Mentioned, trump lawyer Michael Cohen. He sits in the bulls eye of two different scandals, the Mueller Probe and the payments to remember tStormy Daniels. Her lawyer kicking off the day with a tease of more to come, prodded on the set of morning joe where i was also at the table. Theres at least two that i think are on solid ground. As the evidence rolls out over the coming months, disclosures are going to be made that my client was not alone as it relates to this payment. That Michael Cohen was not a ec women with agreements with donald trump . Correct. And women who had affairs with donald trump . Correct. And did they have payments larger to then than 130,000 . Yes. Whats new is the allegations were larger than the payment to danie daniels which got him in so much trouble. We also asked if that could create more criminal exposure. Do you believe any financial dealings with these women were properly reported at the time or like Stormy Daniels, do you believe they also might create other exposure for donald trump . I think they may create additional exposure. Thats the view from Michael Cohens antagonist. But in another twist, fitting for 2018 today, the New York Times reports avenatti looking at teaming up in a deal with an ally of trump and cohens former White House Communications director anthony scaramucci, the two reportedly pitching a joint tv show to cable networks, including msnbc. Its not clear if such a show is anywhere close to an actual formal pitch or how Stormy Daniels might feel about her lawyer working in partnership with someone on the trump team. Cohens troubles reports he tried to get qatar to pay him a million bucks. The new yorker reporting cohens financial records were leaked by a whistleblower concerned that cohens other banking files were potentially improperly missing from a secret federal database. The reporter who broke that story, telling msnbc, those suspicious activity reports did appear to go missing. Your source says the reason he or she did that was because of concern that other similar reports that are gone . Yes. And we can absolutely report the two that you referenced, now unaccounted for, exist. They are referenced in the third report. When you search for cohens name, they should come up in the system under the normal course of business. They do not. Im joined by independent counsel from the white water investigation and participated in the questioning of president clinton in his grand jury appearance, bringing a lot of experience to this discussion. Also former prosecutor seth waxman, and also speech writer for george w. Bush who has talked about corruption issues with donald trump from the start. Before i get super legal, lets get super real. David, when you connect all these dots tonight, what do you think is important . Well, not to add to anybodys reading pile, but i think theres one more piece from the day that people need to look at, the story in buzzfeed that shows contrary to repeated denials from president trump, from his family, from Michael Cohen, that indeed the Trump Organization and Michael Cohen were working on a project in moscow through the republican convention, through the campaign and almost to the point of Inauguration Day when it finally fizzled out. And the big prize for the deal, should it happen, would be to announce sometime in the fall of 2016 at a trump putin joint meeting. One of the questions that many of us have had in figuring out the trump putin attraction, was the lure in the past . Something trump had been before that the russians held over him . Or was it in the future, some tasty tidbit the russians were holding in front of his greedy nose . Put that in context to the open investigations and the increased attention on Michael Cohen and these somewhat missing or mysterious disappeared records . Yeah, every time we hear about Michael Cohen, we hear about more and more contacts with russians, and it goes to the idea of this potential conspiracy between the russians and the Trump Campaign to influence the 2016 election, whether there were gifts or payments as part of a quid pro quo. So now were hearing about this activity going into the moscow hotel and connections there. As for the missing documents, ive seen some reports that the Financial Enforcement Network has come out and said that they do limit access. So it may be the case these files hadnt gone missing, that they are being limited in access by either bob mueller or the Southern District of new york. And finally, whether theyre restricted or missing, the underlying documentation at the individual banks will still exist. So i have little doubt that bob mueller and the Southern District of new york can go out and get the documents let me jump in. What youre saying is that the underlying evidence is not necessarily going to be gone. Thats not whats concerning about it from say, a chain of custody position. Were six minutes into the show, so obviously well talk chain of custody, because its exciting. But the larger issue that the whistleblower is raising is whether let me read to you whether this presents new deceit. Ive never seen something pulled off the system, when somethings not there that should be i immediately became