After hearing gun shots. They made the call because they believed at that time if they didnt enter, there would have been many more lives lost. Events that were unfolding inside the premises led them to the belief that now was the time to deploy the number of gun shots that were heard, which caused officers to move straight to what we call an Emergency Action plan and that caused them to enter. After the raid, a number of hostages were taken out on stretchers and transported by ambulance to sydney hospitals. It was the conclusion of a standoff that gripped the worlds attention. Overnight, we saw chilling images of five hostages making a daring dash to safety. While inside customers and staff were forced to hold up this islamic banner. Witnesses described the first moments of the siege. Yeah, i saw the gunman, yep. He was quite tall. Late 40s. Very calm. He was just pacing. He was looking out into the lift well. And the customers were still sitting at the tables. They were drinking, but im not sure how alert they were to what was going to unfold. Police identifying the suspected gunman as manuran mompt onis, he had a long criminal record, including a conviction for sending offensive letters to the families of australian soldiers killed in afghanistan. This pen is my gun. And these words are my bullets. Ill fight with these weapons against oppression, to promote peace. Today the u. S. Defense department told nbc news there was no evidence the gunman had any connection to isis. But among the questions now, was he a lone wolf, or part of a larger plot . And how can future incidents be stopped . Joining me now, retired atf analyst and counterterror expert. Thank you both for being here. Thank you, rev. Lets talk about how this all ended. Walk us through the raid by the australian police. Well, what happened, reverend al, from all the reporting, it looks like the hostage taker at any 2 00 in the morning, about 2 03 in the morning, started herding the hostages into two separate groups. So thats the activity that started everything, it looks like. And then a series of events happened. One man went out a door. And a couple minutes later, five more people went out. Australian newspapers are reporting that a man inside a few minutes later tried to grab the guys gun. Im not sure when. Theyre saying it might have happened. But the dynamics were changing inside. People were escaping out the door. One of the long riflemen looked through the window and reported a shot fired at a hostage, and then they launched the emergency assault. You can see on the video youre showing there, reverend al, the emergency assault where the flash bang devices are deployed and they set off a series of explosions. Theres some gunfire in there, and theres evidence that he fired at the police. Because one of the officers was wounded with a pellet. He was killed, unfortunately, two hostages were dead. The onscene commanders were forced to make a decision. It looks like he shot a hostage. It all started when there was some activity in there. A guy tried to get his gun away from him, or him trying to herd the people around. Not sure which happened first, but it was the only response that they could do. Leith, we watched this all night. The world was totally gripped by this. What are you learning now tonight . What has come to you now thats new . Well, weve learned a few things just by studying whats left of his social media activities. And that is his twitter account, that has not. Taken down. His latest tweet was on december 12th. But the man which was friday . Which was friday. And the man appeared to be infatuated by radical elements like isis. He declared that the leader of isis, he asked people to pray for him. He accused the Australian Government of actual practicing torture on prisoners in australia and for launching what he called terrorist campaign by allying itself with the u. S. Led coalition that has targeted but theres no evidence of a direct connection with isis or any terrorist group . So far theres no direct connection that we see. Theres also no direct connection that we see with a larger group. It seemed that he acted on his own. Jim, from the suspected gunmans background, he faced more than 40 charges of sexual or indecent assault. In 2013, he was charged with being an accessory to the murder of his exwife, and he was convicted of sending offensive letters to relatives of fallen australian soldiers. So he was certainly on the radar of authorities in sydney, right . Thats right. They knew about him and even the reporters knew about him because of his extremist views and being public in the street, preaching in the street this extremism. And sending these letters to the families of the australian soldiers. He was well known to the police, to the media. And i agree with leith, hes an inspired, sbrg, lone actor, much like major hassan at ft. Hood, the hatchet attack on the london soldier, the canadian attack on the parliament, theyre inspired actors. Theyre not part of the connected organization, but theyre still deadly. Isnt that even more dangerous, laith, than organized groups that can be looked upon, monitored, spied upon . That you have these lone people that no one has any way of knowing theyre going to come out . How do we protect ourselves from that . Most definitely, these are the unknown unknowns. You dont know whether theyre going to strike. They leave very little evidence behind. They dont cooperate or organize with other individuals. They dont act on