And right now unfortunately, the moderate position is strong in some parts but weak in other parts, for it will take time. But we are, you know, sharing that same goals. But the americans are doing some job, an excellent job. We are doing some job. Maybe in the future we shall evolve. But for the time being we are concentrating on iraq. Rose renzi and fabius next. Funding for charlie rose is provided by the following theres a saying around here you stand behind what you say. Around here, we dont make excuses, we make commitments. And when you cant live up to them, you own up and make it right. Some people think the kind of accountability that thrives on so many streets in this country has gone missing in the places where its needed most. But i know youll still find it, when you know where to look. Rose additional funding provided by and by bloomberg. A provider of multimedia news and Information Services worldwide. Captioning sponsored by Rose Communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. Rose matteo renzi is here, he has been Prime Minister of italy since february 2014. Hes the leader of the democratic party, a center Left Political Party in italy, International Monetary fund said last week italy will remain in recession throughout 2014. The imf report urged renzi to push flew his ambitious reform agenda. Italys structural weakness continues to impede its growth potential. The countrys debt is the second largest in the euro zone, it is predicted to peak at 136 of gdp this year. Italy currently holds the rotating presidency of the council of the european union. Matteo renzi visited Silicon Valley and met with Technology Entrepreneurs before arriving in new york for the United Nations general assembly. Im very pleased to have him at this table for the first time because i love his country. Welcome. Thank you so much. Rose what did you learn from Silicon Valley . I chose Silicon Valley because its the capitol of the future. Its one of the capitol of the future. And our country italy is an incredible capitol of the past so we must change our perception. And we must invest in the future. Silicon valley could be a model, could be a place of aspiration. And i received a strong message from the italian people who stay in Silicon Valley. We cant change the world if you cant change the country, matteo, so i must change the country. And then everybody will change the world. Rose so how are you going to change the country . With a reform is very clear but in every field. Liberal markets, constitutional reforms, fiscal system, terrible, paying italy is particular difficult. And investment in public administration, a fight against corruption, a new system of justice. So for everything we have project, very concrete, with the procedure in parliament. And i think with this reforms, we must absolutely give to italy the position of the past, the leadership. Italys leader. Not follower. In the last period we lost few times an opportunitiment now is the time to change. Rose you had the Business Community behind you. Do you still . My Business Community, the Business Community is an incredible asset for the future of country, if finally we invest in opening markets in italy. Because in the past, you know, the Business Community are very close. And the flag, but its not important the passport of entrepreneur. Its important the quality of project, the quality of projects. So the Business Community must invest in the made in italy. Made in italy means a few things. Wine, food, culture. But also quality of engineering. Ability to innovation, investment in technology. The renaissance today is in the new investors in Silicon Valley or if boston than in italy. We must come back to invent and to change. Rose so you can bring a Silicon Valley to italy in your judgement . Italys own Silicon Valley. Italy is not simply a Silicon Valley. Italy is a place in which ideas could become projects. Ideas could change the life of the people. But in this moment its impossible if we dont realize the reforms of justice. Today in italy, to have a process, we need three years in the civil court. In u. S. A. You gave germany one year. So we must further reduce the gap. We must absolutely change ourselves. Rose when they say italy desperately needs structural reform, what do they mean . I think first of all italy cuts numbers of politicians and make easy the prospect of politics. Rose you mean election rules and earnings Everything Else . In general f you think in usa there are 500 members of parliament, in italy, 1,000. I am very proud of my country. But its impossible to double the members of parliament of the United States. So the reduction of power of politicians is a part of this challenge. Rose politicians do not want to give up power. Politicians have power of veto in this moment, veto block decision. We must come back we must come back to the model in which politicians are not the people who blocked the ideas, but will prevent the future. The role of Politics Around history in hit ree of machiavelli to today is the future, not defend the present. For me this is the structural reforms,. Rose what did burr lus cone do to the image of italy. Burlosconi was Prime Minister for nine years,. Obviously with burlusconi in italy there is the destruction of discussion in politics because a part loved him, a part hate me. The part in my opposition is my enemy in the discussion of politics. But i think we must close the discussion of the past and we must discuss about the future. There