Transcripts For MSNBCW The Beat With Ari Melber 20171207

Thats what makes this story so interesting. Brand new emails that have leaked if trumps inner circle. They were first obtained by cnn and they appear to tell a different story. That the meeting led to plans which were put in writing by the very people who orchestrated the trump tower meeting. It involved the british publicist who set this whole thing up. Rob goldstone had the offer that donald trump would get dirt on Hillary Clinton from russias meeting with the people you see on the screen. Those people, of course, trump jr. , Jared Kushner, Paul Manafort and some russians. The issue was what would happen. There was a news story about russia hacking the dnc and said, it was quote, eerily weird given what they had discussed at the trump tower meeting five days before. And after trump jr. Posted his email response on twitter under pressure, it was revealed, of course, that there was that dirt offer. The son of one of the russian attendees emailed his father and said why was trump jr. Admitting, quote, collusion . These pretty extraordinary. So i dont want to spend any more time reading the emails to you. I want to bring in our experts. Frank, a former assistant director for counter intel at the fbi, and former u. S. Attorney randall alyson. With government fraud, a key section of a key u. S. Attorneys Office Located in washington, d. C. Frank, i go to you. Because there is the kind of thing that fbi agents do all the time. They pour over material. What do you think of these emails . I think it is time to start asking ourselves whether don jr. Is beginning to behind they are investigation. Weve gotten word that he refused to answer a question on the hill and has claimed attorneyclient privilege because he was with his father when attorneys were in the room. Now were hearing something more significant. Everything he seems to remember and cant recall about the meeting seem to be inaccurate. Because now the person who organized the meeting has emailed folks in the meeting, reminding them what they talked about. What did they talk about . Topics that don junior has not brought to our attention. The candidate trump should create a russian social media site. Even more importantly, were learning that he sends, the guy who organized this meeting, sends the copy of a cnn news article, talking about russian hacking of the dnc and says, this is eerie, based on what we talked about at the trump tower meeting. Right. Eerie there sounds like a concern that the discussions in the meeting were somehow germane to news of the hacked emails. Sometimes we play the statements in don junior in fairness to say here is his defense. Other times we have to play them in a way that makes him look ridiculous. Here he was saying there was no followup. These emails show followup at the minimum. There was no followup because there was nothing there to follow up. As we walked out, he said im sorry about. That he built it up. There was some had puffery to make the meeting happen and in the end there was probably some baitandswitch about what it was supposed to be about. So you know, there is nothing there. Theres tons there. This is basically what i have been saying all along. There was a criminal act that occurred here which was the hack at the dnc. The Trump Campaign knew about it as early as april 2016 through papadopoulos when Ron Goldstone offered to give to the Trump Campaign. Which he said was part of russias effort to help the Trump Campaign. There can be little doubt that the only thing they had that was dirt on Hillary Clinton that was helpful to the campaign, was those emails. The reason why don junior does not want to admit that he actually received those emails, is because it is a crime to receive those emails. Knowing they were stolen. Thats why hes doing it. This is part of one of two conspiracies that is out there, that relates to this conspiracy between the campaign and the russian government. And this one may be, i dont know if it is most serious, but it is certainly one that we know there was a crime because we know there was a hack at the dnc. Youve prosecuted Corruption Cases and other types of complex conspiracies. A big question is what did people think they were doing . If you show up in the wrong room, in a big building, maybe you walk in on something but youre not criminally culpable. If you know whats being discussed, if you come to plot about it and you do followup, that evidence can stack up against you. So walk us through how would you look at it. Sure. There are two main ways in which these emails are interesting. One is as you mentioned, they contradict the claim that this meeting was just a oneoff. And it feeds into the larger narrative of the more extensive contacts by those involved in the campaign that theyve consistently denied. And additional contacts keep looking out and leaking out on. And now we have this meeting that was portrayed as this one off meeting. The second reason is to the extent theyve potentially contradicted things that have been said by other members of the administration, don junior or Jared Kushner or others who have been interviewed by the fbi, if they made statements about that meeting or any possible followup to that meeting, that is contradicted by the emails. Even more importantly, by the author of the emails. On their face, the emails can be ambiguous or a little hard to interpret. If the author comes in and starts testifying and contradicting what theyve said, it is very