concerned. The person goes on to say im terrified right now. To be in this situation, to watch all of this unfold. This is a person who is obviously taking risks to leak, and saying their concern is that there might be people inside, the authorities of the financial oversight, or the american government, thats trying to hide stuff. Thats the allegation. I find that hard to believe. The idea that someone can go in and manipulate the system and permanently delete a computer file, it just doesnt happen. Working with the fbi agents, i would be involved in cases and say, can we get this email from ten years ago, where i would never be able to accomplish that. They would go in there and find it through servers or all sorts of avenues. So the idea that someone, a mole, was able to intentionally go in there and manipulate and delete a fincen computer sars, i find it difficult to believe. We have breaking news coming to our newsroom, building on reporting out of the wall street journal. Nbc news now reporting for the first time this moment, Paul Manaforts former soninlaw being who also was in business with him has flipped and cut a secret plea deal with federal investigators. A matter of major significance to the open mueller case against Paul Manafort. Panel stays with me, but first im joined by phone, by nbc investigative journalist, andrew blank stee blanksteen. What can you tell us . We know from Law Enforcement sources that Paul Manaforts former soninlaw has reached a plea deal to plead guilty in connection with a real estate fraud case thats ongoing in los angeles. What we dont know is whether it involved local prosecutors in the Central District of california, or it involves people on bob muellers team. We also dont know the specific details or when a potential plea would be entered and when that happens, when there would be a sentencing. You mentioned the timing. One of the most tantalizing things of the wall street journal reporting on this, was that what might have been reached as a secret deal was as far back as january, which means that whoever Paul Manaforts soninlaw is cooperating with, its been going on all this year. One of the things in terms of checking back on this, obviously when it initially began, the question was, was it going to be a matter of time . When was the case going to get going . And now, although we dont know the specifics of what the plea deal would be in exchange for, we know that certainly bob muellers people have been looking into all aspects of his former fatherinlaws finances. And in this investment fraud case, its how does that sit on the rest of this case . I think thats going to be really interesting going forward. Stay with me. David, from one other thing that we do know that looks more significant tonight with this breaking news, 6 09 p. M. On the east coast, reports that paul manafor manaforts estranged son has flipped and hes cooperating. We dont know who hes cooperating with, but we know bob muellers investigators had previously met with him. Your view of this story . Well, theres so many angles with the manafort story. Because many of the things manafort did before joining the Trump Campaign were so intensely suspicious. So its not clear to me that this would have a direct bearing on anything to do with what happened in 2016 and after. But the thing that Everyone Needs to keep in mind, his pre2016 dealings, he volunteered to work for the Trump Campaign for free. Thats just something you have to keep in mind. Manafort, not a very charitable person normally. So why do this . Why do it for free . What motivated him . Thats the big overhanging question. And if not what, who motivated him . Also a question of intent. I bring in saul wisenberg, one of the only people alive whos questioned a president in a grand jury proceeding. I appreciate your patience. Dealers choice, your view on all of this . Well, one thing to really look at when youre dealing with the mueller investigation, is to look at the plea agreements and to look at the language of the plea agreements. One thing that is striking about the language of the plea agreements and the associated documents is, it doesnt look like, and hasnt looked like for a long time, like he has a case on criminal collusion. You know, conspiracy to violate any of the offenses that have to do with the campaign activity. We see that in the flynn plea agreement and statement of the offense. We see it in the papadopoulos one. So it will be interesting to look at this. Theres nothing in those two or in the gates agreement that would indicate i mean, typically youll lay your case out to let it be known theres very damaging evidence here. So i would say, wait, and look carefully at the language. With respect to your respect about the ronan farrow report, whats interesting to me, if im not mistaken, its a crime to do what this person did typically, yes. To leak it. I think he even says it. I havent had a chance to look at the statute. Those kinds of activity reports are highly protected. That means there will be a criminal investigation theyre already looking at the leak, but there will be a criminal investigation of this. I think at some point, farrow, if he has a prosecutor as aggressive as