Washington post to have engaged in a sexual encounter with a 14yearold girl when he was in his 30s. This guy who is constantly posturing about howdy vout he is and sinful everyone else is. Crime, abortion, sodomy, sexual pervasion, sweep our land. Roy moore insists hes not guilty yetting everybody in the Republican Party in alabama is making excuses for his behavior. Some gop leaders in alabama say they back moore even if the worst was true. Unless he can prove his innocence, burden is now on him within the next day or so i believe he has to step down. John mccain and mitt romney calling roy moore unfit for office. This to me is the party into the gutter. If this does not offend your sensibilities what will. Republicans need to decide if its worst to have a democrat in the senate or a pedophile. I dont remember every dateding any girl without the permission of her mother. Today the National RepublicanSenatorial Committee announced its severing with roy moore to Alabama Senate seat on december 12th because of a 14yearold girl. And a 16yearold girl. And a 17yearold girl. And a 18yearold girl with whom roy moore had inappropriate contact when he was a 32yearold assistant District Attorney according to a report in the Washington Post based on interviews with over 30 sources in alabama. Roy moore let 24 hours pass in the face of these accusations before finally raising his voice in his defense today. But he still did not dare to show his face. And so he presented himself to the safest possible forum in america to make his case. Shawn hanna dty radio show where asked him a series of leading questions that he never would have been allowed to ask if he was roy moore defense lawyer in la croom. Shawn hannity tried to help roy moore in every way he possibly could. But as lawyers who represent guilty clients can tell you, he couldnt get the sound of guilty out of roy moores voice. Roy moore denied a statutory Rape Allegation against Leigh Corfman what roy moore did to her had she was 14yearold. Gave a statement saying i stand by my comments. The article is very detailed. Anyone with questions should please reread it. And i want to say thank you to my friends and others who have supported me and my story. And so we will reread some of those accusations. Leigh corfman ploemother suppor her story of meeting roy moore in the courthouse where he was a District Attorney. It reports struck up a conversation with her mother and offered to watch the girl while her mother went inside for child custody hearing. He said, oh, you dont want her to go in there and hear all that. Ill stay out with her says corfman mother, nancy well 71. I thought how nice for him to want to take care of my little girl. According to the Washington Post report, roy moore had other plans for her little girl. Called her on the phone. Set up a date. With a 14yearold girl. Arranged a place to pick her up where her moent wouldnt know and drove her 30 minutes to his home in the woods. Leigh corfman told the Washington Post, quote, before she long she was lying on a blanket on the floor. She remembers moore disappearing in the other room and not coming out but with nothing more than white tight underwear. She says that he guided her hand to his under wear and she yanked her hand back. I wasnt ready for that. I had never put my hand on a mans penis much less an erect one corfman says. She remembers thinking i dont want to do this and i need to get out of here. Every bit of roy moores behavior that day with Leigh Corfman was a felony punish bab by at least ten years in prison and that is what roy moore denies. Roy moore claimed today that the Washington Post is completely biased against him as it is biased against President Trump and thats why they wrote this article with that lie. But then in the very same interview, roy moore used that very same article to prove that he was a good guy. He used the stories about the other little girls told in that very same article to prove that he is a good guy. Its a direct attack on this campaign. And it involves a 14yearold which i would have never had any contact with, nothing with her mother, or any courthouse or anywhere else would i have done that. In fact, her allegations contradict the whole behavior pattern that the other two of the young ladies even witnessed them self. So there he is saying that the behavior pattern described by the other two teenage girls in the very same article was accurate. He wants you to believe that the other two teenage girls and he doesnt want you to believe the 14yearold girl who has accused him in effect of Sexual Assault and statutory rape. Okay. Here are the stories raioy moor wants you to believe. Wendy miller was working and he wants you to believe that he asked a 16yearold on dates and hes a nice guy because he gave up when her mother said no. Ray moo roy moore wants you to believe debbie gibson, she was 17, when roy moore spoebke to her High School Civics class. He met her in her civics class in high school when he was speaking to the class. And he asked her out on dates. And he had several dates with the girl. 32yearold prosecutor. The girl he met in her High School Civics class. And hes proud that the Washington Post says those dates did not go beyond kissing and no sex on those dates according to the