Listen. Well have to see. Do you think its going to pass . Well see what happens. Did you rush it, do you think . No. Well see what happens. Reporter did you rush it at first . No. Reporter will paul ryan stay speaker if it fails, sir . Right now the house is taking the second in what are expected to be a series of procedural votes ahead of a final vote late this afternoon. Earlier this morning this tweet from the president , quote, after seven horrible years of obamacare, skyrocketing premiums and deductibles, bad health care, this is finally your chance for a great plan. The president issued an ultimatum to House Republicans, pa pass the bill today or he will leave obamacare in place. A bunch of people from the white house went over to the house. Mulvaney raised the stakes even more this morning. Listen. Lawmakers will have to be accountable as to why they didnt vote to get rid of obamacare when they had the chance and that chance is today. And right now it appears republicans do not have the votes they need. Our latest nbc count shows at least 31 House Republicans will vote no or are leaning no. That is nine short of the 215 votes needed for passage. But again, anything can change. Nbcs Kelly Odonnell joins us now from capitol hill. Kelly, what does that even mean those nine votes . Something can happen to change a bunch of them or nothing can change and the bill goes down or the vote can get pulled. Reporter ali, deadlines have a way of forcing people to make that gut check decision. Do they want to challenge the president on his first big legislative attempt or do they want to quarrel with whats in the bill for principled reasons or political reasons of their Home District Court . Its a big challenge for all of these members because there lwil be a price to pay one way or another. If they believe their sfe constituents dont want to this move forward, theres a price there. If they believe the president wont be supportive of them Going Forward, there lwill be a price there. Im told the Vice President will be working on behalf of the president to try to close this deal. While the president is still new to washington and he let the ultimatum fly vote today or we move on to other topics. So expect him to be a vital part of this team today to try to convert some of those votes. Now, the most conservative wing known as the Freedom Caucus, they really have been the roadblock for not only the speaker but the white house on this. There were changes made to the bill as weve talked about in the last 24 hours or so to try to appease them, shifting from the federal level to the state level that list of essential Health Benefits that states could require insurers to provide them but the federal government would no longer do that. And to try to bring along some of the more moderate republicans, there were changes made to keep a sur tax on high earners on medicare, keep a fund of 15 billion available to do some of the care issues that the more liberal wing of the Republican Party was interested in. But its much too difficult to get more of the more moderate numbers based on all of whats played out so its really a trump versus Freedom Caucus kind of day. So what can happen . Well, democrats have a little bit of a role to play. They can try to slow thing down on the floor today. More time could mean more time for the white house to secure votes to yes or it could let some of the air out of the balloon. We just dont know which way its going to go. From my experience up here from the last decade, i can say that a gap of roughly ten votes is a very big gap when there isnt anything specific to offer a member to bring them on board. Were watching these high stakes. A big gap except so many of those no votes have very similar concerns. If something happened to address something very big, you could flip a whole lot of them at the same time. Reporter but that would mean going back and rewriting the bill and starting the clock over and going back to the rules committee. It is baked in at this point, at least with the bill that were dealing with. So there wont be any changes. It will all be about sort of a crystal ball trying to read the future to these members who oppose it, what will life be like if they oppose President Trump, what will life be like if their voters think they had a chance to repeal obamacare and did not . And are they standing on principle because this isnt the right bill at the right time. At the moment, that vote is still scheduled for this afternoon. Its not Just Health Care at the white house. Just in the laust hour, the president just gave final approval to move forward with the Keystone Pipeline. Well bring you remarks from inside that meeting as soon as we get them. Peter alexander joins us live now from the white house. Hes also dry. Am i the only guy standing outside . Whats going on over there . Youre on an island right now but i think theres some people at the white house who feel similarly in effect when it comes to this Health Care Bill, they feel theyve done everything they can and now its up to House Republicans. The president said hes done negotiating but he isnt done with his socalled art of the deal deal making. This is what he wrote. He was going after the conservative members of that Freedom Caucus, tweeting the following the irony is that the Freedom Caucus, which is very prolife and against planned parenthood allows planned parenthood to continue if they stop this plan. Beyond that weve just now heard from planned parenthood speaking out on this topic. They just sent us a message. They said in part while the president tweets and plays politics, were busy fighting to Save Health Care that one in five women rely on right now. So theres some of the politics that continues on the health care issue. But more broadly whats been striking here, ali, you were talking about the conversation President Trump had with some of those individuals as he was talking about their moving forward, authorizing the permit for the Keystone Pipeline. He was peppered with questions by reporters about health care. He wouldnt commit either way whether it would succeed or fail today or what would happen Going Forward if it does fail. He says we will see what will happen. Paul ryan said if this fails, should he step down in effect or be out as House Speaker . He said he did not believe