is a new generation. Rose but he had a point of business, so did you, leonardo dellveccio, one of the wealthiest by owners in italy f not the wealthiest, he said about you renzi is the best government weve had in ten years. And there are many obstacles to improve. We have a lot of obstacles in this moment. But i think we must absolutely find the solution, not find an i think in italy last 20 years, 50 years, the politicians explained the list of problems. Show every problem but dont solve the problem. So im not sure if i am good or bad government governor. Im sure i must absolutely solve a list of problem presented by the last generation and finally show we are able to change. Rose and what do you need to change italy . What is essential at this moment to get through the reforms you have talked about, creating growth,. We must absolutely create growth to give a number of very an employee for give a possibility for the strategy, for the strategy for the future. But if you ask me what is the things you need to change, first of all, con ken consensus of people, i received a consensus, incredible. 41 last election. The first time after 57 years in italy. My part is around europe. So second, the idea is very clear and very determined. And we have, i dont know, if this is sufficient but this is very important. The third is the courage. I have only one possibility. Give a very strong message, if i solve the problem, i change italy. But if i dont able to solve the problem, i must retire myself from politics. Rose if you cant do it, youll get out. I think if i think we can absolutely obtain the results. Im confident. Rose on foreign policy, theres always been a relationship between between italy and libya. And you have said libya is more important to us than syria. Because there is a collapsing for italy. Rose central government. Its difficult to make ranking of problems around the world. nr obviously its a problem ukraine. Obviously its a problem of sirria. Obviously its a problem iraqment but for me, for my country, the most neighbor with the problem is libya. Libya now is under control. And we must absolutely create the condition to give an open for the libyan people an also for the european people. So for me, yes, this is the first priority. Rose but does a Larger Community have to come together to make sure that happens . Or can the libyan does it on their own . I think libya after the decision to stop the dictator of qaddafi with intervention of nato, a few people believe, okay, mission established. Mission accomplished. Because when you use a very important intervention in an area as libya, you must think also about the future. Not all about the present. This now is difficult but possible. We must, we are the only one country with our embassy open in tripoli in this moment. We were to create the respect of last elections in june 2014, and we reduce the bottle and the fights on the streets. I think libya must be absolutelyo about libya, we must have more attention by the community. I spoke about it yesterday with ban kimoon and im confident italy is ready to make the role, to play a very important role. In libya we are absolute the disposition of the international community. But the international Community Must think libya is not the last problem. Rose many people look at europe and they say they have two great men over there. One is pope francis which im sure you agree with. Pope francis is a great man. This is my personal point of view. Very simply, i met him with my family. And i think he was a man very important for the catholic church, obviously. For the relation with italy and vatican. But also to give a message of hope. Because in this moment, the words of pope francis are words of hope. And if you think, if you ran a newspaper, if you verify media message a few times, the message is not a message of hope. Why francis pope give this opportunity, this words of kindness in the direction of man. This is absolutely new in International Discussion this moment. And for me its absolutely important. That i value, human value of this. Rose a past oral role as well. The other man that many people say have the ling of gateness is mario dragi am when they look at the euro zone they think he saved it. I think mario is a good man, very able to lead European Central bank, unfortunately European Central bank is not fed lal reserve, the power. Rose is not the Federal Reserve. Is not the Federal Reserve but the power, the role, the relation is different s the modality o of but draggee obtained a few important results. I think the role of him for euro is absolutely a good role. And i think really its a great man for the job. Rose how will we measure whether matteo renzi succeeds. In the next two years italy will be more open, smarter and simpler. This is the message we warn about. Because this happening, we must absolutely, dont waste nothing. Nothing a day. Because we must absolutely work stepbystep every day to reduce the po web power of bureaucracy and to give this message of efficiency in our country. Im confident that this could be possible. But we must absolutely dont waste nothing. Dont waste absolutely possible. We cant lose the we can lose the next election but we cant lose now this opportunity. Rose and what dow say, finally to the italian people they must do in in order to restore italys greatness. Come back to be dreamers. Because in the last period, we lost a dream and we make nightmares. We lost the possibility, ability to show ourselves as real