Transcripts For MSNBCW MTP Daily 20190129

An old College Friend of mine. Ill leave it at that. Im not going to draw blood on air. Im sorry, i didnt know. Oh my god. Why cant everybody get along. Thank you very much. If it is tuesday, democrats may have a half calf nonlatte on their hands. And hold the phone. Their hands. And hold the phone good evening. I am chuck todd in washington. Welcome to mtp daily. Were going to get to todays dramatic testimony on capitol hill in a moment as the nations intelligence chiefs broke with their boss. President trump on russia, isis, north korea, iran and notably the wall. We begin with an even wilder story thats brewing, pun intended. A lot of democrats are freaking out about emerging independent candidacy of former starbucks ceo and self made billionaire Howard Schultz. Why . There was a heckler last night that pretty much sums up Many Democratic Party activist concerns. Take a listen. I am seriously considering running for president as a centrist independent. And i wanted to clarify the word independent which i view merely as a designation on the ballot. Dont help elect trump, you e egotistical billionaire. Go back to twitter. Sometimes with hecklers you dont understand everything they said. That room allowed the heckler to say their piece. Schultz has no political id, no message and no real following, but is being pounded by the left from prospective candidates, democratic strategists, progressive pundits, National Party leaders, you name it. A full on panic. Theyre all screaming what are you doing . Were going to find out in a moment. We have an exclusive interview with one of schultzs top strategists. Democrats panic is arguably over something bigger than the prospect of a 2020 spoiler. This appears to be what the democratic nomination fight will be about. Reaction to schultz with recent moves by high profile 2020ers like Elizabeth Warren and Kamala Harris, suggests democrats dont know what the primary fight will be about. Electability, progressive politics, what . Some may say it is about winning at all costs. Comes amid signs of a progressive arms race on the left. Elizabeth warren targeting ultra wealthy americans, Kamala Harris responding by endorsing complete elimination of the entire private insurance market. Is the democratic contest about electability, progressive purity, populism, all of the above or none of the above . What schultz may have done with the prospective independent candidacy is jump start the debate that will define the Democratic Party most of this calendar year if not for the beginning of next. For more on this, i am joined by ron fornier, president of the Political Consulting firm prescott rothsman. And eugene scott, stephanie cutter. And alfonso aguilar. Ron, i brought you on here, you are not associated with the schultz efforts but you are associated with another independent effort thats trying to create space for explain what youre creating space for, a third party or independent candidacy or both . Reform the political system and thinkers outside of the duopoly, not aligned with the republican and Democratic Party no matter what they get from those two parties. Were for choice. Fair enough. I wanted to get that out there. Stephanie, it is the Democratic Party having a bit of the freak out. Why now and why are they freaking out over a guy who, im sorry, i didnt hear a message. Ross perot had a message, ralph nader had a message. Successful inchdependents, John Anderson had a message. He doesnt know what he is for yet. So why the freak out . I think that the one thing that unifies democrats is the focus on taking our country back from what trump has thrust upon it. And reorienting us around core american values. The idea of a Third Party Candidacy self funded by a billionaire poses a threat to that because somebody like Howard Schultz is likely going to take away, think of the obama, truck voters, theyre not going to be for trump but they could be for Howard Schultz. The idea of that, risking our ability to prevent donald trump from getting kicked out of the white house is alarming. However, i do think we are going a little overboard. Were 24 hours into this. He says he is thinking about it. Lets see what happens. He may completely implode himself or he could make a better case for the Democratic Party. We have to see. Right. I think you said something, chuck, thats very important. I think thats why theyre concerned. He raises the problem the democrats have that they have been trying to underestimate and that is the move of the leadership to the extreme left. We have the same problem in 2008. Rise of the tea party, freedom caucus. Youre having the same problem. Now youre seeing candidates like Kamala Harris, Elizabeth Warren who are seen as extremists. So you have a problem. I dont think you can call Kamala Harris an extremist or Elizabeth Warren. It is interesting. If you look at the coalition that essentially rejected trump in the midterms, it includes a slice of the electorate that is affluent, suburban republicans that want to be democrats. Welcome with an x panned electorate that doesnt see eye to eye. Some voters are fickle. Democrats won these voters, but didnt win them in 2016. Theres an awareness some will be turned off by policy positions coming from Kamala Harris and aoc