Karen mcdougal said she had a relationship in 2006. We will get to that what else do you need to know . Investigators have this tape, the fbi seized it in april. And news on this show, declaring that he knew for a fact that this tich tape existed. I know for a fact that donald trump is on at least one of these recordings. I am not going to get in to details. Would you say that in court . Absolutely. Donald trump is on one of the records, at least one of them. I stand behind it. Stands behind it. Today, that fact reported. Michael joins me with more. And the white house is making it clear, it doesnt like this news at all. It was caught off guard. Trump didnt know he was being recorded a source says. And they are trying to put word out, that any other recordings that may exist are not substantialive. This story has moved fast. These leaks make cohen look like a threat to donald trump. As Michael Cohen relies on his lawyers to defend himself, and a top Hillary Clinton aide. This lightning speed era we are living with, trump was telling on air force one that coehne could take all the tough questions on trumps behalf. I always liked michael. I havent spoken to him in a long time. I will speak to john flanery about the legalities of all this another lawyer, jay goldberg who joined me before. I begin with an Investigative Reporter for the New York Times, and liz blank, a senior producer giving us reporting and analysis, by women who say they have had contact with donald trump. When you look at the original version, how did these women get us to this place, and why doesnt Michael Cohen seem like he is taking what we know, toward the end. President ial race two things, one, payments made to women who claimed consensual affairs with the president. One was the made by directly by michael cehen, Stormy Daniels payment. And the national inquire. Trump said he didnt know anything about the payments, Michael Cohen said he handled them on his own. What we have seen today, more new evidence that would suggest that president was actually certainly aware, much closer to the time of the payments, if not the exactly time. Which means what . The payments are significant. They are being investigated as Campaign Finance violations. Implying that he was lying about it before . That is one way to read it. The question s if he has been lying about it, in fact, what he a direct participant in the payments, was he aware of them at the time. That could punch him into the heart of this, one aspect of the criminal investigation. Giuliani said if cohen were to make a statement, write a check so it can be documented. If there is a case, quote, it sent clear if a federal judge would rule if prosecutors can listen to the recording, we will get to the lawyers here. It is in the New York Times for a reason tonight. Do you think it is because Michael Cohen is himming give a hard time it. Meant he meant that he would. Eye double negative burn. One person that would understand that, that would be donald trump. I believe that in sort of inching at the idea that there are these tapes today. It is clear, we dont know who leaked this story. Who leaked this information given the reporting, it is clear it may be coming from Michael Cohen himself. The idea of the pardon, him wanting the pardon is in the back drop and clear with the story. The point liz makes wouldnt be a bad theory, double negative. I botched it. Hard to do. In defending the trump on this tape said that he wasnt aware that he was being recorded at the time. That raises a couple of questions, what was one Michael Cohen in the habit of representing him. And two, why did he feel compelled to secretly record him about this matter . Let me bring in john flanery. When you look at everything that you heard. What is the legal significance. In terms of the law, the Campaign Violations are obvious, i thought the time story before the quote that you had was significant. It shows knowledge of both men, cohen and trump, was what ami is doing with play mate mcdougal. Said he, should we buy her story directly, or should we buy it from ami . That, then the question is, pay in a check or cash. He is to do it by check. Strikes me at bizarre. Was this a pattern to reimburse from what they had already done. You are talking about the National Inquirer, whether there was a pot to abuse that Media Company to secretly try to buy people off and. That is a big no, no. We have been reporting for thr a long time. Different angles of the story on what looks very shady. Was the National Inquirer acting as the arm we strongly suspect they were. Can you prove it . If the laut continued we would. Well, here is the thing about the abuse. I think that what we have, a long standing relationship. In which they have favored other trump and killing other stories, mcdougal, they paid her 150,000 and tried to tie her down with that contract. They said this is a story that is going to run. You dont pay 150,000 and not run it they did that in august. These conservations are in, should we pay her from ami or the inquirer . That shows a continuing knowledge of what is going on. And the denials are after that. If he had an inc. He thought there was something shady that would backfire on him. There are certain thing that is we dont know. That races the what was the motivation to secretly. They