Transcripts For MSNBCW The Way I See It 20201017

During my eight years as the chief official White House Photographer for the Obama Administration i documented all the important moments of his presidency. The emotion. The tough decisions. The stressful times. The fun times. But also showing what he was like as a dad. As a husband. Just as a human being. To me that shows how the job of the president should be done. I got high hopes i got high hopes i think its my right as an american citizen to speak out when i see wrong. I really come at this from a unique perspective. Not just as a former photo journalist, but also having worked for both the obama and Reagan Administrations. And seeing what its like on the inside of a presidency. Whether you agree or disagree with the president s policies, how that president should behave. High hopes i got high hopes im going to throw some shade tonight, if thats okay. But i want to tell you first how i how i got there. So if we go back to january 20th, 2017 president obama left his successor a personal note and stuck it in the drawer of the resolute desk and the last line of the note was michelle and i wish you and melania the very best as you embark on this great adventure and know that we stand ready to help in any way as which we can. Good luck and god speed. With that he left the oval office for the last time. Good morning, everybody. Good morning, sir. Good morning, sir. Thank you, sir. Thank you, guys. He went and said goodbye to the household staff, butlers, ushers, ground keepers. And von everett, one of the butlers who had been there since the reagan years, you can imagine what it was like for him to have been there for the first africanamerican president. Theres a tradition that the incoming president comes to the white house the morning before the inauguration for a reception. After everyone else had finally boarded the motorcade president obama took trump aside to brief him on a pending National Security issue. He escorted trump to the limousine. They had to ride in the limousine to the capitol together. The guy on the right is mike white. Hes head of the president ial secret service. You always see the person in that position behind the president or behind the first lady. As they were leaving the podium i now notice that mike white and his deputy were behind trump and melania, and not behind president obama. And thats when it really hit me that this for real had happened. You know, if i go back to january 20th, 2017, im ready for the job to be done because, you know, it just takes so much out of you physically and mentally. There was a sense of relief. All this excitement that i would not have a blackberry with me 24 7 365 for eight years anymore. You have no idea how good of a feeling it was to be done with that. But there was a sense of disbelief and worry. And i was. I really was concerned for the country. To this day i have that same feeling. Not literally in the room anymore. But i know what happens in the room. And thats what scares me about whats happening today in the oval office. After i left the white house i started this personal instagram account. My intention was to highlight some of the photographs that i had made throughout my career. I never intended to be vocal in any way about what was going on. So the first day he came to me with his photo that he wanted to post on instagram with the president sitting on the resolution desk and the red curtains. And he wrote a caption, Something Like i like the old curtains better. What did you think . I said you cant say that because he had spent eight years having no voice. And no opinion of what was going on. And suddenly heres an opinion about drapes. I said you cant do that. What i didnt tell you is i had just seen a picture of the redecorated oval office with these gold ornate curtains and there was even a comment on that very first post from somebody that said pete is dropping shade with a comment on drapes. And i have to admit i had no idea what dropping shade meant. I knew what i was doing i just didnt know it was called dropping or throwing shade. Can you give us dont be rude. Can you give us a question . Dont be rude. Give us a question. When you report fake news, which cnn does a lot, you are the enemy of the people. Go ahead. Mr. President [ street noise ] [ camera clicking ] hi, pete, welcome to india. Thank you, its nice to be here. Is there hope for journalism . Theres a lot of people doing a lot of great work but it doesnt help when the president of the United States calls journalists fake news and the enemy of the people. I think thats really dangerous. I think our president is causing grave damage to the institution of the free press. The former chief White House Photographer, please welcome to the stage pete joseph souza. [ cheers and applause ] i want to ask you as a photo journalist your commitment while photographing is to the truth but when youre the chief White House Photographer, when youre consciously or subconsciously building a public image of obama was there a conflict . I think thats a good question. I often say to people though my background as a photo journalist, certainly when youre the chief White House Photographer youre working for the government. But so i didnt ever think of it as a conflict because i wasnt a p. R. Photographer. I look at myself as a historian with a camera. The job as a chief official White House Photographer is officially document the presidency for history. When inauguration rolled around i had in the back of my mind for the journey i was about to take this thought, make authentic photographs, think mood, emotion, context. Be ready for the fleeting moments, both big and small. My goal was to create the best photographic archive of a president that had ever been done. Lasting images for history. The origination of my office was a military office during the kennedy administration. Lbj wanted somebody to cover everything and he hired this guy named yoshi yokomoto who traveled with him as vice president. Johnson was such a character, and okomoto was such a great to photographer. His pictures are just amazing. You know, more than anyone, his work was the kind of work that i wanted to do. I wanted the level of access that okomoto had to johnson. Thats sort of what i was striving for with obama. Photographs can tell a story, just as a book can tell a story. And its a very special thing because it breaks down the idea that these people are somehow different from us. Yes, they have different responsibilities. Yes, they have greater anxieties but theyre leading a life that has a daily ritual to it. I knew how the job should be done having worked for the Reagan Administration too. The White House Photo editor called me up one day out of the blue and said we want you to apply for this job. It was totally unexpected. Im in my 20s and id never met a president before and i was just nervous. It was kind of like just sort of overwhelming to me. I actually turned it down at first. A, i was not really that into politics. B, i was really not the biggest fan of reagan. Photography. Photographer. Sure. Well this is from the lips. But you hope that what youre doing is important for history, right, you used to say journalism is the first draft of history. And im thinking like heres a chance to actually be involved in documenting history. The Photograph Office primarily it was myself and fitz and jack and then pete. But we were very much a team. Lock that sucker down. Working at the white house as the first woman official photographer was a humbling experience. I was recording for history. Now, is pete nice and clear . Yes, they both are. The orchestration of Television Coverage absorbs the white house. They provide pictures of him looking like a leader. Confident with his marlboro man walk, a good family man. The white house has become more and more a theater. And the question has become, are the Television Networks going to manage that theater . Are they going to manage that stage or is the white house going to do that . They were very aware of creating the best backdrop possible for tv networks and time and news week. Now, do you want us on either side of the tree or what . Well, i think they want to do one standing but i think for release purposes it would be better to have you doing something and my suggestion is watering the tree. We have two shovels. We have a chain saw. No, please. Pete, its too hot. Can we just do watering the tree . Watering the tree is fine. Did you get that, pete . Yeah. You did, huh . Ive got an idea for another picture. Just one more. Ive got the chain saw. No, and youre blocking me off. Stopping me from dont just stand there, youre supposed to be saying no, im not going to start the saw. No. All right. Thank you. The amount of access you get as the chief official White House Photographer is really totally dependent on the relationship that you have with the president. All i tried to do was push for more access for the behind the scenes moments, most of which were never seen until after he had left the presidency. Some of the pictures that i would make would be fairly intimate, after mrs. Reagan had undergone Breast Cancer surgery at bethesda naval hospital, every day at the end of the day he would take the helicopter and go visit her. They were exactly the same way together behind the scenes as they were in public. It was very much a true love and companionship between the two of them. I always felt the best pictures i made of reagan were not from planned events. They were things that happened between events and moments that you couldnt