missy leah with a tim jeff, darker room. there's a crazy, that's a lot of the my subway, but just a, i need a price quote. was for that for a while. i'm on the back or quick with global. i'm saying years about how she took on a job, please about the enough room for you real quick to take a picture. well, go double play. you have to close with a. ah, imagine you're in the u. s. military and your job is to take care of waste, disposal. that sounds easy enough and your orders are to bulldoze everything into a giant pile, spray it with jet fuel and set it on fire. that sounds like a terrible idea. it'll pollute everything, and it will cause untold health problems. i'm john kerry aku and you're watching the whistleblowers burn pits have become a serious issue in u. s. military policy. the concept of burned pits is relatively simple. the military needs a way to dispose of its waste, but that waste includes every thing, food scraps, plastics, rubber, medical, waste, chemicals, even broken military equipment. the policy for decades was to bulldoze everything into a giant pile, using acres of land hose it all down with jet fuel and then set it on fire. just imagine all of that burning waste. it would have to be one of the most toxic environments on earth. and what happened is that soldiers and proximity to the burn pits began returning to the united states and showing signs of rare cancers, especially glee, oh bless, domus brain cancers claiming the lives of people. busy like bo biden, the son of president joe biden, and claiming the life of my best friend, david mccracken, the connection between the burned pits and these rare cancers was clear, but the pentagon refused to acknowledge it. and for years after the burn pits were wound down and the u. s. withdrew from places like iraq and kosovo, the victims continued to suffer and to die. our guest today is joseph hickman. joe hickman spent most of his life in the military 1st as a marine and then as a soldier in both army and the national guard. he is deployed on several military operations throughout the world, sometimes attached to foreign militaries, the recipient of more than 20 commendations and awards. joe hickman was awarded the army chief met metal and the army commendation metal. while he was stationed at guantanamo bay, he's also the author of the book, the burn pits. joe, welcome back to the show. chart, read. joe. the problem of burn pit seems to be patently obvious. everybody knows that you can't burn plastic. everybody knows that you can't burn rubber or medical waste out in an open field. everybody knows you can't mix chemicals and equipment and food and just set it all on fire. how did this stupid policy begin in the 1st place? i began in the beginning, remembering trash and military years, decades during the war we birch. but we really started to realize something's wrong . even though we changed that realization, we gave the job to dispose of waste from soldiers and from the basis we're building to government contractors and the government contractor that did we gave the contract to a j d r, which was james. he was former ceo of that company or vice president united states and they were cutting cost figure out way, way instead of contractors generators decide to take acreages of fields and burn our waste. burn joe, how long was it before people began to see a correlation between the burn pits and illnesses. even if those illnesses weren't these rare cancers, what happened then? did the complaints go back to the pentagon in a timely fashion? it did once cause it moves. so slowly on, we started seeing crowns. almost within months after we dated once we got into iraq, they call it the iraqi cried 3 months. so you're coming down really bit with a lot of bonuses and mostly sort of the symptoms understood. and they call it into the regular people, begin to realize that you're living. this is causing this so called direction. so you've done a major investigation of this policy that led to your 3rd book, the bern, pitts. why did the pentagon deny for so long that there was a problem? why did they deny that these clusters of rare cancers affecting a wide variety of people who had one thing in common that they worked in or near the burn pits? was this financial issue that the pentagon just didn't want to have to deal with? it was definitely a financial issue. it was also after, wow, the paragon stopped in 911 this year. so it was a legal li loophole that they use. j. b, r was held responsible for the birth, so actually also came from over 400 soldiers. the illnesses of burg this well gave york on the military saying the military the military came up with the idea of where to go and give your schools the military stake on the issue. because the ferris doctrine can't sue the military . so you are going to military, no solid and it was just the case for the use of this problem because it just who do you blame one side denying it and the other side by side this denying it and you get to that? well, let me ask you a follow up on that issue because i think i think you're hitting on a very important point here. you've got these military contractors who are more or less indemnified for what they're doing in war zones during war time. you've got k, b r, which is a multi 1000000000 dollar company with very, very close ties to the military industrial complex, but then they get away with something like this. this is the same company that got away with multiple accusations of sexual harassment, of female employees. for example. why is it that these 2 big to fail military contractors who are clearly in the wrong on some of these issues of life and death? just get away with it. how does this happen? well, i get all of your dentist things there. like i said, dick cheney is a timers before or become a nice day. he had resigned years ceo. he was he will bury host tires with your money. he left which $1000000.00 in stock. gosh, that was part of his stepping down. was part of what he sees after the iraqi and yes, the more started his thoughts are who stock options. so i really, i mean, i figured there was a lot of evidence. so yes, a lot of things. why keep your god? because no big contract to waste management and the money that you're you know, government official date on this? absolutely, sir. yeah. yeah. it's astounding for these members of the u. s. military who were exposed to the bern pits. joe, tell us a little bit about what they had to endure. in the case of my friend david mccracken, he worked on burden pitts, both in kosovo and iraq. he came home and developed a glee, oh, blessed alma and was dead. less than a year later, at the age of 46, his family was denied defense department medical benefits. and he was even denied