Patrick Fitzgerald was with the press, that he can expect a subpoena, and hell have to make a decision about whether or not hes willing to go to prison to protect a source. Because its a very big deal to leak one of these. I completely agree with seth, the information is there. The information isnt going to be lost. But also if you read that report, many of the people farrow talked to, at least half the people, i think, said, well, there could be an explanation for this other than the theft or the and i appreciate that nuance. And indeed nbcs reported on the possible counterintelligence reasons, which is to say, it was put to the side for the right reason, not the wrong reason. Although i did read the allegation of the whistleblower. Seth, when you look at these reports breaking over the last five minutes, that Paul Manaforts estranged former soninlaw has flipped, as far back as january, is cooperating with investigators and that we dont know whether that directly comes from the Mueller Probe or separately, this is a person that was on their radar, that was investigated, that did meet with muellers investigators. Walk us through just as a line prosecutor, how this kind of thing works, why, for example, is it a secret plea deal . Other plea deals have been released in the course of normal investigation. Your analysis . I think it couldnt be any more clear to me. I want Paul Manafort. There were three people in that meeting, kushner, don jr. And Paul Manafort. They are trying to get someone on the inside of that meeting to cooperate and roll them up on don jr. , kushner, and potentially the president. Be it an indictment in d. C. , an additional indictment in virginia. Which as i understand it, is about 300plus years, and now theyve flipped his soninlaw. Let me go to the secret thing. I mean, its hard to be afraid of a concealed weapon if you cant see it. So why secret if the goal is pressure . I dont know that they didnt tell Paul Manafort this was going on. I suspect they had. Why secret . It could be they have pro active cooperation going on. In other words, they flipped him, and it could be the case talking about a wire . Talking about a wire. That they wired him up and got him into conversations. Paul manaforts on house arrest. So in theery, he could still have phone calls and meetings. Whether that happened or not, theres a whole host of things that a prosecutor and fbi agent team would use to use a cooperator proactively. I can almost assure that all the defense lawyers for mr. Manafort and anyone else indicted, theyre saying, dont talk to anyone. Dont talk on the phones. David, ive dealt with mr. Manafort in a reporting capacity. Youre no stranger to a lot of players in republican politics. Walk us through the mindset here of an individual with this much pressure coming down on him, his deputy flipping who he brought in originally as an intern in his firm. His soninlaw flipping since january and seth giving us the reason that prosecutors do that, to put more heat on. Whats Paul Manafort holding out for . I dont know. But the question that i would keep brooding about is this who question as well as the what. When Paul Manafort went to work for donald trump for free, did he do so because he had people to please or people to whom he owed money. People who might come at you with something a little more frightening than a subpoena. Final word from you, sir. Well, if the soninlaw was wearing a wire while he talked to a federal defendant under custodial control, that would be amazingly aggressive and risky prosecutorial tactics. So again, i think we have to wait and see. I think you need to be very careful not to make enemies with your former soninlaw. I think thats a very important lesson. Well, it all depends on what he has on you, like so many things. Special thanks to all of you. A lot of experts on this panel. Coming up, my special guest tonight, the man who literally wrote the rules that govern bob mueller. Neil catchual is on the beat and talks about what could let to indicting a sitting president. Also, nothing wrong with getting dirt from the russians. Nothing ill legal about that. Whether it comes from a russian or german, doesnt matter. Congressman Joaquin Castro is here to discuss Donald Trumps attacks on ms13 and immigrants in general. And a special guest tonight on the woman who could be the next attorney general in Donald Trumps home state of new york. Youre watching the beat on msnbc. As a control enthusiast, im allbusiness when i travel. Even when i travel. For leisure. So i go national, where i can choose any available upgrade in the aisle without starting any conversations or paying any upcharges. What can i say . Control suits me. Go national. Go like a pro. You might be missing something. Y healthy. Your eyes. Thats why theres ocuvite. Ocuvite helps replenish nutrients your eyes can lose as you age. It has lutein, zeaxanthin and omega3. Ocuvite. Be good to your eyes. Can be a big bad problem that you could spread to. Family members, including your grandchildren babies too young to be vaccinated against whooping cough are the most at risk for severe illness. But you can help prevent this. Talk to your doctor today about getting vaccinated