Reporting from the wall street journal on the possibility of an interview between President Trump and special counsel Robert Mueller. The journal reports trumps attorneys hope to decide whether he should testify by may 17, the oneyear anniversary of the appointment of special counsel Robert Mueller, trump attorney Rudy Giuliani said monday. Mr. Trumps legal team has long been divided on whether he should dwee. Gary mr. Giuliani said, every day we swing a little different on whether the advise mr. Trump to talk to mr. Mueller through the though the suggested he suggested, rather, that recent developments in the probe have made him more leery. The journal goes on to report, in an informal practice session, mr. Trumps lawyers were only able to walk him through two questions given the frequent interruptions on National Security matters along with mr. Trumps loquaciousness. Also tonight, nbc news reports Rudy Giuliani has confirmed on the record that special counsel mueller has rejected an offer for the president to answer written questions in lieu of a sitdown interview. Giuliani says this happened about ten days ago during his first ever meeting with mueller. He also says the plan is to submit a counteroffer to mueller the week after next. The details of which he did not share. Yesterday on abc news, Rudy Giuliani addressed the issue of a possible interview. If he tells and he tells the truth as you would advise him to do, what is the danger in answering Robert Muellers question questions . You couldnt put a lawyer on the show that would advise him to answer the questions. Its only a trap if the president doesnt tell the truth. Its only prosecutable if they have some builtup, manipulated evidence to prove the president didnt tell the truth. But you believe the president is telling the truth. If you believe that, you have that conviction, youre his attorney, why dont you go say, go in, talk to Robert Mueller. Because i wouldnt be an attorney if i did that, george. I would be living in some kind of unreal fantasy world where everybody tells the truth. The president has kept up his attacks on twitter this morning, sending out this message and again with no regard for established norms of capitalization. Quote, the russia witch hunt is rapidly losing credibility. House Intelligence Committee found no collusion, coordination, or anything else with russia, so now the probe says okay what else is there. How about obstruction for a madeup phony crime. There is no oh, its called fighting back. And as the president tries to discredit the russia investigation, there are new indications of ominous stress fractures, lets call it, in his relationship with, among his newest lawyers, Rudy Giuliani, according to a new politico article out just tonight, the former new york city mayors dayslong media blitz has irritated the president who says Rudy Giuliani has failed to shut down the Stormy Daniels hush money saga and he has expressed frustration that giulianis media appearances are raising more questions than they are answering, turning the story into a dayslong drama capped by the admission sunday that the president may have made similar payments to eother women. That question came up during the giuliani interview yesterday. So did Michael Cohen make payments to other women for the president. I have no knowledge of that but i would think if it was necessary, yes. He made payments for the president or conducted business for the president which means he had legal fees, monies laid out, and expenditures, which i have on my bills to my clients. The topic then came up again today at the white house briefing. Rudy giuliani said that if necessary, its possible that Michael Cohen could have paid off other women to keep them quiet about alleged affairs with the president. Is that possible . Are there other women out there who received money from the president to stay quiet . Im not aware of any other activity but i would refer you to Rudy Giuliani to respond to any of those questions or anybody else on the president s outside counsel. But youve been in his circle for a long time now. You were on the campaign. Is that anything that came across your desk . Again, im not aware of anything like that, but i would refer you to the president s outside counsel. And there is this new reporting tonight from jonathan le mere of the Associated Press. He writes that the president , quote, is growing increasingly irritated with lawyer Rudy Giulianis frequently off message media blitz in which he has muddied the waters on hush money paid to porn actress Stormy Daniels and made claims that could complicate the president s standing in the special counsels russia probe. Trump has begun questioning whether giuliani, the former new york city mayor, should be sidelined from television interviews. According to two people familiar with the president s thinking, but not authorized to speak publicly about private discussions. Giuliani is weighing in on reporting about trumps reaction to his interview, telling nbc news, follow us here, that, quote, hes not frustrated at all and one source familiar with the president s thinking is telling nbc news tonight, quote, the president still has confidence in rudy, but rudy will need more discipline to keep the president s confidence. Isnt this interesting . Lets bring in our leadoff panel for another busy monday night. Ashley parker, Pulitzer Prize winning White House Reporter for the washington post, peter baker, chief White