important. And frank, part of my job is to ask obvious questions. So let me throw one your way. If there was some followup from this meeting, but it was innocent. Say there was followup to discuss the logo of the Trump Campaign and they had ideas about it. Why lie about that . Why not say, we met about x and then there was some followup but it is not what they thought it was. These emails explode that. And one example is an email leaked. First obtained by cnn that said don and paul were on board to create a russian social net working site, it would be to connect with russian americans, a cute marketing idea. Goldstone mentioned it at the end of the trump tower meeting and continued to push it over email. Why from an investigative standpoint would someone lie about that . Two reasons. On a macro level, first you have collusion concerns. Were beginning to see a theory of what was really discussed at that meeting. Whether it was dnc hack. This isnt just about don junior. The president himself crafted a statement about that trump tower meeting where he said it was about child adoption. Now were getting information that is not what it was at all. I want to bring in joan walsh. I know youre joining us. But the big headline here is these emails leaking out. Really explode any idea that there was an isolated meeting that nothing ever came out of. Now you have a lot of key people talking about not only the meeting and the fallout but other ideas heretofore undiscussed. I think it is clear. They are eerily weird as someone might say. They really show a pattern at this point. Rob goldstone, more than donald junior, is the obvious center of it but hes brought don junior in. The idea that they needed to have presence on a russian social net working site. It is quite bizarre. And it does seem like there was at least a low level team but receiving back to people in the campaign who had a lot of ideas. Do you think it is possible that it was not just to do social networking . I cant go any farther than what we can. It is an odd place to need presence. You say its odd. Is it eerie . It is also eerie. I wanted to use the word of the night. While i have you here, i want to ask but the debate. There are reasonable arguments if you have two people who are getting counsel advice and theyre together with counsel, that it would be privilege. It could be like doctor patient privilege. You get to claim it. Yet we would be remiss if we didnt report that that big debate yesterday about attorneyclient privilege connects with the breaking news tonight that theres more and more dribbling out about what had previously been lied about at the trump tower meeting. So your view on both questions. One, could it be a legitimate claim on privilege . And two, do you see any link to this meeting . For it to be privileged, it has to be communication to a lawyer to obtain legal advice. If the facts is they were on the phone with their attorneys to obtain legal advice, then yes maybe. If they can raise some kind of joint defense argument. You couldnt make it privileged by putting a lawyer on the phone or in the room. I guess the privilege claim seems unlikely. It is not impossible. The problem with the privilege when it comes to the committee is their ability to press the issue is dependent on their willingness to do that. The only way would be to subpoena don junior to come back and then to override any claim of privilege. And then if he refuses to testify, to hold him in contempt or take him to court. That seems unlikely. If he tries to make the same privilege claim with bob mueller in the grand jury, he will find the Opposing Side much less accommodating and mueller wont have any trouble taking this to a court to find out whether the privilege claim is valid. Getting an order to compel him to testify and holding him in contempt if he refuses. Very interesting. Thank you very much. Nick and joan, stay with me for later in the show. I have a the beat special report on the flynn investigation, protecting trump in any pardons. And some brush fwrak trumps own fbi director. And senator al franken said he is resigning and he is asking why it is okay for donald trump and roy moore to remain in office. And later, my exclusive interview with the man who was deny ad marriage license by an antisame sex marriage clerk. He just fired paperwork the get her job. Your brain changes as you get older. But prevagen helps your brain with an ingredient originally discovered. In jellyfish. In clinical trials, prevagen has been shown to improve shortterm memory. Prevagen. The name to remember. Each day justin at work. Walk. And after work. He does it all with dr. Scholls. Only dr. Scholls has massaging gel insoles that provide allday comfort. To keep him feeling more energized. Dr. Scholls. Born to move. Discover card. I justis this for real . Match, yep. We match all the cash back new cardmembers earn at the end of their first year, automatically. Whoo i got my money hard to contain yourself, isnt it . Uh huh let it go whoo get a dollarfordollar match at the end of your first year. Only from discover. Weve been reporting on big breaking news. Emails about the Infamous Trump tower meeting. There is another side to all this and you could call it the distraction side. Republicans attack bob mueller in an fbi hearing today. Did bob mueller recruit people to his probe had had a bias against the president . You are taking an Fbi Department that was weakened by muellers time. We do not know the magnitude of this insider bias on mr. Muellers