Transcripts For MSNBCW MSNBC Live With Hallie Jackson 20200617

I dont think the nation is going to allow us to lose the momentum. Thats good news. Ive had multiple conversations with senator booker. No conversations with senator harris. And i look forward to finding a middle ground where the motion to proceed will has arct articulated already, 100 votes, how to make the legislation better and serve the American People. I hope that he is willing to cooperate on getting us there, but certainly without any democrat support, that means that this is only a symbolic moment and not a moment for us to make a law. Are you open to any national mandates at all, whether it is mandating the use of body cameras, requiring banning no knock warrants and drug cases, or banning chokeholds . Are you open in all to any of those national mandates that democrats are proposing . I think we achieve some of the same ends by our approach. If you think about the inability to have any grants if your department has chokeholds, that frankly is by default a ban on chokeholds. The conversation will move forward and only way we get to a place where we have a law is to work with our friends on the other side, who are willing to have that conversation. I think that there are things that i believe the conference will not support, but they will all support a conversation. I think well all support having meaningful dialogue, but whatever comes out of that dialogue will have to be in the best interests of the nation. One thing that democrats are talking about is qualified immunity. They say thats a Sticking Point. But yet we talk to a number of Police Officers who say hey, youre not going to get qualified people. Why should i put myself on the line if im going to be able to have something taken away from me in a civil suit. Is this off the table qualified immunity . I think different members of the conference have different opinions on qualified immunity. My position has been that when the democrats Start Talking about qualified immunity and the ability to aggressively pursue the officers at a higher threshold, that is hard to thats the poison pill from my perspective. Is there a conversation that could be had around Something Different . Perhaps. I havent heard it yet. But were open to hearing, i think, lindsey alluded to the fact there has been a conversation happening on the Judiciary Committee that may bring more light to this issue. But i have not had that conversation so far. I have a question, first, do you expect to have the endorsement of President Trump for this legislation and also when you met with the victims families yesterday at the white house, did you talk to them about this bill and if you did, what was their reaction to your approach . Well, i hope the president will join forces and jump on board. I have had several conversations over several days with the president and his team who crafted the executive order. We were part a part of the process of understanding and appreciating the direction of the executive order. I tried to take the information that i had about the executive order, hard wire the bill from Mental Health aspects of it as you see the coresponders in the president s executive order and then sitting down with the Family Members yesterday, twice, one at the white house and the second time in my office, we went through the bill and what it does, what it doesnt do, they were i think you heard in some of the media reports, they believe the bill is helpful. Does it take it to the level that every Family Member wants it to . I think the answer is probably not. Does it get us much closer . According to the words i heard from the Family Members and both meetings, the answer is yes. You said at the top this is not a binary issue between the police and pushing for a lot of the records we hear from the president , hell tweet law and order, those types of things, do you think he can give a little bit hes going to have to give and good conversations, after the hearing yesterday, hes going to have to give a little bit. Do you think hes willing to bend . Ill say this, the president was the most president ial ive seen him talking to the families yesterday. It was not about anything other than finding justice for the victims and their families. If you want to see the president s willingness to bend, so to speak, it is not so much about bending, and all about finding justice and the path forward. His instructions to the ag yesterday during that meeting with the families was get it done. Dont tell me youre going to do it, go do it, start getting closer and involved in the cases that are yet the alchemist to undetermined. The president s willingness to meet us on this issue, it is clear. His executive order statements about justice for the families about having this conversation, his frankly his executive order went a lot further. You have van jones talking about this, real executive order, van jones and President Trump on the same page, you know, thats almost walking on water in america. There is a lot for us to celebrate about every lever of government wants change. And most of us want about 70 of the same change. Meant to be not your bill, jobless bill, but democratic bill, something the House Democrats are putting together in the markup. I cant speak to what the democrats are doing. I will say what we have done is a bipartisan piece of legislation, taken the priorities in the house bill, the words of the president and the executive order and the frank the fantastic minds behind me and crafted it into a piece of legislation. The legislation is already bipartisan. The question is can we get bipartisan support . Can i just clarify, are there active ongoing negotiations with democrats right now on