>> we cannot sacrifice our safety to the murderous greed of drug cartel. >> arizona's crackdown on illegal immigrants forced washington to act on illegal reform. that with the "roundtable" h-george will, paul krugman, former fox business news vice president alexis glick and cynthia tucker from the atlanta journal constitution. and as always, the "sunday funnies." p president obama had to cancel his trip to poleland. this morning he said he hopes the volcano stops smoking soon and the volcano said the same thing about him. from the heart of the nation's capital, "this week" with abc's white house correspondent jake tapper live from the newseum on pennsylvania avenue. good morning, everyone. tomorrow the senate is scheduled to hold its first vote on the biggest overhaul on the decades on the financial system, changes that could impact your savings your pension maybe even your job. this, as a big wall street investment bank comes under attack tuesday. goldman sachs who is already facing accuseizations of fraud. will testify whether they provitied from the housing crash at the expense of its clients. three key players with me here is austan goolsbee from president obama's council of economic advisers, bob corker and cincinnati, democratic senator sherrod brown p. both key members of the senate banking committee. gentlemen, welcome. >> good morning, good to be with you. >> before we start with wall street reform i want to talk about goldman sachs e-mails that have been released. that seem to show executives rejoicing as the housing market crashed. in fact contradict the impression given by goldman sachs that they lost money as mort gauge-related crash hand. and lloyd blankfein wrote. of course we didn't dodge the mortgage mess we lost money then made more money because of shorts. senator brown what do these e-mails signify to you? >> these signify there's all kind of conflicts of interest on wall street. that wall street is working for its clients and working against its clients in the same sort of bundle toxic securities. that's why we need really strong reform that will separate the proprietary trading from banking functions. that says it more arctic u larly and forcefully, that example than anything we've seen so far. >> senator corker, this is like pro pry temporary trading, where they use their own money, that should not be in the same as trading for commercial banking for clients that there is an in-bread conflict of interest there. >> well, i can understand the sentiment. i know that certain of the e-mails do not read well. i look forward to seeing what the s.e.c. investigation brings forth and the senate investigation, to this sub committee brings forth. at the end of the day, some of that has to do with making markets. i'm in no way defending sort of the attitude expressed in the e-mails. i think we're better off waiting to see exactly what is taking place. i think at the end of the day, instruments are set up on wall street. people take either side of it. there are some conflicts of interest that can exist, and do need to be looked at, but i'd rather wait and see how this investigation unfolds before making any judgments. >> austan is there anything in the legislation that democrats are pushing that president obama wants to pass? is there anything that would have presented what goldman sachs is accused of having committed? >> you know, i don't know the exact details but there are a number of things that go directly at the heart of some of these issues that are raised in these cases like with securitizations, people who originate securities maintain ownership, so that if they pack it full of things that fail, they, themselves are going to lose money when they do it. i certainly am not going to comment on independent, you know, regulatory investigations, but these e-mails that are released there, the ceo of goldman is not going to win any popularity contests over a period that ordinary americans, pensions, houses, et cetera, were collapsing at value. they were actually making significant money off of it. if that's true, i think senator brown's point that we got to end the conflicts of interest, and that the vocal rule is on point on that, i think is also highly relevant. >> senator corker, the status much the wall street reform bill. right now members of the senate banking committee are negotiating. tomorrow senate majority leader harry reid is scheduled to bring it up for a vote. do you think there's a compromise before that happens and if not, are all 41 republican has going to stand against preceding to a debate? >> first of all, everybody know, sherrod know, i want to see a bill. i think we do need to address regulation in our financial markets. it's in play right now. the fact is that i know shelby and dodd are actually on another program this morning. after that program i know they continue meeting, hopefully getting to a compress mice before tomorrow evening. i think what we need to do is have a template. we don't need to address every issue in this compromise. one that deal was derivatives, one that deals with consumer protection and one that deals with orderly liquidation. if we get that agreed to in a bipartisan way. we can debate amendments that sherrod brown wants to bring forth, some that i want to bring forth. i think it's very important that we reach that bipartisan agreement first. in the senate, as you know, it takes 60 votes to change anything. this is something, by the way, that fun has committed to try to do, and that is to have this bipartisan agreement before it goes to the floor. i think it's important that we do so. >> so if there is no bipartisan agreement, republicans will block the motion to proceed to debating this bill? >> i think that is very likely, i do want to