And donald trump himself. And it is all leading, according to sources, to growing frustration and anger from the president. Pure madness, sources tell the washington post. Unglued, sources tell nbc naews. Chaos, sources tell the New York Times. But you dont need that white house whisperer to tell you that. As we said last week, this is a president who wears his heart on his twitter page. And this morning, his heart wanted to know why you are looking at him. Quote, why did the Obama Administration start an investigation into the Trump Campaign with zero proof of wrongdoing long before the election in november . Wanted to discredit so crooked h. Would win. Unprecedented. Bigger than watergate, exclamation point. Plus, obama did nothing about russian meddling. The grand jury subpoena wants all documents related to ten members of the trump orbit, including hope hicks, paul manafort, and rick gates, and the president himself, as we said. Not to mention a number of names not recently reported in connection with to the Mueller Investigation. Names like Michael Cohen, keith schiller, and Corey Lewandowski. Mueller wants information going back to november 1st, 2015. So our big question is, is there something in these documents that will give mueller evidence of collusion . You look at the breadth and scope of the targets of this subpoena and you see, potentially, the entire Senior Campaign team that worked for donald trump in 2015 and 2016. None of these people, to use a term that Sarah Sanders often uses, were coffee boys or coffee girls. They all had they were all very close to the president. What this also really shows is that the question of Trump Campaign collusion with russia is still very much an active part of this investigation. Ive been very clear about this. If anybody attempted to influence our u. S. Election system by coordinating or cooperating with an outside source to materially change the outcome of this election, those people should be in jail for the rest of their lives. Well get to our team of reporters in just a moment. But first, lets bring in paul fishman, a former u. S. Attorney for the district of new jersey and a former federal prosecutor. Paul, with thanthanks for being. Always a pleasure, katy. When you looked at reporting for the subpoena and saw the president s name on it, what was your reaction . So, im not really surprised. And heres why im not surprised, katy. I think what a lot of people dont understand is that the only way for bob mueller and the prosecutors and agents with whom hes working to get information, to get physical documents, emails, notes that people took, whatever pieces of paper that they have in their houses or their offices is with a grand jury subpoena. They can call people up and say, will you give it to us . But people have the right to say no. And the only compulsory process to collect documents, even to interview witnesses, really, is a grand jury subpoena. Its the most basic tool in a prosecutors tool box. Can we assume that Robert Mueller already has the information that hes asking for and is just trying to see whether or not this particular witness is trustworthy or potentially see whether another witness is trustworthy . So in general, what you want to do before you talk to witnesses is get the documents, if you can. It doesnt always work that way. Sometimes people come in, sometimes you want to talk to people right away. But in general, its always better than to talk to people during an investigation if youre an agent or a prosecutor after youve seen what documents they have, after youve seen the email traffic or their texts with other people, so you have a pretty good idea of where they fit into the puzzle. Nine months of this investigation, you can imagine that they have a plethora of documents related to all of this stuff. Lets talk about Michael Cohen. Once hope hicks leaves, the only person on this list of people, and were going to show it right now, there are ten people on it, that is not going to be working for donald trump any longer will be Michael Cohen. The only one left working for him, i should say, that we know, at least, to be working for him. How could that be significant to have all of these folks now no longer in Donald Trumps employ, except for one . Well, i think the thing that matters the most is what donald trump seems to surprise more than anything else is personal loyalty. But certainly with hope hicks, or the stories we saw last week, is that the personal loyalty wasnt being totally reciprocated. I saw that he berated her after she said what she said about Little White Lies while testifying in front of the house intelligence committee. So the problem for the president , is that these people with are out there, and all were participants in some way in conversations. And that seems to be why most of those people would be on that list. That they have some information about contacts that may have taken place during the campaign or later about interaction with russians. We dont know if this is a focus of the Mueller Investigation or if theyre asking questions about it, but Michael Cohen has been in the news in regard to Stormy Daniels and that 130,000 payoff. The wall street journal is just now reporting that the payment was flagged by his bank and they say under federal law, banks are required to flag transactions that have no business or apparent lawful purpose or that deviate inexplicably from a customers normal bank activity. Suspicious activity reports are filed to the treasurys financial crimes enforcement network, where federal investigators can access them. Would this be of interest to Robert Mueller . It could be. I mean, if there was criminal intent involving Something Like that, its possible. Ordinarily, disguised Campaign Expenses dont necessarily rise to that level. But you dont know what else they have with respect to that. What i think people need to understand here is that bob