Good evening once again from our nbc news headquarters here in new york. Day 813 of the Trump Administration and its a weird feeling on this friday night. We dont yet know how this story is going to change exactly in a few days. It certainly feels like this coming week will be a consequential one for this presidency. All we know is this. Next week will bring the edited or redacted version of the Mueller Report which right now remains entirely in the control of the attorney general william barr. Bloom blerg news reports Deputy Attorney general Rod Rosenstein gave something of a preview of the report today during a private lunch in washington. Three people who were present told Bloomberg Rosenstein said, quote, muellers report describes russian cyber crimes during the 2016 election. And that it will clear up questions about the Russian Campaign to interfere in the election. More on that later. Last night we learned from the journal that rosenstein fresh from overseeing the mueller case has been working alongside the a. G. On those redactions of sensitive material. There are concerns about bill barr, concerns that hes already tipped the scale somehow, that he sees the president and not the American People as his client. And he tried this week to address some of that. I was going to try to be as transparent as possible. The fact that information is classified does not necessarily it doesnt mean that congress cant see it, so im willing to work on some of these categories. The category i think is the most inflexible under the law right now is the grand jury material. But then a few minutes after that, thats when barrs comments about the early investigation into trumps 2016 campaign, thats when it reignited democrats fears about what they would see in the report, perhaps, and about the attorney general himself. If i think spying on a Political Campaign is a big deal. I think theres spying that did occur. Note the s word. Spying. Trump has given barr high praise for that assessment. Today lawmakers from both sides of the aisle made clear where they stood on those spying comments. I think when he used the obviously political charge expression of spying, he lost whatever credibility he may have had. That was, again, music to President Trumps ears. Heres my advice for my friends on the democratic side. Leave bill barr alone. Let him do his job. Trump has said he doesnt care about the Mueller Report. His tweets today notwithstanding, and we quote, no matter what we do or give to the radical left, it will never be enough, and they should stop wasting time and money and get back to real legislating, especially on the border. Further proof that words have consequences and barrs use of the word spying was indeed a loaded term. Politico reporter kyle chaney tells us the Trump Reelection Campaign is already fundraising based on that word. Despite that not being remotely true they have written this to their supporters and we quote, a. G. Barr believes the Obama Administration illegally spied on President Trump. We need answers. Fight back. Here for our leadoff discussion, shannon, josh, and not one but two former federal prosecutors. Our friends paul butler and joyce vance. Welcome to you all. Ill start with the journalists tonight. Shannon, the attorney general gave trump the characterization advantage. Trump turned it into taking, you know, trump license, no collusion, no obstruction, and as we saw there fundraising on the word spying. That, however, could change by tuesday night. Yeah. I mean, i think that the narrative of all this is going to shift dramatically. Whether or not President Trump has gotten enough of a head start onseting the narrative on his own because he has had this window of time with barrs letter out there, we are certainly going to be getting a more nuance and a fuller version of this investigation on that 4page letter. I even think theres hints in that 4page letter that tell us theres going to be more coming out of this 400page report than a more nuanced picture than we have right now. Barr mentioned things like most of the incidents of obstruction have been publicly reported. So suggesting theres some that will be included in the report that we dont know about obstruction. He mentions multiple attempts at the russians to reach out to the Trump Campaign even though we really only know kind of about one or two of those. So i mean, i think that theres still the possibility that this moment either monday or tuesday or wednesday or sometime next week could be one of those really sort of pivotal moments in american politics and ive been going back and reading about the star report and the News Coverage around that and i think there is the potential for that to set the narrative for these next two years and how it goes into trumps reelection campaign. Josh, this is your chance to clear your reporters notebook. Tell us everything you know about the suspected and expected timing of this. How will we come to read it . How will we come to digest it based on what you know . Well, i think that it probably is coming, if i had to guess, somewhere around tuesday of next week. I think its going to probably take officials about a day to put in process the various procedures that they want to have in place to make sure that their release goes in a smooth way. I think its officially going to be released to the public probably via special counsel Robert Muellers website which is still active. He is still in sort of a winddown phase. He has still not officially left his position and i think it will be simultaneously released and delivered to people up on the hill, although most of those representatives are