ever predict. They would just happen. And that really humanizes the president of the United States. One of the roles of commander in chief is you send people into harms way but then the president usually is the one who has to go talk to all the families who have lost someone. Hes clearly empathetic and compassionate, and you can see the emotion in their faces as theyre looking up to see what reagan is saying. Thats the way a president should behave. In times like that. In some respects i think it did a disservice not to show him in these true, authentic, behind the scenes moments more than they did. Okay, folks, i always wondered what it would be like to stand okay with you, mr. President . Scram. Mr. President , just step this way. Hes to the left and im to the right. Big smile. Here we go, big smile. I wanted this time to talk with you about an extremely sensitive and profoundly important matter of foreign policy. Certainly during the iran contra affair there were a lot of pictures that i made where he was agonizing over what he did or what he didnt do. It was a big scandal. I made that picture with the Tower Commission after this many month investigation had concluded that, in fact, reagan had sold arms for hostages. And you see that look on reagans face. He was still somewhat in denial. But to me it really defines that whole scandal and how impactful it was on his presidency. I did not necessarily agree with some of the things that president reagan was doing. For example, how long it took him to come to grips with aids. I think that, in retrospect, is more than disappointing. But this photo i made of him holding a baby with hiv did help destigmatize the disease. I was naive and not as politically aware as i should have been at the time but i did feel that he was a decent human being. He respected other people from all walks of life. When reagan had passed away, and his body was being flown to the west coast, nancy reagan requested that pete would be on the plane with them. And of course he had been out of the white house for so many years and pete did that. When i left the white house under reagan it wasnt like i was that wellknown. So for nine years i was a freelance photographer. After that i went to work for the Chicago Tribune based in d. C. If somebody had told me that i would end up working for the most iconic republican president of our generation, and then the most iconic democrat president of our generation, i would have said they were crazy. What are those words . Yes, we can thank you, illinois, i love you thank you. Thank you, illinois. In 2004 barack obama was elected to the senate. I didnt see his 2004 speech at the convention because i was traveling with kerry. The hope of a skinny kid with a funny name who believes that america has a place for him too. I remember the editors in chicago said to me, make sure you get a picture of obama. I was like, i didnt even know what the guy looked like, you know. Youre on the front page of every paper this week, youre all over television. Everyones calling you the future, the savior of the democratic party. So are you . You know, i rank 99th out of 100 in seniority. Im going to be sharpening pencils and scrubbing the floors, i think, for the first couple of years. I doubt that. Jeff zeleny, who was a correspondent for the tribune, he came up to me one day and he said, hey, im thinking of pitching a story to the editors of following obamas first year in the senate. I love this picture because, you know, hes got half a sandwich in his mouth and sashas eyeing the other half. This is the day i met him, the presence of my camera didnt bother him at all. Which is not always the case, especially with politicians. Did that say anything about him to you . You know, i found him a good subject. This was the first day that he was in washington as the newly elected senator. And malia was 6. Senator obama spent the day with his family and showing them around and helping them understand what it was like. And sasha was 3. I think he thought i was a competent photographer. I continued to further that trust as the year went by. By the age of youtube, and so much internet video, do photographs still have a very powerful impact in terms of covering politics . You know, i like the still photograph. It stops time. You can remember a still photograph. A lot of photo journalists now are evolving into video but i still think the still photograph, for me, says a lot more. I wasnt with him every day but i got to know him pretty well professionally. It was very clear that he was different from most politicians. I hadnt really seen somebody, especially a freshman senator, with this kind of presence. He had us call him barack. He was casual. He would email you in the middle of the night. Generationally he had more common in people that worked for him in their 20s than he did with probably the other senators in washington. This would have been in 2005. I went to russia and ukraine, azerbaijan with him, were in the middle of red square and not a Single Person recognizes him. Hes just a regular guy. And then i went to africa with him in 2006. And we went to mandelas cell. Not go the view on the outside, on a clear day you can see capetown. When we went to kenya he had this meeting with some ngos and word got out that he was in there. And when he emerged from this meeting there were like thousands of people waiting to hear him say a few words. When we went to nairobi and he gave a big speech i got this picture of this guy writing down like the bullet points of what he was talking about. Hey hey good to see all of you. The reception at his grandmothers village was like chaotic. Anytime i think a child comes back to his parents grave it makes you reflect on your own life and mortality. It makes you think about the next generation. My wife and i are going to get tested for hiv aids. So i just want everybody to remember that if a u. S. Senator can get tested, and his wife can get tested, then everybody in this ground can get tested. Because you need to know your status. Seeing the overwhelming response that he got in africa, i remember coming back from that trip saying that, you know, ill bet he runs for president. I mean, just the way people were hanging onto his every word. You could just see, in peoples faces, that this guy was Something Special to them. Obviously he was very intelligent but i think he also had the right temperament to become president. To me this picture really tells a story about a young u. S. Senator, about to walk out, announce that hes running for president , knowing that his life will never be the same. And i think you could see that in his face. You could see the anxiety in michelle as shes trying to brush off some lint from the back of his jacket. I knew the gravity of the moment. And i knew he had a shot. I knew that once people got to see him and hear from him that he had a shot. He had the kind of qualities within him where people people would relate to him. I stand before you today to announce my candidacy for president of the United States of america. People forget that hillary was so far ahead. Had so many endorsements, that people thought he was a long shot. Doesnt obama face a big uphill battle despite all the Media Attention hes getting . He will have to deal with the issue of only two years in the u. S. Senate. The media was ready to kind of write us off or put us in the barrel. It was like no, there was this broader force out there that was not going to let that happen. American history wont be the same again. Americans elected a young man, with a young family, an africanamerican, the first ever. Its been a long time coming. But tonight, because of what we did on this day, in this election, at this defining moment, change has come to america. Gibbs called me on january 5th and offered me the job. And i just said to gibbs, i said, look, heres the thing, if i do this, i have to have access to everything. And he just said to me, the president elect gets it. Theres no worries there. I said, okay, ill be there tomorrow. Two days later i met up with obama. He walked in the room and he said were going to have some fun. Over the horizon smooth sailing i think there was an enormous amount of respect overseas when he was elected. I think people were just excited that our country had finally put prejudice aside and elected an africanamerican president. And really, a different kind of politician. That resonated around the world. I wont break it down no honey i wont wear you down pete was with the president all the time. Hed start his day around 9 00. Id get his schedule. But i came to learn the schedule was really just a starting point. I covered all the behind the scenes meetings. All the situation room meetings. I mean, i cant take ownership of this analogy. But imagine trying to take a sip of water from a fire hose that never shuts off. I wont wear you down no honey i wont wear you down it was nonstop every day, 24 7, always on call, always ready. That was the challenge for me, for my job, for eight years. Pete had walking pneumonia one time and he still came to work. If you really want to document the presidency for history youve got to be there all the time. You cant predict when images are going to happen. Pete really wanted to be the guy who disappears and thats the gift when youre White House Photographer is the president doesnt even know youre in the room. Occasionally the cabinet would be gathered to present some really tough decisions to the president. You know, thered be chatter, chatter, people commiserating and the first sign that the president