mueller, in the course of a criminal investigation, is going to come across, stumble may not be the right word, but is going to come across all sorts of things that will fit within the parameter that he originally started to investigate, or other things, like the manafort case. And some of those things will fit neatly into or dovetail with the things that hes already looking at. But some of them wont. It happens in lots of investigations. Youre investigating somebody for bank fraud and you discover tax evasion with two other people. When faced with that circumstance, bob mueller has basically three choices. He can say, look, this is nothing. Its really not worth anybodys time, so were not going to look at it at all. Thats option one. Option two is to say, it doesnt really fit within my rubric. Its not really something that im supposed to be taking a look at. And im going to kick it back to the rest of the department of justice for Rod Rosenstein or somebody else to assign elsewhere in the department. Thats option two. And option three is for him to say to Rod Rosenstein, look, this is close enough to what im doing, i would like to add this to my jurisdiction, how is that you . We know from what rosenstein testified about in front of congress that he has on at least more than one occasion expanded muellers jurisdiction in that way. Well have to see ultimately at the end whether that happens here too. Quickly, its notable whos not on this list. Again, this is just one witness subpoena. But we dont see jared kushner, we dont see rowna graft, donald trump longtime personal secretary, the gatekeeper for him for many, many years, before the campaign and even partially during the campaign. We dont see mike pence. So theyre not of interest . No, in general, people get subpoenas for documents that they are likely to have. And so, i dont have whether the person who got this particular subpoena ever corresponded with mike pence. Maybe the answer is no, in which case it wouldnt be the likely but what i suspect is that there are dozens and dozens and dozens of subpoenas out there and everybody gets a slightly different one, depending on who he or she is. I think everyone has had some contact with rona graft, i imagine, considering how close she was to the president. Paul fishman, good to see you. Appreciate it. And lets talk about the fallout of all of the Mueller Investigation stuff and whats happening inside the west wing. Hallie jackson is at the white house. Phil rucker is with the washington post, and peter baker is the chief White House Correspondent for the New York Times and author of obama the call of history, also answer msnbc political analyst. Hallie, im going to start with you. Whats happening inside the white house today . Reporter well, youve seen part of whats happening at the white house, this is the Benjamin Netanyahu visit, but the more interesting part of whats happening behind the white house is what you cannot see. And that is what we continue to talk about and what weve talked about at various points in this administration, which is frankly chaos. Which is, a president who is based on our reporting and based on sources that weve spoken with, angry and frustrated related to a lot of different topics, not least among them, the reaction to the new tariff institution theyve put in place. The announcement hes going to put punishing tariffs in place on steel and aluminum imports. Ill tell you, there are folks within the white house that the president is surprised by the markets reaction. Because by many accounts, he had been wandrned about this. If he took these steps, the market might react poorly. Other analysts, wilbur ross and Peter Navarro, defending the president s move. But stepping back big picture, and i imagine phil and peter can talk about this, as well, this feels to me a lot like a year ago. The early days of the administration, when every day you were soaking up a fire hose of new information about how frustrated the president was and how chaotic it was behind the scenes. Thats not to say i think when we say that, people get an impression of staffers sprinting down the hallway screaming, pulling out their hair. Its not visible chaos. Like, you go in, people are going about their daily business. But its more a function of the phone calls that the president makes, the discussions hes having behind the scenes with friends and allies, venting, as he often does, about whats happening. Hallie, i think you nald it. I was talking to a former trump staffer, someone still close to the white house, who said thats exactly what it feels like, like this is the early days of the administration, those chaotic days all over again. Phil, with you have a lot of reporting on whats happening inside. You write that your sources describe the president as, at times angry and increasingly isolated. He fumes in private that just about every time he looks up at a television screen, the cable News Headlines are trumpeting yet another scandal. Phil, what is your take . Well, what we have had in the last week or so is a collision of a few different sort of negative news stories, for lack of a better description, that have really set the president on edge. You have his feud with jeff sessions, the attorney general, intensifying. You have the scrutiny on jared kushner, on his business interests, as well as his foreign conversations and lack of a security of a toplevel security clearance being a real negative moment for the soninlaw and other factors that just have the president , frankly, fuming. He has spent a lot of time on the phone talking to friends outside of the government, but also venting to his aides, to his senior staffers there in the west wing about all of these developments. And its left his aides and friends very worried about him. They, in our reporting over the weekend, they say theyre not sure what could come next. Theres a feeling inside the white house that they havent