say that we voted this bill, 1336 pages. we voted it out of committee in 21 minutes with no amendments with the understanding that before the bill came to the floor we reached this bipartisan agreement. again, we want to see what was stated honored. i know sherrod brown and austan both know i want to see a bill. i think having this template done is very, very important. it's very likely, i think it's almost a given that we f we don't reach that bipartisan agreement that republicans will want to put in place something that allows those negotiations to keep going for a while until we do that. yes, 41 republicans, in my opinion would block it, unless we reach this agreement which we've all stated needs to occur. >> senator brown, let me ask you a question about the legislation itself. i have a copy of it here. it says right at the top of the bill, the purpose is to promote financial stability of the united states by improving accountability and transparency in the financial system to end "too big to fail" and for other purposes. senator brown, does it bill end "too big to fail"? >> yeah, it does. it can do it better, and senator corker was part of the negotiations to deal with the resolution authority, but i also think we need -- >> let me just interject. resolution authority for the federal government to come in and if there's a failing financial system to take over and lick dade that. i'm sorry, go on. >> let me go back to something bob just said and i'll answer the question specifically. washington street people said, the longer they can delay this, the more chance they can kill it. i don't want to see it delayed. we've been -- two years ago was the bear stearns problem, ever since then senator dodd put out a working draft. then put teams together including senator corker and warner and greg and others and senator dodd and shelby. and senator jack reed was part of that too. so this -- we've been working on this for a long time. i hope that tomorrow night when we have a vote, all we're asking tomorrow night is 60 votes, we need a republican or two or three to say let's move forward in debate. then bob corker and others can offer any kind of amendments we want. i hope they will not -- put it this way, i wish there were more bob corkers in the senate republican caucus, he's been very open with negotiations and senator shelby and senator minority leader mcconnell pulled them back, i think on behalf of wall street lobbyists. put that aside. in terms of too big to fail, we do have this resolution authority, it's well done. written by senator corker and dodd and others, bipartisanly. i think we need to do more to prevent too big. too big to fail is too big. my amendment that senator kaufman and i are offering next week or the week after will basically say that we'll put limits on the size of these banks. let me give you one statistic if i could. 15 years ago, the assets of the sixth largest banks in this country, totalled 17% of gdp. 17% of gdp. assets of the sixth largest banks today total 63% of gdp. that's two -- we got to deal with risk to be sure. but we've got to deal with the size of these banks. if one of these is in serious trouble, it will have such a ripple effect in the whole economy. we simply can't let them get this big and have this kind of economic power over main street over a small business in canton, ohio, or a manufacturing plant in dayton. i mean, we just can't let this happen. >> austan, senator brown will introduce an amendment to cap the amount a bank can borrow. 2% of gdpp. gross domestic product. wouldn't that actually stop "too big to fail" by preventing them from getting too big? whyn't isn't the president behind that? >> he's committed that we'll end the "too big to fail" end the bailout that began under the last president for good. that's not going to happen anymore. we're open to negotiating details, obviously as we're starting to get into it, they're complicated. some of these financial risks more like worms where you can chop them in half, it doesn't kill them, it just give us two different worms. the bear stearns, aig, they weren't the biggest, they were the most danger ougs. we got to come at this from every side. we're open to looking at ending "too big to fail" on the size angle, what investment they're allowed to take. looking at derivative components so aig can't threaten to blow up the whole world because they have some $600 trillion pool of derivatives that we know virtually nothing about that are in the dark. all of that ends when we sign this bill. if you look at the bill an stalk a step back. i don't know much about the legislative strategies that are going on in the senate, they are important, i do know that the president has laid out what this bill does, as we're going to end bailouts, we're going to hold accountable the people that get into the messes. so if they get in trouble, they fail. all we're going to do is pay funeral expenses and we'll have the strongest consumer protections ever in this country. >> let me stop you right there. you said we'll hold accountable the people that get us into the mess es. senator corker, i think one of the problems a lot of american people have with bailouts and with legislation, they feel after these firms fail or are propped up by the u.s. taxpayer, they take billions of taxpayer dollars, then ceos and board members drive off in their as ton martins to their $20 million houses in the hamptons with $5 million in the bank. no accountability whatsoever. is there anything in the bill that provides personal accountability for these ceos? >> before i answer that, let me refer back to something senator brown said. nobody pull immediate back from negotiations. the fact is that senator dodd, and he said this publicly, left me at