behalf of a group. They act inspired by an ideology more than anything else. What we need, we need a counter narrative, a Deradicalization Campaign that can take off in a be in of societies where we believe isis is trying to infiltrate, or its ideology is trying to infiltrate, in australia, the United States, europe and all across the middle east. You were talking about other incidents around the world and some that have occurred may have been inspired by other terrorist groups. In may, four people were shot and killed at a Jewish Museum in brussels. In october, a man drove his car over two canadian soldiers in a strip mall. Two days later a canadian soldier was shot and killed at the national war memorial. And today the standoff in sydney. And heres what president obamas former Deputy Director of the cia said today. Listen to this. What concerns me the most is that were going to see this kind of terrorism around the world and we are going to see it here, and we need to be prepared for that. It shouldnt surprise people when this happens here sometime over the next year or so. Guaranteed. Thats a very chilling, chilling statement to americans. Right, it is, reverend al. But weve seen it before. Weave seen it in ft. Hood. Weve seen it in the cases youve outlined. If the people dont have a direct connection to isis, if they havent gone over there, or al qaeda, if they havent worked with them, trained with them, you know, and theyre not in contact with them, then theyre inspired lone actor, but theyre still deadly and they still can pop up. So the Broader Community of americans, and then the Broader Community of muslims that reject these people whole heartedly, we all have to Work Together to find them and interrupt their deadly plots if we can. Jim cavanaugh and laith alcorey, thank you both for your time tonight. Straight ahead, revenge politics. Why senator benter is vowing to block president obamas pick for attorney general. Plus, thought Elizabeth Warrens white was over . Think again. The power of warren and what it means for the new congress. And tens of thousands marched to end Police Brutality. Now Oprah Winfrey is speaking out. More on the oprah effect on the movement ahead. I have a cold with terrible chest congestion. I better take something. Theraflu severe cold doesnt treat chest congestion. Really . New alkaseltzer plus day powder rushes relief to your worst cold symptoms plus chest congestion. [breath of relief] oh, what a relief it is. Wow [ narrator ] on a mission to get richard to his campbells chunky soup. Its new chunky beerncheese with beef and bacon soup. I love it. And mama loves you. Breaking news tonight, gop senator david vitter, announcing hell try to block president obamas nominee for attorney general, Loretta Lynch. But its not about her record. Its about political revenge. Thats next. [coughing] dave, im sorry to interrupt. I gotta take a sick day tomorrow. Dads dont take sick days, dads take nyquil. The nighttime, sniffling, sneezing, coughing, aching, fever, best sleep with a cold, medicine. Politics of revenge. Thats what were seeing from louisiana senator david vitter. Hes so mad over the president S Immigration executive action, hes vowing to block his pick for attorney general, Loretta Lynch. Vitter says, quote, well have the opportunity to push back on executive amnesty with one of our first major battles. The attorney general nomination. The attorney general is one of the linchpins to obamas amnesty plan, and ill be working to get the new congress to block this nomination. This has nothing to do with lynchs merits. Its just a childish political power play. I its counterproductive and its todays Republican Party. Joining me now, Dana Millbank and joan walsh. Thank you both for being here. This is flatout revenge. How will it play out if he follows through with this blocking plan of his . I dont know. Hell get some support for sure, but look at what he didnt say in that release. He didnt say her name. He didnt say anything about her record. Because it was all about president obama. Right. He didnt say, were going to talk to her about her views on immigration and executive power. There were lots of things he could have said. He didnt say anything about her record here in new york. Pro or con. Shes not a person. Shes a cipher. Shes a standin for the president. She also happens to be african american. And theres tended to be a little bit of a beating up on certain nominees and black Office Holders like eric holder and susan rice. So this is shaping up to be another battle that can it get pretty ugly. But, dana, this is crazy. We are in the middle of some very serious legal questions in this country, from immigration, to policing, to wall street. And were not dwebating the merits of the nominee, were playing political revenge power games here. Of course its crazy, but youre not surprised that craziness is occurring to capitol hill right now. This is basically the ted cruz playbook. He said he wants to fight president obama in every way possible, including with the nominations. Now, there arent a lot of guys like ted cruz and vitter who want to do this. But you dont need too many. They cant stop it permanently, but they can slow it down. You know who doesnt want to hear this, Mitch Mcconnell, because its exposing a rift within the Republican Party. The leadership doesnt want to look irresponsible. If they go holding up confirmation of the nations chief Law Enforcement official, theyre going to look pretty