yet bottomed out, which means it could get worse. But hallie is exactly right, spoton, when she said it hasnt felt this tense, this volatile since those early months of the presidency. Peter, how much does the Mueller Investigation, the process of it, the relentlessness of it, how much is that affecting the president s mood, public ly. Outward outwa outwardly, hes defiant, hes tweeting about it. He seems angry. But is this affecting his daily Decision Making . I think you have to look at the gyrations of the last week through that prism, basically. In other words, we had this meeting on gun control, where suddenly hes defying the nra and meeting the nra and softening his position again and we have this trade tariff announcement, which wasnt supposed to be made that day. We had the sort of policy gyrations that clearly have their roots in a president who is, in fact, you know, angry, as phil has said and as hallie has said, who is isolated. And i think these things are not unrelated. The president s mood in this particular white house matters probably more than most in terms of determining sort of a policy direction and creating what we now see to be some pretty important fights and fissures within his own Republican Coalition on issues like guns and trade. Hallie, lets talk about voters. Is the president , are his advisers still confident that his base of voters is still solid . Ive heard from a couple of folks who did vote for him, who were really excited about voting for him, and who are now, frankly, regretting it, saying its just been a little too chaotic for their taste. Is that an outlying opinion or, what are you hearing . I think anecdotally, you will get mixed opinions. I think there are a lot of folks like the ones that you talk to who say, hey, man, this is not what i signed up for. There are others we spoke to, when weve been outside the beltway, on the road chatting with people, who say, yeah, maybe he tweets too much, but we still belief in what hes doing. You get people pointing to the tax reform, and even now, the installment of justice gorsuch. So i dont think theres a concern that that base might be shrinking. It is very low, though. Listen, i dont need to tell you about the president s approval ratings. Youve seen the numbers, as well. They are extremely low, lower than any president at this point in their presidency in modern history. There is a sense, though, thats not a great place to be if youre a white house heading into the midterms, but this is also a president who likes to be on the road, he likes to be involved in, for example, campaign s when he believes tha somebody could end up winning. Obviously, the alabama special election race didnt end up going the way they wanted to. But you may see the president get on the road over the next six months or so, until november. Hallie jackson, appreciate it. Phil rucker, you too, and peter baker. And speaking of turmoil, trumps tariffs are causing concerns in his caucus. Speaker paul ryan is trying to talk trump out of a trade war. Thats next. And later, the realworld International Man of mystery. Youve heard a lot about his work, but what do we know about Christopher Steele, the author of the trump dossier . Oh, look. Another antiwrinkle cream in no hurry to make anything happen. Neutrogena® rapid wrinkle repair works in just one week. With the fastest retinol formula to visibly reduce wrinkles. Neutrogena®. The markets change. At t. Rowe price. Our disciplined approach remains. Global markets may be uncertain. But you can feel confident in our investment experience around the world. Call us or your advisor. T. Rowe price. Invest with confidence. You know whats not awesome . Gigspeed internet. When only certain people can get it. Lets fix that. Lets give this guy gig really . And these kids, and these guys, him, ah. Oh hello. That lady, these houses yes, yes and yes. And dont forget about them. Uh huh, sure. Still yes xfinity delivers gig speed to more homes than anyone. Now you can get it, too. Welcome to the party. So this is going to happen this week, for sure. The way he said it. 25 , 10 . Whatever his final decision is, is what will happen. Meaning this isnt a done deal . I didnt say that. I just said, what he has said, he has said. If he says something different, it will be something different. I have no reason to think hes going to change. President trumps republican allies are trying to talk him out of imposing tariffs on steel and aluminum imports. House speaker paul ryans spokesperson told nbc news, we are extremely worried about the consequences of a trade war and are urging the white house not to advance with this plan. The new tax reform law has boosted the economy and we certainly dont want to jeopardize those gains. A republican source also tells nbc news that congressional leaders wont rule out potential action in the future, adding to the pressure threats from canada, china, and the European Union that theyll respond with their own tariffs. The eu says it would target levis jeans, kentucky bourbon, and Harley Davidson motorcycles. But the president shows no signs of backing down. Our country on trade has been ripped off by virtually every country in the world, whether its friend or enemy. Everybody. China, russia, and people that we think are wonderful, the European Union. We cant do business in there. They dont allow it. They have trade barriers that are worse than tariffs. They also have tariffs. Joining us now is cnbc editor at large, john harwood. John, good to see you. Reporter hey, katy. So on friday we were reporting that the president basically announced this tariff, this trade war, if you will, because he was upset with his own advisers. How do republicans roll that back . How do they convince a president who is angry and announce that out of anger and in anger, that its a bad idea . Well, first of all, katy, what i say will be what i say, but then if i Say Something different