Transcripts For MSNBCW MSNBC Live With Velshi And Ruhle 20190509

Certain provisions. The white house wants to make it political where you see the legal argument coming from the department of justice. Do you agreement with chairman nadler that the country is in a constitutional crisis . Yes, i do agree with chairman nadler. Wow. Because the administration has decided that theyre not going to honor their oath of office. The Mueller Report that we have seen, the redacted version paints a very damning and frightening picture. I wonder if theyve read it. If they had read it, they should be as alarmed and frightened as the rest of us are for our democracy. Breaking news. North korea fires two more shortrange ballistic missiles, their second highprovide file launch in less than one week. Two rounds of suspected shortrange missiles, one at around 3 29 a. M. Eastern, the second 20 minutes later, each traveling 260 miles and 170 miles respectively. Well, were looking at it very seriously right now. They were smaller missiles, shortrange missiles. Nobody is happy about it but were taking a good look and we will see. I think American Voters need to take very seriously into account the nature of our leadership and what it says to the world and what it will do to our standing internationally and our ability to secure our interests if we have another four years of donald trump. Breaking news at the white house. President trump just went into full attack mode on special counsel bob mueller. He also talked about supporting john bolton. He said bill barr was a great guy and reacted to the subpoena of his son, don jr. Nbc News White House correspondent Peter Alexander was watching it closely and is at the white house. What was the news . Reporter hey, ali. What was striking is it was supposed to be an event for the president to focus on Surprise Medical Bills but he went off script as you saw, taking a series of questions on all of those topics you just noted. Among the headlines that the president just made, defending his son, donald trump jr. , who is facing a subpoena slapped on him by the Republicanled Senate intelligence committee. The president saying he was very surprised by that, saying that his son is a very good man and describing that meeting that took place at trump tower in the summer of 2016 as a nothing meeting. Of course, his son was among those in attendance and his son receiving emails that those who would be attending the meeting, russians would be providing, as it was described to him, dirt on Hillary Clinton at the time. Strikingly, President Trump again today doubled down on his contention that it is okay to accept Opposition Research from a foreign adversary. As it relates to the Mueller Report more broadly, he described it as the bible. He said there was no obstruction and he says that there was no collusion and, notably, he said that he would leave it to the attorney general, william barr, whether Robert Mueller would be able to testify before congress. It is worth noting william barr himself, who testified in the last couple of weeks, said he had no problem with Robert Mueller testifying. That was a series of the domestic headlines. There were some significant foreign headlines as well. One relates to a recent clash as it is described in some reports between the president and his National Security adviser, john bolton. The president has been privately expressing frustrations about the situation, the crisis taking place in venezuela, frustrated that he was under the impression as advised by some of his aides that Nicolas Maduro would be out much quicker. Of course, he remains in power there. The president said he is the one who often tempers his hawkish National Security adviser, john bolton, which was notable to a lot of people paying attention there. On china, the president said negotiations will begin at 5 00 this afternoon, the president not in attendance for the dinner to take place with the vice premiere, one of the top deputies in the Chinese Government there. The president , though not really sounding a very optimistic tone saying theres always the available alternative of new tariffs. The president threatened those new tariffs would go into effect tomorrow. And as it related to north korea, of course, in the wake of the recent firing of missiles in recent days, the president said that they are looking at it very seriously. As for kim jongun, who he has praised in recent days, most notably over the weekend on twitter, the president said he did not believe the North Koreans were prepared to negotiate at this time. Ali and steph. Thank you very much. Ali, we have to note the president said that trump tower meeting was a nothing burger. Right. Michael cohen is currently in jail about lying to congress about plans for a trump tower in moscow. Donald trump said he only new a little bit about that. Michael cohen, and, yes, he might be lying, Michael Cohen said he briefed donald trump jr. And ivanka trump ten times on that deal. Yes. We have not seen the president s taxes. One of the number one reason we want to see the president s taxes is to understand where his business interests lie. Right. It is where he could be compromised, where he could be vulnerable. From seeing the taxes or what we saw of his taxes in that New York Times report, he lost an enormous amount of money in business. He rebuilt himself as a brand of a rich and powerful guy. All of this gets you closer to understanding what motivates him. Theres one year where he claimed 57 million in interest but theres no underlying investment that he had that would actually have held that. You know, stephanie, people are trying to get this information and it looks like it is getting harder to do so because on wednesday, yesterday, the president took the highly unusual step of exerting something called executive protective, namely the full unredacted Mueller Report and identifies underlying evidence. I want to look at what executive privilege in and why this move is so controversial. If you pop out your copy of the constitution you wont find any mention of executive privilege. It has been around, however, since the beginning of the republic. The first congressional inquiry was during George Washingtons administration. Washington considered not handing over