But john boltons publisher, Simon Schuster, they really went to the mattresses for him. They fought tooth and nail. They defied the white house bluster and threats. They fought every legal action. And they they got that thing out. And, you know, Simon Schuster has the First Amendment on their side, and they were righteously, and effectively, standing up for the First Amendment rights of themselves and their author, for sure. To be honest, though, Simon Schuster, also, knew that it was really important that the bolton book hit bookstores, because they knew it would sell a gajillion copies and it did. The bolton book has been a huge bestseller. Something like 800,000 copies in its first week. That was a record for Simon Schuster. Until today, when the same publisher Just Announced that mary trumps new book, about her uncle, the president , her account of her life in the trump family and what she came to learn about her uncle. And what she describes as his manifest unfitness for office. We learned, today, that her book didnt sell 800,000 copies in its first week, like john boltons did. Her book sold nearly 1 million copies, in one day. Sorry, mr. Bolton. Mary trump will have your seat now. And congratulations to Simon Schuster to what is amounting to a bangup summer for people saying absolutely horrifying things about what they know about this president , from close proximity to him. So as i mentioned, tonight, we are going to be joined here by mary trump. And you should know that, before she wrote this book, she was not exactly in hiding. This is, obviously, her debut as an internationallyknown person. But she has pursued a distinguished academic career, including recognition as a literature student at tufts, which may explain, in part, why she is a notably good writer, which i think is helping sell this book. She earned her ph. D. In clinical psychology. Shes contributed to widely cited books in that field. And she has she has been in the press, in the past, as a lowerprofile, but goodstanding member of the trump family. She was notably in the press before, in an instance when something went very, very wrong inside that family. And you should know this for context. I am going to quote this to you from an article in the New York Daily News from december of 2000. Quote. On june 25th, 1999, fred trump, one of the last of new york citys major postwar builders died in a queens hospital at age 93 after suffering from alzheimers disease for several years. Fred the 3rd, a 38yearold real estate broker, told the 650 mourners at Marble Collegiate Church that his grandfather was a generous man, who had always shown an underlying responsibility to those in need. Fred the 3rd was glad he had been invited to speak. It was an acknowledgment, he said, to his dead fathers memory. And to the fact that, no matter what, he and his sister were family. While fred delivered his eulogy, his wife lisa sat in one of the front pews, pregnant with their third child. That night, after returning to their home in greenwich, connecticut, lisa went into labor. All seemed well at first. But 48 hours after baby William Trump was born, he turned blue in his mothers arms. His body, stiffening and then shaking, uncontrollably. It was the first of many devastating seizures to come. What followed for the next harrowing six weeks of his life were brain scans, spinal taps, blood tests, and hea heaheart wrenching visits to hospitals including yale medical center. Infantile spasms, a rare disorder that can lead to Cerebral Palsy or autism and a lifetime of care. Quote, we just dont know what williams future holds and what he will be able to do in his life, said lisa, a fulltime mom. During the babys threeweek stay at mount sinai, robert trump called to assure his nephew that what ever the child needed would be covered by precise, the Trump Company medical plan. Pulmonologists, emergency room visits, when william stopped breathing twice in the first eight months of his fragile life. We were so relieved when robert called, fred the 3rd remembered. Roberts call to fred and lisa was followed by a july 19th letter from the Trump Company lawyer to a family Insurance Broker which read, quote, please instruct precise, again, the Trump Company medical plan, please instruct precise to pay 100 perverse of all costs relating to baby williams care, notwithstanding any plan limits, percentage, number of visits, or maximumdollar amount. Or whether or not they are deemed to be medical necessary. So the baby was born in june, 1999. The day of fred trump sr. s funeral. Lisa trump goes into labor. Baby William Trump is born june 99. The family, as of june and july 1999, was explicitly and in writing, promising to pay through the Family Business health plan 100 of all of the healthcare needs for this little boy and their family. In the meantime, though, there was the matter of grandfather trumps will. Remember, he had passed away in june 99. And there ended up being a dispute in the family, as to whether or not all five of his kids, including the descendants of his eldest