changes to this bill that could get them on board before the motion to proceed . Not with me. Theyre active conversations going on about democrats. If we let me say it this way, if we dont have the votes on a motion to proceed, that means that politics is more important than restoring confidence in communities of color in the institutions of authority. On that point, we have seen bipartisan groups of lawmakers get together on big issues whether it be immigration or gun violence or deficit reduction, only to have it fall apart. Why is this issue different . I think we have gone through a lot this year as a country. We started with impeachment, we found ourselves in the Global Pandemic and the Global Pandemic, i remember sitting and talking to ben sass about some of the challenges were facing and working on some of the lindsey on the unemployment issues, and i thought to myself, there is no way that were going to all come together and do something meaningful. Well, 96 votes later, to zero, this congress, this senate acted not in a pitbipartisan fashion,t good oldfashioned americans making something happen for their neighbors, friends, people they never met. I believe that if we take that same consciousness into this process, and dont make it about bipartisan or partisan politics, we make it about families who lost loved ones, about restoring trust, about respecting officers, if we can put that on the table, and not your shirt versus skins game, well get to the finish line. Last question. Senator, throughout yesterdays hearing and throughout the debate after George Floyds death we heard a number of viewpoints. Seems like democrats and a number of activists are talking about systemic racism in policing. I dont hear any of you saying that. How does that i could be wrong. I just didnt hear that yesterday. Other than, you know, chairman graham got talked a bit about that potential, but i wonder, how does that how does that difference really affect the outcome of this bill . How does it affect your chances to get to a solution if you dont agree on the problem . I would say that if you look at the legislation, you look at the house legislation, you would have to come to the conclusion from a training perspective the importance of deescalation, the duty to intervene, chokeholds is a place where you have common ground. I think if you look at the importance of data collection, you say, without any question, the senate wants more information on serious Bodily Injury and on the use of force that leads to death. The house bill says they want information on all uses of force. Here is what were saying on the issue of data collection, were on the same page. On training, and on grants, and on using the resources of the federal government to compel and to encourage behavior and local departments, were on the same page. On misconduct of officers, we want to a department by department database, locally, they want a state database, the president and his executive order talks about a database. Were on the same page. The fact that some people enjoy talking about systemic racism, or the fact that some people want to define everything from a racism, racist perspective, and we dont spend time on the definition of a word, but we spend time on the definition of the problem and the definition of the solution, when there is an overlap of 70, 75 when you start, youre in the right place. So i dont know how to tell people that the nation is not racist, ill try again. Were not a racist country. We deal with racism because there is racism in the country. Both are mutually true. Theyre both true. Not mutually exclusive. I dont worry about the definitions people want to use. Good for headlines, but bad for policy. Were going to focus on getting something done. Thank you. All right, hello, everyone. Im ayman mohyeldin. You saw the proposal on Police Reform, the bill led by South Carolina senator tim scott who fielded all the questions there in that news conference. Over on the house side, this is a live look that youre seeing right now at the Judiciary Committee, where the markup on the democrats bill about Police Reform is about to start. Were going to keep you updated on any developments that come out of that hearing. Obviously now the question is about the two bills and some major issues. Senate Majority Leader Mitch Mcconnell saying he plans to bring the gop bill next week to the floor of the senate. And Garrett Haake is on capitol hill for us. Shannon pettypiece at the white house. Garrett, ill begin with you, where this briefing took place. Bring us up to speed on the kind of general outlines of the Senate Republican bill that was just released and if you can, tell us a little bit about the key differences between their version and the democrats. Well, the Senate Republican bill attacks almost all of the same issues that the Democratic House bill does, though it does so slightly less expansively and slightly less aggressively. If you want to look at it wholistically, the senate bill is more carrot and less stick. So on things like getting rid of chokeholds, the republican bill ties that to grant money and essentially says to local departments if you dont do this, youre not going to get this extra money. The democratic bill bans it outright, on things like no knock warrants, the republican bill moves slower, says we want to study this process first before we start to ban it at the federal level. Probably the biggest single Sticking Point from a policy perspective between the two bills is what to do with qualified immunity. Essentially the ability to bring a civil suit against a Police Officer in a use of force case. Democrats want to end qualified immunity. Tim scott, you heard, say thats a poison pill. He