irresponsible. Joan, we did have a hint when dana mentioned ted cruz. We had a hint that conservative centers might go after Loretta Lynch over immigration. Because when she was nominated senators ted cruz and mike lee asked her to put out a statement on whether or not she believes the president s executive amnesty plans were constitutional and legal. If senator vitter is getting tips from ted cruz, this cant end well for him, can it . You know, hes made a choice to get his tips from ted cruz. Ted cruz has said he didnt think they should approve any nominees, not for ambassadorships, not for anything, including the attorney general. So, you know, dana might be more optimistic than i am about there being really pushback among leadership. I cant see Mitch Mcconnell stopping letting his people stop this, but i can see them letting them have some fun with it. So well see. We see the revenge coming from the right. But i also want to talk about the thunder from the left. Elizabeth warren taking on the gop for pushing through secret favors for big banks. Democrats dont like wall street bailouts. Republicans dont like wall street bailouts. The American People are disgusted by wall street bailouts. And yet here we are five years after doddfrank with congress on the verge of ramming through a provision that would do nothing for the middle class, do nothing for community banks, do nothing but raise the risk that taxpayers will have to bail out the biggest banks once again. This is warrens moment. And the fight is only beginning. Shes trying to derail the nomination of an investment banker named Antonio Weiss for position at the treasury department. Senator warrens arguing a wall street executive shouldnt turn around and start regulating wall street. Republicans try to block nominees to score political points. This move is on actual policy. Dana, there seems to be a false equivalence, linking warrens fight to the far right. In a superficial sense shes bucking the party establishment, the way a ted cruz bucks the party establishment, but shes not trying to throw sand in the gears here. Shes stating her policy objection right up front here. I think for the democrats as a whole, its unfortunate because they could be at this moment, exploiting the rifts that are naturally existing on the right in the Republican Party as they take over congress. It would be nice to see that the white house could get on the same page with Elizabeth Warren and could get some of that populist energy going and back away from being just the second Major Corporate party in american politics. But when you have these disputes out in the open, theyre losing an opportunity for unity here to exploit the republican divisions that are going to be popping up. But, joan, everybodys eyes are on Elizabeth Warren right now. How much power does she have . Joe manchion, a blue dog, not normally with Elizabeth Warren, not necessarily a populist, has joined her on this one. I dont know that she can block it, but shes going to try. I know there were some progressives who hoped maybe the president would back away from this nomination. He forced people to vote for the budget, even with the wall street stuff in it that they didnt like. Maybe he would give on this one. Hes not going to. Thats his prerogative up. But hes going to face a fight with his party. I disagree on the issue of democratic unity. I think this is a fight worth having. Sometimes fake unity has prevailed. Nancy pelosi had to whip votes for things she didnt believe in over the years and i think that kind of faith unity is not going to happen and maybe some serious debate can be had. Usually ends up with no unity at all. But senator warren, you know, they keep talking about her running for president. She was asked again today if shed consider a run for president. Take a listen. Im not running for president. Thats not what were doing. We had a really important fight in the United StatesCongress Just this past week, and im putting all my energy into that fight and to what happens after this. Would you tell these independent groups, give it up, youre just never going to run . I told them, im not running for president. Youre putting that in the present tense. Are you never going to run . I am not running for president. Youre not putting a never on that. I am not running for president. Do you want me to put an exclamation point at the end . She says shes not running for president , dana, but is there a reason she wont put a never in that statement . Because shes a politician. Youre never supposed to put the never in there if you have ambition. But shes not doing anything to indicate shes running for president or that shes prepared to run for president. So i would take her at her word. That she is trying to infuse this populist energy into the crowd. Im not sure what joan means about fake unity. I think the white house should be grasping some of this populist energy and shifting their views to where the energy is within the party right now, i think that would be very effective. Dana and joan, thank you for your time tonight. Breaking news, breaking news. President obamas nominee for Surgeon General was just confirmed by the senate with a 5143 vote. Dr. Vivek murphy was nominated by president obama over a year ago and has faced steep opposition from republicans, namely because the nra opposed his nomination. Murthy has been confirmed now. Well have more on this. And ted cruzs role in his nomination ahead. Murthy confirmed. Also ahead, dick cheneys explosive comments about torture, innocent people, and whether hes do it all over again. Plus, Oprah Winfreys powerful interview with the policing protests sweeping the country. And what president obama says is so hard about buying christmas presents for the first lady. Good morning everybody. 