was imminent was when pete walked in. Everything would freeze. So i dont know what it felt like for him for eight years to have that Chilling Effect on every room. Why should historians Pay Attention to what you do . Well, i think for me the job of the chief official White House Photographer is important for history. And thats the one thing that i am concerned about with, you know, whats happening with the current administration, that the access is not the same as i had for president obama. And i think history will suffer as a result. President obama puts his Administration Front and center on yet another major aspect of the countrys troubled economic front. Restructuring the u. S. Auto industry. Early in 2009 we were in the midst of this big financial crisis. I think this picture helped show whos in the room, the mood, the emotion of the moment, which was he was about to call the ceos of two Automobile Companies to tell them the federal government was going to take over the company. As you recall, it was very controversial at the time. And i was thinking who is this man . How does he deal with crisis . And i think some words that were crossing my mind were leadership, character and empathy. The more ive studied leaders in crisis times, whether its lincoln or fdr or Teddy Roosevelt or lbj during the civil rights struggle they had almost like a family resemblance of leadership traits the first one being humility, the ability to be able to acknowledge error and learn from your mistakes. I would go from there maybe to empathy as an absolutely critical human quality, the ability to understand other peoples points of view and to feel a sense of connection to those other people. All the leaders that ive studied were able to communicate in a way to the people so that they felt a sense of trust in what they were saying. They were inspired to act because of them. And then beyond communication is the ability to control emotions and to remain cool during difficult times. And then at the very end in some ways you have to have the selfconfidence to create a team of people around you who can criticize you, who can question your assumptions, who can argue with you, and then to accept that its going to come from the country at large is such an important quality in a leader. Looking at president obama, he came into office with a desire to wind down americas wars overseas and step up the focus at home. But events had a way of intervening, especially in the middle east. I want to speak to you tonight about our effort in afghanistan. We did not ask for this fight. While weve achieved hard earned milestones in iraq, the situation in afghanistan is deteriorating. And as commander in chief i have determined that it is in our Vital National interest to send an additional 30,000 u. S. Troops to afghanistan. President obama, again and again, would come back to, okay, if we do what youre proposing, how is it likely to play out . He welcomed dissent and debate and discussion. His belief was that he would make the best decisions if he had been exposed to the greatest array of counterarguments, alternative viewpoints. Lets say really difficult backdrop like syria, we had tensions over that. We have nothing but lousy options confronting the president. But the person who has to live with the consequences and to know that they own the outcome, thats the president and the president alone. President obama said, actually, that he viewed the presidency as a relay race. Youre given certain problems when you come in. You work on those problems. Some of those things will not be solved during your time. Maybe some steps have been taken to get that solved. Maybe weve gone backwards or forwards. Wars are going to be there maybe that shouldnt have been fought or you wish hadnt been fought. Wars are going to be there that are left unfinished. But its really that continuing march. For me it is constantly important to remind myself why i got into this business in the first place. Especially when its hard. You look at an issue right now, like health care, so many of us campaigned on the idea that we were going to change this health care system. Well, here we are. With a chance to change it. Theres an early Health Care Speech he was working on with jon favreau. Every page looked like this. So i think it really shows you how involved he was in the words that were coming out of his mouth. Dont you wish we had that now . But i think this picture also tells you something about how he works with other people because instead of just handing jon the marked up draft the next morning when he came to the oval office he called jon in and they sat on his sofa for an hour and a half and went over every change that he had made. I know how bitter and contentious the issue of Health Insurance reform has become. This bill is the greatest threat to freedom that i have seen in the 19 years ive been here in washington. Weve gotten caught up in the political game in a way thats just not healthy. This is nancy imparo who was as responsible as anyone for the Affordable Care act and nancy had two young boys and they never saw their mom for like two years. Like she would leave the house early in the morning and the boys hadnt even woken up yet and by the time she got home they were often already asleep and thats the kind of sacrifice that people at the white house made. President obama was aware of this. It was it wasnt anything that was ever said but i started noticing it wherever whenever he could he would make a point to make sure the boys were invited when the nba basketball players came to the white house or events like that. This is nicky. He invited him into the oval office to share a power bar with him. Nicky came to one of my book signings. Hes now a sophomore at duke. And told me how much this picture meant to him. And he realizes now the good work that his mom was doing. There was still some lobbying to be done, lots of phone calls. This is in the limo with his legislative director and i think this was the phone call where he realized that they probably had enough votes and he took his lucky charms out of his pocket. I saw that he took his lucky charms out. That morning i was like, okay, this is a good sign. Lets get this done. The bill is passed. [ applause ] and he felt on this day that he got something done, that bettered peoples lives. Got to switch cameras. Sorry about that, sir. We all right . Yup, just got to switch you caught me in an embarrassing moment. Its like that never happens to me. Sorry about that. That was a little embarrassing. Man, i tell you. National geographic. Camera broke down. I filled the disk. Hes usually much better than this. Take the lens cap off. No, it was i filled the disk. I mean, the speech was so exciting that i filled the disk. One of the cool things that my office did was hang jumbo prints. Its a tradition that had started with the nixon administration. So we would update them every few weeks. There was actually only a few dozen people that interact with the president of the United States on a regular basis. And yet theres hundreds of people working for him. So this was a way for them to see him in a very personal way. I think it sort of gave them added purpose. The first time that we went to the u. N. We had a break one afternoon, and he and reggie love played basketball for like an hour. Now, reggie love was 27 at the time. Was 66. He was the captain of the Duke University Basketball Team when they won the national championship. Barack obama was 20 years older, at least four inches shorter, and didnt start for his high school Basketball Team. But hes like the most competitive guy ive ever met. At one point president obama goes up, blocks reggies shot. They finish the game. And president obama makes a beeline towards me. Comes up to me and he goes did you get that block . And im like scrolling through, and i come to this picture. And he goes he goes, thats great, make that a jumbo. He made reggie sign it, dear, mr. President , nice block, reggie love. Somebody came to me and said we need to get these online. Pete said the white house wants us to put pictures out on flicker, which was a photo streaming platform. My job was to make an edit of from 10,000 down to what would be about 50 pictures a week. That was unprecedented. No Previous Administration had ever put out as many pictures. I thought it was a great way for the public to see what was happening behind the scenes. When you get to be my age, and you look back at things that happen earlier in your life you start sort of connecting the dots a little bit. I was trying to remember with jane when we went to washington. I think it was in 1965. But we went and visited the white house. And we also got this book called the white house. And i used to look at this book all the time. This book was published shortly before kennedy was assassinated and Jackie Kennedy wrote the introduction. She said that the book originally was intended just for children. Im going to get emotional just reading this. It seems such a shame that they, meaning the kids that visited the white house, should have nothing to take away with them. It was hoped that they would read more about the president s who interested them the most. And i was one of them. This book, for each administration, was updated subsequently. The last version of this, the cover photo, and have several photos of president obama inside the book. So you talk about full circle. This was when my mom met president obama for the first time. And he wrote to lillian, it was a joy to meet you, thanks for doing such a great job with