son, freddy, who had died. There was dispute as to whether or not all five of trumps kids would receive equal shares of the grandfathers will. Or would only the surviving four kids split the estate . Well, donald trump, the current president , was one of the surviving four kids. And from what you know about him, you can imagine how he felt about that dispute, right . If you cut out the descendants of his deceased, elder brother, freddy. Well, donalds share of the inheritance would be just that much larger. Itd only be split four ways, instead of five. As that dispute percolated in the family, donald trump and his surviving siblings decided to pull the one nastiest, little lever that they had, over their deceased brothers kids. They explicitly moved to cut off the medical coverage for the little baby boy with the seizure disorder. Quote. On march 30th, fred the 3rd received a certified letter informing him that the medical benefits that had always been provided to his family by the Trump Organization would end. Lisa trump, fred the 3rds wife said, quote, i burst out into tears. Fred says, quote, i just think it was wrong. These are not warm and fuzzy people. They never even came to see william in the hospital. Our family puts the fun in dysfunctional. And then, theres donald trump. Asked, in an interview with the daily news, whether he thought cutting this Health Coverage could appear cold hearted, giving given the babys medical condition. Donald told the New York Daily News that he made no apologies. He said, quote, i cant help that. George washington couldnt lie about whether or not he cut down the cherry tree. Jfk had pt 109. Izen you know, all president s have back stories. What they do to get them to the white house. Its part of the allure, right . Its part of why the country chooses them to lead. For donald trump, there is that time he cut off Health Insurance to his baby boy nephew with a rare seizure disorder as a hardball legal tactic against his relatives, so he could get his share of their money. I cannot tell a lie, says george washington, about the cherry tree. I cant help that, says donald trump about denying lifesaving care to a baby so he can inherit his relatives share of his dads money, in addition to the millions of dollars he was already getting from his dads estate. So that makes news, in in 2000. And mary trump surfaces in that story. At the time, shes a grad student and she is trying to be supportive of her brother and her brothers sick, little boy. And she tells the daily news for that story, quote, my aunts and uncles should be ashamed of themselves. Quote, im sure they are not. When mary trumps uncle donald would go on to be elected president in 2016, mary trump responded online to New York Times columnist charles blow. Charles blow was writing online about his dismay with the Election Results that night. Mary trump responded. Quote, worst night of my life. That same night, legal analyst, lisa bloom, wrote on twitter. Quote, dear world, i am so embarrassed for my country. Please, do not judge us too harshly for this. Mary trump wrote online, in response. Quote, we should be jumgdged harshly. I just hope we do the work to right this horrific wrong. I grieve for our country. Bloom then wrote, quote, we are not moving to canada. We are stating and fighting like hill. Like hillary, like hell. We are staying and fighting like hill for our values and our country in the courts in the streets. Mary trump wrote back to her online that night, quote, 2020. Period. Well, now, its 2020. And mary trumps new book about her family and, specifically, about her uncle, sold a million copies on the first day of its release this week. And the white house did everything it could to try to stop this book from coming out, too. You know, threatening and talking all sorts of smack. The president s younger brother, mary trumps uncle robert, miraculously, sprouted the same antifirstamendment lawyer the president s repeatedly used to try to stop people from publishing things he doesnt like. They sued mary trump to try to stop the book. You know, the past financial disputes within the family, on which ms. Trump and the president have most definitely been on opposing sides. That tells you, theres probably some family bitterness there. So you can take that as a grain of salt when you read very unflatering things she has to say about him. But financial disputes themselves. She is not hiding them. And theyre not just psychological context in understanding what she has written here. Those are also material to this as news. Because part of the story mary trump has to tell is about the president cheating, financially. Including, trying to cheat members of his own family. Those disputes, ultimately, lead to mary trump having reams of trump Family Financial documents. Which, turns out, contained evidence of decadeslong schemes, carried out by the president and his family. To not just evade taxes but to commit serious financial fraud, including some types of financial fraud that may have affected tenants in new york