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Another latenight ted cruz grandstand. Too bad he forgot his copy of green eggs and ham. But his show boating totally backfired. Cruzs point of order stunt set off a Chain Reaction in the senate procedures. Eventually allowing democratic leader harry reid to set up dozens of obama nominees to be confirmed before the Senate Adjourns this week. Nominees who republicans hope to run out the clock on. Like tony blinkin, for the deputy secretary of state. And Sarah Saldana to head immigration and customs enforcement. And most controversial of all, vivek murthy, president obamas nominee for Surgeon General who strongly was opposed by the nra. But he was just confirmed by the senate moments ago. Democrats were overjoyed. It was like christmas came early and senator cruz was santa claus. But republicans werent as thrilled. Susan collins declared it counterproductive. Kelly ayotte called it ridiculous. And orrin hatch said it was, quote, irritating a lot of people. Did senator cruz think wed ignore his crash and burn on the senate floor . Nice try, but looks like your fellow republicans gotcha. Aching, fever, best sleep with a cold, medicine. They take us to worlds full of heroes and titans. For respawn, building the best Interactive Entertainment begins with the cloud. This is titanfall, the first multiplayer game built and run on microsoft azure. Empowering gamers around the world to interact in ways they never thought possible. This cloud turns data into excitement. This is the microsoft cloud. Wow [ narrator ] on a mission to get richard to his campbells chunky soup. Its new chunky beerncheese with beef and bacon soup. I love it. And mama loves you. Cold with this i have the worst cold with this runni better take something. Dayquill cold and flu doesnt treat your runny nose. Seriously . Alkaseltzer plus cold and cough fights your worst cold symptoms plus your runny nose. Oh, what a relief it is. 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Late today we learned that John Crawfords parents plan to sue the two officers involved in the shooting of their son, as well as the police chief and walmart. And now in a new video obtained by the guardian newspaper, were seeing how his girlfriend was grilled and threatened by police for over an hour and a half right after crawford was shot dead. You might be on your way to jail, so im going to be very clear i swear to good, i swear to god, i swir to god, i have a job and a family. Where did he get this gun . Sir, i dont know. I swear to good. Sir, i swear to god. You were with him just moments before this happened. You need to tell me the truth. I am. I am, i swear to god. You might be on your way to jail. That man had a weapon. But the threats and attacks didnt stop there. Why would he have a gun in the store . I dont know. Dont tell me that you dont know. Thats the first thing i realize when someones not telling me the truth. You are close to this man and you need to be truthful to me. This might be your last chance. Im not going to take another statement. You knew at some point he did carry a gun . No, sir, i swear i didnt know. Tasha, im having trouble with this. Give me a lie detector test. That might come in the future. Hes grilling her as if she committed a crime. This video is disturbing. But its part of a growing problem. People who have lost loved ones to Police Shootings deserve to be treated with respect and dignity, not as if theyve done something wrong. Joining me now are mark clq cla and former new York City Police officer and former prosecutor and host of just faith, thanks for being here tonight. Faith, they say the officer didnt even tell her John Crawford was dead until 90 minutes into the interrogation. Whats your reaction to this video . This video was so disturbing to watch, especially in light of what we know now about what happened in that walmart. But sometimes Police Officers have to question witnesses or suspects in a hostile manner to get information. But this wasnt one of those cases. This woman was not a suspect. There was a phone call with the walmart about John Crawford. She had done nothing wrong. She was not suspected of doing anything wrong. And the way this officer is interrogating her, well, first of all, in this state, hes interrogating her about him having this gun. Where did he get the gun . In his state, hes legally able to do so. Even if thats true, thats not illegal in the state of ohio. And under walmarts regulations. Because it was a toy gun. And on top of that, at what point after they shoot John Crawford the Police Officers are there, theyre trained to use deadly force. They know what real guns look like. How do you not know at some point right after the shooting, thats not a real gun. Its a bb gun. Its sold in walmart. He basically is calling her a liar. Hes the girlfriend of a man just killed, who was talking to him on the phone. She was not there, not suspected of anything. Hes badgering her and basically calling her a liar. I mean, you were a Police Officer for many years. He even asked, was she sober. Watch this. Are you under the influence of anything . No. Been drinking . No. Drugs . No. Your eyes are kind of