And that is going to wrap up this hour of msnbc live. Katie tur is going to take over. Its 11 00 a. M. Out west, its 2 00 p. M. In washington where it is day two of french president emanuel macron are meeting at the white house. Well see if that special relationship between macron and the president can change the president s mind on a host of issues, primarily the Iran Nuclear Deal. Even as the president hosted his french counterpart, mr. Trump was pressed on issues here at home. And at this afternoons joint Press Conference, it was his embattled pick to be the next secretary of Veterans Affairs. I havent heard of the particular allegations, but i will tell you, hes one of the finest people that i have met. Admiral jackson, dr. Jackson, hes a wonderful man. I said to him, what are you needed for . And as far as experience is concerned, the Veterans Administration which is approximately 13 million people, is so big, you koucould run the biggest Hospital System in the world that is small time compared to the Veterans Administration, so nobody has the experience, hes a high quality person. I said what are you needed for . Its totally his decision, but hell be making a decision. The Senate Committee on Veterans Affairs said this morning they are postponing the Confirmation Hearing for Ronnie Jackson, President Trumps choice to be the next va secretary. A white house official said the scope of the allegations are not yet clear. But the New York Times reports that lawmakers are now examining allegations that jackson oversaw a hostile Work Environment as the white house physician. And allowed the overprescribing of drugs. They also have received claims wouldnt want this for anybody, hes a good man, he wouldnt want to deal with anybody, its disgusting, hes ultimately going to make his own decision. Reporter i read that the same way as you, katie. I think were having an issue with jeff. Lets go over to garrett. Reporter we can make this argument that jackson was being unfairly maligned by the press and he made this argument also that democrats were targeting Ronnie Jackson because they had previously tried to derail the confirmation of the Secretary Of State. You got the sense that the president was trying to make the case that Ronnie Jackson was one of the finest men he ever met, but the president was in many ways giving jackson the opportunity to step aside if he saw fit. Lets listen to what the president had to say. I dont want to put a man like this through this process, its too ugly, and too disgusting. Are you saying, mr. President , that you would stand behind him . I would stand behind him. If i were him . In my ways, i would love to be him, but the fact is, i wouldnt be him. Reporter you can plainly see the unexpected issues of governing, he didnt pick mr. Jackson because he had a deep well of managing large organizations. He said mr. Jackson didnt have that, most people dont. And he said that he thought this would be smooth sailing, we know that certainly wasnt the case. It appears the president picked Ronnie Jackson without the proper vetting because he likes him personally. He had a strong personal rapport and the president gave him that clean bill of health after he had his physical. But mr. Jackson says hes still looking forward to continuing in this process. It you were able you were able to catch up with Ronnie Jackson while he was up on capitol hill. Reporter if we take the president at his word about the conversations he had with jackson. He had these conversations with the Veterans Affairs committee, just as the president was speaking, he left the hill a few minutes before the president made those comments publicly. What dr. Jackson told me is hes looking forward to answering all the questions about him. Although when i asked him those questions, he didnt answer them to me. Dr. Jackson, can you say anything about all these allegations that have come out about you in the last couple of days . Im looking forward to getting the hearing rescheduled and answering everybodys giant offravrmp. If you want to leave, you can sail right out the door and i wish you well. And also democrats saying once pompeo got through the committee and pompeo will probably get okayed as the nominee for Secretary Of State, the democrats went and looked for somebody else to, he did not say torture, but to tear down and derail the confirmation process. But when you think about the vetting that this senawhite hou does, theyre in trouble about the vetting of Paul Manafort or rick gates, the vetting wasnt done there. Donald trump refused to be vetted himself. Often when youre running for the white house, you let your team vet you to get ready for things that you might get attacked about in the white house. The president doesnt care particularly to vet anybody in there administration. Do we know how the vetting process works, even if theres a team of people at the white house . There is a team of people who handle that at the white house and they work for the Chief Of Staff in this case john kelly, so this is raising new questions about john kellys role in overseeing all of this. As part of the vetting that is done, there are often times conversations with, in this case, it woulders on the hill, whether or not the nominee would have an easy Nomination Process. It appears that that conversation didnt even happen. So if the white house isnt doing the careful vetting on the small things, what sort of big picture issues are they missing as well. Mitch mcconnell was asking the Nomination Process a moment ago, lets play that. With regard