against whooping cough. Because dangers dont just exist in fairytales. Sure. Mom,whats up son . Alk . I cant be your it guy anymore. What . You guys have xfinity. You can do this. Whats a good wifi password, mom . You still have to visit us. I will. No. Make that the password you stillohave toovisit us. Thats a good one. [ chuckles ] download the xfinity my account app and set a password you can easily remember. One more way comcast is working to fit into your life, not the other way around. Neil katyal. Big story right now is this. Can bob mueller indict donald trump, charge him with crimes that could lead to prison while trump is in office, and eventually send him to prison . If that sounds like resistance fan fiction, consider the topic is news tonight because like many terrible stories for trump, his own attorney, Rudy Giuliani brought it up on tv. First of all, he cant legally be indicted by anyone. I president cant be indicted. He can only be impeached. I asked them if they realized they didnt have the power to indict. He said well, he wouldnt answer. One of his assistants said, they acknowledged they were bound by Justice Department policies. Then the next day or the day after, they clarified they didnt have the power to indict. If true that was really interesting. Giuliani taking everyone inside a secret meeting with bob mueller himself and rudy elaborated on this in a longer interview, saying, quote, one of his assistants broke in and said, well, of course, were bound by Justice Department policies. And giuliani then said mueller looked at him, like, quote, dont interrupt me. Then giuliani said, it reminded me of that scene in the god father where he said, youre going to take care of us, we can take care of ourselves. Your business a little dangerous. If youre worried about security for your men, theyll guarantee it. Are you telling me that the italians guarantee our investment wait a minute. I have a sentimental weakness for my children and i spoil them, as you can see. They talk when they should listen. Corleoney then warns, quote, never tell anyone outside the family what youre thinking again. In giulianis telling, thats what mueller would be telling to his deputy. Maybe some day theyll write movies about this period in america, but that assumes america makes it through this period. While giuliani has gotten a lot of things wrong, it is true that Justice Department guidelines do state, you cannot indict a sitting president , which would be unconstitutional. And giulianis basically saying a mueller aide cited that rule in their meeting. Which is possible. The rule that the doj applied for past president s would seem to continue. People who want to change it because they dont like trump may not appear credible unless they have a better argument. And what about the rules that give mueller this power . Well, my next guest wrote the rules, neil katyal, and he points that they provide for exceptions of doj policy with the approval of muellers boss, in this case, Rod Rosenstein. My next guest wrote those rules, neil katyal. He points out the rules do provide for exceptions to doj policy with the approval of the special counsels boss, Rod Rosenstein. Mr. Katyal, you worked at a doj with the same internal policy about not indicting a sitting president. Why should that be different now . I think the first thing to point out is that we just consider how low the president s bar is here, what hes saying. Weve gone from, russia, whats russia . Or Stormy Daniels, whos that . Whats the 130,000 . To, oh, you cant indict me, i have a get out of jail free card. And thats a remarkable thing. Were talking about the president of the United States saying that. Theres a large number of reasons to be suspect about what mr. Giuliani has said, apart from the fact that details and facts arent exactly his strong suit. The story just seems very incomplete, because the special counsel rules, as you just said, ari, do absolutely permit mueller to indict the president , but he has to seek the permission of the acting attorney general Rod Rosenstein first. Are you familiar with a situation, though, where the acting attorney general would authorize directly contradicting standing guidance from the office of Legal Counsel which is sort of the dojs doj . Absolutely. So when we wrote the rules, we had in mind a situation in which, you know, there are some doj policy, Something Like that, that would preclude the special counsel from doing his job. And in an appropriate circumstance, we said absolutely the solution is to go and ask the acting attorney general. Did you have in mind something as big as indicting a sitting president . We certainly had in mind big things. Theres no question about that. And the rules reflect that, in point 7 of the rules. Dont you see theres a concern here, that it all seems to be changing within the context of donald trump . What do you say to people who perceive, even from folks who talk about the rule of law and the importance of the nps independence of the doj, a hunger to go tougher when donald trump is the target . Id say a couple things. A lot of these opinions that a sitting president cant be indicted were before the paula jones case. And the