going to be out on recess, so reporters will be scrambling to get reaction from lawmakers who are out in different parts of the country. So thats how i think its going to roll out. Of course, theres still a little bit of mystery about how much of a heads up the white house gets. Will the president or his lawyers get sort of any chance to look at this and prepare comments on it in any sort of meaningful amount of time before the public sees it . I think the answer probably will be no. But well see how that plays out in the middle of next week. On a rare visit to us in new york city, joyce vance is here in the studio. We had a former u. S. Attorney on the broadcast last night. Her guess was this could be up to 60 redaction. Thats interesting. Number two, you have a rule about the Justice Department the more we mention tuesday . I think this is how things tend to work. Just when you think everythings done and ready to be released, someone wants to go back and look it over one last time where theres a question. Typically things happen a little bit later than we expect. Maybe with Something Like the Mueller Report that wont be true. And this may call for a judgment on your part, but what the heck, lets ask anyway. What do you think rosenstein is up to . Hes still number two in doj. Hes still got at least 1 foot out the door. In the last 24 hours, weve read of his defense of barr. And then today what was supposed to be a private lunch, they never turnout to be as private as you think. Offering a tidbit or two about what might be in the report. Rosenstein surely knew that lunch was slightly less private than it was being billed at and may have even been deliberate in making those comments. No huge surprise, but we will learn more about the contours of the russian side of interference in the election from muellers report. We already knew that because it was the subject of one of his indictments. I think, though, that rosenstein is still an institutionalist. People can disagree about what hes done the right thing or not, but he is clearly down to the end trying to do what he believes is the right thing to protect the integrity of the Justice Department. Hey, paul butler, one of the words you lawyers love is declinations. Its a fancy word for the charges declined and not charged. Do you think well see any of that evidence involving, say, some of the big names that people expected to be indicted and charged long before now . How much well get to see is up to the attorney general of the United States, which is not confidence inspiring for people who would like to see transparency and accountability, because mr. Barrs acting more like a private lawyer for the president than he is like a representative of the United States. So yes, when a prosecutor declines a case, that is, he elects not to bring charges, he writes a long detailed memo explaining why. So we should be able to learn why people like don junior were not charged with perjury when apparently he told some of the same lies to the house and senate that other people who were charged with perjury were. Why wasnt jerome corsi charged . Mueller sent a draft indictment to him and then elected not to charge him. Finally, there was that bizarre meeting in the cigar bar between the ukrainian russian operative and Paul Manafort at the heat of the campaign and manafort gives private polling data. At one Court Proceeding mueller said that goes to the heart of the investigation. Whats up with no evidence of collusion according to the attorney general . That seemed pretty incriminating to me. You asked only good questions for which there are no answers yet. Shannon, we note that the president is not in maralago this weekend. Hell be bouncing around the white house all weekend. Is there a stated plan for white house rebuttal other than rudys constant mentions that they have a counter report ready and on the skids . Right. Well, they do have a counter report and thats something theyve been working on for months. Actually, since the summer. Jane raskin, one of the lawyers down in florida has been leading that. This is something that we saw in the white water investigation where clintons lawyers quickly came out with their own i think it was a 70 something page counter report immediately after the star report came out. I think we expect for that to come out. Of course, they dont know everything thats going to be in muellers report. But the big concern for them all along has been this obstruction charge. I think in their counter argument, there will be a lot of their own analysis about what the law is around obstruction and what the president s Constitutional Authority is. But i think on a broader scale, the president s strategy in responding to this is going to be focused on no collusion, no collusion, no collusion. There are details that are going to come out but he is going to simplify it and focus on the bottom line. No one is being charged with collusion which is a word he made up and not one mueller has used. Any other details i think they are going to say put those aside to try and make this confusing and keep things simple is a binary choice been collusion and no collusion. Say they found no collusion, stop paying attention, theres nothing here folks. Josh, i want you to share something even further. Using your thumb if it comes out on paper and your cursor if not. What section will you go to out of sheer urgency and interest if you have a choice and an index . I think im probably going to jump to see what the unknowns in this report are to borrow a rumsfeldian phrase. I mean, what things has mueller investigated or begun investigating and then spun off that