the altar, and the reason was, as we negotiated, democrats were being lost and i think he wanted to get the bill out of the committee on a party line vote. he stated that publicly, so nobody pulled me back. i'm my own person. i want to get a good bill here. but back to the question you're asking, there's no question. i think that, first of all, i plan to offer changes to this resolution authority that say that if a large entity like this has to go through this resolution, where, in essence, they're liquidated in an orderly way, i think that everything that the executive team and the board members have earned through this company, over the last five years, needs to be clawed back. in other words there needs to be some penalties assessed to the management that have caused the country to have to go through this orderly liquidation process. absolutely, i will be offering an amendment that deal was that, so that we're taking back, we're clawing back all of the earnings that management has made out of this firm, if it has to go through orderly liquidation. i think that's very appropriate and certainly i'm going to do that on the floor if it doesn't make it in the base bill. >> i think the white house gets behind that? >> in the bill now, the president went to cooper union this last week to revisit the spot where more than two years ago he went and said we need to have fundamental reform. >> there's nothing back in this bill? >> there's a requirement they're all fired. if you get to that point they're all fired. >> take $500 million to their home in the hamptons? >> as i said, on any details we're open to looking at negotiating the details how we carry out the president's principles. but if negotiation and senator corker, to his credit, is not in this camp, but if the negotiators are going to come forward more as a delaying tactic and we'll just put in hundreds of amendments and try to keep this going, so as to stall, delay and kill reform, that's not going to happen. this is going to pass. >> one of the big -- let me just move on to another subject if i could. but we will get back to senator corker. one of the big debates going on within the democratic caucus, how strong the derivative legislation should be, derivatives are these risky bets that big money men and women make on whether or not an industry will rise and fall in value, and it's a way that has a lot of risk. senator brown, you are in favor of senator lincoln's provision, she wants to say, if you are a bank and you have federally insured money, you have to separate these derivatives, trad traders, it's too risky what they do. we should in the have connection with taxpayer-sured money. do you think the democrats will put that in the bill? if not, why not? >> i hope so. this goes back to your first question on the conflicts of interest of wall street. you really can't serve two masters. you can't serve your clients and serve yourself and play these transactions one off against another. i think these -- anything we do in this bill, whether it's consumer protection, stand alone. i hope that the consumer protection agency, whether it's regulation derivatives, whether too big to fail. whether the rule celebrating out proprietary trading, from standard banking practices, any of those conflicts of interest we have to address in this bill, and i think senator and her draft in the agriculture committee we voted out. we got one republican supported it. senator grassley did. i think that's a good sign. that means there will be a number of republicans that are open mined like senator corker that want to move forward monday night. let us begin the debate. the monday vote, are we going to start the debate or shut it down and continue negotiating, negotiating, negotiating. to me the legislative process, put a bill on the floor. bob corker offers an amendment that i like that he just mentioned, in terms what you do with the executives that brought us there. i offer my amendment on too big to fail means too big. dozens of other amendments will be offered. we'll see what happens and we vote a bill. >> austan can you get behind senator lincoln's provision separating trading with banks that have federally insured profits? >> three years ago, virtually no one in america heard of derivatives, if they had, they had nightmares of their college math class or something. the fact is that there are now $600 trillion of derivatives that are trading in the dark that we know virtually nothing about and are unregulated, and it's not a party that's taking place on washington street that has no impact on america, they are exactly the things that threaten to blow up the entire financial system ig. so the president's completely commit thad we're going to bring the $600 trillion out into the open, and under the regulatory umbrella. now, i think it was -- we made great progress that in both the dodd and lincolns versions of what would happen with derivatives, we purged a bunch of loopholes that some of the banks had gotten put into the bills before. the president is not going to allow putting loopholes in, that let these $600 trillion get back not dark and threaten the whole system. we can work on -- so the -- >> you guys don't support separating this, though, right? >> look, there are several very technical aspects of difference between the lincoln bill and dodd bill. >> not really that technical, whether or not -- it's whether or not commercial banks should be able to do this. senator corker, i hear you giggling, you think senator lincoln's provision goes a little too far, right? senator corker? >> are you talking to corker? >> yes, senator corker. >> i think what austan is saying he doesn't support it. i don't either. let me say this. i want to see as much traded through clearing