Crisis, a crisis of the heart and a crisis of the soul. How much more american blood must we shed before congress does its job as part of an overall approach to Border Security, Law Enforcement professionals have requested 5. 7 billion for a physical barrier. At the request of democrats, it will be a steel barrier rather than a concrete wall. The wall will also be paid for indirectly by the great new trade deal we have made with mexico. The federal government remains shutdown for one reason, and one reason only, because democrats will not fund Border Security. The president has chosen fear. We want to start with the facts. The fact is we all agree we need to secure our borders while honoring our values. The fact is President Trump must stop holding the American People hostage and stop manufacturing a crisis, and must reopen the government. The symbol of america should be the statue of liberty, not a 30foot wall. Most president s have used oval office addresses for noble purposes. This president just used the backdrop of the oval office to manufacture a crisis, stoke fear, and divert attention from the turmoil in his administration. If there is a crisis at the border, why didnt the president declare a National Emergency in his speech . Something were looking at, something certainly still on the table. I think that is a last resort. I think he played it just right. In the midst of this partial Government Shutdown, the president offered a reminder of just whats at stake. That is, the security of our nations southern border. It was a little more than a rehash of spurious arguments and misleading statistics that the president s been using for weeks. We dont have operational control of our border, but the way you do that is with 21st century technology, not a 4th century solution. Im against using department of defense dollars for any other purpose. Im for a wall and im for supporting our troops and none of us none of us should have to choose between the two. I think it is incumbent on democrats and republicans to find something between zero and 5. 7 billion. The president wablnts a figh. I dont think the president wants to reopen the government. I know its going to be inconvenient and financial hardship, i hate that. But this is the best chance ive seen for a solution to Border Security and other things. We heard reports earlier this morning that named five different republicans in the senate who said that they would like to see a vote. Would your name be added to that list at some point . Potentially, but, you know, im not there right now. You know whats going to happen today . Were all going to be in the room. Being one of the people in the room, i want to solve the problem. Id like to stay in that room until it gets solved. What we want to say is if we can come to some agreement, we want it in writing so the public can see it so that so it doesnt change. And take a look at that. That is the motorcade of the president of the United States on its way from the white house to the capital. The president is going to meet lawmakers at capitol hill. Well keep you posted on how that develops. As of now, no developments. Welcome back to velshi and ruhle. Its day 19 of the partial Government Shutdown. This is now the second longest shutdown in u. S. History. And President Trump is not backing down on his demand for a wall. That is despite 800,000 Government Employees going another day, wondering what theyre going to do if they dont receive a paycheck. Do you hear what im saying . If people who have been doing their jobs dont get a paycheck in two days, some of them are already applying for unemployment benefits. All right. Were going to continue to follow, the president is going to get to capitol hill. Well report on what hes doing. He seems to have just arrived. The president has arrived at president hill. He is going to meet with Senate Republicans during their policy lunch. He is going to try to sure up support for his border wall. Solidarity is beginning to crack as they are calling for government to reopen while negotiations continue. Moments ago while signing an antiHuman Trafficking bill at the white house, donald trump told reporters why he thinks the wall is necessary. Look, we can all play games, but a wall is a necessity. All of the other things, the sensors and the drones, its all wonderful to have, it works well but only if you have the wall. If you dont have the wall, it doesnt matter. A drone isnt stopping a thousand people from running through. And so we can all talk and you know, interestingly, if you look, every, virtually ever democrat over the last 15 years, theyve approved what were asking for. So i think were doing something, i think were getting closer, but we really have to think about the people of our country. This is not a fight i wanted. I didnt want this fight. Thats not true. The president 100 he said so in the white house. He was quite prepared for this fight. Theres mike pence standing next to the president. When were going to listen in. They all know we need Border Security. We need to have people stop being killed at our border. And the democrats are losing a lot of support. Last night was a big victory for the republicans, but it was really a big victory for america, for our country. The democrats have lost support. There is tremendous republican support unwaivering as you probably know. Why not declare a National Emergency . Why not declare a National Emergency if theres a crisis on the the president not answering questions about National Emergency. He did say at the white house hes still considering this. Can we correct something . The president is continuing on this narrative, democrats, they need to get the votes from democrats. We have no confirmation what republicans have all their votes in line. In the last year and a half, President Trump was not able to get funding for his wall from republicans who did control congress. Right, its really clear, he promised this during the election. For two years he had the ability to get this done and it didnt get done. Here we see the president walking