to the jackson nomination, im waiting to hear from both chairman isaacson from the administration, what they believe the way forward should be, and well take our queues from them. Mr. Mcconnell, did you meet with dr. Jackson . So the president says its dr. Jacksons decision, senator mcconnell says its the white houses decision, theyre waiting to hear their queues from the white house. It does sound like theyre waiting for jackson to bow out. That this confirmation is not going to go forward, am i right . Kevin barron, are you there . Executive editor of defense one. I assume the viewers just knew your face and wouldnt actually need an sbintroduction. Its Business As Usual at the white house, so this nomination is already off the rails before it really began. And, yeah, it sounded today like the president gave him an offramp. But he still wanted him. In the same breath, the president said he wouldnt put himself through the process, but he did, hes the president , he knows how this goes. So im less worried about the lack of im not so worried about Business As Usual, because this is what we have come to expect. It does sounuoes sound like it hands of whether he wants to go through this or not, so i guess well have to wait and see. Lets wait and see if dr. Jackson does bow out of the white house. Who would where be on the top of the vas list for a person to run that agency, kevin . We well, it wouldnt be their decision. People who run the va right now, people who work at the va, veterans advocates groups, what kind of person would they want to see lead the va Going Forward if they dont have shulkin and if they dont get Ronnie Jackson. Its an enormous organization to a very specific group. 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These are issues that macron holds the opposite view on. Translator you consider the iranian deal, the jcpoa, the one negotiated in 2015 with iran is a bad deal. For a number of months, ive been saying that this was not a sufficient deal, but that it enabled us, at least until 2025 to have some control over their nuclear activities. This is a deal with decayed foundations, its a bad deal, its a bad structure. Its falling down. Were going to see what happens on the 12th. So the big question we are asking today on this story is, can president macron get donald trump to change his mind. Phillip, thanks for being with us, we appreciate it. When macron goes in and meets with the french president , wants him to go back to the paris act koract accord, what is he using to get donald trump to potentially change his mind . It seems that relationship we have now seen over the last 24 hours in fact, they seem to truly get along very well, the french president and the u. S. President , we saw that in mt. Vernon yesterday, we also saw that at the white house, but it really is a contrast between how they get along as president s and the views they actually have, which as you say are completely different from one to the other. And it looks like the french president didnt get all too much out of his meetings at the white house. There are many ways of looking at this right now, there are ma getting briefs saying they believe they got a concession from the u. S. President , that contention being that he, President Trump will now look at the nuclear deal in a bigger frame work, that means he will be looking at the nuclear deal and several other deals on the side. But from the Press Conference at the white house just a short while ago, the u. S. President says hes going to make a decision on the 12th of may, he looked at the president emanuel macron right next to him and said you know very well what kind of a decision i will take. And he didnt exactly get a smile back from his french counterpart. In other words it still looks like that departure by the u. S. From the Iran Nuclear Deal is very likely indeed. You saw them speak and say they both got what they wanted out of this, but i was at the white house earlier today but It Didnt Look Good to see the u. S. President attack that nuclear deal while standing and sitting next to the french president. The president knows very well that president macron came here with a few things to talk about, none more important to try and convince the president to stay in the nuclear deal with iran. It is very unlikely that he proceeded in getting precisely that. Let me ask you that, if he doesnt walk away with a major concession, having him stay in the Iran Nuclear Deal, which is a very big deal for the french president , or getting back in the paris Climate Accords or something else. What good is it to be seen Walking Around holding our president s hand to be accepting a kiss on the cheek, smiling as he brushes dust off his lapel, does he risk his reputation back in france having looked so chummy with the president and walking away with nothing . He certainly risks something there, because remember that u. S. President donald trump is very, very unpopular in france and indeed in large parts of the rest of europe. So why would the french president indeed come to the white house and be so chummy with his american counterpart. One would presume to come out of here with an end product. Its unlikely there will be an end product to give to the french people if you will and indeed president macrons Counter Parts in the uk and in germany. They had a Strategy Meeting between macron and merkel before the french president arrived here about how to tackle these important issues including the nuclear deal. It looks like president macron is not going to go home with too