that was the case. What is most notable is the change of tone at the white house, focusing less on health care and more on other president ial priorities right now, signing the or approving, announcing the approving of the Keystone Pipeline and separately today sean spicer tweeting out that theyre focused on comprehensive tax reform by august. Lets see if that turns out to be the case through the course of the day. Peter, good to see you. Thank you so much. Joining me now, congressman rodney david, a republican of illinois. Sir, thank you for joining us. You are a yes vote at the moment, correct . I am. And nothing is going to happen obviously to change that for you. What do you think is going to happen, though . Are you been talking to those who are no votes . Absolutely. Im part of the deputy whip team. Many former no votes are now yes votes and the president and the speaker and our Leadership Team have been working hand in hand together, ive been at the white house twice this week, ive watched President Trump in action and he is doing everything he can to fulfill the promises that he made and that we made to fix this broken Health Care System. Congressman, as of last night we still had about 30 no votes, which meant about nine more that you guys needed. Are you saying that we dont have anywhere close to 30 no votes, that you think this bills going to pass or are you just saying metaphorically you think some people are coming around . No, im saying there were a lot more no votes before we nektnek negotiated some changes, positive changes that will help states like illinois, positive changes to make sure that the rug isnt pulled out from anyone right now. President trump has been fullyin gauged. He understands the impact of this bill not passing. He understand the promises that he made and what we made to actually fix this broken Health Care System that still has left 21 Million People without Health Insurance and 31 Million People that cant afford to use the coverage that they have. We dont know that the Vice President has cancelled his trip. Hes coming back to try and wring some hands. Heres the issue, though. Lets get nine or ten votes over to make this happen. The things that the white house may need to do and you guys may need to do to get those votes are different depending on whether youre going for the conservatives in the Freedom Caucus or whether youre going for the moderates. Their interests are not aligned here. Whats most likely to happen . Whats your best argument sp. I dont think theres any more negotiations. Hope flip the president will have impact for those opposed and let them know this is a chance to fulfill promises that we made. No bill in congress is ever perfect. I believe its about 80, 85 things that are positive for my district and state in this country and if theres something that we believe needs to be fixed still, lets pass this and then we can go on and fix the problems that you see may still exist after this is signed into law. You guys as whips have better counts than we have. We still think were about nine votes off. If you get to 3 00 or 3 30 this afternoon and your number shows something similar will this happen or is this some chance this vote gets put off . Right now the president wants this vote to happen, our Leadership Team wants it to happen. I want it to stop raining right now but i may not have control over that. If youre not going to be able to win that vote, are you going to pull it . Thats not something were discussing. We fully intend to have that vote and fully intend to make sure it passes. Joining me now in washington with me at storm center one here, a practicing physician with Johns Hopkins medicine and fellow at the brookings institution. He was instrumental in the development of obamacare and john c. Goodman, senior fellow of the Goodman Institute for public research, andy slavitt, former head of medicare and medicaid underpresident obama. A whole lot of people here who know a lot about it. Kavita, youve watched the changes to try and do more, it didnt seem to change the whip count on how this is going to go. Whats your sense of the best thing to happen right now . The best thing if youre a republican the best thing to happen would be you can at least say to people, look, this is just to get us through the house, were going to still be working on this, its a long process. They still have to get it through the senate side and then committee and youll continue to work on this. If youre a democrat youre hoping that youre still nine votes short and that this fails and that we still have the Affordable Care act as pretty much the law of the land. Which is what President Trump has said will happen. By the way, this is not about the changes made last night, its about the last set of changes. Interesting result. It shows basically no change in the number of people who will have coverage versus the first draft but less of an impact on the deficit. In fact, less of a reduction in the deficit. In the original bill, 337 billion deficit reduction in this new bill, 150 billion. Does this help or hurt the efforts to get this bill passed . Well, the big mistake that the republicans made is they are repealing 1 trillion in obamacare taxes and this includes taxes on Drug Companies and Insurance Companies and those are special interests who agreed to be taxed in order to have Health Reform. Theyre not even asking for their money back yet the republicans are insisting they take the money back. When you give away a trillion dollars, you have less money to insure people. Thats why the cbo is saying there will be 14 Million People without Health Insurance. Thats not what i think Republican Voters have really been asking for. What do you think theyve been asking for . Because thats the complexity here. Theres a lot of people who say the one thing republicans voters were promised is an appeal of obamacare and thats what theyre trying to get done but i think there seems to be a shift in sentiment here about people who doesnt want more Expensive Health care, worse health care or nothing in its place. Obamacare allowed people to be dumped into the market, it was working reasonably well. And people in that market have seen their premiums double and tri triple and benefits were being cut. There was an opportunity for republicans to show they could