House Correspondent for the New York Times, the aforementioned jonathan, White House Reporter for the Associated Press and because we need a and a damn good one, Barbara Mcquaid is back with us. All are msnbc analysts. Jonathan, since we dropped your name we know rudys feelings about trump. What are trumps feelings about rudy, do we think. At this moment, he does appreciate at 11 07 eastern time. Ask me again at 11 09. At this moment, he does appreciate that the president that the former mayor is sort of an attack dog in the media, that he is out there, hes grabbing headlines, hes defending him. That he is. Hes defending him and hes taking a much more aggressive tact than some of his other lawyers have done. That said, as our reporting indicates, hes also growing frustrated. Pretty muddled answers suggesting the president couldnt be trusted to tell the truth. Suggesting that there may be more women that Michael Cohen has paid off to keep quiet, a la Stormy Daniels. These are things that have not set well with the president who certainly at this moment is not suggesting hes going to dismiss Rudy Giuliani, but hes grown frustrated with these stories. He doesnt feel like hes silenced the stories about Stormy Daniels. Hes poured more fuel on that fire. He thinks he needs to be more disciplined or come off the air for a while. Hes also frustrated in an exchange from a previous interview with sean hannity, whe sean hannity is a longtime confidant, surprised that he was suggesting he said, oh, they were funneled through the law firm . Giuliani repeated back and said, funneled, yes, and the president , according to our reporting, got mad at both men saying funneled suggests a criminal enterprise. Thats not a normal word. Peter, i have two questions for you. Number one, the rudy factor. Since the hannity interview, it strikes us tonight hes been all or part of our lead story every night since so theres that and a serious question, we dont get to see you in new york that often, by percentage, you cover this white house for the New York Times. How much of the Trump Presidency do you end up covering every day and how much of this, the moving parts, the machinations. Thats a great question. There was talk just last summer about trying to separate these things, to have somebody who just dealt with these things so that the white house could get on with the business of governing the country. Weve got a big decision on iran coming tomorrow, an upcoming summit with north korea, weve got the embassy moving in jerusalem, this just the next few days alone, tariffs, uk visit, all kinds of things and instead, the president of the United States and his team are focused on hush payments to a porn star. Not the way this is supposed to work. So Rudy Giuliani rather than taking it off front pages has put it back on the front page every day with each succeeding statement no matter how much more off message, to use your phrase, it could be. Ashley, youve written about this, talked about it to some degree. What does this say about what could be an innate need for drama on the part of the president . I think it says that its inescapable. We often write about the president sort of preferred method of governing and managing, which is to do so in chaos, and i think what youre seeing with the legal team right now is a microcosm of that. There was a lot of talk when Rudy Giuliani came on, people were a little skeptical but they were excited to have a big name, excited to have a television attack dog, and there was also excitement when the president brought emmet flood on. That is a well respected lawyer who is the sort of person you want in the trenches with you when youre facing this sort of investigation. But the way the president has managed sort of not quite pitting one against the other, but plotting a strategy with Rudy Giuliani that emmet flood and the rest of his team didnt know about. I talked to an outside adviser today who basically described the other lawyers as simply baffled by whats going on. This is the president s management style. This is what he seems to prefer. Hes stated that publicly and articulate it and it seems to be an almost instinctual urge but you are seeing the downsides of that right now with his legal team. Barbara, on that point, i want to show a tweet from someone we all know and a colleague of peters, maggie haberman. One person close to the white house sums up trumps legal strategy right now as two teams. Theres the trump rudy team and then theres the lawyers. Elegant turn of phrase there, but do you imagine right about now emmet flood is really happy he moved all his stuff across town from his partnership in williams and connolly to a small office in the west wing . I imagine hes quite frustrated to see Rudy Giuliani out on television after he himself says hes only about halfway through learning the facts of the case. I mean, no lawyer should be out doing that and there could be some very significant consequences of Rudy Giuliani as trumps attorney making these statements on his behalf. Those are statements that are binding on the party, on whose behalf youre making them. So, you know, hes not just some friend of President Trump or pundit who is opining about issues. Hes his lawful attorney, representing him, and making these statements. So some very serious consequences there. So i imagine that emmet flood and others are very frustrated. I think this is a consequence of President Trump being his own communications