and looking for a third lane. Whats important for people to realize, schultzs like ability, theres not as much support for candidates that are economically conservative and socially liberal as there are for people socially liberal. I know i will let you fully respond, i want you to think about this framing. Thank you. No. I think theres a lot of room for somebody with a message that you have been talking about. I think schultzs first couple of days, i dont know what, i think he missed a moment. Im not here to endorse Howard Schultz and i dont know what he stands for which i think is a big problem for him. I am for choice. We are 644 days from tthe elect. We have 18 months to figure out who could be the spoiler and help donald trump get elected. We dont know whether thats an independent candidate or if that spoiler could be the democratic nominee. We know theres no data point for how an independent candidate would do in a modern election against donald trump. We have a data point for how the democratic nominee may do against donald trump. She lost. So i say let him run. Let everybody run. Let all flowers bloom. Lets have the best candidate emerge to take on a president that most americans think needs to get out of office and not limit it to one party and be for choice. The Democratic Party should be prochoice. Stephanie, i think the question a lot of people have of Howard Schultz and the reason there was such blow back on him is many in the community met with him. Many of them personally know what he is espousing. They know that hes espousing a center left agenda, whatever you want to describe center left to be these days. So thats where i think some of this is coming from. Why doesnt he think theres room for him in the democratic primary to run . Not only has he gone center left, built his company with a center left agenda, he supported democrats and most if not all of his political giving. Why does he think theres not room . You know, i think he does think the party has moved left. Do you think theres room for him . I think theres room for everybody. The only way for the Democratic Party to get stronger is for everybody to run as democrats and lets figure out what we stand for and lets figure out what were going to run on and how were going to form a choice in the 2020 election. I think if he thinks he has a viable option for the country and vision for this country, run as a democrat. Thats his best shot of winning. I think theres another point. I think a point about the polarization of politics today. Look at who his advisers are. You have steve schmidt, former high level obama who will be on in a few minutes. He is trying to make the point that perhaps both parties moved to the extreme, and i can be a third option. I think one reason he also thinks theres no room for him in the Democratic Party is because we have polling that says democrats are less likely to support a washington outsider with no experience. That works on the right, that doesnt work on the left. I was going to say, left of center voter myself, i dont understand why the Democratic Party wants to take this position. They look weak, they look afraid, they look like theyre against choice. Why not let the battle of ideas win and beat schultz and any other independent candidate koch comes in. Why are they saying you cant run. Your organization, youve read a lot of this, what is the real opening here that again, i go back to i get the political reform message, but he didnt leave with that. Set schultz aside. What is the room that is there you think in the middle . I think it is a radical middle. I think theres a message, we live in a time of huge economic disruption, huge change making life simpler. Huge demographic shift. We live at a time where our institutions arent adapting as quickly as were forced to change. Were anxious, afraid, let down by every institution. What side of the barricade are you on . My side or their side. I think a strong independent candidate, heck, a strong democratic candidate with that kind of message, i am fighting for you can win. I dont think that message only wins if youre donald trump on the Republican Party and i dont think you have to be wearing a blue jersey to win with an im fighting for you message. A populous message. I didnt hear that from Howard Schultz. Is this something the Democratic Party needs, this wakeup call, you have a wealth tax, i mean, do they need to think of the fact that the coalition is bigger than they wish it was . Let me say number one, i dont think the Democratic Party can win unless they are running on Something Like what ron just said. That im on your side, i want to create a fairer economy. Isnt that the answer, ask which candidate is fighting for you. You look at policies, like we can debate 70 tax, 50 tax, regardless of the number, making sure that tax cuts dont predominantly go to those at the top is part of what ron is talking about. Giving everybody a fair shot. Weighing the scale on behalf of people at the upper income is not a fair shot. Thats part of what has broken our system. It is not that were trying to take wealth away from anybody, and democrats have to watch their message on that. It is about creating an economy. I dont want to sound like im using talking points, but creating an economy where you can have a middle