dont lie. You can have disputes about a conservation with a he said she said. Tapes dont. The scale doesnt lie, the tapes dont lie either this. Is yell Michael Cohen may have made it. I want to bridge in Donald Trumps litigator. I appreciate you taking the time to come on the beat. Do you think that they are in the news like, did you regard him as a eye dont think it is unique to Michael Cohen. Who may be viewed as a coconspirator. Not unique to what . A coconspirator. If someone is doing something wrongful, then, they might be concerned about their own position and they will tape record it to see if can be used later on to win the corporation of the government. Do you think. You are saying something so powerful, i want to make sure you are saying you right. Are you saying you think Michael Cohen is viewing himself as a coconspirator at that time . When i represented donald actedati actedatively, he referred david pecca to me. The relationship between me and trump, it is extremely close. Make no mistake. Michael cohen was concerned about his own position. He wanted to stay in the good graces of trump. Trump essentially was his only cliend. He had the presence of mind to know that he was treading on shaky ground. He had to have something he could cell should it implode. Do you think he had potential exposure to do thing that is werent under his sdutys to that company but some other scheme or blot . I think he has a duty to the share holders. And he, too, has exposure. I am concerned about Michael Cohen. If you spend five minutes with Michael Cohen he is not strong, he is weak it is odd to say this. When you he said he would stand up for the president , i knew talking to him for less than 5 minutes, that he is weak. That he it would cave in with respect to any wrong dealings or prosecutors. High couldnt be counted on to protect those paying him. Those who face the prospect of jail stand up. It is difficult for me to recall any sdansz, over detectives of practice, someone stood up and taken it on the chin. I understand the pointed you are raising, the facts that he provides to the federal investigators are not negative or incriminating to donald trump, then it doesnt matter if he is weak or strong . Right . The as to whether or not the person is telling the truth negatively or positively. If the prosecutor feel its you are not measuring up to criminal activity on the part of the targeted, you have the corporation. Let me brin bring in a college of yous. My reaction, are you being gentle. Cohen shared this tape with trump. When they they going through the tapes. It is not clear the government has a green light to disclose it. There are only two ways, cohen and trump. A skilled publicist. He may have been responsibility for the Rudy Giuliani should have remain ed it doesnt exculpate trump. Another when it is close to the payoff in jewel janny. I will give you the final word, briefly. Giuliani has not been helpful to trump. He gives a wrong statement. Then he says that Michael Cohen can be counted on to tell truth. It is in trumps best interest, to remove the negtiflt hosity. North trumps laurs, saying he is someone who can be counted on top tell the truth that is what he said. That will come back to haunt trump, burg the prosecution of any claims. We are going 18 minutes, and i am you calls cohen liz plank, will the tapes get a hearing on the hill . The manhattan madem with a are you ready to take your wifi to the next level . Then you need xfinity xfi. A more powerful way to stay connected. It gives you super fast speeds for all your devices, provides the most wifi coverage for your home, and lets you control your network with the xfi app. Its the ultimate wifi experience. Xfinity xfi, simple, easy, awesome. Al kinds of accusations that president denied, k4rding those of interest to investigators on the mueller side and congress. What many remember in congress, when butterfield revealed to the congress, there was a taping system in the white house. Mr. Butterfield are you aware of the listening devices of the oval office of the president . I was aware of listening devices, yes, sir. I am joined now by the top democrat on the judicious committee. This isnt an oval office taping center system. This is not watergate. What does it mean about the leaks of the tapes, are they of interest to congress . It is in context of what is going on, the walls are closing in on the president. The Mueller Investigation has come up with 35 indictments, about how the russians hacked into our systems, and how they interfered in our elections, the president denies the obvious. The president sides with the russians, in their denial, against his own intelligence people. Ongoing threat for the ru russians. People wont believe the report whenever it comes out. And the special council, from whom we hear no leak, 35 indictments, and as is proper. Sure. Apparently, developing a solid case of criminal conspiracy, subverting our laws, these tapes made the evidence of the president being involved in a criminal conspiracy. They see the walls closing in. If Michael Cohen ever did anything that related to muellers collusion issues, do you think the news makes it more or less likely that he taped those conversations. If you are taping conversations with your client, Michael Cohen is a fixer, not a lawyer. If you