director. And not having a comprehensive strategy where everyones on the same page, and my guess is that emmet flood would ask Rudy Giuliani to either stop talking or at least learn the facts before you do talk. And youre so right to make that point. He is playing with house money during all these media appearances or more appropriately, white house. And barbara, one more thing. I want to run Rudy Giuliani on the subject of the president potentially taking the fifth and then get your opinion coming out of this. Are you confident the president will not take the fifth in this case . Oh, how could i ever be confident of that . When im facing a situation with the president and all the other lawyers are, in which every lawyer in america thinks hed be a fool to testify, ive got a client who wants to testify, please, dont he said it yesterday. And you know, jay and i said to ourselves, my goodness, you know, i hope we get a chance to tell him the risk that hes taking. What happens if Robert Mueller subpoenas the president . Will you comply . Well, we dont have to. Hes the president of the United States. We can assert the same privilege as other president s have. Barbara, what the you make of that . Well, you know, essentially what hes saying is that President Trump would be a fool to testify in front of Robert Mueller. You know, his choices are to tell the truth, number one, and it seems he seems to be suggesting that hes not capable of doing that because that would incriminate him of a crime and so he would consider asserting the fifth amendment, which means, you know, thats a right that all citizens have, to protect themselves from incriminating themselves, but it means that if you were to tell the truth, it means he would have to confess to crimes and that would be the reason that you would invoke the fifth amendment. So, it sort of sounds like hes saying he either has to confess to crimes or lie and that would be an untenable situation. It seems that telling the truth is not an option that would save him from incriminating himself. And thats why we thought we needed a lawyer present for tonights conversation. So, jonathan, youve already talked about this president , his consumption of cable news, which is apparently undiminish. That will be a repeating circle, though. If hes calling sean hannity to trouble him about something he said on the air, theres the ongoing all the issues, peter baker just mentioned, there is the ongoing matter of the presidency at hand. There is, but this president its a cycle. He says something, cable covers it, he responds, whether by twitter or making policy to how cable covered his statement and so on and this is a very reactionary president , and he does seem consumed by these daily dramas that sort of moves the needle. He always has to be the center of attention as opposed to the very weighty decisions, matters of policy, international affairs, that he now has to get to. I mean, it cant be overstated how important the decision tomorrow afternoon, what the u. S. Will do with the iran deal. That is a significant thing but that is not what this president often thinks about, that he is more consumed and every night or most nights, goes back to the white house residents, calls his circle of informal advisers often to get their opinions, not necessary lae abo necessarily about the policy but how things are playing in the media and that informs what he then wakes up the next morning and starts tweeting about. So peter, on something as important and potentially as important to the republic as a mueller interview, you really wont know until you know, because weve heard the bosss attorney and its going to come down to whether the boss is feeling it or not. Yeah, no, its absolutely one persons decision, not the lawyers, and the other thing thats interesting about this is, its not just this question of the fifth amendment. What you heard Rudy Giuliani there assert is that because the president is the president , he doesnt have to fly compcomply subpoena. Thats an untested theory. In the clinton case in 1998 when we were talking about whether he lied under oath and obstruction of justice in the paula jones lawsuit about monica lewinsky, ken starr did issue a subpoena for the president s testimony. Clintons team did not challenge that in court. What they did was negotiate. They said, if you lift that subpoena, we will give you voluntary testimony if these conditions are met. No court has tested this but what the clinton team concluded was the nixon case, the 80 case of the tapes back in watergate, in effect, provides a precedent that means that if a court can compel a president to provide tapes, it can compel a president to provide testimony and that theres no reason for them no ability for them to resist such a subpoena. And does he want to be the first president to test out this new area of law . Hey, ashley, just one more question on rudy. Whats been your reporting regarding how big or small his constituency is in that building other than the residence portion of that building. To be clear, the only portion that really matters is the residence portion. Thank you for the reminder. So, stipulated. But among the president s aides and some people that could have advisers and friends he calls late at night, the constituency is not particularly high. There was skepticism when he went in, but they were willing to give him the benefit of the doubt and say he might be a good attack dog on tv. He can perform