men and women able to have a big project. In the last period italy was sad. Was lack of a fissure. And my fourth thing, my fourth message is exactly that. My fellow citizens, we are able to come back to be dreamers, to come back to give the message of equality, call of life an lifestyle and ideals and the cultural and the beauty around the world. But for this we must change. Change is not a bad word. Change in the only way to come back to be dreamers. Rose thank you for coming. Thank you. Rose pleasure to have you here. Thank you. Rose back in a moment. Stay with us. Laurent fabius is here. He is the French Foreign minister. He also served as Prime Minister of france from 1984 to 1986. Hes in new york for the United Nation general assembly. On wednesday an algerianbased jihadi Group Released a video showing the execution of a french tourist. The group claimed solidarity with the Islamic State in iraq and syria, also called dash. Now by people including the foreign minister. France joined the United States air strikes against isis in iraq last friday. It is not yet participated in strikes against the group in syria. Im pleased to have Laurent Fabius back at this table. Welcome. Thank you. Rose let me, as so many people around the world and certainly the United Nations, extend our own sympathy for the loss of this french citizen. Its a terrible day because, you know, he has been not only assassinated but beheaded. It was a terrible cruelty. And these people, of dash. Rose is a term for the Islamic State because you object to using Islamic State. Yes, because they want to be a state but they are not. And they say that they represent islam, but its not true. Rose no islamic leader i know says that they represent them. But you know, they want to have a sort of bloody it could not work, we shall not surrender. Because we are defending freedom. And these people, we cannot accept the way they behave. You know, its a fight not only from france but all of us. And we have to stand. So what does france do with respect to the United States and the other. Rose youre participating in this. We have decided as you said, we have decided in iraq to bring our air support and the iraqi had asked us to do that and we are doing that. We have given weapons. We have given humanitarian aid as well. And. Rose in iraq. In iraq. Rose in syria we are directly helping the moderate position in terms of humanitarian aid n terms of weapons as well. And but the two things are interrelated because this dash group is transnational. And the america has decided with some arab countries to be present in but you know we cannot do anything. And for the time being we are concentrating on iraq. Rose i dont understand why you cant do air strikes into syria. You dont understand . Why . No, we could, we come obviously we could. Rose why do you refuse to. We didnt refuse. We dont want to do everything. An our view is that okay, we are supporting what the americans are doing. But we have to Pay Attention because dash has to be fought, okay. But the problem in syria is that it must not you used by bash ar alassad in order to gain ground. And therefore, and right now, unfortunately, the moderate position is strong in some parts but weak in other parts. For it will take time. But we are, you know, sharing the same goals. But the americans are doing some jobs, an excellent job. We are doing some job. Maybe in the future we shall evolve but for the time being we are concentrating on iraq. Rose i still dont understand why theres a difference. Because the its a different story, why . Because you know in iraq we have been asked by the Iraqi Government to support them, in syria its not the same story. Rose because you do not want to be engaged in something that supports the Syrian Government s that the reason . Its obvious. In syria we have not only one, dash. The other one Bashar Alassad, you know that we dont want to support them. By no means. In fact, if you remember bashar is the origin of dash. You know that bashar has liberated prisoners from prison. And they are the leaders of dash. Maybe you know that during years, bashar has not fought dash. And today, i mean today, dash is having a lot of oil and part of this oil is sold to bashar. Therefore we have not only. Rose by dash . Yes, by dash. And it has been decided and its excellent, by u. N. Recently to cut the financing because now people there are maybe states who finance dash. And through oil and through different means. And we have to cut them. But to come back to your main question, we have not only one adversary, we have two. And we have to organize ourselves. I mean u. S. , france, arab countries and the coalition, in order to fit against the two. Rose are you pleased that the americans are using their air power in syria . To attack isis. Its quite okay. And its quite okay. And we have said and i say today that we are supporting them, yes. Rose what is it going to take in terms of quote boots on the ground to dismantle and destroy isis . And is the syrian, are the moderate forces from the Free Syrian Army sufficient. And can they be made sufficient . There is a lesson to draw from the recent past conflict. You cannot win a victory without the people themselves. In iraq, the iraqis. In syria, the syrian, okay. In iraq we think that thanks to our support the iraqi stepbystep would be stronger. And they can beat dash. And we are bringing our air support. In syria its a bit different because as you pointed out the moderate position which has been