pete. So this is my grandmother and grandfather. They were both born in azors. They immigrated within a year or two of each other. My parents both worked. My mom was a nurse. My dad was a boat mechanic. I had no interest in anything other than sports. I didnt get interested in photography until i was in college. If there was such a category, i would have been in the most unlikely to succeed. I think when he was at b. U. He took a course in photography and he came home and said, mom, i want to be a photographer, and i said oh my god, four years at b. U. , and youre going to take pictures. Thats when i thought, oh, my god. To me, it was magic. Shooting a roll of film, rolling that film up onto the reel, and as youre shaking the tray, the image starts to appear. Youre in control from start to finish. And i was like, this is what i want to do. You really wanted to be a photographer and thats a really competitive field. And the day that he left to go to kansas to get his masters degree, he was driving out of the driveway i started to cry. And our dad said, why are you crying . Hes just going away for a year and i said no, hes not, hes never coming back. I was always trying to make a good picture for every assignment, no matter how bad it was. If theres a dog that crosses the street at 1 00, that has a potential to be page 1 photo. You realize your photographs do have an impact. I got a call one day from director of photography at the sun times and he goes we want you to come interview so i flew up to chicago and he hired me and i went from a 6,000 circulation, daily newspaper, where i was the only photographer, to 600,000 circulation newspaper where i was one of 25 photo journalists. I really think it was helpful for me to have the number of experiences that i had had. Did some stuff for national geographic, when life was a monthly i did some work for them. Right after 9 11, a correspondent and i snuck into afghanistan. Just as the war was getting under way. And in some ways was one of the more fulfilling things ive ever done in my career because my images were appearing in the tribune every day. I really felt that i was doing good work and people were seeing it. I dont want people to come away with the impression that i was a war photographer because i wasnt. But when there are rpgs coming at you i did not do a really good job as i was scared [ bleep ] ill admit it. The realization was, okay, this is im not good at this. [ applause ] we thank you again for coming here tonight. Lindsay was actually kidnapped twice in her career. We know that ryan swims with sharks. So pete, was there ever a time when you really really felt fearful in the white house beyond january 20th, 2017 . This white house. Yeah, this white house. No, i never felt fearful. I didnt have bullets flying over my head and i didnt have sharks coming at me from all directions so i had it easy compared to these two. The one thing that we were talking earlier, you have to have intuition in terms of when its time to give the man some space. So its more of just an intuitive sense of when it is time to sort of slowly back away. Every three months we would go to walter reed and he would visit wounded warriors. I think it affected him emotionally. One time he went and we saw cor corey remsberg, the guy he was on patrol with in afghanistan was killed instantly. Corey was thrown into a ravine. He was under water. Somehow he survived, not drowning. He spent months in a coma and he lost half his eyesight and the ability to control half his body. He had to relearn how to walk, talk and eat. But heres the thing that really took me aback. President obama had met corey in normandy the previous june. And i had taken a picture of that encounter. And the picture, we had sent a copy to the family. And it was taped on the hospital wall. And i was looking at that picture and looking at corey and saying to myself, there is the real cost of war. You dont usually see it that starkly. Corey has made remarkable progress. Three years later, he visited with president obama again. He was starting to walk with a walker. In january of 2014 was the guest of honor at the state of the Union Address and sat next to Michelle Obama. And then toward end of the administration, president obama visited him in arizona at his new house. One of the most important parts of the president s day was when they would go out to cities all over the u. S. How long did it last . Seemed like forever. Thank god you guys are all right. Yes, sir. When youre face to face with people theres so much in this world to make me grieve those images are burned into your brain. Stay with me, lets just be and you carry that with you. Pete would always tell me the stories of what happened on the road that day and when you go back, you are constantly reminded why youre working so hard. Everything you gave and nothing escape you touched me so much. Nothing you would take, everything you gave hold me until i die meet you on the other side morning meeting was at 9 30 in the oval office. Every day it was the same kind of meeting. People sitting in the same chairs in the same spots. I would think, i cant look at another picture from this meeting. But you have to look through frame by frame just in case. And one night i saw a scene and i started to cry. And i get chills thinking about it. It was some, i dont know what the meeting was. But i knew from looking at the president s face, the intensity of the decision he was making. And i was incredibly moved. Because i knew the responsibility and the weight of that job and it made me understand how important it is to have the right person in that chair making those decisions. When we vote, were voting for a decision maker. Who is listening to everyone around him and is then making that decision. And people say it doesnt matter who is in the white house. It doesnt matter. It totally matters who is in the white house. Breaking news that the worlds most wanted man has been killed in a mission led by United States special forces. President trump laying out what he watched as he started to view this operation in the situation room. When you look at this picture, it definitely looks like hes looking at the camera. Dont you think . And ive been in this room, you know, more than 1,000 times. The photographer is completely blocking the screen. It looks fishy to me. If youre going to release a photo like that, then youve got to be truthful about what is taking place. What was he looking at . I will go to the New York Times story that i saw. Unlike his predecessor, mr. Trump does not allow his Staff Photographer free range to capture behind the scenes photographs of life and work in the white house. Instead, he most often invites miss craighead or other White House Photographers into the room specifically for the purpose of taking an official picture. We need to have real moments of real history. Not posed moments of history. So its hard to know what youre missing. Well, talk about the bin laden raid, it was a very tense day. Throughout that day he had meetings in the situation room. They had set up the Communications Link in a small Conference Room across from the big situation room. So when president obama walked in, Brigadier General brad webb stood up to give up his chair. And president obama saw that he was on a laptop communicating directly with admiral bill mccraven who was running the raid from afghanistan. And said no, no, no, you stay right there, and ill pull up a chair right next to you. Thats why president obama is seated where he is. Youve got the most powerful people and the executive branch of our government all gathering in this room at the same time. And yet they were powerless. There was essentially nothing they could do to affect the outcome of what they were witnessing. And now its up to those special forces on the ground. That bin laden photo is so powerful because nobody is posing. You can see the nerves on everybodys face in that room. Tonight i can report to the American People and to the world that the United States has conducted an operation that killed osama bin laden, the leader of al qaeda. The picture in the bottom right is right after they knew they had killed bin laden. And you dont see any high fives. It is very anticlimactic in a lot of ways. As a photographer, as well as as a human being, what were some of the things which were easy for you to capture . And what were a little more difficult . I dont know that there was anything that was easy. The hardest things were when he would have to meet with families that were affected by tragedies. And im sad to say that we had to do this too many times. And it was incredibly emotional and difficult. I felt intrusive at times. But also that it was part of my job to document these moments. But i would say that those we the most difficult times. 