Not feeling pressure on impeachment. Ill talk to a Judiciary Committee member who is trying to change that feeling. Welcome to wednesday. Its meet the press daily. Good evening. Im chuck todd here in washington. Happy hump day. And thank god for the nats lineup. They can make up for that bullpen. Anyway, confusion and frustration in the republican caucus. Virtually no one in the republican conference supports the president s sweeping new tariffs on mexico but no one is willing to say publicly they will stop him. Which is why soechl anxious and hand wringing republicans are watching whats happening at the white house this second where a mexican delegation is might meting with Top White House officials to potentially cut a deal to stop the new tariffs, which could effectively function as a tax on american consumers. We could hear from some of the Administration Officials in this meeting, including the Vice President and secretary of state. However, expectations are very low that any deal will be cut today. President s not there. President , you know where he is. The president today doubled down on his demands and his frustration with mexico. Theyre swamping our border. Mexico can stop it. They have to stop it. Otherwise we wont be able to do business. Its a very simple thing. And i think they will stop t i think they want to do something. I think they want to make a deal. They sent their top people. Well see what happens today. We should know something. Weve seen a parade of Senate Republicans come out against the president s tariff threat. You break with him at your own peril. Even on an issue thats been Party Orthodoxy for the past few decades. Even the Top Republican in the house doesnt want to see these tariffs, but he basically signaled to his caucus that if you want to oppose the president ,off got to support him. Im not making this up. Here is what he told nbc news about the president imposing these tariffs. Nobody wants that to happen. Thats why i think from one aspect, if were all united going in, we can end up with no tariffs. Thats what we should be doing. Its undercutting and most likely to have a tariff if you undercut the president before going into negotiations. To be clear, would you push your members youre dealing in a hypothetical. So you got it . The party needs to unite behind the president s decision to threaten the idea of tariffs on mexico in order to make sure he doesnt impose tariffs on mexico. Then theres Chuck Schumers comments today, which makes you wonder if hes trying to goad the president by publicly calling him too chicken to go through with it. This is what american politics is today. I said yesterday that i dont believe that President Trump will follow through on his threat to impose tariffs on mexico. The president has a tendency for bluster. The president needs a way out of his bluster. I continue to believe that he will back off. That has been his m. O. You know what that means. Anyway, whatever happens, political ramifications will be huge, as he might say. Another transformational moment for the Republican Party, by the way, into something they havent been in generations. Its not 2019 in the Republican Party. It might be 1919. Protectionism, tariffs. We have a holly in the senate. Will we find a smoot . I thought you would like that one. Kristen welker. Gave me a little chuckle, smoot holly. And Howard Fineman is an nbc news analyst. Kristin, we are waiting with bated breath to see if something comes out. Can mike pence and mike pompeo cut a deal with the president across the atlantic . Reporter i think thats going to be very tough, chuck. I should tell you a moment ago, i got a text message from a Senior Administration official who confirms that that meeting is ongoing. Were going into about a little bit short of an hour and a half now. Will there be a deal . Based on my conversations, the expectations are very low, very low that thats going to happen because, of course, the president is overseas. Hes overseas with a number of top officials who work on immigration policy, Jared Kushner, steven miller, john bolton overseas with President Trump. Who is in the room . Mexican foreign minister, his delegation, secretary of state and the Vice President , of course, leading these talks as well as other top officials. I was speaking to an Administration Official and said what does a deal look like . What is it that you guys want to get . They go back to this talking point, chuck, which is we want the border to be secured but really skim on the details. Again, by all accounts its going to be very tough to get a deal this afternoon. And, as you point out, a mounting number of republicans speaking out against these tariffs but what are they actually prepared to do about it . Kristen, look at the people in this room right now. Mike pence, congressman and governor mike pence hated tariffs. Mark short, mike pompeo, again somebody not a fan of at least congressman mike pompeo wasnt. Kevin mcalean, im not going to pretend to know where he is on tariffs and the white House Counsel is in there to talk about the legality of all of this. Reporter rate. Thats what makes this odd. The people meeting with the mexicans are probably all sympathetic to the mexican governments point of view. Reporter i think thats right. Even Jared Kushner was supposed to President Trump making this threat to issue 5 tariffs on all mexican