that role and that certainly scratches an important itch for the president and maybe if hes going it, the president wont be doing it himself. But theres a growing sense that he is just complicating things. Not just on the legal front, although certainly there, but weve also seen him weigh in on sort of policy and governing issues, like regime change in iran or whats going on with the detainees in north korea which are areas that he is absolutely not qualified to speak on as the president s lawyer and that white house aides and the White House Press secretary, Sarah Huckabee sanders, have to clean up and account for and its just a huge, tremendous hassle for them and theyre not happy. And barbara, one more legal question that draws from the news of tonight. Eric schneiderman, the attorney general of the state of new york, has resigned. He came three hours after the new yorker dropped a story citing four women, some terrible cases of alleged abuse. The reason i ask you is, schneiderman was said to be kind of loading up ancillary and companion cases so there would be an outlet. Lets say in the event of pardons, that new york could proceed on its own against some of the principles, schneiderman having already prosecuted trump university. Do you think this will have a Practical Impact on any case Going Forward . No, i areally dont. I think this will rock that office for some time, especially since Eric Schneiderman was such a strong advocate in favor of womens rights, having sued Harvey Weinstein on behalf of some of his victims and so i think it will send some shock waves through the office in the shortterm and may have to address some things with the culture of that office, but you know, these cases are brought by the career professionals who work in these offices, the Attorney Generals Office of the state of new york is much bigger than any one person. He will be replaced at some point. There will probably be an acting attorney general for some time and the worker bees will continue pressing forward with their work. Were so thankful to be able to talk to all four of you. Ashley, peter, jonathan, barbara, our thanks, and coming up for us, President Trump weighs in on a race in West Virginia as an excon is in the running for the republican nomination. And later, while youd be forgiven for fearing that all of our better angels have long since flown away, john meacham is here with us tonight with a reminder that theyre, indeed, still around. The 11th hour just Getting Started on a monday evening. Whoooo. When it comes to travel, i sweat the details. Late checkout. Downalternative pillows. And of course, price. Tripadvisor helps you book a. Hotel without breaking a sweat. Because we now instantly. Search over 200 booking sites. To find you the lowest price. On the hotel you want. Dont sweat your booking. Tripadvisor. The latest reviews. The lowest prices. Reminder that theyre, indeed, n y thing on my mind. And with godaddy, im making my ideas real. With godaddy you can get a website to sell online. 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Remember alabama. Vote rep jenkins or a. G. Morrissey. If blankenship wins, many republicans worry that senator joe manchin will keep his seat come fall, while manchin sometimes votes on the other side, hes still got a d after his name and the Weekly Standard reports in internal Campaign Polling is showing blankenship narrowly leading the republican pack. This as the New York Times reports trump got involved after a request from the Senate Majority leader. Mr. Trumps decision to speak out on the race came after senator Mitch Mcconnell of kentucky whom mr. Blankenship has targeted in a deeply personal manner urged the president in a telephone call on sunday to weigh in against the controversial former coal executive. Well, earlier today, blankenship responded to the president s tweet at a town hall meeting. We all really like President Trumps policies, but we know that he doesnt get things right. I mean, he recommended that people vote for a guy that was a basically accused of pedophilia in alabama. Its really sad that the pressure on the president and the misinformation and the untruths that hes been given would cause him to suggest that you vote for two guys that have failed you. Because i will not fail you. In a statement, blankenship said, tomorrow, West Virginia will send the swamp a message, no one and i mean no one will tell us how to vote. As some have said, im trumpier than trump and this morning proves it. Lets talk about it with none other than james carville, who worked for multiple political campaigns, including both bill and hillary clinton. James, theres got to be some fantastic southern louisiana expression for when you dont get the candidate you want but you get the candidate you might deserve. Well, i mean, it kind of reminds me some headline is going to be excon opposed by future con. Kind of really pretty funny. You know, as Donald Rumsfeld said, you go to war with the armor you got and the Republican Party has got to go to war with the candidate they get. But i do think they were traumatized by the experience in alabama. That was a pretty traumatic experience for the Republican Party, and i probably his late intervention will probably stop blankenship from getting the nomination, but you know, they have to count the votes, its a unique they only registered republicans can vote in the republican primary in West Virginia, which prohibits a lot of registered