911. Whats the location of your emergency . Sandry andy High School Elementary school. I think theres somebody shooting in here. Somebody theyre running down the hall. Okay. Theyre still running. Theyre still shooting. There is still shooting going on. Please one of the worst days of his presidency was the day of the Sandy Hook Elementary School shootings in newtown. John brennan who at that time was the Homeland Security adviser was updating him throughout the morning and then finally came in and said 26 people had died including 20 grade school kids. Hes reacting as a parent more than probably as a president. Imagining the horror of kissing your child in the morning. Sending them off to school on the school bus. And then only a few hours later having to identify your childs body, who has been shot multiple times at close range. He felt it was his duty as president to speak to the nation. In these times of tragedy, i had never seen him do this before. Blow his cheeks fast he was unsure whether he could keep it together. The majority of those who died today were children. Beautiful little kids between the ages of 5 and 10 years old. They had their entire lives ahead of them. Ahead of them. Birthdays, graduations, weddings, kids of their own. Among the fallen were also teachers, men and women who devoted their lives to helping our children fulfill their dreams. So our hearts are broken today. This evening, michelle and i will do what i know every parent in america will do which is hug our children a little tighter. Well tell them we love them. And well remind each other how deeply we love one another. But there are families in connecticut who cannot do that tonight. And they need all of us right now. In the hard days to come, that Community Needs us to be at our best as americans, and i will do everything in my power as president to help. Malia, who had just gotten home from school, was stand manage the hallway, and he latched on to her. He would not let her go. Two days later, he was invited to come to newtown. It happened to coincide with sashas annual dance recital, which he was going to have to miss. He decided to stop by the dress rehearsal in the afternoon before flying up to newtown. He sat in the box by himself. He started editing his remarks already for that night. Then when sasha was dancing, he would turn and watch her. At one point, i went down to the third row to take some pictures of sasha in her outfit. I figured those would be the only pictures they would have. When i was standing there, this young one dance troop had filed out from backstage and sat in the row in front of me. There were about 20 or 25 little kids. I said how old are you guys . She said were 6. And i thought to myself, this is what just got wiped out in newtown was this whole row. I had to turn away. I started crying. We flew up to connecticut and he spent two and a half hours meeting with the families. This is the wheeler family, francine and david. Their son ben who was 6 was shot and killed. And their oldest son nate hid in the School Supply closet during the shooting. We learned that the president was coming. We waited for a long time. Because the president s people were trying to hurry him through the process. And he said no. I will take as long as it takes. He comes in and he made a bee line for francine. And he just wrapped her up. He just held her. Let her sob into his lapel. And i asked him, i said, is this different . And he said, i hope so, but i dont know. There is no substitute for empathy. It is a foundational relationship between human beings. And to know that the guy who is running the show cares enough not just to come and visit, but to let you know that he cares about you. That he cares about your wife, you know, that he cares about your 9yearold kid. We are so good at dismissing the people that we elect to serve us. Were so good at turning them into things that arent people. And we have to be very careful about that. Because when you do that, then you get the elected officials that you deserve. Ive seen him run up these steps many times. He didnt run up the steps that night. Whether its newtown or aurora or any of these places, pete was the only guy that was always in those rooms, you know . So you could sense his anger at what was going on around him. So can we go to the place they usually get the cherry tomatoes . Can i get one kale bunch . Thank you. Yep. Oh, yeah. Im voting. I know joe biden. So im voting for joe biden. Wait a minute. Youre pete . I was at your show last night. Oh, great. Thanks. Im toni brown. Welcome to madison. Rumor has it the president takes responsibility for this happy reunion. So as president he started in 2009. So as he gets to know me more, and he gets to meet patty, he would tell people that he liked her better than he liked me. You know . And so he would start working on me like in terms of, well, wait a minute, so you guys have been together for like whatever it was, 15, 17 years. So why havent you gotten married . President obama pushes everybody to get married. He loves love stories. Michelle was on the trip. We were in the Conference Room and hes not letting it go. And hes turning to michelle and saying, can you believe that pete wont ask patty to marry him . That is when he brought up, well do the wedding in the rose garden. And ill officiate. And i remember i said to him, no, i dont want to do that. He said what, the rose garden is not good enough for you . Come hold my hand ill be your biggest fan ooh the most interesting part of my job was that i saw him and all these different compartments of his life. I saw him as a dad. I saw how he behaved with his children. I watched this family grow up, essentially. I think sasha and malia did such a great job under the limelight. And it is really a testament to michelle and barack and marianne robinson, who you see here on the right. Michelles mom helped out, especially when michelle went on solo trips overseas. This is him happy birthday to michelle. We were on a boat ride in the gulf coast. I saw michelle stroking his hand. Then at the second inauguration, just before they boarded the motorcade, i approached him. Michelle was standing next to him. I said, mr. President , do you mind if i ride in the limousine with you for part of the parade route . And he looked me in the eye and said, well, michelle and i were planning to make out. And then he started laughing and said of course you can. Hell tell you the best day at the white house it was day the Congress Passed the Affordable Care act. Not true. The best day for him at the white house was a day that sashas coach could not make the game and he got to coach the game. With little help from reggie love. So the sidwell friends vipers were undefeated. And during the first half, under the tutelage of coach obama, they fell behind. So he called timeout. And sasha is looking at him like, dad you are embarrassing me. These are like 9yearold girls. And hes coaching as if this is game 7 of the nba finals. One of my favorite days was we had a big snowstorm. It was called snowmageddon. And he ended up coming out for about two hours. It was just the three of them and me. At one point they are in the rose garden. And sasha, you can see what shes about to do. She did it. I mean, like who else can throw a snow ball in the face of the president of the United States and not get tackled by the secret service . To this day, he has a photo that is the lock screen photo on his ipad. It is this picture of the three of them doing snow angels on the south lawn. And then they grow up. Where did the time go you were just a little girl in my arms i can see you with my eyes closed theres a moment when our world was so calm princess in a kingdom i would gladly give away the throne to see you smile i wish that you would stay young and although youll grow, youll always be my child snow angel i just want you to stay this way forever snow angel in my heart will always be together snow angel what one of the most emotional days was in 2015 in the morning this day. The Supreme Court upheld samesex marriage. It was beautiful, a summery warm morning. Everyone knew that the decision would come down. That day, we didnt know when. Like every morning, i unlocked the door, turned on the television. You can hear the cheer in the crowd. A very dramatic moment. A 54 decision. I called joe, my now husband, who was there and i said, its done. And the president walked in and put his arm around me. It felt like for that period of time, we were on the right side of history. The president did an interview in the cabinet room. Several months before then. Ive been going through an evolution on this issue. When i think about members of my own staff who are incredible committed monogamous relationship, samesex relationships, i think samesex couples should be able to get married. When he vocalized in that interview his support for samesex marriage, that was a moment for me as well. Sometimes there are days like this. When that slow steady effort is rewarded with justice that arrives like a thunderbolt. Then later that morning we flew to charleston. President obama was invited to give the eulogy for reverend clementa pick ney. He was one of the nine africanamericans shot and killed at Emanuel Methodist Episcopal Church by somebody who had prayed with this group of nine people at a Prayer Service for an hour, and then took out a gun and killed them all. President obama wanted to give a eulogy with the theme of grace. Amazing grace. The amazing grace. Amazing grace [ cheers and applause ] how sweet the sound that saved a wretch like me it was emotional in the moment, as you can imagine. I didnt know he was going to sing amazing grace. And i didnt realize the struggle. You can see him trying to decide, can i pull this off . Should i speak the words or sing them . And hes trying to get the courage up to sing, and he did. Blind but now i see [ applause ] bidding farewell to the reverends daughters and widow. Meeting with some of the other families backstage. And then we flew back to d. C. Someone had decided to light the white house in rainbow colors. These are all white house staff out on the north lawn. People were crying. People were drinking champagne. It was i think one of only two times that i called my wife. I said to her, i dont care what youre doing, what youre wearing. Get in a taxi and