I think we found one time over a threeweek period that any of the nature candidates. Voters do care more about health care, but i think the point that the democratic leadership is making is that you can walk and chew gum. There are certain committees that are designated to handle issues that if this was an impeachment referral, and we dont know if it was yet, there was language in there that read as if mueller intended for congress to weigh these issues of obstruction, and that is their statutory duty to do so. And so i think that from a messaging standpoint, you have Many Democrats like sherry bustos, head of the dpoc, saying, for the love of god focus on health care and infrastructure, but you have the Committee Chairs that feel compelled in their duty. This is yet another infrastructure week that ended well. There goes infrastructure week again. By the end of the week, nancy pelosi was accusing the president s attorney general of being a criminal. Is there any possible way they work out the bob mueller issue in the next three weeks or is the white house strategy like we said, go pound sand, democrats, and tryo extract it out of us, because in their mind, the trump admi there is any political price to pay right now for not cooperating. I think thats right, there is no indication that and, therefore, no indication that bewere going to see a big infrastructure bill. Although you cant rule anything out. Conservatives arent going to spend 2 trillion, thats the problem. Reporter the white house is digging in on this issue. I spoke to steven groves, one of the top advisers here, that sort of reiterated that point. Look, they think the allegations by nancy pelosi that the attorney general was lying was beneath the dignity of their ofr office, so they are fighting back forcefully. I asked the president if he is going to exert executive privilege to keep don mcgahn from testifying. The president said were going to discuss that next week, but again, saying overnight to fox news that its done, he doesnt want anyone else to testify. As the president prepares to head out on the campaign trail, chuck, i think he sees this as something that fires up his base as a political strength. He gets to say hes in battle. Donna, whats left for the democrats to do . A contempt citation. Im sorry, nobody cared when republicans held over in contempt, right . You thought it was going to be a big moment. Mueller was like, whatever. Im still in the minority, but this is why ive actually argued from the beginning impeachment proceedings. Because impeachment is a process. Not the articles, but you develop the record so that at the end of it, then you have the ability to at least hold the president and his cronies accountable. And without that, the public is never going to be educated. If the public thought it was just an impeachment process for congress, right now they think its a removal for office. Its the democrats responsibility to educate them. Kristen welker, thank you. Glad it didnt rain on you. This has been a crazy spring. Up ahead, how far did the fbi go to uncover possible russian collusion . Were reporting on a covert operation on the Trump Campaign that made its way into the white house. Plus, remember when a traffic jam was worthy of being called a political scandal . Ah, the white house days of political scandal. You should be mad at forced camaraderie. And you should be mad at tech that makes things worse. But youre not mad, because you have e trade, whos tech makes life easier by automatically adding technical patterns on charts and helping you understand what they mean. Dont get mad. Get e trades simplified technical analysis. With uncontrolled moderatetosevere eczema,n who got an awful skin condition. 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Or your giant nephews and their giant dad. Or a horse. Or a horses brother, for that matter. The room for eight, 9,000 lb towing ford expedition. Title x for affordable natbirth control and Reproductive Health care. The Trump Administration just issued a nationwide gag rule. This would dismantle the title x ten program. It means that physicians cannot tell a patient about their Reproductive Health choices. We have to be able to use our medical knowledge to give our patients the information that they need. The number one rule is do no harm, and this is harm. We must act now. Learn more. Text titlex to 22422 i was happy to see on the front page of the New York Times for the first time where they were talking about spying and they were talking about spying on my campaign. Thats a big difference between the way theyve been covering, but thats a big story. Thats a story bigger than watergate, as far as im concerned. Welcome back. You heard it there. President trump seizing on a new story from the New York Times, using it as ammunition for his unfounded claim for spying on his campaign. The times is reporting that in the early investigation of trump and russia, they sent an investigator posing as a Research Assistant to meet with George Papadopoulos in london. She was set to meet with an informant for papadopoulos. That informant was cambridge professor Steven Hopper whose involvement was previously known. But