do a better job at this and so far they havent shown that. Health and Human Services secretary tom price says way too much focus of whats not in the bill. Listen to what he said on morning joe. That is part of a plan. Thats why its so important to appreciate that theres so many other things that are going on in the area of health care to make certain we move in that direction of patientcentered health care. Andy, i mean, that is kind of hard. Theres actually no bill for most people to see. There were changes made last night. There hasnt been good review of this. The groups who have interest in this have not been represented. Its a bit of a hard sell to say go with this but much better stuff is coming later. Its a really tough vote for them to ask rank and file republicans premiums are supposed to speak 15 to 20 above current levels. Now theyre talking about taking away things Like Mental Health and other protections. When they say dont focus on the other issues because there are going to be other bills coming. It reminds me of when my kid comes home from school and says, dad, i didnt get a good grade on this test but dont worry, there will be other tests. Peoples premiums went up in the markets as a result of obamacare. But when you look overall, when we dont cherry pick stuff,s rates insurance rates go up all the time. What recommend difficult should republicans offer rather than saying that insurance rates are going down because theyre not. Well, premiums went up about 60 on average for about everybody who has been notice individual market and for some much more than that. And the reason is they allow the risk pools to dump their sick people into this market and allow the city of detroit to dump 8,000 people into this market. Let me stop you there. Thats exactly the topic i want to get in. How do you do this without creating a bigger risk pool . You dont allow them to dump sick people into this tiny little market. I helped Pete Sessions and bill cassidy with Health Reform and we would have treated everybody the same whether they were in the individual or group market. Kavita, i think johns talking about things i talk about all the time, create a bigger market, the biggest risk pool you could get. How about everybody in the same market. Every other oecd country has done this and rates are lower. This is just insurance 101. You create a larger risk pool and spread that risk across a much larger population, not just an individual market. Remember, part of whats been delayed in obamacare has also been the employer mandate. So the idea is no get we were thinking of doing that with a public option. If youll remember, the house actually had a public option but because of differences, we used the Senate Version which did not have it, it would create a bigger risk pool and bring costs down. Thank you for sitting here during this weather indecident were having. Youre looking at at the live floor. You just heard a congressman say they are pushing him to vote. Just moments ago we heard more from house intelligence chair devin nunes. He says a former top trump aide has volunteered to speak to the incommittee. Well have the late breaking details next. Call the clown parents arent perfect but then they make us Kraft Mac Cheese and everythings good again. My insurance rates are but dad, youve got. Allstate. With accident forgiveness they guarantee your rates wont go up just because of an accident. Smart kid. Indeed. Its good to be in, good hands. No one burns on my watch try alka seltzer heartburn relief chews. They work fast and dont taste chalky. Mmmmm. Amazing. I have heartburn. Alka seltzer heartburn relief chews. Enjoy the relief. Kevin, meet yourkeviner. Kevin Kevin Kevin KevinKevin Kevin Kevin kevin kevin trusted advice for life. Kevin, hows your mom . Life well planned. See what a Raymond JamesFinancial Advisor can do for you. singsong budget meeting. Sweet. If you compare last quarter. Its no wonder everything seems a little better with the creamy taste of philly, made with no artificial preservatives, flavours or dyes. At the white house President Trump is meeting texas republican Governor Greg Abbott and thomas rutledge. This is moments ago. Lets listen. Thank you very much. I really appreciate youre going here. Im delighted to welcome tom rutledge, chairman and ceo of Charter Communications, a great company, to the white house. Im also very honored that my friend, texas Governor Greg Abbott, my good friend and supporter, i love you, is here with us today, very appropriate. Hes done a fantastic job in texas and we have a previous governor that did a very good job, right . Where is he . Hes standing right over there. First is some background. Five years ago Charter Communications was a struggling company that had slowly emerged from bankruptcy. Today thanks to hard work and unbelievable leadership, truly great leadership, its the Fastest Growing television, internet and Voice Company in the nation. I would say thats a good job. What do you think . Its a good job. Not bad. Very impressive. Bring him into the government. Tom rutledge and his team turned the company around. They created a cult of Customer Service and embasxcellence and importantly, they brought back many jobs that were shipped overseas. That has been good for certain businesses but not good for the United States, but not good for america, not good for our people. When American Workers win, america as a country wins. We want to have companies that thrive and hire and grow right here in america and we want them to use American Workers and american citizens. Today i am thrilled to announce that Charter Communications has just committed to investing 25 billion, with a b, 25 billion youre sure thats right, right . Not with an m . With a b. And has committed further to hiring 20,000 American Workers over the next four years. Charter is also committed to completely end its offshore call centers. That is such a big deal. And will base 100 of its call centers here in the United States, all american jobs. This is great for their workers, its great for the customers and its certainly great for the United States and you watch, it will be one of your really fantastic decisions. Tom will be opening a brand new im going to leave this for a second. Congressman adam schiff, Ranking Member speaking now. So the country would understand