come to the white house. You need only the here to see this celebration. How many people are you going to be speaking in front of . There is going to be like 800 people there. Are you ready . Am i ready . Yeah. Was obama nice . Yeah. Youll hear all about him today. Sweet clearly, i could see what he meant to the africanamerican community. As time went on, i was probably more aware of just trying to tell the story of what it meant for them. To have, you know, to have him up on stage. It was often in the back of my mind that he was the first africanamerican president and i had to incorporate that into my photography. This is ruby bridges in person and as pictured in the famous Norman Rockwell painting. She was the first africanamerican to desegregate schools in louisiana. I think it is fair to say if it hadnt been for you guys, i might not be here and we wouldnt be looking at this together. This is Paul Mccartney singing michelle to michelle. The next day i was walking on the colonnade with president obama. I said that was really cool last night when mccartney sang michelle. And president obama turned to me and said, yeah, i dont think Michelle Obama growing up on the south side of chicago as a Young African american kid thought some day shed be sitting in the front row of the white house as first lady, as a former beatle sang her namesake song. And then there is this picture. This is jake in philadelphia. At one point, jacobs mom said, mr. President , he has a question for you. So jacob is like, mr. President , my friends tell me that my hair cut is just like yours. And with that, president obama bent over. Jacob touched his head. Click, i got one photo and it was gone. That image was what barack obama said to us two years ago in an office in chicago. That kid literally cant even believe even though he is seeing the president of the United States in the oval office, until he can feel his hair, he doesnt truly believe that hes just like me. That single image stands for so much more. It stands for how kids will see themselves forever. Its true that at the behest of a 5yearold kid, you would bend other and let a kid touch your head like that. The pete succeeded in offering a window into the man that was occupying the office to show what the office can be, what it has been, what it can be again, to show the kind of integrity of pump, i think thats inspiring. The presidency is about a lot more than just policy. There is something intangible about that office. What do people remember about the obamas . They remember the marriage between michelle and barack obama. They remember a certain speech he gave. They remember how the rooms that used to be only full of white men are suddenly full of people of different races and genders. Thats what they take away from the Obama Presidency. And frankly, thats going have a Lasting Impact on this country and on the world. I think obama understood that the images of him not only being president but being president in a certain way, that could change attitudes. It did i think change perspectives on what is possible and what is achievable for people of color in this country, but it also woke this, you know, constantly present ugly horrific racism. When i first met pete, his politics were not at all evident. I always wonder eed what did pe souza get from president obama . Like how did he change . Because he spent so much time with president obama. The political concern, the feeling that you have to care and make a difference. You can make a difference. He could no longer be this fly on the wall. And i would see these moments when pete became furious for president obama. The way in which pete has the most changed is by becoming a vocal political person because of president obama. Let the refugees free hundreds swarmed the arrivals at sfo today. Citizens in shock of the speed of which President Trumps executive orders are turning into action. Pete souza is a very unlikely instagram superstar, attracting millions of followers after he started replying to President Trumps tweets by posting obama White House Photos, along with snarky captions. He is president obamas former chief photographer whose instagram is now full of pics showing glaring contrasts in how the two president s handle certain situations. Its earned him the moniker the king of shame. Do you have a picture for every single thing President Trump has lied about with barack obama . Pretty much, pretty much, yeah. How much joy do you get when you do it . I get a lot of joy, actually. I see you sitting at home, giggling, working on your laptop. My wife said she didnt know i was that funny. And i said you just havent been paying attention. When i first started out, i was trying to be humorous in my comments. I had all these reporters wanting to interview me about what i was doing instagram and i would not respond. Just say it speaks for itself. In the words of some younger people, they say you troll President Trump. Why . The photographs that i post on instagram now, and the words that i write i think speak for themselves. And i think ive gotten more and more out there in terms of making it pretty damn clear how i feel. There are also a lot of questions about the phone call you received from President Trump. What he said was the president. Yes. The president. He said he knew what he signed up for but it hurts anyway. He couldnt remember my husbands name. If my husband risked his life for our country, why cant you remember his name . Since leaving the white house, i made this conscious decision that i couldnt not say anything and i couldnt not speak out. It was all about the dignity of the office of the presidency. Specially for young people. I didnt want them to think this is the way a president is supposed to behave. No, its not. Pete bore witness to an ethical, decent, not perfect, certainly fallible lawabiding humane presidency. For eight years. And my hunch when i saw pete draw devastating contrasts between what was and what is was, he just felt he had no choice. Whatever instinct that pete may have had to remain behind the scenes seems to have been obliterated by the harm that President Trump was doing and the urgency to call that out, to mobilize people. This was a 911. It just got progressively worse. I just thought it was dangerous. So i think over time, yeah. My instagram posts got more pointed. I thought that trump had just gone way too far. And i said, okay. I want to do this book shade. Trump tweet on one page. My response on the other. Obama portrait, a Coffee Table Book based on the eight years of the Obama Presidency will hopefully last a lifetime. The shade book hopefully will outlive its usefulness on january 20th, 2021. Pete souza i wasnt surprised to see him hit this nerve on social media. I was surprised to see him like on a Television Show talking. You know . Hes a behindthescenes guy. And i think it spoke to just how offended he was by the new reality, and how he felt compelled to speak up. We usually dont see it from a White House Photographer. It is a fly on the wall type quality to him or to her. What makes you want to step out and make this stand . Well, i think this guy disrespects the presidency. Its as simple as that. I always thought he was fairly apolitical. So what is it about this moment that has changed you . He bullies people. He lies. He calls you guys the enemy of the people. He doesnt believe our own intelligence agencies. There are just too many things. Im trying to make an argument that this is not who we are, that this president really doesnt speak for us as americans what it means to be an american. Believe me, he gets lots of hate mail. Because i get a lot of them on his behalf. Hes not loved by everyone for sure. But for the people who feel strongly as he does, they see him as almost a leader to help them get that message across is and to help make some changes in this country right now. How are you . Congratulations to you. Its good to see you. My god, youre kicking ass. I love the book. I saw potus today, and one of the things im telling him you can tell stories now and in context make complete sense. Like you couldnt have defended yourself the way you did about benghazi, for instance. No. And yet i had no choice. I was speaking on behalf of the government and on behalf of the president. That was what i wanted to do. What i committed to do at this time. That meant in that period, i didnt have my own voice. Im a journalist who wishes i could give my opinion once in a while. Im wondering as a white house official photographer, did you have to wait for a certain time the throw shade . Yeah. I would never have done it during his presidency. I would never have done it if, you know, jeb bush or john kasich or look, this is not a partisan thing to me. This is somebody that i feel is not a good person, doesnt respect the office of the presidency, thinks about himself and not other people, lies to us. So it became something that i felt i had to do. I dont think a photo journalist is supposed to be opinionated. Im now opinionated. I in some ways have ruined any chance that i have of being a working photojournalist again. But to me that is a small price to pay for doing what i think is the right thing. Pete and i probably, ive never talked about this, feel a similar sense of obligation and so do a burge of our other former colleagues to fight these battles because we dont want obama to do it. He shouldnt do it. His voice is too important to be trivialized by having to respond to tweets, you know. Ive never been overtly political. And now i am political. I want to make sure Everybody Knows