goods next monday if mexico doesnt do more to stem the flow of migrants. Youre absolutely right. The president is yet again on another issue, apart from his top advisers. Again that raises questions about how exactly they are going to be able to cut a deal with mexico. Mexican officials, by the way, chuck, saying look, they feel as though they have been cracking down on the flow of migrants crossing the border. Cdp out with new statistics saying 144,000 documented migrants crossed the border last month, a 13year high, chuck. I want to play for you from the mexican ambassador to build off to this point to seem to say you think this is a high number now, you aint seen nothing yet. Take a listen. We vowed mexicos efforts, an additional quarter million migrants could arrive at the u. S. Border in 2019. Slapping tariffs, along with the decision to cancel aid programs to the northern Central American countries could have a counterproductive effect and would not reduce migration flows. One would assume shes likely in this meeting as well. Is there anybody in the west wing that actual lly conquers wh the mexican point of view, you have no idea how bad it could be . Were not hearing a lot from them right now. This is a president who launched his president ial ambitions on this topic of immigration, selling to his supporter that he would build the wall, stem the tide. He will continue to double down on this and say again and again, youve got to do whatever it takes. The numbers today that Kristen Welker was just mentioning will make the president s resolve to not back away from this. He wants to see mexico do more. Its a not clear in my reporting what more looks like and how he would avoid the effects in that sound bite, that are talked about. If he goes ahead with these tariffs, things could actually get worse. Howard fineman, youre a Mitch Mcconnell watcher of sorts, being a louisville guy, at least as far as your university was concerned. Mcconnell is sending mcconnelllike signal, please dont do this, please dont do this, please dont do this, but is stopping short of fully threatening him. Mcconnells situation is even if the republicans in the senate abandon the president on this, mcconnell and the president can be sure that the house of representatives will not override a veto. Are we pretty sure about that . Im pretty sure about that. I think so, too, but im not 100 . Im pretty sure of that. Theres no other wing of the Republican Party. You said the ryan wing. There is no other wing. Theres the trump wing and republicans are basically going along for a wild ride in which the president is saying ultimately in states like michigan and ohio, which according to new reports are two of the states that will be most affected by the 5 or 10 mexican tariff, that cultural fear trumps economic fear. Thats ultimately what hes saying. Hes giving them steel tariffs and tariffs that they like but will take the risk on others. Whats happened to the Republican Party . Is it a protectionist party now or is it just a trump bypass for a few years . I think a lot of it has to do with how much trade power has been transferred to the president over the decades. If this were a question where congress had to affirmatively give him these tariffs he wouldnt get them. Two had been third supermajority in the house and senate in order to take away that power from him. Thats the problem. Republicans might be willing to take him on. Are they going to do what looks to them like a Suicide Mission . They dont get what they want, no tariffs, and they have to take on trump at the same time . Thats why theyre not going to have a fight. Kristen welker, do they at all care about the Senate Opposition right now, considering it does look like the house is with them on this or do they worry about it a little bit . I think they care about it, chuck. Look, you saw some republican senators, chuck grassley, come out on day one and say that he was opposed to this. And part of the concern internally here is that this threat was, to some extent, rushed out, that senators werent properly briefed. Thats why you have the early opposition that is now growing and mounting by the day. Again, does it cross that vetoproof threshold . That remains to be seen. You heard President Trump yesterday during that press conference with the british Prime Minister say republicans would be foolish to take any type of legislative action. Hes clearly trying to essentially dismiss any intraparty feud, chuck. I think its real. It sort of underscores the fact that they were not in concert with republican lawmakers on capitol hill before announcing this. Whats the likelihood, though, instead of a total cavein by the president and him not doing this, whats the likelihood . I think mcconnell has asked for can you delay till the end of the month . The other tactic with trump is buy a couple of weeks and after a couple of weeks he forgets hes angry about this. Absolutely, chuck. One thing we know about this president , he has a tendency for distraction. Thats why on an overseas trip you see him talking about everything except the state visit hes currently on. Theres a possibility of this delay. This is his signature issue. He really feels strongly about curb i curbing the string of migrants. On other issues i might be more convinced but not so much on this one. Ramesh, i want to jump on one jobs report, a did. P, private