democrats who would be sympathetic to trump from jumping over in that primary so we got to wait and see. James, theres a theory afoot that the democrats can indeed still find 15 ways from sunday to screw up the blue wave during the midterm elections. That pelosi has to stop talking about being speaker and theyve got to stop talking about impeachment. Where do you put their chances to actually put forward a colossal challenge . Well, first of all, i mean, look, i dont know if its going to be a blue year, whether its powder blue or navy blue is to be determined. The democrats are the winning elections in these special electio elections are not talk about impeachment. Theyre talking about health care and infrastructure and things like that. And im in touch with a lot of these democratic campaigns that are coming up in 2018 and thats not the conversation that theyre having. You go out in the lamb campaign, doug jones, ralph north am, the campaign in arizona, theres very little talk about that. Impeachment is a talk coming out of democrats in washington and some democratic donors but Democratic Candidates who are successful, this is not high on the agenda. Health care is really high. James, how does this trump situation end in your view . When people ask you that, how do you answer . How does this end . Well, i think one day hes just going to leave. You dont see it its really unique. I went through a similar thing and i had a role, i guess, that people would call me attack dog during the clinton thing but i was not one of the lawyers. Its really unprecedented when you see one of the president s lawyers, which is entirely different status than a president s political supporter, going on television. After one of his experiences, avenatti, the lawyer for Stormy Daniels, whos done really well, said he thought it was a hoax that giuliani really wasnt saying what he was saying, and its very, very unprecedented and its very weird. And i know emmet flood slightly but i know people that tell me that hes a terrific lawyer and that guy must be beating his head against the wall right now as to whats going on. Its a very strange situation that a president s lawyer would be going out and saying the things that Rudy Giuliani is saying. Its odd. Very odd. So, perhaps trump finishes his term, but rudy doesnt finish his . I dont think i dont think rudy doesnt have very long to go in that position based on the reporting that the a. P. And they have some good reporters. I dont think theyd get Something Like this wrong. Hes probably on a short leash. I dont know whats going to happen with the president because they keep running through these guys and then theres mooch and somebody else and now they end up with giuliani. Who knows who the next one is going to be, but you know, it will be entertaining for a lot of us, and it will be quite a ride between now and the time this thing end. Final ten seconds, prediction on lsu football this coming season. We lose three games and beat alabama. All right. Well take that. Well have you back on. Ill take that. Next time, well talk about how the saints did in the draft. James carville, always a pleasure. Thank you very much. Coming up here with us, a retired four star u. S. Army general on a high stakes announcement by the president tomorrow afternoon when we come right back. Here to tell you about the Colonial Penn program. If youre age 50 to 85, and looking to buy Life Insurance on a fixed budget, remember the three ps. What are the three ps . The three ps of Life Insurance on a fixed budget are price, price, and price. A price you can afford, a price that cant increase, and a price that fits your budget. Im 54. Alex, whats my price . You can get coverage for 9. 95 a month. Im 65 and take medications. Whats my price . Also 9. 95 a month. I just turned 80. Whats my price . 9. 95 a month for you too. If youre age 50 to 85, call now about the 1 most popular whole Life Insurance plan, available through the Colonial Penn program. It has an affordable rate starting at 9. 95 a month. No medical exam, no health questions. Your acceptance is guaranteed. And this plan has a guaranteed lifetime rate lock, so your rate can never go up for any reason. So call now for free information. And youll also get this free beneficiary planner. And its yours just for calling. So call now. We need to help more tocalifornians get ahead. D, thats why Antonio Villaraigosa brought both parties together to balance the state budget with record investments in public schools. And new Career Training programs. As mayor of la, he brought police and residents together to get illegal guns off the streets and keep kids out of gangs, and on the right path. Thats Antonio Villaraigosa. A governor for all of california. The iran deal made by the Previous Administration is one of the worst deals i have ever witnessed, and ive witnessed some beauties. You look at this new deal with iran. Its disgusting. Im not going to be a john kerry who makes that horrible iran deal. Horrible. One of the worst deals i mean, how do you make a deal like that . This was a deal at the highest level of incompetence. I mean, people know my views on the iran deal. It was a terrible deal. It should have never, ever been made. We could have made a good deal or a reasonable deal. So lets put him down as a no. President trump appears to be ready to pull the plug on the iran nuclear deal. The deadline to recertify the u. S. Commitment to it is saturday. But trump said this