Shimon peres at a conversation p ;york here on sunday. It was a conflict, and neither93 them nor us], n shod condemn our children to fight all their lives. So from our standpoint, we want to be a truly democratic state. Its inseparable beingoxu jewh and democratic state. Dawn dermer and shimon prepares when we continue. W theres a saying around here you stand behind what you say. Around here, we dont make excuses, we make commitments. And when you cant live up to them, you own up and make it right. Some people think the kind of accountability that thrives on so many streets in this country has gone missing in the places where its needed most. But i know youll still find it, when you know where to look. And by bloomberg. A provider of multimedia news and Information Services worldwide. Captioning sponsored by Rose Communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. Rose we begin with the tragic discovery of the bodies inz . Teenagers. Israel mourned themthey were ki and murderon their way home fra Israeli Occupied west bank. T he bodies were difficult coveredc. He blamed hamas andv lh5ell find those responsible for the teens murders. ÷uelocations. Joining me is rontxa dermer ss been israels ambassador to the hes close to minister. Im pleased to have him here on this program for the first time. Rose tell me everything you can tell me about what israel has8tragic death of the. Well, we know for a fact that these crimes perpetrated by members of hamas from the hebron and we will eventually find them. A couple of the perpetrators of this crime their pictures haisrd them. What happened was you had three teenagers who were coming back from school trying to get home and they were7a,jn kidnapped and essentially executed by these hamas members. And israel has taken action in order to dismantle the terror infrastructure of hamas in the west bank. Weve taken in gaza because rockets have been fired in our city, about two dozen rockets. We took antiterror action in gaza as well. The Prime Minister is meeting with the security cabinet to find out what is the right response of this in order to bring the perpetrators to justice, dismantle the terror infrastructure in the west bank, conduct theses uthe rocketeers r city and÷ protect the civilianpopulation. Rose what were the motivations of those who killed these teenagers. Well, one off rz the motivats on themotivation of isis and alf these terror groups. In the middle east these terroristlike poison. Hezbollah is an example. The shiite fanatics are led by iran. You have sunni fanatics in the middle east, hamas, isis, alqaeda. These are trying to essentially reverse history tojync restoren the case of the sunni and case of the shia to dominate the middle east. And these Terror Organizations have to be opposed and confronted and thats what israels doing in gaza and the west bank. Rose if it was a political act, why havent÷ mm y taken well, it might be that E Organization of hamas, their headquarters in gaza does not want to take credit for this act because they dont want the retribution that comes along with it. But we knowhamas in the hebron a perpetrated this attack. Hamas is a Terror Organization, theythey have fired scores af bs at our city, at our cafes and buses. Members of hamas perpetratedui7. Hamas is not just a run of the mill organization theyre a genocidE Organization. They call for the murders of jews worldwide. The leader of hamasz24 48 hoursw what its b it shouldnt changed and hamas has to be confronted. Rose what kinds of options does israel have that it might use going forward. Well listen, i will leave it to the decision measures in jerusalem with all due respect to the israeli ambassador in washington. Those decisions are made in jerusalem. We had security cabinet meetings. Hell take the actiobare necesso justice, and also to do whats necessary to defepi population. Youll recall a year andahalf ago israel had to engage in a wider action in gaza. We did that because we were getting rockets, hundreds of rockets fired on our cities every couple weeks and the Prime Minister had to draw a line saying this was unacceptable. He took action in gaza didnt solveone of the yetest periods m gaza. Obviously the people in gaza, hamas believe these types of actions are acceptable. The job of the Prime Minister of israel and his security cabinet is to ensure that hamas knows that these actions are unacceptable. I think onexf5m role, charlie, s very important that the world can play, is they have to send a message that terrorism is unacceptable. They can actually send a message to president abbas. We pressure very much that president abbas the leader of palestinians has condemned the kidnapping. The problem is that president government with the kidnappers. So hes condemningi terrorism oneday and hes joinh terrorists the next. We think the next important thing8l send a clear message to president abbas to dismantle the alliance, the attacks he hasgzw made with the hamas owingion to turn their back onhis back4y rk to peace negotiations. Rose for historys sake, what had the government of israel said before about the fact that hamas and the plo or the fatah had come together. ,clear that they found that an unacceptablE Organization to deal with. As soon as they announced this alliance was going to su takeplace, the ; ntity cabif israel met and made clear thatit political negotiations with this new Palestinian Government because were not going to negotiate with those committed to our destruction. That decision was made already six weeks ago. The join, president abbas joinep with hamas, you9c7n have seen he para in the west bank and i think thats part ofwerein thes since the kidnapping theyve taken against