fought both by bashar and the terrorists is sometimes in a strong position, sometimes in a difficult position. And it will take time in order to get it stronger. Rose can they do it in the end over the long run . Yes. Rose do they have sufficient yes, we shall help them. Rose Ground Forces to do it. We shall help them. Not only us but americans, you know that it has been decided by the americans to give training to give 500 million dollars. Saudi arabia as well, jordan as well, Different Countries as well. We had a meeting today this afternoon with what we call core group, all the people were supporting the syrian army, moderate position. And we have decided to support them. But agree it will take time. And in between we have to strike dash but to avoid that bashar will take advantage of this. Therefore its a bit difficult, you know. And we have to be veryical coordinated. Rose under no circumstances should there be any kind of relationship with Bashar Alassad to defeat dash. No. Bashar is wanting to take advantage. Maybe you have seen that he has a proposal, saying im part and parcel of the collision. But bashar is at the origin of dash and terrorists. Because you know, things are going so quickly that we have forgotten the origin of that. You remember, charlie, that when was it, three years ago, with the socalled arab spring, at the beginning it was maybe ten youngster who were wanting in the countryside in syria to be freer, to be more free. And bashar has reacted in such a way, its unbelievable, that today you have 200,000 people who have been killed. Rose an refugees. And refugees. And is a dictator. You remember the chemical weaponment and some people say that today is still using chemical weapons. Rose a different kind. Yes, different kind. But chemical is chemical. And therefore, by no means we shall support him. By no means. Rose do you believe did isis get money from arab countries . Today, i hope not. Rose but before. I mean are the same countries that are now, this is the charge that president rouhani said to me yesterday. He found it interesting that the countries who had helped build up isis because they were opposed it to Bashar Alassad are now fighting seis is isis, is that true . Well, i think that, well, that there has been financing. It can be states, it can be persons, private. Rose foundations, individuals. Et cetera. What i think is that some people or some states have thought that it was possible, you know to have a sort of agreement which will protect them if they were giving money. But it was completely foolish. Dash, their idea, and its new if you compare them with al qaeda. Al qaeda you know, they were not wanting to have the state. Where these ones, the socalled chall i fate are want chalifate are wantsing to have a state, syria, iraq, jrd an, palestine. And if they are that, afterward t will be saudi arabia, it will be turkey, and then your and then why not u. S. And these people. Rose thats why it is organized t is essential to stop them now with everything you possibly can. We are defending ourselves. I mean all of us. Rose but shouldnt it be all out to do that, everybody in in every way . Yes, yes, yes. And i think that now these persons, these states have understood that themselves were men ayesed by dash. And men ased by dash. And the reason why we have struggled it can seem ridiculous because its legal, but legal aspects are porbts. Now there is a res loution which has been by a unanimous vote saying that the financing that they completely cut and that every single country must take they were seis steps in order to prevent foreign fighters to go there. And under what we call chapter 7 which means that we can react and have sanctions if they dont do it. But my guess is that there has been an evolution. Because all the countries, have understood that these guys were dangerous for everybody. What are the iranians doing . In iraq they have said, we have met president rouhani. And you know that he is close, geographically to iraq. And his shiite and Prime Minister as well. And they said that they were not accepting that dash could take baghdad or irbil. Rose and you fought against that. Yes. And they actually helped the iraq toy prevent that. Now for syria, its different because as you know, they are supporting bashar, hest hest has been present. And on the syrian case we dont agree with them at that point. But what are the idea, at the end of the day we shall have to have a political setting, you know, political agreement. And the idea is to have an agreement between the moderate position and some element of the regime with al bashar. Bashar leaves and in a way, i dont know exactly what will be because you have to have political. Rose in by russia and iran as friends of Bashar Alassad will be part of building some kind of yes. Some kind of agreement in which he will give up the presidency. It was the idea when we signed the geneva one agreement and it is still true. But in between we have to have a strong moderate position, stronger. Rose is america leading this coalition . Yes, they are leading its coalition. And run by the americans. Yes. The next question is ba about france. And we are part and parcel of this coalition, coordination. But you know that we are paying to the autonomy t has always been that way. We are coordinating our efforts and actions with the u. S. And theres no problem. Rose okay. Let me turn to the unga. There is, this is climate week here. And i think in 2014 you are going to chair the