city, in a way that continues, even to this day. Those alleged, fraudulent schemes and taxevasion schemes were laid out, from those documents that mary trump provided. And explained, ultimately, in a gonzo, huge, New York Times investigation that produced a Pulitzer Prize for the reporters who wrote it. As both congressional investigators and new york prosecutors have just been cleared by the United StatesSupreme Court to pursue financial records and tax records for both the president , himself, and his businesses. Just today, new york prosecutors and the president s lawyers were in court arguing about how quickly a subpoena for his financial records could now be served. Now, Supreme Court says that he cant evade that subpoena just because hes president. I should say, the prosecutors are making the case to that judge today for how quickly theyd like to get those records from the president. The president s lawyers were arguing to the judge, how much more slowly theyd like the judge to go, please, because, tick tock, elections in november. But, also, tick tock, mary trumps book about her lifelong knowledge of the conduct and scams of the president. That book is out, now. And it has sold a million copies and there is a weekslong waiting list right now to get a physical copy of this book at some major booksellers. That said, you have an advantage because you are here, and mary trump joins us here, tonight, to talk about it. Joining us now is mary l. Trump. She is the niece of president donald trump. She is the author of the new book called too much and never enough, how my family created the worlds most dangerous man. Ms. Trump, thank you so, so much for being here. We have been through weve been through the wars together, technically, in terms of trying to get this interview on the air. Thank you so much for sticking with us, and thank you for being here. Its an honor, rachel. I really appreciate your having me. First, let me ask you. In terms of the introduction that i did there and the way that i set this up. If im looking at any of that the wrong way . Or if ive been misconstruing anything that you were trying to do, in terms of the way that you approached the book . I want to make sure that i am explaining these things, in terms that youre comfortable with. Yeah. It was, both, accurate and devastating. How are you doing since the book has landed . I mean, i imagine you knew that this was going to make a splash. But i cant imagine that you thought it was going to make this big a splash. Both, in terms of the number of books sold but, also, the attention. The National Attention that this has brought to you. Is this how you thought it would go . Not even close. Its been extraordinarily gratifying, i have to say. Its been a long time coming, and it hasnt always been an easy road. So im really happy, way beyond my expectations. Have you heard from anybody in your family or in the white house or the Trump Organization or anybody . Since the book came out or since people knew what was in the book . Or has it just been basically the legal fight to try to stop you from publishing and other than that, youve been on your own . Yeah, its just been the legal fight. And i think thats thats fine with me. Thats appropriate. I found myself thinking, in Speed Reading the book, the first day i got it. And then, rereading it when i found out i was going to get the chance to talk to you. I found myself thinking about your, like, acute cognizance of whether its a useful thing for you to do this. You, obviously, on election night, were disponderespondent. And why you feel he is so inappropriate, so unsuited for the job. But you, also, seem to be sort of resigned to the idea that nothing you might say might change anybodys view about him. You didnt release the book before the 2016 election, because you didnt think it would make a difference or change anybodys mind. How did you how did you how did your state of mind about that question change, between 2016 and now, that you felt like it was worth taking it on now . It was worth putting yourself out there . Yeah. Thats a great question. Theres been quite an evolution. And i think we need to start with the fact that the concept of learned helplessness is something that runs very deep in my family. And i think there are examples in the book that point to that. So, in 2016, literally, all i would have had was my own experience and my own voice. And i there was no reason for me to believe that either one of those would have mattered. I thought about it. But, first of all, in the context of all the other things that were going on, that donald was getting away with. From his attacks on a gold star family, the khans and a reporter at the New York Times. And of course, culminating in the access hollywood tape. I just didnt think anybody would take me seriously. I had a lot of reasons to believe that i would be dismissed as a disgruntled, disinherited niece, who had been out of the family, to all intents and purposes, for almost 20 years. And part of it, too, was thinking that donald was the