class. Speaking of giving everybody a fair shot to the political system. Right now, the political system is slanted to two parties. We have issues like gerrymandering, ballot access. Take on political reforms in a populous way. But schultz isnt saying schultz is saying i dont want to run as a democrat. Democrats arent saying you cant be in our tribe. Fair point. This is where i wanted to invite, ron, i know because people are looking at schultz, it is like that doesnt mean there isnt room here for something on the outside. It is true, but the other thing i want to point, everybody talks about the Democratic Party running far left. Ron is talking political reforms. What did the house take up today, what did they introduce . Political reform to take big money out of politics. Democrats are trying to enact some of the reforms, economic and political, to bring our country back together. So what do you make of the fact that republicans are joking great, run schultz, run. Like this is a good thing. They really want this . I thought some of his appeal should be to the moderate republican. I think his appeal is to average americans, swing voters. Youre not a big fan of this president because of immigration in particular. Immigration and the way he talks, but i am a conservative. No, it has gotten to a point where the problem that the democrats have that is really with the average voters. Only about 25 , you talked about this on the show before of the electorate is liberal. You have about growing number, the number is growing. Not going to grow in two years. You still have 35 that are swing voters. You start faulking about government control of health care, single payer, that is going to scare a lot of people. We had the biggest political upset in 44 years, taking back the house. We won popular vote in six of the seven last president ial elections. Hard to say were out of mainstream. We are the mainstream. Before i let you go, your organization is trying to recruit more than president ial candidates. Does the schultz attention help or hurt . The biggest problem of the independent movement is the question of viability. Most voters wanted something other than choice of two. You have a thousand different artists on your hip, you can go to the grocery store, have 12 different kinds of cereal to pick out. They want more than two Political Parties but arent convinced the other guy can win. Were trying to get more people elected at grass roots level to prove that viability issue. I dont know if schultz helps or hurts, the wayesque beat up by democrats, you know, theyre trying to poison the well so no independent can be seen as viable. I think thats pore initial us and bad to say you can only pick from two. Ron, going to let you go. Panel, you have more bites at the apple. Good to see you, ron. Good to see you. Up next, im going to ask the former obama aide referenced earlier now advising Howard Schultz how he feels about his former partys anger over the possible schultz candidacy. Possible schultz candidacy what if numbers tell only half the story . At t. Rowe price, hundreds of our experts go beyond the numbers to examine Investment Opportunities firsthand. Like a biotech firm that engineers a patients own cells to fight cancer. This is strategic investing. Because your investments deserve the full story. T. Rowe price. Invest with confidence. I never thought id say this but i found bladder leak underwear thats actually pretty. Always discreet boutique. Hidden inside is a super absorbent core that quickly turns liquid to gel. So i feel protected and pretty. Always discreet boutique. Tailored recommendations, taxefficient investing strategies, and a dedicated advisor to help you grow and protect your wealth. Fidelity wealth management. Woman this is your wakeup call. If you have moderate to severe rheumatoid arthritis, month after month, the clock is ticking on irreversible joint damage. Ongoing pain and stiffness are signs of joint erosion. Humira can help stop the clock. Prescribed for 15 years, humira targets and blocks a source of inflammation that contributes to joint pain and irreversible damage. Vo humira can lower your ability to fight infections. Serious and sometimes fatal infections including tuberculosis, and cancers, including lymphoma, have happened, as have blood, liver, and nervous system problems, serious allergic reactions, and new or worsening heart failure. Tell your doctor if youve been to areas where certain fungal infections are common, and if youve had tb, hepatitis b, are prone to infections, or have flulike symptoms or sores. Dont start humira if you have an infection. Woman help stop the clock on further irreversible joint damage. Talk to your rheumatologist. Right here. Right now. Humira. Welcome back. More on the Howard Schultz independent bid for the white house. That has a lot of people in political circles buzzing and as you just heard, plenty of democrats steaming. Joining me now in his first tv interview since signing up for this gig, bill burner, former adviser and press secretary and now adviser to mr. Schultz. Thanks, chuck. Good to talk to you. Let me start with what probably every one of your former colleagues are asking, number one, are you a democrat and why are you doing this . I am a democrat, been one my whole life and will