hopper met with papadopoulos and both campaign ads, in fact, hopper was in the white house in 2017 meeting with peter navaro. The fbi is investigating mr. Hoppers work and is investigating agents of mr. Papadopoulos activities. If youre wondering where the genesis of this story is coming from, joining me is someone who knows how the fbi conducts this investigation, a former attorney and now an msnbc contributor. This story tells us a few things we did know, steve hopper, papadopoulos assistant. When i found out that helper, before going into a meeting at the white house before being invited to the white house, is letting the fbi know he was invited to the white house. If i was trump i would be like, oh, my god, they were spying on me in the white house. Why shouldnt you feel uncomfortable about that . You should ask questions. Its probably one of the most risky things the fbi does. You have to monitor them carefully, they have to check in with you. If theyre acting at your direction, fine, if theyre freelancing, not so fine. I think its appropriate for the Inspector General to figure out if its appropriate. But i can tell you about the New York Times article, if you want. I do, and im curious about it. How complete do you feel like it is . It tells part of the story, but heres a good analogy. Lets say the dea is working an important case against a violent and dangerous drug dealer and theyre working it because an informant sort of told them where to look and who was doing what. The goal for the dea would be to remove the informant from the occasion and put an officer or an agent in that persons place. You have a professional, they can testify in court but theres some pop culture terms like a Donnie Brasko . Its not good for me because ive not seen it. A moderate type informant. He worked for the fbi but he ingratiated himself. You want to get the informant out and you want Law Enforcement to work the case. In terms of New York Times reporting, it makes perfect sense to me that the two people who originally had contact with papadopoulos would be ultimately removed from the equation and you put an investigator, a trained Law Enforcement official, into the relationship. Thats actually the proper thing to do. Bill barr keeps calling it spying. Hes the attorney general, so this has now put a Law Enforcement figure on top of that word. Is there any part of this that you would say is spying . No, this is a tried and true investigative technique. The fbi doesnt spy. To me spying means something extralegal, outside of the legal process. What they are doing is running a predicated investigation. Now, theyre running it with an informant which, as i said earlier would they have to get judicial information on the informant . No. But they would have a rigorous set of internal guidelines with a lot of vetting, careful vetting, to make sure the informant is doing a couple of things, being truthful and following the rules. And that is something that inspectors general look at. They want to make sure that federal Law Enforcement agencies are properly running their informants. It can be risky. But the notion that you would introduce an officer into the relationship is actually something that should give mr. Trump comfort. Instead of having an informant work the relationship, youre having a professional work the relationship. So a lot of this is going to be predicated by, was there probable cause . It struck me just today with the putin phone call at a time when the decision was made to open a counterintelligence investigation on the president himself, and i know im in a separate aspect of this. Do you see an incident like this, the president s calling it a russian hoax with putin who is it a fact that they interfered in the election, is that something that ends up looking like probable cause to folks that are in counterintelligence . Its absolutely concerning. They would need probable cause if they wanted a warrant. But you wouldnt need probable cause necessarily just to open an investigation, to do a preliminary investigation. And by the way, you can use informants to obtain probable cause. So on the surface, i dont see anything improper, but its always okay, its always smart for the Inspector General to make sure were playing by the rules. This Inspector General report, look, the president being so happy by this New York Times article, there will be some people that think, oh, is there something being cherry picked here . Do you look at this report and feel like its a fair reading of whats coming . I look at the New York Times report and it strikes me as a normal traditional Law Enforcement operation. Remember, russia interfered in the election. The fbi didnt disclose a word of that before the election. If they really wanted to get President Trump as he seems to think they did, wouldnt they have disclosed it before the election . As the Clinton Campaign likes to point out, the fbi talked about one investigation before the election, not his. Without picking thats the point. What i see happening is that they introduce the Law Enforcement officer to the relationship which actually gives the fbi better control over whats happening. It takes the informant and