permission to be buried at arlington national cemetery. because they said that his illness was not service related. was that kind of treatment common for soldiers coming back, who had been exposed to the burn pits? is that what ho biden's family and others endured? yes, and i did practice and this was for client was a terrible story. cerebral, fresh story. unfortunately. you know, the story is very common is to show the back or, and i don't understand why this should be right on the front page of all the people actually being denied at 1st, almost everyone was denied now denied benefits and a lot of them died just completely drunk and not giving heroes. you know, it all ever just under the radar. these are all your lessons. tell us about some of the diseases that we're talking about here. i mentioned in a moment ago glee, oh, blessed oma, which is this rare brain cancer? it's something that my friend had, it's something that bo biden had. it turned out that in my friend, david's case, he had to tumors in his brain one the size of a walnut and one the size of a p. but they were so deep in his brain that they were in operable. there was just nothing that could be done. it turned out that bo biden had pretty much the same thing. but what else are we talking about here? are we talking about respiratory illnesses like c o, p d? are we talking exclusively about cancers? what are these people coming home with? the current home? what was so different diagnosis? you have to share. there was, you're burning anything and everything. so you're, you're deal with, with thousands of courses that are affected by so many different ways. i've talked to people that had this soldier who had a tumor on the side of his side. on his side, the size of football popped up. and i think to really understand all the look at the rack and what, what their purpose asked the cd. she don't even have names for dorms. so i think i think the sex where does you know so many different things. the soldiers are having an error and are having this this, i'm believe you may go, you make a very good point there. and a very important point. i read a new york times account of bern, pits in iraq. that said that when the, when the wind would shift, the smoke would settle on a u. s. military base. and literally everybody on the base was, was forced to breathe in this. iraqi gunk as you call it. everybody got sick, whether it was from asthma or a cold, or an upper respiratory infection, all the way down to these these rare cancers. but then just imagine what people, the neighboring villages had to go through. if you're a soldier, you're eventually going to cycle out of that base. you're going to come home or you're going to be transferred somewhere else. if you're an iraqi national or a coast of our or an afghan, and you live near these, these burn pits, you breathe this in for years and, and nothing good is going to come to this. no, it was um you talking about over a 100 maybe different build law for us, iraq or outside of our military bases. and like i said, the burg respects to their state now they, they 1st tried to say it was a lot, several doctors and she said, this is from the over the country on a developing story. it is very sad to know the story is these children are being born with some of the worst birth facts you ever see. we are speaking with jose, have hickman about the toxic, burned pits created and used by the u. s. military around the world and how they lead to untold human misery among american soldiers and others, including the locals. we're going to take a short break and come right back, stay tuned. 2 2 2 2 2 2 ah ah, with watching it was a what a national z m a in china has performed a master stroke of diplomacy is brokered in agreement that we'll see a ran and saudi arabia again reestablish diplomatic relations. this could be a step not only to reorder the middle east, but also usher in an area of stability in the region. today. washington is the odd man out the welcome back to the whistleblowers. i'm john carrie argo were speaking with joseph hickman or u. s. military veteran, an author of the book, the burn pitts. good to have you back joe. the u. s. defense department is now estimating that 3 and a half 1000000 troops that us troops in kosovo, iraq, afghanistan eventually returned to the u. s. with respiratory or other health problems because of, of exposure to the burn pits that is a gigantic number. but the problem that we've seen since 2010 is that the pentagon didn't bother to keep records of what was actually burned, where it was burned, how it was burned, and who was exposed to the smoke. as a result, the u. s. department of veterans affairs has been reluctant to admit that these diseases were service related. has that finally been fixed, or veterans finally receiving the care and the benefits that they deserve. a lot more veterans in the here. the pact act that recently was a huge. but again, it moves so slow, we're still seeing a lot of people being denied that we shouldn't be there. but it is, it is turning around, it's getting better, it should have been better a lot faster. what happens with ages aren't, which is very similar to. ready as far as how we handle it took 27 years for this veterans from the army and were just seeing the same thing with them or from 6 inches or what are you trying to do tribute that to, to just bureaucratic normal see or, or is there some other reason why the, the pentagon and the department of veterans affairs just can't seem to get it's, it's act together on this issue. i, i think it's, it's deeply cool at all. i can tell you that before the team now i had a company global research solutions and i submitted a detailed report on what was happening with these burg better. and it was going through the bottles. i told me directly to senator ron john directly to senator ron john thompson. and i asked him to explain to this you got the height is 100 percent to me when i was basically get his office and he said he would do what he can. and then just a couple weeks later, a bill was introduced to, to actually recognize the issue and to do some sort of, you know, testing evaluations on soldiers or the purpose. and he, he already against the bill. oh, i couldn't understand why he was still his office staff and his veteran whose people don't status any. yeah. we started on a missile system. i think the guy that he had to go for $35000000.00 to help them and the bank, i believe the board that this will just because it hasn't worked in 2 years trial trials. but after that, i id, i think the deep lives where she were, where some people were just really paid by the military, industrial, military and so much slows these issues down. one of the things that has me