much to show. You mention the paris accord, theres not much to get President Trump to sign up for the paris climate deal again. What the president also wanted was some extensions from not getting those Trade Tariffs On Steel and aluminum imports imposed on france and other European Union countries, no confirmation yet on whether he got that either. This was indeed a pretty risky trip for the french president , and it still is, more than anything, because hes been very, very friendly indeed with a person who is very unpopular in europe. Now the frame work that emanuel macron has been giving to this visit hiere in washington is tht this is a strong relationship between france and the united states, a historically strong one and that is why they need to show that they can get along. White house correspondent come back soon please. And senior counselor for the albright stone bridge group and an msnbc contributor. Thanks for being here. A lot of folks will say that frances president is trying to manipulate the president , trying to play the long game, by being very chummy, in a way that Angela Merkel cannot or teresa may cannot, but if he walks away leaving with nothing, does it show, one, that the president is just stone minded and is not going to move on these issues . Or that ultimately that he just doesnt have any real influence . I think were about to find out over the next couple of weeks, president macron gave President Trump offramps, he gave him an offramp about Keeping Troops in syria for a while, because its part of a larger strategy to deal with iran and to build a political settlement in syria. He gave President Trump an offramp on the joint conference of plan of action, the iran deal,ing lets leave that post here, but lets build three other posts and we will then have a big house that will cover all of our concerns about iran. I suspect he will also say you have a new Secretary Of State likely to be confirmed shortly, so why dont you give him some time to work with us. So i think that president macron has given on several issues here, hes saying that the Paris Climate Agreement is not just about france. And we will see if any of those offramps will be taken by the president and see if macron can say that he made progress here. This can also be a north korea issue as well, because if america is seen to be pulling out of the iran deal, what assurance does iran have that any agreements will be honored in the future. And kim jongun opened and Honorable Today and then a reporter followed up on that in the bilat a moment ago, asking why he would call a dictator who just recently sent back one of our citizens in pretty bad shape and dies a short time later, an honorable person. You mentioned today that you thought that the leader of north korea has behaved openly and honorably. This is something that many people have accused of starving his people, killing family members. What did you mean when you called him that . I think were doing very well, meetings are being set up. And i want to see denuclearization of north korea, a lot of concessions have already been made, we have made no concessions despite some of the media saying i have made concessions. What is the president s strategy here, obviously its very different from other leaders before him. I think what hes frying to do is create a positive pathway to a summit. Quite frankly if any other person, democrat or republican, donald trump would have said its outrageous to stay that a dictator that oppresses off the human rights in this country, lets people starve, and takes other countrys citizens as hostages is open and honorable. We know where things stand, were not naive, were going to have talks at this summit. I know what im doing. Kim jongun understands that as well. I think all would have been able to say, okay, lets thats a good first step, lets go on. I wonder what Otto Warmbiers family ask thinking and other families that have family members being held in north korea. And president michaabout mi cohen, saying thats a stupid question, but how stupid would that be if the fixer flips. That is next. Today, there are more sensors on our planet than people. Were putting ai into everything, and everything into the cloud. Its all so. Smart. But how do you work with it . Ask this farmer. Hes using Satellite Data to help increase crop yields. Thats smart for the food we eat. At this port, Supply Chains are becoming more transparent with blockchain. Thats smart for millions of shipments. In this lab, researchers are working with watson to help them find new treatments. Thats smart for medicine. At this bank, the worlds most encrypted mainframe is helping prevent cybercrime. Thats smart for everyone. And in africa, iot sensors and the ibm cloud are protecting endangered animals. Thats smart for rhinos. Yeah. Rhinos. Because smart only really matters, when we put it to work not just for a few of us, but for all of us. Lets put smart to work. I want some more of it. I try so hard, i cant rise above it dont know what it is bout that little gals lovin. Applebees new bigger bolder grill combos. Now thats eatin good in the neighborhood. Pg e prunes and removes over a Million Trees every year to ensure that Hazardous Trees cant impact power lines. And since the onset of the drought weve doubled our efforts. I grew up in the forests out in this area and honestly its heartbreaking to see all these trees dying. What guides me is ensuring that the public is going to be safer and that these forests can be sustained and enjoyed by the community in the future. President