what we were looking at, what progress we were making, what the issues were and most fundamentally why the American People should care about why about how russia intervened in our election and the seriousness of this issue, the challenge it poses not only for our own democracy but for democracies around the world. So we agreed that many of these hearings would be done in open session and we invited five directors well, four directors and sally yates to come and testify and they all agreed to come testify in open session because of scheduling, we ended up breaking up that first open hearing into two parts, the second part to take place on tuesday. The three witnesses for tuesday have all agreed to come and testify in open session, to share with the public what they know about this investigation. Now of course there are many questions that they may not be able to answer in open session, but at the same time as we saw on monday, there is a lot the public can learn about this and should learn about this and most fundamentally all the different methods that the russians use to interfere in democracy, in our own and as we see in europe right now in that of our allies. Its a very important component. I think what we have seen this week is the following chronology on monday we have the first open hearing in which the country really gets a glimpse of whats at stake. They get a sense of why we are so concerned about many things but in particular whether there were u. S. Persons involved, whether there were people involved in the Trump Campaign that were in any way, as director comey said, coordinating with the russians. We not only i think gave the public a real glimpse of why this is so significant, but we also heard for the first time that the fbi is doing a counterintelligence investigation that involves associates of the Trump Campaign and that investigation has been going on as soon as july and it continues to this day. That of course was very significant information for the public. That was monday. On tuesday wednesday, the chairman in what appears to be the dead of night, he has documents that he hasnt shared with the committee, all of us essentially are in the dark. But what was most concerning about that whole incident is taking that information to the white house. Now, it is associates of the president who are potentially the subject of investigation into whether they colluded in any way with the russians. To take evidence that may or may not be related to the investigation to the white house was wholly inappropriate and of course cast grave doubts into the ability to run a credible investigation and a credible investigation. That was tuesday wednesday. We are here now on friday. On thursday we learned that the chairman wanted to close the hearing set for tuesday. Or cancel it altogether. Off course that was not in our view in the Public Interest and we resisted that. Today the chairman has announced that hearing is cancelled. He has also announced that he wants to bring back directors comey and rogers for a closed session. We welcome at any time bringing the former directors back in closed session. We dont welcome cutting off the Public Information when we have witnesses, as thee these three willing witnesses. We said we could have the witnesses testify in open session and if there were questions members wanted to ask in closed session we shall could go to a closed session of the hearings. This is what we do in the worldwide threats hearings often when we have open testimony followed by testimony in closed session. The reason we do that in the worldwide threats hearing is because there are questions that can be answered in public, it is in the Public Interest to know what threats the countries face, even if many of those questions cannot be answered in closed session. And of course the session that follows is important to the members in our oversight responsibility, to understand more of the details, more of the classified information behind those threats. The same is true in this investigation. Some of this should be done, needs to be done in the public eye. So we strongly object to the cancellation of this hearing. We would still urge the majority to reconsider. The witnesses have made it clear to us they are Still Available and we would urge that that hearing be allowed to go forward. Second, with respect to the documents, again none of us have seen what the chairmans referring to, the chair and i did request documents of the directors of the nsa, cia on unmasking procedures. That is a normal part of our oversight and that is perfectly appropriate. Whether what the chairman saw is a subset of that or not, none of us have any idea. If it is a subset of what we requested and expect to be delivered, it begs the question why it was necessary to take a subset of those documents to the white house before the committee did its own work. Be that as it may, at this point we do not have the full response from the nsa. They did respond to one of the five questions that we asked and told us that they are working to respond to the others and we have every confidence that they are. Finally, with respect to mr. Manafort, we welcome his testimony before the committee. We would also welcome that that testimony be done in open session so the public may be informed of what he has to say. Similarly, if its necessary to have any of that in closed session, that can be arranged but as much of this investigation that we can rorl properly do in public, i believe we should do. Reporter [ inaudible ]. Do you encourage him to make that a public hearing . We had a public hearing with comey already. I dont think anyone should be should have any question about what is really going on here. This is not a desire to have them come back in closed session and somehow thats at conflict with having an open hearing that is already scheduled, witnesses who have already agreed to appear. That is at most a dodge. We welcome them coming back at any time. Whats really concerned is the cancelling of this hearing. What is the reason for that dodge . I think there must have been a very strong pushback from the white house about the nature of mondays hearing. Its hard for me to come to any other conclusion about why an agreedupon hearing would be suddenly cancelled. Clearly it had to do with the events of this