today, quote, i will be announcing my decision on the iran deal tomorrow from the white house, 2 00 p. M. We only wanted one guy to be here with us to talk about this, and he is here, retired four star u. S. Army general barry mccaffrey. Former battlefield commander in the persian gulf, vast experience in the middle east, also former u. S. Drug czar for good measure. He is thankfully an msnbc military analyst. General, i dont pretend to know the details or contours of this deal and im guessing most people watching tonight dont either. Give us the what we should know about the iran deal in your view. Well, i think youd start with, you cant withdraw from the deal without encountering huge problems. You got to go with secretary jim mattis, who has a good grasp of all the issues. He says well never get the economic sanctions reimposed by the europeans. The russians and chinese will block any potential movement in the larger community. The iranians would probably not suffer economic consequences of any significance, and they would likely to be race to a breakout and have a nuclear device. Which might also, i might add, impel the saudis and the Sunni Muslim Community to get their bomb to counter the persian bomb. Having said that, i personally believe it wasnt a very good accord. The israelis opposed it, the saudis opposed it. When you look out 15 years, it really didnt achieve any finality to it. It didnt affect the iranians massive involvement in terrorism throughout the middle east. It didnt affect their Missile Development program, which is obviously a key part of a new credible Nuclear Strike capability, so we got sort of a shaky situation and i think hes going to pull us out and theres going to be real trouble in the coming year. I was going to say, its possible that bad deals keep the world safer and theres got to be a reason that the leaders of france and germany have come here and the British Foreign secretary has come out and said please, mr. President , keep this together. Sure. Well, i think the iranians, by the way, are pretty cagey people. In the short run, theyll probably try and break up the c consensus in the European Union among our nato allies so this may not get us very far. Im not sure if theyre as smart as i think they are, theyll actually immediately restart their nuclear program. Theyll probably wait and see if they can achieve through political means what they need to do. But theyve already gotten the money. I mean, count it as 400 billion infusion of cash. That cant be brought back. So, again, as mattis says, we got to stick with the deal. I want to read you the definition of strange bed fellows on the subject of gina haspel. Heres what the president said on twitter today. My highly respected nominee for cia director, gina haspel, has come under fire because she was too tough on terrorists. Think of that in these very dangerous times, we have the most qualified person, a woman who democrats want out because shes too tough on terror. Win gina. And the next one i want to read is john brennan, former cia director, who has filleted this president on other matters but listen to this. Senators, show that you put country above politics. Gina haspel is a competent, experienced, and highly qualified intelligence professional. Ask her tough questions, listen to her answers and then decide but dont penalize her for previous policy decisions or because donald trump picked her. General, not only have you given your life to service to this country, much of it in uniform, youve had children of your own on foreign battlefields who you would have not wanted tortured under the flag of another country. Youve never believed in it. Torture is at the basis a former policy of ours, is at the basis of the disconnect here. Look, theres no question that that was a shameful chapter in american history, and it wasnt just the cia. It was also the department of defense. Where we had a policy of maltreatment, of torture of people under our control. It did us damage in the international community, put our own troops at risk. Its been corrected. We now have a legal opinion, certainly in d. O. D. And also the agency that its against the law. So, we shouldnt lose sight of that and President Trump has said he supports torture, its just appalling that he could make that statement and be supported by some congressman, i might add. Having said that, gina haspels the most professional possible choice to be the director of the cia. Shes nonpolitical. She is supported by leon panetta, by general mike hayden, and by the way, if it isnt her, its like when you get rid of h. R. Mcmaster, i hope youre happy with what you get to replace him so im not too keen on seeing a political appointee to be director of the cia. They ought to confirm her, are renounce any violation of the law in the future but unless were willing to go after the president of the United States and the attorney general and the secretary of defense, who were all involved in that policy decision, after 9 11, they got scared. They lost their judgment temporarily. We got to put that behind us, though. Not our proudest moment. General, its a real treat to have you here in our new york studios. We usually have to talk to you via satellite. Thank you, sir, as always. Coming up, the current and ongoing fight for the soul of america. That is the idea behind the new book by our Pulitzer Prize winning friend, john meacham. He is here with us to talk about it and well do that after