team. If he kicked everybody off who was antitrump, i dont think there would be anybody left. This comes several months when many Public Officials avoided attacking mueller directly. But the mood has begun shifting in conservative media. Robert muellers entire team should be replaced. Mueller himself should be canned. The person to be investigated is barack obama. The special impeachment counsel from the beginning. The mueller investigation. Weve been talking about how thats corrupt to the core. Mueller is corrupt. The senior fbi is correct. Like the owed kgb that comes for you in the dark of the night. This is the biggest corruption we have ever seen in terms of of our Justice System i believe in our lifetime. Hmmm. Thats whats happening over there. So you have the conservative media pushing the house republicans. What do you get next . Today this was pretty interesting. Christopher reyes, the man was hand picked by donald trump to run the fbi and he was asked about mueller and he had a different take. You know the reputation of director mueller with fbi agents and fbi lore . My experience has been that director mueller is very well respected within the fbi. Im joined now by the executive director for citizens of responsibility on ethics. Hes written a new report on how it would work if you try to remove mueller. What are we seeing . Partisan politics attacking an independent Prosecutorial Agency that is critically important to protecting the laws of the United States and the integrity of the federal government. In a nut shell. Do you think politically the shift is based on facts in evidence . Because there was a report about one vd who worked at the fbi who had texted about politics, or do you think this is somebody, as we laid out in the introduction, getting their cues from fox news . This is clearly partisan and not based in fact. First of all, were talking about a leadership in the department of justice that is itself republican. So to suggest that there is somehow a partisan attack simply because one lawyer back, relating to the clinton email investigation changed language from gross negligence to is a, it is silly. Because the reality is edits go on all the time. If the fbi is saying they didnt find reason to prosecute Hillary Clinton, you wont then use planning suggests you should prosecute Hillary Clinton and it is a simple editing process. Even if you had one attorney who was later put in a different position, that certainly doesnt suggest that you suddenly have an independent agency fundamentally responsible for upholding the laws of the United States, not upholding the laws of the United States because it is pursuing credible evidence that there may have been crimes committed by People Holding Public Office. What did you think of this shift today . Because it is different than what Many Republican hs previously said. I think what is happening here is that it is very clear that Robert Mueller is moving quickly, aggressively. He is moving effectively. And i think that the, those who dont want to see this investigation move forward in an aggressive way, and get closer to the president , we dont know where the flakts lead but right now theyve led relatively close to the president. You view this as a direct response to bob mueller getting flynn to flip and breaching the white house for the first time in this investigation. Thats right. For those who are concerned about where this is going, discrediting mueller and those working for him is, it seems like better tactic than actually addressing whats happening in the investigation. The facts that are coming out of the investigation, and the pleas and the charges are pretty alarming. And clearly, folks would rather be talk about allegations. And the nature of a plea is theyre not debatable. It is not that mike flynn is accused, it is mike flynn admitted and it maybe other things he didnt admit. It is so big, it is worth more than a weeks coverage. Take a look at the obstruction questions today. Do you believe a sitting xres commit obstruction of justice . Do you believe donald trump is above the law . I dont think anyone is above the law. It sounds like obstruction of justice, i think the American People can reasonably conclude it is obstruction of justice. What was important about that questioning to you on a week where the Trump Legal Team took the position that it is impossible for donald trump to obstruct justice and then walk that back publicly . Well, it is very clear, the law is very clear that he the president and anybody can obstruct justice. The fact that you have Legal Authority to fire an fbi director, or to criticize an investigation, doesnt mean that you can do it corruptly. It doesnt mean that you can do it for improper purposes. So it is an argument, what seemed like shot in the dark by an increasingly panicked legal team, and it was appropriate that there be pushback. You dont think public fighting with each other was three dimensional chess . I dont think so. Im just kidding. I tell bad lawyer jokes. It is part of what we do. I dont think it was chess because it didnt go well. Up ahead, senator al franken said in his speech announcing his resignation that it is ironic. And later, inside something you may not know about a deal that mike flynn made with bob mueller. New doj documents showing a potential path around a trump pardon. And later, remember kim davis . Who could forget that circus after she denied Marriage Equality rights. Now man running for her job is my exclusive guest. More people shop online for the holidays than ever before. clapping and the United States Postal Service delivers more of those purchases to homes than anyone else in the country. because we know, even the smallest things are sometimes the biggest. Even the smallest things anyone ever have occasional y constipation,diarrhea, gas or bloating . She does. She does. 