payroll people are reporting a disastrous may jobs number, something in the five digits rather than the six digits. If that does hit at the end of the week and these tariffs, does that rattle the Republican Party or no . I think that it would, particularly, of course, the question would be whether its sustained into another month and a month after that. Right. I think the political risks for this president are also its not just that he feels so exercised about the southern border. Its a big deal to a significant portion. He has made it a big deal to them. Right. He said this is what im going to do. And i do take him at his word in that he knows he has nothing to lose. And he has run out of ways to achieve anything on this when he first of all didnt use the two years republicans held to congress to cut the kind of deal where he could have maybe made a difference there and that he lost control of the house and hes run out of options. This is what he has got left. What should democrats do here . Do what schumer is doing, goad him into doing it . Theyll have to let him play it out. I think in a way, as dramatic and arguably unconstitutional as his threatened move is, because its taxation without representation, essentially, because congress doesnt get to vote, i think that the democrats are not do not have the upper hand on the immigration issue for all. They just dont. And this is whats defined the trump era. They cant really change it right now. And either trumps gamble, which is what this is on michigan, pennsylvania, ohio, wisconsin, et cetera, is going to work or its not going to work, there isnt really very much they can do. Kristen welker, when he talks about parents, child separation, he takes the pressure off the Democratic Party to have to worry about the migration crisis. Youre right about that. Obviously, its come under a lot of scrutiny right now, amid our own reporting that some of the attempts to reunitee families and children have been botched, particularly last summer. It does take the heat off the democrats. Chuck, just looking into a crystal ball of course, we dont know how this is all going to end up. But one scenario might be thats being discussed here is will that first tronch of tariffs go into effect monday and will they strike a type of deal before the second traunch goes into effect . Economic pain starts to be felt over time not immediately on monday. You talk about delaying, thats what that delay could potentially look like. Donald trump has been talking about slapping 25 tariffs and chinese goods for 15 years. Were getting close to the 25 number. Maybe he wants it for mexico too. Want to mention howard, youre sticking around. House Judiciary Committee working on keeping the momentum for impeachment going. Has it stalled . Joe biden is he playing defense today as his fellow democrats take him on over his record on abortion. Lets pass a strong, robust roe versus wade and enforce it all across this country. Its time to go on offense. E to. Wow. Plug that in for me. Whoa holy smokes oh wow and the all new silverado has more trim levels than any other pickup. Whoa laughter oh wow theres something for all of us. Its time to upgrade. Get 0 financing for 72 months. Or, get a total value of over 8700 on this allnew silverado. Find new roads at your local chevy dealer. I swibecause they let metual, customize my insurance. 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Make no mistake. We know exactly what path were on. We know exactly what actions we need to take and while that may take more time than some people want it to take, i respect their impatience. Its a beautiful thing and its important to our country. That new line she introduce there had, i respect their impatience. Welcome back. Thats House Speaker nancy pelosi, steadfast in her stance to hold up on impeachment proceedings. 59 democrats, about a quarter of their membership in the house, support the launch of an impeachment inquiry right now. Is t 19 of those made their decision after Robert Muellers public remarks last week. Grace nap dlnapolitano was adde after we made our list so shes not on here. Some thought we would be in the hundreds after that memorial day recess. It has been more of a trickle. That raises the question, it Robert Mueller didnt cause a ground swell of support for impeachment inside the House Democratic caucus, will anything . Democratic congresswoman joins me now, house Judiciary Committee and one of the democrats who support an impeachment inquiry. Good to see you. Thank you for having me. Do you feel are you surprised that there wasnt a greater number willing to go public about impeachment . Here we are, one week removed from Robert Muellers, at the time, stunning public remarks. Chuck, no, i really wasnt. To begin an impeachment proceeding, process, is a major undertaking. For me as a former Law Enforcement officer i say it along with the majority of my colleagues in the very begin g beginning, let wait to see what is in the Mueller Report and kind of take our direction from that. Well, after reading the report, i said two months ago and still say today i believe there is enough in that report to show that the president clearly obstructed justice, tried to prevent others from cooperating, persons around him lied, theyve been indicted. I believe theres more than enough right now to begin those proceedings. But, look, i have