continue to be one. I am doing it because howard is a great guy. He loves his family, this country, he wants to make america a better place. Being with him on the journey as he figures out whether or not to run for president is exciting. One of the things thats great about it, i have been in politics a long time as you can tell from the gray hair on my head, the thing thats cool is there are democrats, republicans, people in the former military, former journalists, a people of diversity i never experienced. For us to come together and work on this has been an experience. You know the way twitter and social media works. Theres an oped you wrote in 2016 making the rounds nfor. Why should you not eat those words today . Couple of things. Number one, Howard Schultz is not jill stein. She was in that race because she thought two candidates were too close together. What Howard Schultz thinks is the polar opposites of the parties are so far apart but the American People are close together. Maybe what we need is a choice for the American People to choose something different, a different path, a different kinds of outcome, different kind of politics in america. Secondly, i think that first of all he hasnt made the decision to run, but if he did, i think we can agree it would be a more serious effort than jill stein put together. Fair enough. We still dont know how much jill stein had from outside actors given where she spent december of 2015. Let me ask you this. Obviously youre using the book tour to launch an exploratory bid as well as any book tour launch for president ial bid as i have seen in a while. It is clear you want this to be the front. Why . What im trying to figure out is i dont understand why he wants to run other than he is not them and not them. What is the big idea beyond not a republican and not a democrat . Well, the book tour, he wrote the book whether he was going to think of this or not, he has a story to tell and wanted to get it out there. He is a guy that grew up in the projects and was self made. He worked his way through college, he went on to build a Great Company that did the right thing by the folks that worked for it, and now he wants to continue to serve. In terms of what his big idea is, it is that politics is broken. And maybe we need a solution that risks the imagination of a new kind of possibility. What has he done, i am curious, to try to fix politics in his own way. Has he done Ballot Initiatives to try to change gerrymandering laws, tried Ballot Initiatives on campaign money, is there a platform he has been working on on this reform front or no . Look, the way he conducted as ceo of starbucks was very forward. All the workers, including parttime workers which nobody else had done, given them a chance to invest in stock or access to College Education they may not have otherwise had, it was trying to start conversations on bringing folks together, about race, about a whole set of different issues which he used his time as ceo to do. Is there a defining issue . Ross perot ran because he thought Neither Party was talking of the issue of outsourcing of jobs and it was true, okay, and he forced a different conversation. What is the conversation Howard Schultz can force the two parties to have that theyre not having now . I think he can force a conversation that is more aligned with where the American People are. You take an issue like immigration, on the far right youve got President Trump who wants to build a wall. On the far left, you have democrats that want to eliminate i. C. E. It doesnt need to be on the furthest outreach of the conversation. Most americans agree there should be a path for dreamers and some protective barriers that are on the border in places it matters. We shouldnt have internment camps for kids and families. It doesnt make sense. But because of the way washington is operating, theres no path to getting a better outcome. Were stuck in the place the countdown is on for yet another Government Shutdown. Theres a better way and Howard Schultz is talking to the American People to see if the solution could be a Third Party Candidacy. He spent a lot of time beating up democrats and not republicans. Sounds like he is more comfortable in the left lane. Maybe he wants to hug the center, but he is more comfortable in the left lane or right lane. Is that fair . I wouldnt characterize it as that. When he came out and said he was thinking of running for president , it is centered in the fact that donald trump is unfit for the office, and anything he says or does is in the effort to make sure he doesnt get a second term. I would say that as a lifelong democrat, he looked at the race this time and thought maybe theres a different path. Maybe the answer isnt just to have this fight in a handful of battleground states and districts, maybe it is all 50 states and every voter getting in the game. Why is he sure the democrats will nominate somebody that cant win . He is not sure who the democrats will nominate. What he is sure of is the way we have been doing things is fundamentally broken. So if they nominate Michael Bloomburg, does he stay in the race or get out . Look, he will look at a lot of different factors when it gets to the end of period of exploration, then he will make a decision. Why does he think he knows something