the diplomat out, and that should give the president some comfort. I doubt he looks at it as comfort. I doubt he does, too. Chuck rosenberg, i have to leave it there, but before i go, i want to promote something youre doing. Dont miss the First Episode of the oath. Its chucks podcast. Subscribe today. The comey interview in particular very good. While youre at it, dont forget to prescribe to the chuck toddcast. Up ahead, forget podcasts, weve got some burning tv. Before he was a president ial candidate, he was a Public Access tv star. Bernies world. How sanders past could be a problem now for his future. R hi. So no matter what, youre guaranteed to have a perfect drive. [laughter] vo go national. Go like a pro. See what i did there . I have one kid in each branch of the military, but im command central. 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And a dressing fit for a goddess. Oh and every ingredient is 100 clean. Come taste what a salad should be. And for your next event big or small, try panera catering. Panera. Food as it should be. A 2020 vision. Bernie sanders old issues are being treated as new again. Who knows about cocaine . Anyone ever seen cocaine . Yes. No. Hold it, one at a time. What about cocaine . Good thing, bad thing . That was then burlington mayor Bernie Sanders on his Public Access program in the late 80s. Thats just one of the intriguing stories from sanders past. That was actually reported during his last president ial run. That is now popping up again, like his conservative voting record on guns and his honeymoon in the soviet union. You know what i would love to think . Sometime in the future, i would like to see families, your mothers, your dads and maybe yourselves go to the soviet union and learn about that country and people from there come to here. But unlike the last time, voters are more than likely to put sanders past record under a microscope. At this point in 2015, sanders trailed Hillary Clinton by 42 points. This time hes considered one of the front runners. And there are many more candidates to choose from with the frontrunners target on his back, the sanders baggage from his past could weigh a bit heavily. Just a reminder, his message may be similar, but 2020 is going to be very different for Bernie Sanders than it was in 2016 because of that target. Well be back with more on that and more 2020 after the break. R announcer people with type 2 diabetes are excited about the potential of onceweekly ozempic®. In a study with ozempic®, a majority of adults lowered their blood sugar and reached an a1c of less than seven and maintained it. Oh under seven . And you may lose weight. In the same oneyear study, adults lost on average up to 12 pounds. Oh up to 12 pounds . 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Some side effects can lead to dehydration, which may worsen kidney problems. I discovered the potential with ozempic®. Oh oh oh ozempic® ask your Healthcare Provider today about onceweekly ozempic®. Were finally back out in our yard, but so are they. Scotts turf builder triple action. It kills weeds, prevents crabgrass and feeds so grass can thrive, guaranteed. Our backyard is back. This is a scotts yard. I happen to believe that our trade policies over the years have been a disaster for workers in this country. If you had the job loss as a result of nafta which joe voted for, joe is a friend of mine, and were going to have this policy discussion in a very civil way. But joe voted for nafta, he voted for pntr with china. Add those two trade policies together, youre probably talking about the loss of 4 million jobs. Welcome back. That was Bernie Sanders hitting fellow president ial candidate joe biden on trade last night. Msnbc chris hayes. The 2020 campaign is shaping up quite a bit differently for Bernie Sanders, because this time people are taking him as a potential nominee. Political experts are back to talk some 2020, heidi, don na ad michael. Its funny what seems new to people. We went through those tv shows at n brbc news four years ago. They were crickets of interest. We understand at the time that his going to soviet union and the gun issue didnt get the same attention. Hillary clinton tried to go after him. It all looks different this time. Were trying to take him more seriously. I think last time we wrote some of those stories we did this work, and this is sort of on the idea that we didnt. It just seemed to matter less. It just seemed to matter less. I had a question today about his gun record. Especially now with young voters, i think there is every reason we should write that story again, because a lot of those young voters who are now powering that movement dont know about that record. So those stories will be written and theyll be elevated in a way that they werent in the last cycle. You know, don, i find what bernie did with biden interesting just like how i found what biden did a few weeks ago. Bernie and biden really need each other right now. I think theyre their best asset which, if they have this fight, there is no oxygen for anybody else, and more importantly, they neutralize the issue that i think is the achilles heel for both of them. Their age. Thats true, and