into the capital. Theres Sarah Sanders. Theres jared kushner. And thats not the president. Bill shine is there. Hes coming in. Hes going to head hes going to have this conversation, this lunch with republicans and congress and hes going to head back to the white house this afternoon to continue to meet with congressional leaders. Remember, you know, yesterday, President Trump had that off the record meeting with tv anchors. The New York Times reported the president in that meeting said he didnt want to do the president ial address last night. He does president want to go to the border wall. He didnt think it would make a difference. He pointed at bill shine and Sarah Sanders and kellyanne conway. But those people think it was a good idea. Last night was bill shines brain child. Theyre trying to figure out a way to get republicans together. Theyre about to find out, did that work . I mentioned it earlier. To me it was stunning. Moments after the president gave his remarks last night, you saw theres the president now and mike pence. You saw on fox the company where bill shine was the former president absolutely factchecking the president , myth busting all the sort of misrepresentations. Lets listen in. Are republicans with you today end . We need Border Security. Tremendous republican support and i think were going to win. We need listen, we need Border Security, very simple. Whatever it takes. Well, what you should do is take a look at last night and see the results this morning. The people know we need Border Security. Thank you very much. All right. The president says were going to win, not were going to reopen the government, were going to win. Border security and the wall are not the same thing. Can we help our audience know . There is not an equal sign between the two. Enhanced Border Security is what both democrats and republicans are looking for. What the president and a portion of his base is looking for is specifically a wall. The wall is the sticking point, not Border Security. Although the wall was a promise paid for by mexico. Thats gone away. I want to apologize to you for something. My 3 00 p. M. Show, the executive producer came back, her birthday, we were celebrating, we got mexican food. I ate it until showtime and i didnt get a chance to brush my teeth. Build the wall. During the show yesterday ali gave me a breath mint. I was sharing. It wasnt about you. Today its about me. When someone says, do you have a breath mint . You check. Unprompted someone offers you a breath mint, someone offers you mid show makes me nervous. I was projecting. Theres no breath mint. If anybody has one, please send it to me. Happy birthday. Nbcs ali vitale is in boon. Near a border crossing, she got reaction to the president s speech from those who know the conditions at the border firsthand. We want to get out there and get outside of washington and Start Talking about how this is affecting real people. Lets start with allie vitale. You talked to people who have a story about how theyre facing the shutdown. Reporter ali, youre right. The president in the oval office at one point he called the workers patriots which is absolutely true. He also said he thinks they are with him on this and thats not what i heard at all from the family were going to stop you because you definitely sound like youre in an aquarium. Right . Youre not at an aquarium, youre under the water. Were going to fix that audio. You have important things to say and we cant hear. Hopefully Mariana Atencio is above ground. Shes in la raid owe, texas. Many people in that border town, help us understand their perspective. I know they were watching last night. Reporter so, im not in an aquarium. Im actually in the busiest part of the border when it comes to trade, guys. Just to give you an idea, in 2017, 200 billion worth of trade came through this port between the u. S. And mexico. So its extremely busy. And then you also have the Border Patrol here telling us that its also an active part of the border. They apprehended 32,000 people trying to cross illegally last fiscal year. And they say that a thousand of those are gang members. So theres a lot of things here at play. Everything that happens in washington has a big impact here. And what i guess what stuck out to me the most last night was a lot of mixed opinions. Everyone was, one, paying attention, and everyone was cordially discussing with each other why they disagreed. I want to play some of those sound bites for you from the president s primetime address, the reaction here in laredo. Lets listen. Shouldnt be political. I mean, it is a crisis, we know its a crisis. Ive lived on the border all my life so i know its a crisis. Here in south texas, we dont see a crisis. I know its a matter of degrees, but leadership here, i confidently can say we dont see a crisis either humanitarian or otherwise. Reporter do you think he should continue the shutdown to get funding for the wall when other Border Patrol agents are not getting paid over this . I dont like that idea. Ive been through four of those in my career. Its not a good thing. But i dont think its totally his fault, but it has to come somethings got to give. I think the wall is necessary. If i were to see a wall go up in my community, i would feel very oppressed by that. I love the fact that i live in a community that has this binational fluidity. Reporter so one of the things, steph, that you were talking about before is does Border Security equal a concrete border wall like the president is asking for. And if you listen to that local resident that we just heard from, many people hearsay no, because in this area of the border, you have the rio grand river. It already acts as a sort of natural barrier. So most of the people here that ive spoken to, even those who voted and support the president , say they do want the drones, they do want the technology. What they call here a virtual wall, not a concrete wall. Guys . The president has created sort of a false equivalency here. If you dont want his wall, you must not be in favor of Border Security. Ive actually yet to meet anybody who says theyre not. All the stuff weve done over the last several months to illustrate the dangers of the border. The president said 3755like terrorists came across the border, turns out it was six. I think we can agree we want zero. Zero. Whatever technology and Law Enforcement gets us there makes sense. Republicans and those who mariana are talking to, the wall is not actually the solution to the problems we have to deal with. To that very point, when Sarah Sanders this morning i believe it was on fox business was asked about her misstatement or misrepresentation about the 4,000 terrorists or six people have entered, her response was it doesnt matter if its 4, 14 or 4,000, we want zero. Shes right, we, too, want zero. We can totally get smart people think there are ways of getting to zero that dont involve 20 plus billion dollars on a wall. The president is asking for 5. 