later, then i will Say Something different, okay . So i want to straighten that out. Cheeky. Reporter look, there is tremendous disagreement within the white house on these tariffs. The only people who believed that these tariffs are a good idea are fringe economists on the left and some on the right, as well. Mainstream economists do not believe that this is a good idea. That it will hurt more americans than it helps and gary cohn, inside the white house, is arguing on behalf of that side. Paul ryan is also arguing on behalf of that side. However, i think that the only chance for republicans to block this is by persuading the president not to go forward in the first place, because i dont see any appetite among republicans in the house or senate to stand up in a direct conflict with the president on something he has bent on doing. Just fyi, were watching the white house, where Benjamin Netanyahu is about to depart. Ill translate what wilbur ross was saying in that clip. Donald trump believes what he believes in the moment he believes it and if he changes his mind, he believes that. Thats generally how to follow this president s train of thought. The president s top trade adviser, though, does agree with him, john. Peter navarro is saying that while there arent exemptions for allies, there will lwill be exclusions. Listen. Lets distinguish between exclusions for countries and exemptions for specific situations. Therell be a claus that will have exemptions for vary specific oneoff type situations, but nothing like for beer cans. I inverted that. There wont be exclusions, there will be exemptions. Are exemptions enough to make this more palatable to our allies . Reporter no. And, look, the administration justified these tariffs on National Security grounds, even though few people believe that tariffs on steel are vital to american National Security. If the president is now saying, and perhaps thats what Peter Navarro may have been hinting at, maybe well take these tariffs off if we get a better deal from canada and mexico on nafta. That undercuts the National Security argument. Its also hard to see how given Donald Trumps political position at the moment, how it would be in the interest of canadian and mexican leaders to bow to his demands for unilateral concessions on nafta. You know, canada is the high es exporter importer of steel to the united states. Putting tariffs on our allies is simply the kind of thing that you dont see american president s do. And mexico, in addition to that, is one of the top exporters of the steel to the united states. I dont know how the president gets out of this, because unlike some of the loose talk that he makes on legislation, this is something that he specifically has the power to do. He has come out and said it last week he was going to do it. He reiterated today hes going to do it. Hard to see how he backs off. And the markets have already taken a hit because of it. John harwood, thank you very much. Good to see you. Reporter you bet. And will big red turn big blue . Or at least big purple . Coming up, were talking to two women from two different parties running in two different races in texas. The two veronicas join me next. Smile dad. I take medication for high Blood Pressure and cholesterol. But they might not be enough to protect my heart. 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Right now, the early turnout numbers are in their favor. Nearly 50,000 more democrats and republicans voted in the states 15 largest counties as of friday. Compared to the 2014 midterms, the number of democrats who have voted early is up 105 . On the republican side, their early vote number is only up 15 . When theres an election and we want to crunch the numbers, who do we turn to . We turn to nbc National Political correspondent, steve kornacki. Does it matter that these early numbers are so much in favor of the democrats . Well, well find out. Look, the early vote numbers can sometimes be very misleading. But we do know there have been a lot of signs in all of these special elections weve been seeing as an enthusiasm surge for democrats. And in texas, there are a couple of incumbent republicans where democrats think, if the climate is right in 18, these could be pickups for democrats. Theres one in particular i want to focus on, because theres a fascinating almost soap opera going on in the background. Its around the houston area. Sorry to move the map around here. Its the suburbs of houston. You can barely make out the district here. Let me zoom in and show you what were talking about, though. This district here, the seventh congressional district, it has been republican for half a century, since george h. W. Bush. Remember him . He won this as a congressman back in the 60s. Been republican since. But look at this. Its a certain type of republican congressional district, reliably republican in the past, suburban, white collar, college educated. And guess what . Not too fond of donald trump. Mitt romney had in problem winning this district in 2012. In 2016, trump couldnt even carry it. This is the kind of district democrats look at and say, hey, in an antitrump wave, if thats what they could get this year, this is the kind of district that could go. Again, you look at this. A whole bunch of numbers here. What does this mean . These are all the congressional districts in texas, ranked by the percentage of adults who have al fouryear degree. This district, texas7, comes n number one. So we talk about those white collegeeducated suburbanites, this is where you find them. Thats why democrats are excited about the seventh. But heres the flip side. They have a whole bunch of candidates running in a primary tomorrow. Theres probably going to be a runoff, we probably wont know the winner tomorrow, but democrats in washington are going to war against one of those candidates. Her name is laura mosher. She has some support on the left. Why is that . She gave an interview that few years ago and made some disparaging comments about life in paris, texas. Thats not part of the district. She talked about she would sooner have her teeth pulled than without anesthesia than be there. They think that can come back to haunt them. Theres a bit of a blowback there. Thats the soap opera in a district of all the districts in the country, this is the one democrats are most hopeful about and one of the most barometers nationally. Does beta orourke have a chance against ted cruz . In a neutral year in texas, its probably not time for democrats to win. But in an antitrump wave and ted cruzs numbers arent that great in texas, certainly worth watching. Nice to have you here, steve kornacki. Appreciate your time. And politico reports at least 50 women have filed to run in texas tomorrow. Texas has 36 districts, but only 3 women in its house delegation. In fact, the state hasnt added a new woman to Congress Since republican representative kay granger in 1996. Joining me now are two candidates who are trying to change that. Veronica escobar is a democrat running for texass 16th district, a seat currently held by congressman beta orourke, who is now challenging senator ted cruz. Veronica birkenstock is a republican running for texass 26th district, challenging republican congressman, michael burgess. Veronicas, thank you very much for being here. Veronica birkenstock, ill start with you. You were a member of the Trump Campaign finance team. Your website says you stand with President Trump. Why are you deciding in this period where there is so much tumult and so much controversy to align yourself so closely with the president . Well, our district is about 90 conservative republicans. We have and we are the ninth largest conservative voting bloc in the country. And being aligned with President Trump very early on in his campaign, i just felt the need to give a voice for our district that was closely more closely aligned with than our current congressman. He was supposed to lead the charge in repealing obamacare and did not do that, at all. In fact, the house bill that was sent over to the senate was dead on arrival. And then when we did the tax reform, there never was a repeal of the individual mandate in the house bill. It was only in conference that came out of the senate bill. So i just sat back and im just tired. Hes been there for 16 years, im just tired of us not having a voice on that hill. Skbr and just decided to do something about it. I was very energized working with the Trump Campaign, traveling to six different states, being a surrogate in many cases and speaking at different rallies and also attending the debates and just want to come alongside him to help him move that agenda a little bit farther. Do you plan on standing by the president on all issues, or is there something that you might break with him on . So far, there havent been any issues that i have stood against. So far, i am pretty much aligned with everything that he has put forth. What about the nra and the bumpstock ban or potentially even raising the age limit from 18 to 21. The president has expressed some support for that, veronica birkensto birkenstock, but where do you stand . I dont agree on the 21. I think if a person can serve in our military at 18, they should be able to own a firearm at that age. As far as a bump stock, i could support some of that. But im more concerned about where all the missed opportunities and all the red flags that were shown prior to this, when the fbi failed us, when local Law Enforcement failed us, when the School District failed us. Im more concerned about how we can identify problems before. I dont think its a gun issue. I think its being an alert issue and taking threats very serious, whether its a bullying effect or if its on a social media or if its a fight or if its a disagreement that we come into that situation and try to diffuse it before it gets completely out of hand. And thats what happened in florida. And its not just florida, its in every one of these cases, we see there are so many signs that people do nod follow through or they just allow the evil to continue, without stepping in and being responsible. Veronica escobar, youre one of six Democratic Candidates in your race. Why do you think youre going to stand out over the others . Well, first of all, thank you, katy, for having us on. Its a pleasure to be on your show. My hope is, is that the community sees my long record of being devoted to el paso, one of the greatest communities in america, and the work that i have done to help expand access to Affordable Health care, ensuring we have a modern transportation infrastructure system, and really being a zealous advocate for our community on the u. S. mexico border. There have been so many myths that have been spread about el paso over that seems to be gaining traction and those myths are growing. And i think el pasons know we need a strong voice in washington right now, especially to follow up on congressman beth orourkes great work here and in d. C. And i have a lot of faith in el pasons that they will support my effort. What do you think of where the democrats or what they did, at least, when it came to dreamers. Was it a good idea to end up copuch lac capitulating, to shut down the government and end up capitulating so far without a deal for dreamers . So far, we havent seen any movement on that. The courts have extended it, but theres been no muchlt ovement congress. No concrete movement within congress to legislate for dreamers. Right. And you know, it was as many of us feared and predicted. If youre going to make a threat. If youre going to say, we are willing to hold this hostage in order to ensure that our dreamers get access to what was promised to them, and promised to them even by candidate donald trump. Then we should have kept that promise to them. I do think that there was capitulation. I think that