Washington Post. Debbie gibson says that roy moore took her to his house, and played guitar. The same house where he said he assaulted Leigh Corfman. Gloria deason was a 18yearold cheerleader when roy moore began taking her on gates that included wine, legal drinking age in alabama at the time was 19. They met at the mall, too. Gloria deason says they never had sex when she was 18yearold dating the 32 year old prosecutor. And roy moore believes that that story means that he was a good guy. Thats the whole behavior pattern you just heard roy moore talk about. Now, lets listen to the part one more time where roy moore is using the other girls in the story to prove that the 14yearold is not telling the truth. In fact, her allegations contradicts the whole behavior pattern that the other two ladies witnessed them self. And that is it roy moore pleading gie pleading gulty to the preaccusations of trying to date and dating teenage girls when he was 32 years old. A 16yearold whose mother was there to protect her daughter from roy moore, a 17yearold he met in her High School Self ici class. And a 18yearold cheerleader, thats his defense, that those girls are telling the truth about roy moore. Because they say he did not have sex with him. Thaelgs the truth. Thats what he says is the truth. That was a very, very incriminating answer. Roy moore said that he didnt remember speaking at debbie civic class, but did say that he knew her. So naturally Shawn Hannity asked if you remembered going out on dates with her. I dont remember specific dates, i do not. And i dont remember if it was that time or later, but i do not remember that, no. But you know her but you never dated her ever. Is that what you are saying . Know her but i dont remember going out on dates. I knew her as a friend. If we did go out on dates, then we did. But i do not remember that. In a croom ourtroom if you d rerp if you went out on dates when you are talking about the little girl you met in civics class when you were 32 years old, there is not ha jury . America thats going to believe that you did not go out on dates. There is no man in the world who would not remember speaking to a High School Civics class at age 32 and then going out on dates with one of the girls in that High School Civics class. If we did go out on dates, then we did. Thats his testimony. Then Shawn Hannity turned to the general idea of a 32yearold guy dating teenage girls. Would it be unusual for you as a 32yearold guy to have dated a woman as young as 17 . That would be, what, 15 year difference or a girl 18 . Do you remember dating girls that young at that time . Not generally, no. If i did, you know, im not going to dispute anything, but i dont remember anything like that. But you dont specifically remember having any girlfriend that was in her late teens even at that time . No, i dont remember that. And i dont remember ever dating any girl without the permission of her mother. And then Shawn Hannity had to go to a commercial or in a courtroom they would have called a recess. And during the commercial Shawn Hannity clearly realized there was a serious problem for roy moore that just developed in that interview that roy moore did not deny dating teenage girls when he was 32. And so after the commercial, this happened. If youre 32, and you do date, again, this is a difference, 17 or 18yearold, thats a pretty big gap for a pretty young girl. Is that something you did when you were dating . Im not talking about the 14yearold in that specific allegation. Would it be normal behavior back in those days for you to date a girl thats 17 or 18 . No, not normal. My daughter is 17. My daughter is 16 years old. If she is 17 or 18 i dont want her dating a 32yearold. I wouldnt either. And you can say unequivocally you never dated anybody that was in their late teens like that when you were 32 . It would have been out of my customary behavior, thats right. Out of my customary behavior. There is Shawn Hannity doing everything he possibly can to guide roy moore to the correct answer and he cant get him there. Can you say unequivocally that you didnt date anybody that was in their late teens like that when you were 32 . And Roy Moore Says out of my customary behavior. That is a very different answer, a very different phrase from the word never. Shawn hannity knew exactly how deep a hole roy moore had dug for himself so he gave it one more try. And he tried to put the right words into roy moores mouth in a way that would never be allowed in a courtroom. And those were the words that roy moore had not yet said. In other words you dont recall ever dating any girl that young when you were that old . Ive said no. And you think thats inappropriate too, thats what you are saying . Its in appropriate, yes. And so the best roy moores defense lawyer could get him to say today is that he does not recall dating any girl that young when he was that old. Does not recall that is the roy moore defense. That was enough for republican senator mike lee who tweeted this. Having read the detailed description of the incidence as well as the response from judge moore and his campaign, i can no longer endorse his candidates for the u. S. Senate. So shawn handty believes if if roy moore dated 14yearold when he was assistant District Attorney, that