trump continues to be dogged by questions about the investigation of his longterm personal lawyer Michael Cohen. Today the day of the president s first state visit with the leader of france was no exception. Mr. President what about Michael Cohen thank you very much. [ inaudible ] stupid question. Is it a stupid question . If cohen knows theres a pardon on the horizon, could it keep him quiet . Or quieter . And is there a chance of cohen caving better than not . Even President Trump suggested today it could be a legal minefield. The Executive Editor of Bloomberg Blind Field and Chuck Rosenberg is former u. S. Attorney and senior fbi official. Tim, lets start with you, i wanted to get the sense of Michael Cohen, hes been pretty loyal to donald trump, youve obviously had dealings with him, what is your sense of how far michaels low pressure systyalt . I think anybody thats been around donald trump for any any lgtd of time that Donald Trumps loyalty is a oneway street. Outside of his family, his children, his loyalty doesnt really extend very far beyond that. And that has to be weighing heavily in Michael Cohens mind. A think a little bit of daylight came between cohen and the president the day that the fbi raided cohens office. He said it was disgusting, the fbi knocked on my lawyers door and they bursted into his office. And Michael Cohen said it was actually a little bit more polite. This is a guy who historically has said i will take a bullet for the president , ill do anything to protect him. And in this moment when the chips finally came out on the table, he was saying no, i have a different recollection. A source told me that cohen basically knew that the president was speaking right to him when he was holding that news conference, when he was sitting in that cabinet spray, supposed to be talking about syria, but instead talking about Michael Cohen and how disgusting it was that the fbi raided his office. In hearing that, chuck, that the idea that cohen might have thought the president was talking directly to him, what would your legal take be on that . Well, i dont know who the president was talking to, katie, i do know this. But if a witness thinks that a subject or a target of an investigation thinks a person who could pardon them is talking directly to them when he says, hey, listen, this was a disgusting and terrible raid, as a prosecutor, what would you take from that . Yeah, so as a prosecutor, its possible that the president is saying to a witness, a potential witness, stay strong, i have your back. If and only if mr. Cohen, you have mine. And that type of conversation particularly happening, you know, in private or well over the airwaves can be awfully troubling to prosecutors. I dont know that thats what the president was saying, but i guess as a prosecutor, i tend to have a suspicious mind and thats what it makes me think of. I do want to ask you about politicos analysis, they say that it could be pretty tricky to potentially get Michael Cohen to flip. And again, we should be clear that we dont know that its the intention of the sdny to get cohen to flip. But heres what politico writes, even if cohen is determined to break his confidence with trump legal ethics might deter federal prosecutors from vetting his relationship with donald trump. Is it going to be hard . Its going to be hard, but its not a minefield. By the way the Minefield Analogy is useful. Because with the right equipment, as you well know, you can navigate a minefield. So imagine in a search warrant, they get three types of stuff. One bucket would mr. Stuff that is absolutely not privileged, which the filter team can give to the Investigative Team. One bucket of stuff is things that are clearly privileged, which the filter team would keep and the Investigative Team would never see. Then theres that middle category which is a little bit harder and thats why prosecutors get paid all that money and get to make decisions about things that may be privileged and they can go to the judge if they need more guidance. Its not rocket science, it happen s all the time. Prosecutors make these determinations and decide what they can and cannot use. So i think that politico article is helpful, but i also think its a little bit overwrought. Quote, Cohen Isnt The Biggest Catch from the trump world, other players know far more about the president s dealings than his lawyer does. This is what you wrote on bloomberg view. Who were you talking about . I was talking about Jason Greens Abo Gre Greenb Greenblatt who is President Trumps white house attorney. People attach their stars to the president s wagon in the hopes of furthering their own careers. Michael cohen began working there in 2006. He wasnt an attorney in any of the usual ways, he was a fixer, he solved problems for trump. If theres somebody inside the Trump Administration who knows where the skeletons are, its Jason Greenblatt. But Jason Greenblatt would have more cover than michael kon does if he was acting as an advisor or a fixer, right, chuck . One more way to think of it, i think the factual contours that he lays out are really important. But prosecutors dont really set out to get anybody, what they want from cohn is the truth and theyre going to take that truth wherever it leads, it may lead to the president , it may not lead to the president , it may lead to other people, we dont know sitting here. But i dont like the characterization of prosecutors setting out to get somebody. At least good prosecutors dont think that way. I think its always important to remember that the prosecution