are taping conversations with him with one thing, it sent logical you taped them on a lot of other things. There is donny, you can see Michael Cohen knows a lot of people. Telling people that makes it seem like he is getting ready to corporate. I believe at the end of the day, Michael Cohen will do what you would do, what i would do, to do what is best for him and his family. Whatever comes out involving michael will have to do with Stormy Daniels things, missing looing links to solve the problem with russia. Are we seeing a recommend out that links, do you find a way i expect we are seeing that unless we are seeing the begging for a pardon before the president with his testifying to mueller, in the absence of that parton as to whether we ask for testimony. I think we would wait until the criminal investigation is over. We would be careful not to interfere. We would do it in a way not to interfere, or ask for that for those teams. Because this investigation is very important, we have to find out who was involved with the conspiracy of the russians, a basic crime here, you just saul the president against our own intelligence in order to cover up a platto subvert. We cant trust the president to keep the safe guards of the counselingry, a domcratic congress, maybe aiding and abetting in an ongoing obstruction of justice. Before we are hearing from you. Insurance company. For drivers with accident forgiveness Liberty Mutual wont raise their rates because of their first accident. Liberty mutual insurance. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty the attorney for Stormy Daniels, you made this prediction, how did you know it then there was a tape. What does it mean today . There is not just one tape, there is multiple tapes, and you know, i think ultimately, when all the tapes come out, it will be problematic for Michael Cohen and the president. We are calling for the release now. I agree, this clearly came from Michael Cohens camp, the last flare gun if you will in a long list of flare guns, shots at aimed at getting Donald Trumps attention, telling him the shoot is about to drop, unless he brings Michael Cohen into the tent. To mix met fors. The other theory, donald trump had perhaps the worst week of his presidency, given the bizarre display in helsinki, and the things he said, unsaid and resaid about valdimir putton. Or coming out from the giuliani side. I dont think it is accurate. There is a series of tapes, more than one tape. That is why i called for the release back in late may, the clock is running out on mr. Trump. I think this is going to be very, very be problemattic. The tapes am speaking moments ago, and calling cohen weak. If you spend five minutes with Michael Cohen, you know he is not strong. He is weak. It is odd to say this, when he said that he would stand up for the president , i knew from talking with him for less than five minutes, that was he substantially weak that he would cave in with respect to any wrong doings. Do you agree. Do you know why goldberg is saying that on television . Michael cohen is not a general. He say corporate. Corporal. Ari. This was not a guy calling the shots. This goes to show you, what i have been saying a long time. Michael cohen was not smart enough or tough enough to eeventually donald trump will pay the price for that this is another example of the lack of judgment of donald trump and the people he surrounds himself with. He of course, is working with cohen, suggesting against trump. Take a listen to mr. Davis. I have never worked for a client that has lied to me. Or they could trust not lying to me. That is not reason he cant find a great lawyer. It is because he has lied to the american people. We know that he has lied to his own lawyers, no lawyer will take a client who lies. We are seeing this new davis chapter on behalf of cohen this week. Is that why this stuff is leaking . What do you think is holding them back, holding them forward, and getting it done if that is the goal . I think a lot may be happening behind the scenes. Not necessarily public or disclosed yet. You had me on last week, i talked about the proy gression, it was on your show or pod cast, we have seen a drum beat, for rehabilitating cohen, and i have a lot of respect for lani, i dont understand him when he said he has never had an a client lie to him. Consistent to what, i think it was a grave mistake by the president. If there was anyone the president should have been looking out after, valdimir putin, inviting him to the white house. He should be inviting cohen to the white house a long time ago. He is looking for a tough lawyer to to take on trump. Would you ever consider representing Michael Cohen in any way, have you discussed it with him . I wont get into what i may or may not have discussed with Michael Cohen. I am not going to say no, as potentially representing Michael Cohen. You would not rule out representing Michael Cohen in this manner . If he was try paired to turn state a evidence. I would consider it. In an effort to disclose information and bring the truth to the american people. Prior to this television interview, is he aware of your willingness to do that. I you could say no, you could discuss it not what it seems you are implies is not news to him, something that may have been discussed . Well, you can draw your