houses as possible. py absolutely agree that that needs to occur. we don't want to force those things that are not liquid to be traded on a clearing house. but i'm on the side of let's get as much possible. the fact is, that senator brown is in a state where a lot of manufacturing takes place. i'm in a state where a lot of manufacturing takes place. and what people don't -- i think appreciate so much is that all of these tools, are used for capital formation, they help companies hedge their rest. they help companies create capital. i think if we start drawing lines in the sand where we take these tool as way, what we really do is hamper companies' ability to access capital. so i don't think separation is appropriate. i do think clearing as much as possible so that on a daily basis, if somebody is money bad, they have to put money up to be money good or neutral so we don't end up in the situation we have with aig. i think it hampers our ability again to create great companies if we just create an absolute celebration. >> unfortunately that's all of the time we have. it was a great debate. i thank you, senator corker, in chattanooga. senator goolsbee for joining us in the studio. look how "saturday night live" pitches wall street. >> i pointed out what they're doing is wrong and illegal and that they were all going to spend eternity in hell. but in the end. they just weren't on board. ultimately, i think, their opposition to reform comes down to the fact that they really, really like the way they do things now. >> and we're joined now by our "roundtable" as always. george will, cynthia tucker. paul krugman of "the new york times" and alexis glick former vice president at fox business news thank you all for joining us, george, does this calculation end "too big to fail? >> no, that's not the problem. we all sympathize with sherrod brown and senator cochran's idea. the problem is it's not skate but connectedness. what people are arguing about is whether or not they accurately located risks to the entire system. this is an unusual argument. usuallily in washington when there's controversy about a bill, the two sides agree what the bill does and not whether ought to be done. in this case, there's an argument wlornt the bill will actually do what it set out to do. both sides want to guarantee the obliteration of certain kinds of failed firms. they want management to go and shareholder equity to disappear. it's a competition to see who is most beastly to the bad companies. the question whether or not this happens. >> it's unclear if there's a bipartisan compromise. you heard senator cork ran say the negotiations should continue. you don't have a lot of faith in that. >> no, the democrats don't either for good reason. we saw this tactic used with health care reform, when max baucus was given months to negotiate with republicans. at the end of the day there wasn't a single senate republican voting for health care reform. mitch mcconnell came out a few weeks ago and said let's start over with this financial reform bill. that was the very same tactic used with health care reform. democrats need to be leery of this idea of negotiate, negotiate, negotiate. it gives lobbyists time to lobby more. give more campaign distributions and gives republicans time by mischaracterizing the bill. i think chris dodd is very leery. >> can i make a comment on the campaign distributicontribution. on this cycle. the finance, insurance and real estate sector is giving much more to democrats. do you think the party is to close to wall street? >> it has in the past. no question the late '90s, the clinton team in some of whom are now in the administration were way too close to wall street. they believed these were wise men who knew what they were doing. it's party in power. they're gaiting a lot of contributions. that's not surprising. anybody says we should be bipartisan. should keep in mind mitch mcconnell has been trying to stop reform with the most dishonest argument made in the history of politics which is claim having regulation of the banks is bailing out the banks. if the argument boils down to saying what we need to do with fires is abolish the fire department. it's incredible. bipartisan, doesn't include the senate minority leader. but, you know, i agree with george, actually, believe it or not. too big to fail per se is not the problem. the great depression was made possible by the failure of the bank of the united states which despite its name was a bronze-based institution a 28th largest institution at the time yet brought the whole system down. what we are get anything this bill is a way to have graceful failure of big institutions. we know how to deal with small banks. fdic seized seven banks on the verge of failing and liquidated them gracefully but we don't have a way of dealing with complex what we call shadow banking institutions like lehman or citigroup. what we've been doing is what we've done routinely for small ones. doesn't end toot big but may end fail big. >> alexis, you've worked in business, done trading in goldman sachs and morgan stanley. what do you think of the regulation bill. do you think derivative, monitoring and separation senator lincoln is trying to do, do you think that goes too far? >> bottom line. look at the derivative equation, do we need transparency? should there be a central clearing facility? absolutely. it is without a doubt the wild west. without the shadow banking market. that black market. we've not been able to see who son the other side of that transaction. i do believe it's going too far to say that large financial institutions cannot have a derivative business. believe you, me, i don't want to see one american deposit in this country used as a tool to go out on a proprietary