we havent heard about . There are perhaps billions of words, bits and bites that have been spilled on News Coverage of this investigation, but i remain convinced there are probably whole branches of it that we dont know about at this point. We may not learn about all of that if its still active next week, but i think well learn about at least some of it, what the contours of this investigation were, which are still not entirely clear. And i think there could be some real nuggets in those matters that really havent been turned over by the press up to this point. Joyce, do you think we will learn why it is that mueller took a pass on obstruction . Do you think the supporting reasoning and documentation will be there . You know, i had thought we would see that in the full text of the report, but when barr testified on the hill this week, he testified that mueller had not told him he was leaving the question for congress. But also that mueller had not asked him to make a decision on obstruction. That left me wondering exactly how much well learn from the report itself. Paul, we have a lot of things still out there. Gates, flynn, stones trial, and u. S. Attorney investigations. Those will all continue to revolve like the mini hurricanes that they are . Thats right. We have people who it will be in their interest in avoiding jail to come clean to say everything they know. And so while the Mueller Investigation is over, i think its way too soon to exonerate the president and his men on obstruction or even on conspiracy, so we know from Rod Rosenstein today that the russians were active not just in trying to influence the election, but in trying to get donald trump in the oval office. There was considerable evidence that folks in the Trump Campaign knew about some of the wikileaks information in advance, so its hard to believe that all of that information is out there and theres no connections between the Trump Campaign and the russians, so maybe they dont amount to the level that a prosecutor would want to bring a case, but they definitely implicate National Security. Terrific front four to get us started on a friday night. Shannon, josh, paul butler, joyce vance, our thanks for being with us. Coming up, what the president reportedly offered one of his top officials if he was willing to break the law. And later one of trumps former advisers undertakes a new crusade against an establishment that dates back pretty much to the actual crusades. The 11th hour as we say just Getting Started on a friday night as abe lincoln looks on. , . [ paper rustling ] exactly, nothing. Theyre completely different people, thats why they need customized Car Insurance from liberty mutual. Theyll only pay for what they need [ gargling ] [ coins hitting the desk ] yes, and they could save a ton. Youve done it again, limu. Only pay for what you need. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Ensure max protein. To give you the protein you need with less of the sugar you dont. In two great flavors. With the most lobster dishes lobsterfesof the yearred lobster like our classic lobster lovers dream. So hurry in lobsterfest ends april twentyfirst. And now for a limited time, get ten percent off red lobster to go. Im missing out on our family outings because i cant find a bladder leakage product that fits. 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This was first reported by the Washington Post and reported by us as well last night. Administration officials quickly said it was just a suggestion that had been floated and knocked down, rejected. Thats when the president doubled down on it to threaten democrats if they cant reach a deal on border security. Well bring the illegals. I call them the illegals. They came across the border illegally. Well bring them to sanctuary cities. And well let that particular area take care of it, whether its a state or whatever it might be. California is certainly always saying we want more people and they want more people in their sanctuary cities. Well, well give them more people. We can give them a lot. We can give them an unlimited supply. Lets see if they have open arms. The alternative is to change the laws and we can do it very, very quickly, very easily. More later on the notion of using humans as punishment. Tonight the New York Times is reporting that during his visit to california a week ago tonight, trump urged kevin mcaleenan, the person he was about to tapas acting Homeland Security secretary to close the southwestern border. No matter that days earlier the president had pledged to delay that border closing decision for a year. According to the times, quote, it was not clear what mr. Trump meant by his request or his additional comment to that he would pardon him if he encountered any legal problems as a result of taking the action, closing the border. Federal judges have already blocked the administrations attempts to limit Asylum Seekers who illegally enter the country and it is not likely he would have ended up in jail if he had followed the president s directive. One of the people briefed on the conversation said it was unclear whether trump had intended the comments as a joke. Theres one more immigration headline today. Our own Courtney Kubey and julia report some of trumps advisers have discussed whether the military could be used to build and run migrant detention camps. Still with us here in our studio is joyce vance. Joining our conversation, the aforementioned julia we try to keep our eye on the ball around here. And we try to call stuff for what it is. Are both of these stories the using migrants as a political weapon, the offering a pardon as a get out