Supreme Court in that case said, the american principle, no one is above the law. That was a civil case, and what goes for a civil case, i suspect there will be a pretty good argument, goes Even Stronger for a criminal case. That a president shouldnt be able to commit crimes and act with impunity. Theres a second real problem here. The whole idea behind, you cant indict a sitting president , a large part of it comes from the fact that indictments are distracting to the president who is very busy. Courts operate in the real world. And they know, for example, that donald trump has golfed 53 days out of his 482 days in office, more than 1 in 10 days. So its a little hard to make the kind of distraction arguments that are at the core of president s cant be indicted opinions when youre talking about this president. Let me push you on that. Because that was an issue in paula jones, and just about anyone can file a civil case. But i dont think it goes down just to the time and the golfing. I think it goes to the idea that a federal indictment of a sitting president would effectively knee cap their term and potentially their reelection, that you are taking the person charged with executing the laws and making them subject to other decisions within the executive branch that might detonate their presidency as a practical matter. Thats absolutely right. Very good point. There are two basic paths. One is to say, we have a principle thats more important, no one is above the law. And it arguably applies to criminal, and at least may apply to the indictment of a president. And maybe you say, you cant try him in office, that would knee cap him. The second and more funeral poin fundamental point, all the scholars who say, you cant indict a president while hes sitting, say, the remedy is impeachment, its congress doing its job. You cant, if youre the president , say on the one hand, you cant indict me, and then say, mueller, you cant write a thorough, comprehensive report, detailing everything you found. Both arguments cant be true. So they work together. So these people who say, you cant indict a sitting president also say congress should have all the Information Available to it. And the constitutions kind of like a graphic equalizer. If you put everything up [ inaudible ] trumps arguments are always to go minus 10 on everything and destroy the symmetry in the institutional equilibrium. Its absolutely fine. I can imagine an argument that says a sitting president cant be indicted, but its always then coupled with, mueller, all the stuff you found, all these reports and stuff, everything has to be turned over to the congress of the United States, both the majority and Minority Party so you can do your job effectively. You say its like a graphic equalizer, when you think about checks and balances and the language relationship between bass and treble, obviously those are important matters of ek wi pose. Before i let you go, i have to ask you about your arguments against trumps travel ban in the Supreme Court. What did you take from the arguments that day . Do you have a chance to win . Im not going to comment on that, im sorry. But thats my basic policy, when it comes to a case thats pending in the Supreme Court. Ive heard about that kind of policy, but i had to ask. Neil katyal, thank you very much. Thank you. Let me bring in a former Trump Campaign surrogate and graduate of ohio state law school, and also a fellow at nyus mcsilver institute. This seems tabo be a big topic kicked up by Rudy Giuliani. Whats your view . I think theres arguments to be made on both sides. At the same time, something thats not been mentioned enough, if we were to indict a sitting president , any sitting president , not just trump, that would essentially give a jury up to only 12 people the ability to essentially overturn a national election. And thats a pretty scary thing. Christina, what do you think about that . Neil walked through a lot of the nitty gritty details on the law. But at the broader level, america is now taking this all in, rudy is going to the mat, because he thinks, to madisons point, that a lot of folks would have the natural reaction. If this were obama and it were going to be up to 12 jurors, people might say, is this any way to resolve this . It would be highly problematic. We talked about this a year and a half ago. The way the framers laid out the constitution is such that there have to be checks and balances. So congress is always supposed to serve as a check on the president. The problem is, because this president has a Republican House and a republican congress, or a republican senate, theyre acting like a bunch of sycophants. Theyre not stepping up. Weve never seen a president like president trump. The closest weve come is nixon. And nixon actually was a public servant, was an elected official, and had some decency in the sense that he stepped down so he wouldnt embarrass himself and the american people. Your argument is not necessarily this is a normal thing that we shouldnt be concerned about indicting a president , this is abnormal but in the right abnormal circumstance it might be merited. It might be. Because as mueller, who is moving in silence, as he uncovers and