basis to go out in trade derivative. i don't like that. go back to "too big to fail" to pick up what you said. the fdic has done a financial job. no depositor has not lost a dime. they've wound down financial is institutions in a smart and effective way. the question is -- >> the ability of the government to step in and wind down a financial institution that's failing. >> good job. the question here is all of those ear institutions who have a financial arm, as we talked about earlier, it's the gm situations where they have a finance arm, it's the ge capitals of the world. where do these guys fit into this equation when they may be in the manufacturing business or other business? >> that's what worries republicans, they think this is a thin end of the enormous wedge getting the government deeper into treating capital and credit in this country as public utility to be priced and allocated in washington which is inevitably a recipe for something like crony capitalism. you have slippery, but open texture definitions. nonbank financial institutions. well, gmac gets general motors brought under t.a.r.p. and ge capital would get all of general electric trick, or would it? would it be a segment of general electric brought under this bill? >> yet there's no alternative. if we protect banks in traditional sense. you're missing 60% of the modern banking system. the fact of the matter there are lots of things, money market funds, repo. things have functionally play the same role as bank deposits that can destabilize the economy the same way as bank deposits, we have to bring those under the umbrella. quibble with details but something like this has to be done. >> let me interject. we'll take a quick break. when we come back the "roundtable" will take down the issue of arizona immigrants. and later the "sunday funnies.." >> send our troops to iraq. wants more oil drilling. rush limbaugh said he got a republican president, you got one. however you picture your retirement, pacific life can help... using 401k savings, life insurance, and annuities to provide a dependable income for the rest of your life. with more than 140 years of experience, pacific life can help you achieve your vision of the future. ask your financial professional about pacific life... the power to help you succeed. 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"reasonable suspicion" that the person is an alien. >> fourth amendment says there should be no unreason house bill searches and seizures, we general rated volumes of case law to sort out what that means over the last century or so. it's not clear ha that means. let me say this. they have an estimated 460,000 illegal immigrants there. so before washington lectures arizona with irresponsibility. washington ought to attend to central attribute of national sovereignty which is to control the borders. we are only developed nation of a 2,000 mile border with undeveloped country and mack number of werth to the north. it's not arizona's state. be yond that, this should be said. reasonable suspicion will put on the police of arizona a terribly difficult job. this is what the governor said. we must enforce the law evenly without regard to skin color, accent or social status. i don't know how do you that. >> how do you do that cynthia. the governor put out a racial order that there should be no racial profiling. you can be sued if you're not doing enough. are convinced you're not doing enough to crack down on illegal immigration. if you're a preliminary, what's reasonable to think somebody might be an illegal immigrant. >> several law enforce. agencies have actually opposed the bill. not only for that reason because they have no idea what it means to say reasonable suspicion p. a california republican has said you can tell an illegal immigrant by the shoes they wear. of course this is an invitation to racial profiling. everyone with a spanish surname, everyone with a certain look, you may or may not be latino. there are people in my family who look as if they could be latino. it harkins back to apartate where all black people in south africa were required to carry documents in order to move from one part of town to another. and let me just say this about arizona's problems with the border, it is absolutely true. that arizona has problems with the border. a rancher was killed apparently by drug smugglers. but this has absolutely no bearing on that problem. all it does is open the doors for harassment of citizens. >> let's you talk about that rancher for a second. his name was robert krantz killed in march. >> you cannot allow a border in our country to akin to that of pakistan. it's simply intolerable. not just for rob krentz or the krentz family but the entire country. >> doesn't he have a point? this is federal failure at the border. >> we've never put in enough money, what it comes down to to enforce border patrol. it's not a deep issue, a question of resources. people are willing to be talk tough about it but not willing to do reasonable stuff in terms of enforcement. it's going to be a problem. what i want to go back to here, not just apar tide issue, we have alleged authoritarian tendencies that we have some kind of -- inside the obama/hitler stuff that government is encroaching in our lives, we have pretty much the same people demanding we have a system that turns into a apocryphal regimes where the police are saying hand over your papers, a world you have to prove who you are. it will be racial profiling but who knows what else. some people tell me i look like the president of brazil. i might be pauled over when i'm on my morning walk. >> you're much better looking than the president of brazil. it's interesting, you are not the first to say i want to see your papers. cardinal mahoney saying, american people are fair-minded and respectful. i can't imagine air zonens now reverts to german zazi and russian communist policies. now we have them talking about immigration reform. we thought it was dead an not brought up. we not it was a big issue in washington. >> at first glance people say wait a second. we're trying to tackle too much too quickly. bottom line, if this is a bill that will be the catalyst, what happens in this arizona is the thing that gets people moving in washington, d.c. to address things like the border, then so be it. i saw senator lindsey graham came out and said way a second i'm working and not going to show up on the conference on cap and afraid. it's first before we address climate change, before we address immigration. bottom line. we have to address immigration. 