documents about a disastrous military operation, but was persuaded by his cabinet to comply. Later, Thomas Jefferson told a court he would not appear as a witness in his Vice President s conspiracy trial, but he did end up producing the documents that were requested. It wasnt until United States versus nixon that the Supreme Court weighed in on this issue. The court protected some private communication between the president and his advisers, but also pointed out the balancing act between the president s right to privacy and congresss need to investigate. What President Trump is asserting is something called protective privilege. Essentially you cant have my homework because i want to check it again. The claim surrounds testimony of former White House Counsel Don Mcgahn and underlying evidence in the Mueller Report, but executive privilege typically protects communication in the function of government, not a blanket. You cant have this during a congressional investigation, particularly one that may involve and does involve the president. That gets us into the branches of government. So let me give you a quick civics 101. The primary job of the executive branch, headed by the president , is to take care that the laws be faithfully hold on. All right. The president is supposed to take care that the laws be faithfully executed according to the constitution. It carries outlaws and treaties made by congress and other duties. That brings us to the legislative branch. All right. I dont see to have the legislative branch here, but that is the first congressional inquiry that George Washington faced, and it established that congresss right to call for such persons, papers and records as may be necessary to assist their inquiries. The president s apparent refusal to produce these papers it will likely end up in the courts, the third branch, essentially one branch of government calling on another to compel documents from a third branch. As you know, the judiciary according to the constitution can call for such persons, papers and records as may be necessary to assist in their inquiries. Joining us is msnbc contributor and senior fbi official Chuck Rosenberg who also hosts podcast the oath, talking to those who shaped pivotal moments in history. I want to start with don jr. The president said moments ago were going to see what happens when it comes to don jr. Fighting the subpoena that came from the Senate Intelligence subcommittee the Senate Intelligence committee. Help me understand how they could fight it. Don jr. Is a fighting citizen, not a sitting president , not a member of the president S Administration or the president s lawyer. Great question. Ali just gave an important run down on executive privilege. Theres another privilege equally important that could apply here to protect donald trump jr. , the fifth amendment privilege. So if he did something wrong, if he lied, if he committed a crime and they want to ask him about that or he fears that they want to ask him about that, he would invoke his fifth amendment right to refuse to answer any question. But wont he still have to show up to do that . Well, often as prosecutors we accept from an attorney her representation that her clint will invoke. We normally dont make people come into the grand jury and actually invoke in front of the grand jury. We accept it from lawyers. I dont know what congress will do. They may make him sit in front of the camera and invoke, but as federal prosecutors we normally do not. We accept that representation. Chuck, the executive privilege stuff is complicated as we noted. It has a long history. Does this turn into a constitutional crisis . I mean there is still a process were in the middle of. The president doesnt want to if he wants to invoke this protective privilege, there are still the courts. Yes, and i think thats a really important point, ali. So constitutional crisis at this stage seems somewhat hyperbolic to me. The constitution has an answer for this confrontation, right . And that is to adjudicate the question in a court of law with either party arguing the merits of their case, the executive branch on one side and the legislative branch on the other. A constitutional crisis in my view is when the constitution literally holds no answer to the question. So as long as we are, as you say, still in a process, it strikes me we are somewhat short of a constitutional crisis. So what can congress do to compel action . For example, in don jr. s case if he says, i plead the fifth, this what . Right. Again, different sort of privilege, stephanie, but if he pleads the fifth, in theory congress could immunize him and compel his testimony. If you are immunized you no longer have the fear of being prosecuted, but federal prosecutors would object strenuously to that because they may well have a case theyre putting together against donald trump jr. So they would they, the federal prosecutors, would probably beg congress not to immunize a witness while theres an ongoing criminal investigation. That would be their option. The other option would be to wait until federal prosecutors are done. Chuck, good to see you as always. Thank you for joining us. Chuck rosenberg is a former u. S. Attorney and senior fbi official. The goal is to get smarter. Chuck does it every time he joins us. Lets turn to north korea. They fired two shortrange missile launches early this morning, both coming from a base near the chinese border. The missiles were fired eastward according to south Korean Defense officials with one traveling about 170 miles and the other just over 260 miles. On state television the north claimed the launches along with another last saturday were part of a combat readiness drill, testing new technical guidance weapons. The south said they were not helpful to the improvement of interkorean relations and easing military tensions. Some suggest it shows the norths frustrations about stalled diplomatic talks with the trump administration. A short time ago the president said the administration is looking at it very seriously. Joining us now, someone else looking at it seriously, democratic congressman of massachusetts and 2020 president ial candidate seth molton, who also is a member of the Armed Services committee. Congressman, welcome. You have all of this