excavates possible real deepseated corruption on a series of levels for quite some time, i think this is worth keeping on the table. I agree with madison, we shouldnt just move the bar just because 50 of the country or maybe more doesnt agree with this particular president. We cant set that precedent. However, weve never had a president whos been this disrespectful to the American Office of the presidency, because hes never been a public servant. Its a smashandgrab presidency. Were seeing this on a financial level. A smashandgrab. Madison, there are politics to all of this obviously. Take a listen to senator Richard Blumenthal on msnbc going where more and more democrats appear to go. It has never been tested, theres no precedent. There is a department of justice guideline apparently that says the president cannot be indicted. Theres a lot of Legal Support for that view, but my own view is that he can be indicted. Hes not above the law. Impeachment is not the exclusive remedy. Do you think democrats are basically changing their rules because they dont like donald trump . I think the only response to this is in the words of lauren hill, yall cant see the truth in a courtroom of lies. So many Democratic Senators and congressmen are going against what they would have said if this was obama, clinton, or someone else. And theyre not really looking at the constitution, looking at the history of the doj and the risk that we would take if we were to indict a sitting president. The flip side, you want to do this through lauren hill. She also said consequence is no coincidence. And the idea that christinas raising is that donald trump has pushed the norms, devalued the independent independence of the doj and fbi, that there has to be some reaction. Assuming were going off that, hes different than the president s weve had before, but that does not change the constitution and it does not change the rule of law in this country. The constitutions a rough draft. A rough draft for what . It is an outline of things. An outline of things is how you would define the constitution of the United States . I would define it that way, because the framers never thought they would have a president in the man of donald trump. We are supposed to elect a president who puts this country first. This president has never even had excuse me, madison. [ all speak at once ] im going to go to christina and then back to you, madison. This president has never had a board of advisers for any of his businesses. He does not respect the rule of law, because he says he didnt read. Hes never even read the constitution. So we have to rely on the courts and congress to serve as a check on this president , and theyre not doing so. So unfortunately, yes, we are in a constitutional crisis, not might be. And we know that the doj might have to indict a sitting president , which weve never had before. But weve also never had someone like donald trump. The worst thing that obama did realistically is his tan suit and his mom jeans, when you put it in the grand scheme of things. Bill clinton and the Monica Lewinsky scandals and all these other things come nowhere near the Trump Administration. I mean, this is a point where domestically and internationally, we are in a crisis. And if you look at all the various articles of the constitution, theyre pretty vague. And its up to congress to fill in what they deem appropriate. So, yes, it is a rough draft from over 200 years ago, and we are the ones that are supposed to uphold as promised, i want to give madison a rebuttal. On the point on the rough draft, there were a lot of problems in the original constitutions. There are amendments. It is true while the doj policy says you cant indict that language itself is not in the constitution. Final word, madison. Exactly. Its not in the constitution, but i think its insulting to this country and the framers of the constitution to call it a rough draft when thats what this country is [ all speak at once ] let me go back to something that she said, saying that the president has never read the constitution. I know the president. Thats not true. Hes read the constitution of the United States. Hes also read federalist papers number 69 about alexander hamilton, where he talks about the fact that the president should be impeached before being charged with a criminal offense. And thats what they intended. Might want to read about separation of powers. Thats part of my argument. We have separation of powers and checks and balances so we dont unduly burden the president. Were quoting lauren, different federalist papers. Ready or not, here i come, a quote from robert mueller. Thank you both for talking directly to each other. We like to do that on the beat. Congressman Joaquin Castro is live with me when were back in 60 seconds. If you use some of these moves way too often. Then you might have a common condition called dry mouth. Which can be brought on by many things, like medication and medical conditions. Biotene provides immediate, long lasting relief from dry mouth symptoms. It is clinically proven to soothe and moisturize a dry mouth. Plus, it freshens breath. Biotene. Immediate and long lasting dry mouth symptom relief. Breaking