problem, right . And of course, after the inauguration, he would be surrounded by more competent people, who understood how government worked. And they would protect him, and us, from his worst impulses. Clearly, i was wrong. To make that assumption. So it wasnt just the speed with which he had started upending norms, which he started doing during the campaign. It was the number of people who lined up to help him in that endeavor. Which has only grown longer and more egregious, as times gone on. I cant say that there was a last straw because there have been so many straws. But certainly, the horrors at the border. You know, the separating of children, from their parents. The torture. The kidnapping. And the incarceration of them in cages was was unthinkable. Unbearable. And when i had when an opportunity presented itself to me to do something, i needed to take a leap. Our guest tonight is mary trump. Her new book is called too much and never enough. Well be right back with more. R well be right back with more. As a caricature artist, i appreciate what makes each person unique. Thats why i like Liberty Mutual. They get that no two people are alike and customize your Car Insurance so you only pay for what you need. Almost done. What do you think . I dont see it. Only pay for what you need. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. In a highlyconnected lexus vehicle at the golden opportunity sales event. Lease the 2020 es 350 for 359 a month for 36 months. Experience amazing at your lexus dealer. Experience amazing announcer reliability is everything. So, if your networks down, youre down. Verizon knows your customers need to reach you seamlessly. Your team needs to work from different places across many devices. Plus, you want the security trusted by some of the Largest Companies in the world. And thats why you trust us. The most Reliable Network in america. When ourkids, bedtime her kids moved in with us. She was worried we wouldnt be able to keep up. Course we can. What couldnt keep up was our bargain detergent. Turns out its mostly water, and that doesnt work as well on stains. So, we switched back to tide. One wash, stains are gone. Kind of like our quiet time. [daughter slurping] what are you doing . Dont pay for water. Tide is concentrated with three times the active cleaning ingredients. If its got to be clean, its got to be tide. groans hmph. food grunting menacingly when the food you love doesnt love you back, stay smooth and fight heartburn fast with tums smoothies. Tum tumtum tum tums dramatic section of the book, towards the end. About the leap that you took, when you decided that you would provide the financial documents that you had, to the New York Times. Theres this great moment, where you describe the reporter, Suzanne Craig, from the New York Times. Turning up on your doorstep to ask help to ask for your help with this thing that they are working on in terms of trump family finances. And you say to her that it is, quote, so not cool that you are showing up at my house. And you send her away but you do let her leave leave her card with you. And i asked Suzanne Craig about that, and she was very professional and really wouldnt talk about her side of that, at all. Other than to confirm that everything you were saying was true. But that that seems, to me, like that was, maybe, a pivot point for you, too. You initially, didnt have any interest in talking to her. But something happened with you, alone, where you decided, you know what . Maybe those documents can help and they shall get out there. And without even really knowing what was in them, you decided to hand them over. What was that process like . First of all, the the crucial difference was that Suzanne Craig, extraordinary investigative reporter, was finally giving me something concrete that i could do. I had totally forgotten about those documents. And there was no reason for me to think they mattered. They hadnt mattered when i needed them, 20 years ago. Why would they matter now . And after i asked her to leave but took her card, anyway, in an interesting bit of unconscious wish fulfillment, i guess. She persisted. She wrote me a few letters. She called a couple of times. And i thought about it. You know, i i still wasnt, necessarily, going to do anything because it wasnt even clear to them what would be in these documents, quite honestly. And i didnt feel, yet, able to. It would have been taking a big risk. Not that i necessarily felt that but it was so amorphous, still, for me. And thennings, i fractured my f metatarsal, badly, and wound up on my couch for a few months. So i watched far too much tv than was good for me, and was on twitter far too much, as well. And watching, in real time, what was happening to this country. The destruction of institutional norms. The perversion of our institutions, that were designed to protect us. The failure of the other branches of government was really weighing on me. So finally, one night, i remembered all of the things sue had been telling me. And i decided to trust her. And i called