of jail free card, are they both some radio chatter . I think that was a worthwhile conversation in newsrooms across washington today is should we keep giving air and lip service to these ideas that seem to be coming from the dark corners of a mine and someone inside the white house . Maybe the president , maybe steven miller, but theyre actually meant as scare tactics. The answer and why we came down to publishing stories like these is because this administration has been known to act on things that are not legally or logistically possible and then theyre immediately challenged by the courts, but they happened. It was the same conversation i had with my editors in february of 2017 and we heard that they were thinking about separating families at the border. Its something they went ahead with. Same thing with the idea of stopping all Asylum Seekers if they entered the country between legal ports of entry. They went ahead with that. It was enjoined by the court, but we did it. We have to put out this information thats being talked about. Ere was an emergency meet on tuesday night where they brought in officials from the Defense Department and talked about a plan to use troops not just to build tent cities, but also to run them which would be in direct violation of a law that keeps the military from enforcing domestic law. They are not supposed to interact with immigrants. Right now the plan to build the tent cities has gone further. That could end up in an agreement between dhs and dod very soon. The plan to rum them has not been operationalized yet. It hasnt been taken off the table. None of these things have. The president made it clear today that he at least from a messaging standpoint is not taking away things like bussing immigrants to sanctuary cities. At this point all of these things hang in the balance, especially at a time we know the president is getting rid of people who say no to him and hes filling these positions with acting secretaries and acting administrators who say yes more often. Joyce, last night when the idea of using migrants came out in the Washington Post, there was actual hyper ventilation. Maggie habermans guess was the president was watching tv and the idea sounds tough to him and being stopped by lawyers doesnt. Emily singer tweeted about the idea. Trump is so racist. He thinks its punishment to send brown immigrants into someones city. Its disgusting. On the law of it, joyce, is it legal to do . You know its an interesting question and we wouldnt know a precise answer until we saw exactly what the president did. Theres some question about whether i. C. E. Can transport people further once theyve caught them. Could they actually transport them for hours. Would that be some form of lawful detention . And then there will be questions about whether, for instance, sanctuary cities have First Amendment rights and whether the president is punishing them for their exercise of those rights. This is all very speculative. This is new. This is unplowed territory. You want to say that its dangerous for this administration, but nothing really seems to be dangerous. No matter how far trump goes stepping on these traditional norms and rights. He never seems to be accountable. We havent even touched on the law which many of us thought was a lyric to woolly bully. How about the legality of offering a pardon . Is that a problem . You know, were back i suppose to this issue that weve dealt with other times, but look, this story with acting secretary mcaleenan, this is something thats different. This is the president who has by the way just fired his secretary. A secretary who loyalty loyally carried out everything he asked her to in the area of separating kids from their parents and he fired her we are told because she would not violate the law. Hes got a new acting secretary and the first thing he says to him is i need you to violate the law for me and if you get in trouble ill give you a pardon. We should all be consider concerned about that. How will the idea that the president may have floated a pardon in conversation go over in the hallways at a place like dhs . Gosh. In a place like dhs, i think it would make people want to maybe ask more questions of someone who is a holdover from the Obama Administration but certainly seen as a fierce loyalist to this president. People ive talked to said he will go far in order to show the president he will come through on these promises. It does seem to be not taken seriously that they would seal the entire border mainly because of the impact of the economy and how hard that would be to do. There was a big deficit i think it was 5 million lost just for shutting down one small sector, a few highway lanes overnight in november when that honduran caravan came through california. And so that seems like something they would rule out. The idea of now dhs officials being pulled into the pardon game which doj knows all too well would frighten some of the people there. I think they do worry they are starting to have leaders that are part of these small circles at the white house and theyre not being as forth womaning with them about what operationally is around the corner. A note to our viewers. When we get the Mueller Report in the coming days, these two women are going to be a critical part of the team reading, digesting and explaining it all to us. So extra thanks to joyce vance, to Julia Ainsley for joining us on a friday night. We appreciate it. Coming up, an outspoken republican strategist has labeled william barr the most dangerous man in america. Well ask the author why he might have said a thing like that when we come back. Whos al, two motorcycles, a boat, and an r. V. I would not want to pay that insurance bill. [ ding ] oh, i have progressive, so i just bundled everything with my home insurance. Saved me a ton of money. Love you, gary you dont have to buzz in. Its not a question, gary. On march 1, 1810 [ ding ] frederic chopin. 