the utmost respect for our speaker. Shes the speaker. She has a lot more to consider. She has to look at the Bigger Picture than whats going on in the Judiciary Committee. So im not really surprised at the number of people who have not come out publicly. Publicly. We have private conversations, a lot of people are frustrated. They are impatient. They feel the way that i do. But let them figure it out. We want to get this right. And so but for me, i believe we have enough and were ready. Jim clyburn was implying that impeachment feels inevitable. Youre not ready now but youre sort of youre getting close. Are you one of those that believe and i know he walked back the comment. Do you believe its going to happen . Its just not there yet . Or this is a 50 50 proposition . Let me say when you read the Mueller Report, clearly the president , multiple times either obstructed justice or attempted to obstruct justice. We know right now, chuck, that he is continuing to obstruct justice by not allowing those around him and those who are former staffers to obey lawful subpoenas that have been issued that prevent us from doing the investigations that the American People expect us to do. Now, you know, i heard what the majority whip said. I believe if we stay on this path and justins to be obstructed and were unable to provide the oversight and do the investigations we need to do, i dont see how impeachment is not inevitable. Congresswoman, how would i assume youre going to run for reelection. I dont want to make assumptions but assuming you run for reelection a year from now and youre out there campaigning and youve not opened an impeachment inquiry, do you think thats a tougher thing for you to explain to your constituents or do you think i think a major part of what were doing right now, right, is to make sure that the american public, people in my district and districts all over this country, understand exactly what the impeachment process means, what it involves and really lay out the case to them. We know they dont have time to read all 400 and something pages of the Mueller Report. Its up to us to lay the case out for them. It was so significant for the American People to hear bob mueller in his own voice explain some of the most significant portions of that report. Right. But, you know, i keep an open dialogue with the people in my district. Of course, theyre asking, when are you all going to begin impeachment . Some are asking, can you explain what that means . Im just keeping the lines of Communications Open for them so theyll understand, those who are in favor. But clearly understand those who are not quite there yet. So we can all move forward and deal with some of the issues, really, that we have been sent to congress to deal with, Like Health Care and other issues that the other American People worry about. Im curious, does it matter to you that polls are showing that a majority arent there yet on impeachment . One in michigan showing a majority in michigan. Swing state where right now democrats are polling very well against trump but a majority dont want impeachment . In florida that number is higher of people who dont want impeachment. Does that have an impact on you at all . Look, youre in the swingiest of swing states. Yeah, i am. And if somebody came to you and said impeachment is going to mean the difference between florida going red or blue and starting impeachment is going to push it red, would that have an impact on you . Chuck, you know, i wish that i had the luxury for me to make every decision as a former Law Enforcement officer, nows a member of congress, based on how popular or unpopular that decision would be. I dont have that luxury. And as i said earlier, when you read the Mueller Report it is clear to me that the president abused his power, obstructed justice and tried to get others to do the same. We have an obligation to address that and take the action given to us by the constitution. It would have been great if Robert Mueller had drawn a prosecutorial decision but he didnt. I think he laid out the case that its congress responsibility. And he has given it to us to act and we need to do that. By the way you think you sound like bob mueller wasnt clear enough. I had somebody on my panel sunday say he took a mulligan and hit it into the lake. What i said a couple of months ago on a confidential phone call i was on with the Democratic Caucus was i wish he had been clear but he did leave us, my words, bread crumbs to follow. And so it would have been great if he had drawn all the conclusions. He didnt. We know in our hearts what the right decision is and we have work to do. Congresswoman val demings from central florida, thank you for sharing your views. I appreciate it. Thank you. Up ahead, joe biden is being attacked from all sides today. Republicans are hitting him on that plagairism charge and President Trump having an interview with his old apprentice star peers morgan. Prince charles, he doesnt have to worry about that in theory. Thats what impressed me maybe the most. Eory thats what impressed me maybe the most Award Winning interface. Award winning design. Award winning engine. The volvo xc90. The most awarded luxury suv of the century. The volvo xc90. As a doctor, i agree with cdc guidance. 