he is unfit to be a senate candidate. And he got roy moore to agree with that principle. And the best roy moore could say is that i dont recall when it came to the question of dating teenage girls that Shawn Hannity would make him unfit for senate. I dont recall. They did accusations very clear and detailed and roy moore has denied the most important and the most criminal of those accusations. The one with the most severe penalty. And then in most of his interview today, he agreed to the other accusations, bthat i tried to date and date some of the teenage girls but finally left hannity with the contradiction of his own testimony when he said to Shawn Hannity that he did not recall dating those teenage girls after saying that he did date those teenage girls. That was good enough for Shawn Hannity. It was okay. He accepted that. And that is good enough for the president of the United States who is a self confessed Sexual Assaulter. And it is so far, as of tonight, good enough for the majority leader of the United StatesSenate Mitch Mcconnell who invited roy moore into the senate, into a meeting with all of the republican members of the senate, and sat down with him and said how can we help you, what can we do to help you get elected, and not one of those senators and not Mitch Mcconnell is dragging him back in to say what did you do with this 14yearold girl. Not one of them. But with this sharply set of allegations coming forward to tell their stories, i dont recall is not good enough in the court of public opinion. It is not good enough in the court of basic human decency. Not good enough. Well be right back. You need . No, im good. Come on, moe. I have to go. vo we always trusted our Subaru Impreza would be there for him someday. Ok. Thats it. vo we just didnt think someday would come so fast. See ya later, moe. vo the Subaru Impreza. The longestlasting vehicle in its class. More than a car, its a subaru. 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Find out how at sanfranciscodignity. Com. I dont know Leigh Corfman from anybody. I never contacted her. Allegations with Sexual Misconduct are false. I blee i believe they are politically motivated. They are brought onto stop a successful campaign. Joining us now on our panel. Former u. S. Attorney for the Eastern District of michigan and professor of law at the university of michigan. Shes also a nbc news and msnbc legal con trtributor. And i want to go to you first, they should use many elements in evaluating witnesses including their berg, what they are picking up from them in their testimony. We couldnt see roy moores face today. That would have helped a lot. It would have helped the jury. But based 0on what you heard today in reference to some of the inconsistencies that i just highlighted, what was your assessment of that as testimony . Jurors are told they are supposed to use their common sense in ha cessing witness credibility. What i heard him say is he doesnt recall whether he ever dated an under age girl at the age of 14. You dont recall. Maybe you dont recall what you had for dinner three weeks ago on tuesday. That seems legitimate. But you dont recall whether you committed stat tu are rape or Sexual Misconduct with 14yearold . Thats not the kind of thing you dont recall. It would be an unequivocal no something that youve never done. To say you dont recall means i might have. Well, hes saying that hes absolutely denying everything that happened with the 14yearold and of course thats the one where if it was in the statute of limitations the legal jeopardy would be very severe. Hes denying that. Hes saying he doesnt recall if he dated the other girls. But in the earlier part of the testimony he seems to be saying he didnt date the other girls because you should listen to them, they say that we didnt have sex. Yeah, and that contradiction that either i didnt date them or i did, and we didnt have sex, its one or the other. You have to pick one. To argue in the alternative, i think under mines his own credibility. And i just want to reread Leigh Corfman response to what roy moore had to say today since we just played his denial one time. She said i stand by my comments. The article is very detailed. Anyone with questions should please reread it. And i want to say thank you to my friends and others who have supported me and my family. Hand david i cant recommend to people they should reread the article in the Washington Post. Judge moore could have said ive never met her in my life or i met her in the courtroom, i was never alone with her in my life. Thats what he said. He said it didnt happen that way. Then he said i never committed Sexual Misconduct. Thats ha opinion. Different people may have different views about what constitutes miss conduct. Even there, there isnt a denial. And of course Leigh Corfman story is enormously credible. The thing i took away from it is how good he was that he identified people in a moment of distress, carefully severed the girl from her mother, he sent the mother on. How practiced he was at this. Yes. He was good. This was not a first time encounter. And so the question i think that is hanging over this whole story is how many other Leigh Corfman are there who may be more damaged by the experience than she was who are reluctant to talk