week. The chairman himself said it had nothing to do with the documents he saw so what other explanation can there be . There real really is none when witnesses are available. Do you believe the dead of night excursion was arranged by the white house in any way . I dont know. I am concerned the chair has been unwilling to rule out whether the documents came from the white house or in coordination of the white house. Some of the members of why are committee have lost faith of him to be chair of the committee. Are you there . Do you believe you can still run this committee or should he step aside . Ultimately thats a decision that the speaker needs to make. And i think the speaker has to decide just as well as our own chairmen whether they want a credible investigation being done here, whether they want an investigation that the public can have confidence in. The events of this week are not encouragi encouraging. I think anyone watching has legitimate concerns whether this congress can do a legitimate investigation. One of the profound takeaways of the last couple days is we really do need an independent commission here because the public at the end of the day needs to have confidence that someone has done a thorough investigation, untainted by political considerations. You know, it had been my hope, its still my hope, i had maybe hope against hope that theres some way that we can do that, but i have to say im deeply discouraged by this weeks events, i think the public is deeply discouraged by this weeks events and i think that what at this point would give the public more confidence than anything else is if we didnt stop what were doing but we established a truly independent body, quite separate, apart from the Congress Just as we did after 9 11, that the public can say, okay, at least there we can be confident someone is doing an investigation unhampered by political precious, uninterfered with by the white house or anyone else. Reporter do you have any allegations that the [ inaudible ]. Have you had any contact with president obama or anyone from the Prior Administration or representatives about these allegations that President Trump made about being surveilled . I certainly havent had any conversations with the president. The president has a huge staff so i dont want to represent whether ive heard from anyone from the Prior Administration. But one thing has been abundantly clear this week and it began with director comeys testimony and director rogers and what they represented on behalf of the department of justice and that is there is still absolutely no basis for what the president has accused his predecessor of. That was just pure nonsense. And i think whats happened here and i really think people need to understand what is going on here is the following the president made a slanderous accusation against his predecess predecessor, one with absolutely no base, that his predecessor, barack obama, engaged in felony crimes and ill legally wiretapped him and senators on the senate committees, and house committees have said weve seen in evidence to support the president s statements. Then we heard testimony from the directors this week saying there is no evidence of this. And then we had this peculiar excursion at which the chairman said, well, its still no evidence that his predecessor wiretapped him in any way and although that midnight run caused some confusion and still does, the bottom line is still the same. And whats happened is that accusation has now damaged our relationship with our british allies. I think the comments the president made with ainngela merkel to be veritable the most tasteless ive seen in a meeting with heads of state and can only be damaging in that relationship but now in an effort to further justify the unjustifiable, hes further interfering with this investigation. So that effort to defend the indefensible has led us down this terrible rabbit hole and threatens the integrity of the only investigation thats authorized in the house. And thats where weve gotten to today. Reporter congressman i. I want to go to someone who hasnt had a question before. Reporter you said you believe the white house is interfering with the investigation. That would seem to suggest the excursion was collaborated by the white house. Can you elaborate on that . Is there any level of political tainting that would cause you and the democrats to walk away from the investigation . Well, democrats feel that if were not engaged in this investigation, no one will be. And there are some im sure in this building who would like nothing more for this investigation to go away. From my point of view, that would be irresponsible of us. So i think were going to do our best to investigate this regardless of the obstacles were encountering. Were going to continue to urge the majority to work with us to the degree theyre willing a and but we do feel the need when the majority makes mistakes like today by cancelling an open hearing to speak out and speak loudly, in an minority the only power we have the power of public persuasion. I hope those watching will contact the Public Hearings Committee and urge them to go forward. It may be more important to reach out to republican members and say you dont want this hearing cancelled, you want to be informed and youre going to demand that of all the representatives regardless of party. Reporter what is your understanding of the nature of how these names were released . Is it your understanding that Trump Associates were party to these communications or simply unmasked in the course of other conversations . Let me make this the last question. This deals with the issue of unmasking. And again, because of the extraordinary way that the chairman has introduced this issue, that is by viewing certainly and telling the press and the white house about it without telling his own committee or sharing with his own committee what is really involved and we dont have it so we cant say, i have to read between the lines and reading between the lines of what the chair has said, i would assume and again, this is just an assumption that this is a subset of what we requested from the nsa. And again, a significant question about why this would be done in this man are if were going to be getting these documents from the nsa. But what weve asked the nsa for are documents