unrest happening with our foreign adversaries like north korea, things going on with iran. Theres an ongoing situation that isnt turning out as the administration planned in venezuela. You are one of the candidates really who is running on your experience as a Foreign Policy expert, but the reality is voters seem to have other issues to care about. How do you make Foreign Policy your area of expertise, a major concern for voters . You know, as i have been traveling around the country and listening to voters on the ground, their number one concern is beating donald trump. They can see every single day what a threat he is to our democracy at home. I mean the fact that were just talking about constitutional crisis right now on tv and the threat he is to instability around the globe. I think it is critical to take him on where hes weakest, which is not just his job as president but his job as commander in chief. Thats the most important thing to voters, and thats why im in this race, to challenge him in his job as commander in chief. Hes clearly lost moral authority all around the globe, and with many people here at home. It now looks like he is completely losing control of his own administration. That might be the priority for democratic voters, but if you are actually going to be the next president you somewhere to get more than that. Your Political Action committee, serve america, endorsed 21 of those 40 seats that flipped blue in the 2018 election. These are candidates that are veterans who appealed to conservative voters who might not vote for trump a second time around. I am assuming you are still focused on many of those voters. As you have traveled around the country, what is it you are focusing on with them . What are you telling them and what are they telling you they care about because their number one priority is not to defeat donald trump. What they want is a country that is safe, strong and secure. They want a commander in chief we can actually trust. They want leaders they can trust. Those kinds of leaders are exactly who they sent to congress in this amazing midterm. A lot of the 21 leaders are veterans. They are people who made a case to american voter, especially the independent voters, voters who went for obama and then switched to trump, that they will put the country first. They will put the country before politics. They will put the country before Political Party and thats exactly the kind of leadership that we need right now in america. What about the president who often touts he is responsible for the great economy. Stephanie said it well about half an our ago when she said we have to be careful calling it a great or bad economy. For some people it is fantastic, for some people it is exactly the same as it was before donald trump was elected. What do you say to people about the economy and what you would do with it . The first thing i am doing is listening. When you listen to people on wall street they will tell you the economy is great. Im sure all of trumps friends are telling him the economy is doing well for them. When you go to the parts of the country we have to win back, the places where i campaign for people in the mid terms who actually helped flip the house and regain democratic control, thats where you will meet voters who will say the economy is not really working. Theyre not on unemployment roles because they have jobs, but they have two or three jobs to pay the bills and put food on the table. Congressman, what do you deliver for them . The truth is wall street didnt vote for President Trump last time around. Theyre his new quiet supporters. Those people who are telling you things arent working for them, President Trump said, im going to make them work. Now, he hasnt, but they still have that problem. You are listening to them. What is your prescription to solve their problem . I think they want two things. One, they want a tax system thats actually fair. It is not fair that people on wall street are paying lower tax rates than people who are in these hardworking jobs, even working two or three jobs. One of the questions i sometimes ask people is, you know, raise your hand if you paid more than a dollar in taxes this past year. Of course, the whole room, anyone who has a job is raising their hands. I say, it is interesting, you paid more than amazon. Think about that. Think about the tax system. You diagnosed the problem. What is the solution . So were going to equalize rates. We will have a tax system thats fair so that if you are working a hard job, you are paying a comparable rate to what people are paying for sitting in a wall street desk and investing their money. The second thing is we have to embrace the new jobs because the old jobs are just not coming back. Donald trump ran on a promise to kick out the immigrants, to go back into the coal mines. It was a completely backwardslooking economic picture. What people are realizing is that it is not working. We still dont have those jobs, those old jobs have not come back. What we need to do is win the future. That means making sure everybody in america has a job in the new economy, not the world not the old. That means not promising them work, like a jobs guarantee or a handout like universal basic income. People dont want a handout. They want a good job. They want the skills to work in this new economy. What i am talking about is a skills guarantee, not a job gar tee. It means more seats in vocational schools. It means more seats in places where we actually need apprenticeships because those are the jobs in the new economy. Electricians and plumbers are doing great. A lot of kids need to be inspired to do those jobs too. I have a sixmonthold daughter. She is not thinking about the new economy yet, but a lot of democrats have one plan for her. They say she is going to go to college. I dont actually know if she is going to want to go to college or build the college or defend the college, but i know one thing. I will be proud of her no matter which role she chooses, and she might even choose more than one. I think america should be proud of her too. Thats the message that resonates with a lot of the people who voted for obama and then voted for trump because it is not working for them and they need change. Congressman, usually the second