her. We had a long conversation. And within a week, i was on my way, on my crutches, to the office of the lawyer who had represented me all those years ago. And its a much longer story than ill tell now. But a few weeks later, i left with 19 boxes full of, what turned out to be, quite explosive documents. And they were explosive in ways that you didnt, necessarily, understand when you decided to hand them over. I mean, part of the times reporting and part of the reason their piece was like 14,000 words and went on to win the Pulitzer Prize is that they were able to tease out from, essentially, anadign looking records, this incredible story of alleged fraud and tax evasion. And by the way, in terms of the president s potential legal liability. But by the time the times story came out, did you know what they had . Did you know that sort of the explosiveness of alleged misdeeds that they were going to uncover, thanks to what you gave them . I had no idea. It was extraordinary. I mean, the brilliance of that reporting that those the analyses they did and the story cannot be overstated. They were anadign documents but they were also incredibly complex. And the financial devices that my family used to cover up certain things they were doing, were not easily decipherable. So, i was utterly blown away. As, you know, just objectively by by the story but, also, personally. To find out just exactly what had happened in the family. That i didnt understand, at the time. And also, considering it wasnt just, you know, people in my family did these things that they shouldnt have done. But that these were my aunts and uncles, who also happen to be my trustees. And clearly, i didnt benefit from the role that they were supposed to play in protecting my financial interests when i was younger. The consequences of that reporting and of what was uncovered, thanks to those documents that you had access to and handed over and that those reporters analyzed. Still, im not sure we totally understand what the ultimate implication of that is going to be. Obviously, theres statute of limitations questions for a lot of that alleged behavior, in terms of whether or not it could ever be criminally charged. But it does seem to have cost your aunt marian trump barry, to resign ahead of an ethics inquiry that would have looked into her role in those financial schemes. Also, potentially linked to both the congressional investigation and the new york prosecutors subpoenas that have now been green lit by the Supreme Court in terms of the president s finances and Trump Organization finances being handed over. Going through what youve been through, learning what you have learned, knowing what your family has done. Do you have any expectations, in terms of what prosecutors or congressional investigators might find, if they got complete the kinds of access that they want to the financial records that your uncles trying to keep hidden . I have no particular insight into that. You know, nobodys spoken to me about it. Essentially, my role ended when i handed over the 40,000 pages of documents. But if if the times story is anything to go by, i think there is a lot more to uncover. And there will clearly, now that the Supreme Court made, in my opinion, the correct ruling, there will be many more documents to come. Let me ask you, mary, about something you said in an interview with the Washington Post this week. You talked with Ashley Parker at the Washington Post. And and you said there was shes quoted you saying there was kneejerk antisemitism, kneejerk racism in your family. The the post quotes you as saying growing up it was sort of nofrmle to hear them use the n word or use antisemitic expressions. Do you mean, just generally, in the family, that was an accepted thing . Or do you mean, specifically, you heard your uncle donald use that kind of language . Just generally, with the older generations. As if it were perfectly commonplace and ordinary to say such things. I had the benefit of living in jamaica, not jamaica estates, and going to school in forest hills. So i didnt share their ideas about race and and judaism at all. But, you know, when you grow grow up with that as being perfectly normal, then, you dont really think twice about it. I have to press you on it a little bit. If just to ask if the president , if your uncle, was an exception to that in your family . Or if he if if you ever heard him express either use antisemitic slurs or the n word or ra sentiments like that . Did you hear it from him, too . Oh, yeah. Of course, i did. And i dont think that should surprise anybody, given how virulently racist he is today. Have you heard have you heard the president use the n word . Yeah. And antisemitic slurs, specifically . Yes. Mary trumps new book too much and never enough is about her uncle, the president , and her upbringing in the trump family. We will be right back with more. Family we will be right back with more. And that protects our customers 24 7. Sorry im late, everybody, and apologies for my appearance. You look fine. We were just