7 billion. 5. 7 billion is not even a down payment on a wall. If you want the number to be zero, admit that its 4 or 6, not 4,000. If youre inflating the number to 4,000, for what reason would you be doing that . And you bring up a great point or mariana did there when she was talking about, listen, people want a virtual wall or they want drone surveillance. Putting up a big beautiful concrete wall with a draw bridge, why wouldnt you want the most advanced technology . Now hes going for steel. Because he claims that democrats are asking for it which theyre not. The other part of this thing, while Border Security is remarkably important valid debate we need to get to the bottom of, there are people who are really suffering because theyre out of work. Allie vitale, you can be hear. Reporter basically when i spent the day with the Zimmerman Family yesterday, they said what you just paraphrased. Its not about to them the debate over whether there should be a wall or debate over Border Security. They dont understand why theyre not getting patd while congress has that debate. The husband is the sole source of income. Hes a furloughed federal worker, environmental engineer here in iowa. Hes saying that financially theyre okay until march. They have sort of a Rainy Day Fund for situations such as these. But there is a Family Impact that they told me about, too. Take a listen. He cries. He doesnt understand. He keeps saying, how come theyre not talking . And i dont have an answer. Why arent you at work . Well, why arent they doing something . He keeps asking why. And i dont have an answer because i dont understand myself. Everybody talks about 800,000 federal employees. Well, thats just the 800,000 of us who work. How many wives, husbands, spouses, partners, children, parents, how many more people are associated with that 800,000 employees . We both are just hoping that someone in washington, some group of someones are going to come to their senses and do something, like their jobs. Reopen the government. Yeah. Reporter and, ali and steph, they want them to reopen the government. They say the border debate has nothing to do with that. When i talked to kate this morning and asked if she watched the president apartments address last night, she said she didnt feel like the president was talking to them. He didnt mention furloughed workers, she doesnt feel they are top of mind. He asked about furloughed workers, he called them patriots. Thats true. He said most of them are with him on this. Thats not the vibe i got here today. Missing your mortgage payment, there is nothing about that that shines out as patriotic. That is unnecessary and a hardship on americans that they will spend years getting out of because of the damage you do to your credit rating. Thats the worst thing you can do to a credit rating. Thank you so much. When the president said people can adjust, there is not an adjust when your bills arrive and youve already spent that money because you obviously were expecting to get paid for work done, sir. How long for people to adjust after the recession when they wreck their credit and miss their mortgage payments, in some cases lost their house . Why would you impose that upon people voluntarily . Ali, even in the subprime crisis there is an argument to be made. Maybe people shouldnt have bought that home, they couldnt afford it. People went to work, performed the work, are owed money and theyre not being paid. All right. Were going to dig into the negotiations, so as they are, between President Trump and the democrats and trump insists that his border wall is going to solve americas problems on drugs and crime. Thats not actually true. Were going to offer solutions for what could actually work when were dealing with drugs and crime. Youre watching velshi and ruhle live on msnbc. boy got it. dad its slippery. boy nooooooo. grandma nooooooo. dad nooooooo. dog yessssss. vo quick, the quicker picker upper bounty picks up messes quicker and is two times more absorbent than the leading ordinary brand. boy hey look, i got it. Bounty, the quicker picker upper. In them therr hills on your guarantevacation. Find gold but we can guarantee the best price on this rental cabin. Or any accomodation from hotels to yurts. Booking. Com, booking. Yeah your but as you get older,hing. It naturally begins to change, causing a lack of sharpness, or even trouble with recall. Thankfully, the breakthrough in prevagen helps your brain and actually improves memory. The secret is an ingredient originally discovered. In jellyfish. In clinical trials, prevagen has been shown to improve shortterm memory. Prevagen. Healthier brain. Better life. Hey, batter, batter, [ crowd cheers ] like everyone, i lead a busy life. But i know the importance of having time to do what you love. At comcast we know our customers time is valuable. Thats why we have 2hour appointment windows, including nights and weekends. So you can do more of what you love. My name is tito, and im a techhouse manager at comcast. Were working to make things simple, easy and awesome. All right. Negotiations i want to point out during the commercial ali said to me, stephanie, this is all