doesnt think that gets anywhere on the republican side of things. So what were going to see over the next week is fairly quick action when it comes to the United States senate. You heard Majority Leader Mitch Mcconnell say theyll dispense with two federal judge issues that were already cued up on the floor of the senate, now move this to the floor next week. The house bill will probably also reach the floor of the house next week as well. There are significant differences here. There are procedural hurdles to go through. But at least we have some significant momentum and some actual motion here on real honest to god legislation to address this issue. Yeah, it is quite remarkable you see the wheels of it spinning the way theyre supposed to. There is, of course, the third aspect to this, which is the president and his executive order. Garrett, stay with me. Over to shannon pettypiece. The president introduced his own executive order yesterday, where does that stand because we heard tim scott there, the senator from South Carolina field a question about whether or not the president is on board. They didnt seem to be 100 certain that the president is on board saying he hopes he will get there, but what is your sense between where the president stands or how much of a gap there exists between the executive order and what we heard come out of Senate Republicans . We have not officially formally heard from the president on this. It is unclear if we will get an opportunity to ask him about this today. But we a few things we know, through the course of several weeks, a big guiding principle for the president on what hes willing to get behind is whether or not it has the support of Law Enforcement. So if this tim scott bill is something were going to see Law Enforcement getting behind, and endorsing, then you can see probably a clear path from the president getting behind it as well. A number of Senior Administration officials, chief of staff mark meadows have been pushing the president to make sure that whatever he backs also has a backing of Law Enforcement. So i would say to look for that. Now, on whether or not were going to see anything land on the president s desk as of yesterday, i was hearing some skepticism that anything could actually get done. There were comparisons made to gun reform, where it looked like democrats or republicans were close, but never got a deal together and other events came along and overcame those. We do have a very limited window of time to get something done when you look at the congressional schedule. So skepticism in the white house, but that could all change today now that as garrett said there is actual legislation out there. A lot of momentum. We have a lot to unpack in that news conference. Thank you very much for starting things off for us. You heard there about President Trumps executive order. Thats drawing widespread reaction including to a provision that encourages Police Departments to ban chokeholds with one major exception. Would this have stopped George Floyds tragic to bring into th conversation right now George Floyds sister, Bridget Floyd and family attorney benjamin crump. Thank you for joining us. Bridget, thank you for joining us now. Let me ask you how your family is doing this morning. We are making it. We are making it. Pretty tough. But with god on our side, everything is working together for our good. How do you feel about the amount of protests and the calls for reform that youre seeing right now . How has that impacted you and impacted your family . Were happy to see people supporting my brother. It is a wonderful thing. We just hope that they keep they continue to keep it peaceful. And do the right things. And we appreciate all of the support. We appreciate all of the support. Mr. Crump, there is no doubt that the killing of george floyd has as youve seen rocked our political world with everybody now calling for some kind of Police Reform. Youve seen the house put their bill forward. Youve seen the president introduce his executive order and youve seen the Senate Republicans introduce their measures. Give me your reaction to what you have seen so far from all of our political leaders in terms of their reforms that you and the floyd family want to see implemented. Based on what ive seen in the aftermath of the tragic killing of george floyd, this is the best opportunity for us to have real substantive systematic reform to prevent this from happening to anybody elses family. As bridgett just said, you want people to do right. And this is an opportunity for our elected officials to do right. When we testified last week before the United States congress, i was asking why is this a crisis that needs congressional attention right now . Representative Sheila Jackson lee, and i told her, if we dont change the culture and behavior of policing in america, i predict that 30 days th s there be another unjustified Police Killing of a black person and another city on fire. And that was on wednesday. Two days later on friday night the police shoot rayshard brooks. I think it is a crisis situation because theyre killing black and nobody has been held accountable. Bridgett if i can, i wanted to ask you about these reforms that youre seeing. What would you say to those working on Police Reforms about what you believe is needed right now in the country. I would say that these offic officers should have some sort of Refresher Training classes. I think some things need to be put in line. Because it is like theyre doing whatever they want to do. And im sure that they were not trained that type of way. To kill people at first hand. We definitely know that thats not how they came aboard. So i think that they should have some training in between the