hamas operators and hamas own farah structure that westb z to dismantleet6nthe terror ned to sprout up. We think president abbas has to take a stand a clear stand against hamas. Rose i realize thats thing. But did the president abbas, did he condemn the killing and did he help in the search toa kx fd the teenagers. Yes. He condemned the kidnapping. At the time iksince the killing. Yes, he condemned the kidnapping and we appreciate it and he condemned it in arabic. He condemned it in saudi arabia and thats very important the ps also worked with israel and they were cooperative with israel in trying to find those who were responsible. And we appreciate that as well. But hes sending mixed messages. As i said, hes condemning the kidnapping one day and hes in the government with the kidnappers the next and thats the problem. We hope he will take a clear stand, stand with israel in a search for back on hamasc and terror. M unylook the palea foraged a unity pack. Had hamas changed and recognized israels right totgn existrenoua this is unity for peace. Rose if hamas took those steps you would beahamas and plr because you could unite, you could then negotiate with one party representing all the palestinians. Of course. Because then youd have a tj cqestinian leadership that w. We dont have any problem with palestinian unity thats for peace. We have a problem with the Terror Organization that shoot changed one iota thats the problem. Hamas right now controls gaza. Theyve got thousands of rockets in their arsenal. Theyre firing these rockets and president abbas unfortunately made a pact with this organization. Rose will you try to]82qc assassinate the hamas leadership. I dontthe security cabinet. I can only tell you, charlie, you know the primeinterviewed n thisthe Prime Minister is a very responsible leader. Hell take the actions he needs to take to defend israels population. The government has a responsibility to protect israels civilians, protect them from rocket attacks, protect them from these types of heinous terrorist attacks and i have no wcdoubt the Prime Minister willo what he has to in order to fulfill this responsibility that he has. Sumyou can do ij n to change e behavior of hamas . Well, i think ifabbas forite internationally for him to forge an alliance with an organization like hamas that will be the beginning of the change. It will take some time for hamas itself to change. But they have to understand that their passive terrorism is unacceptable. The problem is theyre getting the wronge message. rose has the Prime Minister heard from any arab leaders. I dont know if hes heard from arab leaders today. You know, its funny. In the middle east today, the tvarabs are beginning to understand that israel is not their enemy. Uparticularly the kd they understand that we face common threats. Led of course by the threat4irao loping Nuclear Weapons,and nucl. Thats the greatest danger to the arab world as well. They alsoforces in the region. Zf and you have a unique, in some ways its a real opportunity because israel and the arab world for the first time that i can remember, and many people tell me for the first time in the historysptb÷ ofleading powed and the state of israel see their interesbzand the criticalr the israeli leadership and for contribute to peopportunity to s between israel and the arab world. Theres a unique opportunity here and i know my Prime Minister is very serious about doing so. Hes spoken about it publicly and i thinkits possible because of these common enemies, because of theseand threats foro build those bridges. ;9 rose you expect that theuniy 20th on a nuclearadt ÷ understa . I dont know. Obviously israels concerned. Iran is a country that directly calls for israels destruction. They are the foremost sponsor of terrorism around the world. We think everything should be done to prevent iran from delving a nuclear capability. That means not only Nuclear Weapons today but the ablitycapr nuqapons in the future. Yougood d andgiv that was signed to remoe the Syrian Chemical Weapons and the chemical weapons making capability. All of those were removed and dismantled. At least those that the syrian governmenthn. 8 declared. And i think that thatswachievei applaud the president of the United States for leadif÷g8v tht diplomatic effort. It didnt solve the problems, it didnt solve the humanitarian problem or isis marching both in syria and iraq. Theres great clashes going on in syria. That didnt change. But what it did change it took this weapon of mass destruction, the chemical weapons and took it out of potentially the hands of killers. The same thing everything should be doneiout of the hands of thie in tehran. Not just Nuclear Weapons cy butNuclear Weapons capabili. We hope the model of syria will be the model with iran. 5 . Di where youre not, youre removing all of theuplq richuranium, youre cept feudges and all thehcapabi. The greatest danger charlie to the whole world is you will have one of these radical forces that are fighting right now in the middle east, radical shiites led by iran, radical sunnis led by al companies, isis and hamas and other organizations, youll seeb one of these forcesim n armed itselfwith nuclear weapx if iran is left as a thrasher hold Nuclear Power what you will see is other countries in the region will rush to develop their own Nuclear Weapons capability. And then youre going to create the most unstable region on the planet. You will turn it into aig. K g. Its a rose as well as irad sport for actions against terrorism. Well, i can tell you a year andahalf ago charlie it mo was with the Prime Minister in the war room in israel when we had a confrontation with hamas and i couldnt ask for better