you. They said go. I go like this and he starts talking. Go. He literally okay, steph, this is all you. Go ahead. Do you know the negotiations underway . All yours, biggie. Theres negotiations underway. The president has gone to talk to republicans at congress. Republicans in congress, its not like republicans and democrats are completely on the other side. There are a lot of republicans who dont see the need for this wall or the money that needs to go into it or the fact that the government should be shutdown over it. I do think there are negotiations to be had about what good Border Security looks like. People agree we need enhanced Border Security. But when you continue to hear this narrative, the president versus democrats, it is not the president versus democrats. It is the president , a faction of his supporters trying to convince congress, a congress that wasnt convinced the last two years to fund his border wall. Joining us is bill crystal, defending democracy together and editor at large of bulwark. And msnbcs Garrett Haake live on capitol hill. Bill, i go to you first. The president said in his remarks, how much more american blood must be shed before congress does its job . When he said that, i thought, ive said the same thing, but ive said it after the parkland shooting, after newtown, after vegas. When the president gives a Statement Like this and clearly, trying to incite fear in the country do people believe him . Actually given Fact Checking after. If this is a necessity, thats the word he used, the wall is a necessity. The republicans controlled congress for two years. The president was a president. They had a majority. They could pass bills with 51 votes or 50 votes plus the vicepresident. They did so, right . The tax bill, obamacare repeal, they fell short, that was under reconciliation. They changed the rules on filibuster so they could confirm gorsuch and kavanaugh. If this was a necessity they could have passed it. It wasnt a necessity. Thats the big lie. There are a lot of little lies about the wall and cement and steel. How many people are coming across the border. The big lie is the president himself ever thought this it was a necessity, he didnt. He could have governed if it were. He never made this a mustpass item added to a reconciliation bill and said this is as important to us as tax cuts. He never did it. I really think it would be a big mistake actually for even to treat this as a negotiation in good faith in a sense. Its not a real i think the speaker is right and schumer. They need to insist the government reopen first. You cannot let yourself be taken hostage this way by a president acting in bad faith. And i think the question is do Senate Republicans buckle, do they separate, do they remember that they are elected by their own constituents, they dont work for the president , and i think they do buckle actually in a couple of days. You tweeted the prediction, the government will be open by the end of the week as Mitch Mcconnell bows to the wishes of his colleagues and to political reality and cuts a deal with pelosi and quietly takes great delight in throwing trump under the bus. Do you believe thats going to happen . Mitch mcconnell has been i mean, hes been pretty silent. I mean, i keep hoping that theyll break with trump, theyll have some sense of both public spirit and pride and not being pathetic subservient pawns to the president and they should do the right thing. They voice voted this budget, the same budget without the 5. 6 billion, whatever it is, three weeks, four weeks ago. The president said that was fine with him. Well have a different debate, separate debate on Homeland Security and the wall and Border Security and how much money needs to be spent on different aspects of it. Thats what we do in the legislation. Thats what legislatures do. The president reversed himself and now hes holding the entire government, a third of the government hostage to the wall. Mcconnell thinks its wrong im sure. Im sure mcconnell is annoyed at the president. Does he have the guts and others have enough guts to say this is nuts, let us pass by majority, open the rest of the government and lets have a normal debate as we should in legislation and appropriations on Border Security. Garrett, the president said he would own the shutdown. But the ones who are bearing the brunt of all the angry constituents are those congressmen and women. So, is the president going to get an earful from those republicans hes meeting with now . Hes trying to convince them, lets continue with this Government Shutdown, and their phone lines are ringing off the hook in their home states and people who arent getting paid. Well, if past is prologue, he wont. Im old enough to remember several of these other lunches when the president came in times of crisis real or manufactured in times when lawmakers were upset with him. I remember when he was attacking john mccain regularly, including after mccain got diagnosed with brain cancer and everyone thought the republican senators were going to push back really hard against the president and tell him that was unacceptable and it didnt happen. The structure of these lunches has been typically that the president comes in, gives his remarks, gets a round of applause and there is not a lot of q a and not a lot of push back. What will be incredibly telling is if that pattern changes today. We know theres half a dozen republican senators or so who have signalled varying degrees of willingness to break with the president on separating the wall from the shutdown, including some who have been willing to prove their free thinking on some issues with their votes. Susan collins and Lisa Murkowski most notably who broke with the president on health care. Murkowski doing it again on kavanaugh. These are folks who have pushed back in the past, could push back here behind closed doors. But right now the machinery of the white house is pushing very, very hard in one direction, and do any of these senators have amongst themselves, even as a Single Person or as a unit enough to push back on the