time you were hired, and the time period that you have been working for your department. And a refresher course is always good. It is nothing bad. It is just to keep everybody up to date with the rules and regulations on how to serve our people. Mr. Crump, i wanted to get your reaction, specifically to a little bit of the gap that still exists on some of these key issues. Are there things in the congressional bills or the president s executive order that did not reach the magnitude for what you think this time needs . Certainly, i think in specific cases, you think about jrn george floyd, you want to ban chokeholds. You dont want to disincentivize anything. You want to take absolute action to say these chokeholds are killing people. Eric garner, george floyd, and then back in california, where congresswoman Maxine Waters in the late 80s, seven black men were killed by chokeholds in los angeles, so even from there to now they still have not banned chokeholds and qualified immunity. That allows Police Officers to escape any kind of accountability. There is no deterrent factor. Unless we end this qualified immunity or do something about it. And lastly, there is a racial problem in policing in america, we need to hear them say black lives matter. We need to hear the president say black lives matter. We need those leaders to acknowledge that because if they dont do it, theyre not acknowledging that the problem is fixed f you dont acknowledge a problem exists, how do you solve it . Let me ask you about the events yesterday at the white house. Were you invited to that . Were you at all in communication with the white house about attending it, mr. Crump . The family of george floyd wants to see real systemic change happen. They want to go to the white house when the george floyd proposed legislation is signed into law. They dont want to have people talking about it, they want to see people doing something about it. Because Everything Else is just rhetor rhetoric. What we need is the george floyd Police Reform law to be passed and it to have the support of the Congressional Black Caucus who have been dealing with this issue for decades now. Way before other people started dealing with it. All right. Attorney benjamin crump, bridgett floyd, thank you for joining us this morning. I appreciate your time as always. Thank you. Were also waiting for a major announcement out of atlanta. The District Attorney there is expected to decide as early as today whether to charge the two Police Officers involveshooting brooks at a wendys drive through. Catie beck is on the scene in atlanta for us. When can we expect this announcement to be made . Reporter well, we have been told it could happen as soon as today. We know District Attorney paul howard is under the microscope, much of atlanta wondering what the next steps will be. Will he charge one or both of the officers . The charges that are on the table, murder, felony murder, and voluntary manslaughter. Those are charges that are being considered as he reviews ballistic evidence, surveillance video, body cam video, and tries to determine just what the threat was to those officers. If they indeed felt their life was in danger when they fired the shots against rayshard brooks. That is what hes contemplating. Were toll the answer could come down as soon as today. It is extremely rare to charge a Police Officer with murder. This is an incredibly difficult decision. Especially when District Attorneys work with Police Officers on a daily basis. So howard has made clear he does not want to rush this decision. He wants to be careful and deliberate and make sure he considers all of the possibilities of things that were going on in those very tense moments. So we are waiting as far as protesters and demonstrators are concerned, the past two days have been very peaceful here in atlanta. It seems as though protesters heard the message that came from mayor Keisha Lance Bottoms she taking Police Reforms very seriously, implementing changes right a way to ensure the family remains safe in the wake of this and until we know what the charges are. We are watching and waiting for a decision, it could come as soon as today. But we dont know at this point. Well bring you that news as soon as it does. Catie beck live for us in atlanta with the latest. Thank you. Coming up, it is the state with the fastest growth rate of coronavirus cases. Hospitalizations surging dramatically, leaving one Medical Center in the states second largest city with one available icu bed available earlier this week. Well talk to the mayer who says the governor is hampering her ability to stop the surge. A solemn remembrance in charleston, South Carolina, where that city is marking five years since the shooting at Mother Emanuel Church that killed nine parishioners. The shooting carried out by a white supremacist inspired a wave of support for removing confederate symbols in South Carolina as seen here. And around the country. Just days after the tragedy, president obama delivered a eulogy for one of the victims and spoke out about the systemic changes that many are still calling for today. By recognizing our common humanity, by treating every child as important, regardless of the color of their skin or the station into which they were born, and to do what is necessary to make opportunity real for every american, by doing that we express gods grace. What getting fueled with one protein feels like. What getting fueled with three energy packed proteins feels like. Meat cheese and nuts p3. Because 3 is better than 1 meat cheese and nuts as business moves forward, were all changing the way things get done. Like how we redefine collaboration. How we come up with new ways to serve our customers. And