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Are you ready to vote tomorrow, michigan . Some accused Hillary Clinton of taking michigan for granted in 2016. Democratic candidates are focusing on the state early this time around. I wanted to come to detroit. After this, im going to lansing because i wanted to talk about another economic plan for america. Michigan wasnt the only state with some new polling for 2020 out today. Check out these numbers from texas. Joe biden, the only democrat to lead President Trump in hypothetical matchups in texas. Warren trails by one, buttigieg by two. Were back with more mtp daily after this. Mtp daily after this applebees new loaded fajitas. Now thats eatin good in the neighborhood. When it comes to type 2 diabetes, are you thinking about your heart . Well, im managing my a1c, so i should be all set. Actually, youre still at risk for a fatal heart attack or stroke. Thats where jardiance comes in. 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Joe bidens campaign may have thought their day was going to be about cleaning up one major mistake, after admitting that climate plans had been taken from other sources and not cited properly. It was an actual plagairism scandal that derailed his president ial bid in 88. That isnt what republicans are talking about biden about right now and its not what democrats are in attack mode. 2020 opponents are going after him for a separate issue, one first reported by our own heidi pryzbylla. Bidens campaign confirmed to nbc news that biden still supports the Hyde Amendment. That didnt take long to fire up bidens 2020 opponents about the issue. I will continue to fight to rip them down and empower women to have better access to contraceptive care, health care and kind of things that help them live healthy lives where they control their destinies. This is not about politics. Its about whats right. The Hyde Amendment should not be american law. A woman in the United States of america, no matter how much money she has or doesnt have, should be able to plan the size of her family and deal with her personal health issues. Harris, gillibrand, orourke, sanders, diblasio all tweeted their support for repealing the Hyde Amendment. Joe bidens the Hyde Amendment is something that has had general support over the years. Here is a poll from 2016. While a majority of democratic voters believe that medicaid funds should be allowed to pay for abortions, 55 of democrats said yes, 37 said no, among all voters, this has been a majority issue the other way, 58 against it, 36 said no. But boy, it allowed every other democrat to basically say look, im not joe biden. Because this is a different context in which were having this conversation than any previous debate, arguably going back to the inception of roe, with abortion being such an divisive issue on the left. Hyde is being seen as one part of how you codify roe. If the court is going to try to take away roe what can we do legislative to codify roe . Theyre making this a litmuchlt s test so joe biden stands apart from everybody else on this in that he still supports it. To his credit, its the same position he has always held. Its just surprising in this current environment and also a lot of these activists, including the aclu, planned parenthood, emilys list. Go down the list. They thought they had gotten him to flip on this issue. Garrett haake, i said his greatest asset is that he has been in politics for 40 years and his greatest liability, he has been in the mainstream of Democratic Politics for 40 years. Is the campaign uncomfortable with how today has gone . Ill get to the whole plaigerism charge in a moment. Where the rest of the field is is striking. Voters care about this issue a great deal and this has already penetrated since heidis story came out this morning. They need to come out and talk about an issue. This is an issue of his faith and its not a cleanup. They have to figure out how to talk about this going forward. In terms of the Democratic Party rather than the plagiarism issue, its more stable ground to fight on. I want to play a quote for you yesterday. Number one roe v. Wade is the law of the land. Woman has a right to choose. And if this court, if this court were to overrule roe v. Wade and i was president , i would push to make it legislative veto. Is that enough to sort of keep the activists who are, as you say, i think because of the moment were in, whats happened in states like alabama and missouri theres less tolerance in some activists groups for joe biden to moderate his position on abortion. We shall soon find out. In my reporting, this is one of the things that was upside down to me. Theyre saying they want to codify roe but the easiest way to do that is to overturn hyde. Hes saying im not there yet. You get a feeling hes waiting to see how big the blowback is and then hell say ill sign whatever passed. Access is already at risk. If access is at risk then well do t a lot of democrats say were already there. Garrett i want to go to the pl pl plagiarism issue. You expected him to have a bare bones operation, volunteers. Joe biden has his name on a Public Policy institute at the university of pennsylvania. He has been preparing to run for president at least for the last 18 months, perhaps longer than that in different ways. Why are they cutting and pasting Climate Change proposals at the last minute . That, to me, seems to be is this a sloppy campaign . Are they not up and running . Whats going on . Reporter look, this