messed up looking and you seem lethargic and tired, but i dont know if its because youre upset or not. I mean, this is crazy. Mark, is this an appropriate way for Law Enforcement to interrogate someone . Not appropriate at all. What were witnessing there on the video is termed the hard interview. And there are occasions when police investigators, like i was a retired detective, used a hard interview to gather information, facts, some evidence. But then there are times when the investigator themselves are basically incompetent and unaware of the facts to engage in a successful or fruitful or meaningful hard interview. You cant lose your humanity and your decency and your morality when dealing with anyone, especially this young lady, who he knew had a boyfriend who had just been killed. He should have also known that the weapon in question was not a real weapon. It was a toy gun. So he went in, basically blind, if you believe him, and then used this hard interview technique. And i suspect that technique is probably used with everybody he interviews. Thats his style and thats one of the problems with some investigations and with the investigators that conduct them. But, you know, mark, faith just talked about humanity and thats what ive been saying all along. Where does your humanity come in . Ferguson, statin island choking a man. When does your humanity kick in . Were learning more about how police treated the family of tamir rice, a 12yearold boy shot by ohio police. After he was killed, listen to his sister described what happened when she tried to run to her brothers side. I ran to the gazebo. And i couldnt get there all the way to him because the officer attacked me. Threw me on the ground, tackled me on the ground, put me in handcuffs and put me in the back of the police car. When i come running out, they tackled me and they didnt do nothing. They was just standing there looking really lost. I mean, faith, her brother was dying. And they tackled her and threw her into the police car. I mean, do they have any Legal Recourse . This is a kid. You look at her, you clearly see shes a kid. You know, these Police Officers, whether its with tamir rice, or with eric garner, you see Police Officers and this pattern of them responding to a scene or to a call, and theres this inability to assess the situation, to assess the real dangerousness of a situation before using deadly force. So its not surprising that they treated her that way. They just killed a 12yearold with a fake gun because they responded in a matter of seconds decided to use deadly force on that 12yearold, before making the proper assessment to see who he was and what he was really doing. In a recent case here in new york, akai gurley was killed by officers in the stairwell of his home. And the daily news reports that the nypd officer who shot gurley was texting his union rep as gurley lay dying. And what the officers were incommunicado for more than six and a half minutes while their Commanding Officer and an emergency officer tried to reach them. Mark, what can be done to ensure police treat the people they shoot and their families with more dignity . You have to shift the mindset of Law Enforcement, which is surrounding much of what the activity going throughout the nation. You have to shift the mindset of Law Enforcement to the point where they realize that what youre doing is public service. Youre doing community service. Youre doing goodwill. Thats the bulk of Law Enforcement. Until you shift the mindset away from this overmilitarized, overaggressive, in many communities of color in particular, and we have to be honest about that, until you shift away from that mindset, youll continue to find incidents where they dont respect the humanity, and in large part, too many police agencies, too many Law Enforcement agencies operate based on color and the community. What community theyre in and what color the individuals that theyre dealing with are, and thats unacceptable on any level. Totally unacceptable. We have to shift it back to public service. Totally unacceptable. And i want to add, im not saying this about all police, not even most police. But those that operate this way needs to be held accountable. Marq claxton and faith jenkins, thank you both for your time tonight. Thank you, rev. Coming up, dick cheneys talking torture. Would he do it again . Plus, we heard from a lot of celebrities on the movement against Police Brutality. Now oprah is speaking out. And president obama revealed something about his christmas list. Conversation nation is next. vo nourished. Rescued. Protected. Given new hope. During the subaru share the love event, subaru owners feel it, too. Because when you take home a new subaru, we donate 250 dollars to helping those in need. Well have given 50 Million Dollars over seven years. Love. Its what makes a subaru, a subaru. Wow [ narrator ] on a mission to get richard to his campbells chunky soup. Its new chunky beerncheese with beef and bacon soup. I love it. And mama loves you. And mama loves you. Philosophy is, reynolds . No. Not exactly. To attain success, one must project success. Thats why we use fedex one rate®. Their flat rate shipping. Exactly. It makes us look topnotch but we know its affordable. garage door opening sighs honey, havent i asked you to please use the. We dont have a reception entrance. Ship a pak via Fedex Express saver® for as low as 7. 