that are a result of incidental collection, that is collection not as the president has suggested that was targeted at the president because theres no evidence of that but surveillance that maybe targeted at foreign spies. And in the midst of looking at foreign spies, it could be as simple a matter of a foreign spy mentioning the name of an american. You imagine they might mention the name of an american running for president. That would be considered incidental collection. So i assume without knowing any better what the chairman is talking about is hes looked at communications that were incidentally collected that is not targeted at the president. So no defense for the president , not a full validation or vindication of the president , not a partial validation of the president , even if you accept what the chairman has said. Thank you. All right. That is Ranking Member of the intelligence committee, the most senior democrat on the House Intelligence Committee adam schiff coming out and really expressing his remarkable frustration, the rift between him and the chair of that committee, devin nunes, has not healed ever since devin nunes took information that he believed he had to the white house before taking it to his Ranking Member or to the members of the intelligence committee. Now, devin nunes has since issued something of an apology to his members of the committee but then he doblubled down and reiterated and thinks he did the right thing by going to the white house first as opposed to going to his committee. This is not get anything better. One this evening adam schiff said is he confirmed devin nunes is cancelling an open hearing on tuesday in which they were supposed to hear more testimony from others involved in this allegation, this investigation into relations between the Trump Campaign and the white house. So i want to bring in naveed jamali. Naveed, so much happening here. First of all, these two guys, adam schiff and devin nunes, a democrat and a republican, are really supposed to be working together in a bipartisan fashion to run this intelligence committee. These are two guys of the gang of eight who get better intelligence than pretty much anybody else in the country except the president. Absolutely. And, you know, ali, it disturbs me that there seems to be a fundamental misunderstanding of some of the basic terms of art. I this i what adam schiff said at the closing of his press conference was so important. Weve heard all about surveillance and masking and unmaski unmasking. That has nothing to do with what nunes is referring to. A lot of the products and reports are based on reading foreign newspapers. In that case youre going to write back that country a has this reaction to a proposed administration policy. In that case you dont mask the president s name. That is not surveillance. Of course if you go into what we call the different systems, the Intelligence Community kind of internet and you search for donald trump, youre going to find reports that contain his name. That does not mean there was incidental or otherwise surveillance done on the president. Its a complete misnomer. And its important to note, i just want to sort of remind people, that devin nunes has sort of backed off on that a little bit. Hes implying this was stuff picked up between talking to foreign entity about american entity, very different than what the allegation has been and that is somehow either the Obama Administration or u. S. Intelligence agencies were trying to listen in on americans. That is exactly right. That is in no way, shape or form, surveillance on krot. You might be surprise to know there are writing about march madness. Its 99. 99 of intelligence products are preddy pedestrian. And i think theres this, again, just because of a does not mean theyre the subject of intelligence. Thanks for clearing that up for us. Naveed jamali. We want to turn to the Health Health care vote that is in theory just hours away. Joining us is a physician, dr. Coburn, tom coburn is a senior fellow at the manhattan institute. Sir, thank you for joining us. Good to have you back on our air. Lets talk about whats going on in the white house and capitol hill. How bad lee does have hell and he promised tax reform and infrastructure. Does he have to get these done or can he just move on . I think the president his message is pass it or were going to pass up on it and im going to go to the other things i want to get done, which i think is really refreshing. Theres not 60 votes in the senate, theres not the super majority. Understood that thats how we got the Affordable Care act and thats what youre going to need to take it away completely. I think what were seeing is a normal process and i think nobody knows what the end of that process is going to be this evening when the votes are cast. I guess the problem is the part thats not normal about this and is different from obamacare is weve got a president who has about a 37 Approval Rating providing an ultimatum on a bill that seems to have very little support among republicans and amongst the whole country. In fact well, wrong thats right at all. Hold on. Sir, ive got it on the screen so you can look at it. I cant look at the screen. Ill read it to you if you let me read it to you. Let me make one point to you. Why dont i just make the point first and then you can answer it. First of all, the average american has no knowledge of whats in this bill. Thats not true, sir. We spend all of our days helping people stand whats in it. Thats just not true. Can we talk about the poll . Are you going to let me ask im just telling you you cant trust a poll. Look at the last federal election. You cant trust the poll. Lets take the poll off the screen because the senator doesnt want to see any details. Why dont we no, no, i just want to make a point. This is a complicated bill. I agree with you, sir. As nancy pelosi said, you had to pass it to find out what was in it. Thats how complicated health care is. I agree. Most retired politicians, most people who are political junkies dont know whats in this bill. Plus it changed from yesterday to today. Sir, no disagreement, sir. I really strongly believe you on that one and thats why we and me in particular, i spend a lot of time trying to discuss whats in it and when people find out whats in it, what theyre about