i think the fight they each have waged in different ways against the president really sets them up, and then nobody gets to talk about the rest of the field. Heres the challenge, i think, for bernie. Hes got a lot of other people down there both pulling away at his natural base that are not the same as biden. And so hes got to distinguish himself, and i think well see, but there are some things that are being elevated now, like this gun issue, that really didnt have any resonance in the 2016 campaign, and this campaign is going to be all about that. Welcome to 2019 where two candidates in their 70s are rehashing issues from the 90s. This is a reminder that these are very, very old candidates. Putin is very grade school. Thats right. And energetic in the party right now. Whats crucial in the Republican Party is looking at the split. Everything in the Democratic Party is younger and not these guys. I was reminded looking at those things, there is some sanders supporters who want to relitigate 2016 and said, if he would have been the nominee, he would have beaten trump. I look at some of those, and i dont mean to assume that i think voters would react in certain ways, but how many of you want to go to the soviet union in 1987 . I mean, you know, i think they would have hammered and sickled him to death. You see where this is going. This is the same thing that would have happened in 2016, which is that he lines up so perfectly with the label they put on every single democrat. That he honeymooned in the soviet union, and there was video of him today running around shirtless doing shots with a bunch of russians. Its the only way they do shots in russia, apparently. Shirtless. Donald trump is the cartoon image of a plutocrat, Bernie Sanders is the cartoon of a liberal. You understand that republicans want him as a nominee. For democrats, that is why that vote that bernie got in 2016 is split in a lot of different ways. There was not the kind of focus and were going to have that in this campaign. There was a posting today of an interesting story about Kamala Harris. I think we were all thinking this, and yet she had an incredible moment with barr that i think served her well, but she is trying to find what is going to be her nonprosecutorial thing, right . Whats going to be her issue that isnt about holding the president accountable . Well, i think that there is you know, the problem for her in terms of defining herself, but i do think that this campaign is going to be a campaign of a lot of different moments for candidates, and the question is how much they can hold onto, and for kamala, its interesting, because when joe biden got into the race, you also saw these polls come out about where the black vote is lined up, and its not necessarily lined up yet behind Kamala Harris or cory booker for that matter. Some of that was the same way with clinton and obama, in fairness. Once obama proved he could win, something changed. I do think shes got you know, i agree with you about these viral moments but shes got to find an issue. Black voters didnt vote for barack obama just because of the color of his skin, and theyre not going to do that today, especially today. Shes got to give them something to line up behind. Lets face it, joe biden has done the legwork. He was obamas wing man. Hes got many, many allies in the critical first voting state of south carolina, and so its unclear that when you said yet, i dont know that it will happen unless there are those issues that bring black voters over. Michael steele, the president is at 45 or 46 . Is it resilient or not enough . I think its extremely resilient. It is proven resilient in the face of gaffes, misstatements, statements of fact. John mccain stuff. Its been incredibly resilient can it grow . Its a pretty hard floor and he grows by subtraction. He grows by taking votes away from the democratic nominee. He cant get a mandate by himself, but he can make the other guy unacceptable, or other woman. Heidi, donna and michael, thank you. Up ahead, my interview with bridget kelly. Plus, why im obsessed with a swarm of bees. Obsessed with a swarm of bees. You might take something for your heart. Or joints. But do you take something for your brain. With an ingredient originally discovered in jellyfish, prevagen has been shown in Clinical Trials to improve shortterm memory. Prevagen. Healthier brain. Better life. What is that . Uh mine, why . Its just that its. Lavender. Yes it is, its for men but i like the smell of it laughs youre having one more bite no one more bite kraft. For the win win. The 2020 truth that really stings. Michael bennett. Michael bennett. Booker. Buttigieg. Biden, bernie, buttigieg, beto, booker, bennett, maybe bullock and de blasio. See what i did there. The 2020 candidates are swarming with bees. Theyre underrepresenting our candidate names. It has to stop. English, its a great language with the best words. But if you look closer, youll discover something bleak. A brouhaha. A big, bad, brewing brouhaha. A balanced budget. B. Sure, it starts off with one or two, then suddenly there are more. Its time for a fresh start. Choose q, x and z in 2020, bringing you great words like quiche and