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Who inspires and pushes us to go further than we could ever go alone. Sofi. Get there sooner. Today al franken announced he will resign over allegations of groping and sexual harassment. Today, i am announcing that in the coming weeks, i will be resigning as a member of the United States senate. I of all people am aware there is some irony in the fact that i am leaving while a man who has bragged on tape about his history of Sexual Assault sits in the oval office and a man who has repeatedly preyed on young girls campaigns for the senate with the full support of his party. 35 democratic lawmakers have called on franken to step down. The news comes three weeks after the first accuser had stepped forward. Today she said she had previously publicly accepted his apology and did not think he needed to resign. By contrast, it has been 28 days since it was first reported that roy moore had sexually preyed upon a 14yearold girl when he was 32. As democrats are rallying and calling on their colleague to resign, the rnc and the president have been all in for moore. Since that report, moore has not stepped down from the race and he has also denied the accusations. Meanwhile, republican senator graham said this. What does it mean for republican thats the roy moore backs senator and senator franken has resigned . Im not supporting roy moore. I wish the rnc wasnt supporting roy moore. I want him to step aside. I wish he were not our nominee. I think if he wins, hes the gift that keeps on giving for democrats. Back with me, joan walsh, and michael steele. Joan . It was really heart breaking to watch al franken resign today. Excuse me for my voice. Im not sick. My voice is sick. It had to happen. There were eight allegations. And as ive talked on friends of his, and friends of mine, you could find something wrong every allegation. But you were having to parse it so much. If there were eight, maybe there would be 80. A lot of people are making politics out of this. The democrats wanted to get him out of the way for roy moore. This is not going to help or hurt roy moore. This wont be taken seriously by the republicans. Now hes gone. Sarah huckabee said the difference is al franken admitted to something and apologized. Donald trump didnt. So he is a sexual abuser and the man in the white house isnt as far as republicans are concerned. So this wasnt really a political congratulations that i saw. A calculation as far as i saw. It is powered by womens anger at the access Hollywood Tape and the 16 women who came forward and said he abused them who were not listened to. So this was a really tragic unraveling that i think had to happen. And i salute al franken for having the decency to do what he did. Joans book spoke to the ethics of it. We want your reaction as someone who was a chair to the Political Party and watch the Democratic Party respond very differently than the rnc to date. They did. And from early on, while the leadership may have taken an early lets wait and see, and sort of was stumbling through, the individual members in the senate, on the democratic side, were not. Particularly the we will. I think thats important to note. They came to the table with much more clarity than we saw even among republicans who were coming out of the gate against roy moore. So i have to give kudos to the women in the senate who were really the drivers here behind this whole narrative. And not just with respect to democrats. And it does speak to the point about the ethics, the reality of this. It is a very bright line. You cant get it twisted or confuse it. Whether youre talking about a 14yearold girl or a 27yearold woman or anyone else, there is a very bright line about how you treat them. How you do not disrespect them. Et cetera, et cetera. The politics of this is even more disturbing. Because by the political congratulations of the gop, they Value Holding a seat. Getting a vote over the ethics. Over the morality. Over the concern thats a young woman would have. Even though this may have happened to her a while ago. That that somehow was less. She had to prove it. The women still have to prove, not with one, two, three, seven, eight, nine, ten, coming in saying this happened to me. She still has to prove it. I think for the republicans, thats a very dangerous spot. And republican women, you need to step up and say something. Particularly if youre in elected office here when roy moore comes in. You have to show up. Thank you for saying that. If he gets elected, i hope he will not, and i think theres still a chance he will not. If he shows up in washington, does he go straight to an Ethics Committee . How does Republican Leadership respond to this . Mitch mcconnell has said the right things. He said it is up to alabama but he said there will be an ethics investigation and i think there has to be. I dont expect this necessarily to work out for democrats. Thats not why it had to happen. Even on our network, even people that i love went from saying, why are the democrats taking so long the get rid of al franken . Oh, you tossed al franken overboard. Last night we had the shale of laura ingram and