Biggest Issue if it is not beating donald trump for democrats is health care. You stated you are not for medicare for all. You are one of the few not for some sort of a universal solution. What is your alternative suggestion . Because what we have now doesnt work. What we have now doesnt work at all and im the only candidate in the race who actually gets a medicareforalllike plan because i have Single Payer Health care through the va. I made a commitment to continue going to the va when i was elected to congress. Health care is a right. Everybody in america should get health care, but im not forcing everyone on to a onesizefitsall Program Designed in 1963. That is medicare for all. I think we would be better if a medicareforall program, a more modern version, a public option which is what president obama wanted from if beginning, competed against private option. If you have a private Health Care Plan that you like and you say, look, i look at the veterans, theyre not Getting Good Health Care at the va, i dont want to go into that, i want to keep my private plan, thats great. Just so you know, that private plan has to compete against the public plan and may the best win. It will bring down prices, bring down premiums, bring down Prescription Drug prices, and improve outcomes for everybody. I mean thats basic Market Competition that has always made this country strong. If it works for other places, it should work in health care. I mean sometimes think about the postal service. It is a Big Government monopoly. Imagine how much worse it would be if it didnt have to compete against u. P. S. And fedex. Thats what theyre advocating, no, were going to force u. P. S. And fedex out of the market, you have one choice if you want to mail something and it is the postal service. Consumers have choice. If we have it for sending packages we should have it in health care as well. Healthy competition. Well, with all of the people running for the primary democratic seat, you got some healthy competition ahead of you. Congressman seth molton, thank you so much for joining us today. We appreciate it. Thank you. Stay right here. Guess why . 2020 contender and vermont senator Bernie Sanders. Who likes medicare for all. He does. It is an embarrassment of riches for ali and i today. He Just Announced a plan to tackle Credit Card Debt and we will dig into the details with the senator next. Youre watching velshi and ruhle. Youre watching velshi and ruhle the best eggs. In so many ways. Which cage free eggs taste fresher and more delicious . Only egglands best. Which organic eggs have more vitamins and less saturated fat . Only egglands best. Better taste, better nutrition, better eggs. Did you know comcast business goes beyond fast with a gigspeed network. Complete internet reliability. Advanced voice solutions. Wifi to keep everyone connected. Video monitoring. Thats huge. Did you guys know we did all this stuff . No. Im not even done yet. Wow. Business tv. Cloud apps and support. Comcast business goes beyond at t. Start with internet and voice for just 59. 90 a month. Its everything a Small Business owner needs. Comcast business. Beyond fast. Today senator Bernie Sanders and new york congresswoman alexandria ocasiocortez are introducing a new bill to help americans deal with increasing amounts of debt. According to the federal reserve, as of march americans held more than 1 trillion worth of Credit Card Debt, and the average Interest Rate on that debt is 17. 73 . Thats according to creditcards. Com. The bill looks to cap credit card Interest Rates at 15 , laying out historical Interest Rates as a roadmap. They are taking on payday lenders who can charge ready for this . Between 300 and 900 Interest Rates on loans. The bill caps those at 15 just like credit cards. It also allows lowincome communities to do much of their banking at the post office. It is something that might sound a little strange. From the early 1900s until the early 1960s, thats exactly what the post office did. Sanders and ocasiocortez argue would allow lowincome access and prevent them from becoming prey. Joining us is vermont senator and 2020 democratic president ial candidate Bernie Sanders. Thank you for being with us again. Here is a question stephanie and i were talking about before we started the segment. If Interest Rates otherwise are set by the market, why have you decided a 15 cap is where to go . What happens if we get into a world where Interest Rates for mortgages and otherwise are higher . Shouldnt it be sort of a range thats related to Something Like the prime rate . Well, first of all, ali, what we should understand and what makes what banks are doing today so outrageous is they are borrowing money at 2. 5 and half of the people who are paying Interest Rates are paying more on credit cards, are paying more than 21 . So if your point is that if Interest Rates go up, might the maximum go up . That is also included in the legislation. Got it. Okay. All right. So what this would do, as you just articulated, is it would cut sharply into profits for lenders, the banks that make these loans and issue these credit cards. Do you have concern that because of that the banking lobby is very, very strong and they influence a lot of your colleagues, as you have known for the last few decades . Do i have concerns about that . Well, thats kind of an understatement. Look, you got wall street and the Drug Companies and the Insurance Companies basically running the United States congress. Thats why the rich are getting richer and so many people are struggling. But i think here and i mean this from the bottom of my heart, you have a profound moral issue. Every major religion, christianity, judaism, islam, every religion understands that usury and loan sharking are immoral. Lets call this what it is. This is loan sharking. Now, i dont know that the wellpaid executives on wall street go around breaking peoples fingers or their kneecaps, but what they are doing and think about this. Half of the American People today have no wealth at all. Theyre living paycheck to paycheck. You have a medical emergency, your car breaks down, these are desperate people. And then they go to wall street and theyre charged outrageous Interest Rates. Wall street profits are soaring. People get further and