here, the sdny could solely be going after something that Michael Cohen did alone, with no real intention of trying to get him to turn on the president of the united states. Theres got to be reason why this is with sdny and not with robert mueller. Gentlemen, thank you very much. And could a blue wave hit the special election to replace arizona congressman trent franks . The democrat vying for his seat, dr. Tippernini joins us next. And were keeping an eye on the dow right now, stocks are falling sharply as Big Industrial and Technology Companies take heavy losses, right now the dow is down almost 600 points, the reaction is based on several factors, but the big ones are heavy equipment Maker Caterpillar and 3m. Caterpillar is warning of weaker profits and 3m is citing higher costs for its raw materials. Were going to keep an eye on this right here on msnbc. But i realized something was missing. Me. The thought of my symptoms returning was keeping me from being there for the people and things i love most. So, i talked to my doctor and learned humira can help get, and keep,uc under control when other medications havent worked well enough. 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It can lead you on an unexpec ted journey. To discover your heritage. Get ancestrydna for just 59. The lowest price of the year. There will soon be a new congresswoman in arizona. Today is the special election in the states eighth congressional district. Voters there will beside if Hiral Tipirneni will replace republican congressman trent franks. Franks resigned after he reportedly oured one of his employees 5,000 to carry his child. But can they continue their Winning Streak today or if they cannot, what does that mean for the blue wave . Earlier this hour, President Trump weighed in on the ration, tweeting arizona please get out today, debbie lasko for congress. Nbc National Political correspondent joins us for a look at how this could all play out. I think this is one of those where you can see in the context of all of these special elections you were just talking about, this is one of those, the world is full of surprises, but the suspense right now is not so much whos going to win this night, but whats the margin going to be . Because this is the district that were talking about, 2016, trump by 21. This is a very republican area, a little different than what we saw in pennsylvania 18 a few weeks ago, where democrats had won races, they had a lot of democratic voters. This is republican through and through, so the question becomes can the democrats eat significantly into that trumpromney margin, can they get it to the single digits. You put them up there, thats the broader context for what were looking at here, a burge of Double Digit Gains for house elections, they had one last year in kansas, they had one in montana. They cut 15 points off trumps margin, they obviously were able to win pennsylvania. Can they get that 21point trump margin down to single digits. They would take that tonight as a sign of, hey, theres Movement Even in red america, for republicans, they want double digits tonight at least. I Hope Movement in red america means a lot more movement in blue or purple america, maybe those who werent so excited in 2016. Steve, thank you. Are you going to be holding a pen in your hand . I may not be able to eat so much tonight. Heres what two voters told our own von hilliard on the ground. I voted for the democratic candidate. Reporter do you usually vote democratic . No, im a republican, but lasko seemed to want to go to congress and get things done. Reporter who did you vote for . Debby, absolutely. Overall im a republican, have voted republicans my whole life, believe in all the measures that President Trump is putting in place and believe that debby supports all that. Joining me now Hiral Tipirneni who is the democratic candidate in the race, dr. Tipirneni, thank you so much for being here. Thank you for having me, i appreciate it. We were able to catch up with your opponent debbie lasko a little bit earlier. Im just a better fit for this district, whether it be securing the border, my opponent is not really in favor she doesnt want to put any money towards a border wall or improving education. I really have been a strong proponent of that, the whole nine years that ive been in the legislature. I also think that its important to the people in our district that we have low taxes and Less Government regulation and im definitely in support of that. My opponent not so much. So is she correct in stating your positions . No, shes not correct and in fact i am a very good fit for this district. Its a drikt i haistrict i have for 21 years and its a little disingenuous when she refers to those issues because i have actually been working on strengthening education throughout. I have a very clear health care plan, because theres a big issue for voters all across the west valley. Their premiums are going up, and i have a detailed plan to get us to a point where everybody has quality, Affordable Health care. As far as taxes go, that tax cut bill, that harmed my district. A very small percentage of people in my district got a benefit from that. So we need to work on protecting the middle class, and elder voters. Its also threatening Social Security way im committed to fighting for. So im a very good fit for this district and im excited that we have been resonating with the voters throughout the campaign time. You also said that you are not in support of the wall or any Real Security funding for the border. And thats incorrect as well. Thats a mischaracterization. I have spoken very clearly about where i stand on this. We have to have secure borders, theres no doubt. There are smart ways to go about it. We have to follow the data. Some money should go to reenforcing those areas of the border fencing that are vulnerable. We should be enhancing our Board Security patrol. Investing in technology, drones. 