support from president obama. He stood by our side throughoeby to the Prime Minister. In that strong support actually helped israel deescalate that conflict because we hadbacking e president of the United States6e system we1wn have produced togr thats financed by the United States, its israeli technology. Because all of those elements israel was able to bring that confrontation to a ceasefire. And a ceasefire which pretty much held throughout 2013 and is beginning to fray now and to restore detairnlts. Gand allies r and more vulnerable to this threat from iran. Our position is iran should not just be prevented from having Nuclear Weapons but prevented from having Nuclear Weapons capability. We do not believe the answer is to leave iran, to leave them parked as a threshold Nuclear Power. Maybe some months or a little bit longer away from havingymata nuclear bombinspectors as theog thats going to block iran from breaking out or sneaking out in order to have Nuclear Weapons in the future. Inspectors will not do the job. The only thing that will do the job is to remove this Nuclear Weapons capability from iran. And we hope that the president obama and the rest of the p5 plus 1 leadership will make sure they stand veryduvery firm. Sanctions are hitting the iranian economy very hard. Theres no need to rush into a bad deal. We hope he will stand very firm and to prevent iran from having a Nuclear Weapons capability. Rose finally, theres on sunday afternoon thex n park avenuesynagogue here i o come and engage in a conversation with one of the sort of surviving early founders of israel, shimon peres who has had many jobs there. You were there sittingbenn on tj first row. You called him both aes. n dreamr and a doer. We will see now this t . conversation, a man who has served Prime Minister, defense minister as welll] where do you . He is a unique figure, president peres in our history. What i said hes both a dreamer and doer. A dreamer in the sense of imagining a differentxea doer iy trying to implement that vision. In public life, the people ive encountered usually fall, the great figurese usually fall thisone of those. They either inspire others withp their vision of the future or they actually work to achieve something specific and pragmatic goals for their country. Very rarely does it go together and president peres you have somebody through his lifetime of servicehas actually done both. The Prime Minister very closelyi think he was a terrific president for israel andohim a u will be hearing from president peres a lot more in the years ahead. Rose ron dermer, ambassador from israel to the United States, thank you for joining us on this evening. Thank you. Rose vt shimon peres the prf israel for another month. Back in a moment. I hope this conversation request and im sure it is with shimon peres wmatch8 h the eloquence t introduced it. It is a great honor for me to be here in synagogue to lookout and see who come here out of the appreciation for the contribution you have made to the world, to the3yh state israel,to humanity. There is a sense aseian i look t them viewing this at the historic moment, an opportunity to see you as president. F anyone who knows you, knows that you will be back in new york and the United States because as was iis where will you be and what will you be doing with a great faith that your lifes work will continue beyond the presidency. B we as members of the Community Look forward to thatohave servd humanity for3 ie1im deeply hon. It is about history, it is aboun world and i was fascinated with you andbit was his idea that wat responsible for your first visit yes. I was. u a good check out. G ic6it was the whole independenc . He was1innocent. Paeluat that point. It really mattered what he said. And he saidroand iw÷night, it c its less severe person it is not÷6n a matter of trust of beig moral this is the highest degree of wisdom. cto stand up 16 t people called him back. They had proposed himlike sos everything. I was still a young boy and he took me when i was 24 years old and he made me listen and after the war, i discovered thai n ignore. I didnt know his ;ce called me up andthe united statu thehead so i started resh and then i work. Rose you said the other day you hope to see peace if you live another ten years you expect it tozcare you optimisti. Im i think made a mistake that there wasfou not opportunistic. Because when i compare our early ys and the reality that f ethe reality was founded, e need to be 650,000 at the time. This is a deficit in our being and its better the reality. [applause] thank you. Rose jbiggest obstacle toda . Skepticism. I think too many skeptics among us. And people can be a little pessimistic very much serious, imoptimist and pessime ÷c thesame way. But differently, why you a pessimist more you trust the. And i think each everybody will pass. Theres 5 a Great Potential wecan becl great causes. And that would be theadvice i c rose used to stay pal tonys never missed an opportunityto9y÷ toh okn miss an opportunity. Has i8 opportunity. Im not sure i extend the co. As im optimistic i know there are many others and problems and things dont happen over night. And its not should i say a walk rose yes, yes. So you shouldnt give up because there are some difficulties. But i started by suggesting with king hussein everybody it, so what should weac1done. Do nothing . Im sorry we didnt meet again with king hussein but the next was arafat. He was a verye every day, hea iu flowerthere are affects that ca [laughter] i can say without him you couldnt start with so we went. Now we mentioned a realistic organization. All ofyou have the two camps ame palestinians. Theres the camp of with focus and look he has