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Well, let me the question is whether it was predicated, adequately predicated and im not suggesting it wasnt adequately predicated, but i need to explore that. More on that moment. The headline of our next guests latest oped is this. Bill barr is the most dangerous man in america. In this piece, rick wilson tosses aside his customary shackles of journalist i can restraint. William barrs tone was calm but agenda was clear. His job is to protect donald trump no matter the prerogatives of congress or any consideration of the rule of law. Bill barr is not the attorney general of the United States. He is the roy cohn whom the donald has craved. An attorney general who sees his duty as serving trump. And were happy to say that with us tonight the aforementioned rick wilson. The author of everything trump touches dies recently released with new material in paperback. There is new material around here every day. Rick, talk some more about bill barr and why he might see the president as his client and not the American People. Well, brian, thank you for having me. I will say the reason i wrote this piece was because like a lot of other people, i had given bill barr the benefit of the doubt. I had given bill barr based on his reputation in d. C. A moment to decide whether or not he was going to be an honest broker. When the 4page memo came out it was pretty clear and then when the testimony in congress this week in the house and senate, bill barr very clearly flagged for the American People he doesnt work for us. Hes not a traditional attorney general who has an independence from the political desires of the white house. Because as the chief Law Enforcement officer in which hes imposed enormous power and he said basically this week flatout im here for donald trump. Im here to take care of protecting the president s flank and protecting the president from legal jeopardy and it should have shocked the conscience of americans. Frankly, if the democrats understood power, they would have recognized this moment was a man who was incredibly contemptuous of the rights of congress to be informed of the things that are in the Mueller Report. Hes basically rubbing their nose right now saying youre not getting what youre entitled to. Were not giving you. Were protecting donald trump. You dont get to see the goods. I think its taking a very disturbing turn and i think bill barr is in a position of enormous power and the president like he does with everyone will exploit that power to the maximum advantage. Something i dont think we do often enough is to ask if a judgment like that on barr isnt a painful exercise for you in this way . This is a guy who was steeped in the modern history of your party. He was in the bush wing of the gop. He was mr. Republican lawyer. This is his second go around as attorney general of the United States and now this is the assessment that you reluctantly have come to. It really is, brian. I went back because i was a very junior guy in the bush 41 administration. I was a kid. I went back and asked people i knew. Do you know bill barr. Everyone when he was named said oh, hes a solid guy, institutional guy. Hes not flashy. Hes going to be hes nuts and bolts, right up the middle. Well, like every other person that gets in Donald Trumps orbit, the moral corruption of donald trump is his super power. And bill barr is displaying right now i mean, by using the language of spying and witch hunts and things like that, bill barr needed to say when he was asked about spying, say no, it was legally constituted surveillance. He sent the message to the fbi putting donald trump ahead of the people i supervise in the doj because im going to tell them that trumps language of their behavior is how were going to describe it. I think this is a guy who is going to meet the everything trump touches dies test head on in the coming weeks. One aside here at 11 33 p. M. On a friday night, the president of the United States, its almost as if you can watch his viewing habits, has tweeted another fake story on nbc news that i offered pardons to Homeland Security personnel in case they broke the law regarding illegal immigration and sanctuary cities. Of course this is not true. Mainstream media, we did qualify for capital letter, Mainstream Media is corrupt and getting worse if that is possible every day. Heres Maggie Haberman of the New York Times, cnn and the New York Times both reported this as well. We reached out for a comment from the white house shortly after 11 00 a. M. Asked for a comment three times. In case the white house approach its not to comment and then have trump say fake news with an assist there by Maggie Haberman. I know youve had fun this week with your half a million twitter followers. Lets lop off 10 for russian bots. On the topic of Julian Assange, other than being a paragon, how do you think they should remember Julian Assange thus far . Bad interior decorator and bad cat parent. Julian assange in 2016, whatever Julian Assange started out as, if he started out as a transparency advocate or what have you, Julian Assange by 2016 was a willing coconspirator with the russians to provide information for a russian Information Warfare program seeking to disrupt the u. S. Elections. This isnt debatable. There is an abundant tract record of why he did what he