further in debt while wages remain stagnant. This really is disgusting and it has to we have to stand up to the greed of wall street and change it. Is there any avenue to work in a productive way and the reason i say this is because payday lending is the best example. We saw Great Strides to protect our most vulnerable americans against payday lenders in the last few years. Under the Consumer Protection bureau. Correct. And now the Consumer Protection bureau has had its lights knocked out. Right. And we know how powerful and well itty t wealthy the lobby of is payday lenders. Obviously the vulnerable americans cant go up against that kind of lobby. Right. So is there some sort of way to work with banks on finding a Common Ground . Because the risk we run is flipflopping administrations just going all the way one direction or the other. Because for those vulnerable americans it is devastating that were right back to where we were before 2008 as far as regulation goes. It is devastating and it is you know, i cant use the word outrageous when we talk about the trump administration. I guess thats become a hackneyed expression. It happens every day. But to make it easier for payday lenders to get blood out of a stone is really disgraceful. Can you work with the banks . Maybe, but i have my doubts. Look, this is what i believe and i think Many Americans agree, whether it is wall street, whether it is the pharmaceutical industry where the Top Ten Companies made 69 billion in profits last year while charging us the highest prices in the world. Whether it is the Insurance Companies who are going to end up spending 100 millions of dollars trying to defeat medicare for all. Whether it is the fossil fuel industry thats destroying the planet and lying about it. We are taking on an incredible amount of corporate greed, unlimited amounts of money, lobbying power, campaign contributions. What the American People really have got to do this is not rhetoric. This is reality. They have to stand up and say enough is enough. We need an economy that works for all people, not just the people on top. Senator, we just talked to congressman molton about health care. He doesnt support a medicare for all or a version of a singlepayer system. As you and i have talked about before, i grew up in canada so i am partial to a singlepayer system. But i wonder with medicare for all, why do you think it wouldnt have been more reasonable to retool the Affordable Act to work as it was initially conceived but not executed, as an insurance pool where everybody is in it, old and sick, young and healthy, with the young and healthy offsetting the costs for the old and sick . Talk to me about the thinking about why not retool that but go to a medicare for all system. Because you have a dysfunctional system. Thats all. It is a disfinksysfunctional sy which, you know, tens of millions are uninsured or underinsured. We pay the highest prices in the world for Prescription Drugs and we end up spending twice as much per capita on health care as do the people of canada or any other nation. You have to get to the root of that. The root of the Current Health care system is that it is not designed to provide quality care to all people. You can argue about the strengths and weaknesses of the canadian system or every other major country on earths systems, but theyre all designed to provide quality care to all people. Our system is designed to make huge profits for the Insurance Companies and the Drug Companies. Not only is that problematic, it creates an unbelievably complicated bureaucracy where we spend hundreds of billions of dollars on administration and billing and distorting health care priorities, such that we have a very weak primary Health Care System which not only is absolute imperative, it wastes enormous money if people cant walk in a Doctors Office when they should. The priorities are distorted. Massive amounts of bureaucracy, massive amounts of profit taking, and that system has to change. By the way, i would add to it. Medicare today for the elderly is the most Popular Health Insurance Program in america. What we are proposing is over a fouryear period, today 65 years of age and older, youre in medicare. Take it down to 55. Take it down to 45. Eventually over a fouryear period cover everybody. By the way, extend and expand benefits for seniors to cover dental care, hearing aids and eye glasses. Can your ambitious, progressive plans pull in all democrats . Nancy pelosi has said the number one priority for the Democratic Party should be to defeat donald trump. Do you believe your plans can pull the Party Together . Since joe biden absolutely. Official entered the race weve seen you drop in the polls. Absolutely. Look, what i believe is the way you beat trump, who is the most dangerous president i expect in modern history if not the history of our country, is bringing more people into the political process. That means speaking to working people who out of frustration in some cases voted for trump. It means getting young people involved in the political process and voting. What we saw in 2018 was a good step forward, and as more young people voted than in previous years but we have to do a lot better than that. So you expand the base, talking to working people and young people, and we expose trump for the fraud that he is when he said that he when he campaigned on being a friend of the working people. You do that, i think i can win. I can defeat trump in every poll that i have seen suggests we are ahead of trump, and i think that is the correct way to go forward. Can you swipe his base . President trump believes and many do that his base is bullet proof. But you and he had a similar message in the last election that it was economic populism. He hasnt delivered for those voters. Can you take them from him . Absolutely. Look, trump essentially lied to the American People who were hurting, and for too many years the democratic leadership ignored that pain and ignored the midwest and the flyover states. So when trump tells the American People during his campaign that he is going to provide health care to everybody remember that . Everybody. Well, then he fights to throw 32 Million People off of the Health Insurance they have. He said, hey, im a different type of republican. I