Michael Bloomburg doesnt. As you and i know, he wanted to win the presidency without a Major Political party, and if he thought there was a path, he would have done it. I think 2016 was a different year, but i think it is too lazy to look at a poll 4 years ago, 8 years ago, 12 years ago and make a statement about whats happening in politics today. This is different. It is a different time. I think it is a time when Howard Schultz should be asking this question. He should have the right to go to the American People and say maybe we should do this differently. By the way, he could do both. Run as democrat and see if he could get traction in iowa and then run independent, has he thought of that before ruling out the Democrat Party . Theres a lot of paths he could take. As someone not widely known in the United States, having a moment to go around the country, talk about your ideas, tell your story, talk about the future for our nation is the right thing to do right now, and if youre thinking about doing it as an independent, now is the time to do it. Does he know this is a 1 chance historically . I just say that. I mean, is he being given honest assessments like hey, you know, you can spend all the money in the world, ross perot outspent both opponents and still finished very far behind. When donald trump ran for president of the United States and had one opponent, he won. And stakes are too high for us to look at this race and assume we get a different outcome because we need to stay in old construct of the way things have been done. I think what we ought to do is not let conventional wisdom and pundits that said donald trump couldnt win decide the election before it has begun. Bill burton, thank you for coming on, sir. Good to catch up via satellite. Look forward to seeing you when you get back east. Thanks. Coming up, how the nations Top National Security officials basically said to President Trump everything you have been talking about, youre just plain wrong. Well have more after the break. Wrong. Well have more after the break. On average, well live in eleven homes. And every time we move, things change. Apartments become houses, cars become mini vans. As we upgrade and downsize, an allstate agent will do the same for our protection. Now that you know the truth, are you in good hands . About medicare and supplemental insurance. Medicare is great, but it doesnt cover everything only about 80 of your part b medicare costs, which means you may have to pay for the rest. Thats where Medicare Supplement insurance comes in to help pay for some of what medicare doesnt. Learn how an aarp Medicare Supplement insurance plan, insured by United Healthcare Insurance Company might be the right choice for you. A free decision guide is a great place to start. Call today to request yours. So what makes an aarp Medicare Supplement plan unique . Well, these are the only Medicare Supplement plans endorsed by aarp and thats because they meet aarps high standards of quality and service. Youre also getting the great features that any Medicare Supplement plan provides. For example, with any Medicare Supplement plan you may choose any doctor or hospital that accepts medicare patients. You can even visit a specialist. With this type of plan, there are no networks or referrals needed. Also, a Medicare Supplement plan goes with you when you travel anywhere in the u. S. A free decision guide will provide a breakdown of aarp Medicare Supplement plans, and help you determine the plan that works best for your needs and budget. Call today to request yours. Lets recap. There are 3 key things you should keep in mind. One if youre turning 65, you may be eligible for medicare but it only covers about 80 of your Medicare Part b costs. A Medicare Supplement plan may help pay for some of the rest. Two this type of plan allows you to keep your doctor as long as he or she accepts medicare patients. And three these are the only Medicare Supplement plans endorsed by aarp. Learn more about why you should choose an aarp Medicare Supplement plan. Call today for a free guide. Medicare supplement plan. The company who invented car vending machines and buying a car 100 online. Now weve created a brand new way for you to sell your car. Whether its a few years old or dinosaur old, we want to buy your car. So go to carvana and enter your license plate, answer a few questions, and our technowizardry calculates your cars value and gives you a real offer in seconds. When youre ready, well come to you, pay you on the spot, and pick up your car. Thats it. So ditch the old way of selling your car and say hello to the new way. At carvana. Welcome back. Forget not being on the same page. President trump and his own Intelligence Community dont even seem to be on the same planet when it comes to the most imminent threats facing the country. They dont seem to be in the same country. That was on full display when heads of the Intelligence Community presented the annual worldwide threat assessment to congress. This is their own assessment of nearly every major threat and it contradicted the president s own assessment on so many threats, on russia. Is russia still targeting the u. S. . Make your way out. Is it the assessment that this countrys adversaries fin to use social media platforms as a vehicle for weaponizing