we should be holding our dreamers hostage. These are young men and women who are of incredible value to our country, to our communities, to our state. And we have to stand by them. They are a fundamental component of what makes America Great and what makes places like el paso, texas, great. Would you stand by nancy pelosi as House Speaker or vote for her as House Speaker if democrats were to retake the majority in the house . You know, i am not thinking about anything past march 6th. My primary is tomorrow. We are working hard to get out the vote. Weve been knocking on doors, weve been calling folks. As you mentioned, im in a sixperson race, so were doing everything we possibly can to get our supporters out. And ill think about the future when that time comes. If either one of you ladies win, youll certainly add another lady to the caucus over there in congress. And veronica escobar, as i understand it, you would be the first latina to serve texas in congress. Right. You know, its so important that we have a Diverse Congress and that we have people representing us who look like the communities that they live in and that they represent. And so if el paso should get that designation, it would be very exciting for our community. Veronicas, thank you very much. We appreciate it. Veronica birkenstock and veronica escobar, appreciate your time. Thanks. Two veronicas. And next up, new details about the man behind the trump dossier and how the exspy tried to warn the world about trumps ties to russia. Your body was made for Better Things than rheumatiod arthritis. Before you and your rheumatologist move to another treatment, ask if xeljanz xr is right for you. Xeljanz xr is a oncedaily pill for adults with moderate to severe ra for whom methotrexate did not work well. It can reduce pain, swelling and further joint damage, even without methotrexate. 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His name is widely known, his dossier even more so, but Christopher Steele is still a man of mystery. Now a new piece by the new yorkers jane mayer is giving us new insight into the former british spy who was a target of both the president and his allies. Quote, in conversations with friends, steele said he hoped that in five years, he would look back and laugh at the whole experience, but he tended toward pessimism. No matter how the drama turned out, i will take this to my grave, he often predicted. A longtime friend of steeles pointed out to me that steele was in a singularly unenviable predicament. The dossier had both infuriated Vladimir Putin and donald trump by divulging allegedly corrupt dealings between them. Youve got oligarchs running both superpowers, the friends said, and incredibly, they both hate this same guy. Mikko oyang is a former congressional intelligence staffer. Mikko, good to see you. Another report that the kremlin had intervened to block mitt romney as secretary of state. Listen to this, the memo said that the kremlin, through unspecified channels, had asked trump to appoint someone who would be prepared to lift ukrainerelated sanctions and who would cooperate on Security Issues of interest to russia, such as the conflict in syria. How far fetched is that from your experience . Romney wasnt ultimately chosen, it ended up being rex tillerson, somebody who through exxon had deep ties to russia. Thats right. Its not surprising that the kremlin would have a preference and that they would not like mitt romney. Remember, he said during his president ial campaign that russia was the number one g geopolitical foe. And people at the time thought he was out of touch, but it turns out he was prescient. So its not surprising that he would say no, but what is surprising that the administration would take their concerns seriously and pass over someone like this in favor of someone like rex tillerson, who has very little experience with government and has his management of the state department shows that. Mieko, hold on. We have some breaking news to report. Former Trump Campaign aide sam nunberg has been cualled before the grand jury and will refuse to go and refuse to turn over any documents. Sam, you join me on the phone. Hi, katy. Why are you saying no . Because what they sent me was absolutely ridiculous. They wanted every single email i had with roger stone and with steve bannon. Why should i hand them emails from november 1st, 2015 . I was thinking about this today, katy, i was preparing it. Should i spend 50 hours going over all my emails with roger and with steve bannon . And then they wanted emails that i had with hope hicks, with Corey Lewandowski. Are you giving me a break . Its ridiculous. This is the special counsel. Hes investigating donald trump you know what you know what mr. Mueller but you sat with him a week ago, or a week and a half ago, and did that make you change your opinion of this investigation, that you dont want to cooperate . Im not going to cooperate when they want me to have when they want me to come in to a grand jury, for them to insinuate that roger stone was colluding with julian assange. Roger is my mentor. Roger is like family to me. Im not going to do it. What has happened in the last 24 hours thats made you im not change your mind on this . When i was going over everything today, when i looked back at the subpoena, this is ridiculous. It was absolutely ridiculous. And you know what . Im not a fan of donald trump, as you well know. Katy, do you know that . Youve said it. Im not a fan of his. He treated vorn eed roger and m badly and he screwed us over during the campaign. But you know, here, when i get a subpoena like this, rogers right, its a witch hunt i mean, mr. Trumps right. Its a witch hunt. The president s right. Its a witch hunt. And im not going to cooperate why do i have to spend 80 hours going over my emails . That ive had with steve bannon and with roger stone . Why does bob mueller need to see my emails when i send