did. He was working to provide this information for the Trump Campaign, working to to put it out there to damage Hillary Clintons chances of elections. He did it. They were successful. They made a huge difference in the russian effort to disrupt our elections. And Julian Assange even since then has been in touch with sean hannity as part of the trump cheerleading and propaganda efforts. This is a guy who was an actor in the Information Warfare program with the russians. I have zero pity for Julian Assange. The narrowly crafted charges against him have been very carefully built so as not to impinge on journalist prerogatives or in publishers prerogatives, but this is a guy who didnt play that role. Hes an Information Warfare asset for the russians. So i hope we see him soon in our courts. I would like that. He was also a guy who played a role in facilitating one of the largest leaks of information during the iraq and afghanistan wars in the early years of that that cost American Security and cost american lives im certain in the course of that. And so this is not a guy who is a journalist. Not a guy who is a publisher. It is a guy who is a propagandist and a russian asset. With us from the great state of florida, great cat and dog parent, rick wilson. Thank you as always for coming on the broadcast on a friday night. He may not officially be in the race just yet, but well play you this candidates message for the nations second in command. Ave made the rx the leading luxury suv of all time. Lease the 2019 rx 350 for 409 a month for 36 months. Experience amazing at your lexus dealer. You should be mad at airports. Excuse me, where is gate 87 . You should be mad at nonseasoned travelers. And they took my toothpaste away. And you should be mad at people who take unnecessary risks. How dare you, hes my emotional support snake. But youre not mad, because you have e trade, whose tech helps you understand the risk and reward potential on an options trade its a paste. Its not liquid or a gel. And even explore whatif scenarios. Wheres gate 87 . Dont get mad. Get e trade and start trading today. 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New jersey democratic senator cory booker and Eric Swalwell are also holding Campaign Kickoff events in their hometowns this weekend. Its busy out there on the campaign trail. With us tonight to talk about it, Laura Barone Lopez. And reported for the associated press. A pleasure to have you both. I want to talk about buttigieg specifically. He sure is getting we all watched him on ellen. Hes getting his first round of attention. How is the scrutiny on him about to get tighter still . I mean, thats the problem with being a front runner, brian. You not only get the money and attention and the headlines, you also get the scrutiny. I think thats why people are asking questions particularly about his relationship with Vice President mike pence. The former indiana governor. In recent weeks buttigieg has been more of a critic about him particularly on religious grounds. We heard him saying in that clip with ellen. But when he was when pence was the governor of indiana and buttigieg was mayor of the fourth largest city in the state, he even gave mike pence a short that said i heart south bend. They needed to Work Together and he didnt have the strong lines of attack. We saw those comments surface when he made a state of the city when he said all lives matter. He talked about reconciliation. As he grows in popularity and as we expect him to jump into this race pretty quickly now with that special announcement on sunday, i think well see more headlines like this. We also know the kind of scrutiny to get on the National Stage and run for president looks quite different than what he might have seen when running for the mayor of south bend, indiana. Ive got a paragraph for you. Its fra the l. A. Times. The subtitle is the film waiting for guffman. The obvious challenge for buttigieg is what he calls flavor of the month phase. He needs to rapidly grow his campaign to compete against better established candidates. With larger and more sophisticated operations. Like a Community Theater troop that suddenly finds itself on the big stage, buttigieg has struggled to keep up with his new fame. I dont think its cute to say that the greats, the obamas of the world dont peak early. They keep up a level of energy and excitement and organization. Its a longer haul than ever. But the greats get there. Right. Thats true. And i think that we dont we arent quite sure yet if buttigieg is peaking early or if he can keep this momentum going. It is notable that he came in third in multiple polls. Especially since he didnt have the same kind of National Platform that a lot of these other senators who are running have. So i think thats why its surprising to people that hes coming out early in iowa and in new hampshire. But yes, that being said, we have nine months to go before the first primary contest. Its going to be a long slog. He has to find a way to make that fundraising money. He has to find a way to build up his campaign. Maybe well see him start to do that after this announcement which i think we can expect will be him jumping into the race. And laura, let me ask you about the other dems. Again, its almost like we should list the democrats who arent running. It is so crowded. Were getting close to 20 of them in the race. How are they all striving to find a lane they can run in . Right. Theres so many of them. Ive reported in particular on a number of house members. Theres about four House Democrats alone not counting beto orourke. A former House Democrat that have or about to jump into the