11 million immigrants. we have an unemployment rate at 26, 27-year high. we have to address citizens and what they take of the piece of the pie. what they should get in addition to what taxes they should get. what services they're going to be offered. this is an issue that has been plaguing us. we have to address it. >> again in defense of arizona, large majority of arizona support this bill. large majority of arizonas are them pratt decent people with a huge problem. what the arizona law does is make a state crime out of something that is already a crime. a federal crime. the arizona police and i've spent time with the phoenix police department. they are not bad people, they are professionals used to making the kind of difficult judgments. suspicion of intoxicated driving, all kinds of judgments are constantly made by policeman i wouldn't despair their ability to do this. >> we should point out some organizations do support it. it's interesting, president obama had this to say on the north lawn of the white house, or, i'm sorry, the rose garden of the white house the other day even before the law pass was passed. >> i've instructed members of my administration to monitor the situation and rights of this legislation. if we continue to fail to act at a federal level we continue to see misguided efforts opening up around the country. >> obviously that's a call for immigration reform. in addition, is he ask the justice department to look into whether or not they should block the law? >> i think they are looking -- first of all, i think the justice department lawyers and civil rights division probably spent the weekend figuring out what they can do looking at the bill itself. trying to figure out where there might be civil rights violations, and reasonable search and seizure is one place for them to look. but the justice department doesn't have to do anything. there will be other organizations that have already said that they are planning lawsuits against that. so it will be in court shortly. let me say this about immigration reform, though. if we thought health care reform was devicive, this is going to be an all-out battle. and will even create fissures in the democratic party. that's why speaker pelosi said we will act but only in the senate acts first. >> she's no fool. the senate -- president obama has been saying -- pointing out there are 11 republican senators who supported immigration reform in 2007 when it failed and suggests they need to support it now. i don't think they'll support it, though. >> this is one of the issues that cuts through the middle of both parties. democrats, on the one hand democrats sent to be pro labor, which means they are worried about immigration, on the other hand they tend to be -- it is a party that now gets most of the hispanic votes. democrats are divided. many divided within their own hearts. interesting thing, it's not so much different wings of the party as each individual democrat tens to be torn about this. republicans are divided between the sort of cultural conservative wing that preserve america as the way it is and business wing which likes having inexpensive immigrant labor. this is one heck of an issue. it's deeply divided among both parties which is one reason not to rush it to push the top of the agenda right now. i'm kind of upset at the notion this might push climate change off this year. because we don't do climate change legislation. i'm ready for that one, george. if we don't do that this year we won't do it for quite a few years to come. >> i thought one of the interesting things, senator mccain's stamp on this. someone who talked a lot on the campaign trail who has been very vocal about meeting come pre hence hiv immigration reform. i understand he's running a tight race and battle there. i thought it was very telling, go back to how will this impact mid-term elections. this is about what will happen to that hispanic vote. is this about what you need to do in the short-term election toss get the necessary votes? i thought that was a very telling sign that in the last hours he decided to back it. >> but the problem, my judgment with health care is that we're comprehensive. instead of making bite-sized incremental improvements we're trying do everything at once. because we're all held hostage by the advocacy groups in the country. if we close the border, guarantee we're not going to have serial am necessary tis. >> do what mccain suggests, we'll find the american people are not irrational but want national sovereignty asserted. >> where does the money come from for that? >> on the rounding error on the gm bailout. >> sealing the border would be much more difficult than advocates for that idea suggest. it's a very long border, 2,000 miles. >> we're only talking about the southern border. we're not trying to keep the canadians out? >> they're different from you and me, aye? >> technology doesn't work that we thought we can depend on, doesn't