this break. Dray, when he was younger, he loved to smile; and we knew he would need braces because his teeth were coming in funny. This is the picture that was on the front page of the newspaper. All you can notice is the braces then, once he got to michigan state, he broke the retainer my bottom teeth, they were really crooked, and i just wasnt getting braces again. Then i discovered smiledirectclub. Its easy to just grab it and go and i can change it on the road. I did photoshoots with my aligners in and you cant see them. A smile is a first impression, thats why i think having a great smile is so important. Ahh. Summer is coming. And its time to get outside. Pack in even more adventure with audible. With the Largest Selection of audiobooks. Audible lets you follow plot twists off the beaten track. Or discover magic when you hit the open road. With the free audible app, your stories go wherever you do. And for just 14. 95 a month you get a credit, good for any audiobook. If you dont like it exchange it any time. No questions asked. You can also roll your credits to the next month if you dont use them. So take audible with you this summer. On the road. On the trail. Or to the beach. Start a 30day trial and your first audiobook is free. Cancel anytime, and your books are yours to keep forever. No matter where you go this summer make it better with audible. Text summer17 to 500500 to start listening today. As special counsel Robert Muellers russia investigation looms over the white house, the president continued to attack the people leading the investigation. Trump wrote on twitter this morning, the 13 angry democrats in charge of the russia witch hunt are starting to find out that there is a court system in place that actually protects people from injustice and just wait until the courts get to see your unrevealed conflicts of interest. Proper name. Here to help put everything in perspective, save spelling and punctuation, john meacham. Pulitzer prize winning author and historian, also were proud to see an msnbc contributor. And his new book, the soul of america, the battle for our better angels is in stores tomorrow or more appropriately, allnight bookstore, youve got like 15 minutes to wait. John, you hail from the great state of tennessee where you currently live. If people come up at a signing, in two different constituencies, i want to hear your answer. To the guy who says, this country wasnt working for me, so youre damn right i voted for donald trump, and theres more work to be done and were going to break some furniture on the way, what do you say to him and what do you say to the second person who comes up and sincerely looks in your eye and says, im worried about our country. What you say is that there is room in the american soul for us to disagree about the means to solve problem, but our best moments, the moments we look back on, the moments we want to emulate, to commemorate, the new deal, the breakdown of the war against jim crow, the reagan era in many ways, were moments in which we opened our hearts, we opened our arms wider, and we grew stronger. This is not a partisan homily. I voted for democrats, i have voted for republicans. It is a Historical Data point that the more prosperous weve been, the more open weve been, free trade, the Free Movement of people, the Free Movement of ideas, a free press. The stronger weve become. Were the most powerful nation until the history of the world. Largest air force in the world is the United States air force. Do you know what the second one is . The United States navys. Were doing just fine. But were doing fine because weve always widened what jefferson meant when he sat down in late june in 1776 and wrote that were all created equal. You are certain ive been asked to ask this by a mutual friend you are certain that what were in the middle of is not a cataclysm of democracy, not fed by something unforeseen by the founders called social media that has driven us apart and splintered us . Youre convinced its not a cataclysm, its a recoverable act. Absolutely. Its not hey, relax, weve been through this before. Its, hey, lets get to work and stay at work because we need to keep making it work. The constitutions a human document. The constitution was written for an hour like this. It was written to stop demagogues. It would have stunned madison and morris and adams and washington, the idea that we didnt have a demagogue at the highest levels until 2016. The point was we are sinful, we are driven by appetite, we are driven by ambition, ambition must be made as they said to counteract ambition. And so what i suspect our mutual friend would then say would be, well, thats fine, but the president doesnt respect the rule of law and congress is a bunch of quislings. Theyre not standing up to him. There are four, five, six elements in the public sphere and remember the republic is only as good as the sum of its parts. Theres the presidency, the legislature, the pretsz, the courts, and the people. If you can get two or three of those force on the right side, were going to be all right. Right now i think we have to take the presidency off the table. Congress is on the edge of the table and about to fall off but the press is doing a great job. The courts, the rule of law have been doing what they can do. And the people, were seeing remarkable activism, whether its guns in florida or women marching. Our best moments have come when those voices of protest have actually reached the