xylophone and z zanzibar. Right for scrabble, right for america. All right, and if you think thats bad, dont let me get started on the js. Im looking at you, joe, john, john, jay and julian. What . . laughing what . . D julian what . what . [crash] what . haha, it happens. And if youve got cutrate car insurance, paying for this could feel like getting robbed twice. So get allstate. And be better protected from mayhem. Like me. If you have a garden you know, weeds are lowdown little scoundrels. Draw the line with roundup. The sure shot wand extends with a protective shield to target weeds precisely and kill them right down to the root. Roundup brand. Trusted for over 40 years. Mr. Christy, you are a bully, and the days of you calling me a liar and destroying my life are over. The truth will be heard, and for the former governor, that truth will be unescapable regardless of lucrative Television Deals or even future campaigns. Welcome back. That was bridget kelly. Shes the former deputy chief of staff for now former new jersey governor Chris Christy not holding back on the feelings of her former boss. That was made after a judge sentenced her for the new jersey political scandal that became known in the press as bridgegate. She is appealing her conviction in federal court. Bridget kelly, thank you for coming on. Thank you for having me. Let me start with something you said in that statement after the hearing. You said essentially that Chris Christy was lying. Whats he lying about . His time frame in knowing about the traffic study. He was told about it by me in august of 2013. And then seven people under oath during the trial testified to his knowledge prior, too. So there is a lot of things that hes, you know, had a very forgetful memory about. Why couldnt if you informed him in august, how did that not what prevented that from getting established as fact am your case and in bill be beronis case . I testified in court as did bill beroni as did others. It just didnt resonate, i guess, but it was the truth, its how it happened, and we laid out a time frame and a timeline, and that was how it went. And, unfortunately, the seven people that even testified stating that the governor had knowledge of the traffic study all are people who have done very well by the governor after their testimony. I want to put governor christie put out a statement again after your comments, and heres what he said. Its worded very interestingly. As ive said before, i had no knowledge of this scheme prior to or during these lane realign mts, and had no role in authorizing them. No credible evidence was ever presented to contradict that fact. Anything said to the contrary is simply untrue. If everything was true, why add, no credible evidence was ever presented to contradict that fact. Another piece of evidence is mr. Christ christies cell phone, correct . They couldnt find it, and then they found it. Its remaining in a desk drawer somewhere. Im not sure where. And the government was never able to go in there and find out what Text Messages were in there . To my knowledge, no. If what you did if the governor had said, yes, i ordered this, would you and mr. Beroni have committed a crime . When i was told about the Port Authority was thinking about doing this and was going to be doing this it never dawned on me that it could be a crime. Why would they do that . So when i told the governor that the Port Authority was doing that, he was planning to do this traffic study but there was going to be some residual effects with that traffic problems being one of them, it seemed like a normal action for the Port Authority to study this issue. So for me, it was one of many things that i ran either by the governor or by his chief of staff, kevin odowd. So ones i ran it by them and they didnt seem to have a problem, i kind of thought it was a done issue. And here we are. Five and a half years later and im looking at time in prison. Why are you going to prison . Why is bill barone going to prison . We shouldnt be. Other people should be in more trouble than we are. We were convicted of nine crimes to begin with. And seven of which remain. Two were thrown out by the Third Circuit court of appeals. And we are still appealing to the United StatesSupreme Court and hope to hear on that. What did you do wrong . The easy answer is that i should have not written emails and Text Messages in haste. When interpreted by others, this is where i am. Let me stop you there. When you see your Text Messages that say, i feel badly about the kids, i guess. Chuck, i absolutely, i am happy to answer this. It is all banlt we are david. There was more to this prior to these Text Messages. The time for traffic messages which i have owned from day one was giving david back words that he used. It was a quick way to tell him that i had spoken to those that i had to in trenton. If could i rewrite it and write time for a traffic study in ft. Lee, i would like to. What would i do differently . I wouldnt trust or stay in a situation that was as unhealthy as my time, and i love my career. It was a very unhealthy situation. I worked for a bully. When youre a single mom with four kids, youre not looking to rock any