race. A lot of them are deciding to pick a very specific policy lane. Similar to governor ainsley of washington who is saying he is th have tim ryan of ohio focusing on dignified jobs which sounds state senator. O the National Security candidate. Eric swalwell who also as we mentioned earlier is going to be on the trail and he is focusing on gun control. Castro who had a town hall wants to zone in on immigration. Hes one of the first candidates who came out with a very detailed immigration plan calling for a martial plan if you will for central america. And ive got to say its been interesting to see the knives out for Bernie Sanders depending on where you look around the web. As the critics look at it, here is the guy who is a million air. Millionaire. Hes not a democrat officially and would turn 80 in his first theoretical term in the white house. Oh, by the way, hes raising a ton of money out there. Hes raising a ton of money and unlike any other candidate in the race so far, hes the only person who has not only run for president before, but he had a National Footprint that kept alive momentum and i think thats why youve seen him reach important milestones. Hes started a bus tour across key states which he said he want capture that Hillary Clinton couldnt and he can take from donald trump. His Campaign Just launched and said theyve had their one millionth donation. Hes only been in the race for several months now. They have more than a hundred staffers looking to staff up in key states, like california very soon. While all of those criticisms, theres certainly some truth to them. Its also unquestionable that Bernie Sanders is one of the frontrunners in this race by standards that go far from just financial and he has the ground game and the money to be competitive in this race for quite some time. Our two guests tonight have great but exhausting jobs and to our viewers, these are two reporter bylines to look for and follow. Our thanks tonight to Laura Barone Lopez and juana summers. Appreciate you guys coming on with us on a friday night. Well take a break here. More 11th hour when we come back. We got no free pass. 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Progressive cant protect you from becoming your parents. But we can protect your home and auto. Before discovering nexium 24hr to treat her frequent heartburn, marie could only imagine enjoying freshly squeezed orange juice. Now no fruit is forbidden. Nexium 24hr stops acid before it starts for allday, allnight protection. Can you imagine 24 hours without heartburn . That man brings us to the last thing before we go tonight. Its about a Political Movement as led by and exemplified by steve bannon, he of trump fame, long ago aimed his sights of destabilizing european governments and alliances. So why not the vatican. Reporter pope francis is a new kind of leader, a humble priest who reaches out to immigrants, gays and muslims. And now the same person who helped elected President Trump is going after the pope. The administrative apparatus of the church has to be changed. Reporter thats President Trumps former Campaign Chairman steve bannon, now on a new crusade. Are you feeling confident after you hept bring significalped br change to the United States, you can impact change here . Absolutely, no doubt. Reporter bannons goal is to save the Catholic Church from the pope, who he says is failing to deal with decades of sexual abuse by priests. My problem with the pope today is about this crisis on pedophilia, that they are not treating that has a crisis. Reporter but critics say bannon, a catholic, is using the sex abuse scandal to attack a pope he and a movement around him consider too liberal. Reporter if youre against migrants and refugees who doesnt have any rights in the world, thats going to upset. Reporter bannon plans to build an apartment for himself here and live here part in the year in the monastery of bannonism. Each says this will be a school to teach Judeo Christian values to a new generation of nationalist populists and he said the pope is the most powerful opponents to his plan. Hes constantly and putting all the faults in the world on this nationalist populist movements. Reporter maybe hes right. There are going to think, oh, no, the guy who helped put trump in the white house now has his sights set on the pope. Why would they think . Because its true. Youre trying to bring change to this institution. This institution is in decline. Reporter so this is just the beginning. This is just the beginning. Its going to take years. Reporter people say why give bannon any airtime . He th this is happening. Hes gathering together people who have different grievances against the pope. Theyre connected online and as we saw in the United States with the election of President Trump, that is a powerful recipe. Richard engel in our London Bureau tonight. This is some of the reporting from a special we are airing on sunday evening at 9 p. M. Eastern on this network, Richard Engel on assignment. Thats going to do it for our friday night broadcast and this week. Thank you for being here with us. Have a good weekend. Good night from our msnbc news headquarters from new york. Rod rosenstein previewing parts of the Mueller Report. We have that story later tonight and a breakdown of Donald Trumps education chief betsy devos under fire for using kids at props while still trying to slash 200 million worth of programs for literacy. We begin with trumps power grab and a sign he knows some of his own orders are illegal. First there are new reports trump wanted to ploliticize border policies. Officials in trumps own administration saying this