night gingrich saying the democrats were he in a witch hunt and a lynch mob. So these people will find a way to twist this every which way. This cant be done for political damage. Ill still pained to say it was the right thing to do but i think it was. Now people in alabama have a moment of reckoning and i hope some women watch al franken and say this is painful for this man. I dont agree with his politics. This is what a man does when he is in the way of his party and when hes caused pain to women. And they do the right thing when they get into the voting booth next week. I thank you both for an important discussion. After the break, we have a very different break. Has the new weapon that might be available to mueller if donald trump uses his weapon of the pardon. And later, a woman who turned down a man for a marriage license. Now hes running and said hell do her job a better way. He is my exclusive guest tonight. Spread a little love today spread a little love myy way spread a Little Something to remember philadelphia cream cheese. Made with fresh milk and real cream makes your recipes their holiday favourites. The holidays are made with philly. If you have moderate to severe plaque psoriasis,. Rites. Isnt it time to let the real you shine through . Maybe its time for Otezla Apremilast . Otezla is not an injection or a cream. Its a pill that treats plaque psoriasis differently. With otezla, 75 clearer skin is achievable after just 4 months,. With reduced redness,. Thickness, and scaliness of plaques. And the otezla prescribing information has. No requirement for routine lab monitoring. Dont use if youre allergic to otezla. 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Now to our special report, republicans pressed chris write a in hearings today, some the person who used to hold his job, bob mueller, could be biased in the trump russia probe and arguing these attacks could give trump a plan b, that if he gets closer to the white house, there could be a plan to shut it all down by side lining bob mueller and pardoning trumps top aides. Im not in the pressess head. If he wants to pardon people, he can pardon people. Theres not a huge check on that. He can have a blanket pardon for everybody involved and say i pardon them all. Case closed. Unless a pardon is on the table no, defense attorney would have that ultra aggressive dismissive attitude toward this indictment. If donald trump thinks he can easily pardon himself and pardon his aides, pardon his children, we are on our way, if that happens, to seeing a constitutional crisis. The premise there is that pardons would stop prosecutions. But even if a trump pardon was lawful, it only applies to federal prosecutions. Not state prosecutions. On august 29th, we reported exclusive on the beat that one attorney was considering a probe relating to russia. The very next day, politico filed one this headline. Mueller teams one new York Attorney general in manafort probe. So there was reporting that local prosecutors to help mueller pick up his case in the face of a trump pardon. Tonight we have a new development on this front that comes from muellers office. A potential tool buried in that all important agreement that bob mueller reached with mike flynn when flynn flipped and started talking. His plea part of a deal with special counsel already has flynn talking. We know that special counsel reached an agreement michael flynn. This is a plea agreement. This is the kind of Court Document that is filed when someone has agreed to plead guilty. Flynns discussions were and i quote, part of a coordinated effort to create Foreign Policy before they were in power. So all of that first news was about his crime. Lying to the feds and lying about a russian sanctions plot. News about what happened in the past. Tonight i can report to you but what could happen in the future. The agreement that flynn signed one week ago today not only confessed to a crime and dished on the trump transition team. It made a specific commitment to not only cooperate with mueller but to cooperate with someone else. Heres the pledge to cooperate fully and truthfully with this special counsel office. From flynn. But then it goes farther because bob mueller got flynn to agree to cooperate with state and local Law Enforcement authorities identified by the special counsel. Thats important because it means if flynn was pardoned for lying to the fbi, he still signed an agreement to cooperate with any local prosecutors who mueller chooses. Is that arrangement in all the jarlts plea deals . No. Well, not all cooperation agreements even publicly available, a review of 18 agreements the doj did publicly release shows most do not explicitly require quoopgs local prosecutors. Even mueller doesnt always use this requirement because his other plea deal with special counsel with that former Trump Campaign adviser george papadopoulos, there is to reference to local prosecutions. So what does this all mean . Lets be clear. Nobody knows if donald trump will pardon people in this probe. Nobody knows what bob mueller would do if there are pardons. But good prosecutors dont make predictions. They prepare methodically for every possible outcome. Bob mueller didnt just get mike flynn to flip. He got him to pledge potential quoopgs local prosecutors, who donald trump cant touch. At a time when Donald Trumps breaking norms, bob mueller has a prudent strategy, drawing on protections in our constitutional system. Think about it. The only reason there are prosecutors that trump