talking about yeah, right. I look like a wanted poster. I didnt have time to get my beard routine in this morning, so. What beard routine . Ah. Well, the key is maple nectar. Gives it that sheen. Is there something wrong with my screen . Mnhmnh. Jamie, what are talking about . Youre right, alan. We should be talking about bundling home and auto with progressive, not this luscious mane of mine. [ laughs ] jamie, do you know what a beard is . Stand up to moderate to severe rheumatoid arthritis. And take. It. On. With rinvoq. Rinvoq a oncedaily pill. Can dramatically improve symptoms. Rinvoq helps tame pain, stiffness, swelling. And for some. Rinvoq can even significantly reduce ra fatigue. Thats rinvoq relief. With ra, your overactive immune system attacks your joints. Rinvoq regulates it to help stop the attack. Rinvoq can lower your ability to fight infections, including tuberculosis. Serious infections and blood clots, sometimes fatal, have occurred. As have certain cancers, including lymphoma, and tears in the stomach or intestines, and changes in lab results. Your doctor should monitor your bloodwork. Tell your doctor about any infections. And if you are or may become pregnant while taking rinvoq. Take on ra talk to your rheumatologist about rinvoq relief. Rinvoq. Make it your mission. If you cant afford your medicine, abbvie may be able to help. I thought was the singl singleweirdest thing in the book. Which other reviewers and people who have read it and talked about it have not singled out but this strikes me as so weird, i literally woke up in the night thinking about it. Im sorry. No, its all right. You wake up a lot, anyway. But its this anecdote, where you are being introduced to, not the president , but donald trump, your uncle at the time, is introducing you to melania, his wife. Who would go on, of course, to become the first lady. Its on page 163. He introduces you to mrs. Trump. And then, he immediately tells melania, in front of you, that you had a terrible drug problem. That you have overcome. Which is not true, and you correct him in the moment. And say ive never done drugs in my life. And then, you say this. You say he slid me a look and smiled. He was embellishing the story for effect, and he knew that i knew it. She was a total disaster, he said. Smiling, more broadly. So the reason this sticks with me is not just because he told a weird lie about you doing drugs, when you didnt do drugs. But that he voiced that lie, in front of you, when he knew that it wasnt true. And then, seemed to sort of take pleasure in you being helpless before him lying about you . Its very psychologically, youre trained in clinical psychology, psychologically, thats a very weird portrait about what pleasure a person would get from lying, isnt it . Yeah, its also a power play. One, it fits into his favorite narrative. You know . The comeback is much more impressive, if youre coming back from a really awful place in the gutter, like being a drug addict, instead of just like having a tough time in life. Just as with his comeback, you know, it was the bankruptcies and the horrible economy. And he was really down for the count. So, therefore, climbing the summit again was even more impre impressive. Although, you know, its questionable whether that actually happened. So theres that. Its framing the narrative, in a way that he prefers. It also makes him the savior because, remember, that story is told in the context of, and then, i gave her a job. So hes sort of taking responsibility, in part, for my reclamation, if you will. But, more than that, it really is a power play. The difference between that anecdote and other things i see happening is, most of the time, people dont correct him. Which completely plays into his hand because then hes he he can do it with impunity. In that sort of the the comeback idea there is because he did, at one point, engage you to potentially ghostwrite another one of his ghostwritten books, which would be about the art of the comeback. Its, also, telling and fascinating to me that, after you spent time at the Trump Organization. And you were, you know, provided materials that you were supposed to sort of use to start ghostwriting this book. You write, sort of pointedly, as the end in the last line of one of your chapters. That for all that you were allowed to see and all of that you were allowed to witness, including sitting in on his supposed business phone calls, where hed just put somebody on speaker, without that person knowing that you were listening in. Getting all this access. You write that really, at the end of it, had absolutely no idea what he did for a living. That it wasnt it never became clear to you what his actual business work was because it never really seemed like he was doing anything. Thats fascinating to me because a lot of people who have taken a look at his finances and his supposed business background have also come up empathy. But they were looking from a distance. You were looking from up close, and just felt like there was no actual real business work ever