that what this guy is doing is not only not normal. But its really dangerous to the country. This is a serious job, being the president. Im going to do everything i can to make sure people dont forget that. President obama invited the president elect just two days after the election to the white house. It was a surreal day. And it just so happens by sheer coincidence that another meeting had been scheduled that day with a young boy, alex. Alex had written a letter to president obama that he was so taken with that he read excerpts of it at his u. N. Speech that year. I can still remember. In the ambulance, face covered in blood and ash and dust. It looks horrific that someone your age, like younger than me, a year younger than me, being hurt in an ambulance in another country while im sitting at my grandmas watching tv. For days and days, he wanted to ask about oman, show me syria, where is aleppo. First he wanted to send a letter to omran. When i told him, i dont have his address. I dont think he will get it. Thats when he decided to write to the president. My thought was, here goes a santa claus letter. The idea, you write it, you drop it and thats the end of it. Little did we know. He said he wanted him to come live with him and his family. Since he wont bring toys, alex wrote, i will share my bike and i will teach him how to ride it. We will give him a family and he will be our brother. Those are the words of a 6yearold boy. It is so nice to meet you. How have you been . Good. You look very nice in your suit. Thank you. Is that a new suit . Uhhuh. I thought so. You being so nice and kind, hopefully it makes other people think the same way. I was very proud of you. This picture was made 22 minutes after trump had left. This 6yearold kid, the son of two immigrants, showed more compassion, more empathy, more understanding and knows more about what it means to be an american than our current president. This is something that we take very seriously. As soon as there is an outbreak anywhere in the world of any disease, the cdc is in communication with the World Health Organization and other multilateral agencies to try to make sure that weve got an appropriate response. Having watched president obama based on the way he handled the h1n1 epidemic and the ebola crisis in 2014, i mean, if he had been president now, he would have been facing this virus too. He couldnt have stopped it. But he would have listened to the science early on. Its really on trump for not having a nationwide shutdown. Put it in perspective. This is 40 9 11s. 40 9 11s. Thats how many people have died. I view everything now through the lens of the presidency. I think one thing thats changed is the vast majority of the country now realizes that having a competent, honest person in the presidency really does matter. I want to speak directly to the young men and women of color in this country. I want you to know that you matter. I want you to know that your lives matter. You have the power to make things better, and you have helped to make the entire country feel as if this is something thats got to change. There is a light at the end of this road and i know that there is still a long way to go as long as my head is high and i walk with pride go with the strength inside take every step in stride no chance will pass me by as long as i always try wont let my passions die and as long as im alive the future belongs to me the future belongs to me and its gonna be a beautiful thing to see america has always been two stories battling each other. The progressive, inclusive story of people getting more rights and more people being allowed the promise of citizenship and opportunity, and struggling to overcome things, versus people who dont want to give up power. And if you just stacked up the images of the Obama Presidency and the trump presidency, you would see the two stories of america in this darkest possible contrast. And i think thats why petes images have triggered such emotion in people. Thats my america. My america is in these pictures. When history has been written, and the glory days are gone yes, we did. Yes, we did. How will you be remembered thank you, god bless you. What page will you be on . Will you be someone they reference with wise words to quote a paragraph, pages, more than a note symbolize the questions asked, the answer i propose is to look beyond the days gone past to see tomorrow knows that the future belongs to me the future belongs to me its gonna be a beautiful thing the future belongs to me the future belongs to me the future belongs to me the future its coming, a hole in the air from those nights in Tiananmen Square its coming from the feeling that aint exactly there the wars, the sirens night and day from the fires of the homeless, from the edges of the game democracy is coming to the usa im sentimental if you know what i mean oh, i love the country, but i cant stand the scene and im neither left nor right im staying home tonight getting lost in that hopeless little screen but im stubborn as those garbage bags that time did not decay im junk but Im Still Holding up this little wild bouquet democracy is coming to the usa to the usa okay. That was amazing. Hello, im joy reid. That was the way i see it. We have a special treat for our viewers as we discuss what we just saw. Im joined now by pete souza, don porter, director of the way i see it, and former White House Press secretary robert gibbs who met souza when he covered then senator obama as a photographer for the Chicago Tribune and then hired him as the chief official photographer when he took office. Thank you all for being here. And i want to start with you, pete, it is good to see you through camera lens. But i want to first wish you condolences. I know that you lost your mom this week. Im so sorry to hear that. Im in that club as well. Im sorry to hear that. I wanted to give you those condolences to start out. Well, thanks, joy. It was, she was an incredible woman. She lived to 94. And went peacefully which is i guess a good thing. That is. Did your mom have a favorite photo . A favorite photo that you took during your years as White House Photographer . Did she have a favorite of your photos . I think any photograph that i made was her favorite. You know, just the way a mother is, right . A proper mom. You know, watching this documentary, i have to admit, i teared up through a lot of it. Just going back and remembering some of those poignant moments over the eight years that president obama was in office. I think probably cried the most during the sandy hook portion. It was incredibly moving. Talk a little bit about being a fly on the wall in those really tough and painful moments when the president is comforting people who are weeping into his shoulder. Talk a bit about that. Theres no rule book, or guide book on how you interact with people that are affected by a national tragedy. Whether it be a mass shooting or a national disaster. It is inherent in you how you react to these families. The newtown one was especially difficult because there were 20 little kids, 20 first graders that had been shot and killed. He looked at it as a parent. I think in so many ways. And when we went to newtown two days after the shooting, you know the families were still in shock, and here they are meeting the president of the United States under those circumstances. So it is very, very emotional. My job was to document those moments but i didnt want to make anybody feel uncomfortable. I thought david wheeler, his interview for this film was just so poignant. And i think it really spoke to probably how all the families were feeling that night. Yeah. I wrote down what he said in one of his quotes. He said there is no substitute for empathy. It is foundational to the relationship between human beings. I thought his interview was fantastic. It was one of the most poignant moments in the film. I want to go to you really quickly. Youre the man responsible for having the National Treasure that is pete souza. Shade, no shade. Just when hes just being himself and taking great photographs. Talk about this coming together and how you wound up hiring this gentleman to document the obama white house. Yeah. I met pete in 2005. He was on assignment for the Chicago Tribune and he was bugging me to take these pictures behind the scenes at swearing in. And i had avoided taking his phone call for several weeks. I think he called me the night before on somebody elses number. Because i answered the phone. I knew at that point i couldnt pretend that i had lost the signal or something. I was, you know we were all running around pretty harried. And i said, look. Well make it work. Okay. Come tomorrow, like 7 30, 8 00. Whatever time i told him. And i just trusted the process would work out. And what i think you learn pretty quickly with pete is how seamlessly he slips into the background of all this. And he is able to capture those moments of sandy hook. He is able to capture those moments inside the oval office. Because you dont know hes there. You dont feel it. And i think he became so unobtrusive so quickly that there wasnt an excuse to kick him out in 2005. As much as i wanted to. Because i just there is like two press staffers. You dont have time mind the photographer. I knew pete could capture great images. And ill tell you one other quick story. You saw that picture at Robben Island when we went in 2006 again with senator obama. You saw the tour guide is explaining what mandela went through what you dont see. In is, as he is talking about this, pete rushes by everybody. Down the hall and out