cant touch, even with his big pardon power, is because our founders wrote a constitution where power checks power. Where there is prosecutorial power for the states and the feds. The resulting system neither wholly federal nor wholly national. Mike flynn made a deal with the feds. We can. That it turns out he also made a deal with anyone else bob mueller tells him to work with. Now that is power. Nick ackerman served as Watergate Special prosecutor and joins me now. What is the significance in your view and how rare is it to have a cooperating agreement with the feds also holds out cooperating with local prosecution . It is rare. Ive never seen it in all my years of practice. Youve never seen it. I looked in preparing for today. There may have been instances where the federal prosecutors are actively working state prosecutors. I think in this particular incident, it is extremely significant. If bob mueller is working the new York State Attorney general, if it hasnt happened already, he has flynn being interviewed by people in the state attorney generals office. The significance of that is so obvious because if suddenly trump starts pardoning people, it doesnt make any difference. Because, he fires mueller, even worse. He fires mueller. It means that the state attorney general already has a witness and can continue with that witness. And even if flynn were provided with a pardon, it wouldnt absolve him from having to cooperate with snydermans office. With the new york prosecutor. Right. So does this tell that you bob mueller is potentially thinking ahead . And what do you think about get outing of the deal . Flynn is somebody who has information on trump. Kushner, ivanka, and don junior. When you get that close and the president is that close, the odds increase that hes going to do something. Hell pardon or try to fire mueller. And this really acts as insurance. There are crimes in the code that are just gas if not better than whats in the tool box of the feds. And heres a former federal prosecutor who was speaking to our own Rachel Maddow about these issues and how mueller is doing things a little differently. Take a listen. Ordinarily, a plea agreement says you plead guilty to a, or a, b and c. You wont be prosecuted for everything we know about right now. It doesnt say that. This plea agreement does not list what potential prosecutions could happen at a local level or other federal prosecutions. I think whats going on, you can tell from hissalcution. It goes to the materiality on the conspiracy between russia and the Trump Campaign. It has nothing to do with any other acts or anything that occurred after the campaign. So the big question is, what is it about the lies after the campaign and after the election that relate back to the election. What is it about talking to kislyak about sanctions that occurred back to what occurred during the campaign . You are an eagle eye lt we are indebted to your expertise. Coming up, one of the men she illegally tried to stop from getting his own marriage running against her. Hes here next. avo when you have type 2 diabetes, you manage your a1c, but you also have a higher risk of heart attack or stroke. Noninsulin victoza® lowers a1c, and now reduces cardiovascular risk. Victoza® lowers my a1c and blood sugar better than the leading branded pill. avo and for people with type 2 diabetes treating cardiovascular disease, victoza® is now approved to lower the risk of major cardiovascular events such as heart attack, stroke, or death. And while it isnt for weight loss, victoza® may help you lose some weight. avo victoza® is not for people with type 1 diabetes or diabetic ketoacidosis. 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If you dont like the game, get in the game. That was the last major piece of advice barack obama offered as my next guest fits the bill. First time candidate running to replace a kentucky clerk who once denied him a lawful marriage license to his now husband. That clerk was kim davis, who you may remember this. She briefly became something of a political celebrity when she defied the Supreme Courts ruling that people can marry regardless of the gender of their partner. Would you please help me welcome to the stage kim davis. Eye of the tirger, you can barely hear it. Here is how he met davis. Im not being disrespectful to you. You absolutely have disrespected us. Youre telling us we dont deserve the same rights that you have. Im saying that if you would you do this to an interracial couple . A man and a woman, no. And this is what their last standoff looked like in 2015. You see the cameras there. Because the clerk handles not only wedding paperwork but also candidate filings, here they were together again yesterday when he filed paperwork to run for her job. David joins me now as my exclusive guest. What made you want to run for this job . Well, i think youve just seen part of the answer just right there in that last video. Even earlier, you showed a clip of Mike Huckabee there coming to a neighboring county to try to take advantage of our hardship and take advantage of the difficulties that our community has been through. Just to launch his political campaign. So that right there was probably the initial spark in my mind way back in 2015 that made me want to consider running. And so we often think of politics in a falsely binary way. We talk about the politicians and then citizens or voters and thats it. Of course politicians are citizens and they used to be private citizens, and so i just wonder, are