carriage the way heand he says he will participate that . mnpeace. Spoke again for terror. Attack now but hearabic and saus not complete. But you know what, we have the other side which is hamas. They f terror, we have an advantage of. They4xb dont care future, they carry arms. They will not win. And poor gaza cannot support them, do nothey already beginnil the cost of it. Because we are rose do the arab, those arab nations that2÷peace with if the arab league do they they fight for hamas. Rose famous for fighv3hamar is famous for supporting hamas. Different camps yes. But therhof egypt. They make it clear that you allow hamas in egypt. And its clear that its a clear positionv,4n and he does it, ÷e doesnt only say cthey are the countries. They have many difficulties. Who needs them from their standpoint. And i think in the camp 1 have. The program of egypt is against them so is abbas for his own good reasons destroy the life of the young people. Andb4la future. Which is never you know, to be young today. Its nice like always but its expensive. [laughter] young people have to compete very heavily in education, in dressulfk and the parents canno. So we have to allow the Young Children to berfdx with a new e. Rose apart from war and peace which i want to continue to talk about, but israel has become thiskyp remarkable for. Yes. Rose how did that happen andn let mea right way and th. It happens because of the jewish dna. [laughter] [applause]the jewish dna doesje. [laughter] to be my god. And ip. Iperson who is satisfied] rose jewish. [laughter] yes. [applause] you is know israely country. . Qfknpeople complain t countries, we are purely holy country. So we started actually with agriculture because we didnt have nothing. And because weoutnumbered any others. So a land which is nature be and now it calls. Maybe we dont have the talent to be simple people. But we are very rich in many persons, maybe more than and those i think is the only compensation for the suffering of ouro w forefathers. Rose your sus president does not have the same commitment to a twostatesoluti. Lig well its not4president policy and im sure that he will respect the policy whichbasicale government. I mean there are many people cey with different i cant imagine they should have thousand policies. by the way i president says he wants to meet abbas. It wasnt his initial but he sell his people and no trust ÷o. Rose i would love for you to speak though to the democratic argument as you have often pointed out that the arab population is growing much faster than its economic but on the idea of the twostate solution has always been something you have believed inas thinking, believing that would t way for two states to live side by side. If it doesnt happen, people worry and you even have secretary of state kerry getting in trouble and having to sort of pull back something thateusing. What are your thoughts about that . I tsingle state having two ns is over. Sn w[applause] czechoslovakia divorced andun entity if we shall not have two states, we shall have one conflict. Neither them nor us should condemn our children to fight all their lives. So from our standpoint, we want to be a jewish and a democratic state. Its inseparable being jewish; y and democratic. I think by the way there are democr 3w and theres alsomoses. Think about it. He says all people are equal. We are all of us thatfirst s. Andsuperior or inferior, they he to respect everybody. Andvotherwise it would remain in egypt. And dont3g,people are simple dd people. He took them out from egypt and then they started to criticize him. We hadkyegyldc;b you know, and it came down. Rose where are they going. They are goingevo to Ten Commandments and so he was fighting as a democrat. Howdud can you separate democray from judaism, its nonsense. Rose in fact, you gave an interview to israel radio, radio two, im not surep yn r one in which you acknowledge that president abbas said to you he would support israel as a jewish state which has been an issue of contention. The problem of jewish state is not a matter of declaration. In e. . we have to have a jewishark neutral majority. If you have a jewish majority you dont have a declaration. If you have a jewish declaration without a jewish majority it will just be a declaration. I think there was a formula that maybe abbas can agree to it. Thats my impression, i dont want toqand that the statemente like twohb[o states, one state,a jewish state a palestinianst. So this will treatp ic both realities and the declaration. Rose it seems that Everybody Knows exactly what was said and what has to be. That hasnt really changed since the war. It did change very much. You know, the two state solution wasnt accepted by the two major parties of,the left. Palestine the right was what people called the and on the right and verycfg6t much wenr the two state solution. People say w no,4sprocess. So now from our stand point,÷thd official policy to support twostate solution. It was also for arabs. They wanted to conquer everything. So in fact at least in principle two state solutions the best. Now people say it shouldnt be difficult or complicated. Was asked by a friend who says lifeeeso they all seem the alternative, you have to think in terms of alternatives. Its difficult, yes. You should overcome it. Rose ofyministi one of them, who have been closest to . I]3 was it the in the end. And myself from the very beginning, we are products of two streams in theowe came one e followed ourthought it was perst wasnt. It wasnt. And finally verycnnj0et close. And the last day it was the saddest day for me and the last day for him, it was the qfe last day more happy, you know. Its hard this day came and we embraced