to lose, those numbers get worse and worse and worse. So you may not believe the polls but can you at least believe the trend that fewer people now support repealing obamacare today than they did on election day and on Inauguration Day . I have no doubt that fewer people do not support that because of whats been seen and whats been said that is not necessarily accurate. If you take the cbos estimate and look at its estimate on the Affordable Care act. How accurate was it . It want even in the ballpark. Take it on Medicare Part d. It wasnt anywhere in the ballpark. Why would we think that the cbo is accurate this time . Who would you suggest, senator we do this . Hold on a second. You dont want to believe cbo stuff, which is bipartisan, nonpartisan, you dont want to believe polls. Do we just guess, throw spaghetti at the wall and see what woshs . Works . No, you use principles. If you want to Lower Health Care costs in this country, you have to have transparency as to price and outcomes. The hospitals and Insurance Industry dont want that so its not in this bill. It doesnt matter what price they pass, prices are not going to go down. Youre not going to go down until you get price discovery. Thats the first thing. Number two is if you have a refundable tax credit, it will be just like the rest of them, each of them 10 to 20 billion a year in fraud. That isnt going to work. We know that from the child care tax credit and the work tax credit. Right. Those dont work because theyre loaded with fraud. What we do know works, sir what we do know is a study out of pennsylvania when they doublechecked applications for medicaid, almost 600,000 people were found ineligible because they either lied on medicaid or lied on their car loans. Thats not really the problem with health care, the idea that america plays double capital than any other developed nation is not ball game peopecause peo other developed nation with lower outcomes and with lower life expectancies. First of all thats not true at all. Thats 100 true, sir, with all due respect. Those are not poll numbers. Thats 100 true. No, its not true. And let me tell i couldnt. Its absolutely true, sir. If i could put that comparison up. So can i give you some facts . On average you give me a lot of opinion. Id like some facts. On average viable in this country on cancers 50 better across the spectrum than any other country in the world. Thats number one. Number two is why does it cost so much . Because we have a 1960s Regulatory Environment at the fda, with precision medicine, biomarkers and all the other things that are available that they cant keep up with. So theres part of the cost. You dont the reason things cost here is because we have what i would call a bastardized system where the government controls part of it, and the political interests control the rest of it so you cant get price discovery. Even if you had the ideal republican solution which would be medical savings accounts, buying across state lines, associational health plan, theyre not going to bring the price down. I agree with you. Because you cannot know what price is, because the hospitals dont want to you know. The Insurance Companies dont want to you know. You and i agree on this, completely agree on this. Well let me fin shall my point. The point is, you just said it cost twice as much for everything in this country. Thats not true. It is true. Number two, the outcomes it is not true. Show me the data. I can show you what Thompson Reuters put in. Im asking if my control room has that data to show. Weve shown it many times. If you want to just google developed country cost per capita, you will find that in the United States, somewhere between 9,000 and 10,000 per capita. There is no developed nation in the world that comes even to 50 of that. Its absolutely true. Well look at their cost to gdp. They come way above 50 . Thats about 60 to 70 what have we spend. Here we go, ive got it on the screen, oecd, developed country costs 3,814, the United States 9,451. Thats cost per capita. If you want to do it as a percentage of gdp. Thats not gdp. Cost per capita, Health Care Spending per person. You can do it as a cost of gdp as well. Either way the United States doesnt fare well, sir. It costs more here. Im just saying im disputing your numbers. You throw out a number saying its 50 more expensive its not. If you look at what we spend as a percentage of our gdp what germany or england spends, we are more expensive. Ill grant you that. The reason is because we have a system that says the governments going to control, were going to mandate. We dont have a real market like we have in Everything Else in our country. All those other countries actually have full governmentinvolvement in their Health Care Systems. They have full government. We dont have gull government involvement. Other side of the coin but we agree on the point. I get your point. Were agreed on that. We have government that says you cant own a hospital if youre a doctor but a hospital can own a doctor. Thats assinine. We have much more to talk about this, senator, thank you for your time. I appreciate we got to this understanding on it. You bet. In the tom coburn, former k Oklahoma Republican senator with the manhattan project. Day 64 of Donald Trumps first 100 days in office. This week was an historic one. Look. There was circumstantial evidence of collusion. There was direct evidence i think of deception. No evidence of collusion . The fbi as part of our Counterintelligence Mission is investigating the russian governments efforts to interfere in the 2016 president ial election. And that includes investigating the nature of any links between individuals associated with the Trump Campaign and the russian government. Thursday is our chance to end obamacare and the obama cair catastrophe. If hes out of the main stream, i will not only vote against him, ill use every tool at my disposal including a filibuster. Did he ever ask to you overall ros v. Wade . No sir. What would you have done if he asked . Senator, i would have walked out the door. I think our members are beginning to appreciate just what kind of a rendezvous at destiny were having. I have seen intelligence reports that clearly show that the president elect and his team were i guess at least monitored and disseminated out in intelligence. Do you feel