you someone whos often thought about or wanted to be in Public Office or was this really an experience where you just went to do something that the Supreme Court ruled was your right and then facing this extra barrier, right, which is of course a product of someone standing in your way unlawfully. Did that make you more likely to want to do this . Well, you know what, the Lgbtq Community has been used by politicians for years and years and years, for them just to advance their own agenda. You know, we look at these politicians and their strategies and its always just to divide and conquer type strategy. So lets throw a social issue out there. Lets divide the people and all you have to do is get a percent or two of the vote and you win your office. That may help them and that may get them in office, but that divides communities. That pits neighbor against neighbor, friend against friend. And its really hurting our community is what its doing. And then i have to ask you, david, in a nutshell is the biggest problem with kim davis that she took this position where you obviously disagree or is the biggest problem that she failed to uphold the law, whether one agrees with it or not . It is a combination of things, you know. I think that if youre a Public Servant that you should absolutely be serving the public regardless of whether you agree with their personal life or not. So thats part of it. The other thing here is, you know, she has a job to do, you know. If her personal convictions are going to cost the taxpayers of kentucky close to a quarter of a million dollars, then i think we need to reevaluate why shes in office. Do we want a person like that in office. And i think from what happened back in 2015, theres all kinds of consequences. So this isnt just a one issue campaign. In fact, you know, the marriage license, thats already been resolved. Thats done. Of course. And briefly, the clerk race doesnt usually have a public debate, does it . No, there will be a forum later for all the candidates. As i like to say around here, i wanted to extend an invitation to her and to you to join me if you ever want to come on together and continue to talk about it because this is a fascinating next chapter to what happened there in your community. Well, i appreciate you having me, i certainly do. Thank you, david. I appreciate that. Up next, donald trump under pressure for something he used to criticize marco rubio for. Pass please. Im here to fix the elevator. Nothings wrong with the elevator. Right. But you want to fix it. Right. So who sent you . New guy. What new guy . Watson. My analysis of sensor and Maintenance Data indicates elevator 3 will malfunction in 2 days. There you go. You still need a pass. Anyone ever have occasional y constipation,diarrhea, gas or bloating . She does. She does. Help defend against those digestive issues. Take Phillips Colon Health probiotic caps daily with three types of good bacteria. 400 likes . Wow try Phillips Colon Health. More people shop online for the holidays than ever before. And the United States Postal Service delivers more of those purchases to homes than anyone else in the country. Because we know, even the smallest things are sometimes the biggest. Even the smallest things ive always had that issue with the seeds getting under my denture. Super poligrip free. It creates a seal of the dentures in my mouth. Just a few dabs is clinically proven to seal out more food particles. Try super poligrip free. You know, donald trump has taken a very clear position, and i want to give him credit for that. Real leaders dont get thirsty. He even mocked marco rubio for needing water. Its like this and we will, ah, ah, i need water, help me, i need water. Help. And this is on live television. This total choke artist. Now, the white house fending off questions of its own about an apparent case of president ial dry mouth. And finally i ask the leaders of the region political and religious, israeli and palestinian, jewish and christian and muslim to join us in the noble quest for lasting peace. I know that there were a lot of questions on that. Frankly pretty ridiculous questions. The president s throat was dry, nothing more than that. In other news, President Trump will undergo a physical at water reed medical center. The results will be public. Trumps tweets suggest sometimes he does not get a lot of sleep and unlike his predecessors, who have made a point of working out on camera, it appears this president s main sport is golf. His Campaign Aides also recently ate that he ate two big macs, two filet ofish and a chocolate shake for a typical dinner on the trail. The last update came from his doctor, harold bornstein, who said trump would be the healthiest individual ever elected to the presidency. I was under a little time pressure because the Trump Organization wanted to respond to mrs. Clintons announcement of her health. In a rush i think some of those words didnt come out exactly the way they were meant. That was his explanation of that hyperbole. That does it for the beat. Hardball with Chris Matthews is up next. Judgment day. Lets play hardball. Good evening, im Chris Matthews in washington. Minnesotas al franken announced today he is quitting the u. S. Senate in light of allegations from eight women that he either groped or forcibly kissed them of the yesterday after the newest allegation came to light, a total of 35 of his democratic colleagues had called on him to resign. Franken said some of the allegations were not true. He said he