was obviously a Junior Varsity moment for this campaign in what should be very much the varsity level squad. Its embarrassing. It is a staff level mistake. I think its important to keep the context in mind. Were not talking about 1988 or 87 technically when words from Bobby Kennedy and others were coming out of joe bidens mouth. Hes not sitting at the word processor typing this out. But, you know, look this is embarrassing. This is not what you want to be talking about. Youre the frontrunner by 20 points. To have this kind of thing take away essentially, put a cap on the day of talking about an issue that is really of importance to democratic primary voters to me, chuck, the climate issue is, if not the biggest single shift for voters between 2016 and now. This went from an ivory tower liberal elite issue to something that the core base cares about. Joe bidens team put together a robust plan and then tripped over themselves in the rollout of it, by not having footnotes over t you and i would have failed a College Paper because of this. We lost at least a day on t theres not a plagiarism caucus who will abandon joe biden but if cheating joe becomes a donald Trump Twitter nickname it hits at the electability argument. Joe biden is the safe harbor, isnt the risk. Now theyre like do they run a sloppy campaign . That, to me, is the danger of this story, it actually introduces the idea what if he is not the most stable electable candidate . What if theyve got a theyre not ready for this . In this field theyve seen the trend where success begets success. If you appear to be doing poorly, your numbers slide. Its so fluid. If your whole argument is that you are an electable juggernaut who can take down the sky and youre the only one who cant, you have to act like a juggernaut all the time. That means you cant have these kind of mistakes. Junior varsity line. Heidi and i were impressed with that one. Well done there. Garrett haake, good to see you, sir. S a former Junior Varsity player. I hope to make the squad. Heidi pryzbyla thank you. 2020 democrats distancing themselves from frontrunner joe biden. And tune in tonight, speaking of somebody who is all in on going after biden. Elizabeth warren joins all in with chris hayes for a live town hall event. Elizabeth warren live frindiana tonight at 8 00 p. M. Eastern. Im all in. Are you . M. Eastern im all in are you . Its a beautiful piece of land. So why havent you started building . Tylers off to college. And moms getting older. And eventually we would like to retire. Td ameritrade can help you build a plan for today and tomorrow. Come with a goal. Leave with a plan. Td ameritrade. If old sphow will theyense helps know i worked hard . , ive gotta make stuff harder. There, thats hard. Theyre americas biopharmaceutical researchers. Pursuing lifechanging cures in a country that fosters innovation here, they find breakthroughs. Like a way to fight cancer by arming a patients own tcells. Because its not just about the next breakthrough. 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And were developing ultrafastcharging technology for evs. At bp, we see possibilities everywhere. So we can all keep advancing. Plagiarizeplagiarismnow its actually called extreme weather. Were confused, too. Weather changes both ways, whatever that means. Then there was his dustup with meghan markle, duchess of sussex, over whether he did or did not call her nasty, which he actually did say on tape. What happens is they talked about nasty. We were talking about nasty, she was nasty to me. And thats okay for her to be nasty. Its not good for me to be nasty to her and i wasnt. Did you get a chance to talk to her . I think shes doing very well. Denying word nasty, i think he said it six times in that sentence. Im still confused. Then there was the matter of the uss john mccain. I did not know anything about it. Im not sure it happened. Someone said they had to paint the ship and they have tarpallins all over the place. I hear it is fake news. Maybe it is and maybe it isnt. The painting thin is new to us here. The u. S. Military confirmed that it was a white house staffer that made the request for the ship to be kept out of sight for the recent visit. Mulvany came on the show and said it. I did not even get to the tape where mr. Trump said nobody knew about vietnam when it was happening. S happening. Your brain changes as you get older. But prevagen helps your brain with an ingredient originally discovered. In jellyfish. In clinical trials, prevagen has been shown to improve shortterm memory. Prevagen. Healthier brain. Better life. woman when you have the support of a probiotic and the gastroenterologists who developed it. Wherever you go. vo align naturally helps to soothe your occasional digestive upsets 24 7 with a unique strain of bacteria you cant get anywhere else. woman you could say align puts the pro in probiotic. So where you go, the pro goes. Oh. vo go with align. The pros in digestive health. My time is thin, but so is my lawn. Now theres scotts thickr lawn 3in1 solution. With a soil improver seed and fertilizer to feed now yard time is our time. This is a scotts yard. Award winning interface. Award winning design. Award winning engine. The volvo xc90. The most awarded luxury suv of the century. [ slurps ] gwhos a good boy . Its me. Me, me, me. Hey guys youre gonna want to get in on this. I know how to those