done by him. Right. Its also important to remember it was a very small company. Certainly, compared to other real estate developers. But the only work i saw being done was by other people. In the office. So it was pretty fascinating. First of all, his never being willing to sit for an interview with me. But then, just having absolutely no insight into any productive projects that he was engaged in. I didnt see any evidence of it. Mary trump is our guest tonight. Her new book just sold nearly a million copies, on its first day. More ahead. Stay with us. More ahead stay with us these are real people, not actors, whove got their eczema under control. With less eczema, you can show more skin. So roll up those sleeves. And help heal your skin from within with dupixent. Dupixent is the first treatment of its kind that continuously treats moderatetosevere eczema, or atopic dermatitis, even between flare ups. Dupixent is a biologic, and not a cream or steroid. 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In terms of the work that he is capable of, you spent some time in the book discussing the president s terrible, consequential mismanagement of the coronavirus epidemic. And you spend a few pages kind of marveling at the fact that it wouldnt have been hard for any president to be kind of a hero here, right . To use the defense production act to produce more supplies and tests and ppe. I mean, you just have to listen to the scientific experts and, you know, amplify their message and do what they say. You can activate the gears of government, that are supposed to turn during times of crisis. But instead, he didnt. And you kind of, as i said, marvel at that in the book. But i think the country, along with you, is kind of stuck on this open question that you are asking here. About why and how he has bungled this crisis so badly. Just now, openly musing that it will go away on its own, as if thats the only thing he is capable of doing. I want to just talk a little bit about why you wrote this part of the book and what you think that answer may be as to why the president has made all the decisions around this crisis and done so little work to fix anything. I thought it was very important to address this because, of course, its ongoing. Even at the time i was writing, we were i think, in new york, we were past the worst of it. But it was clear that the rest of the country was not doing what it needed to do. I want people to understand what a failure of leadership this is. And the reason hes failing at it is because hes incapable of succeeding at it. It would have required taking responsibility, which would, in his mind, have meant admitting a mistake. Which, in his mind, would be admitting weakness which, in my family, was essentially punished with the death penalty. Symbolically or otherwise. What i think we need to grapple with, now, is why so many people are continuing to allow this. The fact that he is dividing us, at the expense of peoples lives. I mean, what, were 140,000 americans, and counting, are dead. And the vast majority of those people did not need to lose their lives, if only donald had said, listen to the scientists. Wear a mask. Stay home. The fact that this is continuing, people are dying every day. There are states in this country that are absolutely out of control. And to curry favor with donald, certain governors are continuing to ignore the science. And more people are getting sick, and more people are going to die. It is utterly insane, at this point. We need to wake up. And instead of taking it seriously, instead of standing aside and letting the experts take over, donald is hawking black beans. Its, you know, the it would be absurd if it werent so devastating. Your uncle, of course, has a very reasonable chance at winning a second term. Any incumbent president does. Even one with sort of upside down numbers, like he has right now. Uhhuh. What do you think the consequences of another four years of a donald Trump Presidency would be . You write about that in the book, as if you are genuinely fearful that a second term could be, qualitatively, more dangerous for the country than his first term was. Yeah. And i want to i want to make something really clear. This is beyond partisanship. This is so beyond party. We need to be thinking about this as americans. We need to be thinking about what who we want to be as a people going forward. I hear people say all the time, this is not who we are. This is exactly who we are right now. So, continuing along this path, which is exactly what would happen if donald were to be elected in 2020, would, i absolutely believe, be the end of the american experiment. I do not believe theres any coming back from this. There are too many enablers who are, for whatever reason, continuing to enable him. Bill barr has gutted the justice department. Mike pompeo has gutted the state department. We are in serious, serious danger, here. And unfortunately, that is no longer hyperbolic. Thats just the way it is. Do you share the concerns that some people have voiced, that if