because they have more pain but will we hear fwr them. And jennifer one of the things he said when he was this was a political campaign, im sure there will be more accusations that come out. Predicted it. He absolutely did. You know what was interesting about that, there was no anger. If you were accused f dating a 14yearold, committing unspeakable acts, wouldnt you be furious are your accusers . Hes befuddled, defensive, evasive, but hes not angry. And as you say, his memory that will i didnt use these people as character witnesses is of course bizarre. And this goes back to the defense many republicans are using, which is if it is true he cannot be in the senate. What more do they need . Instead of 30 witness , 60 witnesses . What other do they need other than the witnesses coming forward on the record in the Washington Post and moore himself. That was enough for michael lee, why wasnt it enough for donald trump or Mitch Mcconnell . And barbara mckad, mitt romney came out today the presumption of innocence is for courtrooms. We use a different standard when it comes to elective office. Well never know anything we need to know about candidates. We have to use our judgment. And mitt romney said i believe Leigh Corfman. I believe the women. As a law professor what is your feeling of that we need to use this for political candidates beyond a reasonable doubt . I grew he with him. We set in croom beyond a reasonable doubt because someones liberty is at stake of the we might decide to lock them up. This is different. Do we want to elevate someone to the esteemed office of the u. S. Senate where they will have the way to make decisions about people. This is the same thing. Lets listen to what congressman peter king said about this. In this case the charge is so serious and the fact its backed up by other women and so hideous, i would say, unless he can prove his innocence, the burden is now on him, within the next day or so, i believe he has to step down. David, peter king, is it a geographic thing, you have to be a congressman from new york to think that way . Well, peter king is also fighting for his own life. There is it a larger political context that this seat is important in itself. Only a two year hold on the seat e but we are moving into appeared in republican loss of control in the house, is very conceivable. Will is a lot at stake. And so there are patterns here. The decertification of donald trump in the 24 hours after the access Hollywood Tape was much more dramatic than anything that happened. You had about a third of the u. S. Senate disa vowing his campaign. This is much more muted response. Even after that when donald trump did not sink beneath the waves, that the republican parties closed in on him. But i dont want to be cynical about this, i expect you see that the local Alabama Party is rallying to roy moore. Thats already happened. And the National Party may not have much choice. I mean after all tax reform is at stake. John kasich Statement Today ive long opposed roy moore and his view points. The actions described make him unfit for office. He should step a side. But jennifer it doesnt seem like Republican Party has been listening much to john skasich. The report tonight saying the governor of alabama is thinking about changing the date of the election. It seems to be within the governor powers pushing it down the road so they can get rid of roy moore and install another republican candidate. I guess she doesnt believe him either. This is the logical progression of a bunch of tribalists who subsume everything, decency, truth, a childs life, to the cause of the party. To getting that marginal tax rate below 39. 6 . For that its worth putting roy moore in the senate. So this is the state of affairs. And it doesnt surprise me at all. Because if they are willing to take donald trump after the access hollywood, they are willing to take donald trump after he used racist language about mexican immigrants and insulted pows and, and, and, and, theyll accept anything. And another republican, congressman Barbara Comstock of virginia, she released a statement, she compared Harvey Weinstein, roger ailes, and roy moore, said roy moore should not serve in the u. S. Senate. And barbara mcquade, each of the cases that comstock cited are cases that have not been judd kated by courts. These are cases where if republicans chose to, they can say if true, you can use that same if true defense tonight about Harvey Weinstein if you wanted to. But i dont hear any of them doing it. No, i dont think so. And you know i know that their exists in the word i suppose people who fabricate allegations. But i think that one of the things we are seeing syllabus women feeling suddenly empowered to talk about their stories and realizing that people are starting to believe these stories. There are a lot of reasons people dont come forward with these stories immediately. They feel fear. They feel shame. They feel like they are going to be dragged through held if they talk about their experiences. But i think we are seeing a great moment in American History where women are feeling empowered and exposing wrongdoers and are being believed. Thank you all for joining us tonight. Really appreciate it. Thank you. If roy moore goes to the senate, he will have