving the attendance down here in Minnesota. 63 percent of their attendees this year at Target Field were 40 and younger I was surprised to learn that I was a little stunned that it was that that big of a chunk of their audience was 40 or younger and I also look at the twins' attendance overall and they're. Slightly down from where they were a year ago and they haven't been very good this year but you look at a place like Toronto where there's a dome a retractable dome and they are down by over half a 1000000 year over year this year so I tend to push back against the narrative that it's it's all that the weather really had a big impact as Believe me we had some terrible weather here in Minnesota and April you know we had a blizzard that wiped out 3 straight games so I do think the competitiveness plays a big part in it because Toronto hasn't been very good this year they have a dome where people can be heated and sit down and enjoy the games and still they're not coming. I want to sort of pick up Steve's point about our caller Steve about the pace of play and I know that there's a lot of concern about this and that Major League Baseball is considering I don't know you know what to do about too much time between pitches too many pitching changes lineup changes there's even a debate about you know should should defensive shifts somehow be limited because that sort of reduces some of the excitement on the field what do you think baseball need to think seriously about rule changes I mean the the one of the rule changes they made that I'm still kind of iffy about was the whole intentional walk rule where you where you when you throw the forefingers up the guy just walks to 1st base you don't even bother throwing the 4 pitches which at times has proven to be an interim heart of the game with a guy throws a wild pitch during an intentional walk guys have scored I've seen where players like Miguel Cabrera have swung and gotten base hits off of an intentional walk and they surprise somebody that takes part of it out of the game I think changing changing things like the number of mound visits for example where it where you can only go to the mound a certain lot of times in a game not just in an inning that's I mean that's negligible is going to take a ton of time out of the game because until run out there or break things up the defensive shifts. Rhino Joe Maddon may not appreciate hearing them trying to get rid of defensive shits considering that is his bread and butter with running pitchers into the outfield for one play and everything I don't know if you really can there's so many things you can do to to slow up the pace of play a lot of it has to just go back to guys being able to put the ball in play and move the game along faster because some of these games go 34 hours but they're $109.00 games and they're exciting some of these games only go one hour and 59 minutes they're $21.00 games but they are and they're flying by because of great pitching I would almost look at it is the caliber of play if that picks up the pace of play even if the Canes are the same length they that's how you get better I mean I mean I heard you mention something about advanced analytics my fb I'm not big I was never big into it initially but I get it and my favorite advance analytic is the one where it's batting average on balls in play I love that one because it's such a tip it tells you how good of a hitter a guy is even if he doesn't get on base he's going to put the ball in play he's a good hitter Miguel Cabrera was good at this that the Martinez was good at this I don't Mike Trout was very good is very good at this if you're able to get the ball in play it it's aids up to 8 speeds up the game the perception of it being faster and it also lends to it but this is the idea that you're never going to take a lot of those elements out of the game without completely radically changing changing and making it look weird like putting a pitch clock a shot clock on a pitcher things like that it's about helping the actual game get better that these guys need to be better hitters or these pitchers need to figure out what to do before I'm trying to impose limits on shifts I don't mind the defensive shift because sometimes guys beat the shift and find ways around it it's just about letting players get better on the field and that will help the game speed up far more than changing the rules let's go to a caller Let's go to memory She's calling from Oklahoma City Oklahoma go ahead memory good to have you. Thanks for taking my call Hi Anthony I was just talking or you guys mentioned earlier about the cost of Little League and I was also going to talk about the h. I have a 12 year old player and we do travel and when we do that we're paying you know $100.00 a month to a team we're paying for expenses to travel and tournaments and you know $2.00 to $3.00 different uniforms for them to play with and then on top of that you add in $60.00 an hour so that they can be you know the top pitcher the top swing you know have the best swing. And it gets it gets so much it pushes a kid out of baseball but yet if you don't play baseball like that bike my 9 year old went to soccer for 3 years after playing baseball when he was 6 when he won decided hey I want to pick up in the fall and play a spring sport we couldn't find a team for him to play with because Ohio guess what he's too old now and hasn't played long enough he's not good enough at his age and you get a lot of coaches that want to take these kids to you know Little League World Series. You know where even if their hometown baseball they still it's about the win and less about the play and I think we're pushing kids out of the enjoyment of baseball boy well that's a big one Chris sign I mean listening to memory there. Give me your response to that because no doubt youth sports is sometimes treated so seriously and I'm wondering how that affects overall interest in the sport so one of the things that Rob Manfred likes to hang his hat on that that baseball is in a good place is this is like a season that mission or major league the commissioner of baseball Yes So he cites a study from the sports and fitness industry association that says 14700000 people played baseball at least one time the latest year for the study was 2016 that's the year over year. He's for 3 consecutive years so he really likes to tout that number and says baseball's on really good footing you know we have such a large fan base of people playing the game young people playing the game but if you delve a little deeper into the numbers you'll notice that 4500000 of those people play the game between the ages of 6 and 12 if you go one year later and break the age group into 13 through 17 that 4500000 shrinks to 2500000 so between 12 and 13. People are kids are leaving the game and I think it's exactly for these reasons because it becomes a case of specialization it becomes a case of you know travel ball expensive a lot of time all those reasons are chasing kids out of the game now baseball will say that if a kid even plays it once between you know the ages of $6.12 that's good you know that's good for his prospects of being a fan later in life but if you're losing kids from that 12 to 13 year old range how much are you really going to answer. That's a problem that's a real problem j. Scott Smith We literally have 30 seconds left I want to get these last 30 seconds to you and talk to us as a baseball fan what are you excited about for the 2nd half of the season what are you watching kind of watching to see where this goes in the American League East with the Red Sox and Yankees it would be interesting to see what the Astros do do they have do they can they continue this pace in the 2nd half and also looking at a team like Seattle for example which is kind of they've become that they've almost taken Detroit's place in kind of raising up in the league I want to see how the American League shakes out the National League who knows you know it's hard it's hard to figure for you between the Dodgers getting Manny Machado but that's another conversation are right listen j. Scott Smith reporter with Grio I really appreciate your time today thanks so much thank you and John Taylor baseball writer for Sports Oh sorry no Chris great sports and weather going to Fry's reporter for The Minneapolis Star Tribune Chris Sign thing. You so much thank you have that I also want to say thanks to John Taylor who joined us at the top of the hour closers thank you for your calls keep the conversation going I mean I mean Brooks this is on point. On point is a production of w p u r Boston and n p r. Support for on point comes from the listeners of w.b. You are Boston and your n.p.r. Station from the n n Berg foundation committed to supporting educating and engaging communities in the United States and globally for more than 25 years learn more at Annenberg Foundation dot org And the National Endowment for the Arts the federal agency that supports the arts and creativity in communities across the nation more information is available at Art's dot com. 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