work nearly as well as its advocates suggested either. we're talking about people standing up border guards, knoll guards, army troops on the border. if we want to seal it off. >> sealing borders is a lot harder than you want to imagine. nobodyself able to keep out a fair amount of immigration. the japanese can't. they have a lot of illegal immigrants. >> george's point to you. as i said to you guys before when i sent out a message on twitter. when i said what do you think about immigration reform. a lot of messages people in arizona say they support this bill. they see what's going on on a day-to-day basis. i don't agree with it. but what it does show you more and more states, particularly on the border have to address this on their own if we don't take it up as a bigger issue. >> i want to get to one other state very, very quickly because we only have a couple minutes. that is the next week we'll have a station from the governor of florida charlie crist who is running for senate whether or not he's going to drop out of the race. the latest qui quinnipiac poll e would wohl lap him. but rubio, 30%, meek, 24% h.krist 32%. isn't this his only option? >> no, he can lose honorably. wait two years and run against democrat senator nelson. or a 50-point swing against him. he lost his campaign pp manager, former senator connie mack. he's infuriated by vetoing a reform bill. jeff bush, the most popular politician in the state this. is hairy carrie on the parts of this man. >> this is the narrow are of the republican party m. they've swung hard right. no room for a moderately congress serve tiv politician and charlie crist found that out rather late in the game i might say. >> his politics haven't changed. he always worked across the aisle with democrats. always been moderately conservative, but this shows how much the republican party in florida has changed. it's that hub when president obama came to florida, to talk about the stimulus package, there was that moment in video where they did a man hug, and that is killing charlie crist and the republican party. >> quickly, how much of this is about the stimulus? >> absolutely bingo to me. this is the perfect example for republicans across the country who say, hey, look, i didn't support the stimulus package. look what's happening to a guy who did support it. i think that's going to be a big issue of debate. the second issue is tea party. rubio supported by the tea party. if the republicans want to figure out how to embrace tea party candidates. here's an example. >> the "roundtable" will continue in the green room. check a look at this you can interact with your friends on the new facebook wijsity. see what they have to say. coming up here the "sunday funnies." every heart beat, every breath, every anomaly... from over a thousand pieces of unique information per second. helping doctors find new ways to detect life threatening infections up to 24 hours sooner. on a smarter planet... analyze the data and you can predict what will happen faster. so you can do what they're doing in toronto... and build a smarter hospital. let's build a smarter planet. with safe, reliable cars. that's why we're currently spending over a million dollars an hour to enhance the technology and safety of our vehicles. and we've also made our comprehensive star safety system standard on every vehicle we make. ♪ at toyota, your safety will continue to be a top priority in any and all of our decisions. ♪ it's like hardwiring the market right into my desktop. launch my watchlist -- a popping stock catches my eye. pull up the price chart. see what the analysts say. as ip back, streaming video news confirms what i thought. pull the trigger -- done. i can even do most of this on my smartphone. really, it's incredible. like nothing i've ever experienced. trade free for 60 days on redesigned power e-trade pro. like nothing i've ever experienced. somewhere in america... there's a home by the sea powered by the wind on the plains. there's a hospital where technology has a healing touch. there's a factory giving old industries new life. and there's a train that got a whole city moving again. somewhere in america, the toughest questions are answered every day. because somewhere in america, more than sixty thousand people spend every day answering them. siemens. answers. and now, in memoriam. >> african-american women, are women who seldom do what they want to do, but always do what they have to do. i now declare the games of the 20th century -- this week the pentagon released the names of six soldiers killed in iraq and afghanistan. we'll be right back. i'm ed whitacre, from general motors. a lot of americans didn't agree with giving gm a second chance. quite frankly, i can respect that. we want to make this a company all americans can be proud of again. that's why i'm here to announce we have repaid our government loan, in full, with interest, five years ahead of the original schedule. but there's still more to do. our goal is to exceed every expectation you've set for us. we're putting people back to work, designing, building, and selling the best cars and trucks in the world. with our 100,000-mile, 5-year powertrain warranty to guarantee the quality. and the unmatched life-saving technology of onstar to help keep you safe. from new energy solutions. to the designs of tomorrow. we invite you to take a look at the new gm. tdd# 1-800-345-2550 investment firms wouldn't even dream of overcharging people. tdd# 1-800-345-2550 inact, they'd spend all of their time dreaming up ways tdd# 1-800-345-2550 to give us more for our money. tdd# 1-800-345-2550 i guess i'd just like to see a little more give tdd# 1-800-345-2550 and a little less take, you know? 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