to do mandatory Sexual Harassment training thanks to senator amy clof shier. She will join us next. And mvp could be in 15 million of trouble. Much about medicine, but we know a lot about drama. From scandalous romance, to ridiculous plot twists. gasping son . Dad we also know you can avoid drama by getting an annual checkup. So were partnering with cigna to remind you to go see a real doctor. Go, know, and take control of your health. It could save your life. Doctor poses dad cigna. Together, all the way. Depend silhouette active fit briefs, feature a thin design for complete comfort. They say move it or lose it and at my age, im moving more than ever. Because getting older is inevitable. But feeling older . Thats something i control. Get a free sample at depend. Com. At ally, we offer lowcost trades and highyield savings. 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If that is your real name. Its william actually. Hmph affordable, fast fedex ground. We are the driven. The dedicated. The overachievers. We know our best investment is in ourselves. We dont take no for an answer. We fight for what we want. Even for the things that were once a given. Going to college. Buying a home. And not being in debt for it for the rest of our lives. But were only as strong as our community. Who inspires and pushes us to go further than we could ever go alone. Sofi. Get there sooner. Thanks to senator Amy Klobuchar if Rachel Maddow makes it to the United States senate the first thing he will have to do is undergo Sexual Harassment training. Hear what Senate Klobuchar said yesterday. We are all too aware this happens in our workplaces. We cannot expect it to change on its own. Senator klobuchar to have sexual training for u. S. Senators and the staff, it passed yesterday and passed unanimously. Joining us now is senator Amy Klobuchar. Thank you. I think every reasonable person in the country is thinking it coming to this. But roy moore may have first Training Session in the United States senate. Thats possible. Although we note we have a wonderful candidate in doug jones who is wellrespected. The polls have gotten closer. Former prosecutor running on trust and how he wants to help the economy down there in alabama and Better Health care. So i think thats what im focused on right now is him and his possibility of winning. But ill say that the u. S. Senate should be an example for the rest of the country. And i worked on this bill. I vet it with senate grassley, senator from iowa, republican and we had support from every single senator on the rules committee. Because it is really important to tell the rest of the country that no workplace is immune. That this happens at all levels. And it happens when you dont even know its happening sometimes. And that is why we want to make sure that everyone has this training and its going to happen within 60 days. It takes effect immediately. There is no bureaucracy around it. Then we also are requiring every office to publicly certify that all their Staff Members and the senator went through the training. And i was hoping that the senate learned a lesson when they were listening to anita hills testimony but apparently not. So this is great to finally have this codified in the senate. I want you to listen to something that former senator boxer said tonight, which is a fascinating idea about how the senate should be handling the roy moore situation. Lets listen to this. Let me tell you what i think they ought to do. They ought to send the ethics Team Committee out there. I served on that committee for years, i chaired it for a while, then highest democrat on there, send a team out to meet with these accusers. You dont have to talk to roy moore. Just talk to the accusers. Talk to the community. And get involved. Dont just say if its true. Find out for yourself if its true. Senator, whats your reaction to that . Well, there is no doubt if in fact he somehow wins this election, which i really have faith in the people of alabama that they will look at the other candidate, doug jones, who is closing in on the polls, but if he somehow ended up there, the senate does have a right to look at the people who are serving. There is a right to expel senators after they are sworn in. You have to have a two thirds vote. And as senator boxer pointed out, the Ethics Committee can look at allegations. Senator mcconnell himself was involved in heading up some of the ethics investigation in the work that went on when senator pack wood was basically kicked out of the senate because of issues where ten women had come forward and made very clear claims that he had harassed them. And so this kind of thing has happened before. And every workplace, and i remember we are just talking right now about roy moore and a bunch of people who are more famous, but i think part of what you are seeing happen all over the country is that, whether its the shift worker or nurse in the hospital or the teacher in the school, that workplaces have to Start Talking about this, put rules in place. And it is the only way that you are going to see instead of candidates like roy moore, that you are going to see more women in power and see people that have been really suppressed and pushed down and not been able to achieve things, come forward. We still