guys in here. Lets pause the internet on their devices. Wohhh . Huhhhh . [ grumbling ] all sausages mmm, mmmm. Bon appetite. Make time for what matters. Pause your wifi with xfinity xfi and see the secret life of pets 2 in theaters. In these times, democrats can no more keep a promise to take us back to the 2000s or the 1990s than conservatives can keep a promise to take us back to the 1950s. We can only look forward. Time for the lid. Democrats were already trying to create a contrast between themselves and joe biden. That was over the weekend. That was before todays news about the Vice President and his continued support for the Hyde Amendment. So howard, joe biden is, weve been through this year. This is his strength and weakness is the same thing. This long track record in american politics. You know what youre going to get with joe biden. And the democrats, i feel like, have been trying to figure out how to chip away at him. Theyve been trying to do night nice way. Does the nice start to go away . We are inevitably entering the pinata phase here. Joe biden has been stably ahead in all the polls for a number of months. Lets head into the debate season. People are now looking for contrasts and ways to take them down. Joan is the person and secondarily Bernie Sanders who have the most to lose in the series of debates. And people are looking at ways to distinguish among the different subcategories of candidates. But also joe biden. He is kind of like, he represents the Democratic Party to the extent there is somebody who sort of institutionally represents the party. Everybody else is arguing for change. His trick has been the difficulties hes to be an institutionalist and change at the same time. Thats the hardest thing he has had to do. Especially at his age and given all of his experience. I want you to hear it from this voter. Ask about joe biden. Take listen. Biden is a good default, i guess. I wish he was more progressive rather than, rather than so moderate. He is good except i dont like this amendment were talking about right now. In a general, no. But in the primary, i would not vote for him in the primaries anyway. That seems to be, he wont be the candidate for some in the primaries. But that is his strength is what she said. Ill vote for him in the general. Is that a strength or a weakness for biden . I think it is both. What is so glaring is that it illuminates something that was howard was talking about. This idea that joe biden is campaigning on what was lost since president obama left office. A rolling back the clock. Then you have all the other candidates running for a new Democratic Party. A new future there. And i think what joe biden has said really illuminates what many feel about him. That he is out of step with todays Democratic Party. Which has shifted left. We saw that with the type of candidates elected in many places. I think thats where it gets dicey for him. I think there are some things he has to stick to his guns on. He cant show he will get pushed around. On there are some things. I dont know if thats right. Yes, he is standing alone among democrats but he is standing with an awful lot of democraters voters. Those numbers are three years old but a third of the democrats. Thats right. And it is not necessarily a deal breaker. I think this is what another issue which puts him in a better position for the general election. The problem is, at the same time, he is undermining the electricitiability by the way hes going about it. Having to appear to endorse getting rid of it a few years ago and then coming back and saying hes still for it. That raises the question, ohoh, are we going to have more gaffes with this campaign . This is the third president ial campaign. The other two were pretty bad. Is there sort of like, is biden protected on the gaffe front by trump . Unfairly, no. You dont think so . No. Everybody has to answer. The president doesnt even, he talks both ways. Were talking about the two different universes here. The Democratic Party universe. The answer is no. Trump is irrelevant to the question of who will be picked to take him on in that sense. One other thing. I talked about kentucky a lot. Western pennsylvania is my home and i know in those counties, where there is a strong rural catholic vote. The jack murtha candidate. Yes. The fact that joe biden will stick to his guns on the Hyde Amendment. Not only doesnt hurt him. It helps him. The problem is getting from here to there. Thats interesting. It does feel like the gloves are somewhat off the democrats when it comes to joe biden. Finger by finger. If its wednesday, you know what that means. There is a new chuck todd cast. Get it now. You get a new preview by my buddy. Its a good listen. Thats all for tonight. Well be back tomorrow. More meet the press daily. We have a lot including this new ad that donald trump might actually see because it is running on fox news. The republican prosecutors alleging donald trump committed crimes. Later, ill be joined by a conservative who actually left the gop over donald trump. George will is here for a very special conversation. And then we go live to indiana where Elizabeth Warren is campaigning in trump country. Chris hayes is on the beat for that later tonight. We begin the long shad over bob mueller. A Public Servant with such a sterling reputation. Such integrity, such influence which many say was e