news this hour, nbc news reporting Paul Manaforts former soninlaw has flipped, cut a secret plea deal with federal investigators which could have implications in Paul Manaforts prosecution and potentially in the Mueller Probe. Im joined by democratic congressman Joaquin Castro from texas. Thank you for joining me. Business news night. Your view of this breaking news and any idea of whether it is connected to the Mueller Probe . I would suspect that it is. I think most of all, its probably for bob mueller and his team, a way to put pressure on Paul Manafort to cooperate with them. And that can have a real significance for donald trump and his other campaign associates. Youre on the intelligence committee, so you know more than most, and you know more than i think sometimes you are allowed to say under those rules. But how do you feel when you learn this information, that the reporting, starting with the wall street, alleges a secret plea deal from january. Weve been doing these discussions and reporting across the country, that would suggest the whole year, Paul Manaforts soninlaw has been secretly cooperating with somebody. Well, personally, it makes me wonder if its just coming out now, what hes been doing for them since january. How much hes been cooperating and in what ways. You know, when all of this started, when the investigation started over a year ago now, obviously year and a half, sortsort shortly after that i was asked what i thought the eventually outcome of this would be, and i said in march of last year, that i thought that many people would end up going to jail. And there have been 22 indictments, people are on their way to jail now. My sense is that this will continue, that more folks will be headed to prison. More folks headed to prison. Thats an interesting statement from you, on the house intel committee. We dont want to just talk russia. A lot of other things going o including the debate about immigration. The president making these comments yesterday, referring to animals crossing the border, which today he emphasized was a reference to ms13 gang members. Take a listen to both of those comments. So here we are stuck in the middle, trying to decide, we have federal law, we have state law. For what . Ms13 gang member. If they dont reach a certain threshold, i cannot tell i. C. E. About them. We have people coming into the country, trying to come in. Were stopping a lot of them. But were taking people out of the country. You wouldnt believe how bad these people are. These arent people. These are animals. Ms13, these are animals that are coming into our country. Were getting them out. When the other gang members come into our country, i refer to them as animals. And guess what, i always will. Do you accept the white house argument that plenty of politicians talk tough about criminals and gang members, or do you view this as a wider attack on immigrants . Its true that politicians talk tough about gang members, but it seems like every time the president talks about immigrants, he basically seems to assume that everybody is part of ms13. Whenever he talks about immigrants, he always leads with ms13 as though hes casting everybody thats an immigrant as an ms13 gang member. Or somehow saying that ms13 gang members are the embodiment of who immigrants are. And so it was very strange to hear a president of the United States speak in such dehumanizing terms. The other thing, ari, its clear that the Justice Department and this administration are going after people and claiming that people are gang members, simply because they have Something Like a tattoo on their body, which to them signifies that somehow somebody is automatically a gang member because theyve got a tattoo. So theres not only been very disturbing and dehumanizing language the president has used, but harsh and draconian apolicis hes mpursued. Listen to something thats gone viral concerning immigrants. Your staff is speaking spanish to customers. My next call is to i. C. E. To get them out of the country. If theyre going to come here and live off my money, i pay for their welfare, for their ability to be here. Is this a trump effect . Are you worried about how we relate inside this country with people, that individual referencing whether people speak spanish which is a perfectly legal and fine thing to do in the United States. I think its at least partly a trump effect. Hes basically emboldened people to let loose on their prejudices and let them fly and become very open about that. Thats one video thats gone viral, but as you know, there have been many others. And so i suspect when the president continues with this kind of rhetoric, well see more of this. Congressman Joaquin Castro, thank you. Up ahead, were looking at going beyond the Mueller Probe, including new corruption allegations. Im your phone, stuck down here between your seat and your console, playing a little hidenseek. Cold. Warmer. Warmer. Ah boiling. Jackpot. And if youve got cutrate car insurance, you could be picking up these charges yourself. So get allstate, where agents help keep you protected from mayhem. Like me. Mayhem is everywhere. 