mainstream and widened the definition of what it is to be an american. To our viewers, john meacham has never written a clunky or bad sentence, and thats a streak he continues through this new book. Fantastic reading. What a pleasure to have you on your tour of the nations media. Good luck out there. Its getting rough these days. I hear that. Thanks, john. The book is out tomorrow. Soul of america, the battle for our better angels get in line now at your Favorite Book seller because you dont know what the crowds are going to do first thing in the morning. Coming up, its not just all about West Virginia tomorrow. A look at the other important races well be watching at this very hour tomorrow night on the 11th hour. New aveeno® positively radiant sheer daily moisturizer. Lightweight hydration for positively radiant skin that lasts. Aveeno®. Naturally beautiful results® but im not standing still. And with godaddy, ive made my ideas real. I made my own way, now its time to make yours. Everything is working, just like it should as we mentioned, tomorrow, primary day in West Virginia, but there are also races in indiana, ohio, north carolina, were going to be watching and covering all of it tomorrow night. One of the notable recurring themes in this primary season, weve already talked about it this evening, the republicans attempting to outtrump each other, in effect. In the Indiana Senate race, theres a threeway republican contest to unseat the incumbent democrat, senator joe donnelley. Trump won indiana by 19 points. Thats important, and that makes donnelleys seat one to watch. Running on the republican side, current u. S. Congressman todd. His recent ad uses trump language, calling muellers investigation a witch hunt and has worn a he has worn a make America Great again hat in his campaign videos. Also running, congressman luke messer, whos part of the group of republicans pushing the president s nomination for a Nobel Peace Prize for his progress with north korea. And businessman mike braun, who credits trump for his decision to run for the senate. In ohio, two republicans competing to face the incumbent democratic senator brown. Mike gibbons, the first of them, an investment banker who also has zero political experience. And current congressman jim renacci. Renacci, right . Renacci who was recently endorsed by trump. Were also looking at the ohio governors race and who will succeed the termlimited republican governor john kasich. In the running is former head of the Consumer FinancialProtection Bureau under president obama. He also has the support of democratic senator elizabeth warren. He is facing some familiar names here. Facing dennis kucinich, the former cleveland mayor and former congressman who has the support of some from the Bernie Sanders wing of the party. Republican candidates for governor of ohio, current state attorney general mike dewine, also happens to be a former congressman and u. S. Senator, and Lieutenant Governor mary taylor. That gives you some of what youre going to see next, tomorrow night, with steve on the big board for our full primary coverage tomorrow evening, all day, all night long, right here on msnbc. Coming up, when we come back, some desperate hours in a beautiful place. Thats when we continue. From the very beginning. It was always our singular focus, a distinct determination. To do whatever it takes, use every possible resource. To fight cancer. And never lose sight of the patients were fighting for. Our Cancer Treatment specialists share the same vision. 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Aerial photos from the big island show the ground is just opening up in some places, and orange lava is coming out. Pictures from ground level, look at this, show lava approaching a gate and opening the gate as it continues its relentless flow. Its eating up blacktop, parked cars in its way, close to 30 homes so far. The big island has been shaken by hundreds of earthquakes as kilauea has rumbled to life, including one big shaker registering a 6. 9. The gases being released are toxic. Sulfur dioxide can kill you, and this eruption is reshaping parts of the island, the old cone, atop the volcano has collapsed into a much larger crater, and we dont know for how much longer. Kilaueas been oozing continually since 1983. Its just one of five volcanos on the big island alone, socalled fire fountains of magma have shot over 200 feet in the air. Its important to remember volcanos gave us hawaii. Its also important to remember those who have lost everything this week and while we cant stop whats happening, we can hope that everyone gets out of the way until Mother Nature decides thats enough of a show for now. Thats our broadcast for a monday night. Thank you so much for being here with us. Tonight on all in im facing a situation with the president and all the other lawyers are, in which every lawyer in america thinks he would be a fool to testify. Ive got a client who wants to testify. Thats Rudy Giuliani defending the president. Im at the point where im learning, and i can only i cant prove that. I can just say its rumor. Tonight the say anything strategy. How do you separate fact and opinion . And why it just might work. Rudy never changes. Where is rudy . Plus, new details about what the president s other lawyer might have done for his client. Did Michael Cohen make payments to other women for the president . I have no knowledge of that. But i would think if it was necessary, yes