vindicated by chairman knew necessary come over here, sir . I somewhat do. Its a judgment call on my part and that the the end of the day, thats, sometimes you make the right decision. Sometimes you make the wrong one. We have a great bill, and i think we have a very good chance, but its only progress. I think hes done as much as nip could ever expect a president to do to get a piece of legislation passed. I can tell you the big news is, were trending, yes. And once again, that was just one week. Joining me is nbcs Kelly Odonnell on capitol hill and nbc news senior Political Editor mark murray live in our d. C. Bureau. Mark, let me start with you. Does the president want this Health Care Bill passed . Its a risky move, dropping the ultimatum that he did last night that pass it or i move it on. Ali, its a fascinating question. I think actually the answer to it gives us a big question on how this vote plays out this afternoon. On the one hand youve seen President Trump take to twitter say hey, this is important for me. Hes trying to twist arms with the house Freedom Caucus. Weve also seen Vice President mike pence cancel his trip going to see the College Basketball tournament and still going to do work here. But on the other hand, you see President Trump already turning focus to other issues. He was talking about jobs in the oval office and the white house today. He is already starting to take the conversation to tax cuts, and so i think there is kind of an open question on whether the white house really thinks it might be to their advantage to have this day to be the last day they talk about health care and move on to other things. Kelly, youve been doing some great reporting on this, but youve seen this for so long and covered it. I kind of want to ask you, given that they all ran, republicans ran on repealing obamacare, should this have not been simpler than its turning out to be . Well one of the things that there will need to be an after action report on all of this is how did the Republican Party in the house with the greatest advantages it has had in a very long time, and with a clarity about wanting to repeal the law, how did they get to this point where they werent on the same page, sooner, and that the rollout wasnt more effective . Thats something to be talked about down the line. If it gets by today and passes, and additional changes are made, as the process moves forward, and then of course well begin this again in the senate, which is a whole nother drama, perhaps there can be some repairs along the way that will improve some of the trouble spots but the question of how did we get to this point, when they should have had all of the advantages, is something that is really worth talking about down the line. Now, i think based on just my conversations in hallways here today, im not getting a sense of a great deal of optimism. One thing that i would point out is sometimes you look at individual members and say what is their vote tell you about the state of play . Now, new jersey is a blue state, but it does have some republican representatives and a very long time representative is rodney frailingheisen, he was made chairman of the Appropriations Committee by paul ryan, one of the biggest jobs on capitol hill and he put out a statement explaining his no vote. Often if there is a lever that leadership can use, it has to do with things like i made you a committee chairman, be with me on this vote. Right. Reporter that kind of thing. For him to say no is striking to me today. I dont think we can say its a case of this bill is assured to pass so he can individually say no to reflect his own district. Again thats a blue state were talking about, but when you look at those individual members, sometimes it tells you a story of where things are, and it just doesnt feel like the momentum is shifting toward passage. Having said that, the debate is under way. There are still a few more hours, and on capitol hill time, that can still be significant. We did mention the Vice President postponing his travel today to work this bill. That, too, is a sign that its not a done deal and that he believes he can have some effect especially given his own relationships here on capitol hill, having been a member, having worked up here, so many days, even if he didnt make the news, weve seen him on capitol hill lots of days in the 0plus days of this new administration. So i think if youre putting a finger in the wind looking for direction, those who were a part of the whip team are saying its trending positively. Other members are shaking their heads to me and saying we just dont see how this passes. So then the question, will it actually be brought to the floor . Kevin mccarthy, the gop majority leader, who would have that responsibility, did not directly answer that question today when asked a number of times by reporters. In fact, in kidding back and thats sort of his way, he suggested that those questions were somehow negative, but he did not specifically respond to the idea of will the bill be brought to the floor. President trump says vote today, but maybe theres still a possibility this doesnt happen. Back to you. As you said, lots and lots of possibilities. We think there might be a vote later on today, thats many hours away, whoa knows what can happen. Mark, kelly, thanks for your great coverage and we will be watching you all afternoon. Thank you for watching this hour of msnbc live. You can find me on twitter, facebook and instra gragram and snapchat. Right now on Msnbc Andrea Mitchell reports. Right now on Andrea Mitchell reports, take it or leave it. The white house calling house conserve i haves bluff. Its now or nerve to vote on health care. Its time to put up. Its time to recognize that this is the beginning of the overall plan that will bring about that patient centered health care. This is the first step and they need to get on board. Lawmakers have to be accountable why they didnt vote to get rid of obamacare when they had the chance and that chance is today. The holdouts, despite those sticks and some carrots, conservative republicans still hold the fate of the bill in their hands. With ohm a few hours to go, are any of the nos ready to flip . I am going to vote against it, though, because it is one of the worst bills i have seen. Eight not a repeal. That is a marketing