50. Thover 65 million years ago. Rth like our van. Yeah. We need to sell it. Hi. Need an appraisal . Yeah. We do. Vo when selling your car, start with a written offer, no strings attached. Carmax. Start here. Introducing. A pm pain reliever that dares to work all the way until. The am. New aleve pm the only one to combine a safe sleep aid plus the 12 hour strength of aleve. Time now for conversation nation. Joining me tonight, msnbcs krystal ball, Chris Witherspoon and aliona minkovski. Thank you all for being here. We start with dick cheneys defense of the enhanced int interrogation methods. Despite all the findings in the torture report, he said hed do to again. I have no problem, as long as we achieve our objective. Thats to get the guys who did 9 11 and its to avoid another attack against the United States. I was prepared and we did, we got the authorize from the president and authorization from the Justice Department to the go forward with the program. It worked. Weve avoided another mass casualty attack against the United States. We captured bin laden and others who are responsible for the attack on 9 11. Id do it again in a minute. He would do it all over again. Kudos to chuck, this was a great interview. And it was so luminating. He asked him, forced rectal feeding, do you think thats torture . Cheney said no. The conditions they held detainees in where they held to death, is that torture . No. So obviously his definition of torture does not match what International Standards and what the American People just at a basic level of common sense think. And on the point of whether or not it works, that was one of the things that was clarifying about this report. No, torture did not keep us safe. It did not make us safer. When you see an interview like this, taking the politics out of it, does it help or hurt his side when hes saying rectal feeding is not torture . People like that were undecided, start looking at this and say, what . I think its not so much what he said, but how he said it. He was very unapologetic. We know hes to blame. He was involved at overseeing the cia. So i think the fact that he was so arrogant and backed away from saying any kind of im sorry, i apologize, this was inhumane, it was kind of absurd. He didnt deny any of the allegations that chuck laid out from the report. I dont know why everyone is so surprised that dick cheney is not apologizing and that hed do it again. Of course he would because he was never punished for it. And thats a key failure of the obama administration. The rhetoric the president tells us that hes opposed to torture, but the actions there just dont line up. What could be done . What could be done, you could hold somebody accountable. You could try to prosecute people. You could try to set an example. If we supposedly if this goes against our fundamental values as a country, then we need to prove it to the rest of the world. We are sig nattories to International Conventions one idea thats been floated with, to issue pardon, because that way youre recognizing wrongdoing without going through the details, youre able to move forward but with the recognition there was wrongdoing. No ones lost their job. No ones been held accountable at that basic level of losing their job for what clearly the American People see as torture and for not to mention lying to congress and lying to the American People. On the scale of public opinion, how alarmed is the public on this . Is there a real backlash and a real sense of outrage that you sense in the public . I think you can look at it as a political story, but its crossed into the homes of the American People. I think everybody is upset about this. Theres outrage. Its absurd. You look at america as a country that protects its nation, but also protects those in other countries. And to go to other countries and do what we see has happened in these reports, its shocking. I think people across the country and around the world are shocked. Now to Oprah Winfrey, speaking out on the nationwide protests against Police Brutality. Last night at a movie premiere in new york city, oprah spoke to Chris Witherspoon. My feeling is that everything is always happening exactly as it should and on time. Its not coincidence that this is happening now, but because its happening now, people are say paying more attention. And i think life is already there ready to teach, enlighten and open you up to the greater possibilities of what can be done, if youre willing to be awake and to see it. Chris, great interview. She said willing to be awake. What do you think the oprah effect will be on this . I think because oprah has been silent for so long. She hasnt been on instagram and talked about eric garner, Michael Brown, none of that. I think the fact that shes finally speaking is going to make people realize it is a national issue. Its beautiful, but its sad that these people are gone, the families are mourning, but people are awake. They want to engage now more than ever before. I think when she said that now people are paying attention, it was almost implicitly saying, this has been happening a long time, but now is the time. This has been happening for a very long time. You know i know. Well, one of the other things that oprah has said about this too in regards to selma and the movie coming out, the movie is proof that people have been fighting for justice for so long, whether it be voting rights, or fighting against Police Brutality in this country, and not to take it for granted and not to forget that people risk their lives for this in the past. Lost their lives. Many lost