deliver our products. But no matter how things change, one thing never will you can rely on the people and the network of at t. To help keep your business connected. Welcome back. Were back with the facts at this hour, about the coronavirus. On fresh concerns about new spikes in the number of cases around the country, in the sun belt, arizona, texas and florida, theyre reporting the biggest one day increases in new cases. Were live in phoenix in a moment where there is growing concerns that hospitals there will be overwhelmed. Well also talk to a medical expert about Promising New Research on a common inexpensive steroid that has been shown to reduce deaths in the sickest of covid19 patients. And on the international front, honduran president Juan Orlando Hernandez announced he, first lady and two aides have tested positive for the coronavirus. But in a televised address, he said hes feeling well enough to continue working remotely. Lets go live to nbcs von hilliard in phoenix. The numbers there continue to grow, unfortunately in the wrong direction in arizona. What are you hearing from medical experts on the ground . Reporter theyre more than growing, theyre skyrocketing here. In just the last week alone there has been more than 10,800 cases in the state of arizona. Yesterday marked the most number of cases recorded. The highest mark of hospitalizations, the most icu beds being used, and there is one number particularly that i want to point out, because there are some in this government that have suggested that the number of cases are rising because of the increase in testing. But what you need to look at are the percent positive cases, these are the percentage of cases that come back positive, among all the tests that are conducted, and what you see that number doing is continuing to rise. The governor here justified the opening of this government or the opening of these businesses based off of that number. Now youre seeing it going the wrong direction since the stayathome order in the state expired. I want to bring in one individual who knows this well. Dr. Octar. Youre an er physician, youre an assistant professor here at the university of arizona, school of the college of medicine, phoenix. Can you give us a sense, youre seeing folks, what are you seeing in these hospitals now . Thats exactly right. Everything you said is correct. The data showing that the rate of positivity is going up, which means it cant just be because of the number of tests we have done. If anything, you would expect the number of positivity to go down if that were the case. And it is bearing out in the hospital as well. We have had in the hospital you have a predilection for people who are sicker and more like through have covid. We were getting a frequent amount of negative covid tests before. When i worked just yesterday or two days ago, almost everybody tested was covid positive. I havent seen anything like that and i will be shocked to think that there were cases throughout the state arent rise rapidly based on what the data is showing and my experience in the emergency department. What is the condition of these folks . Some of them are coming in, you know, at the initial stages of flulike symptoms and thinking, well, it might be covid, might not be but a lot of them already knew they had covid, they were diagnosed five days ago, ten days ago and crth are coming in because they have gotten sicker. They can get sick quite frequently a little bit later in the course. Thank you very much. I know you have the tucson mayor on with you next. There is a not of frustration in the state because of the lack of response from the Arizona Governor here. There is still localities that are not allowed to make their own restriction or requirements when it comes to the likes of Wearing Masks and right now there is a lot of questions as to what the state is going to do to stop this increase from continuing. Vaughn hillyard, thank you. As he mentioned there, im joined now by the mayor of tucson, rehena romero. Thank you for joining us. Let me begin by getting your reaction, if i can, to that reporting from vaughn that arizona now has its worst day yet in the number of new coronavirus cases. Hospitalizations, icu bed uses at the highest they have been during the crisis. That has to be alarming. Very, very concerning. And unfortunately these numbers started rising as soon as governor ducey reopened our state. And we are hearing from Healthcare Professionals that we can pinpoint to that particular action by the governor regarding our this laalarming rate of covid19 increases in our state. Here in pima county where tucson is located, we saw a growth in one day of 350 cases. In early may we were at in the teens in terms of new cases. We had come to a plateau because of the stayathome orders and my emergency proclamation in the city of tucson. But now we see just yesterday, 350 new cases in tucson and almost 3,000 new cases in arizona. Thats very concerning. I want to ask you about speaking to the governor, do you speak to him regularly about this. I know youre asking governor ducey to give tucson and other cities the authority to require the wearing of face masks in public. Have you been given that authority or what is the response you get from the governor if you do speak to him . The governors executive order very pointedly really took preemptive cities, towns and counties from making our own declarations, anything that doesnt that doesnt include that he doesnt include in his order. We have been having really good conversations when the pandemic first started to explode around the country in arizona. And little by little he stopped started counseling the calls with mayors, and now there is no communication, we have