own conclusions, here is what i am going to say. I had the occasion in the last few days to run into michael roken in a restaurant i have been going to to we had a chance to converse. A positive meeting. I came away from that meeting very encouraged by ultimately how all of this may work out. We will see. You feel encouraged. Based on your recent face to face with michael coach do you knowledge retaining you would send a bigger message to donald trump . Yes. Advance the call of the that is why i am not going to rule it out. You are a man in demand, you could have been anywhere, you are here with us. I do appreciate it. Remember, flattery will get you no where. The socalled manhattan madame. Like my father before. [telephone ring] like my father before. Ahoyhoy as long as people talk too loudly on the phone, you can count on geico saving folks money. Fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more on car insurance. Let someone else do the heavy lifting. Tripadvisor compares prices from over 200 booking sites to find the right hotel for you at the lowest price. So you barely have to lift a finger. Or a wing. Tripadvisor. Wlets do it. . Come on. This summer, add a new member to the family. At the mercedesbenz summer event. Lease the glc300 for 429 a month at your local mercedesbenz dealer. Mercedesbenz. The best or nothing. There is more, we have been reporting Michael Cohen, and his tapes back in the news, allegations to contacts with women to the probe, a secret trip to prague, he denied t relating to the famous dossier. He was involved in trying to set up an alleged back channel involving the ukraine. There is a lot of material for mueller to look at. News breaking today, mueller looking to subpoena the so called manhattan madame. Mueller wants to talk to her because of her links to a former trump advisor, roger stone. She said she doesnt have anything on russian collusion, and quote, very upsetting. Thanks to both of you. What would mueller be looking for from miss davis . Well, the romanian haaker, formed the basis of the most recent indictments against russian operatives that were attacking our democracy, and our electoral system. If she had a close relationship to stone, it would make sense to talk to her. To confirm or deny the other pieces of information that they have. Which i sure is a mountain. I was in the white water investigation, it was a smaller thing than what we are seeing now. What happens behind the scenes is very different than what is public. You reported on roger stone, what are you learning tonight . I texted with roger stone a while ago. He sent me a rely ply, described it as harassment. I can read it. I think we have a version of it. He said, have you lost your sense of humor . His opening to me. Christian davis has been a friend of mine and worked on and off for me for 10 years. She say brilliant woman who remade her life. I am the god father to her son. She is currently in the cosmoatology business. She has no knowledge of russian coligz during the 2016 election. I cannot imagine why the special council wants to interview her, other than for purposes of harassment. Harassment of who . I followed up with. He said both. You or her. He can call it harassment, apparently, he is close to her personally, what the mueller people are looking for are people who know what roger stone knew. Roger has said a variety of things about what he knew about what was going on in russia, and the campaign. And the mueller people are obviously trying to pin him from the outside in, if they can. I think you are reporting rogers rebuttal, and the context, the fact that someone is called for questioning, is not saying something negative about them. The grinding gear is around store. Beyond the cohens tapes, mr. Afnati. I am not going to get into what i may or may not have discuss wide Michael Cohen. I am not going to say no as it relates to potentially representing Michael Cohen. You would not rule out trying to represent Michael Cohen in this matter. If he was prepared to do the right thing, come clean and turn states evidence. I would consider it. Kim, that would be initial, and your reaction . It would be a conflict of interest as an attorney it is interesting, somewhat, what he is doing, both with report to his clients and personal career. National reputation now. What are the implications for the democratic process. The Trump Administration is circling the drain here on many different levels, the question s how does it turn out . Congress is doing nothing. There is questions as to whether or not they can produce levels, people are on the american populous, and the democratic system. Edward bennett williams, in washington used to say, he didnt represent a client, he represented the situation. He is the closest thing to representing the situation. All the even it he ends up not representing Michael Cohen in any way, i am sure that cooperation is growing, ringing the alarm, feeling that donald trump is not as loyal to them as he once was. The rapper is here, bringing is son for a special fallback friday. 