will not cut medicare, medicaid, social security. Look at his budget. Massive cuts to medicaid and medicare, billions in cuts to social security. So i think that we can expose him for the fraud that he is and provide an alternative progressive agenda, which really does speak to the needs of working families. Senator, we know you have to go vote. Thank you for joining us. Thank you. Senator Bernie Sanders. I was just thinking about President Trump, whether he delivered to his voters, the flyover state working class voters. Carried interest. When carried interest was kept in the system, which is a nonsensical hookup for the private equity industry. We talked about it every day. How exactly did it help people staying in the system. Remember, we asked republican after republican day after day and they kept on saying, it will be worked out. It will be gone. And then the bill came out and it wasnt gone and everybody voted for it. And no one has come forward, not one single republican and owned it and said, yep, im the one who fought to keep it in. Maybe but who did . If nobody we talked to fought to keep carried interest as an exemption in the tax code, who did . I dont know. Let me think for a second. I remember steve schwartzman, the head of blackstone, running one of the president s ceo councils. Who knows, maybe the president did it. You may not like Bernie Sanders but the point he makes is clear, that lobbyists wrote tax policy in the country. The first time we had a Major Overhaul in a language time in tax policy and there were no public hearings, no input from regular people. It was a gift to Corporate America and lobbyists. We talked about it every day. Economic populism. We have to remember President Trump and Bernie Sanders share some of the same voters. We have to keep an eye on the voters and see where they go. People who are frustrated about how the Economic System has not wornked for them. Coming up, President Trump one gloated about skirting the tax code in a tweet. He said it was a sport. It could be what the Congress Needs to get his tax returns. Youre watching velshi and ruhle live on msnbc. Roxana when i got into teaching, it was this idea of really transforming our schools. Marisa one of my biggest responsibilities as a teacher is to serve as an advocate for my kids. Newscaster hundreds of teachers are hitting the picket lines. Newscaster thousands gathered here. Rosanne we need smaller class sizes. Angelia more counselors and more nurses. Roxana we have to be able to invest in our young people. Angelia every student has a right to quality education. Ever no matter what neighborhood you live in. Roxana our students dont have parttime needs, so they cant have parttime solutions. Rodney because we know quality public schools. Roxana make a better california. Marisa for all of us. So, you went online andter got so confused. Nia. That your brain went offline. Next time, ask your helpful cvs pharmacist. We created a proprietary search tool that analyzes ways to help lower your prescription costs. Just drop in. Before you conk out. See what you might save at cvs pharmacy. Welcome back. President trump himself may be undermining his argument for not releasing his tax returns. The president responded to a bombshell report by the New York Times that donald trump accumulated far more than a billion dollars in losses from 1985 to 1994. President trump reacted on twitter, claiming this. Real Estate Developers in the 1980s and 1990s were entitled to massive writeoffs and depreciation, which would, if one was actively building, show losses and tax losses in almost all cases. Much was not monetary, sometimes considered tax shelter. And then the president added that almost all real Estate Developers did it and that it was, quote, sport. With that tweet. Sport with that tweet a legal expert says the president has given the representatives a, quote, very good reason to look at his tax returns. The author of the piece joins us now, danielle himmel, assistant professor of law at the university of chicago. Daniel, what is your argument . Both sides of the aisle agree on that treasure ey needs to gi the tax returns. The house ways and Means Committee says its reason is that it has Oversight Authority over the irs. It needs to check to make sure that the irs is applying the same standards to the president that it is applying to every other taxpayer, every ordinary american. Why does the president s tweet change the math here . Why does it give them a reason . Well, just to make clear, i think the mat was already on the House Democrats side, but secretary mnuchen said you have no reason to be digging around trumps tax returns, you have no reason to suspect theres been any wrong doing here. Here we have the president in front of his 60 million twitter followers say that he considers tax dodging to be an athletic activity. That is as good evidence as how democrats could possibly want for why they need in the exercise of their oversight function to look at the way that the irs has been auditing the president. So here is the problem that i get stuck on. Claiming depreciation deductions for real estate is a legal practice. It may be unsavory, but it is legal. Thats different from donald trump allegedly engaging in dubious tax schemes as reported in this now Pulitzer Prize winning investigation by the New York Times, not the one that came out a couple of days ago but the one from months ago. What do you make of the president clamake of the presid claiming that other real Estate Developers engaged in, as he called it, a sport . For the viewers, a depreciation deduction is a write off that oners of buildings and assets that show wear and tear over the course of years. It is a deduction they can claim to show the gradual decline in the value of an asset. Every business is going to claim depreciation deductions. How much you could claim depended on your basis in the assess and there were games people played in the 1980s and early 1990s to inflate basis and therefore to claim larger depreciation deductions and therefore to write off more in tax liabilities. The irs didnt wasnt okay with those games. It challenged those games and it ultimately won a series of court cases. The court cases basically said if these are entirely, as trump