disinformation and spreading foreign influence in the United States . Director wray . Thats certainly the fbis assessment. All right. Fbi versus trump. Got that. Fbi. Here it is. Isis. We have won against isis. We have beaten them and beaten them badly. Isis is nearly territorial defeat in iraq and syria, the Group Continued to guerrilla war fare routes. Isis is intent on resurging and still commands thousands of fighters in iraq and syria. That was dan coats contradicting the president. Director of national intelligence. Now the issue of north korea. We made a lot of progress that has not been reported by the media but we have made a lot of progress. We currently assess that north korea will seek to retain its wmd capabilities and is unlikely to completely give up its Nuclear Weapons and production capabilities because its leaders ultimately view Nuclear Weapons as critical to regime survival. Pretty much 180 difference between President Trump and director coats on that as well. Not mentioned once by the way, the need for a wall on the southern border. A threat for which the president may declare a National Emergency to deal with. Well have much more on the divide between the president and his entire National Security team after the break. S entire ny team after the break remember when we all used to go to the cafeteria and just chow down midday . You mean, like, lunch . Come on. Voted most likely to help people save 668 when they switch. At this school . Didnt you get caught in the laminating machine . Ha. [ sighs ] box, have a great summer. Danielle. Ooh. Danielle, control yourself. Id like to slow it down here with a special discount for a special girl. Danielle, this ones for you. Is iran abiding by terms of jcpoa in terms of Nuclear Activities . Yes, theyre making some preparations that would increase their ability to take a step back if they make that decision, so at the moment, technically theyre in compliance. Welcome back. That was almost the kicker, like the last thing they disagreed with the president on, irans compliance. That was cia director gina haspel telling senators iran is complying with the nuclear deal signed in the obama administration, contrary to President Trumps own assertions. That was only one contradiction between the president and intel chiefs exposed today, russia, isis, north korea. For more, joined by andrea mitchell, and also with me and her, john mclaughlin, former cia acting director and msnbc Global Affairs analyst here to check us. When the day began, we knew they were likely to contradict the president on some things, we know the president has a habit of exaggerating. But i think the sheer volume was still startling. What it did if you take a step back is reassure the world and americans that the intelligence professionals are professionals. Theyre not going to be politically pressured. Theyve seen jim mattis forced out, tillerson and others that disagreed with the president , yet theyre Still Standing up and testifying honestly and openly and thats the important take away. One important take away. Of course, the larger impression is that the president of the United States is misstating policy on almost every global threat, and the one thing he says is the most important global threat that would warrant an Emergency Declaration and 35 day Government Shutdown costing upwards of 11 billion, according to the congressional budget office, the border wall, thats on page 18. It is basically your every year the drug threat, it is china, it is mexico, it is cartels. No mention of rationale for a wall, but it is not even mentioned in two hours of testimony. John, im admit as a citizen, it is disconcerting to me it is the unelected i should take the word for rather than the elected. As a citizen, we get nervous when too many unelecteds, and it seems like we should reassure the world our bureaucracy has got this. Thats not comforting always. The Intelligence Community plays an Important Role in the government. I call them the fact witness. I called them that years ago. Today it has a special meaning because the whole question of whats a fact, whats true, what do we believe is up for grabs it seems. So i often say to colleagues that are still in the intelligence world, theres a distinct i make between hard power and soft power. What you have is truth power, thats an important power now, the ability to say objectively, as objective as human beings can be, whats going on. Thats their job. I think they did it well today. But what concerns you, whats the disconnect of all of the disconnects, whats the one that kernls y concerns you most . I think our policy results from three things, people, process and policy itself. I think whats missing is a process, theres a process missing. For example, when the president said were going to get out of syria. It is evident there was no pro session that preceded that with people like these sitting around a table with the secretary of defense, chairman of the joint chiefs and others saying what would be the consequences of that, how would we do it if we want to, what are the secondary consequences. I think thats whats missing. When i hear intelligence people at stark distance from the policy pronouncements of the president , it tells me theres no process. Mike pompeo i feel like is supposed