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Your one item would be the name your price tool . It helps people save on car insurance. Why wouldnt it save me . Why . What would you bring . A boat. Huh. It is friday, it is time for fallback friday. This is the first ever father s father son. He roared the brakes. He and his son, a rapper, and his company, trap phone mobile, these are the breaks. This is and who needs to fall back . Well, fall back, i was thinking about this ihop. The president of ihop needs to fall back. I just found out that this whole changing the name into ihob, International House of burgers, was a ploy just to get people to complain about it. Its just for press and media. And to get more exposure for ihop. They recently changed back to ihop. Its no longer ihob. So we got played. We got played. So they need to fall back and dont you ever do this again. Kurtis, who needs to fall back . You heard this story about this guy who took a girl out on a date, he wound up stealing her car and going and taking another girl out on a date. And then got caught and went to jail. Thats audacious. Youve got to fall back, bro. Come on. Thats crazy. Ive heard of stealing lines. Yeah. But stealing a car. Stealing the whole car for the date. Thats crazy. Yeah, thats not good. Ill do one. Which is the one of the week that everyones been thinking about. Ill just tell Vladimir Putin to fall back. Ooh. Stop messing with the elections, as charged and as evidence has said. And stop working over our president. I mean, its at times disturbing and at times a little embarrassing. Right. I meant to say wouldnt. Come on. The double negative. Come on. We were saying this on the show earlier this week. Theres the saying i wish you would. You know that saying . No one ever says i wish you wouldnt and then takes a day later and come back to say i meant would. Its not plausible. Ridiculous. You got any other fallbacks . We wanted to do one together like father and son. And what was it . A generation gap in hiphop. Old guys talking about the young guys. Young guys talking about the old guys. Lets be all love. You know what i mean . Lets come together. Lyrics, mumble rap. You know what i mean . One big party, man. All love. Fall back on the hate. Fall back on the hate. Thats beautiful. Fall back on the hate between the generations because there is a generation gap and i want to just show support to all the young rappers out there coming up doing their thing. The world is yours. Do your thing. This is an awesome, awesome culture. We have hiphop 65 billion a year. And its all yours. The future is yours, guys. Go for it, man. Get the money. My man drake, too. Drake has become controversial. Even though hes bigger more streamed than taylor swift now. Hes number one. Like 10 billion streams i think he just hit. What youre saying for our viewers, we have people who love rock and roll, i was talking to college neil peters earlier in the week about the grateful dead. It seems like in all music this is a generational thing that happens. Where because my father and i had a longrunning debate when i was growing up where he would say he didnt feel like hiphop was music the way the 70s era was music. This seems to happen in every genre. The new, guys the first conversation is maybe thats not real music, quote unquote. Everyone has those stories where grandma or mom in the background, turn that music down. So thats it. Live pictures in the silver Lake Neighborhood of los angeles. As we understand, it a car chase, a police chase has ended with a car crashing into a pole in this area oand the driver of that car as we hear at this point has jumped out and run into a trader joes. We know there were people, shoppers and workers inside that store when this began to unfold just a short while ago and in that time some of them have been able to get out. There are reports shots have been fired as well. We are listening into the coverage of our affiliate in the Los Angeles Area knbc. Lets listen in. We also saw were there as kind of all this unfolded . Theres 12 of us in here. Weve all been really cool with each other weve just been here. Theres this lady that got hurt, and she was bleeding but shes fine. It was something superficial. And shes cool. So were all cool. I just want to get home to my dogs. I want my puppies. Tough situation today. Miguel, we want to thank you for calling in. Again, that was a witness to all of this who was walking along when all of the commotion started when this just this crazy situation with this pursuit. It started earlier this afternoon. And you can see the suspect car right there and a person getting out injured, running into a trader joes and taking hostages. Unbelievably, that is where we stand right now. Some people have been allowed to leave. At least one person pulled out reportedly by a worker, someone inside the trader joes pulling that person out who was injured. And you can see people running, people escaping, and now we understand the s. W. A. T. Team is there and the situation continues. They have a crisis negotiator, a supervisor at the scene trying to talk to this person. We know there are as many as potentially 50 people inside of that trader joes still at this hour, at this moment, as the police, lapd s. W. A. T. Trying to get in touch with that suspect, trying to communicate with that person to come out and leave those people alone. We understand that they we dont want to give away where they are inside of the store but we understand that they are safe at this moment. So that is but again, this is all unfolding. This