your uncle loses the election, that he might try to not leave the white house . That he might try to hold onto power, through some extra democratic means, by force. Do you think that, that sort of worry is is hyperbolic, at this point . Or is that the sort of thing that youre concerned he might resort to . No, i think its perfectly reasonable to worry about that. But how he responds depends a lot on how if he loses, how badly he loses. I think the more resounding joe biden victory, the less likely it is for donald to stick around. He, as a, you know, somebody who needs to be right all the time and needs to be winning all the time, will need, desperately, to spin away from a crushing defeat. And i dont know what form that would take. But that, as far as im concerned, is the only way to, not guarantee but, at least give us a better possibility that there will be a peaceful transition, after the election on november 3rd. Okay. Were back with mary trump, in just a moment. I have one last sort of difficulttoask question that i want to ask her. That is straight ahead. Stay with us. To ask her. That is straight ahead stay with us tada did you know Liberty Mutual customizes your Car Insurance so you only pay for what you need . I should get a quote. Do it. Only pay for what you need. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. vo you start with americas verizmost awarded network, to build unlimited right. The one with unbeatable reliability 13 times in a row. This network is one less thing i have to worry about. vo then you give people more plans to mix and match so you only pay for what you need verizon unlimited plan is so reasonable, they can stay on for the rest of their lives. Awww. vo you include the best in entertainment and you offer it all starting at 35. Because everyone deserves the best. This is unlimited built right. Only on verizon. Sprinting past every leak in our softest, smoothest fabric. Shes confident, protected, her strength respected. Depend. The only thing stronger than us, is you. With spray mopping to lock away debris and absorb wet messes, all in one disposable pad. Just vacuum, spray mop, and toss. The shark vacmop, a complete clean all in one pad. Mary, i have just one last question for you. And again, i want to thank you for spending this much time here and talking with us. And i just have to ask. Given what you are saying about your uncle and what degree you think hed be willing to go to, in order to get what he wants. And what youve done, in terms of handing over documents to reporters, and what you have said in the book and what youve laid out here. I just have to i i find myself worrying about you, and wondering if you are scared. If you feel like you have put yourself in personal danger, by doing what youve done and talking the way that you have and saying the things that youve said that the president , obviously, doesnt want out there in the world. Its different than some critic who has no relation to him criticizing him, in harsh terms. What youre doing is something that is different and comes from a place thats very close to him. Im wondering if you feel safe. Im not skafred. Scared. Im taking appropriate precautions. Certainly. Because i i am not diluted about potential scenarios. He is in a position of great power. I know my family to be quite vindictive, and donald has a rather passionate following. But all of that aside, i this need i needed to do this. I felt it was my responsibility. I felt it was my obligation. And what ever the consequences are, im prepared to deal with them, as best i can. Mary l. Trump. The book is called too much and never enough, how fmy family created the worlds most dangerous man. It is breaking records on the first day. Mary trump, thank you so much for for writing the book. But also, especially for being here to help us understand it. Come back anytime you want to. Love to you have you back. Thank you so much, rachel. I need to tell you we did ask the white house tonight for a response to mary trumps claims that she has heard the president use antisemitic slurs and racial slurs, including specifically, the n word. The white house gave us this statement in response. They said, quote, this is a book of falsehoods, plain and simple. The president doesnt use those words. To to be clear, this claim that mary trump says shes heard the president use the n word and other racist slurs and antisemitic slurs. That claim isnt, actually, from her book. Its just something she said in this interview. So them denouncing the book doesnt help. But still, we thank the white house for at least giving us the statement. That is going to do it for us tonight. Im now going to go have like ten martinis and try to not think about ten martinis and try not to think about this for a few hours. God bless us all. My friend called me, and she was hysterical. As soon as she called we all knew who did it. We were like, this guys going to get off. How does this keep happening . Just keep praying. Thats all we can do. There arent a lot of murders in paradise. People still