to be the magic guy here, right . He was at caia, isnt he supposd to be the Rosetta Stone with the president . He is the last one standing. He according to people that have spoken to him, carrying out withdrawal from syria, is not willing to say to the president the way jim mattis and bret mcgerk was, and pompeo is there saying he wants this done, we have to make it work. We can maybe slow it down. But i have been told by some people that were directly involved we will have all our people out by the end of april. Were sending more troops in to get them out because thats the withdrawal process. Theyll be out by end of april. We did not tell the brits, french and others on the ground. Theyre left standing and stranded. Not even telling their own people theyre on the ground in syria. We know that. And the fact is they were given no heads up. So the larger, terrible impression is that our closest allies in nato and around the world in the gulf is real, were given no advance warning. Gets to the points on process. One other topic that came up, i am not going to play the clip, but tom cotton asked for a show of hands about a certain cell phone company, would you be be comfortable using it, nobodys hand went up. Dan coats was not a fan of hand raising, but how concerned should americans be of chinese technology. Part of me thinks is it hype or real . I think theres basis for concern. It is a difficult issue. They make a good phone, world class instrument they make. It is clear that their management was tied to security establishment, also clear that china uses its firms. It is not like the United States. Their firms are integrated with the government in terms of carrying out government policy. Yes, i think theres legitimate concern that those phones and equipment will be able to compromise anyone that takes it. Thats part of a bigger problem which is how technology is made in this time in our lives. The components come from everywhere. Went back 30, 40 years when the u. S. Military made something, they wanted to know where did the components come from and frankly we wanted to make them. So this problem is part of the globalization issue were struggling with. I think it is fair to be tough on them actually. Im going to pause the conversation there. Thank you both. History shows us it is not hard to do the right thing, even if it is not politically expedient. It is not politically expedient. Welcome to the place where people go to learn about their Medicare Options before theyre on medicare. Come on in. Youre turning 65 soon . Yep. And youre retiring at 67 . Thats the plan its also a great time to learn about an aarp Medicare Supplement insurance plan, insured by unitedhealthcare Insurance Company. Heres why. Medicare part b doesnt pay for everything. This part is up to you. A Medicare Supplement plan helps pay for some of what medicare doesnt. Call unitedhealthcare Insurance Company or go online for your free decision guide about the only Medicare Supplement plans endorsed by aarp. Selected for meeting their high standards of quality and service. This type of plan lets you say yes to any doctor or hospital that accepts medicare patients. Do you accept medicare patients . I sure do to learn more call or go online today for your free decision guide. Oh, and happy birthday. Or retirement. In advance. Tonight im obsessed what to do when the bad guys offer to help you. We know how the Trump Campaign reacted when the russians offered dirt on hillary clinton. Donald trump jr. Replied in an email, if it is what you say, i love it, especially late in the summer. Guess what, that wasnt the first time the russians tried to meddle in our elections. One of us noticed in maximum hayesingss book vietnam an epic tragedy, he recounts that the soviet government believed Hubert Humphrey was more likely than his opponent to end the vietnam war quickly. Then hastings writes they offered humphreys campaign secret Financial Support which was politely refused. Politely refused. We didnt want to end it there. We asked our pal, president ial historian if this was an isolated incident. Sure enough, it was not. In his book, the crisis years, michael recounts how in 1960 soviet ambassador reached out to the democrat, add llai stevenso seeking a Third Straight democratic nomination. He told stephenson that crews chef thought stephenson more likely to understand soviet anxieties and purposes than other president ial knlds. Should the soviet press praise him and for what . Should it criticize him and for what . Later, stephenson wrote a friend. As i think about it, i get more and more in dig nanlt about being propositioned that way. I shall do one thing. Reject the proposal. And when the soviet ambassador said crews chef votes for you, johnson responded it is better to leave the election matters up to the American People themselves. In other words, frthere was no its what you say, i love it. Youre the nbc news president ial historian. Well be right back. S president l historian. Well be right back. And shakin me up so applebees all you can eat is back. Now with shrimp. Now thats eatin good in the neighborhood. Uh uh i deliverberty the news around here. Sources say Liberty Mutual customizes your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. Over to you, logo. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. I had a few good tricks to help hide my bladder leak pad. Like the old tunic tug. But always discreet is less bulky. And it really protects. cause it turns liquid to gel. So i have nothing to hide. Always discreet. Our grandparents checked zero times a day. Times change. Eyes havent. Thats why theres ocuvite. Screen light. Sunlight. Longer hours. Eyes today are stressed. But ocuvite has vital nutrients. To help protect them. Ocuvite. Eye nutrition for today. Time now for the lid. Our panel is back. Hey, eugene, something seems to be happening among democrats all of a sudden on the border. Heres jeff merkley this morning on the issue of barriers. I am comfortable with barriers that involve vehicles, fences. There are appropriate places where Border Guards have convinced me that some additional barriers could be useful. Uh, meanwhile, i see that Mitch Mcconnell made sure that the people that got appointed to the committee are people that make deals, not people that represent some extreme. Do i smell a deal coming . It could be. To some degree this isnt that surprising, consider there are democrats that have been working on Border Security issues for a while. They didnt want a 5. 7 billion wall with a big, beautiful door and all the things that the president said were part of the plan, which werent supported by any Tank Research or foundations as effective. Alfonso, es theyre saying rhetorically if you want some barriers, you will find a compromise on that. Has the white house put itself in such a box that they cant accept that kind of compromise 1234. I think if youre saying that democrats would be willing to accept some type of barrier. You heard jeff merkley there. Thats a definition thats a win for the president of the United States. It puts nancy pelosi in a bind. She was saying not a dollar for the wall, for fencing. I think, you know, looking at the nbc poll, people realize that the shutdown political hurt trump, but what came out fromle poll also is people want to see compromise. What theyre sees from nancy pelosi is something who is being very intransigent. You are assuming that the president takes that deeal. I dont know that nancy has a test that if the president takes a deal that looks like a compromise. Fair . If it includes fencing, and it includes billions of dollars, hell take it and its a win for the president. Do you think he would take it and would pelosi do that deal . I think he would be pretty dumb not to take it, but well leave that there. In terms of what nancy pelosi wants, we talked about it last year. Democrats have been fighting for Borders Security as long as ive been in politicses which is a long time what they didnt want is a 5. 7 billion shrine to donald trump for him to make good on a campaign promise, a promise that he said mexico was going to pay for. They wanted to be spar about Border Security. In places, if the Border Control agents are saying we need a fence here or Better Technology here, let be smart about it. Dont build a wall just for somebodys ego. I reason i ask this, will the president take it, because it looks to me, eugene, mcconnell and mccarthy. You had to be happy about the appointments. Let me tell you something, the democrats would be dumb if they agreed to barriers. If they dont push for any type of daca deal, but some are saying we will not push for a daca deal. Sometimes i really wonder if theyre looking out for immigrants. Theres a part of me that thinking that the president is looking for a way to not support this deal so he can do the emergency, because hes fearing the base. At least that is the way he tweets. Yeah, he is faring the base a bit. Do not approve of him at the same rate. I think who he fears most is ann coulter and these are some people hes looking at, trying to figure out how to get back in good grace. You think they will . Yes, they will. I dont think ann coulter is as influential as they say. The rubber will meet the road in about 2 1 2 weeks. Thank you, guys. Eugene, stephanie, alfonso. A quick programming note, senator brown will sit down with chris matthews, as he inches toward a 2020 run. Dont miss hardball right here at 7 00 p. M. Eastern right here on msnbc. Well be right back. Right here on msnbc well be right back. Fact is, every Insurance Company hopes you drive safely. But allstate helps you. With drivewise. Feedback that helps you drive safer. And that can lower your cost now that you know the truth. Are you in good hands . Thats all for tonight. Well be back tomorrow, but the beat with ari mel better stabe we giveth and taketh. What did you think of roger stone in you and i have covered him. He would seem to enjoy part of the spectacle today. Which is why part of me thinking as New York Times wrote, hes too hunting of a suspect. If you were watching the drama, you would be, like, thats too hunting. Im heard that theory and one of his possibility defenses. Its the best defense hes got. If you get past people who follow this in and out the way we do, at trial a jury says, maybe this guy sort of messes around a lot and thats the way he wiggles out. Maybe. Maybe. Maybe. Yeah, i dont know. I sometimes worry hes too available and thats why he seems like the center of the story. The zelig theory . Is that right . Exactly. Now i took way too much time