perplexed is, it's now clear to everybody, including at the pentagon and the pentagon's leadership. that burned pits are toxic, that they kill people and that they should not be in use. but at the same time, the defense department still has not officially bands there use. why is that, and is there any role for congress here? why are the oversight committees? not banning the bern pits and legislation. you're john, you're just going to mind this. actually, my wife has serious respiratory issues. i don't why she's on the shoes in my racket into this issue is just not going away and their, their band aid, but they're not all in lead. summer jo, president biden signed a bill into law that is supposed to improve medical benefits for service members who were exposed to the bern. pitts, do you think that's enough? it took a long time and it doesn't look like there's any more legislation pending. is there more that you think should be done? i do. i think there's more or morality issues that should be done military deal with their own veterans. i don't, i didn't. i didn't like the abilities time, but there's so much to do hardly see the bill itself. i think i think we should just start by leaving our veterans and sicknesses. the v a has worked for years and years years under the concept. ok, you're sick, you're injured. military label and that's how they operate. instead of operating that way they have to just change change. okay. you are sitting and you're showing you tell me we have to prove it's not. ready ready big changes, i don't see we started off here talking about k b r and and defense contractors have defense contractors taken a position on these legislative issues that can be our aside obviously because k b r has a vested interest in bern, pits not being recognized as a health concern, what about some of the other big defense contractors or are the victims of the burn pits standing alone? there's these, these, these covered, these, these companies did draft drake themselves out of our window in the end. they don't, they don't they. it's all about them. and why do you think we're not seeing more support on capitol hill? you just now told this awful story about senator ron johnson, which i completely believe. i worked on capitol hill for many years and, and this kind of thing happens all the time. but why isn't there a movement among other members of congress, whether it's the house, the senate to do something to protect our service members, it just seems like there's this is a no lose situation. if you're a politician, they all hopper you have a couple that are really good. was the north carolina marriage and passionately died. the driveway was helping next month for helping veterans, all these. but there's just too far between like there's, there's some that are just independence. some seem like the talk again, but when it comes to soccer they're not really and i think is over is the country we have to start paying attention to target. yes or no. and all these things are supposed to help. not just for joe back in august, there was a protest about the burn pits right here in washington, d. c. with big names like john stuart, standing with veterans and trying to bring this to light. what more do you think needs to be done to bring about change? ah, when, like i said, i think it has to start in into the system itself. has to be turn around and start actually better actually give stacks. when i go on, there is a lack of respect to the veterans, so they don't really believe with the veterans. say maybe the doctors are just overwhelmed because it's short staffed. every time i go staff and they have a lot to do, it just has to. they have to change the system. you know, good luck. we haven't seen that yet. i'm sorry. that's okay. you have to follow the fact joe. one last question for you. you have blown the whistle on 2 major issues affecting the u. s. military that torture at guantanamo. and we're going to discuss that separately. and on these bern pitts. what has the reaction been to you personally by the u. s. military? i'm sure the rank and file are grateful for what you've done. i know that my friend, david's widow, is grateful for what you've done. but what's the reaction been from the pentagon? pentagon prevents the. i had a hard time. see what i would, i came for with this group one 1st radar still active duty and it was probably a really bad time. but i had to use literally a life or death situation. so they, they gave me a hard time sometimes too much because there is payroll issues, some issues with where i was station the move to a different job. it was a lot of problems in a lot of people hired them, spoke pretty roughly by far as the people in my life years got longer and i miss and we got a lot joe heckman. thank you so much for joining us today. that's all we have for you today. remember in this case, the words of the dalai lama. a compassionate concern for others well being is the source of happiness, of self centered attitude is the source of the problem. we have to take care of ourselves without selfishly taking care of ourselves. if we don't take care of others, we cannot take care of ourselves. i'm john curiosity. and this has been the whistleblowers will see you next time. ah. 2 2 2 ah, ah, in the least of canter, russian state. oh, never. i've tied as on the nose landscape, divest december, candles, all sun set up with within $55.00 will be speed. okay, so mine is 25 and speaking with we will van in the european union. the kremlin, yup. machine. the state on crush up to date and supports the r t sport neck. even our video agency, roughly all band to on youtube with every year on august, the 16th hundreds of people gather in the center of riga to commemorate the land fans who fought with nazi germany. in beth and essence, detachments during world war 2. this day is known as legion in a day. i see tooth really from the good, the mini come on. a just got started with the affinity advocates. if the veterans claim the lengthy and soldiers had nothing to do with the trustees committed against jews, despite historical evidence to prove that country with folder from like a socialist, russia could you with a says the russian airport did not bring down an american military drone over the black sea labeling, the incident, a probably cation and stating it crash after suffering a flight. taylor also i had the fact that this is a terrorist attack is no longer a secret. moreover, it was a terrorist act committed, ready state level, because no amateurs, mit and attack like the nurturing pipeline bombing was a state concert terrorist attack. while the western version of the event is complete. nonsense, that's according to vladimir and canyon struggles with an influx of.