boats. I did love my career. But looking back now, i trusted way too many people. Do you think governor christie was ethical in did you believe he was ethical and acted ethically before this incident . I might have had a big title but i did not really have a lot of, my portfolio was not as large as others. I think that there was probably some questionable things that went on. The manner in which he treated me, you know, i have two incidents that ive talked about in court and ive talked about anywhere else. He threw a water bottle at me. Im a staff member. Why . Because he didnt want to be a game show host. And i set up a meeting that he told me to set up and he didnt like the way i planned for it to go. It was immediately after the fires in seaside heights. And then he told me to set up a meeting with Steve Phillip right after he was elected. He came in and i was told by his chief of staff to cancel these meetings and he came in my office the next day and screamed at me that nobody is entitled to, curse word, meeting. And i dont think thats a healthy environment. At the time, you know, youre in it. You have this job. You love what you do. Theyre amenable to the fact that i have four children and i xheetd two hours each day, each way. I trust and believed in too many people and it didnt, you know. Why do you think he decided it was okay for you and baroni to be the fall people . For me difference lowest hanging fruitful he had enough information that he could turn. He knew how the system worked. And unfortunately, what happened with me was that i knew i told him about this. And then all of a sudden, everybody started saying they didnt know anything about it. And i was left on an island by myself. And you know, i think had he just. Sure, i knew about the traffic study. This would have all played out much differently. If there was anything that the Port Authority or scores that had to be settled, they were above my head and i was not aware of them. Did you know that this traffic study was about punishing the mayor of ft. Lee in. I did not. We maintained a Good Relationship with the mayor of ft. Lee. So that would be something i was not aware of. There is a lot of people working in government today that are political appointees, that never get elected and they devote themselves to the elected official. What advice would you have for people that work in government as political officials, but working in government . I love that question. And i think that you have to be just wary. If something isnt right or doesnt look right, you need to ask more questions and you cant be afraid to ask more questions. I think the world is. Not because of bridgegate but i think the world in which we all work, where people work, professionally, whatever the business is, especially politics. People are starting to ask more questions and i think thats important. I didnt ask enough. Bridget kelly, i know you have a long way to go and i know this has been tough on your kids. Yeah. Good luck. Stay safe and stay healthy. Thank you so much. Thank you for your time. Before we go to break, i want to correct something. I made comment about the president s tweeting and i casually mentioned turrets syndrome. Im sorry that it took the president of turrets of america to remind me. It is important that we all do our part. Anyway, to the president of the association, thank you for bringing that to my attention and well be right back. Tremfya® can help adults with moderate to Severe Plaque Psoriasis get clearer. And stay clearer. Most patients who saw 90 clearer skin at 28 weeks stayed clearer through 48 weeks. Tremfya® may lower your ability to fight infections and may increase your risk of infections. Before treatment, your doctor should check you for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor if you have an infection or have symptoms such as fever, sweats, chills, muscle aches or cough. Before starting tremfya® tell your doctor if you plan to or have recently received a vaccine. Tremfya®. Stay clearer. Janssen can help you explore cost support options. [ aevery box has a mission to protect everything inside from everything outside. When whats inside matters, count on boxes. [ doorbell rings ] paper and packaging. How life unfolds. Featuring three new dishes that are plankedtoperfection. Feast on new cedarplank lobster shrimp. Or new colossal shrimp salmon with a citrusy drizzle. Tender, smoky, and together on one plank. But not for long so hurry in you wouldnt accept an incomplete job from any one else. Why accept it from your allergy pills . Flonase sensimist relieves all your worst symptoms, including nasal congestion, which most pills dont. And all from a gentle mist you can barely feel. Flonase sensimist. Thats all for meet the press daily. Good evening. Im going to be watching sunday for sure. We are covering a lot of stories tonight. New developments in the fight for congress to get Donald Trumps bank records. Plus, Michael Cohens last weekend of freedom before his threeyear prison sentence begins. And deep from the vault. Newly discovered video of Bernie Sanderss 1980s tv show. It is a mustsee friday. We begin with democrats giving trumps attorney bill barr a final