president and change course . It seems unlikely at this point. Bill, the New York Times reports that trump is actually stephanie was talking about this dismissing his own strategy as pointless. Peter baker is writing off the lunch hours before the address, the president made clear in blunt terms he was not inclined to give the speech or go to texas, but was talked into it by advisors. Bill, it seems to me he was talking the entire shutdown by people who convinced him going along with the senate voice vote that you talked about was the wrong idea and that his base would turn on him. It does seem a little weird to be governing this way. It does. I think garrett is right about the republican senator so far. Well see if that changes. Lisa murkowski is one to watch. Alaska has a lot of government workers who are dependent on transactions with parts of the government like the interior department. Businessmen deal with government all the time. The shutdown really has a real effect on her constituents and on businesses in her state and shes always been a little more courageous than some of many of her colleagues, i would say. So i mean, well see if finally we get some stiffening of the spine by republican senators. I do think they will start hearing democrats should really put the pressure on. The president of the United States is going on a photo op that he himself says is pointless, which will cost a lot of money to texas. Half his cabinet is flying off to davos next week. Ordinary government workers who are working in good faith or told to be furloughed are not getting their paychecks and people who deal with the government, depend on the government are having their businesses and their lives in all kinds of ways disrupted. I really think if the democrats cant win this fight politically the next two, three, four days, thats kind of pathetic. I do believe if we are still in Government Shutdown, i dont believe the president or his team will be going to davos. Bill, what about what how the democrats clearly articulated enough, and not just for their base, but for a broader audience. The president loves this whole border the wall and Border Security are the same thing. Theyre not. But how democrats gotten out a clear message, we want to do one, two, three, which could make people believe that it is a big priority for them . I mean, the house could pass separately, you know, the right kind of funding for Border Security tomorrow as well. I think theyve been a little unimaginative. You read an article about the t. S. A. , lines at the airport. Why doesnt Speaker Pelosi bring up funding for the t. S. A. Or the faa or particular things that affect travelers in one bill, and pickup Something Else in another bill. People lose track of what is a big appropriations bill and there are reasons technically why these appropriations are for each cabinet agency. I think they can be more imaginative and put pressure on the president and making clear this president on his own, with republicans going along with him unfortunately, is instead of engaging in a serious debate about Border Security which most members of congress would be happy to take a look not just take a look at, but engage in and pass some of the things the president wants, he is holding a third of the federal government hostage. They can be a little more imaginative, the democrats. You saw, you know, Chuck Schumer and nancy pelosi, impressive people. Not exactly fresh blood or young people, i might have put a couple 40yearold new members up there who serve our country hold on a second. Bill, wait. Are we saying we should have somebody other than the president because hes in his 70s . No, it was kind of ridiculous. Fresh blood governing the country. Donald trump, nancy pelosi, Chuck Schumer, its a tax bill question. Wouldnt it be more interesting to see some of the newly elected members of congress who served in the military say we have served our country in a spirited way, this cannot be allowed to stand. We speak not as democrats, but americans. Thats the line the democrats have to take. They have a lot of good spokesmen and women who can take that line credibly. Im not criticizing them. Its just a fact, for 20, 30 years are the best spokes men at this point or women for the democratic party. All right, guys, good to talk to you. Thank you. Bill crystal and Garrett Haake. I dont know whats going on with congress, whether were going to get anything out of this particular meeting. As garrett says, they dont tend to amount to much. Bill made the most interesting point to me. Hes calling it he could be calling this a National Emergency. What happened in the last nine days that made it a National Emergency . Because ten days ago it wasnt an emergency. It wasnt its kind of weird. There is nothing more thats happened. All of the stuff donald trump is concerned about was in place in the last two years. If anything, theres been a decline in the number of people coming over the border. Correct. The question of why now is really interesting. It wasnt an emergency when republicans had control 11 days ago. Very strange. All right, coming up next, there is so much noise and heated debate over this physical barrier, i want to take a step away from that for a moment. How do you actually fix the problems with our immigration sis democrat . I think we can all agree there are many problems. Many of them dont have to do with people coming over a border illegally. Many of them have to do with how we assign visas to people and how were not getting the people we want to come into the country because there arent enough visas. What does reform look like . One of the solutions, were going to Talk Real Solutions next. Youre watching velshi and ruhle. What to wear. New aveeno® cracked skin cica ointment. With shea butter and triple oat complex. For fast relief and a protective barrier for lasting relief. Wear what you love, aveeno®. Youre smart,eat you already knew that. But its also great for finding the perfect used car. Youll see what a fair price is and you can connect with a truecar certified