roger and steve clips and we talk about how much we hate people . Sam, you were on the Campaign Early on. You were there when donald trump was deciding to announce he wanted to run for president. Donald trump did not collude with the russians it is the biggest joke, to ever think donald trump colluded with the russians. I can tell you, donald trump, when he was involved in conservative politics, did not halt his business, okay . Donald trump did not want to attack Hillary Clinton early on in the campaign. He only wanted to attack jeb bush, because it wasnt going to be it wasnt going to be good for him, and had he not won the primary, he was probably going to endorse Hillary Clinton. Sam, you were on this campaign i am not going to go over my emails, im not going to spend 80 hours because a bunch of fbi agents and a bunch of u. S. Attorneys want me to to harass me. And you know, heres the thing. Theyve gone over theyve already bankrupted people, katy. Theyve bankrupted other people with this. You know, sean spicer has big legal bills. Josh raffaele has big legal bills. Hold on. Hold on, sam. You were on our air, on msnbc just last week, saying the russia investigation was not a waste of time. That this was not a waste of taxpayer money. Its a waste of time you were adamant about that. So what was changed, sam, in the last 24 hours, or last week when you decided to do this . When i got the subpoena, it was ridiculous to me. The subpoena is absolutely ridiculous. Why should i hand them over every email ive had with steve bannon or roger stone since november . And you know what since november of 2015 since november of 2015 give me a break sam, what about those who might look at this and say, you have something to hide . Or theres sthung thomething th dont want to reveal because now youre saying youre not going to cooperate. What if people looks suspicious . Let them think what they want. Let them think what they want. You know, im the first person to go out here and say, im not cooperating. Because its absolutely ridiculous what they want from me. Katy, should i spend 80 hours going over emails . That ive had with steve bannon and donald and roger stone . If youre going to defy a grand jury subpoena, are you worried about being in held of contempt of court . Lets see what mr. Mueller does. Are you worried about getting arrested . I think it would be funny if they arrested me. If youre held in contempt of court, wouldnt you have higher legal bills . I think it would be really, really funny that they wanted to earre arrest me because i didnt want to spend 80 hours going over emails that i had with steve bannon and roger stone. Steve bannon, roger stone, hope hicks, who else is on the list of emails that they want from you . Oh, katy, did i ever communicate with carter page . Do you think i communicated with Corey Lewandowski . After november 1st, 2015 . I mean, korey was the one who screwed me over and got me fired from the campaign. What about steve keith schiller, donald trump . For them to ask me about communications with donald trump, the president of the united states, that is over the hill. That is too much for mr. Mueller to ask for. Its for. It is ridiculous. Sam, let me ask a question. Dont interrupt u. Were in the Campaign Early on and you said Cory Lewandowski helped get you fired but you were there when donald trump decided whether he was going to run for president and why he was going to run for president and what sort of positions he would hold when he decided to run for president. Wouldnt the special counsel be interested in finding out what you know about that time early on . Yeah. They asked about it. They certainly did. What did they ask . And it was ridiculous. What did they ask . If i could tell you, once again, katy, donald trump being involved in conservative politics was not good for his business. By the way, i think my lawyer is going to dump me right now. Why what do they ask you about donald trump taking policy positions early on . They asked me if donald trump took positions and he flat out told me he was taking positions because of his business. And i will tell you he never told me that. He did not. What else have they been asking you . They asked you know what they asked, which is ridiculous to me, they asked things like did you hear people speaking russian in the trump office . Who . Katy, i did not hear people speaking russian in the trump office, okay. That is ridiculous. They asked things like keep going. They asked things like did you hear did you hear about trump tower moscow . No. I never heard about trump tower moscow . Never heard it about it once. And i can tell you katy, youre not going to like to hear this and your audience isnt going to like to hear, this but when donald trump took positions where he said that Vladimir Putin that Vladimir Putin was better off fighting syria against isis compared to barack obama, he was right. Because you dont remember this, or you dont want to talk about it, but isis was chopping americans heads off. And trump was right about it. He was intuitively right about it. Ill leave your allegations against me and the viewers of network to decide. Okay. Im sorry. But i would like to ask this, a gop primary would not have been a fan of russia or Vladimir Putin. It was not a popular opinion to be friendly towards russia or putin among republicans very early on. Why is it not relevant for the special counsel to ask why donald trump was so friendly to shrewd mere putin early on . It confused a whole lot of people back then and he is still pretty friendly. It is confusing a whole lot of people now. And by the way, i agree with you. And i think trump made a major mistake. I think that Vladimir Putin should face serious consequences for what he did during the election. But what ive also said to you and ive said repeatedly is trump was more than if Vladimir Putin wanted to release Hillary Clinton emails and by the way