tried to call the governor, my office has tried to call the governor and he requested that we fill a request form to meet with the governor. It is very concerning because what we see is that governor ducey is not the the first thing he needs to do is acknowledge there is a problem. That he needs to send that sense of urgency to arizonans, and do you think hes politicizing the Health Concern . Is he trying to maybe appease the president by showing hes opening up his state when in reality the data and science does not support that from what you see . We have been working, mayors across arizona have been working hand and hand with the governor. Because we see the value of working in unity. Back in may, when President Trump came to arizona, to visit, that is when we saw the sudden change in governor ducey, and him trying to reopen the state as quickly as possible. Really tied to the time that President Trump came to visit arizona. Interesting. Today President Trump comes back to arizona and governor ducey refuses to make masks mandatory in the city of arizona. Governor ducey received a letter, hes received letters from mayors, hes received layers from board of supervisors, he received a couple of letters from medical professionals, asking him to just take the step to make masks mandatory. That could help save lives. If hes not willing to do that, he needs to untie the hands of mayors throughout arizona, so that we can take the necessary steps to protect our communities. All right, mayor regina romero, thank you for joining us, i appreciate your time. Thank you. I appreciate you. Lets get a quick fact check with dr. Howard ko. Always a flour have ypleasure t on. Thank you for joining us again. Give us a sense why were seeing the spikes in florida, texas, arizona, the administration has been trying to say, of course, it is a result of more testing, were not necessarily seeing that according to what we heard there on the ground. The mayor of tucson saying it was correlated to the opening of that state a couple of weeks ago. Well, everyone should be concerned about the reports that were hearing from arizona, and other key parts of the country. It is a stark reminder that this pandemic is far from over. Were still running a Public Health marathon here. And a threat to Health Anywhere is a threat to our collective Public Health everywhere. So this is a time where we really need to double down on the power of prevention, especially as states try to reopen and get schools and businesses up and running. We need to double down on prevention we know works and save lives, social distancing, Wearing Masks, hand hygiene, and we need to keep that up through the summer and into the fall when the second wave may be coming on top of seasonal flu. In a new oped in the wall street journal, mike pence, hes basically accusing the media of hyping the spike in recent cases. He writes lost in the coverage is the fact that today less than 6 of americans tested each week are found to have the virus. Does he have a valid point . Hes saying this is not a second wave. Some are saying were not out of the first wave yet to look at a second wave. How would you rate the Vice President s assessment there . We dont have a second wave yet because we are five months into a prolonged first wave that has led to over 2 Million People infected, nearly 120,000 people who have died tragically, and the worst pandemic this country endured in a century. So these are really sobering times and we need to, again, maximize the power of prevention here going forward. Second wave may come in the fall and thats why we need a one government approach to have federal and local officials working together as the mayor just pointed out, and just as important on a national level, having federal, state and local officials working together, because we have not had a coordinated response. Let me get your thoughts on new research from Oxford University that found this steroid that reduced deaths by a third in the sickest of covid19 patients. Do you think this is a potential game changer . Should we be getting optimistic about that or not yet . Well, this is a potentially very exciting study with one major caveat. We havent seen the details of the study yet. We have seen the headlines from the press release. But having said that, this is a very respected Research Group in the united kingdom, a large study of over 6,000 patients. These are severely ill patients on supplemental oxygen or ventilators who have responded to dexamethasone, readily accessible and it is very encouraging. We want to seat results, Peer Reviewed and published in the scientific journal and hopefully move on to help lots of patients going forward. All right, dr. Howard kho, i appreciate your time. Thank you. To our viewers, live pictures of the capitol hill, the house Judiciary Committee is marking up the justice and policing act that democrats introduced as their Police Reform bill. It comes a day after President Trump slammed his predecessor and joe biden for taking no action on Police Reform. Next, reaction from former obama Senior Adviser valerie jarrett. I dont keep track of regrets and i dont add up the years, but what i do count on. Is boost high protein. And now, theres boost mobility. With key nutrients to help support. Joints, muscles, and bones. Try boost mobility, with added collagen. Whether you know what day it is or not. Consistency is key when taking on acne. And an everyday cleanser . Thats breakouts worst enemy. Love, neutrogena®. In these challenging times, we need each other more than ever. We may be apart, but were not alone. Use Aarp Community connections to find or create a Mutual Aid Group near you. Stay connected and help those in need. Were back