can change at any minute. We know there are dozens of crews on scene. We have also ourselves, we have multiple reporters and photographers on scene as well. Is there any way that we can go to any of our crews on the ground . We want to talk to our producer in the booth really quick. One of the reasons we are waiting to talk to them is we have Rick Montanez there at the scene and angie crouch actually had a friend who was there and were trying to hook the two of them up. We want to let you guys know its 4 56 right now and we are starting the nbc 4 news at 5 00 early. We are staying on top of this breaking news in silver lake. A Massive Police response outside of a trader joes sxwlp thats right. Shots have been fired. Were told there could be hostages inside. And we have Team Coverage in place. In the air gil layoffas has been following it. On the ground multiple reporters following this. Were going to go right up to gil leyvas in news chopper 4 bravo. And gil, you have been keeping us up to date. What is the latest here as we reach 5 00 . Kathy, i can tell you that the s. W. A. T. Team is in place and the negotiations continue at this hour with the suspect on a cell phone, with a crisis negotiator trying to bring this to a peaceful end at this point. But again, the business is completely surrounded. The area is completely locked down. Theres a huge response. Infrastructure, police and Fire Department are staged on rowena and hyperion. I dont know if you see our shot there but thats the intersection there. You can see the response of lapd and the Fire Department at the scene right now. And again, gelsons is directly across the street to the west of the trader joes. Thats all locked down right now by lapd as they continue to negotiate with that suspect inside who is armed and dangerous. We also understand that the suspect has been shot. We dont know his condition but he is talking, conscious, he is working with the police and theyre trying to work with him to bring this to a peaceful end. But again, we dont know the severity of his wounds, although we did hear a report that the suspect was shot and that one of the customers was trying to assist that person with the bleeding, to stop his bleeding. So at this point the officers are just in a standoff mode right now as we understand people still locked down inside the trader joes itself along with that suspect. And gil, we know this started with a chase. We dont know what prompted that chase or what that suspect was wanted for initially, but can you kind of run through how this start td in hollywood, moved east and ended right in front of this trader joes, that suspect crashing there . It really was. In fact, it started in the hollywood area on surface streets. It was eastbound going into the east hollywood area, and the reports was that the suspect was armed and dangerous. When it got into the silver lake area we heard on the scanners that shots were fired during the course of the pursuit. A couple times in the course of the pursuit before the suspect crashed here in front of the trader joes and at that point that suspect crashed into a power pole right near the front entrance of the trader joes, jumped out of the car and according to witnesses that witnessed this at the scene the suspect jumped out and started firing at officers and ran into the trader joes. Thats where he barricaded himself, taking hostages. He let the lapd know that he had hostages and was starting to release hostages out the front door. We did see two younger people come out of the front door. But in the meantime there were people that were in the second floor of the business itself, they actually evacuated through a secondstory window, in like a foldup ladder, an aluminum ladder that folds out of the window. They were able to climb down that ladder. We witnessed about ten people come out of that window and run through the parking lot to awaiting officers who led them to safety. A very tense situation. It still really is. Theyre trying to negotiate a peaceful result, like i said, to get the suspect in custody and to end this. But again, multiple people still locked down inside. Just the worst possible time for so many people to be out. Its a really busy area. Busy we are approaching the 8 00 hour here on the east coast, approaching 5 00 out west. Youre watching the breaking News Coverage from knbc after a hostage situation unfolded at a trader joes there. We understand that there were some shots fired at some point during this whole incident as well. Nbcs Steve Patterson has been monitoring this from our los angeles bureau. Steve, bring us up to speed on what you know here. Aaron, this is a very developing fluid situation. Lapd officials were talking to are stressing that at this point. They have that what appears to be, again, that trader joes in what l. A. Describes as sort of that silver lake area, kind of a hip area east of hollywood. The lapd officials weve been talking to say this started with a domestic incident, through hollywood, led to a police chase. It ended right in front of that trader joes, that car crashing into as you heard over that call, into a power pole just outside of the trader joes. The suspect then runs inside and barricades himself. At this point it is not clear if that suspect has hostages, if there are people being held