only have 21 women in the senate. I want to double underline the point you made about senator mcconnell. I remember when he was the republican chairman. The lead republican in the senate Ethics Committee. And it was his responsibility to bring those charges against republican senator bob pack wood who was a top senator on the finance committee. I knew you would remember this piece of history. And senator was nothing partisan about it, there wasnt a partisan moment in that investigation and in that process. Well, and i think you see some of this. You see senator lee and senator daines with drawing their support of moore. You see mitt romney and john mccain, former candidates for president on the republican side saying that they dont think hes fit to serve. So you see some of that. But the point is that he is still the candidate of the Republican Party of alabama. We have a very different alternative on the democratic side. And when you look at what just happened in virginia on tuesday, when the voters there, including more republican suburban areas, came forward and said we dont like the hate rhetoric. We dont like these kinds of words and divisiveness and we want someone else. And something different. And so i think that the Republican Party nationally sure better look at what they have in this guy with moore. Thats their candidate right now. And the polls that youve been sighting are looking pretty good. Will is a tie being reported in one poll tonight done in the last 24 hours, roy moore 46, doug jones 46. Doug jones has completely closed that gap. Well, and its, again, not just because of this. You also have someone candidate in doug jones former u. S. Attorney, someone who went back in as a special prosecutor, and handled that case from 1963, when those little girls were killed in that church and successfully prosecuted it. And then you just look at his record and what he stands for and the state of things in alabama where you have people without health care and you have a situation where you would like to make it esser for kids to go to college. There is a lot of good that you could do if youve got someone in there like doug jones. And thats why i think its really important that as we look at these gross stories, and the courage of these women to come forward and tell them, that you also see the other flip side, that there is another way, and there is someone that will bring a positive agenda with this idea of bringing people together instead of dividing them. Senator aim klobuchar, thank you very much for joining us tonight from minnesota on this important night. Really appreciate it. Good to be on. Thank you. Up next, special prosecutor Robert Mueller special focus on Michael Flynn and Michael Flynns son puts the flynns in 15 million worth of trouble. burke at farmers, weve seen almost everything so we know how to cover almost anything. Even a swing set standoff. And we covered it, july first, twentyfifteen. Talk to farmers. We know a thing or two because weve seen a thing or two. We are farmers. Bumpadum, bumbumbumbum but he hasoke up wwork to do. In. So he took aleve. 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Additionally three people familiar with the probe are examining whether they discussed a way to free turkeyish trader in United States. Helped iron skirt United States sanctions. Flynn was offered upwards of 15 million to be paid directly or indirectly if he could complete the deal according to two sources familiar with the meeting. Michael flynn was fired after just 24 days as President Trumps National Security adviser. After firing him, President Trump said this. General flynn is a wonderful man. I think hes been treated very, very unfairly by the media. As i call it, the fake media, in many cases. Well be joined by one of the reporters working on this breaking news report for nbc news next. We35 mules,ur doors with 70 megawatts, and an ice plant. But we brought power to the people redefining what that meant from one era to the next. Over 90 years later, we continue to build as americas 3rd largest investor in infrastructure. We dont just help power the american dream. 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We fired him because he said something to the Vice President that was not so. Did you know that he had had that he had received payments from the russian government or turkish knew. He had clearance from the Obama Administration. Youre a very good person, youre fired. Joining us now is one of the reporters who broke the Michael Flynn story for nbc, julia ainsley, and betsy woodruff. Julia, this is looking like 15 million of trouble. Certainly mueller is looking into that. He wants to know if this meeting happened at the 21 club blocks away from where flynn would have been working on President Trumps transition. If he actually agreed to this and allowed himself to be exploited as National Security adviser, theyre looking at possible bribery charges. This is really serious for flynn and its part of the legal pressure that Robert Mueller is applying when hes trying to get flynn to be a cooperative witness. Betty, hes a transition official, this is quasigovernment official, private season. For him to execute the plan, he can only execute it when hes in the white house and has the governing