said, nonmonetary losses, if they have no economic substance you cant claim them. Here is trump saying in front of the world he has been claiming deductions without economics behind them. Sport, claiming a game. Knowing all of this, what is the next move for those who want to see his taxes . Great. I think there are two moves we should be watching for. First, the house ways and Means Committee is probably in the next few days going to hopefully issue a subpoena to treasury secretary mnuchen saying, hand over trumps tack returns. We know how those work. We will see a battle in court. I think here ultimately ways and means should win. Ways and means have a second, better way to get it or a second quicker way to get it which is to go to new york state, which has most of the relevant tax information. The new York State Senate passed a bill yesterday, 3921, that would authorize the state tax commissioner to hand over trump or any taxpayers state tax files if it got a legitimate request from the ways and Means Committee. I am interviewing the author of that law at 3 00 this afternoon from new york state. Daniel, thank you for joining us. He is from the university of chicago and an assistant professor of law there. Just made us definitely a little smarter. Yes. Next, we have to take a turn to this. Pope francis issued a new law to address the Catholic Churchs global sex abuse crisis. We will look at the policy and speak with one survivor about whether or not it is enough, or even if it is a start. You are watching velshi and ruhle. You dont want to miss this conversation. Ss this conversation to most, hes Phil Mickelson pro golfer. To me, hes well, dad. So when his joint pain from Psoriatic Arthritis got really bad it scared me. And what could that pain mean . Joint pain could mean joint damage. Enbrel helps relieve joint pain helps stop irreversible joint damage. And helps skin get clearer. Enbrel may lower your ability to fight infections. Serious, sometimes fatal events including infections, tuberculosis, lymphoma, other cancers, nervous system and blood disorders, and allergic reactions have occurred. Tell your doctor if youve been some place where fungal infections are common, or if youre prone to infections, have cuts or sores, have had hepatitis b, have been treated for heart failure, or if you have persistent fever, bruising, bleeding, or paleness. Dont start enbrel if you have an infection like the flu. Since enbrel, dads back to being dad. Visit enbrel. Com and use the joint damage simulator to see how your joint damage could be progressing. Ask about enbrel. Enbrel fda approved for over 16 years. Ive always been amazed and still going for my best, even though i live with a higher risk of stroke due to afib not caused by a heart valve problem. So if theres a better treatment than warfarin. I want that too. Eliquis. Eliquis is proven to reduce stroke risk better than warfarin. Plus has significantly less major bleeding than warfarin. Eliquis is fdaapproved and has both. Whats next . Reeling in a nice one. Dont stop taking eliquis unless your doctor tells you to, as stopping increases your risk of having a stroke. Eliquis can cause serious and in rare cases fatal bleeding. Dont take eliquis if you have an artificial heart valve or abnormal bleeding. While taking eliquis, you may bruise more easily and it may take longer than usual for any bleeding to stop. Seek immediate medical care for sudden sign of bleeding, like unusual bruising. Eliquis may increase your bleeding risk if you take certain medicines. Tell your doctor about all planned medical or dental procedures. Eliquis, the number one cardiologistprescribed blood thinner. Ask your doctor if eliquis is whats next for you. Welcome back to velshi and ruhle. Pope francis has issued a new law require inall catholic priests and nuns to report and investigate sexual abuse within the church. The law is going to affect 415,000 catholic priests and 660,000 nuns around the world. It calls for them to inform Church Authorities when they learn of the following. When a cleric has engaged in sexual abuse of a minor, Sexual Misconduct with with a minor, o adult, possession of child pornography or a superior has covered up any of those crimes. One big flaw in this is that it does not require priests or nuns to report those events that the police. The vatican says reporting those incidents to police could put the church in danger. Catholic sexual abuse survivor Shawn Dougherty joins us, a Founding Members of pennsylvanians united to protect children in order to protect children in the future while assisting older victims with coping. Youve helped us make sense of and interpret some developments in the church over the last year or so. What is your initial reaction to this . These have already been in effect and the bishopss are mandated to tell the police already. When is the church ordering the church to report to the church. So is it almost worse because suddenly shouldnt there be an this should be the number one thing first, end of story, call the police and if not youre in trouble with the vatican. These are centuries old tactics. This is not a new policy. No, these are centuries old ta tact tactics. This is a little red meat for, you know, the people that are hoping for them to do something to say, look, were doing something. If they really intended to protect children they would call authorities immediately. They would turn over every document that they have. These practices are centuries old. Human beings, generation after generation, the victims die out, the church doesnt die out. The position doesnt die out. Do you think its not enough or its no good . In other words, is this cover for continuing bad behavior or a very, very small step in the right direction . Its a i dont necessarily want to say its bad but i will say it is a nod in the right direction. To an enabling ear this is just more enabling. You know, the people in the report are bishops. Redacted names from the pennsylvania grand jury reports, theyre already mandated to report so we found that those reports say that the bishops are covering up for these people so the vatican is going to get the report and then theyre going to decide what is credible then theyll decide who gets what punishment or whatever. No. Go to