the door. And im like, where is pete going . And i dont know. Hell figure it all out. And about a minute later, the tour guide finishes and obama steps into the cell that mandela had spent all those years in. And i see pete is on the other side, right . And he is outside looking in through bars. He is not taking the picture with the open door that wasnt afforded to mandela. He was showing us the view that mandela had for all those years. And about that moment he starts taking those pictures. About six other photographers all with their cameras around their necks and their fanny packs, they all rush by us like a herd of people trying to get out there and catch what pete had captured. Pretty early on you realize, the eye that pete has for this kind of stuff. The ability to capture it in a way that really, really is poignant. There was something that you all mentioned, when you talk about being that fly on the wall. The truth of a real photograph when it is real. That situation room moment when president obama takes that seat to the side. Because he is no, im not going to interrupt this operation. I want this to go forward. He takes that he seat to the side. The iconic photo that you took in the situation room upon the killing of osama bin laden. As contrasted with the posed photo that donald trump had created where you make the point that the photographer is obviously standing in front of the screen. Theyre not looking at a screen. Theyre looking at the camera. I want you each to talk about that. Because were facing a moment where we cant necessarily trust the images, the words out of the white house and out of the press secretary. First you, pete, and then robert. I think we need the authentic moments for history. I always looked at it like my job is just to hang around. Hang around and be there when things are happening and photograph the as theyre happening. Dont direct anything. Dont stage anything. You either get it or you dont. And i think, especially in that situation room photograph, you could tell the emotion. You could see how tense it is in that room. Because you know, it is while theyre watching the raid. And i mean, the next day, i remember there was a little bit of sort of faux controversy. Why did hillary have her hand up to her face. And i remember she was doing an interview and said at one point, i didnt even realize pete was in the room. And i was like, thats the way i wanted it to be. I didnt want people to know that i was there. Youre trying to blend in as best you can. Thats the way you make the best picture. If youre there when i guess we cant say the s word. When stuff is happening. Stuff is happening. Really quickly, robert. I think pete wanted to be that, the historian with a camera. He does that. In reality, the history of the raid against osama bin laden, the history of the auto bailout, the history of so many of those moments isnt when someone stands in front of a podium with flanked by a flag and cabinet members and tells you what he already knows and what he is now just communicating to you. It is when the raid happens. It is when the decision gets made. Its the moments of that anguish and that anxiety, and thats what pete captures so perfectly. And i think the advent really of social media allowed everybody in the world to have that window seat for the Obama Administration and to be able to see it on their phones and not just in their newspapers every day. And i think that kind of catapulted us into the ability to tell a story as a leader, as a father, as a husband, you know, somebody who liked to have fun in the snow with the girls, but also could sit there in a room and make an anguished, tough decision. Yeah, well said. Were going to take a quick break. Well be right back with pete souza, robert gibbs. Were going get dawn porter in on this on the other side of the break. So stay with us. And now your copilot. Still a father. But now a friend. Still an electric car. Just more electrifying. Still a night out. But everything fits in. Still hard work. Just a little easier. Still a legend. Just more legendary. Chevrolet. Making lifes journey, just better. Proposition 16 takes on discrimination. Some women make as little as 42 of what a man makes. Voting yes on prop 16 helps us fix that. Its supported by leaders like Kamala Harris and opposed by those who have always opposed equality. We either fall from grace or we rise. Together. Proposition 16 provides equal opportunities, levelling the Playing Field for all of us. Vote yes on prop 16. Were back with pete souza, robert gibbs and don porter. You are a very prolific and wonderful filmmaker. How did you get involved in this project . And what drew you to it . One of the producers of this film, and she and her producing partner jamie levins, they were kind of obsessed with pete an his instagram. Jamie went to his show. She saw his books and it was really jamies idea that this could be a good film. But the real thing that drew me to it, and i was in the middle of making the film the trouble about john lewis was pete was doing exactly what mr. Lewis asked of citizens. He was speaking up. He was speaking out. And as person with a journalism background that i have, i understood what it took for him to cross the line from being the observer, the fly on the wall, to being the person to articulate opinions. And i really respected that. And we just wanted to amplify what pete was doing. And i think had our own kind of plea for people to really lean into the fact that what were seeing now is abnormal. We had the gift that pete worked for two different administrations, and he makes the point that it was not a partisan thing he was doing. It was really to honor america that he was doing it. Yeah. He documented the reagans and the love story. There is a lot of great stuff in the film about that too. Dawn, i heard you got a little emotional at an event with pete and hearing the story. I wonder if there is a particular photo that has particularly meaning to you. I know for me, my favorite pete souza photo he took during this time was the little boy rubbing president obamas hair. I love that photo. It is my personal favorite. If there a particular photo that speaks to you out of all of these many photos . You know, there are so many. I actually think some of the ones i like the most are of president obama just clearly wrestling with a decision, because it gives me, you know, kind of that faith that my leader is doing the job that in this case he should be doing, that hes really got the countrys welfare at top of mind. I also actually really loved the photos that are less wellknown that pete made in africa. And seeing its like the definition of hope in the faces of the people hanging on the then senator obamas words. And then of course some of the family photos are really as parent, you know, really kind of just grab your heart. The love and care and bond between the president and his family is so evident, and pete captured it so beautifully. I know that those photos are really important to the obamas as well. Yeah. And pete, the photos that i also love are the fun photos. A fun obama is a great obama. He was great with kids. He has like baby magic. He holds a baby, the baby stops crying. When you were in those moments with families and with kids, did you ever get asked, you know what . You should go. Were you ever asked, get out of the room . No. I mean, and its a good thing, because there is a lot of families now that have some great pictures of their young kids. And i think that theyre i think they treasure them. Yeah. And robert gibbs, i have to ask you if youve got a favorite photo out of all of then. You were working with the man, and you saw him doing the tough decision, having the fun time with the kids, having the tragic moments. Is there a photo for you that speaks the most to you out of all that youve seen in those eight years . Yeah. I love the photos, as dawn said, of sort of the weight of the office sitting on the shoulders of the president. And those were the tough decision. And so i think watching watching him wrestle with that. But i also love i think the ones of him playing with the girls in the snow are just great, because he im not entirely sure whos having more fun in those pictures. I think it might be i think it might be president obama, even though sasha had a snowball. I think thats what these photos really let people see is not just a president , and not just a leader, and not just somebody concerned about the right policy, but the values that animate those decisions. Yeah, absolutely. Well, i have to tell you, for eight years, we had a good, good man as president. You can see it in all those images and a National Treasure as his photographer. Pete souza, your shade is epic, it is perfection. We appreciate you so much. Thank you for allowing us to see the president in this way. Dawn porter, thank you for making this wonderful, wonderful film. And robert gibbs, man, thank you for everything. And the honesty that came from that office when you were running the press shop. Thanks to all of you all for joining us tonight. Appreciate that. Thank you. Have a good night. Joining us, you, have a good night. The desert is a strange place. So isolated. Somebody got lost out there, a marines wife had gone missing, i never expected to be a part of a huge murder case. My heart just sunk. Something happened. We didnt know if she was stranded in the desert, or can we find her before she meets a horrible end. Its strange that he waited to report her missing. They were laughing and carrying on. There was Something Big going on there