climate. Yes, in december of 2015, yes, in paris. Rose what progress is being made . Well, i should say that in terms of practical steps, well, there has been some progress. Maybe not enough. For instance, we have to capitalize what we call green farm because you need money. And there are some countries which have announced some money but not enough. Okay. There have been, there have been a lot of speeches and going all of them in the same direction, saying we have to have an agreement. Because this question of, i dont speak about climate change. I speak about chime at disruption because its complete disruption. And every single and it is not true because in some parts its warming. In some parts its cooler. And in every partss extreme phenomenon. But to answer your question, there have been some practical steps. Most people important thing is that the private sector has decided to invest in the new direction. Thats brandnew. The local government, i mean town, regions, have decided to go in the same direction. And there is very Strong Movement saying that we have to make the decision. Rose a decision to well, to to halt, to stop this complete. Rose carbon in the air. This situation where our world, it will be impossible to live in. And ban kimoon who is really involved in that has a great formula. And i asked to ban, mr. Secretary, can i use it. He said yes. Therefore i use it. There is no plan b because theres no planet b. If we dont do it and do it quickly, because its not a question within 40 years, it is right now. And we are the first generation to be aware of that and the last generation to be able to act. Rose theres a window of opportunity. A window of opportunity and necessity. Rose necessity. Next year my impression is that chyna is better than it has been before in its commitment, are you completely right. There are major shifts, both in u. S. Atsd tude, you know by john kerrey completely obviously it is difficult for them to announce things now because you have the midterm election. But i hope that they will do it at the beginning of next year. And as chinese are concerned, they are fully aware. Its not a question of international pressure, its a question for them, for their own lives. Last time i was in beijing the same in paris we decided to have alternate traffic because the pollution was ten more than the average. But the same day in beijing it was 10 more. It was 18 times the norm. And people couldnt breathe in the street. And children couldnt go to school. Therefore its an absolute necessity. Its very difficult for chinese because its a complete shift in their economy and they need growth. But the new element you are saying is that now people understand that its not only constraint, it can be an opportunity which is offered. Green growth, creation of jobs. Its a new big thing. And particularly for big business. Rose where is the resistance . What stands in the way of something that clearly threatens the plan snet. The resistance is that many people think that a decision will have to be taken within 50 years. No way. It has to be taken now. The resistance is that all of us are conservative. We are all conservative. And its difficult to change our habit. We have to do it. But once more, no plan b, no plan b. At the beginning i was not a of this. But i have known to chair t im serious and therefore i can tell you, charlie, that really its the question, its a big question. And we have to do it. Rose i want to come to the Nuclear Talks with iran which are you also a part of. But ebola is a loominging it seems to get worse and more threatening and more scary. Yes. Unfortunately thats true especially in three countries, as far as france is concerned, we are concerned about guinea. Weve decided to we are doing what we have to do. But its never enough. And we have a meeting tomorrow in the u. N. And all of us, we have to concentrate on that. But, once we, the epitom epitome epidemic will be stopped. But we have to understand that the basis of it is the weakness of the sanitary systems in those countriesment because when such an epidemy comes and you have no hospitals, no real medicine, no doctors, its a catastrophe. And therefore we have first to stop that. And then to help them to build sanitary systems. Rose is there a scenario in which it could get out of control and be a global threat . That depends on our commitment. And we have to be committed. Rose the Nuclear Talks, you have said that you do not think they can be linked to the fight against dash, isis. They have to be they cannot be connected. Sure, the french president said the iranian president. Rose the iranian president said that to me yesterday as well. Is anyone trying to link them. Are the iranians trying to link them. Are they basically saying if you make an agreement we can live with on nuclear we may change our participation against isis. No, they never said that. Rose theyre not looking for that. They never said that to us. And they never spoke to us about this leverage. And theyre right to do so. Rose why . Because the question of atomic bomb is a question by itself. And you know, its an expression that i have already used. And when i was discussing was my partners about it. I very often use the world in that question of nuclear things, you cannot be half pregnant. Either you get it, or you dont get it. Its not sort of mixed bag. And what is the question. What is the problem. Were saying to the iranian, you have the complete right to have Civil Nuclear energy. Your power, your