each other because before we had this that was more skeptical itself by nature how many people woul come. It was overthrown and some of them shouted and sounding rabin. Of them jumpedhappy. After what . Zls happened i sas face that was the happiest face i ever saw. You know,wc together, we have ds too. Its natural that we are able to overcome it me we serve the couy together. I dont have theabout it. And then it was for the sake of the country. So i think were very close. The major issue is not how do you feel but what do youo cn do rose on the major , have you felt confident that every american president supported israel. By and large,3i met ten pres. Its very hard to be elected to be a president in the United States. C not a simple proposition how to be a president is not easy. So you need the but among that in america there were republicans and there were democrats. All of them as far as im concerned the firsthuu6 was i told you was kennedy. I was then a deputy minister of defense. Its not normal that the president would receive a deputy. But he asked to see me and we wentqi i udidnt use the elevat. I spoke with him and he looked to be different than in the pictures becauselthe pictures e already with white hair. Because he was suffering. He was sleeping on his chair. And then i remember saw him first. He was elected in november soil, the president but by then the end of january. So it was we had a talk. After the talk, kennedy went and just the two of them. Kennedy turning to him and saysu and your people suffered a lot and itxmyu helpedcf r me to be. What can you do in my town. We alli1your town we can do any. Be a great president of2izx the United States of america. That isqys the best we can have. It was thy changed the world. Without United States, the world would be a mistake. Because america being a super power neverempire. Because america became great by giving and by taking, by helping others, not by using others. And its hha very special case. It calls in the bonesunited sta. So it vx was very veryotx treny witnesses. I can witness decides this and that but it isa80l in the ameris possessand because we are smalle but great in freedom and because jewish, wetraditions. m n america stood on our side more than any otherxi country becae we were,[cso people want to thio good toim telling you, itsvto. [applause] rose so if;write the firsf your obituary, what would you write . [laughter] i neverf[laughter] but, you know, im not you know. [applause] rose whats beenod g the proudest moment for you . What. Rose tomorrow. Yes. Im not going t change the past. Im not interested in it. And i think rose but you can change the future. Youe r can and you have to. Not only. So within my who p interest is about tomorrow and tomorrowgods. Thek 9to change the past but if you want to do better, tomorrow. I have to say that things aresq7 not plain and simple. We are facing still the danger of iran. Rose right. Which is not a simple proposition again. I dont know what the hell do0t. We are not their enemies. Nobodys threatening iran. Nobody. So at the beginning they nominated two satans, theyavnprd best. Okay. But center of supporting every terryou know by the way they are young people and they too im not sure agree with the present policy. But right now we have to stand and prevent iran from becoming a nuclear, not because they are inferior people but because theyre the only country that threatens another state to destroy. Nobody threatens them, they threaten others. And i was really glad that the meeting with the president he spoke very clearly about the subject that he will not dominate iran to become a Nuclear Country that theres nuclear bombs. Rose and you feel confident therefore that israel should not have to take it into its own hands to prevent iran fromUnited States will. No. I think iran is a danger to the whole÷3y i mean its not a simple question, you know. Nobody wants another hiroshima. Nobody. And since america is the most responsive country, itsl[that e are not outer people but the living fallsUnited States of am. So itcx not that we dont want another ones, but there is a all the danger and some people are sympathetic to iran. Now iran has own problems too. Syria and iraq. Doesnt mean that theutworld isd submit to your ambihso we disco. Rose does it matter to you that youre now the most popular you have ever been . Its confusing, you know. [laughter] rose all of a sudden youre leaving office h. The mosr been. But you know, i said it whether, its in my eyes like perfume. Jr a nice to; g smell dangerous lee quickly. Nowadays is not to be not saying im great im strong because if you say it, it will come on. Can you blame im not sure. Can you bring an end tsocial de. So what makes you think youre such a powerful man. Today to be a public servant, you have to sell the,pbzqto woo. I believe we have the same because people believe im not runningiambition. Rose let me just say, i can never express to you the full appreciation of the people in this room for your service. And we thank you for that. [applause] captioning sponsored by Rose Communications captioned by Media Access Group at wgbh access. Wgbh. Org er what if those health foods that youre eating every day are actually hurting you . The cereal with skim milk for breakfast, the decaf soy latte midmorning, that yogurt you had for an afternoon snack. You may be surprised to learn that a lot of what weve been told is good for us is only good for some companys bottom line. And its taking its toll on your health, your weight, and the number of years in your life. What im about to tell you will help you reclaim your health and your life. 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