dealer. Now youre even smarter. This is truecar. Billions of problems. Sore gums . Bleeding gums . Painful flossing . Theres a therabreath for you. Therabreath healthy gums oral rinse fights gingivitis and plaque and prevents gum disease for 24 hours. So you can. Breathe easy, theres therabreath at walmart. All right. The president s address from the oval office mashed together several issues many of which are very important. Pitching the border wall as a cureall solution, but as the shutdown grinds on over the question of the wall, not actually about immigration, we want to separate out exactly which each of these issues are, and then work on solutions. Lets take the first one. Every day customs and Border Patrol agents encounter thousands of Illegal Immigrants trying to enter our country. All americans are hurt by uncontrolled illegal migration. Uncontrolled illegal migration. Before the speech the white house circulated a paper document showing projections from customs and Border Protection that the southwest Border Apprehensions are expected to rise. Thats the expected to rise, hitting about 600,000 in the fiscal year 2019. That seems like quite a spike from recent years. But its a fraction of apprehensions from the 2000s. It was higher in the 1980s. Through the 2000s, dropped down in 2003, bit of a spike, take a look at this. This is where apprehensions at the southern border are now compared to where they were back in 2000. And then there is this topic. Women and children are the biggest victims, by far, of our broken system. This is the tragic reality of illegal immigration on our southern border. Okay. So, there are more family units and unaccompanied minors at the border arriving 12,000 in october of 2017 to nearly 36,000 in november of 2018, and that is a vulnerable population. But the administrations recent deal with mexico to force many asylum seekers, including families with young children, to stay in mexico and not be processed, doesnt help the situation and neither would a wall. These families face far more crime in mexico waiting for their asylum claim waiting to play out in the United States. And then weve got this. Our southern border is a pipeline for vast quantities of illegal drugs, including meth, heroin, cocaine and fentanyl. Okay. Again, a wall would be an expensive band aid on the edge of the wound in this case. According to the deas 2015 National Drug threat assessment, cartels, quote, transport the bulk of their drugs over the southwest border through ports of entry. In trucks, hidden on people. Its something former d. H. S. Secretary john kelly, then the chief of staff of the white house, pointed out in a 2017 senate hearing. Tell us, what are the most important metrics that we need to be cognizant of. Another metric would be the amount of and it mostly comes through the ports of entry which is another discussion that we can certainly have here. But the amount of drugs that come through. All right. As for fentanyl specifically, dea testimony pointed to, quote, numerous illicit fentanyl class substances, the mass majority of which are manufactured in china, Msnbcs Jacob Soboroff has reported over and over again that are easily obtained through the mail and come in through airports. That is a problem that a wall would do nothing to stop. Steph . So, lets talk about the issues and the solutions. Weve identified several different problems so lets figure out how could we potentially fix them. Joining us now is the anchor and executive producer of n. P. R. s latino usa, maria hinahosa. Walk us through, what would a solution, comprehensive solution look like . Wow, and weve got how much time . Okay. So, its so complicated, but lets just say im doing a big investigation right now into the Guest Worker Program. Some people say, okay, lets the Guest Worker Program is something of a solution, but its actually not the Guest Worker Program is basically, lets say large farms or small farms are able to bring in Seasonal Workers and its all aboveboard. In the system. Theyre in the system. It sounds great temporary visa. It is a temporary visa. But ive been reporting on this for about 20 years. There are a lot of problems with the Guest Worker Program because basically its a kind of indentured servitude. If i complain the way ali is treating me youre out of the country. Basically if ali gets me back here every year im going to take the bad working conditions, bad housing conditions. Guest worker program, a lot of people say its a solution, but there is something deeply wrong with it, which gets to the issue of what were really talking about right now is the fact that arch right wing conservatives, republican some White Supremacists want to change the narrative of who we are as a country. What about solutions thats what i was going to tell you. Who we are as a country, we have always brought in immigrants. Were a country, apart from slavery, that is of immigrants. So, this notion of closing down is not realistic. People are going to continue to come here. So what do you do . People want to be identified, people dont want to be undocumented. They dont want to be its hard to be no one wants that. If there was a process through which people could come and say, this is who i am, this is you can find me in fact, we already have this, right, because there are people who are working with tax i. D. Numbers so they could be found. People would do that just so that they wouldnt have to have this daca was actually a move in that in the right direction. It was. Lets see, what was happening a year ago . There was a Government Shutdown talking about daca and the dreamers. Thats right. Oh, gee, what happened and the support for daca is overwhelming in america. It is overwhelming. You see how quickly the conversation changed. The democratic response did not bring up children, did not bring up children in cages, or daca or the fact that we have these dreamers who are kind of in limbo. So that is a partial solution. Look, a lot of people come here, would like to stay and become americans. There are also people who want to come