great civilization, you have the right. But so far as nuclear bomb is concerned, the answer is no. Because its too dangerous in this region, particularly. And we want to avoid any nuclear proliferation. And all the discussion which is very, very technical is to draw the consequences of this. I remember because we have always discussed it that i have asked and then accepted to put at the beginning of the statement. And i remember the words. And there are no circumstances iran will never seek nor possession possess any Nuclear Weapons. This sentence has been pronounced by the supreme world and by mr. Rouhani. I said if it has been pronounced by you, we repeat it. And we have to draw the technical consequence of that. Never seek or possess Nuclear Weapons. We are discussing about iraq. We are discussing about we are discussing about control, in order to implement this principles. If they agree with that, it will be okay. If they dont t will be no. Rose so how do they agree to that . Well there a discussion because they agree with the principles but so far the consequences are drawn. They say well, yes, maybe that we have to be firm. Because once more, you cannot be half pregnant. Rose there are many people who believe that they have not made a decision to seek a nuclear weapon. They just want to be able to be within reach of that if they make a decision. So is that the no the question is to renounce to the perspective. We cannot be halfway. Rose do you believe that you have sufficient economic sanctions to force them to do that . Its economic sanctions are very, very powerful. And though they are saying the yes, its o its very likely because of the economic sanctions that have to be discussed. But we have said that if we find an agreement, they will be lifted. And it will be important for the population. But once more, we wish they could find an agreement. But it depends on their commitment. It has to be clear because its a matter of where you have to be clear. You cannot say maybe, maybe not. Rose and the Supreme Leader said they need 190,000 centrifuges. The sort of figures, no way, no wayment because you know that we are discussing about several hundred or some thousand, you cant discuss things is it 1,000, 2,000 but if its 2,000 compared with 190,000. And if you dont want to have a nuclear bomb, what is the use of getting 190,000 centrifuges. If you raise the question you get the answer. Rose youre negotiating with them. What is their answer . Its not very clear. Rose exactly. Are they transparent . Well, we wish. Rose the aeia the ae. Rose at tomorrowic agency says the question of transparency applies both to the past and to the future. To the future obviously because we have to check. And not ourselves, i mean the agency. And for the past, because we want to be sure that in the past of all that has been done, because we dont want to but once more we hope any reasonable people hopes that we can find an agreement. But it has to be a solid agreement. It cannot be sort of, you know. Rose its president of the United States has said an reconfirmed numerous times as has his Vice President that its unacceptable for iran to have Nuclear Weapons. And has said that they will not allow it. Which means that if, in fact, theyre close to getting them, they will launch a mill father attack. Does the french Government Support that . Its what we call the breakout period. What does it mean . It means that imagine that we have an agreement, okay. Its great. But imagine too, that the agreement will not be implemented. It can happen. And therefore the breakout time must be sufficient for the partners to react. And obviously the reaction would be a tough one. Yes. Rose but we are trying to get an agreement. Rose do you support 9 u. S. Decision. We support the fact that. Rose to prevent them from making Nuclear Weapons is there any breakout. We do not want any Nuclear Weapons, thats clear, thats clear. You ought to be a partner in the negotiations. Rose let me move to two places, one ukraine and then libya. Ukraine. There are lots of economic relationships with russia in europe. Will they impede a very strong reaction against putin if he tries to move on eastern ukraine. They will not impede. We have already taken sanctions, you know that. Well, its true that sanctions is not good. Neither for and the same for you. But know the problem is that we at the same time we have to be firm because we cannot accept a country, whatever it is, would make an annexation of a region. We cannot accept that. And you have to react. You seem to be accepting it. We are not accepting. We shall not go to war with russia. We have said. We have to take sanctions, on the other hand we have to have a dialogue. And germany and france in particular have organized a possible dialogue. But and today we have a ceasefire at the end of october. We shall have elections. And what is our idea. Well, ukraine has to be a free country w good relations with russia. And good relation with eu. Well, the way it must be. If the russians, direct or indirectly are exerting the pressure, more than the pressure, we have to react it is a pressure of europe and security. But at the same time we have to keep open a question of diplomacy the ways an means in order to have a dialogue am we are there. I cannot say that i done know what exactly is in the head of mr. Putin. I know that we are trying to have a dialogue but there are things that we cannot accept. Libya. Uhhuh. Its a mess. Libya its a mess, yes. Thats a real