she should have protected her emails, it is fine to me, and if trump wanted to get that out and remember you asked that question to him. If trump wanted to get the emails out, that is fine. Because she should have protected her emails. And do you think russia was the only one who stole her emails . Do you think russia was the only one that hacked her emails . Do you think that china didnt . Or china didnt . Or israel didnt . Of course they did. Im still curious, since you had gone on the record on your network saying this investigation was not a waste of taxpayer money, that this investigation was going along in a professional way. Why you would decide to do this all of a sudden and why you would decide, i imagine against the advice against the advice of your own lawyer. Yeah. I imagine your lawyer is telling you not to rip up a subpoena. Yeah. Hes probably not. And i think Robert Mueller will be pretty and why are you doing . Because im not going to produce them every email i had with steve bannon and roger stone from november of 2015. Why do i have to produce them all of my communications. It is ridiculous. Are you ready to go to jail . Im not going to go to jail. How do you know you wont go to jail. You are publicly snubbing your nose as the special counsel and the investigation. If they dont do anything for you, they would allow anyone else to snub their nose at this investigation. All sorts of people who are being interviewed or go in front of the grand jury. Katy, maybe people should start snubbing their nose because the way they are asking for communications that i had with steve bannon, with roger stone, to me is too much. They want me to go in next friday this friday, excuse me. And they want me to go in and they want me to testify against my mentor who did nothing. He did nothing wrong, roger, okay. He did nothing wrong. In fact, he was treated terribly by donald trump. And by the way, we cost him a lot of money, roger and me, as you know, correct. Did you find an email in the last 24 hours that made you worried, an email you didnt want to hand over, a text mess you didnt want to hand over. No is there a question in your ear. No. I came up off the top of my head. No. I did not go over of my emails since ive been contacted by them. And you know the other thing that really upset me not upset me, i was very low on this list, okay. I got to spend 50,000 on legal fees. And i was very low on this list and then suddenly when they called me you know when they called me, katy, after Michael Wolffs book came out and they asked me a bunch of things in there about roger and me after we were fired. And as you remember, when you covered that campaign, katy, roger and me were treated terribly and trust me we were t colluding with trump and it wasnt some smart idea to be fired and then we would get the emails from russia. If roger and me were there, katy, we wouldnt have had the benghazi parents there, we would have had little clintons illegitimate black child there is the the second debate and the women there. Sam, hold on. Sam, hold on. What you are doing is surprising to say the least. But you sat there in that room being questioned about muellers investigators, i want to hear directly from you, do you think that they have something on the president . I think they may. What . I think he may have done something during the election. But i dont know that for sure. Why do you think that . I cant explain it unless you were in there. Explain the atmosphere. The way they ask questions about anything i heard after i was fired from the campaign to the general election to even november 1 is insinuated to me that he may have done something. And he may well have. If you got that sense from the special counsel investigators, why would you not want to cooperate with them. If you got a sense that something happened because im not interested in handing all of my emails over that i communicated with steve bannon and with other people and with roger stone. Im not interested in it. And im not interested in themmthem insinuating that roger did something bad. Sam i want to be clear yes. I want to be clear. I want to be very clear. Has anybody at all contacted you in the last few days, the last 24 hours to encourage you not to talk to the special counsel no. Or to tell you not to talk to the special counsel or to give you a reason why it would not behoove you to talk to the special counsel . I decided this, katy im sorry, the grand jury. A couple of hours ago i decided that when i was going over all of my emails. And i was going over how long and arduous this process was going to be and i was just like, this is ridiculous. Why do i have to give Robert Mueller my random emails with steve bannon and roger stone . Why . Is anybody from the Trump White House contacted you . No. Has the president contacted you . No. Has anybody from trumps legal team contacted you . No. Has roger stone told you not to go to talk to the grand jury . No. Has steve bannon told you not to go talk to the grand jury. No. And by the way, steve bannon, i spoke to steve bannon for the first time last week after i went in there and the first and i spoke to him and steve and i were discussing about how we both feel, katy, like im tell ug, that trump may have very well done something during the election. I dont know what it is. I could be wrong, by the way. Sam nunberg, remarkable. Thank you very much for calling in. What is remarkable about this, by the way . Everything is remarkable about it, sam. You know, you called me correct. It is all unbelievable i would say. What do you think mule ser going to do to me . You know, im not a lawyer. I dont know. But i imagine given the circumstances you might be held in contempt of court. If im held in contempt of court because i dont want to communicate what roger stone and steve bannon and you talked about in 2015. And it is michael
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