their lives. And the other thing that was interesting about chris tying this into the red carpet interview with oprah is that in the film, they show some of the tension in the movement. And it takes away some of the romance that you get with the rewrite of history, like everybody wasnt with dr. King. Theres a lot of infighting, theres a lot of controversy, but they still made progress. And he wasnt born a nationally beloved figure. Its only looking back at history that everyone celebrates what he was able to achieve. But its powerful to hear oprah on this, it helps to keep the spotlight on. But if people watched that video of eric garner and arent moved to action, to recognize that there is a problem in this country, i dont know that oprah can fix it. Everyone, please stay with me. When we come back, president obamas Big Christmas decision. Its about shopping. Next. Will that be all, sir . Thank you. Ordering chinese food is a very predictable experience. I order b14. I get b14. No surprises. Buying business internet, on the other hand, can be a roller coaster White Knuckle thrill ride. Youre promised one speed. But do you consistently get it . You do with comcast business. And often even more. Its reliable. Just like kung pao fish. Thank you, ping. Reliably fast internet starts at 89. 95 a month. Comcast business. Built for business. Were back with the panel, krystal, chris, and alyona. Now to the holiday shopping. I have a question. I want a show of hands here. Who is done with their Christmas Shopping . Who hasnt started their Christmas Shopping . Ive started at least. Im 3 4 of the way through. We have nine shopping days left before christmas. And if you still have work to do, dont worry. So does president obama. Heres what he told Ryan Seacrest today. Michelles hard to shop for. Shes very fashionable and she looks good. So im worried about buying her clothes, because, you know, on Christmas Day shell look at it and say, thats really sweet, honey and peck me on the cheek and then i never see her wear whatever i bought. So ive got to rack my brain to see whats a new idea. Alyona, whats your gift idea for the first lady . Oh, god, thats tough. I think its pretty fair to say you shouldnt be buying clothes for the first lady if youre the president. Because everything she wears is judged and criticized and scrutinized. The first lady has a lot of responsibility, a lot of duties in her own right. Not to mention you have to be next to the person with the most stressful job on the planet. So i think she needs a spa day. You cant go wrong with that. I think an allaccess unprecedented beyonce tour pass, her and the girls. I like that. For her, malia and sasha. Obama and beyonce. I like the theme of experiences and someone who needs to take a little time for herself. It is a little generic, but i think you can never go wrong for a woman with a day at the spa. Little Gift Certificate somewhere nice. Beyonce, i would get her extra guards at the gate to the white house lawn. More security. [ laughter ] thank you for your time. Thank you. When we come back, the fight for justice across the country. Successful deliveries last year. 15 billion football has a season. Baseball has a season. This is our season. Health can change in a minute. So cvs health is changing healthcare. Making it more accessible and affordable, with over 900 locations for walkin medical care. And more on the way. Minuteclinic. Another innovation from cvs health. Because health is everything. Finally tonight, people marching for justice all across the country. On saturday in washington, tens of thousands of protesters marched right up to the United States capitol. In a rally organized by my civil rights group, the National Action network. We marched with the families who have lost loved ones at the hands of police. Relatives of eric garner, Michael Brown jr, akai gurley, tamir rice, and trayvon martin, showing the world that americans are uniting for justice. I stood in this city and was inspired when i saw a black man put his hand on the bible and become president. But ive also been inspired today when i see young white kids holding up signs saying black lives matter. This is not a black march or a white march. This is an american march for the rights of American People. We also saw tens of thousands of protesters marching here in new york city and similar rallies in cities like oakland, boston, philadelphia, and st. Louis. The calls for change are getting louder. Last night the cast and crew of the movie selma wore i cant breathe tshirts at the premiere. And wide receiver Andrew Hawkins wore a shirt yesterday that read justice for tamir rice and John Crawford. As we see these marches, people that sit on the sidelines that may or may not agree with our raising the questions of fairness, need to ask themselves, the people young and old, the people of all races, are saying that the system is broken in terms of fair and impartial review of cases. Then something must be wrong. What would make people across these lines march . The answer is, we need change. Thanks for watching. Im al sharpton. Hardball starts right now. Dick cheney, id do it again. Lets play hardball. Good evening, im Chris Matthews in washington. Dick cheney could write the book on torture made morally easy. Id do it again in a minute he said on sunday and thats how long it took him to decide. And as cheney puts it, the torture program, as he calls it, was all his. It was all i was prepared to, and we did it, we got