determine. Its a mess. And what can we do, tomorrow we shall have a meeting in u. N. What is the idea . You have intact fact two problems. The first one is that you have two parliaments, two governments, a different and we have to try and have a unite. And a new person has been appointed, mr. In order to favor these. Because you cannot have two governments, two parliaments. Thats one point. But it implies that other countries will not intervene, giving weapons, giving money. And we are back to the dash problem. Okay. Nasss the first one. The second one which is different is that in the thousand part of libya, you have a member of terrorist groups which were not affiliated to the two other ones. And which are very dangerous by themselves. And they have relationship with boko haram in nigeria, with different terrorists. In sahar. And so therefore we have to deal with government and parliament in order to have a normal state. But i would hope that we shall do telephone. But we have to deal with the terrorist groups because there are a lot of weapons in libya. Its a rich country. And its not a state. Its not a state. All right, or its failed state. It a failed state. Well, it has never been a state. Its a sort of a so does that mean no, i draw a lesson from that. You remember, charlie, that we have intervened in some other country. You lead the intervention. Yes. We are in deposition but we said, okay. And i dont regret it. But what i regret is that there has been no followup afterwards. My understanding is that some times its necessary to intervene. But its not enough. And you have to insurance the followup, political. And its the same for what i was saying for syria and for iraq. Its not well, maybe its necessary to send bombs, okay. But afterwards, and therefore the lack of followup, the political and rel followup has been a great mistake. Why did it happen . Or why did it fail . I dont know. I dont know but maybe it was an illusion to think that it was enough to kill mr. Qaddafi and that everyone will be okay. No, no, thats not the way it goes. Rose two last questions, did anything come out of the meeting with the president today that he chaired with respect to fighting isis . Didnt the president today u. S. President didnt he in a sense lead some conversations about what to do at the United Nations . Yes, today it was conversation. Because the u. S. Are chairing the security council. And there was a meeting. Rose the president was president. Yes, he was present. And the question was how do fight foreign fighters. And he chaired this meeting. Rose and what came out of that . A resolution, unanimous resolution which is excellent saying that every single country under chapter 7 must take legal elements, in order to prevent nationals to go in syria and so on. And that we have to cut the financing. And that it will be country under chapter 7. These are elements. Rose you know how much i like your country. Yes, i know that. Rose and its been good to me as well. So it is a mutual thing. The politics, this week Nicholas Sarkozy says hes coming back am he wants to run for president. His country needs him. For the time being he didnt say that. I was here. He said that he wanted to run for the presidency of the conservative party. I agree that there must be some relation between the two. Rose what happened to, i mean here youre a Ranking Member of the socialist party. Why is your party and your president so in disfavour with your people . Well, i think the main reason is that as you know in europe the situation is not good. No growth. And particularly in france. We are doing reforms. But i think you are right. But reforms when there is n no are difficult. But has the president changed. Has he made a socialist president said we have to be din than i imagined . Has he changed his attitude about what is necessary to put france on the right course . I dont know if he has changed but i know because im working on foreign policiment but im working with him s dedicated to deliver the reforms which are. Rose to reform the Economic System. Yes. Not only Economic System but you know, you love france and we have a lot of assets. But there are reforms which too long have been postponed. Maybe there is a relationship with your previous question. And we have to do that. And sometime they are not popular. But you know, when you are president you have to work, maybe its not good for reelection but you are here in order to work for your country. Its as simple as that. Rose thank you for coming. Thank you, my pleasure. Rose fabius, the foreign minister of france. Thank you for joining us. See you next time. For more about this program and earlier episodes visit us online pbs. Org and charlie rose. Com. Captioning sponsored by Rose Communications captioned by Media Access Group at wgbh access. Wgbh. Org funding for charlie rose has been provided by the Cocacola Company supporting this Program Since 2002. American express, and charles schwab. Additional funding provided by and by bloomberging a provider of multimedia news and Information Services worldwide. Narrator in a place called hell valley, an ancient tribe relies on each other to survive. A monkeys position in the group is inherited from its mother. Bloodline determines rank, and every member knows their place. But in this world of tradition, there are opportunities to change your fate. One quiet moment can have great significance, when a young monkey bonds with the leader of the troop. In this clan, nothing goes unnoticed