here and work and not stay. You sound like you dont think the democratic response was as robust as it could have been. Because the problem with the democratic response is they are continuing to play into this narrative of oh, my god, Border Security, Border Security. Guys, ive been talking about this story for 30 years for 30 years theres been the neurosis about Border Security. The greatest terrorist attack in our country did not happen because someone crossed that border. It happened in our country because they got off of planes. It begins to feel like the wheels are just spinning, spinning, spinning talking about Border Security. I want to ask you one other question. You remember we used to think all these immigrants came from mexico, theyre mostly not mexicans, theyre Central Americans. The president has said if they dont stop these people from leaving, these Central American countries, were going to cut off aid to the Central American countries. Given youve been covering this for as long as you have, some americans may not remember that a lot of the problems in south america thank you. Are because of stuff america did. Oh, my gosh. Eric swalwell tweeted about this a few minutes ago. We have a hand in what happened in south america. A hand . Youve got about two hands and your feet also, okay. Because what people dont realize how quickly we forget one, basically it started in the early 1900s, the United States relationship with south america interventionist. The 80s the United States goes full in. They are propping up a military dictatorship in nicaragua, propping up a military well, military guys who are running pretty much a lot of para military. El salvador, they are propping up dictatorships in guatemala. This looks very big. But when you come down to it, its human beings and theyre saying, whats happening to my community that i can no longer live here and survive . That im in the middle of attack . And many of them were being shot at by military that were trained by the United States in the academy of the americas in georgia. They were trained right here. So our relationship with Central America goes way, way, way back. And, by the way, i like to say and i think ive said it to you guys, Central America has millions upon millions of people who are there and staying. There is not a flood, a crisis of people running out. The people who are coming here, who i have spoken to, are the most desperate. They cannot take it any more. You guys have kids. You know that if at a moment you couldnt take it any more, youd do whatever you had to do to protect your kids. Those are the people who are asking for help and asylum. Its not just willynilly everybody is coming across the way the president is talking about. Thats absolutely ridiculous, and he should be ashamed of himself for the way he spoke about caring about human beings and women and children, caring about Human Trafficking. Do you know what people who have their children who are still being held by this government say . They say that donald trump is responsible for the Human Trafficking of their children in this country. So im not going to be gas lit in terms of suddenly this president saying that he cares when hes directly responsible. The buck stops with him. Hes responsible for jakelyn and felipes deaths. When he takes responsibility for that its on his watch. Executive producer of n. P. R. Latino usa. Good to see you. Good to see you. Coming up a sorry. This guy today. You know what, you got it. You got it. Change his name to stephanie. You got it, biggie. Its yours. Coming up next we have a shocking report that cuts to the core of your privacy and safety. A new report shows that major cell phone companies, the ones you pay for monthly service, are selling customers location data in real time, by the way, without their consent. Were going to explain how your Location Information could go from your phone into the hands of someone with bad intent. See, arent you glad he read that . You delivered it. Youre watching velshi and ruhle. It was worth it. Looking good at booking. Com, we cant guarantee youll good at that water jet thingy. But we can guarantee the best price on this hotel. Or any accommodation, from homes to yurts. Booking. Com booking. Yeah todays Senior Living communities have never been better, with amazing amenities like movie theaters, exercise rooms and swimming pools, public cafes, bars and bistros even pet care services. And theres never been an easier way to get great advice. A place for mom is a free service that pairs you with a local advisor to help you sort through your options and find a perfect place. A place for mom. You know your family we know Senior Living. Together well make the right choice. Bike, wheels, saddle. I customize everything thats why i switched to liberty mutual. They customized my insurance, so i only pay for what i need. I insured my car, and my bike. My calves are custom too, but i cant insure those. Which is a crying shame. Only pay for what you need. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Welcome back. Stephanie . Thanks so much. We have discussed the extensive tracking of your Online Activity and how that information often gets sold from Companies Like facebook in exchange for free access. Its a deal. You use their stuff for free. They have your information. But now something you pay for is also selling your information. Your cell phone. A recent article found that taet, tmobile, sprint, were all selling location date on their customers could end up in the hands of anyone from Roadside Assistance Companies to, i dont know, stalkers. The data is accurate within 1,500 feet and can be live in a city like new york or like this. Joining us now, the fcc commissioner. Lets start with you. What is this . What this reporter was able to do was pay a Bounty Hunter and he is able to get a picture of where his phone was in realtime. He uncovered this whole world where your own Cell Phone Company that youre paying a monthly fee for is selling your realtime location data to dozen of companies which then may be