the police. Dont if youre abused or your child is abused dont go to the bishops, dont go to the pastor, dont go to the nun, dont go to the teacher. Dont go to the principal. Call the police immediately. The police will contact the church for you. Trust me. Theyre listening now. Theyll do it. One of the reasons theyre listening now is because of people like you. Can you talk for a moment about how things have changed drastically even though this is a nod and not enough . Before social media existed, you know, the church, media, big business, these were impenetrable forces that an individual, a victim couldnt break through. Can you talk for a moment about how social media has empowered you and given you and thousands of other victims a voice thats actually hit the church where it hurts . You hit on it in my announcement when you brought me on. Before you announced me as a survivor. Today you announced me as a survivor and Founding Member of pennsylvanians united to protect children. If you like, follow and share our Facebook Page, we are a group of united victims collectively across pennsylvania, victim driven, victim run. We are going to hole everybodys feet to the fire, the legislators, the church, the media, everybody. Up until this point weve already had somebody handling us. Were handling ourselves. We are our Facebook Page reached a thousand people within the first 24 hours from i think 20 some Different Countries and growing fast. Go to facebook, like, follow and share our page. Pennsylvanians united to protect children. Social media is the most powerful entity in the world and that is the key to all of this. This is something we have to remember because we spend a lot of time criticizing social media for a lot of things it does wrong but it is always important to remember shauns story. Created a force. Thank you so much. I really appreciate the opportunity. All right, breaking news, the United States has just taken over a north korean ship. Well have the details on why coming up. You are watching velshi ruhle. If these industrial plants had technology that captured carbon like trees we could help lower emissions. Carbon capture is Important Technology and experts agree. Thats why were working on ways to improve it. So plants. Can be a little more. Like plants. kickstart my heart by motley crue truck honks wheels screeching clapping sound of can hitting bag and bowl clapping always there in crunch time. Listen to your mom, knuckleheads. Hand em over. Hand what over . Video games, whatever you got. Lets go. You can watch videos of people playing video games in the morning. Is that everything . I can see whos online. Im gonna sweep the sofa fort. Well, look what i found. Take control of your wifi with xfinity xfi. Lets roll now thats simple, easy, awesome. Xfinity xfi gives you the speed, coverage and control you need. Manage your wifi network from anywhere when you download the xfi app today. We got breaking news. Today the United States has taken ownership of a 17,000ton north korean freight ship that was caught shipping coal in violation of u. S. Sanction. Joining us now with more on what happened and how it happened, tom winter. Im telling you, tom covers everything that is complicated. So basically what happened is this ship which was called the wise honest was reflagging itself to try to misidentify where it was coming from, doctoring documents, in shipping coal in violation of u. N. Sanctions, basically this would be coal from north korea and shipped to other countries and get back other heavy equipment and heavy materials they would then ship back to north korea. All of that because they would use u. S. Funds, moved through new york banks and the banks did not is any knowledge of this. The u. S. Attorneys Office Making it clear. Three banks they would move through that do business in new york and it is a u. S. Jurisdiction and were able to put forward a seizing motion or warrant i should say with the district judge here in new york and now that vessel, the second largest vessel that north korea has is right now en route to america samoa. How is that enforced . So, its enforced it involves the coast guard and state department and involves Law Enforcement officials abroad. The judge signs that warrant here and says, yes, in fact, the u. S. Has the ability to seize that ship and a complaint was unsealed. A civil forfeiture and they say youve committed an illegal act so we want the ability to seize the ship youre looking at right now on screen. We want to have the ability to get that the North Koreans can contest that in court, in federal court here in new york but these cases typically theyre not going to have a good chance of getting this vessel back. Right now its in u. S. Custody on the way to america samoa and the Justice Department is feeling this is the second largest ship they have. This is something they ship Raw Materials on. Which is what they have to ship. I mean thats north korea for you. Thats all they got so this right now is strikes a blow. I want to make one thing clear. I know there was a lot of activity with north korea with respect to missile launch, the Justice Department making clear today this is announcement and unsealing is not connected at all. Tom, as always, thank you, sir. Tom winter, nbc investigations unit. Very smart. If the goal is to lets get smarter, i dont know about you, im going to tell you, as the recipient of all this information just a little secret, we never know. Tom sits down and never know why or what has happened and it sort of doesnt matter. Wow. Knock my socks off on that one. There you go. Thank you for watching this hour of velshi ruhle. Right now we sent you down to washington, d. C. Where Kristen Welker picks up coverage. I get smarter every day watching you guys. I mean, i dont know about everyone else. You guys have great information. Great to see you guys. Good afternoon, everyone. Im Kristen Welker in for katy tur. Last hour we heard directly from the president on the Senate Intelligence committees subpoena of his son donald trump jr. In short he was very surprised. Hes now testified for 20 hours or something, a massive amount of time. The Mueller Report came out. Thats the bible. The Mueller Report came out and they said he did nothing wrong. The only thing is