with a live look on capitol hill, where the house Judiciary Committee is marking up Democrats Police form bill. The first step before the committee and then the full house eventually votes on it. Senate republicans, they just released their own proposal within the last hour while also using the opportunity to take aim at democrats and, of course, the Obama Administration. Where were you for the eight years of the Obama Administration . Im getting a little tired of being lectured to by my democratic colleagues that all this is trumps fault. You had eight years. No attempts to ban chokeholds, no attempts to do any of the things we all agree we need to do now. That was senator Lindsey Graham, echoing what we hear and heard from President Trump yesterday who before signing an executive order of his own, of course, took a shot at his predecessor, barack obama. President obama and Vice President biden never even tried to fix this during their eightyear period. The reason they didnt try is because they had no idea how to do it. So we fact checked that and should note that claim is absolutely false. It got four pinocchios from the washington posts fact checker and our own nbc News Analysis found that president obama did take action to Reform Police and tried to reduce bias in Law Enforcement. The Trump Administration is well aware of that too, because it actually unraveled those changes when President Trump took office. I want to bring in valerie jarrett, who served as a Senior Adviser to president obama, his point person in the white house on criminal Justice Reform, including Police Reform efforts. She is also the author of finding my voice when the perfect plan crumbles, the adventure begins. Thank you for joining us, i appreciate your time. I want to give you a chance to respond to the president and senator graham here. Well, i agree with what you said. During the time president obama was in office, we had a robust Civil Rights Division, we instituted investigations of Law Enforcement around the country, where we saw patterns and practices of discriminatory behavior. Our Justice Department also worked with local Law Enforcement to enforce the recommendations in the 21st century report on policing. So we certainly took this issue very seriously from the beginning. And so it is ironic to hear senator Lindsey Graham criticize us, we were unable to get criminal Justice Reform more generally passed through congress while we were in office because of the opposition coming from the republicans. I was going to say really quickly, in august of 2017, President Trump reversed an obama policy that banned the military from selling surplus equipment to police, a measure that put in place to try and reduce that. I want to also get your thoughts if i can about that executive order that President Trump just signed, it encourages a ban on chokeholds, except when an officers life is at risk. And thats raising some questions. It also encourages Police Departments to bring in social workers for nonviolent calls involving the homelessness or people with Mental Health issues, and it creates a National Database to track officers with a record of Excessive Force complaints. Speaker pelosi called that and said that falls short. What is your take on the executive order that was issued yesterday . Definitely falls short. And, again, when trump took office, he dismantled the Civil Rights Division of the Justice Department that we had built up. He stopped his Justice Department from doing pattern and practice investigations. He cut the resources that were there to help local Law Enforcement implement evidencebased practices that would improve the bond of trust between police and communities of color. So they are way short, theyre trying to play catch up now, and i think frankly because theyre being put under enormous pressure by the American People, but what im hopeful is that congress will come together, establish some broad parameters and then the Justice Department should be working with local Law Enforcement, providing both carrots and sticks to ensure that this bond of trust is established. This is a civil rights issue. People who swear, took an oath to swear and swear that they are going to protect and serve us should do just that. And if there arent consequences, if there isnt transparency, and accountability, then were going to have a continuation of this this horrendous condition in our country, where far too many black families, every blam fack family has to instruct their children on how to behave when they interact with behave when they interact with police. Its gutwrenching. I want to pause for a moment. I think what we need is some empathy which we have seen in all 50 states, people pouring out and protesting. If you care about the civil rights of every american, then rise to this moment and change. I think thats what the American People are calling for. Thats exactly what i wanted to pick up on, the point of the protests in this country. As somebody that served in the white house at a time when there was protests following Michael Browns killing, that put pressure on the Obama Administration to carry out actions and address the issue. Do protests in your eyes have a role to play in keeping the pressure on Public Officials to get something done here . Absolutely, absolutely. When president obama created the 21st century task force, he included one of the protesters from ferguson. Her voice was important. What she learned on the ground was important and valuable and helped instruct the process. For example, one of her recommendations is we should have independent investigations when Police Brutality is involved. Why . Because prosecutors have to work hand in glove with police every day. Why not