selling it to hundreds of others who are reselling with it no oversight. We dont know whose hands it is getting into. A Bounty Hunter, roadside assistance or foreign intelligence. This is crazy. I get that this should be regulated and i get that at t and sprint can get it and Robert Mueller can get it. Im a little worried that someone can pay a few hundred bucks to a Bounty Hunter and find out where it is. That doesnt seem right to me either. I think they need investigate. It shouldnt be you can pay a few hundred dollars to a Bounty Hunter and then they can tell you in realtime where a phone is. Thats not right. This entire ecosystem needs some oversight. I think we have to get to this fast. There are more cell phones in this country than people. So we are all Walking Around with these devices and this potential is real and it is everywhere. Why hasnt the ftc known this . It took a reporter. You have your cell phone with you at all times and it is constantly communicating with cell towers nearby. You want that because thats how you get your texts and phone calls. As a result of that they have a lot of information about where you are. It turns out our Wireless Companies are spelling to location aggregators who in turn sell to it some shady middlemen and it has become possible for any of us to pay them to access information about us in realtime. This is a system that is lacking oversight and it needs it. We talk about Bounty Hunters. Some of these people can be private investigators. The kind of people often used by spouses that are, you know, harassing someone or stalkers. Thats the danger. Theres supposed to be consent from the people being tracked. And the skipping bail cases, that the people agree to be tracked. But clearly it is not being xhekd the people being tracked have agreed to it. That could be any of us. According to this, someone could be tracking us as we speak. Theres been a few statements. They say theyre cracking down and eliminating all these unauthorized use cases. Just for roadside assistance. Even at that level, does it need to be as close as that map showed in order to wave down a tow truck and say heres where i am on the road . There are legitimate discussions about this. I think theres general agreement that tracking of you and your physical location, that youre not aware of, i think we would get broad agreement that doesnt feel right. Absolutely. There are long time principles here. Your phone company can know where you are to provide with you service. You want that. They can send information to Law Enforcement if there is a Law Enforcement request. And they can do things with your location if you give them consent. What is missing here is consumer consend. I havent consent to this and i bet you havent either. Thank you for joining us. A really important story. Coming up shortly, the president is on capitol hill. He is there now meeting with republican senators. In about an hour hell meet with both republicans and democrats in the situation room. This is day 19 of the Government Shutdown. F the Government Shutdown oh oh ozempic® announcer people with type 2 diabetes are excited about the potential of onceweekly ozempic®. In a study with ozempic®, a majority of adults lowered their blood sugar and reached an a1c of less than seven and maintained it. Oh under seven . And you may lose weight. In the same oneyear study, adults lost on average up to 12 pounds. Oh up to 12 pounds . A twoyear study showed that ozempic® does not increase the risk of major cardiovascular events like heart attack, stroke, or death. Oh no increased risk . Oh, oh, oh, ozempic® ozempic® should not be the first medicine for treating diabetes, or for people with type 1 diabetes or diabetic ketoacidosis. Do not share needles or pens. Dont reuse needles. Do not take ozempic® if you have a personal or Family History of medullary thyroid cancer, multiple endocrine neoplasia syndrome type 2, or if you are allergic to ozempic®. Stop taking ozempic® and get medical help right away if you get a lump or swelling in your neck, severe stomach pain, itching, rash, or trouble breathing. Serious side effects may happen, including pancreatitis. Tell your doctor if you have Diabetic Retinopathy or vision changes. Taking ozempic® with a sulfonylurea or insulin may increase the risk for low blood sugar. Common side effects are nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, stomach pain, and constipation. Some side effects can lead to dehydration, which may worsen kidney problems. I discovered the potential with ozempic®. Oh oh oh ozempic® ask your Healthcare Provider if ozempic® is right for you. Its time for our monumental americans. In light of our diverse congress, we recognize congressman dalip singh. He was the first sikh american, the first asianamerican. He became a farmer at a time when they were not allowed to own land. He fought for Immigration Rights and pushed congress to pass a bill allowing indian immigrants to gain u. S. Citizenship. In 1949 he finally became a u. S. Citizen. And he was sworn into congress in 1957 after winning as a democrat in californias 29th district. He fought for veteran benefits, farm labor programs and the 1957 civil rights bill. Saund died in hacks in 1973. What a life. If you have a monumental american, please tweet us. Thank you for watching. Im going to brush my teeth and be back here at 3 00 p. M. Eastern. I gave him such a hard time about stepping on me and then i did it at the end of the show. You resisted the urge to build a wall between us. I wanted to build a wall. I just didnt have the tools. We talk about this a lot. Usually between shows, i eat mexican food before the show. Shes in a situation where she can smell a tuna fish sandwich from seven blocks away. So shes about to pass out from that mexican food. Stop it. This is the time i say, im glad this show is on tape so all that stuff can be edited out. I made sure to have a couple minutes before i came on the show. When you have that, it doesnt solve his problem. Were into your time. I want to say, are those new glasses . They look t