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If you have inflammatory bowel disease tell your doctor if symptoms develop or worsen. Serious allergic reactions may occur. Mitzi with less joint pain, watch me. For less joint pain and clearer skin, ask your rheumatologist about cosentyx. With pg e in the sierras. And im an arborist ask your rheumatologist since the onset of the drought, more than 129 Million Trees have died in california. Pg e prunes and removes over a Million Trees every year to ensure that hazardous trees cant impact power lines. And since the onset of the drought weve doubled our efforts. I grew up in the forests out in this area and honestly its heartbreaking to see all these trees dying. What guides me is ensuring that the public is going to be safer and that these forests can be sustained and enjoyed by the community in the future. Corruption stories continue to dog the Trump Administration. Look at this headline about Michael Cohen potentially selling access to qatar. These are exactly the type of things that as a candidate donald trump said he had the knowledge to prevent. Its called pay for play. Pay for play corruption. Pay for play. More pay for play. Its pay for play, which is illegal. A hundred percent illegal. And a special guest for this, fordham law professor who wrote a book on corruption in america and shes exploring a run for attorney general in new york, and doing that after the resignation of Eric Snyderman after he was exposed for Domestic Abuse violations of a very serious nature. Starting with this corruption, was this predictable and how should it be stopped now. This is really chilling and we have to not ever get used to this. The corruption stories that we saw just today involving qatar, both the Michael Cohen story and about jared kushner, both of them show ways in which foreign governments are really destabilizing Foreign Policy in the United States by using investments, bailing out jared kushner. What it does, it calls into question all of our Foreign Policy voices. So this is destabilizing for all of us in this country, its also globally destabilizing. I think its really important we never come to accept, thats trump, and thats the Trump Administration. Its especially chilling for me because when you look at the founding era that people who wrote our constitution, one of the things they were most worried about, and talked about day after day in that hot summer in philadelphia, was the way that foreign interests might interpose themselves, using cash and influence to try to impact the young country. And one of their animating concerns was the central corruption of monarchies because power is unchecked. Here we are in 2018, dealing with this type of corruption. Turning to the post youre exploring running for, Eric Schneiderman was known to many people around the country who opposed donald trump, took a tough line on a host of issues. How would you oppose this administration if elected within the rule of law, would donald trump be more worried about you than Eric Schneiderman potentially . A lot of people in new york and maybe around the country, im still shaken up by the allegations, i mean, the story, the very powerful story last week and what we learned about schneidermans abuse. And we had seen that office as one of the most, and should continue to see it, under acting attorney general barbara underwood, who is incredibly accomplished, as one of the most important posts standing up against the lawlessness, unconstitutional behavior and corruption of the Trump Administration. Would you be prerd to use the powers of that office, within your understanding of the law to pursue people who might get federal pardons . Absolutely. One of the most important things that you may have talked about before on this show is that passing a pardon does not include state crimes. And so theres many different ways in which a state attorney general, but in particular, the new York State Attorney general but in particular the new York State Attorney general has the power to really resist the lawlessness and corruption of the Trump Administration. First of all, the Trump Administration looks to be violating state laws as well as federal laws, bank fraud, financial fraud. Second, it will be important to be working with federal prosecutors. I would say the issue is complex enough we should return to it in another segment if youll come back. Absolutely. I followed your work for a long time. We will be right back. So is his horse. When it comes to snacking. Thats why he uses the chase mobile app, to pay practically anyone, at any bank. Life, lived victors way. Chase. Make more of whats yours. Ftheres flonase sensimist. F up around pets. It relieves all your worst symptoms including nasal congestion, which most pills dont. 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President trump marked the industry of special counsel Robert Muellers appointment with a tweet this morning proclaiming his innocence. Congratulations, america, we are now into the second year of the greatest witch hunt in american history. There is still no collusion and no obstruction. He went on to claim that despite the disgusting illegal and unwarranted witch hunt, we have had the most successful first 17month administration in u. S