26 billion is a very hefty price tag on something that isnt necessarily going to keep us any safer. One of the areas of the largest overstaying their visas. A border wall does nothing for that. If we are worried about drugs, we also know a large proportion of drugs are coming in through ports of entry. Again, a wall does nothing for that. We have to be smart, we have to keep our borders secure. But there are smart ways to go about doing it and we have to be mindful of the cost of it as well. Good luck to you today. Thank you for being here. Thank you for having me. I appreciate it. Epa chief scott pruitt may drop a new rule today that impacts the air you breathe and products probably inside your home right now. What you need to know with the reporter who broke that story, next. 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Now there is another Sweeping Change in the works. Today, the Washington Post reports that pruitt is pushing a controversial transparency rule limiting what research the agency can use. Juliette elprin from the Washington Post is one of the reporters on that story. Explain to me this rule, on the service it sounds like a good idea, transparency, i only want to be able to see the signs that i can understand the process behind. Is that the best way to describe it . Exactly. Well, thats certainly how administrator pruitt and his supporters would describe this rule. They would say that what they are doing is taking the underlying data thats behind the studies that epa uses to draft, say, environmental regulations and other rules that they issue, and let everyone scrutinize them and reproduce it. What many researchers counter is that many of these critical studies particularly on issues such as Air Pollution, pesticide exposure and other issues, are done through these longterm studies where they get participants to provide personal information about their medical history, about their personal behavior and practices, in exchange for confidentiality and that basically, by saying that now this data would have to be revealed, this would not only potentially disqualify a slew of studies that already exist, it might deter people from signing up for these studies in the first place. In addition to the fact that it would cost millions of dollars to essentially redact this data so that it would not be inadvertently released. They are saying it would limit the science they could use. What are the concerns about real life consequences in terms of water and air . This could potentially affect a huge slew of studies, including some landmark older studies that have underpinned, for example, some of the most basic Air Pollution rules that we have today, which affect the kind of the level of soot that can be emitted from power plants and other burning of fossil fuels like auto emissions. It could affect everything from, say, Drinking Water advisories across the country in terms of a lake, how much fish you could consume as well as maybe potentially what household products. There are huge implications depending on how epa defines what data needs to be released. In the broader view, how would you say scott pruitt is trying to change the epa . Is he taking it away from a sciencebased approach to a holistic based approach on the environment and moving it more towards something, i dont know, friendlier to the industries its supposed to regulate . I think both mr. Pruitt and those who criticize him would say he is changing the way the epa uses science and evaluates it and again, how you define that depends on where you stand. But essentially what hes doing is hes certainly questioning some of the traditional science that epa has used including epas own studies and as a result, hes allowing many Industry Studies to rise and play greater influence in decision making. Affecting millions of people with their water and air. Julia, thank you so much for coming in and talking about this. Thanks so much. One more thing before we go. Tonight will be historic for President Trump. It is his first state dinner and as we have been discussing all day, the soiree was planned by the first lady. Menus grace each plate, freshcut flowers, and as my colleague Vivian Salama points out, the president had no part in its planning. Heres what he said in 2016. All these other people that rip us off we give them these big State Dinners. We give them State Dinners like youve never seen. We shouldnt have dinners at all. We should be eating a hamburger on a Conference Table and forget the State Dinners. You forget the State Dinners. That costs by the way, a fortune. That costs a fortune. Hamburgers, the president will have to give up the Golden Arches for tonight. Somehow he will have to find a way to deal with the Goat Cheese Rack of spring lamb and carolina gold rice jambalaya. Wonder if he will get a welldone steak. We should point out a couple points of irony that will be served up. The dishes they will be dining on, White House China from the clinton and bush eras. Two, although tonights dinner showcases two leaders of the worlds greatest democracies, no press will be allowed in. Only one, count them, one democrat was invited. The governor of louisiana