have what we saw in minnesota where the attorney general took over the case and said let me have transparency, let me assure people that there is fairness and honesty here and were treating people consistent with our core values. So, yes, i do think these demonstrations work. The other thing i think is important is people have to vote. People have to hold our elected officials accountable through voting. Speak of voting, i wanted to turn our attention to the 2020 race. Tomorrow youre going to be hosting a women for joe biden call with Atlanta Mayor Keisha Lance Bottoms. Shes been in the spotlight because of everything happening in that city. Curious to get your thoughts. Do you think she would make a good running mate as her name has been floated as a potential Vice President ial nominee . I think very highly of mayor lance bottoms. All our nations mayors have a tough job right now. Shes rising to that occasion. I think Vice President biden is fortunate in that he has an embarrassment of riches and he knows what the job entails. I trust him to make the right decision to not only help him campaign, but more importantly, when you think about the challenges of the new president , coming out of a pandemic hopefully, trying to restore our economy, trying to heal our country from the racial tensions that we are experiencing, its important that he has a running mate and he is uniquely qualified to find that right person. Do you think that person should be a woman of color . I think thats totally up to him. There are several women of color and several white women in contention. I trust Vice President biden to pick the person who he thinks is right, who will be his partner in what we know will be a challenging next term. Jalry jarrett, thank you for joining us. Appreciate your time. Thank you. Meanwhile, new information coming to light in the killing of a federal security officer. An air force sergeant and alleged member of boog loo was charged with the murder of David Patrick underword. Carrillo shot and killed a Santa Cruz Deputy who showed up at his home after connecting him with the death. Ben, good to have you with us. This is a very important case. I want you to tell our viewers what you learned about this and how that is tied to that Extremist Group boogaloo. Boogaloo is a term for a second civil war that a lot of thats disparate, antigovernment groups want to kick off. These groups try to insight more violence and stir up emotions in these spaces. This guy actively said this, on a facebook group, he said, if its not kicking off in your hood, then start it. If that civil war is not kicking off in your neighborhood, then go and do it. So thats what he was trying to do. He was trying to take protests that were civil and decent and trying to make them violent for causes that were completely separate of the george floyd protests. Let me ask you about another aspect which has to do with the role of s online platforms. As somebody who has covered extensively terrorism overseas, ive seen how twitter and social media have responded to those types of groups. What can you tell us about how social Media Outlets are responding to groups like boogaloo and others . Theyre really not. A couple weeks ago we asked facebook about it because there were three arrests in las vegas, three people who said they were going to start it at the las vegas protests. The joint Terrorism Task force got to them first. A lot of these people came from libertarian groups, tea party groups, antigovernment groups, guns and ammo groups and they went from the recommendation sidebar over to these boogaloo groups. Theyre still allowed on facebook. This is where they planned the attack. They met on facebook. Carrillos accomplice brought a white van down to this protest with him and allowed him to get away with it for a week. So facebook is a big part of this whole story. Ben collins with that important report, thank you so much. Thanks to all of you at home for watching this hour of msnbc live. Im ayman mohyeldin. After a quick break, more news with craig melvin and his interview with netflix ceo read has tinges who has announced a 20 million donation to support black Higher Education in this country. Stay with us. Usaa was made for right now. And right now, is a time for action. So, for a second time were giving members a credit on their auto insurance. Because its the right thing to do. Were also giving Payment Relief options to eligible members so they can take care of things like groceries before they worry about their insurance or credit card bills. Right now is the time to take care of what matters most. Like weve done together, so many times before. Discover all the ways were helping members at usaa. Com coronavirus always have been. And always will be. Never letting anything get in my way. Not the doubts, distractions, or voice in my head. And certainly not arthritis. 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Now thats. Simple. Easy. Awesome. Xfinity x1 just got even better with peacock premium included at no additional cost. No strings attached. Just say peacock into your voice remote to start watching today. Good wednesday morning to you. Craig melvin here. Right now were following a counteroffer of sorts on capitol hill. Senate republicans just laid out their vision for Police Reform. Senator tim scott of South Carolina the only black republican senator spearheading his partys work. Right now the democraticled house Judiciary Committee working on its own Police Reform. What can lawmakers actually get done this time . Well look at that. Across america, leaders in government and business are finding their own solutions to inequality in our country. This morning the ceo of netflix announcing a historic