authority to execute the plan if thats the plan. Exactly. For the purposes of the Mueller Probe, one thing attorneys close to the probe tell me, the campaign, the transition and the white house are all considered three separate legal entities. So that makes this type of situation particularly complex for the mueller team. Of course it also means that this could implicate two different legal teams since it was looking at a conversation that happened during the transition, but then would have impacted the white house. One did bit about this thats interesting, remember at issue the question of the controversial cleric they were trying to forcibly move from his compound in the poconos over to back to turkey. Last summer a colleague and i actually spoke with gulen at his compound. It would be hard to get him out of there. Its difficult to get in, a rural area. It would take a lot of effort to try to find a way to extract this man from his home. Any plans they had that could have come up would have been really ambitious. Michael flynns lawyer has said out of respect for the process of the various investigations regarding the 2016 campaign, we have intentionally avoided responding to every rumor or allegation raised in the media. But todays news cycle as brought allegations about general flynn ranging from kidnapping to bribery. Congratulations, julia, kidnapping to bribery, that are jo outrageous and prejudicial we are making an exception to our usual rule. They are false. You got their attention. Its interesting because first of all two things i would say. One, as weve report it had story, as you know lawrence weve been reporting this since sunday, Robert Mueller had enough to indict flynn, we have been in touch with robert kel near, this is the time where theyve decided to give a response. Of course we know sometimes thats when we get a response, after we run the story. Also, what we are talking about here just procedurally, can we stop for a second, in your reporting on the story, one of the final stages is you run by flynns lawyer what you have looking for a response . Of course. He had a chance to Say Something about this while you were every point of it, yes. Weve no surprises journalism is what we do here. The point, too, i would make in response to their statement is that we are talking about the fact that the special counsel is looking into that. Stand by that reporting, we know hes interviewing witnesses. Were not saying this meeting definitely happened. Were not saying they took the 15 million. Were saying this is part of the probe. Thats what makes this such a linchpin in trying to flip flynn. And thats what were reporting. And this statement is saying that were reporting as fact that he took this 15 million. Theres nothing in the report that predicts that there will be an indictment on kidnapping or bribery. And betsy, the but what it does give us is the sense that the prosecutors have more than one card to play with Michael Flynn. Theyve got quite a deck. Right. Rob kellner, flynns attorney, suggesting you all reported something you didnt report. Of course its long been known that flynn has had significant legal challenges, and thats something were seeing fleshed out with your guys great reporting this week, the fact that not necessarily on the foreign lobbying front, but the specific type of work that mueller may be considering he could have been engaged with is, as rob kellner said pretty eye popping stuff. Its another reason the work the Mueller Probe does and whatever conclusions it comes to are going to be incredibly fascinating and impactful. Michael flynn was the one person that President Trump warned president obama warned president elect trump about, dont hire him. Thats right, he did. Another piece of this as well is the fact that we know when weve reported earlier that the fbi was asked to reup its investigation into gulen and a possible extradition after trump came into office, after the Obama Administration had dismissed that. Julia ainsley, great work, betsy, thank you for joining us. We appreciate it. Tonights last word is next. [ train whistle blows ] what . stop it mmhmm. Weve been saving a lot of money ever since we switched to progressive. This bar is legit. And now we get an even bigger discount from bundling home and auto. I can get used to this. It might take a minute. 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You can learn about watergate by learning about what Richard Nixon, if you want to learn about watergate, learn about what the country was like and what was going on in the country. And the way to start understanding that is to understand 68. Oh, and theres a little bit of collusion in the victory in the end that is worth its actually Richard Nixon used collusion with the foreign government, the south vietnamese in order to win in the end. And for the rest of the story, playing with fire is now available in bookstores and online. If you can bear the sound of my voice for hours on end, the audiobook is available too. Thats tonights last word. The 11th hour with broian will jams is next. 15 million for flynn to have a turkish president s rival sent back to turkey. Also two republican senators tonight withdrawing their support for roy moore as the alabama candidate calls the Sexual Misconduct